Bovino’s Visit to Europe

Summary

Podcast Summary: It Could Happen Here – "Bovino’s Visit to Europe"

Date: June 8, 2026
Hosts: Robert Evans and Mia Wong (Cool Zone Media & iHeartPodcasts)

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Episode Overview

This episode delves into the recent activities and worldview of Gregory K. Bovino, a controversial former Border Patrol executive who has pivoted into the international far-right anti-migrant scene. Hosts Robert Evans and Mia Wong explore Bovino's participation in a European "re-migration" summit, analyze the ideological throughlines between American and European far-right movements, and discuss Bovino’s personal evolution as a figure emblematic of problems within law enforcement. The discussion pulls from translated interviews, Bovino’s public remarks, and the broader context of institutional violence in border policy. The tone is direct, irreverent, and at times darkly satirical, in line with the show’s tradition.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Introduction to Gregory K. Bovino’s Post-Career Activities

[02:31–03:25]

• Mia confesses a long-standing "hater" status towards Bovino, particularly familiar with his law enforcement work in Chicago and Minneapolis.
• Bovino’s recent appearance at a re-migration summit in Portugal is flagged as a pivot further into international white nationalist spaces.

2. The Portugal ‘Re-Migration’ Summit and Its Implications

[03:26–06:35]

• The event’s agenda centers on policies aimed at "preventing population replacement," revealed to be explicit advocacy for ethnic cleansing.
  • “This is an ethnic cleansing campaign.” (Mia, [04:28])
• Organized by Martin Sellner, a neo-Nazi infamous for ties to the Christchurch shooter.
• Discussion of how American and European far-right groups interconnect, referencing the "Virginia Dare" (VDA) tendency—an open white nationalist current.

3. Tracing Far-Right Ideology Across Borders

[06:56–08:31]

• The anti-immigration stance here is distinguished from debates about legality; this is about race and constructing a "white Europe."
• Hosts note the lack of a “cordon sanitaire” in the US to separate mainstream right from fascists, connecting US and European movements.
• The symbolism of "Virginia Dare" (the first white child born in the US to settlers) as foundational for white nationalist rhetoric is unpacked.

4. The Shift in Anti-Immigration Rhetoric

[08:38–09:27]

• The European discussion, and now Bovino’s, explicitly abandons pretense of law enforcement, instead advocating for removal of anybody not white, regardless of legal status.
  • “...the bigotry moved past even that. Right. Like, without the pretense of enforcing the law.” (Robert, [09:13])

5. Mainstreaming of Ethnic Cleansing Language in Politics

[09:27–10:02]

• Groups like AfD in Germany and Spain’s Vox party are called out for slogans like “remove kebab”—open calls to cleanse ethnic minorities.
• Host notes leaked documents proving explicit plans to remove non-whites and Jewish people.

6. Dissecting Bovino’s Worldview and Border Patrol Culture

[10:02–15:18]

• The hosts analyze a translated French interview with Bovino, noting the caveats of language translation, but highlighting the continuity of his beliefs from his decades-long Border Patrol tenure.
  • “[Bovino is] essentially sharing a platform and agreeing with Nazis … this is what the Border Patrol formed him into.” (Robert, [11:48])
• Discussion about the culture of Border Patrol—systemic problems not isolated to individuals, but endemic to the institution.
  • “This is not something we can train. If this country gets through this … we can’t let this keep happening.” (Robert, [12:09])
• Reference to the normalization of brutal tactics across both Republican and Democratic administrations.

7. Militarized Self-Image and Operations

[12:44–16:10]

• Bovino’s self-comparison to Nazi General Erwin Rommel, George Patton, and T.E. Lawrence reveals his military, “general” self-image.
• His pride in operations like “Don’t Let Them Ride” (Las Vegas, 2010) underscores a results-driven, dehumanizing approach.
  • “...we caught more aliens than there were minutes in the operation. It was a very successful operation.” (Bovino, [17:40])
• Robert notes the “success” metric was solely arrests of undocumented people, not rescuing trafficking victims as was publicly claimed.

8. Exporting Border Violence Internationally

[20:02–20:45]

• Bovino’s role in training foreign border forces (e.g., BORTAC deployment in Honduras) is contextualized as part of a U.S. tradition of militarizing allied regimes.
• Parallels drawn to European border militarization and “externalization” of violence.

9. Institutional Entrenchment and Reform Limits

[24:44–25:52]

• Bovino’s contempt for “bureaucrats” (Rodney Scott, Tom Homan) is typical of a far-right narrative that leadership constrained border agents.
  • “He called the withdrawal from Minneapolis a surrender. He called protesters the opposition … he calls protesters pro-fascist...” (Robert, [26:52])
• The mythos of the Border Patrol as a “Federal Law Enforcement Marine Corps” is lampooned.
  • “I’ve not heard them say that.” (Mia, [27:44])

10. Data Manipulation and Racist Demographics

[34:20–36:13]

• Bovino gives unsubstantiated numbers (claims “100 million illegal immigrants”), often using spurious logic (e.g., traffic patterns) to justify. This is debunked using Pew Research and common sense.

11. Civil Society Response and Legacy

[44:26–47:46]

• The need for active resistance and solidarity is stressed, with Minneapolis cited as an example where the community forced Border Patrol’s withdrawal.
  • “Minneapolis beat these people... They came out and stood together as a community... If they were in a battle, they did lose it.” (Robert, [47:29])
• Warnings about the ratchet of violence and institutionalization—“...we have created an entity which is exempt from the law in order to enforce it.” (Robert, [45:22])
• Host calls out both Republican and Democratic complicity and cowardice in confronting the system.

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Notable Quotes & Key Moments

• [04:28] Mia: “This is an ethnic cleansing campaign.”
• [05:14] Robert: “This is very much a conference about a white Europe.”
• [11:48] Robert: “...Greg Bovino is essentially sharing a platform and agreeing with Nazis ... this is what the Border Patrol formed him into.”
• [13:02] Robert: “He compared himself to Nazi General Erwin Rommel.”
• [17:40] Bovino voice clip: “...we caught more aliens than there were minutes in the operation. It was a very successful operation.”
• [26:52] Robert: “He called protesters pro-fascist, which, given the company he keeps, is fucking ridiculous.”
• [34:20] Robert: “This figure, you guessed it, fits perfectly with the total of 100 million ... The category of illegal children—fascinating choice of words.”
• [45:22] Robert: “We have created an entity which is exempt from the law in order to enforce it.”
• [47:29] Robert: “Minneapolis beat these people ... they came out and ... stood together as a community.”

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Important Segment Timestamps

• 02:31 – Introduction of episode topic and Bovino’s Portugal trip
• 03:45 – Overview of the ‘re-migration’ summit and its explicit goals
• 06:06–08:31 – Discussion of VDA and cross-Atlantic Nazi networks
• 12:44–13:55 – Bovino’s self-image as a military general on American soil
• 17:40 – Bovino’s “Don’t Let Them Ride” operation and attitudes towards enforcement
• 20:02 – U.S. training of foreign border forces
• 25:52–27:45 – Rhetoric comparing Border Patrol to the Marine Corps; internal culture critique
• 34:20–36:13 – Bovino’s manipulation of migration statistics
• 44:26–47:46 – Reflection on what resistance can look like, and warning about continued institutional violence

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Episode Takeaways

• Border enforcement has become a cross-Atlantic project of the far right, with American and European actors increasingly sharing platforms, rhetoric, and tactics.
• Institutional radicalization is not limited to explicit partisans; decades of policy under both major U.S. parties have built this apparatus.
• Bovino’s trajectory is presented not as an aberration, but as illustrative of institutional rot—the Border Patrol, in the hosts’ reading, is itself an engine for creating reactionaries.
• Rhetoric in these circles has moved beyond legality to openly discussing and planning ethnic cleansing, making resistance and exposure critically urgent.
• Community solidarity can drive out even militarized state violence, as seen in Minneapolis, but broader political cowardice persists.

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In the hosts’ words:

“Having a massive institutional apparatus that produces Nazis and gives them the authority to do the things that Nazis want to do is not a way that any kind of democracy can survive.”
— Mia, [45:04]

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This episode challenges listeners to recognize the dangers of unchecked, militarized law enforcement institutions, to see the global dimensions of xenophobic politics, and to hold all parties accountable for complicity in these systems.

Transcript

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[Host 1]

Cool Zone Media. Mia, are you excited today to learn about Gregory K. Bovino?

[Host 2 (Mia)]

You know, I would describe myself going into this as an amateur but enthusiastic Greg Bovino Hater. I am very familiar with his work in Chicago. I'm familiar with his work in Minneapolis. I am less familiar with his other work. I'm excited to have a higher tier of hater of one of the worst people we've ever had.

[Host 1]

Yeah. Really a gem of the American law enforcement system. We're going to talk mostly today about Greg Bevino's post career pivot, which seems mostly to be asking to have his old career back. But we can talk also a little bit about his previous career work. When he was down here, he was in IB he was in El Centro, he was in Blythe for a while, but last week, MIA, he was in Portugal.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Oh, boy.

[Host 1]

Yeah. Do you want to guess why?

[Host 2 (Mia)]

You know, okay, going through my. My history of Portugal. It's country that had a left wing military coup that didn't go far enough, by which they. They never quite got rid of all the fascists.

[Host 1]

Yeah. A country that notably has a long history of fascism.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yes.

[Host 1]

Which is why he was there, actually. He was there in a re Migration summit.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Oh, no.

[Host 1]

Yeah. Like. So I'm just going to use the conference's own website here. It is a set fiscal, cultural, economic, social, political and logistical policies whose objective is to prevent population replacement through the reversal of migratory flows. There's nothing there about undocumented people. There's nothing there about visas. Right. Because this isn't about that. This is about race and ethnicity and removing people who do not line up with what you consider to be the national race.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. This is an ethnic cleansing campaign.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

I mean, obviously there's a lot of parallels in the history of all of these countries, but I think if you look at the most immediate one, it's, oh, this is like the shit the Nazis were talking about doing while they were building the concentration camps with Jewish people. Right. Is that they were gonna deport them to Israel or whatever.

[Host 1]

Yeah. We'll keep moving them east.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

And at the very least, this is an ethnic cleansing plan.

[Host 1]

Yeah. That's the explicit goal.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Right. There is not mention in that definition of undocumented people. Even the way that Bavino prefers to refer to it as illegal aliens. A term he uses a lot and I think he sometimes uses it in quite elastic fashion. But even in this case, that is not what this conference is about.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

No. Yeah.

[Host 1]

This is very much a conference about a white Europe. Yeah. It was organized by Martin Sellner. Selner is a neo Nazi who famously exchanged emails with Brenton Tarrant, the Christchurch shooter.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Oh, great.

[Host 1]

Yeah. Pavino spoke about this at a conference. And he said that they hadn't met in person before, but after talking for a little while, they found they were on the same sheet of music.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Incredible.

[Host 1]

Yeah, you got to Google people, man, and like you Google Martin Sellner and the first thing that comes up is that he emailed Brenton Tarrant. Unless, I guess that's not an issue.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah, right.

[Host 1]

Judging by the general company he kept, I don't think that's an issue because he's joined like, like Spanish Vox party there afde, there afd, the German far right party racists from all over Europe.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

We also saw the sort of racists in America who I would describe as like fancy racists. The race science guys, right?

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Oh, the kind of like the Murray people.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Is it those guys or is it the kind of newer gen, like tech fascist people? So there's overlap between them?

[Host 1]

No, it's like the VDA kind of tendency. Oh, yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

No. Should we explain what the vda. Yeah, a little bit.

[Host 1]

Go ahead, May. Yeah, take it.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. Well, I was just gonna say at some point we're gonna have molly on. I, I am a. I am what you would call a. I, I guess technically a professional Nazi identifier or whatever. But I'm like a low level one and everyone else in this network is a very high level one. So we'll probably have molly on at some point to like actually really go into VD air and like that kind of shit.

[Host 1]

But yeah, it's broadly speaking. It's Peter Brimelo's anti immigration website. We're not talking about anti immigration in terms of discussions about what visas we should give. Right. We're talking about like white nationalism.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. These are like Nazi Nazis. These are people that, yeah. You know, like, I don't think the US has ever really had what in Europe is called like the cordon sanitaire, which is supposed to separate out like the, the mainstream right wing parties from like the Nazis. Like we've never had that. So Vidair has been kind of more in anti immigration circles. But it's also like those are people that, you know, even you're kind of like really, really far right. Like people on the radio or politicians don't associate with because they are fairly open Nazis.

[Host 1]

Yeah. There was some stuff that trace back to vider in Agenda 47. I remember thinking like, this ain't good. Yeah. VDA just for people who like have lived a blessed life and don't know, refers to Virginia Dare, who is, I believe, the first white child or the first child first girl. I don't know if maybe there was a boy before, but I think it was the first white child born in the United States of settlers. One of the ones of Roanoke people. Right.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. Which is, I don't know, like maybe you motherfuckers could have made like the Roanoke people and disappeared, but.

[Host 1]

Yeah. Yeah, but yeah, that would be nice. Unfortunately, Mia.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

No, unfortunately they didn't. And they didn't unfortunately assimilate into indigenous cultures the way that the Roanoke people almost certainly did.

[Host 1]

Yes.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

And instead decided.

[Host 1]

Yeah. In fact, quite the.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. Half a millennia long campaign of. Of terror and bloodshed.

[Host 1]

Yeah. It's interesting to see Bevino, I guess, like aligning with these European anti migration discussion is different. It's not really dealing so much in undocumented people. It's dealing with people under various legal statuses. I'm not saying there aren't undocumented people in Europe. There are, but the discussion there has moved past that in a toxic way.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

In a way that is like we need to remove these people even though they have like legal documentation that allows them to be here. If the state says you're cool or you're not cool, like, that's not my concern.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

But it's still alarming to see the, the bigotry move past even that. Right. Like without the pretense of enforcing the law.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

And just simply being about removing people who we don't think we want to live next to because they're not white.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

You know, one of the groups that you talked about there, like the AfD in Germany, like this, this has been happening for like a long time, but one of their like slogans was remove kebab. And that's just liter. Remove all Turkish people from the country.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

And the AfD wants to do this. There have documents that have leaked from them that have been planning at conferences to, okay, this is how we're going to remove the non white people. This is how we're going to remove the Jewish people. This is not even like the pretense of anything has to do with the law. This is just like we are the original Nazis if we want to do ethnic cleansing against non white people.

[Host 1]

Yeah. Most of the people at the conference are peddling great replacement shit. Right. And they. Yeah, they genuinely believe that that is something that exists and that they can reverse it. At the conference, Pavito gave an interview. I found it on a website called Brazeinfo. B R E I Z H. It's. It's a Breton and French language website. It's also published. I saw, in a couple of other substacks. So I wonder if it was a pool interview that he gave that various people translated it. I should note that I translated it from French. I don't think Bovino speaks French, so I'm imagining they translated it from English to French. And there is an editor's note that says the editor was an AI.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Oh, great.

[Host 1]

So any of the quotations here, we can't attribute them directly. Right.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Like, yeah.

[Host 1]

We can't assume that those are the words he said in English because it's been through three layers of bullshit.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

So understand that going in. Nonetheless, I think it's a very interesting insight into how Greg Bevino sees the world. And what's interesting about that is, like, Greg Pavino was very popular in Border Patrol. He was, by the standards of the Patrol, a good Border Patrol agent.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Right.

[Host 1]

He was liked. And I don't think he developed these opinions in a few months since he retired.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

No. Yeah.

[Host 1]

And, like, a lot of the way he talks is not dissimilar to the way Border Patrol agents talk among themselves. Right. I think that, like, what is interesting about this is not like Greg Bevino is essentially sharing a platform and agreeing with Nazis. It is after 25, 26 years, in more than actually 30 years in the Border Patrol, this is what the Border Patrol formed him into.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Because the point I want to make here is this shit is not something we can easily reform. This is not something we can train. If this country gets through this and in 2028. Yes. We have another election. God, we can't let this keep happening.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Right.

[Host 1]

The. The tool that Bevino.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Was deploying in Minneapolis, in Chicago, in Charlotte, and all these other cities. In Los Angeles. Right.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. Memphis, like New Orleans.

[Host 1]

Like.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. Like, all over the country.

[Host 1]

Yeah. Yeah. It is a tool that Democrats build as well as Republicans.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

And the place he's at, he got to. With eight years working under Barack Obama, with four years working under Joe Biden, like, we need to understand what we are diverting a fire hose of money towards.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

With the Border Patrol. Right. And I guess we can just start with where Greg Pavino started, which was comparing himself to Nazi General Erwin Rommel.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Great.

[Host 1]

Yeah. Right out the gate. He also compared himself to Patton and T. Lawrence. You know, like, historically, it makes you wonder.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

I think he probably has some kind of clean Vermark thing going on in his head where they're just soldiers and he can respect both of them for their tactical prowess. You know, like, he Says, quote, they grasp the overall strategy where others in government or in the political class did not see it or refused to see it. Strategic expertise combined with field command, especially in chaotic, exposed events, is very rare. I also listened to a couple of podcasts that Bevino did with a former Border Patrol agent who used to work in San Diego sector. And you hear this a lot, right? Talk about battle, talk about soldiers. But Vino sees himself as like a general on Border Patrol, as his soldiers fighting in a. In a war. Yeah, that's not what they do. Oh, clearly they see it as that. I understand why. Because, like, they've. They've gone around the country generating so much ill will that, yeah, everywhere they go, people fucking hate them.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Your actual job, and this is something we saw in Chicago, is dragging screaming babies out of their fucking homes and putting them in camps.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

I think this is. This is going back to the thing you're talking about earlier, about this not being something that's reformable, is that. Yeah, that task is what Border Patrol was built for. That's what it was doing under all of these administrations. Just fucking dragging people screaming from their homes in the dark of the night. And, like, the only way you can get people to do that is by creating a crucible that creates Nazis.

[Host 1]

You can't have compassion for the people whose families you're tearing apart.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Right.

[Host 1]

Like, yeah, people should read Jen Budd's book if they want to know what going through Border Patrol Academy is like. So this give a trigger warning that Jen was sexually assaulted and writes about that. Border Patrol has a very high rate of sexual assault.

[Mistr Advertiser]

Right.

[Host 1]

Border patrol is 95% male.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

I have seen people in Border Patrol who do have compassion, and then I have not seen them anymore. Like, it drives those people away. Yeah. They have a high dropout rate. And, like, I think there are people who genuinely believe that what they will do is keep their community safe and rescue people who get stuck crossing the border in the desert. Adjudicate them a fair process, deliver them to a fair process, and they will do the best they can. I don't see those people remain in the Patrol for very long.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Right.

[Host 1]

Like, I interact with. Obviously, like, the stance of this podcast is that you should remain silent, not talk to cops. But like I said, I interact with Border Patrol agents more often than most people do. Right. That is the nature of my job and the place I live and the places I go. And, like, I think these days, the recruiting they're doing, they're getting a lot of people who are coming in starting like this. Yeah, but I don't think that's. That's always been the case. Like, I understand that there are people also in communities along the border where there's very little economic opportunity and then this is the only chance they have. But I see those people get spat out. Like you said, Mia, if you are going to train people to tear families apart, then you have to train them to hate. And I think that is what we see in this. Right? Like, yeah, it's really interesting. Vivino tells his own story a little bit. And he tells his own story on this podcast I listen to as well. He starts with Operation Don't Let Him Ride. Are you familiar with Operation Don't Let Him Ride?

[Host 2 (Mia)]

No.

[Host 1]

Okay, so you have to go all the way back to 2010.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Oh, God.

[Host 1]

In Las Vegas, Nevada.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Little, little tiny baby Mia.

[Host 1]

Yeah, yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

13 year old Mia.

[Host 1]

Oh, God. Me, I feel old. I was in grad school. And Greg Pavino, I think he's Belized at the Blythe station at that time. And they do this operation at a bus station in Nevada. It lasts for 60 minutes. It gets called off. The Nevada senator is pissed off about it. Their goal, they said, was to apprehend traffickers and to rescue people who have been trafficked or smuggled. Right. In a community meeting which, like, was convened because the whole Latino community in Las Vegas was like, the fuck, right? This. Internal enforcement was not a common thing at the time. Paul Beeson, who was chief agent of the Yuma sector at the time, said, quote, in that short period of time, we did not apprehend anybody we felt was actively engaged in alien smuggling. We did not encounter any human trafficking victims. So to me, that doesn't sound like a win.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. So wait, so they were just rounding people up at bus stops?

[Host 1]

Correct. They went to a bus depot station.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah, yeah, like one of the big bus. Yeah. And they just rounded people up.

[Host 1]

Yeah, exactly. So his interview with this former border patrol agent, he said that they apprehended more than one alien per minute of

[Greg Bevino (voice clip)]

the operation that was called Operation Don't Let Them Ride. And that operation was set for about three days. It lasted 60 minutes. But the interesting thing is we caught more aliens than there were minutes in the operation. It was a very successful operation. Very successful. Yes, sir. Harry Reid called Hussein Obama and had that shut down immediately. But we never forgot that. We never forgot the vast amount of criminals that we apprehended in 2010 on those bus checks in Las Vegas. And the pervasive problem even then that we saw. And a lot of that problem came in under. Under Barack Hussein Obama as well as Billy Clinton.

[Host 1]

I want to note, the newspapers at the time reported a number that was more than two dozen. Technically, let's say the operation lasted 60 minutes, that is more than two dozen. It would be unusual to report a number of 60 by saying more than two dozen.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Right? Yeah.

[Host 1]

What is more interesting to me is that this operation was supposed to find people who had been trafficked and people who were trafficking and it failed. Greg Bevino seems to have seen it as a success because it just found people.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah, right.

[Host 1]

People who were undocumented, people who were otherwise in infraction of immigration laws, but who were not involved in trafficking. Because for him it seems like the goal was slightly different and therefore the criteria for success are slightly different. Right. And this kind of fits into this narrative of him. So, like, I can see why he. It is especially in the context of him talking to the Re Migration Conference. For him it's a win, but for the explicit goals of the Border Patrol at that time, it's not. So he cites this as a beginning of his journey to where he is. Right. As a guy they went to for massive surges of Border Patrol agents into cities tearing families apart. And I think if we see it the way he sees it, then we can see why he sees it as a success. But Vino, in his early career had worked a lot in the El Centro sector. Right. He eventually became Chief Patrol Agent in the El Centro sector. He was in BORTAC for a while. I've read a Defence University paper that interviewed him. He was in Honduras with bortac, training Border Patrol there.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Oh, Jesus Christ.

[Host 1]

Yeah. I mean the. Everyone should read Empire of Borders. Everyone should read Border Patrol Nation. But like the DHS has done this for years. Right. Funded, armed and equipped and trained Border Patrol units all over the Americas. Because that is how America externalizes its border.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. In a very similar way to the way Europe does it with Frontex and you know, like the deals they got with Gaddafi and then the successive governments in Libya and stuff like that.

[Host 1]

Yes.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

And the people they're training there. It's like School of the Americas shit. Are just like actual monsters.

[Host 1]

Yeah. I mean, the. Sally Hayden's book My Third Time We Drowned is one of the more heartbreaking books that's available for a human to read. But like, if you want to know about the fucked up stuff Europe's doing in Libya, it's a good book.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Yes. It moves the violence away from the Metropole Right. It moves it further. I've seen this from my own eyes. Right. I've seen what happens in Panama, not necessarily with the actions of any border patrols there, but just by forcing people to take that route. Like, I've seen how the externalization of our borders kills people. And I have seen how the Biden administration funded deportations of people who I can't find any criminal record for. And I have seen, literally, babies taken out of people's hands.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

And they're. They were deporting young men at that point. But I look at it, I've literally watched families torn apart right there just after crossing the Darien Gap. And it's heartbreaking.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Talking of heartbreaking, we haven't done an ad pivot.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Oh, boy. Hopefully these. These products and services will fix your heartbreak.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Oh, God, yeah.

[Host 1]

Here's an advert for whiskey.

[George Taveras]

This is George Taveras and Sam Taggart from Stradiolab. Okay, picture it. Your apartment after a Saturday workout. The gym bag, the couch, maybe even the car. Mi amor. It's a full novella of odors and not the glamorous kind.

[Sam Taggart]

That's where Febreze comes in. Boost, spray, spritz, plug or clip. It doesn't just mask odors, it fights them, Honey.

[George Taveras]

Want long lasting scent you can control? Try Febreze Plug scent booster today. With the adjustable intensity dial, you can control the scent to match your mood. Plus, thanks to its Fade defy technology, Your home stays first day fresh for up to 50 days.

[Sam Taggart]

Need a quick car rescue? Clip a Febreze car vent clip and map your ride to freshness. And don't forget the fabric refresher. While you can't cram that cushion in the washer, you can top off every pillow fluff with a spritz of fabric

[George Taveras]

refresher because home should smell like you. Fabulous. Fresh, Unforgettable.

[Sam Taggart]

Febreze is a proud sponsor of the Elton John Impact Awards, honoring those who have helped shape a more inclusive and compassionate world with their artistry, advocacy, and unwavering commitment to equality.

[George Taveras]

You won't want to miss the Elton John Impact awards podcast, available June 1 on the iHeartRadio app. And everywhere podcasts are heard.

[Mistr Advertiser]

Did you know you can get your prep for free? Prep is a once daily pill that's up to 99% effective at preventing the transmission of HIV. Mistr makes it easy and free to get started all online. No doctor's office and no paperwork. They also provide free doxy pep, a simple antibiotic you take after sex to help prevent certain STIs. Kind of like morning after pill for STIs. Whether you have insurance or not. Mistr's got you covered in three easy steps. One, sign [e-mail] two, consult with a licensed doctor online and three, complete your at home testing kit. Then your medication is delivered discreetly right to your door. It's safe, easy and completely judgment free. Protect yourself and protect each other. Sign [e-mail] today.

[Amy Eric]

Hello beautiful. I'm Amy Eric, founder of Madison Reed, a hair color company I named after my daughter. Forget everything you know about hair color color. The mess, the smell, the hassle, the damage. We're female founded and female led. We've transformed the hair color experience with ingredients that care for your hair and award winning color on your terms at home or at our hair color bars. The future of hair color is here at Madison Reid.

[Host 1]

Mom, can I have Lingokids? Dad, Lingokids, please. When did we become the Lingokids house? No idea.

[Amy Eric]

Last week it was dinosaurs.

[Host 1]

This week it's Lingokids. Why Lingokids? Because it's the best thing ever. We can play games with astronauts, wild animals and superheroes. With more than 4,000 interactive games, songs and shows, LingoKids is the number one entertainment platform for young kids. So no dinosaurs and dinosaurs.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Lingokids.

[Host 1]

Everything kids love, download it for free. Okay, we're back. So one of the things Vivino did a lot in this interview is he sought to kind of distinguish himself from what he calls status quo bureaucrats. He's not wrong that like one of the roles of a chief in a sector is to speak to the press. Right. He seems to be very upset that Rodney Scott and Tom Homan didn't speak to the press when they started these big operations. He says, quote, CBP commissioner Rodney Scott and border czar Tom Homan not only had no experience with full enforcement of migration laws, but refused to speak publicly during operations. Their reluctance triggered the unique situation I mentioned above. I neither sought nor asked to become the public face of the operation. But for this type of operation there can only be one. The responsibility fell to me. When you listen to those interviews he did when he was in the patrol, he wasn't as critical of his leadership as he is now. Yeah, probably very obvious reasons, but like the let down by leadership thing is a thing. We've seen this on the right so many times. Right?

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. It's the classic backstab myth employed by one Adolf Hitler.

[Host 1]

Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, and in many cases thereafter. And he kind of seeks in this to, to differentiate field agents from, from like what, I guess he, what he calls status quo bureaucrats. Right. And he is genuinely very popular among field agents. Like, and he did, like, grow through the Border Patrol. Right. Like, he's not a guy who, like, came from somewhere else. Like, he has a 30 year career. He's done like, mountain interdiction stuff down in the Hakumba wilderness. He's definitely had his boots on the ground. I think they like that. And I think for him, that gives him. He feels like he speaks for the border Patrol. And these people who are bureaucrats are what is constraining him and his guys from doing what they want to do. And it's really interesting to see the terms, how he describes what they want to do. He called the withdrawal from Minneapolis a surrender. He called protesters the opposition. In this podcast I listened to, he calls protesters pro fascist, which is very. Given the company he keeps is fucking ridiculous.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

I feel like the other people at that conference can't be happy with that. Yeah, that's the thing, right? Where are the fascists here?

[Host 1]

Yeah, they're not hiding it. It's very interesting to see him, like, not willing to kind of surrender that term. You know what I mean? To not quite say it at the same time as like, yeah, yeah, there are other people at the conference who are like, no, we're the fascists. What are you talking about? They're not pro fascists. They hate us. He's still like, one step removed from joining his buddies there. Another thing I found interesting was he says Border Patrol is often referred to as, quote, the federal law enforcement Marine Corps.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

What? Does anyone say that?

[Host 1]

I've not heard them say that.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Oh, I, I what? I've never heard that.

[Host 1]

It's a very strange. I'm guessing what he's referring to is like, the Marine Corps has these expeditionary units which can deploy very quickly to conflict zones like we saw in Iran. Right?

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Like, yeah.

[Host 1]

And I'm guessing that's what he means. Like, they're the, the hit squad.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah, they're the, they're the, like, oh, my God. We found like, four children sleeping in a bedroom. We have to go. We have to go send our, like, tactical squad after them.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

They're our first line of defense against, against tiny babies.

[Host 1]

Yep. And against, like, Americans exercising their First Amendment rights.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

When people were in the street in Portland, it was Border patrol they sent. Yep.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

It was Sportak. Yeah. Yeah.

[Host 1]

Right. They do have something of a history of being the federal government's hit squad. Yeah, when they want to stamp on Americans, they do send the Border Patrol. Interestingly, he went on to cite the Ole Miss riot. Are you familiar with the old Ms. Riot?

[Host 2 (Mia)]

It sounds vaguely familiar, but I'm not sure.

[Host 1]

Yeah, I mean you can surmise what's going to happen, right? It's a university in the South. Yeah, yeah. What happens is that James Meredith, a black man, had attempted to register at the school several times. He had been prevented by racists, including the governor. And at one point JFK sent Border patrol agents along with federal. I think they were cross sworn as marshals maybe to accompany him to register. They ended up surrounded in the Lyceum. 28 federal agents were shot.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Jesus.

[Host 1]

Yeah, no, this is like they had a fight about it. Like two of the. The people surrounding the Lyceum were killed.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

You know, I'm not sure I've ever in my entire life seen a government deployment and thought you should have sent the National Guard, but like, yeah, I guess you should have sent the National Guard. Jesus. Yeah, the one Southern racist. Really? I guess love shooting beds to oppose integration.

[Host 1]

Yeah. Like in this case they sent the regular ass army to come get him out. Yeah, I think this was the era when they felt like National Guards in the south were not entirely trustworthy.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah, well, yeah, you'd have to do a Trump style. Like we're sending the fucking like California

[Host 1]

National Guard to Mississippi or whatever. Yeah, yeah, they normally send like one of those QRFs, like 82nd Airborne or something like that. Yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

I, Wow. I can't believe I'm in a position where I support the deployment of US troops against America.

[Host 1]

I know it's wild. I know it's a wild scenario.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

I guess it's like because they're trying to do a lynching. So.

[Host 1]

Yeah, like in that case, yeah, maybe stop the lynching. But it's a really interesting choice because he's talking about how border patrols had this long history of doing this. And again, he's not wrong. And I guess maybe the Ole Miss thing plays a part in their mythos because they were fighting against the racists. I can see why they would want to hold on to that. It's interesting to see him doing that at the racist conference.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. It's like, oh, no, no, no. We are a different kind of racist. We are California racist. We are, we are. We are not like the primitive Southern racist. We have advanced our level of racism to cleansing levels.

[Parent 1]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Like, and he's very popular amongst the. Like, we're a different kind of racist racist.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Right.

[Host 1]

Like the VDA tendency is the, like, quote, unquote, scientific racists.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. And by the way, I want to clarify before I get screamed at, the thing I just said was, like, his perspective, not mine. Jesus Christ. Fuck these people.

[Host 1]

Yeah, yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

All of them.

[Host 1]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Please don't clip me. Or out of context. So, like, he then goes on, after he's explained this, to explain, like, his history of migration. He says that around in the year 2000, quote, unquote, the floodgates opened. His basic thesis is summed up in his statement, From 2000 to 2026, our borders were nothing but speed bumps. Illegals and smugglers knew that once they crossed the border, they were virtually safe from any consequences. A couple things there. That obviously includes Trump's first term and part of his second term. Amnesia about Trump having a first term seems to be quite a common issue on the right.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

It's really astonishing. And on the left, too.

[Host 1]

I don't know.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

I'm seeing it more and more. Certain people who will go unmentioned who were working for Blackwater under the first Trump administration.

[Host 1]

Yeah. It's very interesting to see this narrative, but again, not an uncommon one. Right. Like, he talks about how he wrote a paper called Illegal Aliens Destruction of Natural Resources. So he has two master's degrees. One is from the National Defense University. And I'm not sure if that's his second master's thesis, which it would be. I'd be interested to read it, but I haven't been able to find it. I'm not sure NDU makes master stuff public. And I think generally how it works is you have to opt to make it public. Like, I'm interested to know, is this kind of eco nativism? Is it, like, carrying capacity shit? Like, what?

[Mistr Advertiser]

It kind of.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

The other thing it kind of reminds me is, like, you get, like. You get this from, like, Scandinavian racists, where they're like. They have this line about the welfare state where, like, the welfare state is a fire and you can only have so many people huddled around the fire. Yeah.

[Host 1]

And it's like, okay, well, God, we see this lean. Like, we saw a lot from Mike Lee, right, when he was attempting another pathetic excuse for selling off our public lands. Like, Lee was saying how, like, so much of our wilderness areas are destroyed by migrants, so we have to destroy them and sell them to protect them. The logic of Mike Lee is unknowable. But I'm interested to read that if anyone. If anyone's like a library ninja, get in touch. I'd love to find that out, he spends a great deal of time explaining his 100 million number. And he refers to these people as illegal aliens. Right. That he contrasts this with the number of 20 million. He says that comes from Pew Research and he says that it hasn't changed since the 1970s. What? That is not a statistic. Which is played out in Pew's published documents. I'm looking here at a 2023 paper from Pew. The number of unauthorized immigrants in the United States. 1990. 3.5 million. 2000. 8.6, 2015, 11.0. Thanks Obama. And up to 14 million in 2023. He claims it's been 20 since the 1970s. Obviously he's not giving a source here, but he claims Pew has said that. And that's not what I found from Pew. He sort of arrives at his hundred million dollar number first. He said he was looking at some stuff from investment bank Bear Stearns. I don't know what he was looking at.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Why?

[Host 1]

Yeah, it's very strange. He then goes on to give the only hard statistics he gives. He was talking about Charlotte, North Carolina, here, when they were doing Operation Charlotte's Web. Estimates indicated that 30% or more of commuters were no longer traveling. This means at least 30% of them were most likely illegal immigrants. This is based on traffic delays. He's getting the amount of time people spend in traffic jets. Like he's going on Google Ma Maps. This is a massive logical leap. He then says that's about a quarter of Charlotte's commuters. 30%. Not, not a quarter. And this figure, you guessed it, fits perfectly with the total of 100 million. Out of 420 million people in the United States. I estimate that 100 million are illegal immigrants. Same as the observation for children absent from Charlotte schools. More than 30% of students were missing. These were of course illegal children or children of illegal immigrants. The category of illegal children, fascinating choice of words.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Oh God.

[Host 1]

I'm guessing he's talking about like undocumented kids or kids whose parents are undocumented. Separate categories there. But like there are many reasons. I don't think we have to explain this to listeners. Why. Why some people might not have wanted to be out and about or at school.

[Parent 1]

Uhhuh.

[Host 1]

When Border patrol are dragging people out of cars and smashing their windows.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah, this is an extremely common thing, which is like.

[Host 1]

Yeah, yeah, like not wanting to die.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

I want to point this out too. Like they shot like American citizens. Not, not that it's like to shoot an American citizen than a non citizen,

[Host 1]

but like, no, but they did that.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Everyone, everyone knew that they had done that. Yeah, like they did that in Chicago.

[Host 1]

Yeah, like, yeah, they did in Chicago. They were going to go do it again in Minneapolis.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Like, yeah, obviously they shot protesters. They also just shot random people like who they were. Like, oh, you're non white. Fudge you right. Like it's like that kind of shit.

[Host 1]

Yeah. People who got in most of the instance we've seen that what they have said is a person tried to ram them with their car. And most of the times we have seen video evidence. It certainly don't look like that to me.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

No. Yeah, yeah.

[Host 1]

This idea that 30 of students are therefore undocumented people is ludicrous. Yeah. They were in Charlotte like middle to late November. Like this time when Americans often travel, don't go to school. Right. They have this Thanksgiving thing here and people like to, to enjoy time with their families.

[George Taveras]

This is George Taveras and Sam Taggart from Stradiolab. Okay, picture it. Your apartment after a Saturday workout. The gym bag, the couch, maybe even the car. Mi amor. It's a full novella of odors and not the glamorous kind.

[Sam Taggart]

That's where Febreze comes in. Boost, spray, spritz, plug or clip. It doesn't just mask odors, it fights them, honey.

[George Taveras]

Want long lasting scent you can control? Try Febreze Plug scent booster today. With the adjustable intensity dial, you can control the scent to match your mood. Plus the thanks to its fade defy technology, Your home stays first day fresh for up to 50 days.

[Sam Taggart]

Need a quick car rescue? Clip a Febreze car vent clip and map your ride to freshness. And don't forget the fabric refresher. While you can't cram that cushion in the washer, you can top off every pillow fluff with a spritz of fabric refresher.

[George Taveras]

Because home should smell like you. Fabulous. Fresh, Unforgettable.

[Sam Taggart]

Febreze is a proud sponsor of the Elton John Impact Awards, honoring those who have helped shape a more inclusive and compassionate world with their artistry, advocacy and unwavering commitment to equality.

[George Taveras]

You won't want to miss the Elton John Impact awards podcast. Available June 1st on the iHeartradio app. And everywhere podcasts are heard.

[Mistr Advertiser]

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[Tori Spelling]

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[Host 1]

Mom, can I have lingo?

[Parent 2]

Kids?

[Host 1]

Dad, Lingokids, please. When did we become the Lingokids house? No idea.

[Amy Eric]

Last week it was dinosaurs.

[Host 1]

This week it's Lingokids. Why Lingokids? Because it's the best thing ever. We can play games with astronauts, wild animals and superheroes. With more than 4,000 interactive games, songs and shows, LingoKids is the number one entertainment platform for young kids. So no dinosaurs and dinosaurs. Everything kids love, download it for free. He then goes on to talk about the differences between us and Europe. There's a phrase here that I want to read again. I want you to understand that this is translated twice. Uncontrolled immigration to the United States now poses the greatest threat to our culture in our very existence. This goes for you in Europe too. Even when we manage to get past these cumbersome bureaucrats and politicians, the grassroots will take care of it for us. The precise tactics for removing those who need to be removed may take different forms. In Europe and the United States, the grassroots will take care of it for us. Is between em dashes. I don't know if he means the grassroots will vote them out. Otherwise that seems like a pogrom, right?

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Like, yeah, that's. That's not. That's not good.

[Host 1]

Yeah, yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

That just seems like an ethnic cleansing campaign conducted by people.

[Host 1]

I want to be like. Like, but because that's a really scary concept, right?

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Like, yeah, but also. Yeah, it's an AI translation That was then translated by you. And I don't know. I don't know how your French is these days.

[Host 1]

My French is fine, but, like, yeah,

[Host 2 (Mia)]

I forget who said all translation is an act of violence. But, yeah, like, humans doing translation is an act of violence. AI doing translations is like the fucking future Terminator.

[Host 1]

Yeah, bullshit.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Where the machines have killed everyone.

[Host 1]

Like, yeah, like a lot really is lost in translation. In between the EM dashes, the French is la basse populaire sans chartiera pour nous. So, yeah, come at me, French speakers. Let me know if you think there's a better translation for that. He then goes on to try and, like, not blame Trump, which is interesting. Said, I don't believe Trump has abandoned his campaign promise. I believe that his advisors do not bring him back to reality on the ground. And then I've skipped a little here. If I had to do it again, I would have briefed Trump directly several times rather than relying on this inner circle who might have interests elsewhere. Trump is the best president I've ever worked for. I believe he will return to that campaign promise soon. Again, it's kind of a fatty thing, right? Like, it wasn't the leader. It wasn't the dear leader. It was people who failed to reflect the dear leader's thought. It's very interesting to see him speaking so clearly this way. Like, there's two ways he could be going with this. He could be angling for his job back. To be clear.

[Gronk]

Right.

[Host 1]

The reason we don't have Norman Buffino anymore, in my opinion, is that after ICE and then cbp, both murdered US Citizens in the plain light of day on camera, and then took to the television to lie about those U.S. citizens in the hours after they murdered them. They became too toxic for even the Trump administration to touch.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. They were staggeringly unpopular. Everyone fucking hated them. Yeah.

[Host 1]

Yeah. You literally lost, like, the old guys with NRA hats at the gun range who I sometimes talk to.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Like, yeah, again, I can't keep coming back to, like, they lost Kurt Warner, who, like, is, like, a quarterback who has never once talked about politics ever, and is, like, like, made, like, a documentary that was, like, a bunch about, like, his, like, faith journey. Right. And they, like, when. When Kurt Warner is being like, hey, what the. Yeah, you've lost your. You're losing the conservative football guys.

[Host 1]

Yeah. I mean, you shoot a white man on his knees in the street in the back.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

While you're beating him up. Yeah. That's how you lose Americans.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. That's how you lose Barstool. Like it's, It's.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Hideous.

[Host 1]

Yeah. He kind of has two choices. Right. Like he can. And he can go into the consulting world, he can go into the grifting world. Right. And just become like a podcast grifter. Welcome to the club. Or he can go into politics and I wonder which. Like, he's kind of left. Two of those pathways open. Right. Like he kind of.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Podcast grifter or politics.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Well, you can do both now too. I guess that's true.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

See the head of the FBI.

[Host 1]

Too much. It was too much for Dan Boncino. He retired and returned.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

I guess. I guess, I guess. I guess it's like our noble, like Health and Human Services secretary, the latest shit eating Kennedy or whatever. Like, can still do that shit.

[Host 1]

But I think. Yeah. But Serial podcast guest. I just want to come back to, like, we need to reflect on this now.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Right.

[Host 1]

Like, we're doing primaries for the midterms right now. The Democrats have doubled down on same old shit almost everywhere across the country. Like, we have seen some better candidates. Right. But like, I understand that like the pathway to a beautiful life is not through the Democratic Party, but if they are incapable of seeing that this isn't something that we can reform. If they do what Biden did in 2020, which is like, oh, they just need more money.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

This ratchet will continue to only move in one direction, which is towards the brutalization of more people.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. Just on a very basic level, having a massive institutional apparatus that produces Nazis and gives them the authority to do the thing that the Nazis want to do is not a way that any kind of democracy can survive.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

And that's what we've seen.

[Host 1]

To paraphrase, we have created an entity which is exempt from the law in order to enforce it. Yeah. We can't keep up with that. And like now is a moment, I guess it, that demands bravery. And from the Democrats, I've seen cowardice.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

And like, if they continue to be cowards right now, we're going to go so far down this path, there's no coming back.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

And I, I don't know, but I think that's something we really need to reflect on.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. We have 20,000 buffinos who we've given guns and training and authority to.

[Host 1]

Yeah. And who we've allowed to kill people in our streets and not face accountability. Right.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Like, I am not a county attorney appreciator generally, but like, it makes me happy to see that Hennepin county attorney go after the ICE agent who shot someone through their front door and they lied about it. It. Like, if liberal democracy can't do any of that kind of stuff, then it's worthless. It doesn't mean anything anymore.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. And it won't be a democracy afterwards, right?

[Host 1]

Yeah. Yeah. It'll die. It made its own bed to die on.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

There's examples of this fucking everywhere. Right. But, like, the Biden administration was. Tragedy is farce of, like, Allende promoting Pinochet.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Like, that's a thing. That's a thing that he did. He promoted Pinochet.

[Host 1]

Right.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. Like, if you don't get rid of the people who want to fucking kill you and you instead give them more power, they're going to fucking kill you.

[Host 1]

Yeah. And like, what Biden. Biden tried to. They tried pretty hard to retire Bevino because he would talk a lot about the situation at the border and the Biden administration, but they didn't.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

No, they didn't. And then also, like, they made more of them.

[Host 1]

Yeah. And also they threw as much money, like, the money that your kid doesn't get for free meals. It's because Border Patrol has Blackhawks. Like, yeah. Yeah. That was a heartwarming and inspiring episode of It Could Happen Here podcast about things falling apart.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. But, hey, we beat the Nazis once, we can do it again. Yeah.

[Host 1]

And Minneapolis beat these people. That's the other thing. Right. Like, they won.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

They came out and they stood together as a community. They didn't focus on trivial bullshit that divides them. They looked out for one another. Border Patrol thought they were in a battle. And if they were in a battle, then they did lose it. They surrendered. Right.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah. And, like, that's. That's also not to say that there aren't still, like, horrifying happening there. Right. Like, there's still raids going on.

[Host 1]

You're absolutely correct. Yeah. And that, like, people aren't dealing with the many other ills of capitalism and existed Sunday as it is today. But, like, yeah, they were not able to make those people cower in fear.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

And that has shown the rest of the country how brave we can be together. And I just don't think we should forget that.

[Host 2 (Mia)]

Yeah,

[Amy Eric]

it could happen. Here is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from Cool Zone Media, Visit our website, coolzonemedia.com or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts, you can now find sources for It Could Happen here, listed directly in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.

[Gronk]

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[Amy Eric]

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[Parent 1]

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[Parent 2]

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[Parent 1]

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[Parent 2]

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[Parent 1]

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[Parent 2]

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[Parent 1]

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[Parent 1]

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[Host 1]

The action continues every week. This is Total Nonstop TNA Thursday Night Impact every week on AMC. For showtimes and more information visit tnarestling.com this is an I heart podcast. Guaranteed human.