Podcast Summary: In Totality with Megan Ashley

Episode 101: Wrestling with Insecurity & Obedience ft. Dinorah Peña
Date: December 16, 2025
Guests: Host – Megan Ashley | Guest – Dinorah Peña
Theme: Navigating insecurity and obedience in the Christian walk, the role of the Holy Spirit, and the importance of both studying and delighting in God's Word.

Overview

In this deep, vulnerable conversation, Megan Ashley reunites with her friend and fellow minister Dinorah Peña to discuss the ongoing journey of wrestling with insecurity, learning obedience, and cultivating delight in the Lord as Christians. They candidly explore what it means to trust the Holy Spirit in daily life, the nuance of sanctification, the reality of discouragement—even for leaders—and the often overlooked importance of finding joy in simple intimacy with God.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Growth Between Episodes: Finding Her Own Voice

• Dinorah’s journey: The first time she was on the show (Aug 2024), Dinorah was nervous about expressing her own thoughts after years of elevating others' voices in her career.
  • “The invitation to sit on this couch was the first invitation that I had to exercise my own voice. And that was very uncomfortable for me.” (05:11 – Dinorah)
  • She now carries a different ‘good nervous’ rooted in wanting to honor and represent God well.
• What changed: Learning to pray that her words would edify and shepherd, rather than obsess over perfection.

2. Insecurity & the Necessity of Dependence on the Holy Spirit

• Balancing healthy caution and paralyzing anxiety: Megan confesses how striving to do what's pleasing to God can quickly provoke anxiety and perfectionism.
  • “I just want to say and do what is pleasing to him…But I realize in myself…it quickly comes with anxiety for me.” (07:00 – Megan)
• Dinorah’s insight: Her insecurities, especially around language as a bilingual woman, highlight her deep dependence on the Holy Spirit for everything—including writing school papers after returning to academia.
  • “There is nothing that I can do without the Holy Spirit. Nothing.” (08:11 – Dinorah)
• The biblical perspective: Even biblical giants like Moses, Jeremiah, and Sarah confessed deep insecurity, and God still worked through them.
  • “The Lord will still do a work in and through you with the insecurity.” (11:46 – Dinorah)
• Obedience through dependence: Dinorah emphasizes choosing to be obedient and trusting the Holy Spirit over her own preferences or fears.
  • “I have just made a decision that I want to be obedient and that I’m going to place what He's calling me to above what I want.” (11:48 – Dinorah)

3. The Danger of Performance and the Call to Surrender

• Megan: Focusing too much on her own ability leads to prideful self-reliance.
  • “The Lord is like…that's your pride. That's you trying to rely on you?” (12:45 – Megan)
  • “There's only one seat on the throne, and it belongs to one person, and that is God, not you.” (13:22 – Megan)
• Advice: The Christian’s task is to “lay yourself on the altar every day,” practicing Romans 12 by offering yourself as a continual sacrifice rather than trying to control outcomes.

4. The Holy Spirit: Person, Power, and Practicality

• Misunderstandings: Many Christians either ignore or misconceive the Holy Spirit as mystical, failing to rely on Him practically.
  • “I think people often ignore the Holy Spirit as…just this thing that floats around…” (14:39 – Dinorah)
• Invitation to intimacy: They both stress the need to intentionally invite the Holy Spirit into everyday moments, from reading Scripture to responding to conviction.
  • “Invite the Holy Spirit into everything, into every conversation, into every…in your home, wherever you are, in your car.” (17:31 – Megan)
  • “When you invite the Holy Spirit and ask Him to permeate the space…everything in the space is under Him.” (17:31 – Dinorah)
• Memorable phrase: “Throw your weight around, Holy Spirit…Boss up, Holy Spirit.” (18:14–18:19 – Jordan & Megan)

5. Sanctification: The Ongoing, Honest Wrestle

• Sanctification process: It’s not instant. After the high of justification, Christians enter a lifelong process of being made holy, often through wrestling with temptation and failure.
  • “Sanctification is such a hard wrestle…especially for baby Christians.” (20:03 – Megan)
• Encouragement: The struggle itself is evidence that sanctification is happening:
  • “The fact that you are wrestling is the evidence that sanctification is happening.” (24:14 – Megan)
• Dinorah’s practical discipling: She encourages others to recognize conviction as evidence of growth, to repent quickly, and to pray for those who have wronged them.

6. God as Just Judge

• Expanded view of God: Dinorah shares how God has shown her His role as Judge, not just as loving and merciful:
  • “What if justice in your life is that you have peace? …that your health is restored?” (28:24 – Dinorah)
  • She urges listeners to trust in God’s definition and administration of justice, not their own.

7. Knowing God: More Than Just Reading the Bible

• Slow down and savor: Both stress the necessity of moving beyond skimming Scripture for knowledge to slow, patient study and simple delight.
  • “There’s a difference between reading and studying your word.” (31:03 – Dinorah)
  • “When we don’t sit down with the thing that we don’t understand…this is why we don’t understand the fullness of God.” (32:22 – Dinorah)
• Cultivating delight: Dinorah shares her practice of keeping a non-study Bible by her bed, reading it just for pleasure.
  • “So I do my Bible studies at a different time…and at night…just read to delight.” (36:11 – Dinorah)
• Megan’s worship experience: Instead of prepping or studying, she felt God prompt her to just worship and read Psalm 86, which brought her comfort and nourishment. (38:05–38:21)
  • “I wasn’t trying to exegete…I was just reading it and I was encouraged and I felt my strength come.” (38:21 – Megan)

8. Wrestling With Discouragement (Even as Leaders)

• Honest confession: Both admit to experiencing discouragement, lack of delight—even in ministry. They emphasize the importance of confession and asking God for help.
  • “I'm not delighting in any of this. There’s been a few times where I’ve been in church lately, and I'm just like, I'm just here.” (40:27 – Megan)
• Community matters: Ministry leaders go through the same fights as anyone tuned in for Bible study—the struggle doesn’t disappear with a platform (41:06 – Dinorah).

9. Delighting in Obedience: Stewardship, Not Ownership

• Key revelation: Megan is convicted that serving God is not about drudgery or obligation, but about finding joy (“delight”) in obeying Him.
  • “Delight in obedience is crazy.” (42:46–42:51 – Jordan)
  • “It's not ownership, it's stewardship, babe.” (43:24 – Megan)
• Megan: The work God calls us to is also for us, not just for others.

10. Singleness: Contentment, Desire, and Trust

• Dinorah’s honest journey: She’s learning to allow God to “tame” rather than “take away” the desire for marriage, asking for contentment while remaining open.
  • “Until he presents that to me, can he help tame the desire?” (49:34 – Dinorah)
• Real contentment vs. resigned acceptance: Dinorah admits that sometimes she’s tried to convince herself she’s content because she doesn’t trust God to answer with a yes.
  • “I realized that I tried to convince myself that I was content because I just didn’t trust the Lord to give it to me.” (52:47 – Dinorah)
• Ultimate fulfillment: Regardless of what God gives, Jesus is enough—He remains the “ultimate prize.” (54:58 – Megan)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “There’s only one seat on the throne, and it belongs to one person, and that is God, not you.” – Megan Ashley (13:22)
• “The Lord will still do a work in and through you with the insecurity.” – Dinorah Peña (11:46)
• “When you invite the Holy Spirit and ask Him to permeate the space…everything in the space is under Him.” – Dinorah Peña (17:31)
• “Delight in obedience is crazy.” – Jordan (42:46)
• “It's not ownership, it's stewardship.” – Megan Ashley (43:24)
• “What if justice in your life is that you have peace?” – Dinorah Peña (28:24)
• “I'm not delighting in any of this…I had to pause and be like, okay, Lord, instead of…complaining about it, let me confess it and ask for help.” – Megan Ashley (44:47)
• “Until he presents that [relationship] to me, can he help tame the desire?” – Dinorah Peña (49:34)
• “He is the ultimate prize. He is…and He's enough.” – Megan Ashley (54:14)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Returning, nervousness, and finding her voice – [04:48 – 06:56]
• Leaning on the Holy Spirit, insecurity & obedience – [08:11 – 13:07]
• Self-reliance and pride vs. surrender – [12:39 – 13:38]
• Understanding and relying on the Holy Spirit – [14:05 – 19:05]
• Sanctification, temptation, and spiritual struggle – [20:03 – 27:11]
• God as Judge and redefining justice – [27:27 – 29:34]
• Reading vs. Studying vs. Delighting in Scripture – [30:08 – 39:46]
• Honest struggle with discouragement and confession – [40:27 – 44:08]
• Learning to ‘delight in obedience’ and stewardship – [44:47 – 45:24]
• Navigating singleness, taming desire, and contentment – [47:13 – 53:53]
• Ultimate fulfillment in Christ – [54:14 – 54:58]

Tone and Final Thoughts

The episode is marked by sincere vulnerability, relatable humor, and a deep longing for authenticity with God. Megan and Dinorah encourage listeners to be honest about their struggles, to cultivate intimacy with the Holy Spirit, and to allow themselves space for both discipline and delight in their faith walk. Their message is clear: every part of life—insecurities, struggles, study, worship, and obedience—finds its place when surrendered fully to Christ.

Listen if you want:

• Real talk on spiritual insecurity and performance
• Practical advice on inviting the Holy Spirit into everyday life
• Encouragement for dry seasons in faith and ministry
• Support for singles seeking contentment and honest community

Next week: Part two of the conversation with Dinorah Peña!