HIGHLIGHTS: David Rubenstein

Summary

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Episode Overview

Podcast: In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen
Episode: HIGHLIGHTS: David Rubenstein
Date: December 12, 2025
Summary:
In this highlight episode, Nicolai Tangen hosts David Rubenstein—founder and chairman of The Carlyle Group, renowned interviewer, and philanthropist. They discuss Rubenstein’s humble beginnings, career in politics and private equity, perspectives on leadership, successful investing, and the importance of humility and history. The conversation is thoughtful and engaging, peppered with Rubenstein’s signature dry humor and insightful anecdotes.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. David Rubenstein’s Early Life & Motivation (00:35–02:12)

• Modest Upbringing:
  Rubenstein describes growing up “in a blue collar setting” with both parents who “dropped out of high school” and worked hard to raise their only child.

  • “If you grow up in that setting, you have to make it on your own. So there’s a plus about that.” (00:44, David Rubenstein)

• Aspirations Beyond Wealth:
  As a young man, Rubenstein was “only interested in politics and government,” not financial gain.

  • There “were no hedge funds, private equity funds, tech startups”—being a billionaire was not part of his era’s aspirations.

• Career Path Influences:
  Coming from a Jewish background, family expectations were to join the professions—law, medicine, or dentistry—if not the family business.

  • “My mother aspired me to be [a doctor or lawyer].” (01:06, David Rubenstein)

• Becoming a White House Advisor:
  Inspired by JFK’s aide Ted Sorensen, Rubenstein pursued law as a stepping stone to politics and served as deputy domestic policy advisor at age 27.

  • “I wasn’t qualified for the job... But you know, White House staffs are often filled with people who aren’t qualified.” (02:12, David Rubenstein, self-deprecating humor)

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2. Traits of Great Investors (02:36–04:47)

• Similar Backgrounds:
  Many top investors, like Rubenstein, come from middle-class families—they have “the hunger and the drive” often absent in the very wealthy.

• Key Traits:

  • Good at math (“not maybe a math superstar, but pretty good…”)
  • Humility (“when you’re trading or investing, you’re going to lose money a fair bit”)
  • Decisiveness and self-awareness (“If you have…an ego…that this position is right, the market’s wrong, you’re probably going to be wrong a lot.”)
  • People skills (“You have to motivate people to want to tell you information…”)

  “Really good investors say, look, I made a mistake, I’m getting out of this position.” (03:32, David Rubenstein)
  “…A lot of investors who are really good get along with other people.” (03:41)

• Role of Wealth and Ego:
  Rubenstein notes:

  “The richer you get, I think the bigger your ego usually gets... If you want to find people that are low ego, don’t look for the richest people…” (03:53)

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3. Investing & Conventional Wisdom (04:21–05:03)

• Challenging the Herd:
  The best investments “are against conventional wisdom,” as following the crowd rarely leads to outperformance.

  • “If you did what conventional wisdom would be, you’re doing what everybody else is doing… The best investments generally are against conventional wisdom.” (04:25)

• Why It’s Hard:
  People want respect and validation, making it emotionally taxing to go against what others believe is right.

  • “If you tell people you’re doing something nobody else thinks is a good idea, they’re going to tell you you’re stupid. And nobody likes to be told you’re stupid.” (04:49)

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4. Relationships With Presidents (05:03–06:39)

• Staying Connected:
  Rubenstein admires presidents and has maintained relationships with every U.S. president for five decades.

  • “I’ve always admired the presidency and wanted to be around it. That’s why I worked in the White House.” (05:13)

• Presidential Traits:
  Ambition is universal—presidents endure a “hellacious process” to reach the top of their field, despite risks of scandal, impeachment, or even assassination.

  “At the top of the totem pole in the politics world is being president. And so people want to be at the top.” (06:22, David Rubenstein)

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5. Humor and Interviewing Style (06:39–08:21)

• Dry Sense of Humor:
  Rubenstein self-describes as having “a dry sense of humor,” sometimes misunderstood in the U.S.

• Humor in Facilitation:
  He uses humor to make people comfortable in interviews—sometimes interviewees don’t catch on immediately.

  • Example: “I asked [Bill Gates]—if you had a college degree, do you think you could have been more successful in life? Well, it went right over his head…” (07:06, Rubenstein)
  • With Jeff Bezos, “he got the point.”
  • Rubenstein thrives interviewing in front of an audience, using the “audience reaction” to loosen up guests and connect.

  “People might not remember the substantive things. They always come up to me and say that was a funny thing or that was a funny line.” (08:13)

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6. Leadership Values: Humility (08:21–09:40)

• Why Humility Matters:
  Rubenstein admires “leaders that are humble”—arrogance is “not an endearing trait.”

  • He invokes Lincoln as an exemplar of humility.
  • He acknowledges the risk of “false humility.”

  “Humility is something that is a good virtue to have. And, you know, I try to be as humble as I can. I’m not trying to brag about myself unduly, but obviously I’m not perfect in this regard. I put my name on buildings...” (08:25)

  • His philanthropy is partly motivated by showing that someone from “a poor background can rise up and ... do something useful for the country or university by giving money that helps other people, presumably.” (09:24)

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7. The Importance of History (09:40–End)

• Learning from the Past:
  Rubenstein is passionate about history as a tool to avoid repeating mistakes and to inform better decisions—especially for leaders.
  • “The theory behind studying history is that if you learn about the past, you learn about the good things that you should do in the future and the bad things you should avoid.” (09:45)
  • He believes all presidents (and leaders) should have a sense of history.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “White House staffs are often filled with people who aren’t qualified.” (02:12, Rubenstein, dry self-deprecation)
• “Really good investors say, look, I made a mistake, I’m getting out of this position.” (03:32)
• “The richer you get, I think the bigger your ego usually gets... If you want low ego, don’t look for the richest people.” (03:53)
• “If you tell people you’re doing something nobody else thinks is a good idea, they’re going to tell you you’re stupid. And nobody likes to be told you’re stupid.” (04:49)
• “To be president... you have to put yourself through a hellacious process... That’s because... people want to be at the top.” (06:22)
• ”Humility is something that is a good virtue to have... I try to be as humble as I can.” (08:25)
• “If you learn about the past, you learn about the good things that you should do in the future and the bad things you should avoid.” (09:45)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:35–02:12: Rubenstein’s upbringing and early White House years
• 02:36–04:47: Insights into what makes great investors and the role of background and humility
• 04:21–05:03: Why successful investors challenge conventional wisdom
• 05:03–06:39: Maintaining relationships with U.S. Presidents and thoughts on ambition
• 06:39–08:21: Humor, interviewing style, and memorable anecdotes from interviews
• 08:21–09:40: The importance of humility in leadership and reflection on philanthropy
• 09:40–End: Passion for history and its value for leaders

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Overall Tone and Takeaways

The episode is characterized by candid reflections, gentle humor, and a focus on values like humility, historical perspective, and resilience. Rubenstein’s stories offer not only leadership wisdom but humane, relatable lessons for anyone navigating success or striving to grow in business and life.

Transcript

[A]

Hi, everybody.

[B]

Tune in to this short version of the podcast, which we do every Friday. For the long version, tune in on Wednesdays. Hi, everybody, and welcome to In Good Company. And today I'm here with David Rubenstein. David is the founder and chairman of the Carlyle Group, one of the biggest private equity firms. And he also hosts the David Rubenstein show, where he interviews prominent leaders in business and so on. And earlier this year, I had the pleasure of being on your show. So this is like revenge time, actually.

[A]

David, well, thank you for inviting me and you were great on my show. And anytime you want to come back, please let me know.

[B]

You were an advisor in the White house at age 27, and now you are here. Just what are the highlights in your life since then? I mean, briefly.

[A]

Well, briefly. I came from very modest stock. My parents were not graduates of college or high school. They both dropped out of high school. They were married young. I was their only child. So I grew up in a blue collar setting. And, you know, so if you grow up in that setting, you have to make it on your own. So there's a plus about that. My own children have had some advantages that I didn't have. But I was only interested in politics and government at the time. When I was young, I had no interest in making money. In the days of the 1960s or so, there were no hedge funds, private equity funds, tech startups. There were no billionaires. And you didn't aspire to be a billionaire. And my family was Jewish. If you were Jewish and you wanted to go into business, you wanted your family's business, a family might have a business. If you didn't have a family business, you became a lawyer or doctor or dentist. And that's what your mother. My mother aspired me to be was the.

[B]

And you became a lawyer.

[A]

I became a lawyer because I wasn't that good in sciences. And I thought I was interested in politics and being a lawyer, you could go into politics. And my role model was John Kennedy's advisor. John Kenny was a charismatic person, became President of the United States at 43. But his role model, his role, his advisor. And my role model was a guy named Ted Sorensen, who had been his speechwriter and great intellectual blood bank at the year 31. So at 31, Ted Sorensen was writing the inaugural address and every other great speech that Kennedy gave. And I thought, I'm not a charismatic figure. I don't have any money, but I could be like Ted Sorensen. So I attached myself.

[B]

And you became a Ted Sorensen.

[A]

As 27, well, I did. In effect, I wasn't as prominent as he had become because he was more senior. But at 27, I did become deputy domestic policy advisor to the President, United States. I wasn't qualified for the job. But you know, White House staffs are often filled with people aren't qualified. So I did got the job right, but unfortunately I got inflation to 18 or 19%. So, you know, I didn't. Last week Carlo didn't get reelected.

[B]

Now, you have interviewed many of the best investors in the world. And just coming back to that, what you say here is that many of them come from middle class background just like you did. Why is that?

[A]

Well, I think people that grow up in very wealthy families may not have quite the hunger and the drive to put yourself through the torture you have to do to learn how to be a really good investor. And investing is a very tortuous business because you're going to be wrong a lot of times. And so I think a lot of people who are really great investors came from middle class backgrounds. They tend to have these things in common. They, they're pretty good in math generally, not maybe a math superstar, but pretty good in math and arithmetic. They have a certain degree of humility because when you're trading or you're investing, you're going to lose money a fair bit. You have to get used to that. They also have the ability to make a decision to get out of something relatively shortly after they find out it's not going right. In other words, some people have egos that are so big they say this position is right, the market's wrong. If you have that position all the time, you're probably going to be wrong a lot because the market's going to go against you. So really good investors say, look, I made a mistake, I'm getting out of this position. Also, you have to know how to get along with people. And I think a lot of investors who are really good get along with other people. You have to motivate people to want to work for you. You have to motivate people to want to tell you information. And so I think getting along with people is a pretty good.

[B]

Do you think rich people are less good at getting along with people?

[A]

Well, the richer you get, I think the bigger your ego usually gets. Obviously not always the case for some humble people. Warren Buffett is pretty humble, but also very wealthy. But it's a general rule of thumb if you want to find people that are low ego, don't look for the richest people in the United States or the richest people in the world. Because when you get a lot of money, and I mean money, but being worth $100 billion or more, you're generally going to say, look, I'm pretty smart, and I'm smarter than the average person, and your ego tends to get bigger.

[B]

Why does a good investor have to go through. Have to go against conventional wisdom?

[A]

Well, conventional wisdom, if you did what conventional wisdom would be, you're doing what everybody else is doing. So if you do everything, every, how are you going to be ahead of the pack? So you have to do something that conventional wisdom says is not the right thing to do. And so the best investments generally are against conventional wisdom. Of course, the conventional wisdom is, when the market goes up, what do people do? They jump in. When the market's going down, what do they do? They jump out.

[B]

Why is it so difficult why is.

[A]

It so difficult to go against conventionalism? Because generally people want to be liked by other people, respected by other people. And if you tell people you're doing something nobody else thinks is a good idea, they're going to tell you're stupid. And. And nobody likes to be told you're stupid.

[B]

You kept in touch with all the American presidents since you were 27 years old. So for 50 years, what's the key to keeping in touch with the presidents?

[A]

I know some presidents better than others, and I enjoy it, I guess, because I've always admired the presidency and wanted to be around it. That's why I worked in the White House. So I've had a special interest in knowing presidents and maybe hanging around the White House or doing things that preserve American history and particularly White House history.

[B]

What do presidents have in common?

[A]

Presidents have in common? Ambition. There are some presidents who became presidents without ambition to be. So Calvin Coolidge, a long time ago, really didn't really want to be president. But generally, remember, to be president of the United States, you have to put yourself through a hellacious process for roughly two years or so to kind of go from a primary, work your way up, win the primaries in the general election. And it's a very complicated process. And you have to say, why do they want to do that? Because they want to. They're ambitious. This is their profession, politics. The top of the profession is the presidency. But think about it. John Kennedy was assassinated, Lyndon Johnson driven out of office, Richard Nixon driven out of office. Gerald Ford couldn't get reelected. Jeremy Carter couldn't get reelected. Ronald Reagan almost was assassinated. George Herbert Walker Bush couldn't get reelected. And so you say yourself, why do these people want this thing? You might be getting assassinated or maybe assassinated or you have a scandal or you almost, you're impeached. I mean, Donald Trump was impeached twice, Bill Clinton was impeached once. So why do people want this job where it's so difficult? That's because at the top of the totem pole in the politics world is being president. And so people want to be at the top.

[B]

Your humor is more English than American, right?

[A]

I have what people call a dry sense of humor.

[B]

And also it strikes me because you're a pinstripe. So it's a bit English, the whole thing, right.

[A]

I have a dry sense of humor and some it goes.

[B]

Where does that come from?

[A]

You know, it may be a self deprecating style, I'm not quite sure. But I'll give you an example. I interviewed Bill Gates one time and I've known Bill for a while, but I wouldn't say I'm not close to him. I interviewed one time for my Bloomberg show. I think it was maybe one of the first ones I was doing. And I went to his personal office and I said to Bill, tell me this, if you had a college degree, you think you could have been more successful in life? Well, it went right over his head. He didn't think they gave a serious answer. When I gave that question to him another time I interviewed him in front of an audience, the audience laughed and then he got the picture that it was a humorous thing. So sometimes people don't have senses of humor. And if you ask them a dry sense of humor kind of question, they won't get it. But you know, Jeff Bezos, I interviewed him in front of a large audience and I asked him sort of humorous questions. He got the point. But I like interviewing people in front of an audience and the reason I like to do it is because the audience reaction is something I can play off of. If people laugh, that's good. And it also loosens up the person you're interviewing, I found. And also I like to make people happy. And when I'm interviewing people, I can make people enjoy it because I tend to use a fair amount of humor in and by the humor people kind of, they might not remember the substantive things. They always come up to me and say that was a funny thing or that was a funny line. And I just have a good sense of how to do that, I guess.

[B]

Let's talk a bit about values. Why is humility an important virtue?

[A]

Well, I value humility because I think that arrogance, the opposite of humility, is something that is not an endearing trait. And to me, the leaders that I most admire are people that are humble. Abraham Lincoln won the Civil War. Can you imagine Abraham Lincoln walking around the White House saying, hey, I just won the Civil War? Yeah, pretty impressive, aren't I? Or can you see him signing the executive order that outlawed slavery, the Emancipation Proclamation, and holding it up and going like this so everybody could see Abraham Lincoln? You can't picture that he was a humble man. And I think humility is. Is a real virtue. Now, there is false humility, of course. People pretend they're humble, but then they tell you how great they are. But I think humility is something that is a good virtue to have. And, you know, I try to be as humble as I can. I'm not trying to brag about myself unduly, but obviously I'm not perfect in this regard. I put my name on buildings. If I put up money for a university building, I put my name on it. And the reason I do that is I try to show people, and particularly in Washington, D.C. where my name is something that somebody can come from a poor background, can rise up, and they can do something useful for the country or university by giving money that helps other people, presumably. And so that's why I often put my name on buildings if I give them money to help a building get off the ground.

[B]

You talk a lot about history, and you have a lot of historical references. Why are you so interested in history?

[A]

My view is that history is something that teaches you about the mistakes of the past. And the theory behind studying history is that if you learn about the past, you learn about the good things that you should do in the future and the bad things you should avoid. And so I think it's very important for people to have a sense of history. And I think presidents of the United States, particularly should have a sense of history, too, or leaders of organizations, because, you know, people have made mistakes over the years, and if you're going to make the same mistakes, you can avoid them. If you learn about history a bit more.