IMO Live: Choose Yourself with Natasha Rothwell

Summary

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Podcast Summary

IMO with Michelle Obama and Craig Robinson

Episode: IMO Live: Choose Yourself with Natasha Rothwell
Date: September 10, 2025
Host: Higher Ground

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Episode Overview

This special live episode of IMO is recorded from Martha’s Vineyard as Michelle Obama and Craig Robinson sit down with Emmy-nominated actress, writer, and producer Natasha Rothwell. The conversation is candid, deeply personal, and frequently hilarious, touching on Natasha’s creative journey, the meaning of self-love, neurodiversity, and the importance of community—especially for Black women and creatives. The episode is a celebration of embracing your authentic self and creating your own path, no matter how unconventional.

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1. Setting the Scene: Martha’s Vineyard & Introductions

[00:00-07:50]

• Michelle and Craig share banter about vacationing in Martha’s Vineyard and the sense of safety and freedom the island has given their family over decades.
• Warm audience welcome and gratitude expressed for the local film festival team.
• The sartorial choices of the hosts and Natasha are discussed, with Michelle showing off her Ralph Lauren bustier and Craig quipping about his “Oak Bluffs Collection” fit.
• Michelle reflects on the unique Black leisure culture on the island:

  “We leisure, we travel, we leisure—and we leisure all up and down Martha’s Vineyard, don’t we?” (Michelle Obama, [11:39])

• Introduction of Natasha Rothwell, highlighting her career (How to Die Alone, Insecure, White Lotus) and production company Big Hattie Productions.

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2. Natasha’s Creative and Personal Background

[08:05-17:02]

• Natasha describes her experiences as a military kid (“Air Force brat”), moving frequently and learning to make home wherever her family was.

  “It really hit home for me that it’s not a place that’s home. It’s the people. And that has always stayed with me.” (Natasha Rothwell, [12:50])

• The challenges and benefits of her neurodiversity:
  • Natasha reveals she was only recently diagnosed with ADHD and as being “neurospicy” (her term for having ADHD and being somewhere on the autism spectrum).

    “I didn’t get diagnosed until last year. My life up until that point has been understanding that I’ve been spicy but not knowing the exact flavor. And now that I do, it’s allowed me to tap into communities who are also ADHD…and advocate for my needs.” (Natasha Rothwell, [16:00])

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3. Owning Neurodiversity and Ending Stigma

[17:30-24:02]

• Natasha and Michelle discuss the stigma around neurodiversity and mental health, especially in Black communities.
  • Michelle encourages openness for future generations:

    “Our kids do come in all shapes, sizes, and colors…and there’s no shame in being able to diagnose it, treat it, parent it properly.” (Michelle Obama, [22:04])

  • Natasha on destigmatizing:

    “One, name it to de-shame it, you know. And so for me, I have to be able to talk about my experience.” (Natasha Rothwell, [22:54])

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4. Family, Self-Love, and Redefining Success

[24:02-30:00]

• Natasha talks about what her parents’ 47-year marriage taught her about love—both romantic and otherwise.
  • On being “happily single”:

    “I am childless by choice. I don’t want kids. I have two amazing dogs…and so much love in my life…I thought that romantic love was more important than any other kind of love. Platonic, fraternal, familial. As I’ve gotten older…my life is full.” (Natasha Rothwell, [25:45]; repeated throughout)

  • Michelle challenges societal expectations of women, especially Black women, to be “chosen”:

    “I am tired of so many amazing Black women waiting to feel worthy because somebody hasn’t chosen them or they haven’t chosen somebody…Marriage should be a choice.” (Michelle Obama, [28:39])

• Natasha shares her story of taking herself on a date across the Brooklyn Bridge to reclaim her own joy and agency.

  “By the time I left New York, I took my damn self across the bridge and had a great time.” (Natasha Rothwell, [29:27])

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5. People-Pleasing, Boundaries, and Growth

[33:17-36:13]

• Natasha talks about her journey unlearning people-pleasing, rooted in her church upbringing and cultural norms.
  • Notable anecdote: Eating chicken enchiladas as a vegetarian rather than be an imposition.
  • Key lesson:

    “My needs are not an imposition. It was recognizing the importance of honoring my needs in the company of other people, not just when I’m by myself.” (Natasha Rothwell, [34:38])

  • Practical advice: Pause before saying yes—check in with your own authenticity.
  • On people-pleasing in Hollywood: “There’s no in the middle. It’s either a hell yes or a hell no.” ([35:08])

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6. The Making of an Artist

[36:22-46:37]

• Natasha describes her original dream of Broadway, the unexpected move into TV and comedy, and the spiritual serendipity of her creative journey.
  • On production: “When I realized my career had given me a position of power and influence, that’s when I created my production company…to help others, artists who have stories to tell and give them that platform.” ([38:00])
• She recounts her time in Japan teaching and performing improv, learning about universal humor, and navigating Blackness abroad.
  • Natasha’s lived experience as a Black woman in Japan during Obama’s election was met with surprise and joy—a recurring “Obama!” greeting from locals. ([42:51])
  • Her parents’ unwavering support, even when she originally planned to major in journalism, provided the backbone for her creative risks.

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7. Representation, Authenticity, and “Insecure”

[46:37-51:10]

• Natasha discusses the contrast between being the only Black writer at SNL and joining the open, validating “Insecure” writers’ room.
  • On being cast as “Kelly” in “Insecure”:

    “I went from some place where I was screaming to be seen to another place that saw all of me and acknowledged all those parts.” ([48:14])

  • Real-life bonds with fellow cast and showrunner Issa Rae strengthened her sense of belonging.
• On awards and validation:

  “I’ve already won…The nomination is just an acknowledgment from my peers that I’ve done good work. The moment the award becomes more important than the work, I’ve lost the plot.” (Natasha Rothwell, [51:00])

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8. Advice for Creatives, Hollywood, and the Next Generation

[53:24-56:14]

• Reflections on collaboration, the joy of team creative work, and how military/large family background fostered this spirit.
• Encouragement for young, especially marginalized, creators:

  “Do not wait for someone else to give you permission to live your dream. Do it now…Be prolific, not perfect. Create work enough that your bad gets good, your good gets better, and your better is the best.” (Natasha Rothwell, [55:14])

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9. Listener Question: Stability, ADHD, and Finding Your Path

[62:34-67:06]

• Listener Sophia (28, Los Angeles): Asks Natasha for advice on building career and personal stability with ADHD and uncertainty.
  • Natasha: Break big dreams into small steps, reach out to peers (not just “up”), and find your people.

    “All the people that are on the grind with you are the people that are going to be there later…Building that community is so important.” ([63:19])

  • On ADHD: Seek resources and medication if needed; it was life-changing for her.
  • Michelle: “Have grace with yourself. Be okay with not knowing anything at 28. Life is really a journey.”
  • Natasha adds: “Don’t be afraid to suck. Do it anyway.”

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10. Lighthearted TV Talk & Closing Reflections

[69:04-72:30]

• Natasha, Michelle, and Craig share favorite TV shows (The Office, Severance) and the guilty pleasure of reality TV’s sociological insight (“Love Island”).
• Differences in childhood play for boys and girls discussed as a way to understand why women love reality TV’s psychological games.
• Michelle closes the live show with gratitude for Natasha’s honesty, humor, and talents:

  “You are smart, funny, honest, vulnerable. It shows up in the work that you’ve done. And I can’t wait to see everything that you will do. And please tell your parents that you made them proud.” (Michelle Obama, [71:50])

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Self-Validation & Agency:
  “Don’t wait for someone else to give you permission to live your dream. Do it now…Pull up a chair." (Natasha Rothwell, [55:14])
• Love & Singleness:
  “Romantic love…has to match this amazing life that I’ve worked so hard to build.” (Natasha Rothwell, [26:01] and recurring)
• Destigmatizing Neurodiversity:
  “Name it to de-shame it.” (Natasha Rothwell, [22:54])
• Process Over Perfection:
  “Be prolific, not perfect.” (Natasha Rothwell, [55:14])
• On Awards:
  “The moment the award becomes more important than the work, I’ve lost the plot.” (Natasha Rothwell, [51:18])
• Black Joy & Community:
  “We leisure, we travel, we leisure—and we leisure all up and down Martha’s Vineyard, don’t we?” (Michelle Obama, [11:39])
• People-Pleasing Recovery:
  “There’s no in the middle. It’s either a hell yes or a hell no.” (Natasha Rothwell, [35:08])

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Key Timestamps

• [08:05] - Natasha welcomes, talks about her time on the Vineyard.
• [12:50] - Natasha on being an Air Force brat and how that shaped her.
• [16:00] - Natasha discusses late-in-life ADHD diagnosis and “being neurospicy.”
• [22:54] - Destigmatizing neurodiversity in Black communities.
• [25:45] - Insights from her parents’ 47-year marriage and being happily single.
• [29:27] - “Took my damn self across the bridge”—reclaiming self-love milestones.
• [34:38] - The internal battle and triumph over people pleasing.
• [48:14] - How Natasha became Kelly on “Insecure” and finally felt seen.
• [51:18] - On Emmy nominations, validation, and what truly matters.
• [55:14] - Advice to young creators: “Be prolific, not perfect.”
• [63:19] - Listener question about ADHD, stability, and Natasha’s guidance.

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Tone & Takeaway

The episode is a mix of heart, vulnerability, belly laughs, and tough love. Natasha’s honesty about neurodiversity, people-pleasing recovery, and the value of all kinds of love is deeply empowering for listeners, especially Black women and underrepresented creatives. Michelle and Craig’s sibling banter and supportive energy set the tone for a conversation that is both intimate and universally resonant.

If you’re navigating uncertainty, craving creative affirmation, or just in need of a boost—this episode will lift you up, make you laugh, and remind you to choose yourself, unapologetically.

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Transcript

[Natasha Rothwell]

I think in my 20s, I thought that romantic love was more important than any other kind of love. Platonic, fraternal, familial. While it's something that I want, I know it has to match this amazing life that I've worked so hard to build. And that's a great point. You know what I mean?

[Craig Robinson]

That's a great point.

[Michelle Obama]

Yes. Yeah.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Well.

[Craig Robinson]

And where are you going?

[Michelle Obama]

Mm hmm.

[Craig Robinson]

Remember that point. Would anybody be upset if we introduced you to somebody?

[Michelle Obama]

What are you doing? What's he doing?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Introduce me. God is good. God is good.

[Michelle Obama]

This episode is brought to you by Rivian and Progressive Insurance. Well, hey, y'. All. See, this is really like being at home, being here in Martha's Vineyard.

[Craig Robinson]

It is.

[Michelle Obama]

Well, welcome, my big brother, Craig Robinson, to the happiest place on the planet, Martha's Vineyard.

[Craig Robinson]

If I had known it was like this, I'd have been here before sooner.

[Michelle Obama]

I've been trying to get you to adjust your attitude and get here more regularly.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Wow.

[Craig Robinson]

Appreciate you all. Thank you very much. Thank you, man.

[Michelle Obama]

And Stephanie and Floyd and all the team at the film festival. Well, thank you for putting this together when we started, imo. You know, when I come to the venue, I don't like to work, but I thought there's no way we could do this and be doing lives and not bring it here to my favorite place on the planet. So thank you all for. Thank you all for coming out and for the film festival team.

[Craig Robinson]

How you doing?

[Natasha Rothwell]

I'm good. How are you?

[Michelle Obama]

You're looking snazzy.

[Craig Robinson]

Yeah, well, I'm going to talk about my snazz in a minute.

[Michelle Obama]

Okay. All right. You quite pleased with yourself?

[Craig Robinson]

I appreciate my sister. Cause whenever we come out here, she sort of lets me run free. Cause if I try and go places with her, we end up not being able to go anywhere.

[Michelle Obama]

Oh, poor you.

[Craig Robinson]

So she let me drive her car.

[Michelle Obama]

Because, y', all, I can drive here on the Vineyard. I spree eyes free.

[Craig Robinson]

So, you know, you all have heard. If. For those of you who have heard the podcast, you know, we were gifted Rivians.

[Michelle Obama]

You didn't know that? It's pretty nice. It makes it all worthwhile, doesn't it?

[Craig Robinson]

She let me drive hers around the island, and I got to take some pictures. And, you know, I might have to adjust my vacation plans.

[Michelle Obama]

You should, you know, you gotta make this a regular stop. So. We're counting on it. We are counting on it. But you do look nice.

[Craig Robinson]

You like my fit?

[Michelle Obama]

Yes.

[Craig Robinson]

Y' all like my fit?

[Michelle Obama]

You do look Nice.

[Craig Robinson]

This is the Oak Bluffs collection.

[Michelle Obama]

And we want to thank Ralph Lauren for our sponsors of today's event. I am wearing Ralph Lauren neck to ankle, by the way. It's all. And there's. This is y' all ladies. This is a leather bustier. I started to wear it without the shirt.

[Craig Robinson]

She didn't have the nerve, though.

[Michelle Obama]

But it's cute, y'.

[Natasha Rothwell]

All.

[Michelle Obama]

This fits really nicely. And you guys should know, I think I'm quite cute in it.

[Craig Robinson]

She's very cute. Very cute. Very cute. I'm not as cute, but I'm harder to fit because I'm six' six. I got long arms, long legs. They sent this to me right off the rack.

[Michelle Obama]

Off the rack.

[Craig Robinson]

So keep that in mind for those tall folks out there, too. This is a great campaign.

[Michelle Obama]

Well, the beautiful thing about this collection is that it highlights everything that we know is beautiful about this island, about Oak Bluffs, the campaign. If you all haven't seen it, the video, many of our young people, the young people from the island, helped create that ad. And it's a real celebration of what is best about this place. You all maybe, you know, but Barack and I have been coming here for more than 35 years. This has been before we were the Obamas, and we've lived probably everywhere on the island. We raised our girls here. Sasha is here. All you know, this is a special place for us because as you all know, this is where we come to enjoy being us. And I think if you have kids and kids of color, as you all know, having them be able to be on this island where they can be free and they can roam and go into Oak Bluffs and be in town and hang out without anybody messing with them and have some freedom. I love this island. And if my brother gets a little more sense, he will come more often himself.

[Craig Robinson]

We have been coming now for the last five or so years, and it's been off and on.

[Michelle Obama]

Yeah.

[Craig Robinson]

It'S been every year.

[Michelle Obama]

Every year.

[Craig Robinson]

My son's here. He likes it here. He was sleeping by the pool today. But no, it's really. I mean, just downtown. Downtown Oak Bluffs, downtown Egerton. I'm slowly learning that.

[Michelle Obama]

He's slowly learning his way around. We went on Barnes Road, and Craig was like, is that the airport? I was like, yes, again, it's still.

[Craig Robinson]

The airport, but if you don't come here regularly, it can be confusing.

[Michelle Obama]

And he was so surprised. It's like, there's an airport. And I was like, this is where the airport is.

[Craig Robinson]

It wasn't that I was surprised. I was surprised that we were back that direction.

[Michelle Obama]

It's an island. At some point you gonna get back to the same direction over and over again.

[Craig Robinson]

You see what I have to put up with? You know, I am the oldest.

[Michelle Obama]

Well, anyway, we've got stuff to do, right?

[Craig Robinson]

We have a guest for you all and I am excited because I feel like I know Natasha already from everything she does on tv. She is an Emmy nominated actress, Woo woo writer, executive producer, and of the series how to Die Alone. She's also known for her roles on Insecure, which the Robinsons and Obamas watched and our kids watched it too with us. And it was great lessons to learn for my young men. And most recently, she's in White Lotus. I shouldn't say was, but in White Lotus. Go ahead, clap it up now. I have to confess, I didn't know she was in White Lotus because I didn't watch White Lotus. But in preparation for this, now I can't stop watching White Lotus. You watch it too though, don't you?

[Michelle Obama]

I watch everything.

[Craig Robinson]

And she also has a company, Big Hattie Productions, that develops bold, inclusive stories that center around underrepresented voices. And she was recently announced to produce, write, and star in the adaptation of the viral TikTok story called who the F F did I Marry?

[Michelle Obama]

Can't wait for.

[Craig Robinson]

So without further ado, let's get Natasha out here, please.

[Michelle Obama]

Natasha Rothwell.

[Natasha Rothwell]

My God.

[Michelle Obama]

Thank you. I have been so excited to talk to you. We've been talking about you for weeks and weeks and weeks and I feel like I know you. I told Natasha she is now a cousin. It's like cousin Natasha. So welcome. Welcome to imo. Thank you for being here. Welcome to the vineyard.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah.

[Michelle Obama]

Have you.

[Natasha Rothwell]

This is my second time.

[Michelle Obama]

Okay, when was the first time you were here?

[Natasha Rothwell]

This is my first time, like all over. Cause it's with you, so this might as well be the first time.

[Craig Robinson]

You see how nice she's being to Natasha? She hasn't been here as much as I've been here.

[Michelle Obama]

Well, how has it been? Have you been able to taste any of the fruits of Martha's Vineyard? Are you in and out?

[Natasha Rothwell]

I was like yesterday. So I plan on doing a lot of tasting tomorrow.

[Michelle Obama]

And I'll be getting a lobster roll.

[Natasha Rothwell]

I gotta get the lobster roll.

[Michelle Obama]

Some shrimp.

[Natasha Rothwell]

I'm gonna drive by the airport.

[Michelle Obama]

It's fascinating. Actually, one of the best place to get fried shrimp is at. At the airport. Oh, there's great food at the airport. In the airport area.

[Craig Robinson]

There's a great breakfast at the airport.

[Michelle Obama]

Ok. What do you know about the breakfast?

[Craig Robinson]

Cause I'm always coming in to see you.

[Michelle Obama]

That's how I know one of my favorite scenes in this season of White Lotus. And for those of you, you guys have had to have seen White Lotus, but Belinda returns, and we love Belinda. Can you talk a little bit about what Belinda is now doing in White Lotus before I talk about my favorite.

[Natasha Rothwell]

In season one, we see her, and she's with Jennifer Coolidge's character, Tanya, and she gets lied to. And so this is kind of her victory lap. She gets to come back, go to Thailand, learn more about the craft of massage, has a little fling, and gets. Gets to. I don't want to ruin it for people who haven't seen it, but if you haven't seen it by now, that's on y'. All. The man who is responsible for killing Tanya, she's able to hustle a little $5 million out of that.

[Michelle Obama]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But not only does Belinda get her groove thing on, but one of my favorite scenes, because this is this luxury resort and the scene where you're having tea or lunch by yourself and you spot a black couple.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah.

[Michelle Obama]

And most of us know when you're doing something really nice somewhere special and you see other black people.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah.

[Michelle Obama]

And you got that. We know each other. I love that part.

[Natasha Rothwell]

I pitch that to Mike. He's such a collaborative writer, director, and season one, we started working together because he's very aware that he's not a black woman. So in writing the character, I wanted to infuse that authenticity. And when we were working on season three, I was just like, mike, there has to be a moment where Belinda sees someone who looks like her and almost seeing what's possible for herself because she's there under work circumstances, but that couple's there just for them. And so just to have that look make the cut. Because you never know when you shoot something if it's actually gonna make the cut. I was so thrilled, and so many people bring that moment up because it's just authentic to the experience.

[Michelle Obama]

Well, it tells the whole a fuller story of what it means to be black. We leisure, we travel, we leisure, and we leisure all up and down Martha's Vineyard, don't we? And that's one of the beautiful things to see that, you know, we gotta make sure the rest of the world knows that we are traveled and exposed and we do things besides serve other people.

[Natasha Rothwell]

That's right. That's right.

[Michelle Obama]

So, so glad to have you Here. But I want folks to get to know, you know, you, because you got an interesting background. I didn't realize that you were a military kid.

[Natasha Rothwell]

That's right.

[Michelle Obama]

You know, traveled around and I don't know if you know, but as First Lady, I spent a lot of time lifting up military families just like yours. And I just want to thank you, your family, for your service. Absolutely. I'm always curious about how that experience has shaped you as a person, because you moved around a lot.

[Natasha Rothwell]

I moved around a ton.

[Michelle Obama]

Do you view yourself as a military kid?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Absolutely. I'm an Air Force brat. My dad retired as commander at Fort Dix in New Jersey and Clock it. But moving around, I went to two high schools, two middle schools, two elementary schools. And it's all I knew. But the nucleus of the family, that was home. So it really hit home for me that it's not a place that's home. It's the people. And that has always stayed with me. And I do think that that upbringing uniquely prepared me for the life of an artist, because I pick up and move all the time. I was in Thailand for six months and shot in London for five months before that, and then Toronto five months. And so being able to move someplace, connect, establish a family and create memories and to let go of that and to move on, it's all I know. So it definitely prepared me for my life as it is now. But I think my adult life has been one of trying to find roots, you know, like to plant myself someplace. And I still get a little antsy, but I'm in LA right now, and that feels like where, you know, the roots are.

[Michelle Obama]

And, you know, just listening to you, you kind of describe yourself as an introvert, right?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Very much.

[Michelle Obama]

I mean, we wouldn't be able to see that in you. Oh, I am. What kind. Were you always that way? Were you that kid in the family? Like, for me and Craig, Craig was the outside. Outside. He was always trying to be outside. And it took me a second to be ready to deal with other kids. Cause kids were a hassle, you know?

[Craig Robinson]

Yeah, she was an introvert. She was an introvert.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah.

[Craig Robinson]

Yeah.

[Michelle Obama]

Until I decided I need to go outside. Right. Cause nobody's here. So let me get outside. It's just me.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Got a little boring. Gotta go outside eventually.

[Michelle Obama]

Gotta go outside eventually.

[Natasha Rothwell]

No, I am an introverted extrovert. I know how to show up publicly. But it is a draining exercise to be around people.

[Michelle Obama]

Oh, a lot of people are relating. Yeah.

[Natasha Rothwell]

So I recharge. I love my me time. And so as I've gotten older, I have to be really conscious about who I'm spending that time with. Cause that's an expenditure of energy that I've stored up. And so if I'm gonna go out, it has to be worth it. Right? The juice has to be worth the squeeze. And not everybody's worth the squeeze. That's something I've learned as I've gotten older. But I'm very neurospicy. And so for me.

[Michelle Obama]

Tell us more about that.

[Natasha Rothwell]

I have ADHD and a little toe on the tism. I don't have.

[Michelle Obama]

Like, I.

[Natasha Rothwell]

My neuropsychologist was just like, you got toe on the tism, but you're not quite there. But I have a unique way about seeing the world. And having the language of that as an adult has been immensely helpful. Cause when I was younger, I mean, I didn't get diagnosed until last year.

[Michelle Obama]

Yeah, that's.

[Natasha Rothwell]

And so my life up until that point has been understanding that I've been spicy but not knowing the exact flavor. And now that I do, it's allowed me to tap into communities who are also ADHD and explore symptoms of being on the spectrum. And, yeah, you find the community. And it's been easier for me to advocate for my needs because I no longer think it's just a moral failure, that I need you to repeat yourself. It's now, oh, if I'm in front of you and you're giving me verbal directions, I may need you to repeat yourself or give me written directions or instructions. And I can now do those things with a sense of pride as opposed to shame beforehand, because I thought, you know, if I were only, you know, more disciplined, if I was, you know, if I paid better attention. So the diagnosis definitely helped me stand in my power, because I do feel like all of the spiciness in that, whatever you possess is a superpower.

[Michelle Obama]

Yeah.

[Craig Robinson]

Hope you're enjoying our special live episode taped here on Martha's Vineyard. You all heard me talking about how I've been tooling around town in my sister's R1s, which Rivian gifted us. And I have to tell you, Meesh, I had such a blast. I drove around the island. I stopped off at the harbor where all the personal boats go in, and kind of showed the Rivian off a little bit and had a couple of guys toot their horn like, nice car.

[Michelle Obama]

There are a lot of Rivian drivers on the island.

[Craig Robinson]

Yeah. And then we went by that hotel. That's where you can see the lighthouse.

[Natasha Rothwell]

What's the name of it.

[Michelle Obama]

Harborview Inn.

[Craig Robinson]

Harborview Inn. That's it. And hung out there. And I thought about going in to get a cup of coffee, but I didn't want to leave your car out there by itself, so.

[Michelle Obama]

I appreciate that.

[Craig Robinson]

But the best part was I was in downtown Edgartown, and you know how hard it is to park on those little narrow streets.

[Michelle Obama]

Narrow streets, little bitty spaces, man.

[Craig Robinson]

So we were right across from the bookstore, and lo and behold, this guy pulls out, and I'm like, I'm gonna park in there. And I start parallel parking. And I'm using all six of the cameras, right? And I'm worried that I'm gonna scratch up your car. And I was like, you can't borrow your sister's car and then scratch it up.

[Michelle Obama]

You can't get the first ding on the car.

[Craig Robinson]

No, no.

[Michelle Obama]

But unacceptable.

[Craig Robinson]

I squeezed that baby in there perfect. There's like 3 inches in the front, 3 inches in the back. And the guy behind me was waiting patiently. And as he goes by, he slows down and he gives me the old thumbs up. Thumbs up. Like, nice park job, buddy.

[Michelle Obama]

You think he just wasn't happy to see a Rivian? You think it was your parking job?

[Craig Robinson]

No, it was totally the parking job. It was totally. But I gotta tell you, when Aaron and I have been riding around town, we absolutely see what you see when you. Why you come here so often.

[Michelle Obama]

Yeah, Finally. I mean, this is a beautiful place, and it's the perfect place to own a Rivian because it's family fun and activity. I mean, the girls, when they come here, the first thing they do is get in that car. They go to the beach. They use the, you know, the ice bucket, their cooler. The cooler in the front. They use it more than me. But this is. This is the place where Rivians come to thrive. And we're so happy to have our Rivian here. This is beautiful island, beautiful community, and people enjoy their cars here.

[Craig Robinson]

We'll be coming back, and we'll be using it too. So we've had a blast this week on Martha's Vineyard and have loved exploring the island in the Rivian. Go learn more about Rivian's full lineup of adventure. Ready all electric trucks and [e-mail]. so, Natasha, you go ahead. Yeah. Clap it up. Yeah. So now that you've been diagnosed and you look back on your upbringing.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah.

[Craig Robinson]

How did that. At what point do you think that came into play in you becoming an artist?

[Natasha Rothwell]

A huge amount. Well, one when I do look back, it's tinged with grief because there's a huge part of myself when I was younger that really felt like I was working so hard to mask the energy I expended to show up and not be trouble for the teacher, cause an issue. But also I recognize my strength in that as well, because I was able to manage. I do think that having the diagnoses now and looking back, it's clear to me that for boys, the ADHD of it, it's external, but for a lot of women, especially black women, it's internal. So I had a vivid, robust inner world. And so when I put pen to page, it was like the faucet got turned on and I could, you know, I would write these characters and I would be able to tap into these vivid world building, you know, exercises that I, you know, luckily I had theater departments in my elementary and middle schools and high schools. And so it unlocked that in me and gave me permission to be that free with my thinking. And so it really made sense of me as a person, the creative arts. And I think for a lot of people who experience the world differently, I do think that arts are an amazing place to sort of find your voice because there is that freedom to explore.

[Michelle Obama]

And it is so powerful. Absolutely. Natasha, for you to share your story, your diagnosis as an adult, as a black woman, because our community, sometimes we, you know, we don't. We're afraid to own the neurodiversity that runs throughout the entire population, but because of sometimes our beliefs that we don't want to embrace that. And I think that it's so important for black parents, black families, to understand that, you know, our kids do come in all shapes, sizes and colors, and there's no shame in being able to diagnose it, treat it, parent it properly.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah.

[Michelle Obama]

And if we're not talking about it.

[Natasha Rothwell]

That'S why I try to use my platform to talk about not just the adhd, but I also have anxiety, depression, triple threat.

[Michelle Obama]

Way to go, girl. She is an overachiever.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Did I talk about an overachiever? Because I think that, like, one, you know, name it to de shame it, you know. And so for me, I have to be able to talk about my experience. And so many people have come up to me, especially women of color are just like, oh, no, I have anxiety, depression too. And I was like, amazing. Are you on the spectrum? Let's talk about it.

[Michelle Obama]

Yes.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Like, I think the more we talk about it, it becomes less of a stigma. We destigmatize it by living our Experience. And so if that's one thing I can do with the platform I've been given, I'm happy with that.

[Michelle Obama]

Absolutely. Absolute. You also have parents that have been married for 47 years.

[Natasha Rothwell]

47 years.

[Michelle Obama]

47 years. That's wonderful.

[Natasha Rothwell]

They're on a cruise right now.

[Michelle Obama]

Tell them we said, hey.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Oh, my goodness. They are so. Like, I've done some things in my life. This is. My parents are like. They're just like, this is the most important thing you've ever done. So they will be thrilled.

[Michelle Obama]

We're gonna take a picture, send it to them.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Oh, my goodness.

[Michelle Obama]

40, 27 years of marriage growing you one of three siblings? Four.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah. I have three siblings.

[Michelle Obama]

Yeah. Okay. What have you learned from your parents long marriage? What has that taught you about love, about what you want in life?

[Natasha Rothwell]

I mean, it's not the entire reason, but I would say it plays a part in the reason why I'm happily single now because I've seen love that is worthy, and I know what I want.

[Michelle Obama]

Yes. Everyone take a pause on that. Yes.

[Natasha Rothwell]

And in 47 years, I'm gonna try not to get emotional when I talk about this, but their love looks. We got tissue now. You got tissues. Their love looks different now. It looks like, you know, my mom knowing my dad's medication when he forgets, it's, you know, my. My dad holding my mom's purse while she's picking up his prescription at the doctor. They know each other intimately, and they love to support each other. And it's a beautiful thing to observe. But I do think that when I was younger, I found it oppressive because I was just like. My other friend's parents were divorced, and I was just like, I just want permission to go wild. And they just like, nah, we good.

[Michelle Obama]

You got no excuse. No excuse.

[Natasha Rothwell]

No excuse. But, no, it's an amazing model to have. And it's work. I've seen the work. Like, they don't. They don't. They show their. They show their work in the math problem that is love. They're just like. We talk to each other, we have hard conversations. And, yeah, they're just wonderful role models.

[Michelle Obama]

But yet you feel fully empowered to embrace being single out here.

[Natasha Rothwell]

100%. 100%. I am. I'm childless by choice. I don't want kids. I have two amazing dogs, and I have a beautiful house that I nicknamed my peace palace. And I have so much love in my life. And I think in my 20s, I thought that romantic love was more important than any other kind of love. Platonic Fraternal, familial. And as I've gotten older and being single, it has highlighted and elevated the other kinds of love that is in my life. And it's abundant. And so if I hyper fixate on romantic love, I ignore the rest. My life is hollow. And so I'm really. I feel like my life is full. And romantic love, while it's something that I want, I know it has to match this amazing life that I've worked so hard to build. And you know what I mean?

[Craig Robinson]

That's a great point.

[Michelle Obama]

Yes. Yeah.

[Craig Robinson]

Remember that point. Would anybody be upset if we introduced you to somebody?

[Michelle Obama]

What's he doing?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Introduce me? God is good. God is good. And all the time. That's right. To answer your question, I would love to be set up.

[Craig Robinson]

Okay. Okay.

[Michelle Obama]

So what? Do you have somebody in mind?

[Craig Robinson]

That's not your business. You married? You married.

[Natasha Rothwell]

We gonna be at the airport having a conversation.

[Craig Robinson]

She married. Even though a lot of people think y' all ain't married. She married. Let me handle my side of the discussion, please.

[Michelle Obama]

Okay. Oh, my God.

[Craig Robinson]

Okay.

[Natasha Rothwell]

It's Christmas.

[Michelle Obama]

But why? I. I like this conversation about owning. Being able to love yourself, especially as women. Especially as black women. Because sometimes. And we could talk all about this, sometimes we don't have the choice to be chosen. You know? And I am. You know, I am tired of so many amazing black women waiting to feel worthy because somebody hasn't chose them or they haven't chosen somebody. And I'm trying to instill in my daughters right now that marriage should be a choice. Yes. And sometimes we send subliminal messages to our kids. See, they could be doing great things. And it's like, well, are you dating anyone? Yeah. You know, or you could be conquering the world. And it's like, well, you're gonna have a baby.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Right?

[Michelle Obama]

You know, all the while sending the message that who you are isn't good enough until you are partnered, paired off and pregnant.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Ye. Yes.

[Michelle Obama]

I.

[Natasha Rothwell]

I do not. And I do not believe that romantic love is a prerequisite for living your life.

[Michelle Obama]

I agree.

[Natasha Rothwell]

And I think so often. And, you know, my parents are 47 years married. They're traditional, you know, and so for them, it took a minute for them to understand that, like, no, I'm buying my house myself. You know, like, I'm doing these things because that's living my life. I'm going to vacation when I want to vacation.

[Michelle Obama]

Yes.

[Natasha Rothwell]

But there was a point where I was like, I remember when I lived in New York City, it was A very romantic thing to walk across the Brooklyn Bridge. And so when I moved there, I was like, I'm gonna save it for a romantic date. And it's gonna. And then luckily, that was around the time I started therapy. And by the time I left New York, I took my damn self across the bridge.

[Michelle Obama]

Really?

[Natasha Rothwell]

And had a great time.

[Michelle Obama]

Yes, had a great time.

[Natasha Rothwell]

And that was eye opening. Cause I do think that there is this idea of. Of waiting and that your not enoughness will persist until you have someone else to see you, see yourself, see each other. Like, there's no reason why Joy can't be present now with where you are.

[Craig Robinson]

This segment is brought to you by Progressive Insurance, a brand who believes that everyone should have the access and opportunity to own a home. What are some of the firsts that we were able to accomplish in our family?

[Michelle Obama]

What were some of our firsts? Well, I was probably the first first lady in our family. You were the first person to get drafted by the NBA.

[Craig Robinson]

Yes, I sure was. And the first to actually play professionally overseas.

[Michelle Obama]

Right. We were the first in our family to graduate from Ivy League schools. You were the first person in our family to live abroad.

[Craig Robinson]

Ooh, that's a good one. That's a good one.

[Michelle Obama]

We are the first people in our family to have our own amazing brother, sister podcast.

[Craig Robinson]

Yes.

[Michelle Obama]

And that has been an amazing first.

[Craig Robinson]

That's been a really fun first. That's been a really fun first. And it feels like it's a first that the whole family can celebrate because, you know, everyone is giving us ideas and opinions.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yes.

[Craig Robinson]

And it's been really fun spending time hanging out together. And, you know, it feels like we haven't been together in a long time, and we've just been apart for about a couple of months, which was no time. That was nothing in the past.

[Michelle Obama]

And the thing about being the first is that sometimes it can be a little scary, like starting this podcast, even though we're having a lot of fun now, we've never done this before, and there was a little trepidation about, how's it gonna work? Are people gonna enjoy it? Are we gonna have enough to say week after week, can we get guests? Can we get guests? Will anybody come and talk to us? So the first come with a lot of fear but a lot of excitement and a lot of reward. So we recommend being the first.

[Craig Robinson]

And for a lot of folks, that first might be buying a home, something no one in their family has done before. Homeownership is more than just buying a house. It's about creating opportunities. That's where Progressive comes in. Through a $7 million commitment to housing initiatives in 2024 and the recent creation of a down payment assistance program called the Upper Up Payment, Progressive is helping people attain their first homes, maintain them through life's challenges, and build generational wealth. Homeownership isn't just a milestone. It can be your first step in changing your family's financial future. If you're ready to make your first move, visit progressive.com OpenTheHouse to find helpful resources and educational tools for every step of the home ownership journey. Progressive Insurance is here to help you open the door. So I've heard you talk about a red. I should say I've read you talk about unlearning how to be a people pleaser.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah.

[Craig Robinson]

And you hear the oomphs out there. Cause there's quite a few people pleasers. And sometimes, culturally, you have to be a people pleaser.

[Michelle Obama]

Sure.

[Craig Robinson]

But tell us how you went about systematically unlearning that.

[Natasha Rothwell]

It's a daily practice. I mean, I grew up in the church, and martyrdom is the best thing you can be. You know, like, you can be a needless wonder and be praised for it in the church. And I think for me, it was recognizing that in my deference for other people's needs and my recognizing and being attuned to other people's, you know, physical and emotional needs, I have to put myself at the top of that list. And inserting myself into that conversation was very difficult. It came. I mean, it got so bad when I was. This was when I was a teenager. I was a vegetarian for 12 years. But now I love a burger. They're delicious. At the time, I was visiting a friend's house, and their mom made, like, chicken enchiladas. And I ate the chicken while being a vegetarian because that's how bad my people pleasing was. I was so scared to be an imposition. And my needs are not an imposition.

[Michelle Obama]

Yeah.

[Natasha Rothwell]

And it was recognizing the importance of honoring my needs in the company of other people, not just when I'm by myself. And. And I do think that being able to articulate my needs and standing and backing myself has been a huge part of the process. No, I don't want the chicken enchiladas.

[Michelle Obama]

Like, thank you.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Thank you so much. But also, I think there's this fear that if you make someone unhappy, you're responsible for their joy.

[Michelle Obama]

And we say that again.

[Natasha Rothwell]

You feel like you're responsible for other people's happiness if you aren't pleasing them. And that's on them. That is on them. And so it definitely. It's a process because it's like a phantom limb. Even though I've let it go, I can still feel it creep up, but now I can recognize it in real time and really pause. I really. If folks are struggling, pause before and check in with yourself in the authenticity of who you are. Is this a decision that I want, that I need before you say yes to something, before you do anything? And I've definitely taken the mantra in terms of my life in Hollywood. There's no in the middle. It's either a hell yes or a hell no. And that has also helped me to be like, I really want to do this. I have to check in with myself. But stillness has been a huge antidote to people pleasing because I'm able to put that stop gap into, you know, being quick to make sure their feelings are okay.

[Michelle Obama]

So you are an introverted people pleaser. My therapist newly diagnosed adhd. And you work in Hollywood.

[Natasha Rothwell]

I do.

[Michelle Obama]

You picked the right place. Right. How did you know? How did your sort of life lead you into what you're doing now? What was that path like for you? Because you've had some interesting stops along the way.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah. I had no aspirations for Hollywood. I thought I was gonna be a Broadway theater actor. I thought me and Audra McDonald would be best friends. And I just loved performing so much. I went to college for acting, but I would write my audition monologue. So writing was a huge part of my process as well. And again, to get spiritual with it. I knew from that moment of walking across that stage of my degree in acting, that I was walking in my purpose, that I knew that I was doing something I had been called to do. And it was scary. I was very, very broke in New York, and then it's very scary to leave New York to go to la. But I do feel that every when I look back at my career, each one of those doors I didn't open myself, and that I was really listening to my creative self as I was putting pen to page or auditioning for something. And I'm grateful for that because it's a career that's very unexpected and nothing that I could have planned even if I wanted to. And I also had to sort of reimagine dreams for myself because my dreams were too small.

[Michelle Obama]

Really? What were some of the. How did you talk a bit more about that?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah, I think, you know, for me, I was just like, oh, I'd love to do a play one day. You know, I didn't know I would be, you know, creating my own show. I didn't know I'd be a writer on Issa's show or be Kelly. I didn't know White Lotus was in the future or Wonka or anything else. So when I achieved what I thought was big, I was like, well, damn, I need, like, what do I really want? And. And when I realized that my career had given me a position of power and influence, that's when I created my production company. Because I know that I am drawn to. Even before I had decision or agency in my career, I was drawn to characters and stories that centered marginalized voices that uplifted the stories that were usually relegated to the sidelines. So I was like, oh, yeah, that's how I dream bigger for myself. I create a company. I help others, you know, artists who have stories to tell and give them that platform. And that's been a huge dream. Realized that I'm, like, still in the process of realizing. And I think for me, it's, again, pause. Taking a step back and being really deliberate about the things I decide to do, because time is short, and I want to make sure I invest the gifts I've been given in a way that will continue to yield.

[Craig Robinson]

So can you talk about deliberate how on earth? Now, you all probably don't know this, but you spent time in Japan.

[Michelle Obama]

Mm.

[Craig Robinson]

That was what jumped off the page to me. I was like, what? This wasn't in your moving around as a military, as an Air Force brat. You went there to do what? Can you tell us about that whole situation?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah. I was in my 20s, and I had finished college. I was working in D.C. acting and working at Woolly Mammoth Theater and Studio Theater and really trying to figure out D.C. and I'd finished that. And I knew I wanted to go to New York, but I didn't feel like I had lived a lot of life. And so I was like, oh, I want an adventure. And to. I want. I was trying to go to London and be on my black Bridget Jones.

[Michelle Obama]

But that didn't work.

[Natasha Rothwell]

I had trouble getting a visa there. So my search for adventure moved further and further east. And I know Japan has the JET program, which is their big teaching English program, but I didn't do that. I found a tiny, tiny ass school that wanted someone with a theatrical background to perform conversations with students. I was like, well, I'm an actor, and I can do that. And part of my hustle gig in D.C. was being a teaching artist at Arena Stage. And so I Had taught kids. And so I said yes to this program because they would sponsor my Visa and fly me out. I would have to fly myself back. I would have to figure out rent and all that kind of stuff. And I jumped on it. And it was a part time job. And there's a Tokyo Comedy Store which is equivalent to Boom Chicago for comedy folks. It's like this comedy theater at the Crocodile Club in Tokyo. They found out that I was like a ringer for improv comedy. And they're like, would you be a part of this program? So I did that part time and taught part time and was black in Japan. It was crazy.

[Craig Robinson]

And this was English in Japan?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah, yeah, it was.

[Michelle Obama]

So you did improv, English, improv in Japan?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah.

[Michelle Obama]

What was your biggest joke? What landed? What landed?

[Craig Robinson]

What made them laugh?

[Natasha Rothwell]

I will say I don't remember a specific joke, but I'm so appreciative of the experience because the audience was filled with expats, not just us expats, but like English speakers from all walks of life, all over the world. And so I couldn't come to them with my like funny DC comedy like, you know, summer intern on the Hill joke because they wouldn't get that. They understood universal humor. They understood when the, you know, the employee had. Has a higher status than the boss, that's funny. So it really taught me about, like, what is universally funny and how do you communicate that across language barriers? Yeah, I don't remember any specific jokes, but they loved it when it was just like you come in with the broom and someone is looking like they're the boss and then you hit them in the head or whatever. If you exert power and subvert expectations, that was a big laugh. Always.

[Michelle Obama]

And being black in Asia, right?

[Natasha Rothwell]

That was. Wow.

[Michelle Obama]

I mean, that's a whole situation. We've spent time in Asia and I can tell you, you know, even with Secret Service or whatever, we, you know. Can I tell you quite an experience.

[Natasha Rothwell]

You were a part of my Japanese experience.

[Michelle Obama]

Oh, tell us more.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Because I was there in 2007 into 2008. And so I was in my apartment and my dad had the phone to the television to get the results of the election. And so I was there listening. Cause I couldn't get it on tv, so I was up late and he had the phone there. And when you won, I just remember the next day I was riding my bike to teach and people were just like, obama, Simone doesn't live. You're so Obama. Like, yes, yes. You couldn't tell me that you were cousins? I was like, yes, Obama, that's why I'm here. I'm here, Obama.

[Michelle Obama]

Thank you. That's why I'm here.

[Natasha Rothwell]

True story. True story.

[Michelle Obama]

That is great. Did they treat you better?

[Natasha Rothwell]

They did. I would go in the shops, and they'd be like, obama's. And I was like, hi.

[Michelle Obama]

Told you we were cousins. Told you we were cousins. Now, how did your folks feel about it? You know, black child and creativity, you know, coming from the church where they, like, girl, you got a plan B.

[Natasha Rothwell]

They didn't have a plan B. They were so supportive. And I was originally. I made drama where there was none. I originally majored in journalism because I thought that's what they would want, because a theater. You know, majoring in theater, they wouldn't like. And I wrote all the time, so it made sense. And after my first semester, I remember I came home during the Christmas break and sat them down and came out as a thespian.

[Michelle Obama]

And they were like, hold your head.

[Natasha Rothwell]

No, no. Oh, baby, no. We still on track. We still on track.

[Michelle Obama]

We'll like her. We'll like her.

[Natasha Rothwell]

And then the first thing out of their mouth was just like, well, we were confused about the journalism thing. We knew you'd love to act, and we wanted to support whatever you do. And so it was wonderfully supportive.

[Michelle Obama]

Has there been a thing that you've done in your career that made them think, oh, this is. Now we get it.

[Natasha Rothwell]

This. Yeah.

[Michelle Obama]

Oh, man. Not Issa. Sorry. Issa. Girl, you didn't count.

[Natasha Rothwell]

No, Saturday Night Live was good for them. That was when I wrote for them. They were just, like. They were, you know, fans of the show to. So to see my name on the credits. They were really excited.

[Michelle Obama]

Tell us about your. Oh, I'm sorry.

[Craig Robinson]

Yeah, she. She's bogarting the whole discussion.

[Michelle Obama]

I'm sorry. It's Natasha.

[Craig Robinson]

I understand. She's in her favorite place with one of her favorite people. I get it, I get it, I get it. But I might ask a couple.

[Michelle Obama]

Okay, okay, okay. I'll stand down.

[Craig Robinson]

So, writer, actor, producer, which one do you like to do most?

[Natasha Rothwell]

I don't have a favorite. But, you know, dance with the one that brung you. Acting is such a huge part of my identity, and I do think I had this conversation recently with Issa and Yvonne and Jay. We were all chatting, you know, so much of what we've done since then, we've had to write and produce ourselves. And that's just a lot of work, which we love to do, but it is sort of a sweat equity you put in. And so while I love that it's amazing to go to White Lotus and just show up and do acting and go back to my room and, you know, leave it there. So it's been fun.

[Michelle Obama]

What's been the difference? What's the difference being in a black writers room? I mean, that's a, you know, address. Yes.

[Natasha Rothwell]

I went to Insecure after snl and at SNL at the time I was the only black writer in a 40 year old institution. And I remember and Prentices told this story who was the co showrunner with Issa. The first day, I remember raising my hand to talk and Prentice looked at me and he was like, why your hand up? And I was just like, oh. I just, I don't. Cause there were so many. It was very hierarchical at SNL where it was just like, if you're a freshman writer, like you can't talk at this tape. Like there was a lot of rules that you had to sort of weren't told to you. You had to figure it out. And he was just like, no, he's like, you're at the table. And I remember just leaning back and I was just like blown away by like the openness of the space. And at the first, after the first writer's room, I went to my car and sobbed. Just cried because I felt so seen when you walk in and there's already hot sauce and cocoa butter on the table. What more can you ask for?

[Michelle Obama]

Say no more, say no more. Say no more. Say no more. How did you wind up getting the Insecure gig? What was the, you know, I FaceTimed.

[Natasha Rothwell]

With Issa from Brooklyn, my studio apartment. I was wearing what I call a human mullet. I just had fancy clothes from the waist up and pajamas on the bottom. And we FaceTime and we just connected. And so I got hired as a writer and two weeks into the or a month into the writer's room, Kelly was created on the page and we would do readings in the writer's room of the character. And I was so focused on writing because it was my first scripted room after snl. I had no, I didn't have any crosshairs on being on the screen. I just knew that when she would cast the writers to read the scripts aloud, she'd always cast me as Kelly. And one day she called me into her office with Prentice and I was just like, oh, Lord, I'm in trouble. I made one too many. Joe, I'm done. And they're like, they're like, we Want you to play Kelly. And again, I cry a lot. I cried because I went from some place where I was screaming to be seen to another place that saw all of me and acknowledged all those parts. So that's the thing I credit up for Issa is that she wasn't just like, okay, you're a writer. Just stay in that lane. She's just like, whatever you got, I'm gonna use. And she used that part of me and that talent. And Kelly changed my life.

[Michelle Obama]

Oh, my. Kelly was my favorite character. I mean, really. I mean, was there a bond? I mean, was the girlfriend energy real? I know it always doesn't translate. Doesn't have to translate off of the screen. But just curious. I mean, we love Issa. Lisa's been on the show. She's my girl.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Love her to death.

[Michelle Obama]

She's so real. She's so real.

[Natasha Rothwell]

There's no manufacturing that level of authenticity. And I think that I move through the world with that level of vulnerability. And so, to some people's chagrin, it can be kind of cringe to be this vulnerable, but I very much don't care. It's been wonderful to rely on each other, especially in Hollywood, because we can reach out. And yo, I'm at Fox and they're sending me this in my contract. Is that what you got? No, actually ask for this. And so there are resources as well as just being like. So it's been wonderful.

[Michelle Obama]

And now you are two time Emmy nominated. Can you believe? Twice?

[Natasha Rothwell]

I can't even.

[Michelle Obama]

And you're the only black woman nominated in this category this year. So congratulations. Thank you.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Thank you so much.

[Michelle Obama]

Truly, so proud. So, so deserving.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Thank you.

[Michelle Obama]

So what does it feel like? Is your life changed?

[Craig Robinson]

Yes.

[Michelle Obama]

I love that. Tell us more.

[Natasha Rothwell]

And this sounds so like Pollyanna, but I've already won. Do you know what I mean? Like, the nomination is just an acknowledgement from my peers that I've done good work.

[Michelle Obama]

So do people really feel that, or do you really wanna win?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Listen, I watch Hardware like everybody else. I like Hardware.

[Michelle Obama]

Let's be real.

[Natasha Rothwell]

But I'm satiated in knowing that, that I've done a good job. And I think that the moment the award becomes more important than the work, I've lost the plot.

[Michelle Obama]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Beautiful, beautiful.

[Craig Robinson]

That's so important in all walks of life.

[Natasha Rothwell]

100%.

[Craig Robinson]

All walks of life.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah. Because that is fleeting. Famous fleeting. That's also other. Like, I did not know I would be a famous person. I had no desire to be. I just knew I would Say, this is from the time when I was in high school doing theater. I was like, I wanna do good work with good people. That was my. Like, that's what I want. And that being my true north has got me here. And I'm not changing that.

[Craig Robinson]

What in your background makes you that way? Because I'm sitting here and listening to you talk about collaborating with all these different people. But I think you have to have a certain personality and a certain upbringing to be a natural team player.

[Michelle Obama]

Yeah.

[Craig Robinson]

Where does that come from?

[Natasha Rothwell]

I mean, I think it comes from a lot of places. I think a military background, you know, that definitely has the focus. I think I've always loved collaborative things. I'm one of four. You know, we're a little unit, dysfunctional, but we love it. And I think for me, I get joy in that process. And that's just always been true. That's why I've never attempted standup. People often confuse me for Michelle Buteau. They're like, you just stand up, girl. I'm like, no, because I prefer, like, I prefer improv and sketch where it's just like, let's all get together and see, like, the best idea wins. It may not be mine. And so I get. I genuinely get joy from that. And I think that, like, you know, growing up the way I did and. Yeah, I just think that there is.

[Michelle Obama]

A.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah, it's kind of indescribable when you see someone else light up because of something you did and then that sparks something else. There's this connectivity that makes it really present.

[Michelle Obama]

And especially in this crowd, especially with young people. I have a young creative child. I think a lot of young creatives, especially kids of color, young people of color, with all that's going on in the world, they wonder, is there still room for this? Is this still relevant? And I want you to talk a bit about that because I think how not to die alone. The projects that you work on, you know, your perspective of telling a story that doesn't get told. I just want you to speak to not just the audience here, but to all the young artists out there who might doubt that their voice matters, especially as the industry is changing. And I'd love for you to speak to that.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Absolutely. It's so funny. When Insecure was on the air, we were very. On social media as a writer's room and as the actors and interfacing with audiences and, you know, being a plus size black woman on the show, I would get, you know, plus size black women hit me up and be like, well, that's not my experience or that's not the version that I want to see. And my response was always, pick up a pen. Yeah, pick up a pen. Because your perspective is just as valid and necessary. And I think now more than ever, as I limply gesture to the state of the world, we need to be inserting our voices into the narrative in a way that makes sense for us. It's such a personal thing to tell a story. And there's the quote, write what you know, right? And so you know what you know. I know what I know. And I think it's so important for also young creators to know that in their pocket is a phone that is a movie studio. Do not wait for someone else to give you permission to live your dream. Do it now. I mean that one of the biggest mistakes I made, I used to not call myself a writer until someone else did and I had outsourced my power to someone else. So if you're a writer, write. If you're a director, direct. If you're an actor, act, shoot something. And, and it's gonna be probably shitty because you make bad things. But you know, it's be prolific, not perfect. Right. Create work enough that your bad gets good, your good gets better, and your better is the best. And I think that there's glory in the attempt collaborate. Yeah. There's so much space at the table. And don't ever think that you have to get, you know, permission to come to it. Pull up a chair. Pull up chair.

[Craig Robinson]

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[Michelle Obama]

We're going to be jumping to the listener question, but I do want you because this is one project I really don't know. Why the F did I get married? What's the backstory to that?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Because that's your next project, right? Yes. Who the F did I marry?

[Michelle Obama]

Oh yeah, Who?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Theresa Johnson. I mean, she put up this TikTok series on Valentine's Day and I started.

[Michelle Obama]

Watching it, but I couldn't get through the whole thing.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Well, I will say a cheat code for it. Someone brilliantly put it on Spotify so you can listen to it.

[Michelle Obama]

Okay, I'll do that.

[Natasha Rothwell]

So it's a nice little like put it on and go on a walk. But it's one of the most radical acts of vulnerability that I've ever seen because she goes into detail about how she married someone who was a pathological liar. And I didn't know anything about it either. I was minding my business in Thailand doing Belinda and my family. We got this cousin text chain with 25 of us and they put some fan art in the text chain and they thought it was real because they don't know and it was a cover art for who the f did I marry with me next to a very chocolate man. And so I was like, what is this? Because I'm getting tagged in it and people are making fan art. I was like, what is this? So I took a listen to it and I was so moved by her story. Not just for the salaciousness of the details that she recounts and not just the fact that it got a half. Like, it got half a billion, 500 million impressions. I was blown away that she fearlessly was telling the story and still believed in love after that. And so I was just like, oh, this is a beauty from ashes story. This is a phoenix rising from the ash, and there's power in that. And there's this beautiful woman who after everything she's been through, shared her story to help someone else. So that's how we connected. And when the rights to the story became available in Hollywood, and this just goes to my sort of walking in purpose, it was a six way bidding war. And my big caddy Productions, we were kind of fledgling. You know, there was like the Shondas and the Lee Daniels. Everyone was throwing their hat in the ring because to get 500 million people to sit down and watch something, Hollywood sits up and takes notice. And so I just, I got the opportunity to FaceTime with her and we just connected. And my team was just like, should we connect with one of the bigger pods? And I was like, no. I was like, you know, if it's meant to be, it's meant to be.

[Michelle Obama]

And.

[Natasha Rothwell]

And we beat Shonda, y'. All, we got it. So I love Shonda, but I was also just like, this is crazy.

[Michelle Obama]

Yeah, yeah.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Is she?

[Michelle Obama]

Sure.

[Natasha Rothwell]

But I'm so thrilled to be able to, you know, produce the story and also play the role. So that way it can also, I mean, it's in line with the mission of the caddy, of centering that marginalized voice, lifting it up, and hopefully helping people at the end of the day. And yeah, hopefully we'll be on set this time next year.

[Michelle Obama]

It's gonna be good.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Thank you.

[Michelle Obama]

Congratulations.

[Craig Robinson]

Well, the fans of IMO know that we have a listener question now. We have some great listeners that send in some really great questions. So I think we have one that is perfect for you from Sophia in Los Angeles. Okay, you ready?

[Natasha Rothwell]

I'm ready.

[Craig Robinson]

As a 28 year old navigating ADHD and career uncertainty, I've struggled to find stability. Without a clear path or support system, it's hard to feel grounded. I want to build a future Where I feel secure in my career and in a place I can call home. What advice would you give to someone trying to build long term stability when everything else feels up in the air?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Whew.

[Craig Robinson]

I know. That's how our questions go.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah, no, but that's a great question. I will say. And what is the caller's name?

[Craig Robinson]

Sophia.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Sophia. Sophia wants that long term stability, wants that career trajectory. And in looking at the end result, it can get overwhelming because it feels very far away. And one of the things that helped me when my dreams felt too big for the plate that I had was to break it down into manageable chunks to ask for help. And also not focusing so much on reaching up, but reaching out. And what I mean by that is all of the people that are on the grind with you are the people that are going to be there later. And sometimes you're just like, oh, I just want this person that's up here to help me. People that are in the trenches alongside you. And building that community is so important. That's what got me through my very broke years in New York was, you know, commiserating and working along other people who were as hungry and ambitious as I am. And because their appetite met mine, we could encourage each other to keep pushing in terms of the ADHD of it. Had I known then what I know now, I would absolutely try to reach out for resources and medication that can be helpful if that is something that you want to do. It's been instrumental in changing my life. I think that Sophia is on the right path. She's stepping out and asking questions and trying to get that help. But I think that, yeah, make sure you find your community, your like minded people that are on the grind with you because it does make the load lighter. And a lot of the things that she's talking about, it's like future forecasting, which is like the anxiety talking. And a lot of that can be remediated with counseling and through medication. Yeah.

[Michelle Obama]

So what I would tell Sophie is try to chill out a little bit, have grace with yourself, give yourself a lot of grace, be okay with not knowing anything at 28, you know, it's like it's in your 20s and way into your 30s, you're trying a whole lot of stuff on, you know, there isn't a future trajectory always. Maybe there are the people out there who are lucky enough to say, When I was 10, I wanted to be a doctor. And it was actually true. And then you grew up and you were a doctor and you actually liked it. It and we're good at it. For most people, that doesn't happen. You know, I thought I was going to be a pediatrician until I took biology, and I was like, let me try law. You know? So I want young people to have more grace with themselves and understand that life is really a journey. And if you've got some of the core for tools of preparation that your parents are telling you to have. Cause they're right about that. You're gonna be okay.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah. And don't be afraid to suck.

[Michelle Obama]

Like, suck a lot. Suck a lot suck. A lot of sucking happens out there in the world. Hey, we'll edit that out. We're gonna edit that one out. Didn't come out right. That's not what I meant. Leave. Craig, what do you think? Craig, what are your thoughts on that's why it's good to have my big brother. I put my foot in my mouth and I'm like, craig, why don't you. Sophia, clean that up.

[Craig Robinson]

Sophia.

[Natasha Rothwell]

My soul has left my body.

[Craig Robinson]

Great question, Sofia. Great question.

[Michelle Obama]

Your thoughts.

[Craig Robinson]

No, I think you all have hit all the right notes. Now I'm scared to say anything.

[Natasha Rothwell]

I will say. I will. I think Sophia's question. I get a lot. And I would just add one last thing. It's making sure that you don't have to be perfect before you do something. And I think that that can be such a hindrance to people because they feel their ADHD is a roadblock or they feel like their resources or access is a roadblock. Do it anyway. Do it anyway.

[Craig Robinson]

Yeah. Yeah. Natasha, I think you hit it on the head in the discussion prior to the question is fall in love with the process. It's so hard to get young people to understand how to fall in love with a process, whether it be art, whether it's medicine, or whether it's sports. We live in an age where people want the final product because they can see the final product these days, when I was young, when we were younger, you couldn't really see the final product because there weren't many people doing the stuff we wanted to do. So you had to like what you were doing. So I would pass that on to Sophia before I would tell her to suck. On another note, Natasha, you were supposed to help.

[Natasha Rothwell]

I tried to help you. Right?

[Michelle Obama]

You did. Then you took it back. You took it back.

[Craig Robinson]

What shows do you watch on television?

[Natasha Rothwell]

I really love the Pit.

[Craig Robinson]

Oh, okay.

[Natasha Rothwell]

It's exceptional television. John Wells, who was one of the creators, if you don't know, it's one shift in an er, every episode is one hour in real time. It's genius. Producerially. You have one set, your actors have one look. It's just smart, and it's just great writing. Severance. I'm really into.

[Michelle Obama]

Did you like second season?

[Natasha Rothwell]

I did. I have notes. I have notes. But I did enjoy it. I think it's such a beautiful world he's built. He's really a wonderful world builder. And I watch the Office biblically, Like, it's my go to every single. Like, I. It's criminal how much I watch that show.

[Michelle Obama]

We had a whole dinner conversation about how the Office is the foundation of Sasha and Malia's life, and they go to it all the time. They are huge fans as well. But it's a great show. Great show. It's a great show. Any embarrassing TV that you watch, that Love Island.

[Natasha Rothwell]

No.

[Michelle Obama]

Yes.

[Natasha Rothwell]

No.

[Michelle Obama]

Girl, we battled.

[Natasha Rothwell]

It is just every once in a while, it's good to just turn off my brain.

[Michelle Obama]

I think, you know, you need it off.

[Craig Robinson]

It is amazing. The smartest women that I am around, my sister, my wife, my daughter, and my nieces. And now Natasha.

[Michelle Obama]

These shows are a sociological wonder. I think as someone, I'm just like.

[Natasha Rothwell]

As somebody, someone who writes characters and performs. It is a character study on human behavior. I watch it like, you know, an Animal Planet show where I'm, like, watching these young. Cause they're aliens, right? Yes. They're all these, like, tiny, symmetrical, hairless wonders who are, like, chunting each other for sport. I'm, like, watching it like, yeah, David Attenborough.

[Michelle Obama]

But I do think we have this discussion all the time. I think women, I don't know. We grew up playing sociological games. Boys were throwing a ball, and we were all like, okay, you're the teacher. This is the scenario. You're angry and something's going on.

[Natasha Rothwell]

No, no.

[Michelle Obama]

You're not coming in yet, Susan. No. You know, we play on scenes, truly. And reality TV is, like, real life.

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah.

[Michelle Obama]

Child's play.

[Natasha Rothwell]

For girls. It's role play.

[Michelle Obama]

We want to know. We want to go deep. We want to understand. And you all are like, who won?

[Natasha Rothwell]

Yeah, that's right.

[Michelle Obama]

That's it.

[Craig Robinson]

There's the end. Reality.

[Michelle Obama]

That's it. Well, Natasha, it has been a thrill. I mean, see why she cut Natasha. Glorious, glorious Natasha, you must have been a drone. You are smart, funny, honest, vulnerable. It shows up in the work that you've done. And I can't wait to see everything that you will do. And please tell your parents that you made them proud. Oh, my God. As always, you all, let's give it up for Natasha.

[Craig Robinson]

Natasha Rothwell.

[Michelle Obama]

Rothwell. Thank you. Thank you so much.

[Craig Robinson]

You'll have to bring your parents next time.

[Michelle Obama]

Yeah, you all, thank you all, good night.