Podcast Summary: In Totality with Megan Ashley

Episode 100: Sanctification Is Hard – The Process, the Pain & God’s Purpose [LIVE]
Date: December 9, 2025
Host: Megan Ashley | Guest: Jackie
Theme: Living honestly through the challenges of sanctification—what it feels like, how it impacts our lives and relationships, and the importance of community and grace in God’s sanctifying work.

Episode Overview

This milestone 100th episode, recorded live, features a heartfelt conversation between Megan Ashley and her friend and Bible teacher Jackie on the process of sanctification. They candidly explore why sanctification is hard, how feelings intersect with faith and obedience, and the crucial roles of honesty, perseverance, and friendship in spiritual growth. The episode weaves practical theology with lived experience, offering encouragement for those struggling on their journey with Christ.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Defining Sanctification and Its Struggles

(02:36–05:03, 11:32–13:34, 15:45–16:40)

• Sanctification is “the process by which we are conformed into the image of Christ” (Jackie, 13:01)
• It’s not about the absence of sin or struggle, but about continually learning to put specific sins to death.
• The struggle comes from indwelling sin—habits, coping mechanisms, or responses developed over a lifetime that don’t naturally reflect Christ.
• Real Christian maturity isn’t driven by feelings but by faith and obedience, even when God’s commands "feel impractical" (Jackie, 20:33).
• "You don’t have to have it all figured out. You just have to obey… He’s not looking for your perfection. He’s looking for a yes." (Megan, 06:55)

2. Feelings vs. Obedience: What is Proof of God’s Work?

(15:35–20:08)

• Many Christians believe the absence of sinful feelings is what marks sanctification, but actually, obedience in the face of those feelings is evidence of sanctification.
  • “The absence of the feeling is not the evidence of sanctification. It is the obedience of what to do with the feeling.” (Megan, 15:54)
• Feelings, especially passions and desires from the flesh (anger, lust, irritation), shouldn’t dictate decisions—faith should.
  • “Her feelings dictated her decision when her faith should have dictated her decision. Sometimes what we are feeling are actually what the Bible calls passions.” (Jackie, 19:17)
• Trusting God’s word means acting on it even when our emotions lag behind.

3. Persevering When God Doesn’t ‘Lift’ the Struggle

(23:07–30:27)

• It’s common to ask why God doesn’t just take away the struggle (“Why won’t you lift it?”) even though we know He can.
• Frustration and weariness often come from knowing God’s power but not experiencing immediate deliverance.
• Jackie addresses a common misunderstanding: “Some of us have a conception of God—even in Christ—that he still has some justice that he needs to get out on us… That’s us projecting what we would do onto him.” (Jackie, 27:25)
• Megan reminds listeners of the purpose: “He poured out his wrath on his son… So when he sees you, he sees his son now… He does whatever he needs to do to conform you more into the image of his son.” (Megan, 30:21–31:21)

4. Taking Responsibility: Passive vs. Active Sanctification

(33:29–38:31)

• Some Christians are passive, assuming “God will finish the work so I don’t have to work.”
• Sanctification involves “working out” (not for) your salvation (cf. Philippians 2).
  • “There might be a part of your sanctification that you’re just really lazy at. And that’s what’s happening… the Spirit that rose Jesus from the dead lives in you. I mean, how much more do you need?” (Jackie, 37:35)

5. Sanctification’s Impact on Relationships

(38:42–46:09)

• Sanctification isn’t just vertical (God and us), but horizontal (between people).
  • “Sin affects relationships, and therefore, the process of sanctification should help relationships…” (Jackie, 39:39)
• Gifts and ministry effectiveness are not proof of maturity—character is: “How quick to forgive am I? That’s the measure.” (Jackie, 40:08)
• The danger of gifts without repentance—or using gifts apart from the Spirit:
  • “I can be nice and not kind. I can be giving and not selfless… Anything I do independent of the Spirit is coming from a wrong motive.” (Megan, 43:08–44:20)
• Constantly interrogate your motives: “Is the good I’m doing holy or just good?” (Megan, 44:30)
• Christ desires not good people, but holy people.

6. The Practical Power of Abiding

(48:27–50:33)

• Abiding in Christ is the source of fruitfulness:
  • “Apart from me, you can do nothing… The Lord is not pressing you into just doing a bunch of works. He’s pressing you into his Son.” (Jackie, 49:16–49:26)
• Interrogating your heart isn’t to shame you but to make you more aware of your need for God’s help.

Memorable Moments & Notable Quotes

• On discouragement and friendship:
  • “I was just in a really bad spot… I thought I was going to have a relapse… The encouragement is, although we were both frustrated with the pace at which God was sanctifying us, he was using the discouragement itself to sanctify us.” (Megan, 51:07–61:55)
• On honest support:
  • “She just showed up… She just read scripture over me… Not that everything changed immediately, but I had a little bit more strength to continue to be faithful.” (Megan, 58:32–61:10)
• On kingdom friendship:
  • “Our relationships should be a reflection of the Lord and it should draw people to Him. If it’s not drawing people to the Lord, what are we doing?” (Megan, 70:19)
• On sanctification as evidence of salvation:
  • “If you are not growing in Christlikeness, then you don’t know Christ.” (Jackie, 73:28)
  • “It does not matter how much scripture you know… if you were born, you were born in sin. And the crazy part is, we love it.” (Jackie, 74:50)

Detailed Outline with Timestamps

| Timestamp | Section | Summary | |---------------|-------------|-------------| | 02:36–05:03 | Sanctification Defined & Podcast Anniversary | Megan celebrates 100 episodes; Jackie highlights faithful, obedient ministry beginnings; sanctification as being conformed to Christ. | | 09:00–12:42 | Why Sanctification Hurts | Megan opens discussion about honesty, struggle in Christian walk; public vulnerability creates connection. | | 13:34–16:40 | Indwelling Sin & Christian Maturity | The tension between desire and obedience; “Indwelling sin” named and explained as source of struggle. | | 15:54 | Quote: | “It is the obedience of what to do with the feeling that’s evidence of sanctification.” (Megan) | | 19:17–20:33 | Feelings vs. Faith | Passions and feelings aren’t trustworthy—faith should lead us; example of Eve’s obedience to feeling over faith. | | 23:07–30:27 | Weariness with God’s Timing | Longing for God to simply remove sinful desires; the importance of trusting God's process and character. | | 33:29–38:31 | Participating in Sanctification | Active pursuit of holiness; “Work out your salvation” means cooperating with the Spirit, not passivity. | | 38:42–46:09 | Impact on Relationships & Gifts v. Character | Horizontal effects of sanctification; character trumps giftedness; honest self-examination. | | 48:27–50:33 | How to Abide Practically | Depending on Christ day-to-day; heart interrogation increases dependence, not shame. | | 51:07–63:30 | Honest Account of Spiritual Despair & Friendship | Megan shares experience of deep discouragement; Jackie demonstrates selfless presence, comfort through scripture and prayer—practical sanctification in community. | | 64:00–70:19 | The Kingdom Purpose of Godly Friendships | Authentic relationships reflect the gospel—friendships have kingdom implications, not just emotional value. | | 73:28–81:42 | Salvation, Evidence, and Encouragement | Jackie’s gospel reminder: sanctification is the sure fruit of justification; call to honest self-examination; prayer for enduring faithfulness and real relationship with Christ. |

Concluding Reflections

Vulnerability and transparency—foundational to this episode—demonstrate that sanctification is a lifelong, often painful process filled with triumphs, setbacks, and the vital support of Christian friendship. Megan and Jackie keep returning to God’s purpose: to make us more like Christ, not simply to make us feel better or be “good people.” They remind listeners that the journey is not solitary. Community, honesty, and daily dependence on the Spirit are indispensable for becoming the people God means us to be.

Selected Quotes by Timestamp

• "He’s not looking for your perfection. He’s looking for a yes."
  — Megan Ashley, (06:55)
• "Being in the process of sanctification is continually learning how to put certain sins to death."
  — Jackie, (13:20)
• "The absence of the feeling is not the evidence of sanctification. It is the obedience of what to do with the feeling."
  — Megan Ashley, (15:54)
• "You want me to do stuff that is actually beyond me. And that’s where sanctification happens."
  — Jackie, (20:33)
• "Some of us have a conception of God—even in Christ—that he still has some justice that he needs to get out on us… That’s us projecting what we would do onto him."
  — Jackie, (27:25)
• "You can have a gift… but anything I do independent of the Spirit is coming from a wrong motive. Is the good I’m doing holy, or is it just good?"
  — Megan Ashley, (44:20–44:30)
• "Apart from me, you can do nothing… The Lord is not pressing you into just doing a bunch of works. He’s pressing you into his Son."
  — Jackie, (49:16–49:26)
• "If you are not growing in Christlikeness, then you don’t know Christ."
  — Jackie, (73:28)

Final Takeaways

• Sanctification is a messy, ongoing work that cannot be separated from day-to-day decisions, community support, and honesty with ourselves and God.
• Obedience, not feelings, is true evidence of God’s transforming work.
• Friendships rooted in Christ are not just emotional supports but sanctifying forces that propel both people toward God’s purpose.
• The process is hard—but it’s full of hope, and God uses every part of it to make us more like Christ.