
Two months in, $25 billion spent, more than a dozen Americans dead, gas at 4.30 a gallon — and now Pete Hegseth and Donald Trump want to change the subject from Iran to Cuba. This is the forever war machine in real time: shift the target, claim the win, drag allies along, and hope the country doesn't notice. The angry middle is noticing. And they don't feel safer.
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Michael Knowles
He's now threatening to pull troops out of Germany and Germany.
Pete Hegseth
Remind us why Germany is so important.
Michael Knowles
Because it's there to block against the Russians. I mean, this is like the most basic.
Pete Hegseth
We also have a military hospital that we use quite a bit.
Michael Knowles
And there's that as well.
Pete Hegseth
Some of our biggest military bases in the world, most important in the world, are in Germany.
Michael Knowles
Yeah, I mean, this is the framework that has kept America secure for generations. So I think your point is an important one, and I think Americans don't feel safer.
Pete Hegseth
PAUL Pete Hegseth denies the American public doesn't support the war. The polling has shown consistently, consistently there has not been a deviation. They do not support this and it
Michael Knowles
hasn't gotten better and it's going to get worse. Wars don't get more popular over time. He knows that. He served in one of them. We both served in a war that was unpopular and over time they get less popular. This is, I think, maybe one of the most important questions from the start. You have to commit the country first before you commit the troops. Every time you get it backwards, we get into trouble from Afghanistan to Iraq to Vietnam and now again to Iran. I think most Americans are asking what are we getting in two months? What are we getting for $25 billion? And we don't feel safer. Our oil prices are going up, gas prices are going up. We lost, you know, over over a dozen Americans, and there's no end in sight. So Hegseth is on the ropes appropriately. And finally, this seems to be a level of accountability he's never had before. So yesterday, today, I think, is actually day for democracy. These are the type of hearings we should have had two months ago, and maybe we should start having them now on Cuba, because they're already talking about doing that next.
Pete Hegseth
PETE hegseth, Political appointee, though, in the military. So somebody had to give him an honest assessment that Venezuela and Iran are not the same, right?
Michael Knowles
I hope so. I think what he wants to talk the reason why he wants to talk about Venezuela is because he views it as a win. He thinks he keeps comparing Iran to Venezuela that people will think it's a win. That's why he keeps doing it now. He wants to keep that momentum up and roll on into Cuba. I think, first of all, that was just so incredib painful to watch. And as we sit here, I never want to normalize how ridiculous so much of that is. But I think your breaking news headline is actually very important to our national security because he continues to drive away our allies. We have an army base that you served on in Italy. We put naval destroyers in Spain. He's now threatening to pull troops out of Germany.
Pete Hegseth
And Germany. Remind us why Germany is so important.
Michael Knowles
Because it's there to block against the Russians. I mean, this is like the most basic.
Pete Hegseth
We also have a military hospital that we use quite a bit.
Michael Knowles
And there's that as well.
Pete Hegseth
Some of our biggest military bases in the world, important in the world, are in Germany.
Michael Knowles
Yeah. I mean, this is the framework that has kept America secure for generations. So I think your point is an important one. And I think Americans don't feel safer. They don't feel safer with troops overseas. They feel this instability from the domestic terrorism threat and from the political violence. And they're always worried about Iranian proxy. I think everybody walks up the door and goes to a big baseball game or goes to a big crowd has got that in the back of their head.
Pete Hegseth
Yeah.
Michael Knowles
And DHS was just shut down for two months. That didn't help me.
Pete Hegseth
It's not just foreign terrorism now. It's homegrown terrorism and someone with a gun wanting to come in and shoot a bunch of people up. So the worries just keep on, compounding movement that supports this in surprising places, maybe states that Democrats had at one point written off.
Michael Knowles
I think the bigger trend is that the country's sick of all of them. Now, Trump is unique, right? And I think the number he has to focus on is 430, because it's 430 a gallon right now. And that's what most Americans care about more than anything else. But 27% of the country is Republicans, 27% is Democrats, 45% is independents. 60% of young people are unaffiliated independents. The future is actually none of the above. And that's where I see move. And who can buy for those independents? They're overwhelmingly against the Arch and against knocking down the White House and against Iran. And they are the voters that people have to try to contend for. So a place like Maine, where now, you know, Graham Pletner has a more open field against Susan Collins, that will
Pete Hegseth
help Janet Mills dropped out.
Michael Knowles
Yeah, that will help us find out. And the real battle there is for independence. You know, can someone win the independence in that state? And is it going to be Graham Plitner or is it going to be Susan Collins?
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Date: May 4, 2026
Host: Paul Rieckhoff
Guests: Michael Knowles, Pete Hegseth
In this episode, Paul Rieckhoff moderates a sharp and timely discussion with Michael Knowles and Pete Hegseth, focusing on America’s shifting foreign policy priorities. The conversation zeroes in on the debate over overseas military deployments, the continued unpopularity of endless wars, political maneuvering around Iran, and speculation about a renewed focus on Cuba. The hosts and guests explore public opinion, the motivations of political leaders (including Donald Trump), and the evolving landscape for independents and third-party voters.
Quote:
“Because it’s there to block against the Russians. I mean, this is like the most basic.”—Michael Knowles [00:06]
“Some of our biggest military bases in the world, most important in the world, are in Germany.”—Pete Hegseth [00:13]
Quote:
“Wars don’t get more popular over time. He knows that. He served in one of them. We both served in a war that was unpopular and over time they get less popular. …You have to commit the country first before you commit the troops. Every time you get it backwards, we get into trouble.”—Michael Knowles [00:51]
Quote:
“He keeps comparing Iran to Venezuela that people will think it’s a win. That’s why he keeps doing it now. He wants to keep that momentum up and roll on into Cuba.”—Michael Knowles [01:49]
Quote:
“They don’t feel safer with troops overseas. They feel this instability from the domestic terrorism threat and from the political violence...”—Michael Knowles [02:38]
“It’s not just foreign terrorism now. It’s homegrown terrorism and someone with a gun wanting to come in and shoot a bunch of people up. So the worries just keep on, compounding…”—Pete Hegseth [03:01]
Quote:
“The future is actually none of the above. And that’s where I see move. And who can buy for those independents? They’re overwhelmingly against the Arch and against knocking down the White House and against Iran. And they are the voters that people have to try to contend for.”—Michael Knowles [03:16]
On Foreign Policy Fatigue:
“Most Americans are asking what are we getting in two months? What are we getting for $25 billion? And we don’t feel safer. Our oil prices are going up, gas prices are going up. We lost, you know, over over a dozen Americans, and there’s no end in sight.”—Michael Knowles [00:51]
On Political Theater and Accountability:
“Finally, this seems to be a level of accountability he’s never had before. So yesterday, today, I think, is actually day for democracy. These are the type of hearings we should have had two months ago, and maybe we should start having them now on Cuba.”—Michael Knowles [00:51]
On Changing Political Demographics:
“60% of young people are unaffiliated independents. The future is actually none of the above.”—Michael Knowles [03:16]
This episode is invaluable for listeners seeking insight into America’s evolving global stance, the politics of endless war, mounting public backlash, and the ascendancy of independent voters. The guests’ firsthand experience and analytical candor deliver a sobering, clarifying commentary for the “angry middle” and those weary of partisan spin.