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John is joined by New York Times Magazine writer and bestselling author Robert Draper to discuss his new profile of the unrivaled leader of the MAGA youth movement, Charlie Kirk. Draper explains how, at just 31 and without a college degree, Kirk has emerged as a dominant force on the right through a deft combination of donor courtship (bolstering his organization, Turning Point USA), social media savvy (amplifying his own voice via TikTok and podcasting), and high-level Trumpworld personal diplomacy (cultivating friendships with Don Jr. and J.D. Vance). Draper also weighs in on the first four weeks of Trump 2.0 and whether calling Elon Musk a “dick” is a fruitful path for Democrats seeking to find their voice as the opposition party.

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Robert Draper: Travels with Charlie