316. Kevin Baron. Hegseth Grossly Rolls On. The Critical Defense Questions That Weren’t Asked. The Trump Steamroller Is Accelerating. The Democrats Will Not Save You. Congestion Pricing Is Working, CFB National Championship and NFL Playoffs.

Summary

Independent Americans with Paul Rieckhoff

Episode 316: Kevin Baron. Hegseth Grossly Rolls On. The Critical Defense Questions That Weren’t Asked. The Trump Steamroller Is Accelerating. The Democrats Will Not Save You. Congestion Pricing Is Working, CFB National Championship, and NFL Playoffs.
Date: January 16, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this high-intensity, deeply independent episode, host Paul Rieckhoff delivers a passionate state-of-the-moment analysis as Donald Trump's inauguration looms. With the nation bracing for significant political and cultural shifts, Rieckhoff is joined by veteran national security journalist and defense expert Kevin Baron. Together, they unpack the confirmation hearing for Pete Hegseth as Secretary of Defense, the breakdown of Democratic opposition, and what the future of Pentagon leadership might mean. The episode also gives a pulse check on America’s party system, an urgent call for civil and political innovation, reflections on sports as a cultural touchstone, and even some quick picks for the upcoming football games and recommendations for living—and resisting—better.

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Key Topics & Insights

1. The Trump "Steamroller": Political Denial & Acceleration

[00:45–04:30]

• Rieckhoff opens with a sense of urgency: Trump’s return is near, the “steamroller” is picking up speed, and the confirmation of the polarizing and controversial Pete Hegseth as Secretary of Defense feels imminent.
• The Republican Senate’s lack of resistance and the Democrats’ inability to mount a meaningful opposition dominates the first segment.

“The Trump steamroller is rolling, and it is picking up steam. And he hasn't even been inaugurated yet... Pete Hegseth, the most radical, most partisan, most extreme, least qualified, most character-compromised nominee in American history, is likely to be the Secretary of Defense.”
— Paul Rieckhoff [01:15]

2. Democratic Party Failure and a Call for Independence

[04:30–08:52]

• Rieckhoff’s biggest takeaway: the depth of Democratic dysfunction, lack of leadership, and inability to offer any real counterweight to MAGA advances.
• He urges listeners to stop placing hope or resources in a party that’s “leaderless” and “shattered.”
• Promotes the Independent Americans movement and urges support for independent veteran candidates.

“Stop hoping that the Democrats will save you. They won’t. We need creative alternatives and we need new voices… America is not a party, it’s a mission.”
— Paul Rieckhoff [06:48]

3. Pete Hegseth’s Confirmation: Substance-Free Questions & an Ominous Future

[09:02–15:00]

• Kevin Baron joins, relating the MAGA-era political climate to a coming “flood” and warning that the policy and cultural changes are real and profound.
• They examine the Hegseth hearing: softball questions, the absence of tough policy scrutiny (notably on cybersecurity), and alarming lack of oversight.
• Baron underscores how the Senate—supposed adult stewards—has become an enabler of extremism.
• Both agree: Hegseth is exactly the kind of SecDef “the MAGA world wants,” and his primary skill is relentless deflection and denial.

“This shit’s real, man… These are extreme positions, and it’s rooted in all sorts of fringe and extreme policy positions… and it’s being just like sent on its merry way right to the E ring of the Pentagon by the GOP Senate…”
— Kevin Baron [10:45]

“He’s a tremendous communicator. He’s able to deflect. He’s able to deny. He’s able to avoid.”
— Paul Rieckhoff [03:30]

4. Pentagon Culture Clash & the Meaning of Experience

[16:16–22:25]

• Baron contrasts Hegseth with former SecDefs like Lloyd Austin and Ash Carter, highlighting their policy and management experience.
• They draw attention to a trend: the preference for ideological “disruptors” over qualified insiders.
• The culture represented by Hegseth—brash, performative, “tough guy” posturing—is dissected.

“In any other normal world, he would not have accepted the nomination... But these are the types of people you get when you get true believers and activists.”
— Kevin Baron [15:00]

5. What Wasn’t Asked: Critical National Security Issues Neglected

[24:09–33:54]

• Both note the hearings obsessed over Hegseth’s character and personal life, with a near-total omission of global security priorities.
• Key concerns not addressed:
  • Cyber warfare strategy
  • Theory and use of military force abroad
  • Commitments to NATO/allies
  • Approach to China and the Global South
  • Budget and prioritization of military technology and modernization

“Nobody asked him... What’s your theory on alliances? Are you really committed to sending US troops... to defend every inch of the NATO alliance? What are your thoughts on China, on the Quad, on the future of military power?”
— Kevin Baron [24:09]

6. Senate Committee Dynamics: Gender, Generations, and Power

[25:10–28:37]

• Discussion of how the Senate's questioning exposed a cultural and generational clash—“tough-talking, generally younger men” versus “meek and old, civilian women” and nonmilitary members.
• MAGA’s resonance is partly rooted in performative authenticity—“grievance and strength as brand”—and the narrative of American martial masculinity.

“It wasn’t even a fair fight because you just didn’t have people of that culture fighting it out.”
— Paul Rieckhoff [26:02]

7. The Coming Pentagon Purge

[39:28–43:52]

• Expect accelerated attrition at the Pentagon: a departure of career civil servants and experts, both voluntarily (in protest or self-protection) and forcibly (via loyalty purges).
• Trump-era “blacklists” of previous officials may deepen the talent drain, removing seasoned expertise in favor of pure loyalty.

“That room is a mix of civilians and uniforms… and one by one people were leaving and it was empty. State Department, same thing. Remember there was a big like people were quitting, giving up and they didn't want to be it.”
— Kevin Baron [39:28]

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Quotes & Memorable Moments

“You’ve got fascists and cowards on one side, and weaklings and losers on the other side. And most Americans, especially independent Americans, somewhere in the middle, hoping for better.”
— Paul Rieckhoff [04:50]

“If you worked with Pompeo, you’re out. If you worked with Nikki Haley, you’re out. You don’t get a job.”
— Kevin Baron [41:30]

“The solution to the broken party system is not creating new parties, it’s rejecting all parties—because America is not a party, it’s a mission.”
— Paul Rieckhoff [07:10]

“Pentagon and how you measure military might is no longer in the number of ships and the number of planes, rather it’s the technology on them… and the whole non-kinetic war world we’re about to get into with cyber and everything else.”
— Kevin Baron [20:32]

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Important Segment Timestamps

• Trump Steamroller / Hegseth Confirmation: [00:45–04:30]
• Democrats’ Failure: [04:30–08:52]
• Kevin Baron Interview Begins: [08:52]
• The MAGA Flood / Pentagon Culture: [09:22–16:16]
• Contrasts: Hegseth vs. Austin/Carter: [16:16–22:25]
• Theater of Masculinity & Lack of Substance: [22:25–26:02]
• Missed Critical National Security Questions: [24:09–33:54]
• Committee & Generational Gaps: [25:10–28:37]
• The Pentagon Purge / Future of Expertise: [39:28–43:52]

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Sports & Culture Segment Highlights

College Football and NFL Playoff Picks [44:06–52:34]:

• Rieckhoff and Baron lighten the mood with spirited college football and NFL playoff predictions; both pick Notre Dame over Ohio State in the national championship, root for the Lions and Bills in the NFL, and equate football’s drama to American cultural resilience.

“America needs Buffalo versus Detroit. We need this, right? We need some great American gut story, right?”
— Paul Rieckhoff [51:29]

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Recommendations & Notable Sign-Offs

Rieckhoff's Picks [52:34–end]:

• Marcus King Band (music), Coach Ball Game (Instagram/Youtube inspiration), Kevin's Meals (healthy quick meals), Congestion Pricing (urban policy making NYC more livable), and Team Rubicon (veteran-led disaster response).

On Congestion Pricing:

“It’s working and it’s just getting started. So stay strong, New York City, this is what’s best for us and for our beloved city long term.”
— Paul Rieckhoff [52:34]

Final Note:

• A call to look for helpers in times of crisis, appreciation for independent and community-led solutions, and a strong admonition to “stay vigilant.”

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Takeaways for Listeners

• The stakes for American democracy and security are rising. The familiar guardrails have all but eroded.
• The MAGA movement is not only ascendant—it’s remaking institutions, language, and political norms.
• Both parties are failing millions of Americans; independent candidacies and new civic coalitions are urgently needed.
• Critical national security priorities (alliances, cyber, modernization) have fallen out of Senate oversight in favor of culture war theatrics.
• American resilience, creativity, and independence—whether represented in politics, public service, or even on the football field—are more vital than ever.

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Subscribe and join the movement for real independence and vigilance.

Transcript

[A]

Power by righteous media. Welcome to independent Americans. Welcome to episode 316. I'm your host, Paul Ruff. And now more than ever is most definitely a time to stay vigilant. The inauguration of Donald Trump is just days away and things are getting intense. And coming up, I'm going to talk to Kevin Barron, one of my favorite defense and foreign policy and Pentagon reporters. He's been a friend of mine for a long time. We're going to dig into the Pete Hegseth hearing, the impact on the Pentagon, the national security environment that we didn't really talk about this week in America, and much more. So stick around for that. But first, let's talk about the top topics. Just. The number one topic. The Trump train is rolling. It's more like a steamroller. I think some folks are still living in denial. Some folks are still on vacation somewhere. Some folks have just been keeping their head down and watching reruns of Seinfeld or whatever. But the Trump steamroller is rolling and it is picking up steam. And he hasn't even been inaugurated yet. And we saw that in spades this week with the nomination hearings for Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth. Now, I've talked about it at length in media over the last couple of days and on this show. You can go back and check out previous episodes, but here's my biggest takeaway. It's happening, folks. Pete Hegseth, the most radical, most partisan, most extreme, least qualified, most character compromised nominee in American history, is likely to be the Secretary of Defense. We found out just a couple of days ago that that Joanie Er, the Republican so called moderate senator from Iowa, who is a sexual assault survivor herself a National Guard veteran, was the person that most folks were holding out hope would hold the line and oppose Pete Hegseth. And she folded. She made the announcement that she will support him, likely clearing the way for his nomination. It doesn't look like Lisa Murkowski or Susan Collins will hold out and the Democrats won't have the votes to stop him. Now there's a couple days left. It could be a week or more before the actual vote. And we can never Forget that it's 2025 and something could come out, some new news that could come out, especially given Hegseth's sloppy personal life and this general media environment. So nothing is a given yet. But it looks like Pete Hegseth will be the Secretary of Defense. And of course, the Republicans are compromised. They rolled. They didn't even put up a fight. They were cheering them all along. The way. There were no hard questions about cybersecurity, about Iran, about our naval posture or anything else. It was mostly a bunch of patent on the back and cheering. And. And also they didn't allow a full FBI report to be released to the committee. It looks like the FBI report didn't speak to his two ex wives or the person who accused him of sexual assault. And the FBI report doesn't seem to have been comprehensive, but that doesn't matter because he's likely going through in part because the Democrats couldn't stop him. I think that the Democrats really have shown, especially in the last week, how busted they really are in that hearing. There were a couple spicy moments where Kirsten Gillibrand, senator from New York, tried to hit him hard on his positions on women in the military and LGBTQ rights inequality. And it got him on the ropes a little bit. And then Tim Kaine came hard about his character issues, talking about his adultery, talking about whether or not he can be trusted to tell the truth. But outside of that, Democrats didn't really score any knockout blows. They really didn't even score any body blows. And Hegseth showed why he was chosen for this position. He's a tremendous communicator. He's able to deflect. He's able to deny. He's able to avoid.

[B]

And.

[A]

And that's what he did throughout this entire hearing. And his goal was to not get knocked out. And he achieved that goal. So for Hegseth, it wasn't a pretty win, but it was a win. And even more importantly, it was a loss to the Democrats, which means a loss for America. Our Pentagon is going to face a level of politicization we have never seen. And it's on, folks. So strap in and stay vigilant. The Trump steamroller is rolling, and you've got fascists and cowards on one side and weaklings and losers on the other side. And most Americans, especially independent Americans, somewhere in the middle, hoping for better. But something deeper and important was revealed this week. The Hexath hearings showed the depth and the scope of how broken and shattered the Democrats and the Democratic Party are. They are leaderless. They have no strategy. They couldn't coordinate to oppose Hegseth. They couldn't win the election last fall, and they can't be counted on to hold the line for America. So, especially to my fellow Americans who are Democrats, I ask you, why are you continuing to invest your time, your effort, your money in failure? Stop hoping that the Democrats will save you. The they won't. We've seen that time and time again and we're wasting time and energy hoping that they will. We need creative alternatives and we need new voices, not even in the Democratic Party, outside of the Democratic Party. And I don't think it's a complete solution, but I think that independent Americans and independent veterans especially are part of that solution. So support our movement to elect independent veterans to public office. During that hearing for Hegseth, you saw Deb Fisher, MAGA loyalist, civilian, Nebraska senator. She was on that hearing giving patty cakes to Pete Hegseth. It could have been Navy veteran and independent Dan Osborne. And next time it can be. And the Democrats will continue to get rolled until they find leaders and a strategy. They will continue to get smushed and stomped and steamrolled by by Trump. And in the meantime, our democracy is dying by the day. So do what you can do what you can personally, locally, in your community, in your family, on your social media. But please stop waiting for hoping for investing in the Democratic Party. They have failed you, they have failed America and they will fail all of us if you keep doubling down on failure. The solution to the broken party system is not creating new parties, it's rejecting all parties because America is not a party. It's a mission now more than ever. That's why I encourage everyone to leave the herds now and declare your independence. Don't give them your allegiance, your time, your money, your email, your family name. They don't deserve it. But America still does. And America needs you now more than ever. And if you're an independent vet, especially that's interested in stepping up to run, run with the pack at Independent Veterans of America. The future is not a party. It's you. Most Americans want better so you can keep donating to failure or start investing in the future. Lets go. Ain't nobody going in like me. I'm a mix of a man in peace the way I stomp on a. Ladies and gentlemen, Independent Americans around the country and around the world. Are you worn out yet? It's only the second week of January. He hasn't even been inaugurated and it is all on. And we are going to dig into it as we uniquely do with another important, inspiring and interesting guest. A guy I've wanted to have on for a very long time who can give us perspective, especially on the Hegseth madness and everything related my friend, the great and powerful Kevin Barron is finally here on Independent Americans. Welcome sir.

[B]

How you doing man?

[A]

I don't know man. I'm just, you know, I'm surprisingly Cool. How are you doing?

[B]

I'm fine, man. I'm, I'm riding the wave. Just like watching it all unfold, getting ready for who knows what's going to come after inauguration day. Like you said, we're not even there yet. And man, it's, it's coming. I'm remembering what it was like the first time around and I think we're in for a whole lot more.

[A]

Oh, another level. I mean it's not even a wave. I think we've got to be ready for like a new flood that stays there. Right. It's just like. And it's going to keep going up.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Like we're going to use some weather dynamics here. But let me, let me ask you the question I do ask everybody. Where are you and really how are you? You're, you're a dad, you're a journalist, you're a national security guy. But, but where are you physically and how are you?

[B]

So I'm in the great Northern Virginia suburbs of Washington D.C. where we've had snow on the ground unusually for more than a week now. But it's, you know, you can't go skiing around here. So it pains my soul to see all this great white and not be able to get out in it. And yeah, you know, I'm a long time journalist who. I left the newsroom back in September and I'm working on building my own thing, tbd and I'm ready to kind of like dive into the new year. And like I said, just watching, watching the, this interim periods from November to next week unfold, it's just like, wow, if this is a preview, what's to come. Get ready. I was saying to someone this morning, I said, you know, when these, when these immigration roundups happen, there are people, they think it's going to be like the rapture. Suddenly people are just going to have been gone. Like, you know, what happened to my, that neighbor and what happened to my kids soccer coach and it's going to be a whole different world real soon. I think so.

[A]

And you think that's an exaggerated concern or not?

[B]

I don't think it's exaggerated. I, I'm trying to take the position where, you know, the, the policy changes and the culture shift that comes with the maga, right. That has taken over the center, right. That ever. That if everyone existed. This shit's real, man. And I said yesterday after the part of the Hegseth hearing, I was, I was, I was, I was on with Katie Couric and she was asking about some of this. And I said, look like women in combat, for example, and then wanting to, you know, reverse revert the clock decades and pull women out of combat roles. And I just said, this is the kind of thing that just it's not normal to say, well, half the country may want this and half the country doesn't, and now it's their turn to make policy. This is an extreme position. It is a fringe position, and it's rooted in all sorts of fringe and extreme policy positions and cultural positions and, you know, Christian nationalism and all sorts of things. And it's coming front and center and it's being just like sent on its merry way right to the E ring of the Pentagon by the GOP Senate who, you know, GOP senators who I've covered for years and were supposed to be the adults in the room that would, you know, keep the partisan politic crazies out of the room and instead now are embracing it and they grabbed the tiger's tail and we haven't even got started yet. So, yeah, I'm trying, so I'm trying to just figure out how do you ride this wave, what to expect the next four years, both, you know, personally, but as a reporter, as an analyst, as a national security professional, and say, this is all right. This is something that's happening. This is a movement. This is what the country wants. This is really happening. But nobody knows what it's going to look like. I just think that I'm in the camp that people saying, it's not going to be like last time, like we've all said, there won't be guardrail type of people in the room. Just the opposite. There will be enablers in the room and they'll be forcefully enabling what they feel they have the mandate to do rightfully. In a lot of cases they do. And how do you navigate that? I'm also looking, I'll say last thing I'll say, I'm also, it's also making me think maybe just because of my wise old ages, I've been in D.C. for 25 years of other circles of power, other circles of influence, other circles of business, academic culture, other ways that the world spins. That's not just D.C. politics. And I know you're big on this. You've been hammering the Democrats and folks who are looking to government and politicians for solutions. There's part of me that's shifting in that way, too.

[A]

Yeah. I mean, there's a failure of creativity. Right. And I want to take an except with you on a number of levels And I've been very critical of the Democrats. I will continue to be that way, because at the end of the day, what I think we've got is the culture war. Steamroller is picking up steam. Right? Like the Trump train. They always say the Trump train. It's a Trump steamroller. And it's not slowing down. It's speeding up because it's getting momentum and it's winning. And Hegseth, I've said this before, is like the lead element with the flag out in front and the tattoos on the chest. I mean, he is the embodiment of all this. And I think you're right to say it's extreme.

[B]

That shaman hat, you know, like, I.

[A]

Mean, it's not much further than that, man. I mean, you know, he was schlepping ammunition and stuff, like, a couple of weeks ago, and this is our new normal. But I also think too many on the left have kind of pooh, poohed it or thought it, dismissed it or, you know, this is happening. But I think why I really want to talk to you is because you understand the culture of the Pentagon. You've covered, I don't know, 10, a dozen different secretaries of defense, you know, the building. And I want to just kind of drill down on something that I hear a lot, which is. And I felt myself yesterday. Holy fucking shit. It's Pete Hegsett. Right? Like, we all know this guy, right? Anybody who watches Fox News knows this guy. Right? And. And the idea that they can make such a reach and. And almost make it normal. Right. Try to make it feel normalized is not okay, in my view. Right. And the thing that we, as experts with context and perspective and historical understanding and people who knew Chuck Hagel and Panetta and Bob Gates and so many others. You know this guy? Yeah, I think. I think Blumenthal kind of said it yesterday. He would be a great Pentagon spokesperson.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, you've been in that room. You know what that job is. And I always thought, Pete Hegseth, great press secretary, but Secretary of fucking Defense? No way. Right.

[B]

I'll actually argue that. I don't think he'd be a good press secretary. I think, you know, I think he'd be like a good kind of chief of staff, one of those guys who. The guy who stands on the side of the briefing room when the. You know, when the. When the principal comes out and the press secretary actually knows how to talk to the press, and they know they have to build relationships with the press, and so they know how to, like, Be a flack for the boss but also to work truth especially when there's a national security crisis moment and we've all been called in at like 10pm on Saturday because you know, they're about to kill bin Laden or some big thing like that. Moments like that where you're like, all right, this is where truth happens. That's different than like the, you know, the body men who are really, you know, the, the true followers of the SEC death. Right. And so I don't know where you place this guy but yes, you know, I said the same things yesterday and I'll, I'll tell you whatever you want to know about hex death but just impression wise. But yeah, in any other normal world there's no way we would be. He would even have a person would not with his, you know, background would not have accepted the nomination in the first place. You know, wouldn't. He wouldn't have put himself there thinking he had the chops to do it. But these are the types of people that you get in politics and when you get true believers and activists and he's you know, thrilled to be serving at the pleasure of the President.

[A]

Can you take us inside the Pentagon? I mean, I don't know, you've seen them. I mean I'm trying to think of who is the, the, the most significant opposite of Pete Hegseth, right? And maybe it's Lloyd Austin, right Who's you know, a retired flag grade, he's African American, he did 40 plus years in the military, never talked to the press probably until he was in like a flag grade position. I'm just trying to draw the contrast here because Pete XF can call it DEI and woke and all that shit but on day one you've got the Gaza peace deal. On day two you've got, you know, North Korea firing nukes and this is all the stuff you covered at Defense1 and everywhere else for so well. So I think it's, it's going to be really clear how in over his depth he is when that first thing hits his desk. But can you parent contrasted to other secs?

[B]

Usually the SEC's first trip is like straight to Japan and South Korea, it's to the treaty allies and it's to talk to the defense ministers and to meet the prime ministers quickly after they, they end up attending one of the, the regularly scheduled meetings of the NATO defense ministers, you know, the M Mendef meetings and you know, making those relationships happen and usually the people that have those jobs, they already kind of know Each other because they've grown up together. That's a good question. Who is opposite? I mean, Lloyd Austin is a good candidate for that. Like you said, you know, he's a, he made it to the top as a senior officer, not a junior officer. He's a West Pointer. He is African American and was, you know, given this drink. You could argue because of that. He was a good candidate to finally get some minorities into these senior ranks more frequently. He was, you know, known to the Bidens. He's an elite insider. He was known for, you know, he was a surprise when he was nominated. Remember what people did.

[A]

He was both. He was Bo's commander, wasn't he? Right. And Bo knew him.

[B]

No. Lloyd Austin was even on the radar for this job. If you weren't in the super, super inner circle, you thought it was going to Michelle Flournoy back then. Another DP insider. So that's a kind of a good example, you know, and he's. Yes, he's a quiet commander. He's a quiet commander too. But also that, that's part of the Democratic way where even in the Obama years the Democrats tried the simple version of this is the Democrats want to demilitarize foreign policy. And it was a bit of a response to the George W. Bush years where everything was gung ho military in the post nine, 11 days. And they were trying to like, all right, we got to rebalance this and soften it. Actually, the secretary of state is supposed to be the voice of America around the world, not the SEC deaf. And they kind of turned that on its head. And you know, if you're bravado, Republicans don't like that. They want, you know, the opposite to happen. I think a better example might be Ash Carter. You know, Ash Carter was brilliant. He was a nuclear physicist, mit and he was a lifelong public servant in and out of these, these bureaucratic political or career jobs, the kind of ones that the Trump MAGA world seems to hate, that they think are red tape and unnecessary and really worked his way up and wasn't super well known until he became the deputy Sec Def. And before then he was the chief weapons buyer of the Pentagon. The different title, the. The Deputy Secretary of Defense is like the appointment for the entire defense industry to the Pentagon. And usually, at least in those warrior days, like the Defense secretary was seen as the policy guy who was like going out to Afghanistan and making the public appearances and the depth sec guy. He's going to the expos and the trade shows and dealing with, you know, Boeing and Lockheed and General Dynamics and all that. The multi billion hundred dollar world. Except that as Carter was doing both and people didn't realize it, he was also going around the world and doing the policy connections. So when he got the job he really came to it as, as somebody with governing experience, with agency leadership experience and with lots of experience in the outside world, not just as a DC insider. He wasn't a mover and shaker, he wasn't a party, you know, party hopping, I mean like, like reception party, you know, political party kind of guy around town.

[A]

He wasn't taking his staff to strip clubs and getting bombed in the back of a bar bus.

[B]

No, he was, yes, good, good reference. He was. Instead he's the guy credited with, with making the link with Pentagon and Silicon Valley and the tech world to start this new era that we're in that that Peg Seth Petexeth is inheriting. If it gets confirmed where it's a world where the Pentagon and, and how you measure military might is no longer and the number of ships and the number of planes rather it's the technology on them and the whole non kinetic war world we're about to get into with cyber and everything else. So all that to say all of the things of a man like that's life compared to the Pete Hexap option. Now the devil's advocate here is that Pete Hegseth is exactly the kind of guy for the job that Trump wants. Exactly the kind of guy that the entire MAGA world wants and exactly what they said they wanted. Now no voter would ever know like who's who. He's going to be his choice for Sec Def. And even the Republicans were really shocked. They were shocked by Tulsi Gabbard's nomination. They're shocked by lots of these. Not Mike Waltz. We heard Mike Waltz was going to be SecDef. You know, maybe Tom Cotton, a member of Congress, some government experience. Still people, people are saying for years that Tom Cotton's been name has been on that list and he doesn't have the experience to run it. Maybe now he's been in D.C. long enough as a senator, but not at the beginning of his days. You know, look at Bob Gates, a lifelong government servant who was an acting CIA director, Deputy National Security divide, Leon Panetta, his whole background. The MAGA world's argument is that's exactly the problem. All of those guys are part of the problem. They're institutional. They kept us in wars we didn't need, they didn't move fast enough. They left us a Pentagon that's clearly outgunned for the next war in every way that you might measure. Blah, blah, blah, blah. Therefore, we need to blow up the system and put in a different guy.

[A]

Can we drill down on something? I think you and I are uniquely positioned to have a conversation about, which is the narrative and language change that they have introduced and are doubling down on is very intentional. And I want to kind of describe it. It's almost like, you know, bringing in this Dana White, wwe, Sean Ryan, Jocko, Will, Nick, like the podcast guys, right? It's. It's. Everybody's a pussy except for these guys, right? If you're not a certain way, you're a com.

[B]

What do you mean? How. How many push ups did you do today?

[A]

Yeah, I know. I did 36 this morning. I didn't do four sets of 47 or whatever.

[B]

I was tell you. That was literally a question in.

[A]

I know, I know.

[B]

That was a real question, right?

[A]

But I mean, that's. It's. It's a question. It's. It's a big talk thing that is almost un American, right? We've never seen an American defense secretary talk shit like this, Right? Even a Rumsfeld or someone else was a bit more diplomatic. But this guy is using words like lethality and war fighter, right? It's red meat for the base. And this kind of almost character caricature.

[B]

All of that, except the lethality in warfighter goes back to everywhere. I mean, I've heard that that's.

[A]

And, you know, but we're talking about lethality all the time, and we're talking about war fighters, but we didn't really talk about. We didn't really talk at all about cyber. Right? Cyber, which is maybe our most imminent, one of the biggest threats. An ongoing threat. Like, you didn't hear Pete Hegseth talk about his. His strategy for defending us against cyber attacks, which might be the thing that's happening right now.

[B]

You also didn't hear any senators ask him. That whole hearing was about, like, how, you know, you're a shithead, how you treat women in your real life, you know, defend that. And he had to do that. And you, you were bad at anything closely related was these veterans groups, and you're bad at that. Talk about that. Nobody asked him, hey, man, what's your theory for the use of military force abroad? What's your theory on alliances? Do you think that, you know, if north Macedonia, if, you know, one inch. That's what Biden's been saying for, for NATO. If North Macedonia loses territory. One inch of territory. Are you really committed to sending U.S. troops part, possibly in a nuclear armed way, to defend every inch of the NATO alliance? What are your thoughts on Southeast Asia and access to the ports and combating China? What are you going to do about the Quad? Are you willing to give concessions to anyone? How are you going to work with the Indians in their eyes? How are you going to work with the Global South? What are your thoughts on the future of organostral structures like the United Nations? I don't know. Where do you want to start? Ball like fuck.

[A]

Yeah. So can we drill down? I want to go to the lethality thing. But I also think the contrast that I saw, that has to be named and MSNBC and others can't name this, which is like, you had Mark Wayne Mullen, right guy, no jacket on. I'm a tough guy. I'm talking shit. And then you had Hirono, who is like this and was meek and old and female and like, hasn't served in the military. And there was this striking contrast over and over again of like tough talking, generally younger men. Right. White men exclusively, and then older civilian women. Elizabeth Warren, Kirsten Gillibrand, you have Tammy Duckworthy. But, but at some point I felt like it wasn't even a fair fight because you just didn't have people of that culture fighting it out.

[B]

Well, right. I think you make a good point, but I see it. I mean, in some way it's not surprising. I, you know, everybody complains about how old the Senate is and how out of touch, you know, these kind of national politicians become. They're all, you know, millionaires and elites in all the different ways. So to send in anybody of like a younger generation who's like a hot mouth, you know, of course that's a, that's a clash. I mean, it's like when you see Mark Zuckerberg go up on the Hill, it's, you know, and talk to these old guys who are like, I don't really know how to start my computer, but tell me more about, you know, the Facebook. Yeah, kind of like that. I know.

[A]

It's a good comparison. It's a good comparison.

[B]

Yeah. So like, you know, when you did have like Duckworth, it stands out. Like, here's a woman who can talk, literally, she can say whatever the hell she wants for her service. But you can also compare it to Joanie Ernst, which I said on, on, yes, on other show, how, you know, Joanie Ernst was a good example of one of these types where you, you, when she came under the scene as a politician. People thought, oh, okay, she's got this veteran war experience. She'll be one of the adults in the room that will resist the partisan craziness of, like, the bomb throwers and be one of these. You know, she'll be a. You know, she'll show a line with McCain in the old ways of, like, being a. A real overseer of the Pentagon, a person of the Senate, a person of the legislative branch. And then, you know, even in this case, she's a combat veteran. She's. She says she's a victim of sexual assault herself, and she's still making excuses to pass Exf. That's the world that we're in now. That's the difference. Now, I think, again, this just shows. This shows to. It just reveals to me MAGA success. Right. A guy like Hexeth seems to make sense to a lot of people. He seems to be in more in touch than the other people who are asking the questions on the deus, the people who actually have the power, the. The entire purse over the Pentagon. That. That committee controls the Pentagon. Unless they're being controlled by the Pentagon in the system, depending on who's in charge of that gavel, depending on how strong they want to be. You know, nobody questioned McCain's power. Nobody questioned Carl Levin's power. They questioned Inhofe's power. You know, he was not as people that aren't as strong there, you know, and I don't know how Wicker is going to be. I think Wicker was a guy a lot of people think, all right, he's not a far right extreme guy. He's, you know, Mississippi shipbuilder. He, like, he's really smart in the ways of defense and especially the industry. He knows this stuff, and he does, and that's why he's risen. That community made it a priority. I've talked about the Munich Security Conference Conference. Like a lot of reporters, he. He lives in this world, and he came out yesterday, you know, ready to hand the keys to pet.

[A]

Pete Hegseth fell in line just like the rest.

[B]

Yeah. Because I've been covering. I've seen this for a long time. These are politicians. They're politicians. They have to make deals with people. They have to, like, you know, they have to protect their own interests. They will protect their own interests. And so maybe we shouldn't be surprised that, you know, this is a sail through.

[A]

But you t. You said something. That's right. Like they. They. They're not in touch. Right. And I think that's the authenticity is the brand of Trump. Like I really know what you're. What's going. It's a grievance too, right. Power. Ken Burns has been on my show before and talks about the power of grievance. But there was a moment where he, Seth, looked at Jack Reed and said something like, I know as a combat veteran, which was a you to Jack Reed because he knows that Jack reed, Ranger qualified, 82nd Airborne, never was in combat. Right. And you could see Reed's face. But there was a. I know what I'm talking about and you don't. Which he could hold with everybody except, you know, except for Tammy Duckworth maybe. Right. And he didn't really get into it with, with.

[B]

No, but he does with her too, because he thinks she doesn't. She got her job because she's a woman or a minority. And you know, oh, you were a helicopter pilot. You were Kelly.

[A]

Kelly the astronaut.

[B]

You know, more than I do as a veteran. There's always, there's always a veteran who thinks that you're not, you're not as good a veteran or your service didn't count as much. Oh yeah, because you know, you were, you were FOB Hobbit, right? I know these words.

[A]

The whole world of military is like a giant dick measuring contest.

[B]

Right.

[A]

We all know that, right?

[B]

Go back to your original point of like, you know, hex. Seth. I feel like you could have picked this guy off the range and down in Tampa. It was any other guy who did his time. He's, he's like wearing soft kit. He's, you know, living at Monkey Bar, like, or bad monkey, whatever it's called. You know, like he lives the life. And man, does MAGA world love it. They love it. They love it. They love it. That's the America they want. That's the, the, their version of strength and projection that they want. It's not bookishness, it's not the, the people that led the wars of the last 20 years, which they think led us nowhere and got us right back to where we started. So again, like, I just, I just feel you could find a disruptor who believes all those things that MAGA world believes, who still has more qualifications than Hegseth running a major organization. You can find a state governor, you can find a legislator, you could find another, like CEO of a company or, or you know, a university president. You can find plenty of people if you wanted them. Trump didn't want them.

[A]

Kevin, what is the most you, you know, this stuff inside and out. What's the biggest thing from a national security priority standpoint that never even came up and got touched on yesterday.

[B]

Oh, I'd have to think of the list again. I mean, but if you were going.

[A]

To prioritize all them and you were saying, hey, Senator, this is, you know, you're, you're the advisor in the back room advising a senator on either side. We got to get to this.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, if we, if we, if we replaced all the time spent on Hexa's personal stuff and the right. And what I would want to hear more of, I want to hear more of the future of European security and NATO and this idea that, you know, that Trump did help kind of spur more than already was happening because it already was happening, that the Europeans have to do more to defend themselves. It's time. It's, it's past time, but it's still at the very beginnings. Like Europe can't just turn on factories and start making bullets faster than we make them in North Carolina. They have to. It's taken a long time, but it's going in the right direction. It's a fascinating story and it's, it's great if you believe that's what we need to. Because that war isn't over. The Ukraine war isn't over. Putin still alive. This is going to go on for a long time. The entire NATO, you know, roundtable in Brussels is going to turn to this guy and go, what does the United States want? He's got it. So I wish they would have prepped him and like drilling on that China. I was watching Rubio's hearing today. Rubio can talk about China, you know, all day long until he's blue in the face. Like, that guy knows China, he knows those issues. Talk all about, you know, the, in a very nuanced way. You can't just turn China off. This isn't like the Soviet Union. We are connected to China. Half the country wants to stay connected to China. We make billions of dollars dealing with China and you know, again, that this phase is going to pass too and we want to be able to continue. What are you going to do about the future of power and the difference of military power? People want to ask them about non defense power, like the soft power world. Bob Gates and others talked about this stuff all the time back in the day. Like, you know, okay, great, you want, you want us to, you know, Trump's going to want a massive increase in spending in the, in the Pentagon. We all think we, and a lot of us Think a lot of it is overdue and needed. I think we're going to reach a trillion dollars under this presidency for the Pentagon budget for the first time.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

What are you going to do with it? Ask them about technology, ask them about AI. Ask them about, you know, Oshkosh. Ask him about F35 and, and sixth generation fighters. You know, ask him if he really wants to fight China. We need more missiles. Great. How many more, how many ships you want? You want 300 more ships than the 300 we have? Who's going to build them? Are you willing to pay for it? Are you going to come to Capitol Hill and are you going to advocate, you know what, what are the non defense discretionary expenditures that we need to cut to pay for those defense. Go pick. Take a pick, man. Take your pick. There's.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

But you know, strategic priorities I think right now are the future of NATO. I think that's enormous, especially because we're in this, we're in this season where the Munich security conference is coming up, Davos is coming up. There are going to be giant global conversations where this happens and there's a big pulse check moment and they're all going to be about what do we do now that Trump is back, how do we react? How do we Trump proof ourselves like we, like they did last time? We didn't hear about any of that. We hear nothing.

[A]

It's a good thing Hegseth can read a prompter because he's going to be reading from a lot of pages in the next couple of weeks if he's confirmed. Let me ask you something you might be uniquely positioned to talk about.

[B]

Well, yeah, you should point out this is why Senator Wicker limited the questioning to one round. And Reed was rightful right to point out. This is not normal for any other sec dep, Republican or Democrat. Usually any senator that's got a question, they just keep going around and they go to lunch.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Chuck Hagel was a two day process. They brought him for a second hearing.

[A]

And it was brutal. And it was a bad first hearing.

[B]

They decided to have in a smaller room in the Capitol building, not the main hearing room. They barely put out a notice about it. I was a reporter at the time, making sure I got into the room and I was part of the report on what happened because Hagel was a Republican who was getting dogged by other Republicans because they knew he was against the Iraq war. He was questioning a lot of the issue. The policies Republicans wanted was siding with the Democrats as he does sometimes. He's still a Republican from Nebraska. And it was insane what they put him. It was insane. It was just unexpected and unusual. Whereas.

[A]

And he struggled. Right. There was a question of whether or not Chuck Hagel was qualified to be sec Def. And you know, for all this talk of, you know, we need somebody with dirt on their boots. Chuck Hagel's got two Purple Hearts and pulled his brother out of a burning vehicle in Vietnam. I mean, this, this kind of rewrite.

[B]

Still has shrapnel in his body from the.

[A]

Yeah. Still has shot. Right, right, right.

[B]

I'll tell you Chuck Hagel story you might like about. That's related to this, about the, the, the, the. The culture bravado of, of. I know more than you. I'm a combat guy. I'm a trigger puller. I'm more manly. I'm more. Whatever it was when Hegel was coming up, McCain was dogging him. McCain did not want what Hagel was going to bring because McCain wanted, you know, more intervention. He wanted to bomb, bomb, bomb Iran. Right. He was in a different place back then. He was more support. Supportive of keeping the boot on the gas out in the Middle East. And he was like, we got to keep fighting, keep doing those things. We were on a trip with Hegel when he, after he became sec. Definitely may have been his first trip. We were out in Asia and one of the reporters asked him this since come public. It was a, like a off the record moment. And so you asked him about, you know, you're a, you know, McCain was, was famously the most famous POW of all from Vietnam. You were in Vietnam. How do. But you guys are on such opposite ends. How does, how does that happen? Like, how do you. What do you think about when you hear him question you and all that? Hegel's response was. Was very interesting. He goes, you know, John McCain was a Navy pilot in the air. I was an infantry man on the ground. And those are two very different war experiences. Make it new. Not to denigrate anyone's experience. They're all valuable with the R. His experience was flying overhead and dropping bombs. My experience was seeing the effect of those bombs firsthand. And he still has them in his body. That's why he felt it was much easier for a veteran like McCain to want to approve and conduct military interventions and actions abroad. And why it was a harder for a veteran like Chuck Hagel to say yes, he was right where Obama was, which was a much higher bar for saying yes to military interventions. People forget that they think of like.

[A]

No, I think it's important.

[B]

Trump wants to keep the United States out. Obama wanted to fight. No, no, Obama.

[A]

I've been honored to know Hagel and he's been on this show before. And you know, I know that, you know, Chuck Hagel's told stories about walking point with his brother.

[B]

Yeah, right.

[A]

Like he would take point and he felt okay when his brother was on point. I mean, that, you know, they didn't put brothers together. I don't know how they got around that. But that's fucking nuts, right? To be in Vietnam in the shit next to your brother. And then they both got, I think combined five Purple Hearts, right? So they got banged up along the way too. But the contrast is really stark. Speaking of contrast, I want to come to you and get your football predictions. This is going to be something we're doing from now on in this show. So hang with me for a second. I'm going to come to that. But before I do, and maybe you could stick around for five minutes of extra content for our Patreon members. You want to hear Kevin Barron's music recommendations and other things personal. So Patreon members, thank you for making this possible. Stick around for that. If you're not watching on YouTube, please watch us on YouTube. Subscribe. Hit that subscribe button. We're doing a lot more video. Kevin, you know the Pentagon, you know the building. How significant is the purge going to be? Both the purge by Hegseth where he's going to clean out people who aren't loyalists, and the self inflicted purge, people are just gonna say it, I'm out. Right? Like how do we quantify? And there's always going to be these folks say, I'm staying in to fight them or I'm getting the hell out. Right. I don't think it's going to be long before we get a Vinmin type whistleblower who says, I was in the room and I heard whatever. But in mass, I feel like it's like congestion pricing. How are we going to quantify the percentage of people who are no longer driving into the city? Like, how big do you think in terms of impact and even scope the number of people leaving either because he kicks them out or because they want to select out.

[B]

I think it'll be big. It's so hard to quantify because the Pentagon is so big. And the Pentagon is just like the one office building for the DOD, right? The Pentagon's like 35,000 people in an organization of 3 million. But I will tell you, I remember in Trump one years, the just, just, just example for reporters, right? Reporters offices are like down this long hall near the briefing room that's around the corner from where the SEC death is and the chairman is. So that we're near the leadership by design in the Pentagon. It makes it easier for them to walk to the briefing room when they have to. But in between the briefing room and us is a very big wide office of cubicles. That's the Pentagon public affairs main office. It's big, I don't know, maybe 50 desks in there or something like that. It's a large place. It was empty in the Trump years. It was after being just overflowing and busy in the years before, granted war years also. But it was empty because one by one and it's a mix of, it's a, that room is a mix of, of civilians and uniforms, right? So there's like people at the end of their career in the army that, you know, they got a couple more years and they end up as PAOs, these public affairs officers mixed in with civilians who have been there for decades and are experts at weapon systems and policies. And one by one people were leaving and it was empty. State Department, same thing. Remember there was like a big like people were quitting, giving up and they didn't want to be it. State's a little different because you're representing policy in a different way than, than Pentagon in the military. You know, if you're, if you're in uniform, you know this, it's different. There's no, there's no in and out of a career and you know, you're out, you're out, especially at that level. But it's also, it's a, it's a pen, it's a pyramid that gets steeper and steeper at the top where there's few billets, very few billets, the farther up you get. So because it automatically there's a bit of self selection. So when something like this comes, people are, they're not just thinking like do I want to stick around during Trump? They're thinking like do I want to stay in uniform for another four years? Where am I going to get deployed? Is it going to be worth it? Am I going to get my, that I want that star before I go. My kids are of a certain age, they're in college or they're in whatever. So there's all sorts of life decisions as you know, to like do I stay or do I go? In addition to do I want to carry out this policy. So Yes. I think you'll have plenty of career civil servants and who will stay because they stayed through it all. They've been here since Rumsfeld. They've been here for. There's a lot, there are people like that who. And a lot of their jobs, they really are pretty far removed from policy. Their job is to make sure that, like, you know, the helmet visor of an F35 pilot that's being, you know, is meeting the requirements that are in pace 500 of the bill. That's their. Like, they don't care about what Trump says or do. Like, that's different. So I think where it hits is like that ASD level. So you got the SEC def. Deb, SEC def. Then you get an undersecretary asd, meaning Assistant Secretary of Defense, secretaries of defense who are for Middle east, for solic, for, you know, all sorts of these buckets. Those are the people that come up through the ranks through, like, Heritage foundation, know, on the liberal side, they're coming up through center for New American Security and the, the Truman, you know, project. Yeah. You know, there are, there are young and rising smart people who want experience in the agencies and government so that one day they can be, you know, some. Something big in their careers. Just this is how the, this is the career ladder in national security and defense at the Pentagon. That's where it takes a real hit. So a lot of those jobs were empty and Trump won because either so many people signed those, those never Trumper letters saying I would never serve and. Or they were blacklisted by the Trump people because they did or not. So even if you signed that or initially, you say you weren't going to help Trump, and two years later, you're like, all right, I want to help. They need help or I should do it. They said, no, we don't want you. Well, from what we're hearing, that's already the case. Like, if you worked with Pompeo, you're out. If you worked with Nikki Haley, you're out. You don't get a job. So they need to find conservatives, find Republicans who they can either are loyalists or they quietly can stomach Trump. But they want to do the job. They want to get it on the resume because they know this is. They'll be here for 30, 40 years, not just four. And I don't know what's out there yet. Like, if you work at aei, you know, if you're someone like Corey Shockey or if you're Richard Fontaine at CNAS, these are people that worked for McCain that worked for Bush, that are respected and highly respected leaders in the community that are shunned out of Trump world and they will not have any say in policy. Whisper it.

[A]

The next Vivek Ramaswamy or some random tech dude or somebody's kids.

[B]

I don't know. Pete's going to bring with him too. Like people bring with them. You know, they bring staffers, they bring and they tap their friends and we don't know who those people are going to be. That's the real effect.

[A]

Okay, let's do something different. Quick fire football predictions. We're going to need a break from all of this. And we thankfully, we've had the most amazing football over the last couple of weeks. I know you're a sports and culture guy. I'm just going to start with the big one. National championship game is the night of inauguration. Holy. It's Martin Luther King Day inauguration and then a national championship game, which is on many levels just a security issue, right? Like talk about secretary of defense. Like the secretary of defense will have to at least have a briefing somewhere on security at the national championship game, right? Because you got what, 100,000 people there, 80,000 people there. Notre Dame vers all the Notre Dame versus Ohio State. Who you picking?

[B]

All right, man, so I, I got deep roots in this and I'm telling you as I get, I grew up in Florida. My dad went to Florida State. We're a Florida State Seminoles family, so we're hurting this year. That said, I've got a Big Ten son and it was, it was at Penn State. I have cousins who went to Ohio State. I have a brother went to Michigan State. All that to say, man. And I remember 1993 when an undefeated Florida State with Charlie Ward went into South Bend and got beat by Notre Dame in a close game, but then went on to win the rest of our games and make it to the national championship and win. And Notre Dame never forgave us for that because they lost the next week to Boston College. In the old days, that meant you were out. There was no playoffs. All that to say, I watched Notre Dame last couple games and man, am I impressed. Those guys have heart. They find a way and so. And they're exciting. I like what their young coach is doing. And I gotta say, you know, I'm looking forward to rooting for the fight in Irish. Boom.

[A]

Notre Dame it is. Chris, maybe you'll pop up graphics here. I concur. I have been watching Notre Dame all year. I think they got some unique Magic, they believe, which reach for the touchdown.

[B]

That reach over the goal line.

[A]

And I, you know, I was even like almost torn when they played army at Yankee Stadium, but that was, you know, that was a tune up game for them. But, but Riley Leonard's got a little magic. They've got the Notre Dame mystique. You know, Ohio State is kind of become the bad guy in a lot of ways. And they're, they're a machine.

[B]

You're not wrong about that. I'm sorry, man. Kirk Herbstreet isn't doing any love to make me like him or, you know.

[A]

I, I think that, that, that Ohio State's almost like the new Alabama, but without the winds. And, and, and ultimately I'm going with Notre Dame. All right, now we got NFL football. We're gonna have to rattle through these quick until I get some like, fanatic sponsorship or something else.

[B]

Don't you want to hear Notre Dame? You want to hear that fight stunt? You want to hear the Notre Dame fight song in the. Yeah.

[A]

I mean, if you don't think, you want to go to a Notre Dame, you hate America. If you, if you, if you don't hate, if you don't want to go to another game, you're, you are really woked out and you're some like, like DEI hegseth slander about why you hate America.

[B]

Say, this is the most hexaf I've ever seen you right now.

[A]

Yeah, this is me. All right, so Texans, Chiefs, first game Saturday. 430 Texans against. Going to Arrowhead against the Chiefs. Who you got?

[B]

Chiefs. Why are we even talking about this?

[A]

Like, I, I agree, I agree.

[B]

Don't even bother watching. Go to the farmer's market.

[A]

Oh, it's going to be fun to watch CJ Stroud. And you never know, anything can happen. It's still the NFL, but the Chiefs, I think are getting warmed up and then they're going to have to fight against, I think the Bills next week. But. All right, go. Let's go to your hometown, guys. The amazing upstart now called Commanders have to go into Detroit Lions. We always feel a little uneasy about the Lions, right? It's like the Democrats. You feel like they're always going to find a way to it up. But the commanders and their electrifying quarterback, Jaden Daniels are going into Detroit.

[B]

So there's. I have a lot of logic in this pick because I'm a Packers fan who can't stand the Lions and know that the lines have been a joke my entire life. But I'm Also, Washington is not my hometown. Washington is where I moved to. And anybody who's lived here the last 25 years and had endured. Dan Snyder, you could not pay me enough money to root for the Washington any name team. So, hey, man, I'm riding the Detroit bandwagon with Eminem 8 mile all the way. Go Lions.

[A]

I'm with you. I'm with you. I love the pride thing. I love Dan Campbell. He was a great tight end for the Giants. The Ahmad Saint Brown story is amazing about how he changed his name. His dad was Mr. Universe and he speaks German. The Lions, I just think got it. Got to just stay steady, stay steady. I think what they did against Minnesota was awesome. I'm rooting for them to go all the way. I'm with you. I got. I got the Lions. All right, the first Sunday game, 3 o'.

[B]

Clock.

[A]

The Rams, who are riding some. Also some special energy, got a bit of experience, right? They got a quarterback who played solid as. As. As their opponent, who was. It totally imploded this weekend. But the. Oh, it was the Vikings. They just shellacked the Vikings right where Sam Darnold became the Sam Darnold we know. It's like Joni Ernst, right? Like, you kind of hope Joni Ernst is going to be something different, but she ends up being Joni Ernst. That's Sam to Arnold, but. All right. Rams go in to play the Eagles, who now have Saquon, who I miss every single day. Who you got, Rams or Eagles?

[B]

This is a tough one, man. It's like Saquon versus Jared Verse on the. On the Rams side. Where's the game at? Philly.

[A]

Philly. Yeah.

[B]

I think I still might pull for the. I. I would. I expect the Eagles will pull it out, but I'm gonna. I'm gonna root for the Rams, so I'll pick the Rams.

[A]

I'm all right. I'm. I'm with you on that, but I think the Eagles are going to win. I mean, it's. It might be closer than anticipated. The. The Eagles have looked like they're hitting their stride. Saquon's just awesome. And I just.

[B]

I just don't have to adore Jake Tapper tweeting about it if they keep. Yeah.

[A]

You know what else? But the Rams, I think this is also a factor. Like, they didn't play a home game last week. They were in Arizona. Now they got to go all the way to Philly. You know, they got. They're worried about their houses. They got coaches who are getting dragged all around by these wildfires.

[B]

I think that's a good point. Now you're bringing me down with all these exciting.

[A]

So I'm picking. I'm picking the Eagles. Picking the Eagles, and I hate it, but I'm picking the. All right, last game. The most exciting one of the weekend. This is fireworks. Ravens going to Buffalo. I'm glad it's in Buffalo so I don't have to see West Moore do another hype video as the governor of Maryland who needs to come back on this show when he's not entertaining the whole political world in his suite in Maryland. We got the matchup, man. Ravens versus Bills. Who you got?

[B]

Bills all the way. Classic smash mouth. I hope it snows 100ft, you know, the night before, like every time. There's nothing better than Bills in the playoffs. And, you know, I'm. I. I still remember for long enough the four years in a row, so I'm. I'm still hoping for that day. The Bills go all the way.

[A]

I'm nervous for the Bills a bit because Derrick Henry is a fucking machine. And he and Lamar together are just something really special. But at the end of the day, they used to say defense wins championships. Now I think it's quarterbacks who make the right decision. And Josh Allen is also a beast. I mean, he runs as hard as Derrick Henry, and if he doesn't get knocked out for trying to plow over a defensive tackle, I think the Bills have got it. And I think the Bills and Lions are going to match up. I think the Bills can beat the Chiefs, too. I think this is the year where they can finally.

[B]

I think they can, too. But I think those last two games, the home field makes a difference.

[A]

I mean, America needs Buffalo versus Detroit. We need this, right? We need some great American gut story, right? And. And I think we need it. But. All right, those are our predictions. Let us know what you think. Kevin Barron knows almost as much about football as he does about the defense and national security world. Check us out on all the social media platforms. We're going to do more sports, folks, because we're going to need the break and because it's fun and because it's awesome and I like doing it. So keep the feedback coming on this segment and all others. Kevin is going to stick around for five extra minutes for the car question and much other stuff. But, dude, in all sincerity, I really respect you. You're also an incredible dad, and I should tell everyone you've been a great dad, role model, mentor for me over the years. I've called on you for advice and I've looked to you for inspiration, and you're a great patriot, man. The work you've been doing is a tremendous public service. And you keep it cool. You always look cool. You got your little thing going on with the outfits and the piano behind you, and we need a little more cool in the national security and defense.

[B]

We do, man, we do.

[A]

And real cool, not like fake. I got an American flag inside my jacket. You know, you got the real cool going on. I appreciate you, so thank you for joining us.

[B]

You can, you can do anything, but you can also do it with style.

[A]

There it is. All right, ladies and gentlemen, the great Kevin Baron. Thank you for joining us, my friend. All right, I've only got a couple minutes before my kids get home from school, so a couple of Rykoff's recommendations. Number one, Marcus King Band. Marcus King Band. Amazing artist, guitar player, singer, so much soul, so much depth. If you've never heard Marcus King, check him out now. He's playing in New York actually tonight, and I'm afraid I can't make it. He's going to be at the Blue Note for two nights. But check out the Marcus King Band. You're going to need music to get you through the next couple of weeks especially, so check out Marcus King Band from Greenville, South Carolina, right now. Another Rykoff's recommendation. Check out Coach Ball Game on Instagram. This guy is an amazing inspiration. He's a coach, he's a teacher, and he's going to teach you how to think about approaching not just coaching kids and baseball, but life. He's my favorite person to follow on Instagram. I learn from him every day. So check out Coach Ball Game on Instagram. My next recommendation. Kevin Barron is our guest on this Week and not a sponsor of the show, but Kevin's Meals. I am always looking for quick meals that have protein and don't make me have a heart attack. And these things are great. You can throw them in the microwave in three minutes. They also have lots of chicken dishes that you can just put in the microwave and they're delicious and nutritious. Check out Kevin's Meals. Finally, my final Rykoff's recommendation. This is a big one. Congestion pricing. I recommend congestion pricing for every city in America. Congestion pricing hit New York City just a couple of weeks ago, and now it costs $9 to get in and out of New York City below Midtown. And you can see it, you can hear it, you can feel it. Already New York City is more livable and Traffic hasn't been this light since COVID It's kind of miraculous. Just like the smoking ban and Citibike, initial opposition and special interest must be overcome in the long term. Benefits for those of us, and especially our kids, who actually live here, the primary focus for a policy like this shouldn't be what some dude who lives in another state or some business thinks it should be about what's best for the kids who live there. And for my kids here in Lower Manhattan, what's best for them is not necessarily what's best for commuters or tourists from New Jersey or whatever. We live here. And most politicians who've been raising hell don't live here, and that includes Trump. So congestion pricing, it's working and it's just getting started. So stay strong. New York City, this is what's best for us and for our beloved city long term. And our kids one day will thank us. So if you hate traffic in your city, this is what a better future can look like. That's why I strongly recommend for all independent Americans and all Americans, congestion pricing, Guys. I say look for the helpers. And in times like this, we need to look for the helpers now more than ever. Especially given what's happening in the wildfires across California. I want to continue to send support, love and recommendations. Check out Team Rubicon. They are spinning up. Jake Wood's been on this show before. Disaster relief organization led by veterans and headquartered in Southern California, just outside of la. So check out Team Rubicon and look for the helpers. And if you've got a helper, use the hashtag look for the helpers and let me know. Be sure to subscribe here on YouTube and anywhere else on all social media platforms. And let me know. Mr. Rogers always said, when things get bad, look for the helpers. They'll be running in when others run out. And now we need the helpers more than ever. All right, folks, you know the deal. The future is here and the future must be full of independence. We, because independents are the future. We're not alone in our independence. America is more divided than ever before. But we at Independent Americans and Righteous Media are working to change that, adding light to contrast the heat of all the other political news and culture shows. So if you're among the now 51% of Americans who are independent, this is your show. We invite you to join us. Put country over party and join the Independent Americans movement. Country over party. People over politics. Light over heat. Busting up the status quo and creating a new movement that spans all across our society. It just might save us. I hope you enjoyed this episode with Kevin Barron. If you did, please share it far and wide. Be sure to subscribe here on YouTube or anywhere else you're watching or listening on Spotify and any other platforms. And our Patreon members, thank you to you especially. You got this episode first. You got it without commercials. And you got exclusive content with Kevin Barron where I asked for his music, music recommendations and his very first car. But invite others to declare their independence and stay vigilant, my friend, because eternal vigilance is the price of freedom. And no, you're not alone in your vigilance. We're all vigilant and we're all in this together. I'm your host, Paul Rykoff. Thank you for listening. Down with Hamas. And especially good to hear the news of a possible peace deal in the Middle east. Especially because American hostages will be coming home and Israeli hostages will be coming home. American hostages especially, that are long since forgotten. But still. Down with Hamas. Down with Putin. Slava, Ukraine. Let's go Notre Dame. And stay vigilant, America. Stay vigilant. By righteous media.