Podcast Summary: "Inside the Race for Net Facility Gain with Pacific Fusion"
Podcast: Inevitable (an MCJ podcast)
Host: Cody Simms
Guest: Kerry Von Munch, COO & Co-founder of Pacific Fusion
Date: December 9, 2025
Episode Overview
This episode dives deep into the advances and ambitions in fusion energy, spotlighting Pacific Fusion and its quest to achieve net facility gain—a landmark in making fusion a practical, clean, and scalable energy solution. Host Cody Simms sits down with COO/co-founder Kerry Von Munch to unpack breakthroughs in fusion technology, business strategy, the company’s modular approach, and why the time for fusion is now. They explore Pacific Fusion’s massive Series A raise, the public-private partnerships underpinning their ambitions, and the geopolitical race to commercialize fusion.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. Why Fusion, Why Now?
- For decades, fusion was the “energy of the future and always will be” ([07:37]). The dream: clean, safe, abundant power.
- Kerry notes the challenge was never in imagination, but in the underlying physics and engineering not matching the need ([02:52]).
- "Three things happened in 2022 that meant, for the first time, the answer to both ‘can it work?’ and ‘can it be economic?’ was yes." ([08:13])
- Breakthroughs:
- Ignition milestone at NIF (producing more energy from fusion than was put in) ([09:44])
- Sandia’s Z facility: efficient, affordable performance ([10:12])
- Pacific Fusion’s CTO Keith’s innovation: High-efficiency pulsed power technology ([10:12])
- Breakthroughs:
"If you drive fusion fuel to a certain pressure, you get more energy out than you put in."
— Kerry ([09:46])
2. Understanding Fusion’s Milestones—from Science to Practical Power
- Three Steps on the Path:
- Scientific Net Gain: Get more energy out of the fuel than in (done at NIF) ([11:50])
- Net Facility Gain: Get more energy out of the total machine than put in—what Pacific Fusion aims for by 2030 ([12:43], [30:30])
- Commercial Viability: Achieve energy at economic scale.
- Pacific Fusion’s innovations focus on step 2 and a pathway for step 3.
"Net facility gain... has never been done. That’s the big milestone in fusion."
— Kerry ([11:50])
3. Turning Science Into a Company
- Five co-founders with diverse backgrounds coalesced post-2022 breakthroughs, led by prominent scientists—Eric Lander (Human Genome Project), Will Regan, Keith (pulsed power pioneer), Leland Allison (simulation lead), and Kerry herself ([13:53]).
- Heavy hitters on the board: Eric Schmidt, Patrick Collison, Hamant Taneja.
- Partnership with major labs (Livermore, Sandia). Emphasis on peer-reviewed, collaborative science ([05:19], [35:30], [46:38]).
"You should hire people who have built big fusion machines before."
— Kerry ([06:41])
4. Engineering & Tech Stack: Pulsed Magnetic Inertial Fusion
-
Unlike laser-based inertial fusion (NIF), Pacific Fusion uses pulsar-driven systems—no lasers, just capacitor banks and magnetic fields ([27:15]).
- Energy stored in large capacitor banks (the “pulsar”).
- Current squishes a small fuel target, triggering fusion more efficiently and cost-effectively than previous methods ([27:57], [28:08]).
- Highly modular system: scalable, repeatable, mass-manufacturable ([29:07]).
"Each module… for those 100 nanoseconds [produces] about four times more power than the average power provided by the entire U.S. electrical grid."
— Kerry ([29:07])
5. Business Model/Financing: Breaking VC Tradition
- Traditional tech VC (stage-based) is a mismatch for fusion: too capital-intensive, unclear intermediate milestones ([18:57]).
- Pacific Fusion raised $900M in a milestone-gated structure—capital is only released as technical milestones are achieved ([24:31]).
- Early achievements: Met first-phase milestones (modular component validation) ahead of schedule ([25:47]).
"We all know net facility gain is a massively valuable milestone. So let’s collect the capital we need at the outset and call it as milestones are achieved."
— Kerry ([20:19])
6. Manufacturing & New Mexico’s Strategic Role
- Pacific Fusion is building the world’s biggest pulsed power facility and a manufacturing campus in Albuquerque, New Mexico, leveraging proximity to Sandia and Los Alamos national labs ([34:09], [35:30]).
- New Mexico’s public-private support, fast-track entitlements, and local talent (plus state backing through sovereign wealth fund) were decisive factors ([36:46]).
"We have state leadership at all levels… rowing very hard in the same direction to get a project entitled and ready to build very fast."
— Kerry ([36:46])
7. The Geopolitical Fusion Race
- The real competition is with China, which is investing $6–10B in fusion commercialization since the U.S. achieved ignition ([42:00]).
- While the U.S. pioneered fusion science, China is “moving dollars in concrete and steel,” and may outpace the U.S. in industrial leadership if action lags ([43:12]).
"China is moving dollars in concrete and steel and outpacing us in transitioning the science into serious large-scale facilities."
— Kerry ([43:12])
8. What Does the Fusion Future Look Like?
- Various scenarios:
- Baseline: Fusion powers critical infrastructure, defense ([43:45]).
- Abundant energy: “Energy is prosperity”; fusion enables global economic growth ([44:00]).
- Moonshots: Off-world chemical production, space travel ([44:15]).
- Infrastructure could be sited anywhere—mass manufacturing is feasible, and the system relies on non-scarce resources ([45:09], [46:11], [46:38]).
"Our system is basically made of oil, plastic, metal, and water, does not depend on any rare earth minerals or critical materials."
— Kerry ([46:11])
9. Culture, Team Building, & Talent Needs
- Emphasis on assembling an exceptional, mission-driven team (not only PhDs), from engineering to HR ([48:52]).
- Ongoing recruitment and call to action for those passionate about “building the holy grail of energy” ([47:34], [53:00]).
"The name of the game is hire people who are way smarter than you and give them clear guidelines for success."
— Kerry ([39:16])
Memorable Moments & Quotes (w/ Timestamps)
- On Fusion’s Stereotype:
"Fusion is the energy of the future and always will be, or at least that's what everyone had said for a very long time." — Cody ([07:37]) - On Net Facility Gain:
"That’s the big milestone infusion called net facility gain and an essential step to building fusion power systems." — Kerry ([11:50]) - On Scientific Breakthroughs:
"Three things happened in 2022...for the first time, the answer to both of those questions [‘can it work?’ and ‘can it be economic?’] was yes." — Kerry ([08:13]) - On Modular Design:
"Each of those modules sits in about the footprint of a shipping container...produces about 2 terawatts of peak power over 100 nanoseconds." — Kerry ([29:07]) - On the U.S.-China Race:
"The race for AI is, at the end of the day, a race for power...China is outpacing us in transitioning the science into serious large scale facilities." — Kerry ([43:12]) - On the Nature of Fusion:
"You can't do it on a tabletop...a lot of our focus is on de-risking the execution of the build to actually deliver the system that we know, once functional, will create the physical conditions needed for fusion." — Kerry ([30:49]) - On Talent & Opportunity:
"We need a lot of different folks and a lot of different minds and a lot of different skill sets around the table to make this happen." — Kerry ([53:00])
Timestamps for Key Segments
- [02:52] — Kerry on skepticism, fusion’s challenges, and how Pacific Fusion is different
- [07:37] — The "energy of the future" joke & how the field is shifting
- [08:13] — Why 2022 was a watershed year for fusion milestones
- [11:50] — Breakdown of scientific vs. facility net gain milestones
- [13:53] — Founding story and key team members' backgrounds
- [18:57] — Business and financing strategy: Why they bucked VC tradition
- [24:31] — Milestone-based capital release structure
- [27:15] — How pulsed magnetic inertial fusion works
- [29:07] — Modular architecture, mass manufacturable design
- [34:09], [35:30] — Moving to Albuquerque, NM; state partnership strategies
- [42:00] — The fusion race with China and the need for U.S. industrial leadership
- [43:45] — Vision for a fusion-powered future
- [46:11] — Supply chain: why their fusion tech doesn’t rely on rare or critical materials
- [47:34], [48:52] — Team-building, talent needs, and career opportunities
- [50:08] — Timeline for net facility gain & massive commercialization push
Conclusion
Kerry Von Munch and Pacific Fusion are pioneering a pivotal moment in fusion energy—transforming it from a perennial promise into an engineering challenge they believe can be solved in this decade. Their approach is grounded in hard-won scientific milestones, modular engineering, and a business/financing model built for massive, milestone-based industrial projects rather than traditional tech startup cycles. With the world’s eyes on fusion, and China acting as the main rival, Pacific Fusion’s success could mark a global turning point in clean energy.
To get involved or learn more, visit Pacific Fusion's website or MCJ's resources—and stay tuned for the next big milestone in the race to net facility gain.