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A pulp MX Network production. A cerebral and experienced look into the racing action from the week that was this is Industry Seating with Jason Thomas. Presented by Guts Racing, Works, Connection, TL Speed Shop, Unmatched Supplements, Firepower Parts, Grandstone Boots and Fly Racing. Welcome everybody to the Industry Seating podcast. My name is Jason Thomas. I am the host. I have been the host, I'll probably always be the host. And thank you everybody for listening to this thing and I apologize for not being around much. Well, I say that only on this podcast because if you're a fan of dirt bike racing, that is far from accurate. Because I feel like I've been doing a little bit of everything. I've been on a lot of podcasts lately and of course I'm so fortunate to be a part of the Super Motocross broadcast team, whether it's, you know, supercross, motocross playoffs, whatever. So yeah, I'm excited to get back to my own podcast. It's been too long since I've done one. A couple weeks maybe. Not a big deal. Let's get into this thing. Let's talk about what we saw in St. Louis and I'm not going to cover Charlotte because it's old news and you probably don't care anymore. And we all know that the race, the second Motos got canceled and all the drama, blah blah blah. We already know all that, talked about it, you've heard about it, let's move on. But I do want to talk about St. Louis because it's fresh in my mind. I flew back to Boise today recording this on Sunday, September 14, 2025. And yeah, mellow morning. Got to think about the race a lot. We didn't finish super late, which was nice. I think I got to the hotel maybe something like 10 o'. Clock. We were hanging around inside the stadium for a while doing doing the SMX Insider post race show. And then we filmed an interview with Ricky and James for our SMX Insider show that comes out on Thursdays at 2pm so definitely check that out. I thought it was pretty interesting, but yeah, just overall I thought it was a good weekend. I'm sure most of you listening were not there, which is normal, but it was hot and you don't really associate. He or I don't. I don't want to assume your thoughts. Most people I think, would not associate St. Louis Supercross or any race inside the dome and it being really hot. It's just not what we've ever seen because we're always racing there in the springtime March April, it's just a normal dynamic since we've been going there. 1996 was the first year that the series went to St. Louis and I've been to most of those in that time frame and it's always cold. I walked like just brutal cold at this race before, like to the point of where I didn't. I remember one time very vividly, I wasn't sure I was going to make it to the damn stadium. It was so cold. I was walking from park like a parking lot half a mile away and I started like, you ever. And I'm asking a philosophical or theoretical question to no one. I understand. Have you ever been walking in brutal cold and you're like, you start to like get a little panicky because you don't know if you're gonna make it. And truth be told, I was probably underdressed. You know, this is when I lived of course in Florida. And you know, I've lived in Boise now for going on it would be 13 years next month, which is incredible to say. So I'm much more prepared and up to speed on how to dress for cold. I was not at the time, so I had probably had like a white jacket on. And I just remember being like, I'm going to have to start running here because like I'm. I feel like something bad is going to happen to me because I am, my body temperature is going down too much and it was probably, you know, I don't know, 10 degrees or something, not the minus 30 that you'd find in Minneapolis or something. But it was still so far of a contrast this weekend to what most people expect for this race. You know, it was 96 or so and humidity was pretty high and you where you were standing in the tunnels to like, you know, like part of my job is to, is to get rider interviews, especially when we're doing these pre race shows. And a lot of that means me chasing riders around, like trying to find them, trying to get them in the right place so I can do an interview, following them around until they're ready. Like it's just what it is, it's what the job entails. Well, for that job I was in the tunnel which was, had a straight, you know, shot to the outside air. The way this, the stadium was set up this weekend and the way everything was funneled because we remember for this weekend we had that inside section, like there's the tunnel area of the racetrack. Well, that precluded using the normal pit, pit access. So normally if you have a credential or anything. You would use this walkway that goes through like a privateer pit setup and then into the factory setup. Well, that's where the, that's where the tunnel section of the racetrack was, that little straightaway and back. So that was off limits. So we had basically riders and people had to go outside the dome, walk down a little ways and then come back in one of the tunnels and to access the. Basically, if you like had a hard card and you were working or anything, a mechanic, a rider. It was just a very different route than I've ever seen because of the addition onto the racetrack. So that opened up that tunnel all day and it was blazing hot over there. Like if you stood there for more than 10 minutes, you were sweating profusely. And I just, I kept telling myself like, I've just never, I never had been here. It's so weird. If you go somewhere very often in your life and you're very used to a very specific feeling and think about areas you've been to a million times and it's like the same temperature, it's the same like time of year, you can almost place yourself there without even being there because it's imprinted in you whatever that expectation is over time. Well, that's what St. Louis has done for me. And it's always kind of cold, it's always a little windy, maybe some rain. It was so far from that. And everybody was talking about it, about how hot it was. Like every time you had to go out there, like, holy hell, it is on fire outside. But you know, inside it was beautiful. It was so nice in there. You know, I think the, the track was so, so, you know, like I'll give it a, a B, like a B grade for the track. I didn't love it. I, I didn't hate it, but I knew going in what it was going to be. I knew it was going to be kind of easy. I had theorized and I said this multiple places. So I was happy to be right. If you put yourself out there multiple times, different avenues, podcasts, writing, television, and you talk about a track being a certain way, going in without seeing it and you hope you're right. So I did, did turn out to be right, that I thought it was going to be much more slippery and hard packed than what we remember from St. Louis because of the change in weather, because of the change in season. And so I just, I really felt strongly that we were going to see that change and whenever, you know, and this is a very, not selfish, I don't want to say selfish, but it's something like you kind of smile back. Alright, I'm doing something right here. Because when you talk to people who are good at this type of stuff and they're like, oh, that's actually, that's actually a good point. I didn't really think of that. That for me, that type of thing feels good. And this different type of dirt for this weekend, a different condition of the dirt was that for me talking to like Justin Brayton, talking to Mathis, talking to people on the television crew. I heard it several times and I felt good about that because I am trying to think these things through and not try to immediately point to the obvious. Nobody cares about the obvious. Right? The obvious is what everybody has. It's the take that everybody immediately goes to and it's probably out all over the world. You can go on YouTube or online or social media and get the same take 3,000 times in five minutes. You know, like, I don't want to do that. Sometimes you're going to have to because that's what people want to hear about. But other times, if you can find a unique angle on something, which I feel like is my job, I feel like I did something right. And that was this weekend for me with that. So I'm patting myself on the back here, which I'm incredibly hard on myself. So, you know, I was told this by one of my bosses and I have many of them, but I very much respect this person and he once told me that, like, there are going to be plenty of times in your life when you're frustrated with yourself and you're going to, you're going to be kicking yourself and it's probably for a good reason. You need to be better, you need to work on improving that and that's why you're frustrated with yourself. But when you do something that you're proud of, when you get a win, when people are telling you that you did a good job, smile and allow yourself to enjoy it for a minute. And whether it's an hour later or a day later, you can go back to being hard on yourself and wanting to be better, but at least allow yourself to smile and revel in that for a minute. Because otherwise what's the point? If you do the thing that you're trying to do and you can't even enjoy it for a minute, like, why are you even doing this? You know? And I, I, there's a lot of wisdom in that. And you're never going to find the perfect balance of you Know, like kind of feeling yourself too much, being too, too excited about your effort or just gloating in it too much versus, you know, not allowing yourself to enjoy it. But I, I really have tried to take that to heart and I think there is a bigger life lesson there. It doesn't have to be about this. You know, it can be what, whatever your personal application is in your life, you know, whatever your job is. If you really handled something well with your children or they were struggling with something and you made them feel better, or you found a solution for them that they wouldn't have found otherwise, or you really improved your business, you found an efficiency in the business that really changed things. I have found that if I just take a minute or the, the evening to lean into that you just find so much enjoyment in life and it makes you want to accomplish something else. Because I think that I have been a victim of like I'll, I'll accomplish something. I don't take any enjoyment in it and it's on to the next without even realizing that I had done something good. And you just, I don't think you're going to appreciate the efforts you put in or are you really going to find motivation to get there the next time? Because what's the point other than like a sense of relief in the moment? And I think that's what it was for me. And I'm sorry for going off on this tangent. I'm way off script here, but I think it's important is you're. Other than just a momentary sense of relief and then on to the next challenge or thing you're, you're unhappy about. I don't think you're, you're really going to put in your best effort. So anyway, let's get back on the topic. But I, I felt that this weekend and I wanted to share it. I don't get that feeling super often, but the track was totally different than any St. Louis we've ever seen. Hard pack, slippery, breaking down the last moto. You saw guys like tiptoeing around the insides. Especially that inside after trying to think what it would have been at like after the mulch they came around. It was the split lane and you probably know what I'm talking about. You're nodding your head and I'm still trying to explain it, but it was the split lane section where Jet was going outside most of the time and then he went to the very inside the last lap trying to protect. But the inside had gone to crap. Like you could just see them Barely able to get on the gas on the inside. That is not a St. Louis thing. Like that's never a St. Louis thing. So it just kind of showed how different this track was than most. And yeah, I just think that, you know, they're trying to invent this new thing with adding a motocross aspect of a racetrack into a stadium and still making it feel super crossy, have some motocross to it. But there's no blueprint for how to build a hybrid track anyway. So there's no right or wrong. It's just did they get it exactly right or not? And again, I'll give it a B. I thought, you know, everything was fine other than passing was really difficult. That was the one thing that I felt going in was going to be the case and I really thought it could preclude great racing and it probably did. It probably held back some racing that could have been better. But I man, just from looking at the track map, I thought it was going to be really tough to pass. And I talked about it a million times that you, if you didn't get a good start, you were in deep trouble. And yes. Were there outliers to that? Of course, like Jet was incredible. But like for the most part you tell me and I guess you can't tell me, but you think about it to yourself, did you see a lot of passing? I didn't see a lot of passing. Wasn't much passing at all, to be honest. Like it was kind of, you got in position and if you were anywhere close to the same pace, that's pretty much where you stayed. Like think about both of those second motos and think about who really made any passing. Wasn't much happening. So yeah, it's, it's, it's never going to be perfect. There are a lot of people that are kind of like ho hum about these hybrid type tracks and I get it, I do. But overall, like big picture, I think they're a gigantic net positive for the sport. So I'm giving them a really wide berth here on these topics because I think all things considered, the good so far outweighs the bad. That I'm willing to give some on things that I don't really like. And you can say I'm biased. You can say I work for the listen, I hear all that. That's fine. I hear from my best friends, I hear from Mathis every day. That's fine. I'm not arguing that because I obviously work for them and I want it to be successful and I have a vested interest in it being successful. But I'm trying to be objective at the same time. And just because I think it's a huge net positive doesn't mean I think it's perfect. It doesn't mean I don't think it can be better. And I don't think there are specific areas that could be improved. All of those things can at the same time be true without being a super cynic and tearing it down at the same time like that. That's just kind of where I come in on all that talk. So before we talk about the power rankings and the 250 class, which is the meat of this podcast, I want to thank the sponsors of it. Guts Racing. You can go to gutsracing.com and utsracing on Instagram. I got to see Andy Greg, which is the G in Guts Racing and they were at the race watching everything, kind of taking in the scene. SMX next all the, all the aspects of racing. Is always good to see Andy at the races. He is so involved. From every level works connection, Eric Phipps is yeah, man, you talk about guys that are kind of behind the scenes but have been icons in this sport. As far as like an aftermarket level works connection is that to have items that factory teams choose to run and have for 35 years, like factory Honda has been running this stuff since the early 90s. That says all you need to know. So whether it's, you know, triangle improvement, like foot peg changes to the Yamaha's, whether it's the Pro Launch Start device, which is I think is kind of their signature item, you know, they really made their name for frame guards, which is kind of not a thing as much as it used to be. Like in the 90s and 2000s, frame guards were such a thing because you wanted to protect the paint on your frame and everybody ran them. Their work Connection was the name in frame guards, whether it was like. What is the hell's it called? Engine. Like the plate. Engine plate. Why the hell can I think of these names right now? I'm spacing everything. But they had so many items that made them what they are today and things evolve, right? So like the same items that made them who they are maybe aren't what is now like the Pro Launch Start device. And these small ergonomic change pieces really define them more than what used to be. So anyway, I just think it's interesting to watch these companies evolve and time hasn't made them irrelevant. They have evolved with time to keep themselves at the very forefront of aftermarket and accessory stuff. So cool stuff. From works connection, you can go to worksconnection or worksconnection.com promo code is JT23 over there. That chain gauge tool is really cool because everybody that's ever stuck their fingers into a really greasy chain to adjust your chain and then you have to scrub your fingers for hours to get the black grease off you. You will appreciate that chain gauge tool. TL Speed Shop and race-rentals.com they're getting geared up for Baja 500, Baja 1000 stuff. And that's a just such a cool program. They have a big ride going on here in November and I just, I like being a part of these really cool projects. And Jason Cobb, they're going to come to Vegas this weekend. You know, whether it's a corporate event, whether it's a, you know, buddies getaway, like guys trip, anything like that, like, where can you go and rent trophy trucks? Where can you go and just rent side by sides in the coolest riding areas in America or Mexico? And it's plug and play. It's just not very common. And you're talking about that opportunity coupled with moto people. I just really like what that presents. Like it's a power sports theme. It's moto people helping moto people. And you get to do something that I think the average person is never going to get to do other than this opportunity. Unmatched Supplements is owned by my buddy Chris Gethin, who is world famous in the fitness and body transformation world. And when you say body transformation, that means in the end, what does it simply mean? It means people that really want to lose weight and completely change their life. That's what it is. And it doesn't have to be like all weight. It can be, it can be health in general. It can be discipline and breaking bad habits. But most people, it's like, hey, I'm overweight and I don't have the self discipline by myself to go out and do it. I need guidance. I need the plan. I need to just, you tell me what to do and I'm going to do it. They don't have the wherewithal or the knowledge base or anything. That's what this guy does. He's been doing it for 30 years. He is the expert in this field. He trains celebrities. It's, you know, if you've seen me really change my fitness look over the last four years, that's the guy. Like, I, you know, like I've come into a place where I kind of know what to do now, but I mean, he knows infinitely more than I ever will and I'll bounce ideas off of him, off of him, but I have been under his tutelage for a very long time and the using his supplements have been a part of that. And Unmatched has only been around for, I think around a little less than a year now. He founded another supplement company. They decided to go a separate way. So he launched Unmatched with some other industry titans. And what they have now, I truly think it's the number one name in supplements. And their quality of product is really what sets them apart. They don't cut corners. That's where he really had a disagreement with the former company about how they go about building and quality and, you know, like margins and do we want to really lose money to make this the best product versus like, hey, this will be just a little bit less effective, but we could make a ton more money. And he's just not about that. Like, he is. That is not him. If you knew him, you'd be nodding your head because he is the most, no nonsense, no shortcuts, all discipline, all the time guy that I know. Like, if you know who David Goggins is or any like, he is very similar to that in his approach to things. Like, there's only one way to do it and it's all in. And he knows it's not for everybody. But the biggest thing for him is if people want to improve their life, he wants to be able to show them how to do it. He doesn't want them to shrug their shoulders and say, well, I give up because I don't know what to do. Like, he can give you the roadmap. I've seen him take £100 off my friends before. Literally £100 off of very close friends of mine. I've watched it happen right in front of me. You've seen, if you saw me at any point in my life before, you saw what I was. Not like wildly out of shape or anything, but I feel like I'm in pretty good shape for my age now. Like, that's this, that is his tutelage and using his products to get there. So check out Unmatched Supps. It's obviously shortened S-P P S dot com. The product I wanted to mention today was Longevity Multivitamin. It's the newest product they have. It's an all in one multivitamin. Go on the website, check it out. There's so much damn information about this multivitamin, but it has Everything you could ever need in a vitamin. And it's their newest product, so check that out. Grant Stone boots, of course. Fantastic footwear. Keep me looking sharp. And fly racing. So trying to make these sponsor reads not so long. But they all deserve so much love and I don't want to cut them short. So let's get into this damn thing. And what did we see this weekend? Man, it was chaos in the 250s and you already know why. That 252nd Moto with Deegan and Kitchen is going to be the storyline all week. It is going to steal all of the headlines all week and for good reason. Like why wouldn't it? With the first time we have seen somebody go in and knock Deegan down the first time, this is it. I do not think we have seen it until now. And if I'm wrong, that's fine. You don't have to at me. But I can't think of another time somebody went in and just cleaned out Deegan. And I'm not saying he had it coming, but I'm also going to say that I'm shocked it didn't happen sooner. I'm shocked it didn't happen sooner. Listen, when you are the antagonist, when you are not scared to verbally go after people and take shots at people and he's really antagonistic. Like, he likes to stir people up. He likes to, you know, kind of get underneath people's skin. That is what he does. There's no arguing about that. That's what he likes to do. When you do that for long enough to everyone, eventually, eventually someone's going to get sick of it. That's all I'm saying. And I don't think that Hayden is like wanting to run from that. Like, if anything, I think he's leaning into that. So it's not like I'm saying like, oh, man, he had it coming. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying I'm very surprised that someone didn't snap or get really frustrated sooner and do this because I do think had this been the 450 class, you would have seen this a long time ago. And if he goes down this same path, the same approach in the 450 class, you will see it happen again and you will see it happen often. I very much believe that. I'm actually surprised. Again, I'm going to say it again. I'm surprised it's taken this long for someone to do it and you've probably heard me say it. I'm like, I Can't believe someone hasn't just said, you know what? Screw it. I'm taking this dude out. I can't take it anymore. I'm just taking him out because I've done it. I have done it in my own life. Not to Hayden Deegan, of course. Hayden Deegan's half my age, but other writers, Matt, Bonnie, other guys. I have just gotten to the point where I said, you know what? I can't do this anymore. Vince, freeze. I'm taking him out. I don't care. Whatever money it costs, whatever points it cost, I don't. I just. I don't care anymore. I can only take so much, and I cannot look myself in the mirror and take it from this guy anymore. And I just thought it would happen sooner. And we got there. We got there this weekend. You know, like Kitchen said, like, he kind of saw something. A press release or something. Like, he got the block pass wrong and whatever. Like, fine, whatever. However you need to paint the picture, it's fine. But this has been building for a very long time, and I don't like Deegan. Of course he's gonna be pissed. He lost a lot of points, and he's. And he's in a very precarious spot for the title now, which is 500k, you know? But I don't think, really, if you want to be realistic, I don't think you can be, like, super mad and say, like, where did that come from? Like, why would somebody do that to me? I don't think he can say that. I do not think that is a fair reaction to that. And you may, like. I don't think they were real happy, like, kind of watching. I don't think Brian was real happy. And, of course, why would he be? His kid just got taken out. Like, I don't expect him to be happy about it, but I truly don't believe that if they look at it objectively, which they won't, because there's emotion involved. That's a key part. They will not look at this objectively, but I think if they could, they would just shrug their shoulders and say, yep, this probably comes with the territory. Like, if you want to be that guy that's in people's faces and chirping. And believe me, there's a lot of chirping that goes on. A lot of it doesn't get captured by audio or video, but there's a lot of chirping that goes on before the race, after the race, social media, Instagram, DMs, like, there's a lot of chirping from Hayden to other riders. And just trust me on that. I can't prove it, nor would I want to. I'm just telling you what happens. I don't think they could say, like, it. Some sort of negative response feels inevitable in that scenario. So now where do we go from here? That's how I feel about it. Where do we go from here? I think for Hayden, you. You forget about Kitchen for the weekend. Like, you don't want. The kitchen is not. Is not the goal for Vegas. And as much as you want to be, the only thing we buy Kitchen can do for you in Vegas is worse than your weekend. So you want to save that for later. You'll get your chance. You'll get your moment. It may not even be at a race. It may. Who knows where to be, where it could be. Save that for later. Right now, you need to focus on winning. And Joshimoto, how do you. How do you formulate a plan to win this championship back from Joe Shimoto? Because he's going to need help. He's going to need help now, and I don't know what that's going to look like, but I think that is. That is the goal now. Only figure out how to win the championship. Piss on everything else. Don't worry about how mad you are. Regroup. Focus your energy, get with the team. Think about how we can go about this. Do we put, you know, our best starters next to Joe and they try to squeeze them like one on each side? Like, that's a. That's. I'm not saying any of this is, like, super sportsmanlike, but this is the stuff that happens, right? Get next to him. You try to squeeze him, force Joe into bad starts, all those types of things. Try to, like, get aggressive with him in practice, try to get him off his game. Like, all those things should be the goal of formulating a plan for Vegas instead of retribution, instead of against Levi Kitchen. Save that for another time. Far down the road, That's. That's first and foremost. And for Joe, you've just got to be locked in on your game. You got to nail the starts, you got to get the jumps. You got to stay away from anything as far as a blue bike. And you've got to execute. First of all, you need to get back to healthy. You need to be getting IVs every day. You need to do everything humanly possible. You need to be, like, radioactive. You have so many vitamins in your body. Trying to be 100% because you. You need to go win the race in Vegas and don't subject yourself to any of the nonsense. Don't put yourself in a spot where you can be taken advantage of and put the championship in jeopardy. The best way to do that is just pure execution. That's it. You execute, nobody can do anything to you. And I'm not saying he can or will, but that should be the goal. Seth Hammaker. I thought it was a good weekend, right? He rode well. He kind of stayed out of trouble. Solid weekend. He's still in the fight for points. Like, he's. He's in a place to make a ton of money. Is he going to be champion? I don't know. Probably not. But he is in a place to make a lot of money here. And the five points, five point penalty from Charlotte looms large. Don't forget about that. But I think for Seth, you just go there and you're not. You're not the storyline nobody's going to be talking about. You use that to your advantage and go try to win a Moto and try to vault yourself up the point standings with triple points. And if you could walk out of there with second, third, fourth and points, that's a ton of money. A ton of money. For a guy like Seth who hasn't won championships, he hasn't won a lot of races like that could be a big, big, big moment financially in his still young career. Vow, great job. I don't know what the hell's going on with first Moto. Apparently they're still battling some sort of bike inconsistency. I don't know, man. Like, it is so weird over there with KTM and the bike stuff. I don't know what's happening. We'll probably never know what's happening. But the second Moto was fantastic. Great job to Tom Vial in Moto 2. And I don't, I mean, don't really have anything else to kind of add to it. I don't know what's going on. So I don't have any insight as to what was happening in the first Moto. All I know is the second Moto, he did what he's supposed to do. Unchallenged, kind of rode away. Like, you could say Joe was struggling because the fitness and the sickness, fine. But Tom, Tom can't control any of that. Like, Tom just supposed to go do what he does, and he did it. And the last note I had was kitchen. I kind of already covered this, but I don't know a part of me, it's kind of, like, finally, finally, kitchen. You showed, like, some. Some backbone here. And I'm not condoning the move. That's not what this is. I'm not condoning it at all. But I can tell you firsthand that I've watched Deegan take shots at Levi verbally many times. Many, many times. And I was just kind of waiting, like, just. I was waiting for any sort of response from Levi. Any. Anything, like any sort of pushback, any sort of aggression, any sort of, like, you don't have to knock him down like you did this weekend, but, like, get aggressive with him, bump him around, play games with him, chirp back at him. I was waiting for something, something, and we really never gotten it until now. And was it too much? I don't know. That's. That's not for me to decide. I don't have a strong opinion about whether it was too much. That's up for Levi to deal with the consequences of that. But I really felt like some sort of response was due. And again, I don't want. If you're a Deegan fan and you think that I'm, like, condoning this or saying this was the right move, I'm not. I'm not doing that at all. I'm just saying for Levi, you've got to stick up for yourself sometimes. You have to stick up. You will get pushed around by the. By a guy like Hayden, if he feels that he can push you around, he's going to push you around. And I just felt like, even though it was probably over the line, you can't go knocking people down. Some part of me was kind of like, all right, all right, Levi, I see you. I see you, Levi, standing up for yourself a little bit. So anyway, that's. I don't know, like, Brian may hate me or, like, say something, whatever. Like, that's how I feel. I feel like Hayden is the. He's the guy. Like, he is the alpha in the class. He pushes people around, he does what he wants. And the only way to do anything about that is to stand up for yourself and have some backbone. And not that this move was perfect or ideal or acceptable. None of those things. I'm saying. I'm just saying that I appreciated Levi sticking up for himself a little bit. That's it. That's it. All right, let's go to four fifties. Do the power rankings. And I'll be honest, I struggled with these this weekend. I struggled with these because I moved some people around and I had to rethink my approach. Big picture, this Weekend where these guys are in their. Where their momentum switching teams and there's a lot happening. So bear with me. If you don't agree, I'm going to try to explain why they are there. Number 10 is Justin Barcia. And it wasn't a banner weekend for Barcia. 11th overall was okay, but he's been consistent around this 8 to 10, 11, 12 spot. So I felt like, all things considered, he should be 10. And the honorable mentions, just so you know, are Ferrandis and Savage. I don't have. No, I do have. I do have Malcolm in here because he tried to race. So that's what I was going to say. But Ferrandis, you could argue, has been a little better than Barcia lately. But I think Barcia, big picture, when you think about supercross and all that, all the big picture stuff, Barcia has been better with that. So I left Barcia in front of him and then Savage had a good race this weekend, so I wanted to kind of throw him in there, but he hasn't done a whole lot outside of that lately. He wasn't racing pro motocross, so I didn't have them in, but they did deserve a nod. Number nine is Malcolm Stewart. And he tried to ra. He tried, man. And then he had a big crash, which just made things so much worse. So, yeah, it's like when it rains, it pours for Malcolm and you think about how much money he's going to lose with. Really, it all stemmed from the Charlotte crash. And I don't know if he crashed. Just know he hurt his back, so it's not great. But yeah, I'm going to leave Malcolm at 9 because he did try to ride and we'll see if he tries to ride Vegas. But I'm just thinking about the dollars that he's losing here and that that's a huge bummer for. For Malcolm Stewart, number eight. I have RJ here and it feels like RJ should be higher. But I'm in this spot where, like, when you think about body of work and supercross, like, how. How do I do that? Like, how can I move him ahead of these other guys when they were getting podiums in 450 Supercross, most of them. So in the end I can't. And it will be, you know, I'll just have to keep an eye on it from here because maybe I will be able to. I just can't yet. But we'll see. We'll see. Kind of where that trends to. Number seven is Justin Cooper, and it hasn't been great for Coop. It hasn't. And J. Coop, I mean, with that, you know, 11th at the first one, eighth overall at the second one. You know, I like people like Mathis. Like, at our live show, we're talking about, hey, I think this, this track sets up perfectly for Justin Cooper. This is going to be a good one for him. I was kind of like, yeah, it's fine. You know, like, I understand. I understand the rationale. Like, no, whoops. Start dependent. That makes a lot of sense. Like, I'm on board with that. Like, but I don't know. It wasn't there. He wasn't. He really wasn't in the fight at any point. Like, was there any time during the evening's racing where Justin Cooper had your full attention? Probably not. And that's. That in and of itself is enough. Is enough to have him 7. Ken Rockson is 6. And Kenny was really good in that first one. Like, good effort holding off Tomac. He was stoked with his first moto ride. I didn't really see him a whole lot in the second one. So I'm guessing the start was probably the. The biggest factor there. But I can also tell you that for some of these guys that are coming off an injury, that second moto was tough. You know, because they're doing 20s, it's 20 minutes, it's a full main event, and they're flat out for that main event. So to come back an hour later and have to do it again is tough. Like, if you're not all the way back to full fitness, it's a lot to ask. And it's not that they can't do it. It's the effectiveness while doing it. It's how close to your absolute max are you when you do it? And that's where I think a guy like Roczen, a guy like Cooper Webb, some of these guys may be feeling the effects of it in moto, too. I heard some of the guys talking about they were smoked after the first. I'm trying to think who it was. Oh, man. It was somebody in the 250s was talking about they were smoked after the first moto. But anyway, you could see it, guys struggling to get their energy back for that second one in a really, really kind of like, intense type of racetrack. Like, you had to have the intensity up because it was easy, if that makes sense. You had to push really hard because the track was easy. Number five is Cooper Webb, fifth overall, so definitely improvement. He's gone seven. Five. Getting a little better. Having said, That I think Vegas will be tougher for him. I think he will maybe take a step back from St. Louis to Vegas because of the way the track is not great traction, a little bit more outdoor. I don't think it's going to be as good of a setup for Cooper Webb, but that's fine. He's got good points, he came in to the series, you know, like reasonable spot he's going to go into, you know, and he's only improved on that. So you know, I think if you told coup like hey man, put in a good, good effort and you could get like fifth or sixth in points overall, I think he would take it like is he going to be over the moon? No. But if you don't know anything about Cooper Webb, he is all about the money, right? Like he has three Supercross championships. He makes a lot of money in salary, but he is a guy. I'm the same ey Tomax the same. They are driven by financial rewards. Chase Sexton's not like of course he wants to make money but the end all be all motivation for a gu Webb and Tomac. Money is a bit a very big part of that equation where for Chase it's much more about the accolades, the sense of accomplishment. I think making his dad happy is a big part of that. Which sounds crazy because he's a 26 year old person, but I do think it's a big thing. So it's just, it's different kind of I'm trying what are the right word like the endorphin release, like the sense of satisfaction, the how do you feel when you lay your head on your pillow? All those things are driven by different things. I think the money and the legacy is a big thing for Web and Tomac, but I think for Chase it is the competitive aspect of it. And he wants to win like he wants to win period. So it's just interesting. Different strokes for different folks. But you know, Webb weaving here with a few hundred grand for his trouble. I don't think, I think he would be just fine with that. I'm actually very, very sure of that fact because I've talking to him first person number four, Chase X and I was just talking about him. But first Moto was okay. It's actually a little bummed he didn't have more speed. I those guys rode away from him like plain and simple. He did not have the pace to go with them. And the second Moto was even worse. Like Hunter passed him and pulled away. And then something happened to Chase. Or the bike on the last lap. I don't know what. I saw it on video. He rolls a jump, puts his hand up, rolls around the track. So something was going on on the last lap for Chase Sexton. That's why he got 10th. He did not crash, but I have no idea what that was. I'm sure we'll get more info at some point, but as of now, I have no idea. And again, not a great race for Chase. Like, this was not a banner Chase Sexton weekend. I can't imagine he left there happy with anything. There wasn't a lot to really latch onto as far as excitement. I just would say kind of a downer. It was a downer weekend for Chase Sexton. Number three, Eli Tomac. I think this was good for Eli, like the opposite of Chase. I think he was happy with how he rode. He was in the fight. He went three, three, two, strong race. Like, okay, did. Is he bummed he got third overall? Probably. But like, I don't know if you're, if you're an Eli Tomac fan and you were weaving Buds Creek going, I don't know, man, like that second moto was terrible. I don't know what he's going to do here. I think you should be happy with what you're seeing. Charlotte was good. He tipped over, but he still got third. And then this weekend he gets third again. But he was in the fight. He was in the fight all night. Like, he could have a couple things go differently. He could have very easily won St. Louis and I don't know how much more you need than that. Really. Like how much more. If you're asking from a 32 year old Eli Tomac, then do you need than that? So I like Eli, I like him going to Vegas. I like that type of track. I like the, the climate for him. It's similar to what he practices on every single day. I've been to his dad's track. I know what he rides on. It's very similar to this. So I, yeah, he should be on the podium again. I have no reason to think he won't be in the fight and be on the podium again in six days in Las Vegas. Number two is Hunter Lawrence. And this is where I was. Like some of these I was struggling with, but like I moved Hunter up a lot, but he deserved it. This was incredible. And when you think about his pro motocross series, how good he was there. He wins the final motocross race of the season. He sets the fastest lap time in Charlotte Even with a fourth. And he wins this weekend. Wins the first moto going away, putting pressure on Tomac at the end of second moto. Like, he deserves this. He was really good and has been really good as of late. And if there's any rider where I have been underestimating him every step of the way, it is Hunter Lawrence. And I'm really trying to. Not anymore. He deserves better than what I've given him. Like the respect and the expectation that I have given Hunter has simply not been good enough. And I very. I fully recognize that and I want to acknowledge that. So great job, Hunter. You're absolutely crushing it. And you know, yeah, I think he's one of the biggest success stories we've had in the sport in the last decade. You look at where he's come from, this is a guy that, when he came from Europe, he had gone like 7 and 9 in the MX2 World Championships. This wasn't a guy that was winning in Europe and came over and joined Geico Honda and took the world by storm. Seven, nine, something like that. If it's seven, eight, don't kill me. Comes over, really has a pretty brutal 2020 season with Geico Honda. Nothing to report. And then in 2021, he really turns a corner, wins his first race in Arlington. And ever since then it has been an upward trajectory. If you were looking at any sort of chart, it would be up and to the right. Just absolute astronomic improvement. Congratulations, Hunter Lawrence. You have my full attention. Number one, I don't know why I would be anything different than Jet Lawrence. He didn't win the race. But if you're going to tell me he's not the best rider in the world, I'll just stare at you like you're a moron until you change your mind. He's the best rider in the world. I'll just tell you right now. Motocross, supercross, smx, hybrid tracks, don't care. He's best rider in the world. Doesn't have to be more complicated than that. He may not win the championship. Hunter may beat him. He. He might beat him in Vegas. He might. Am I going to say that Jet's not the best ride in the world? Of course I'm not. One race or one small sample size does not change big picture trends for me. And I have so much respect for what Jet is as a rider. That first moto, holy hell, was he going fast. I mean, you guys all saw it, you're watching it. I don't know how much they were Showing him like I'm watching it too, but just my memory escapes me on what they were showing on the television. That guy, he does things that other people don't do. Like that double out of, like the off camera rut. Nobody else does that like that. Those are the things where I say he's the best rider in the world. It's because of stuff like that. It's not just the winning, it's not just the, you know, setting the fastest laps. And it's not just those things. It is he can innovate and put the track together in ways that other people either don't think about or can't. Take your choice. So I think it's probably both at different times. And I, I, I take a lot of heat. Social media people, you know, like, whatever, you know, like, I don't really listen to it because I don't care. But a lot of people are like, give me a hard time for talking. So, you know, like, pleasantly about Jet. He deserves it. Like, what do you want me to do? If somebody's the best at something, it's my job to call that out and to talk about why it is and to say exactly what it is. And that's this. He is the best writer in the world. And I try to show the hidden nuances of why he is doing it. How is he doing it? Where is he making up time on people? I'm trying to find that and if I'm not doing a good enough job, I apologize, but. But it's not always obvious. Most of the time it's really subtle. But that's what separates the very best riders in the world. Like, they're already so damn good. Like Chase Sexton and Eli Tomac and Hunter Lawrence and Ken Rockstone. These guys are amazing. Like, they are incredibly good at what they do. So to be better than them, consistently better than them, there are reasons for it and my job is to find them and I try to share those with all of you. So. So thank you to everybody for listening. Thank you to all the sponsors of this podcast. I hope you enjoyed it. I'll get out another one right after Vegas. See ya.