Executive Disorder: White House Weekly #44

Summary

Podcast Summary:

It Could Happen Here – Executive Disorder: White House Weekly #44
Cool Zone Media & iHeartPodcasts | December 5, 2025
Hosts: Garrison Davis, James Stout, Mia Wong, Sophie Lichterman

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Overview

This episode of "It Could Happen Here" delivers a comprehensive rundown of the week in White House news, U.S. government actions, and their connections to wider trends in American collapse and resistance. Highlights include intensifying surveillance and military activity abroad, evolving immigration crackdowns, controversial law enforcement incidents, major legal battles over tariffs, and alarming developments in higher education and media. The team analyzes both headline-grabbing and under-the-radar government activities, always with an eye toward the lived impact on ordinary people, the trajectory of collapse, and emergent possibilities for building a better future.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. International Surveillance and U.S. Military Activity

[02:47 - 06:30]

• US Manned Surveillance Flights in West Africa:

  • The U.S. is conducting ISR (Intelligence, Surveillance, Reconnaissance) flights over Nigeria and parts of the Sahel, suggesting potential UAV (drone) strikes soon, targeting groups like ISWAP and JNIM.
  • James Stout jokes about their gender-neutral acronym obsessions:
    “When you get killed by an unaccountable drone, but it’s gender neutral.” (03:43, James)

• National Park Service Changes:

  • New fees: $100 upcharge for non-U.S. residents at 11 major parks and $250 for an interagency pass, modernized passes include Trump’s image—a motif of Trump branding government assets.

2. Legal & Intelligence Revelations

[06:30 - 08:41]

• DOJ Updates – Pipe Bomb Case:

  • After nearly five years, an arrest was made connected to the January 6 pipe bomb incident. The suspect’s “anarchist leanings” were noted, but with ambiguous meaning.
  • The case partially debunks previous conspiracy theories and misidentified suspects.

• FBI Surveillance of Left Organizing:

  • FOIA requests reveal FBI investigation into the Socialist Rifle Association under Biden, though no charges resulted.

3. Concerning Criminal Plots and Indictments

[08:48 - 11:07]

• Foiled Texas Plot on Haiti:
  • Two Texas men indicted for plotting to invade Haiti’s Gonave Island for horrific purposes, including plans for murder and enslavement—one even joined the Air Force this year for military experience.
  • Discussion underlines the overlap of violent fantasies, militarism, and America’s armed institutions.
  • James: “While planning to invade a small island and enslave everybody, he got into the Air Force. That… should be a story.” (10:34)

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4. Tariff Talk with Mia Wong

[11:45 - 20:33]

• Impending Supreme Court Ruling on Trump Tariffs:

  • Legality of sweeping Trump-era tariffs challenged; major corporations (notably Costco) are pursuing lawsuits to recoup losses should the ruling overturn the tariffs.
  • Mia: “It is so patently illegal. It is an astounding demonstration of the complete abdication of the Supreme Court’s pretensions at being one of the branches of government...” (11:51)

• Trump’s Trade Confusion:

  • Trump now threatens to abandon or re-negotiate the USMCA, his own 2020 replacement for NAFTA—despite having championed it as a core achievement.
    • “Brother, you did this. This was your trade deal.” (16:43, Garrison)

• Latin America Strategy:

  • Trump attempting to replicate past cordial U.S.-Brazil ties, lowering some Brazilian tariffs as a result—even as U.S. gears up for possible conflict in Venezuela.

• Structural Critique:

  • The hosts emphasize NAFTA and its replacements hurt both American and Mexican workers, and Trump’s moves are political theater with little benefit to workers.

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5. Shocking Updates – Military, Immigration, and Violence

[25:17 - 36:34]

• National Guard Shooting in DC:

  • On Thanksgiving, West Virginia National Guard troops patrolling in DC (part of Trump’s “crime crackdown”) were attacked, resulting in one death.
  • The shooter was an Afghan refugee with a history in a CIA-backed paramilitary—raising questions of trauma, veteran care, and the U.S.’s responsibilities to its wartime allies.
    • Garrison: “Specifically… mental health support for these people… probably doesn’t exist.” (28:58)

• Immediate Policy Crackdown:

  • U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services halted all asylum, green card, and citizenship applications from “high-risk” countries, using spurious criteria (visa overstay rates).
  • List includes Afghanistan, Cuba, Venezuela, Haiti, and several African countries.
    • James: “This doesn’t have anything to do with risk… They do not justify the inclusion of these countries based on potential for people there to do terrorism.” (30:27)

• Trump Administration TPS (Temporary Protected Status) Moves:

  • Announced end of TPS for Somalis in Minnesota, but without legal authority—immigration enforcement ramps up regardless, leading to targeted ICE actions and state fear.

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6. Congressional & Military Controversies

[36:34 - 41:57]

• Drone Strike Debate:
  • House hearings question whether U.S. forces conducted a “double tap” strike on survivors of a drone attack against alleged “narco-terrorists” at sea.
  • Tom Cotton and others use bizarre justifications; the team points out the legal and moral issues, with little hope for accountability.
    • James: “You’re not at war. You’re in a suit in a room watching a TV screen.” (37:01)
    • James: “It doesn’t matter what term we use to describe this other than war crime.” (39:47)
  • U.S. signaling possible escalation in Venezuela—grave humanitarian concerns.

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7. Deep Dive – New York City Sanctuary Policies & Zoran Mamdani

[46:19 - 61:58]

• Clarifying the Law:

  • Explanation of NYC’s sanctuary provisions: only honor ICE detainers for 170 listed “violent or serious” crimes and with judicial warrant.
  • James: “Sanctuary laws are not the same in every city. People have an understanding of them which could do with being improved.” (48:16)

• Limits of Local Power & Harm Reduction:

  • Mayor-elect Zoran Mamdani is constrained, but pushing for stronger sanctuary policies, more legal funds, and less cooperation with ICE—while negotiating with federal authorities to avoid federalized raids and National Guard deployments.
    • Garrison: “There is a difference between being the mayor of a local municipality and what a legitimate politics of actually stopping our current process of deportations looks like.” (57:02)

• ICE and Local Policing Realities:

  • Even with sanctuary laws, ICE can act independently; real protection depends as much on local vigilantism and community organizing (e.g., Canal Street blockade) as official policy.
    • James: “That is what kept those people safe… it was members of their community.” (63:05)

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8. Culture Wars on Campus: Academic Freedom under Attack

[63:18 - 75:30]

• University of Oklahoma Grading Scandal:
  • A trans graduate instructor is suspended after flunking a junior psychology major for a religiously-motivated, citation-less reflection paper denying the existence of non-binary gender and opposing “Satanic lies.”
  • The right-wing group TPUSA launches a media blitz, and the student becomes a conservative celebrity.
    • James: “This is not a scientific response. It is… entirely vibes based.” (70:47)
    • Garrison: “This is chilling speech at universities by making it so you can’t teach certain topics, especially if you happen to be trans yourself.” (74:39)
  • The case illustrates how academia is under siege from external political attacks, especially targeting queer and progressive educators.

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9. Media & Predictive Data – The Rise of Betting on News

[75:30 - 79:27]

• Prediction Markets in Key News Outlets:
  • CNN and CNBC partner with Kalshi—online political betting platform—to feature prediction market data (i.e., gambling odds) as news “data.” Rival PolyMarket partners with X (Twitter) and Yahoo Finance.
    • Garrison: “It’s incredibly dangerous to democracy... It’d be very easy to interpret these gambling numbers as genuine poll information.” (78:56)
    • James: “There is one possible benefit. Will it stop Nate Silver being so fucking annoying?”
  • The hosts warn that this distorts public understanding of elections and major events, disguising speculation as objective reality.

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Notable Quotes & Standout Moments

• “When you get killed by an unaccountable drone, but it’s gender neutral.”
  — James Stout (03:43)

• “Brother, you did this. This was your trade deal.”
  — Garrison Davis (16:43)

• “You’re not at war. You’re in a suit in a room watching a TV screen.”
  — James Stout (37:01)

• “It doesn’t matter what term we use to describe this other than war crime.”
  — James Stout (39:47)

• “This is not a scientific response. It is… entirely vibes based.”
  — James Stout (70:47)

• “It’s incredibly dangerous to democracy... It’d be very easy to interpret these gambling numbers as genuine poll information.”
  — Garrison Davis (78:56)

• “That is what kept those people safe… it was members of their community.”
  — James Stout (63:05)

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Important Segment Timestamps

• International Surveillance & Park Fees: [02:47 - 06:30]
• Pipe Bomb Suspect & FBI SRA Tracking: [06:30 - 08:41]
• Texas-Haiti Atrocity Plot: [08:48 - 11:07], [25:04 - 25:32]
• Tariffs and Trade Policy: [11:45 - 20:33]
• National Guard Shooting & Afghan Refugee: [25:17 - 36:34]
• Deportations & Immigration Crackdown: [31:14 - 36:34]
• Venezuela Drone Strikes, Law of War: [36:34 - 41:57]
• NYC Sanctuary Law, ICE Policy: [46:19 - 61:58]
• Academic Freedom Controversy: [63:18 - 75:30]
• Kalshi, Prediction Markets in News: [75:30 - 79:27]

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Tone & Language

• Deeply skeptical, darkly humorous, and indignant about abuses of law and power
• Unflinching coverage of “collapse” with a rigorous, anti-establishment perspective
• Informal, direct, and laced with profanity, gallows humor, and historical references

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Final Thoughts

This episode exemplifies the show’s blend of rapid-response news analysis and systemic critique. The hosts cover a daunting array of stories, always returning to the human stakes of policy, the dangers of unchecked power, and the importance of local (sometimes direct) resistance. The show’s coverage is clear about the real dysfunction at the executive level and the collapse of normality, while rooting for the emergence of better futures from below.

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For a deep dive on any segment, consider listening from these timestamps, or use the summary above to catch the episode’s most crucial moments and central themes.

Transcript

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[James Stout]

Yo, yo, yo, yo.

[Ed Helms]

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[Garrison Davis]

I'm hungry. What's up y'?

[James Stout]

All?

[Ed Helms]

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[Host/Announcer]

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[Ed Helms]

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[Ed Helms]

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[Host/Announcer]

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[Eliot Khani]

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[Ed Helms]

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[Eliot Khani]

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[Host/Announcer]

I've always wanted us to have therapy.

[Garrison Davis]

So this is such a beautiful opportunity.

[Eliot Khani]

Listen to season two of Family Therapy every Wednesday on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Host/Announcer]

Media.

[Garrison Davis]

This is it Could Happen Here. Executive Disorder, our weekly newscast covering what's happening in the White House, the crumbling world, and what it means for you. I'm Garrison Davis. Today I'm joined by James Stout and Sophie Lichterman. This episode we are covering the week of November 24th to December 4th, an extra long week. Somehow they squeezed a few more days in there to open us up. James, what are some important small stories we don't want to overlook.

[James Stout]

Okay. Yeah, Yeah, a lot. Because of our extra long week. Right.

[Host/Announcer]

Yeah.

[James Stout]

The United States is flying manned ISR flights over Nigeria and possibly parts of the Sahel as well. It's not entirely clear because the flights kind of go dark once they take off. Sources familiar with the matter have suggested that UAV strikes might begin soon. It seems that the ISR flights are targeting ISWAP and jnim. I'm going to write about this on my Patreon, probably because I think it requires visuals and I think it's. It's too much to go into in depth here. But if you want to check that out, you can.

[Garrison Davis]

Can you explain some of those acronyms?

[James Stout]

No, I just love to find.

[Host/Announcer]

Yeah, I was about to say it's.

[James Stout]

Great when you report on military shit because it's just a wall of acronyms. Okay.

[Garrison Davis]

ISR flights.

[James Stout]

These are intelligence flights, right? Intelligence Surveillance Reconnaissance I believe is the acronym they're looking for. Stuff uav, Unmanned Aerial Vehicle. There's a gender neutral term that I can't remember. Unpiloted Aerial Vehicle.

[Garrison Davis]

Woke his back hard.

[James Stout]

Yeah, that's the Biden era thing, right. When you get killed by an unaccountable drone. But it's gender neutral. The iswap, that's the Islamic State. WILI in that part of the world. So like Province West Africa Province, I think it stands for.

[Garrison Davis]

These are the targets of these flights and strikes.

[James Stout]

And JNIM being another jihadist group that is not associated with the so called Islamic State.

[Host/Announcer]

Got it, got it. Wow.

[James Stout]

Yeah. Okay. Hit you with another acronym.

[Garrison Davis]

A foia, I think. I think we know that one Filed.

[James Stout]

By the Cato Institute has revealed that the FBI under Biden was investigating the sra. That's a socialist rifle association. It didn't bring charges against any of the members, but it did apparently investigate them for some time. Finally, the National Park Service has announced a new fee schedule and quote unquote, modernized graphics for passes.

[Host/Announcer]

Is this the horrific image you sent us?

[James Stout]

Yes, it's a picture of Donald Trump. Yeah, that's how they've modernized it. It's. It's not very nice. I. I know there are better things in the parks. I feel like, like, you know, Half Dome is nice. The Yosemite Valley, pretty cool shit in. In Wrangelson Elias that you could do instead.

[Host/Announcer]

That's like him trying to rename that peace institute after himself. He just keeps trying to put his face and name on everything.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah, well, when you're A dying man. Legacy becomes very important.

[Host/Announcer]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. But that's ex. He. The US Institute of Peace is being renamed for Trump.

[James Stout]

Really?

[Host/Announcer]

Yeah.

[James Stout]

Oh, I know. I miss that. Great. Cool.

[Host/Announcer]

It's feeling very similar to that where he's just putting his face and name on everything.

[James Stout]

Yeah. So two things, right? Electronic passes for parks, probably a good thing. And a hundred dollar upcharge for non United States. I think it's residents as opposed to citizens in the 11 most popular parks.

[Host/Announcer]

How can they even check?

[Garrison Davis]

They might just ask like this, this sounds like a tourism thing, right? Like they just want people that are like visiting the States to pay more.

[James Stout]

To be clear, other countries do this. I still think it's bad. Like some of the Grand Canyon is part of the cultural patrimony of all of humanity.

[Host/Announcer]

Yeah, yeah.

[James Stout]

The National Park Service itself is an exercise in settler colonialism, but we can talk about that forever. Yeah, I've seen some stuff with gate rangers be like, I'm absolutely not asking for your green card.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah, no, that's silly fee ranges.

[James Stout]

But yeah, I think they will just kind of assume in good faith. A lot of other countries do do this. Like it's not unusual. I still think it sucks. There's also an interagency pass. It's 250 for non residents and $80 for residents. So those are the big changes there.

[Garrison Davis]

Speaking of big changes, a pretty big update in a case that has lasted nearly five years. This morning, Thursday, December 4, a suspect was arrested in connection to the pipe bombs placed around the Capitol the night before January, specifically at the DNC and RNC headquarters in Washington D.C. the suspect has been identified as 30 year old Brian Cole Jr. From Woodbridge, Virginia. Federal law enforcement sources have told the New York Post that the suspect may have had, quote, unquote, anarchist leanings. Unquote. This could mean anything, right? This, this could mean anything from like anti government, violent extremism, like militia movement type extremism, boogaloo boys, accelerationist, as well as possible left wing anarchist leanings.

[James Stout]

Sure.

[Garrison Davis]

It could be any number of things. There's still very limited information about this. Even in the like DOJ press conference that just wrapped up a few minutes before we started recording. They're being pretty tight lipped about details.

[James Stout]

Anything about his gate?

[Garrison Davis]

Well, yes, people are, people are asking about his gate and allegedly he had begun building explosive devices in 2019.

[Host/Announcer]

Okay, okay.

[James Stout]

So like some, some background, this arrest.

[Garrison Davis]

Does partially discredit a report from the Blaze which Robert has talked about on this show before, which falsely identified a Former Capitol Police officer as the bomber, based on gate analysis.

[James Stout]

Yeah. If they prosecute someone else, the Blaze is going to get sued out of existence, I would imagine.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah. Critical support to former Capitol Police officer who puts the Blaze out of business.

[Host/Announcer]

Wow.

[Garrison Davis]

Pour one out for Glenn Beck. But this suspect lives at a home associated with both their parents. It's unclear if the parents are still married. The suspect's dad runs a bail bond business, which the son is supposed to have worked for, and the mom is a real estate agent. Not much online presence can be found yet on Brian Cole Jr. I've spent hours looking, and so far, not much there, but we'll see if that changes over time.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Host/Announcer]

A developing story.

[James Stout]

Yeah. Yeah, we'll do a whole episode if it merits it later, I guess.

[Host/Announcer]

Sure.

[James Stout]

Talking of terrible indictments, Garrison, would you like to hear about a terrible indictment out of Texas?

[Garrison Davis]

I'm going to say yes, but no. I don't know if I'd like to for work reasons. I feel like you're going to do it anyway, so play along.

[James Stout]

Two Texas men have been indicted for a plan to invade a small island off Haiti, kill all the men, and sexually enslave all the women and children.

[Garrison Davis]

What?

[Host/Announcer]

I'm sorry, what?

[James Stout]

Yeah, this is. This is a wild one. The indictment says they hope to, quote, lead an unlawful expeditionary force to the island of Gonave, which is part of the Republic of At. For the purpose of carrying out their rape fantasies, Weissenberg and Thomas planned to purchase a sailboat, firearms and ammunition, then recruit members of the District of Columbia area homeless population to serve as a mercenary force. As they invaded Ganave island and stage a coup d', etat, Weissenberg and Thomas intended to murder all of the men on the island so they could turn all of the women and children into their sex slaves. That is what is alleged in the indictment. Right. Look, be an interesting case. One of them had joined the air force in 2025 to. To get some military experience, or was in the Air Force this year to get some military experience and had successfully been transferred to nearer to D.C. from where they hoped to recruit unhoused people to serve as mercenaries.

[Host/Announcer]

This is absolutely insane. Who are the. Who are these two Texas men? Why do they think this is, like, a thing that can be, like, all.

[James Stout]

Right, it's borderline something I considered not including because, like, these people are probably pretty unwell, it seems like.

[Host/Announcer]

Are they just obsessed with, like, Eric Prince? Like, I don't. I don't under. I don't.

[James Stout]

Yeah. Like, if the guy hadn't passed all the background checks to get into the Air Force. I feel like this would be less remarkable. Right. But while planning to invade a small island and enslave everybody, he got into the Air Force. That, that in itself, like, like should be a story. And of course, this is all alleged. Right. It's all in an indictment. We don't know what the evidential basis for a lot of this is.

[Host/Announcer]

Well, that was disturbing.

[James Stout]

Yeah, it's wild one. I guess we'll. We'll keep you informed.

[Garrison Davis]

What.

[James Stout]

Garrison. Garrison has been.

[Host/Announcer]

I like. I, like, can't even compute. Like, that's one of the most insane things I've heard in a really long time.

[Garrison Davis]

Well, first of economic news, let's throw it to tariffs.

[Host/Announcer]

Let's go to tariff talk with Mia.

[James Stout]

Rocking Casper.

[Mia Wong]

This is Mia Wong with Tariff Talk. So, obviously the biggest tariff news right now is the impending Supreme Court ruling on the legality of a broad swath of the tariffs that Trump has imposed using unbelievably dubious legal and economic authority. And by unbelievably dubious, I mean it is so patently illegal. It is an astounding demonstration of the complete abdication of the Supreme Court's pretensions at being one of the branches of government that this hasn't already been overturned, but this ruling has not dropped yet. Everyone's waiting. So in the meantime, what we have is a bunch of Trump administration officials have been going on TV and talking about trade policy, and they're saying something that we've been hearing for a while now, which is that they believe that they can use different set of legal authority to impose the same tariffs. Whether they can do this or not is. I mean, they shouldn't be able to do this. Like, all of the, all of the authority they're using is pretty ridiculous. But this has been. This has been their strategy. They've been reiterating their strategy. On the other side, we've seen some interesting movement in terms of the opposition, which is that Costco has become sort of the biggest company to join in this trend of companies going to court with lawsuits to try to recoup the money that they've spent on these tariffs, because if the Supreme Court ruling overturns the legality of these tariffs, these companies can get their money back retroactively. Costco is the biggest company we've seen so far sort of move to attempt to do this remedy through the courts. So we will keep an eye on this. And this is, you know, I think especially if this comes overturned, we're going to see a lot of companies try to make moves for this. This is something that is going to piss off the Trump administration because they've been talking a giant game about how, oh, these are going to fund the, like, $2,000 tariff checks you're never getting. Trump is literally talking about. And this is the, you know, this is an old sort of right wing thing, but he's talking about how, oh, tariff revenue is going to replace income tax, which, no, it's not like just nonsense gibberish. Numbers don't work, orders the magnitude off. Just nonsense, can't work. But, you know, these are things that they're saying. And there's probably going to be increasing conflict between the sectors of capital that just want their money back from these tariffs and the Trump administration, which, you know, wants this money for its, you know, nebulous political purposes. There's been some sort of interesting political developments in terms of Trump and Lula. So people will probably remember from listening to the show that there have been very, very high turfs on Brazil that are effectively political tariffs for actually putting one Jair Bolsonaro in prison for, you know, the mere crime of attempting to overthrow the government to install himself as the ruler of Brazil. Now, there has been, over the past few weeks, there's been some sort of ratcheting down of a lot of the tariffs. There's been a bunch of goods that have been exempt from the tariffs as part of Trump's sort of widespread efforts to like, lower food prices because there's a bunch of food goods that are being exempt from this stuff. And there was also, very recently we got an actual call between Trump and Lula which seems to have gone fairly well. You know, at least it seems to have been cordial. The two seem to both be coming out of it saying like, oh, we agree on things, it's going to go great. And this is to a large extent an attempt to do a replay of Lula's positive relationship with the Bush administration the last time he was in power. Where, and this is, you know, this has been a trend in the, in the sort of the original pink tide and in this government where you have a kind of mix of the sort of pink Thai center left governments in Latin America where Lula has traditionally been the one who's been sort of playing with the U.S. more. And as we're seeing right now, you have the US Gearing up for potentially a war in Venezuela and there's been a whole bunch of conflict with Colombia. But Lula seems to be trying to sort of play the role that he played in the 2000s. We'll see how that goes. Trump is astonishingly, significantly more unstable than George W. Bush, which is just. Good Lord. Oh, God. Okay, enough. Oh, my God. They finally found a president who's less coherent and more unhinged than George W. Bush. The final piece of news that we need to touch on is the US's chief trade negotiator gave an interview with Politico and this is per Yahoo News, basically talked to Politico and told them that Trump is considering, you know, is talking about leaving or renegotiating the usmca, which is the trade agreements that he negotiated to replace NAFTA in 2020.

[Garrison Davis]

Roll this back again. This is his deal. He's talking about leaving or renegotiating his deal.

[Mia Wong]

This was his big thing in 2020. His big, one of his big things.

[Garrison Davis]

Was, oh, I abolished nafta.

[Mia Wong]

Oh, I created this deal. And you know, everyone at the time was like, well, this is just like NAFTA with like the edges filed off, you know, but like, this is sort of the point that we're at in, in Trumpian trade policy where it's like, ah, we're getting ripped off by Mexico and Canada. In the trade deal that I signed. As Garrison is, is fond of saying, the defining political question of our time is who was president in 2020? Brother, you, you, you did this, this, this, this was your trade deal. And somehow, somehow now, you know, in terms of real terms, right, this is actually a massive deal. So this deal has a six year term. It was negotiated in 2020, which means it's coming up next year. And this is a big enough deal that there's already sort of a full court press in the press. You can see the New York Times running it, where every single faction of capital, not every single faction, but a whole bunch of factions of capital are getting every single think tank and lobbying group and you know, like Policy Research Institute or whatever together to be like, please don't get rid of this. Because the thing about the usmca, and this is something we've, we've talked about to some extent in terms of Canada and Mexico tariffs. But one of the really important things about the tariffs that have been imposed on Mexico and Canada and the tariff rates are extremely high, is that those tariffs haven't been applied to goods that are covered by the usmca. And this has been a crucial lifeline to allow trade to not be annihilated by those American tariffs. And if Trump pulls out of it, and suddenly those goods are covered by these tariffs. It's going to be a really, really significant economic hit for everyone in the world eventually. But for the US And Mexico and Canada, this is going to be a massive deal. And I want to kind of close on a kind of broader point about this for a second, which is that, like, we're not pro nafta. No, NAFTA was bad. Part of the reason the Trump administration was able to do this was because of the ways that NAFTA sort of hauled out and destroyed vast sections of the American working class and also the Mexican working class. This has not been good for anyone really involved in this. One of the things that happens if you go into the economic literature, one of the episodes I did a while back talking about US And Mexico and the history of trade policy, there sort of talks about this, which is that if you go back into the economic literature, all of the economics people have had to admit that the leftists from the 90s or whatever were right that this was not going to benefit the Mexican working class. It hasn't. But on the other hand, Trump's sort of this is also not benefiting the Mexican or American working classes. Nothing that these people do on either side really do. If you want to look at what actual sort of resistance to NAFTA looks like and what effective resistance NAFTA looks like, look at the Zapatistas, whose rebellion was sparked by NAFTA and who went into revolt on the day that NAFTA went into effect. But Trump has been able to very effectively kind of be the person who comes in as the I'm the champion of the workers, et cetera, et cetera, because I'm renegotiating the evil trade deals. And now our good American workers will no longer be exploited by evil Mexican or Chinese workers, which has been an extremely effective political strategy for him and is also this sort of national fascist program that he's running is sort of based on this kind of trade policy and on manipulating the sentiments of people who got actually screwed over by nafta. So, yeah, that's where we're going to close on this. As Trump is thinking about pulling out. That is a huge deal. And, yeah, this has been tariff talk.

[Host/Announcer]

Let's, let's go to an ad break real quick. We'll be right back.

[iHeart Advertising Representative]

Run a business and not thinking about radio. Think again. Because more people are listening to the radio and iHeart today than they were 20 years ago. And only iHeart broadcast radio connects with more Americans than TV, TV, digital, social any other media, even twice as many teens than TikTok. And that reach means everything. Just think about the universal marketing formula. The number of consumers who hear your message times the response rate equals the results. Now let's get those results growing for your business. Radio's here now more than ever. And iheart's leading the way. Think radio can help your business. Think Iheard streaming, podcasting, and radio where the reach is real. Let us show [e-mail] that's iheartadvertising.com or call 844-844. Iheart one more time. Just call 844-844-Iheart and get radio working for you.

[Ed Helms]

Hey, it's Ed Helms. And welcome back to Snafu, my podcast about history's greatest screw ups. On our new season, we're bringing you a new Snafu. Every single episode.

[Host/Announcer]

32 lost nuclear weapons.

[Garrison Davis]

You're like, wait, stop.

[iHeart Advertising Representative]

What?

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah.

[Eliot Khani]

Ernie Shackleton sounds like a solid 70s.

[Ed Helms]

Basketball player who still wore knee pads.

[James Stout]

Yes.

[Ed Helms]

It's gonna be a whole lot of history, a whole lot of funny, and a whole lot of guests. The great Paul Scheer made me feel good. I'm like, oh, wow. Angela and Jenna, I am so psyched you're here.

[Host/Announcer]

What was that like for you to soft launch into the show?

[Ed Helms]

Sorry, Jenna. I'll be asking the questions today.

[Host/Announcer]

I forgot whose podcast we were doing.

[Ed Helms]

Nick Kroll. I hope this story is good enough to get you to toss that sandwich. So let's see how it goes. Listen to season four of SNAFU with Ed Helms on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Garrison Davis]

In early 1988, federal agents raced to track down the gang they suspect of.

[Host/Announcer]

Importing millions of dollars worth of heroin into New York from Asia.

[Mia Wong]

We had 30 agents ready to go with shotguns and rifles, and you name it.

[Garrison Davis]

But what they find is not what they expected.

[Ed Helms]

Basically, your stay at home moms would.

[Garrison Davis]

Picking up these large amounts of heroin.

[Ed Helms]

They go, is this your daughter?

[James Stout]

I said, yes.

[Ed Helms]

They go, oh, you may not see her for like 25 years.

[Garrison Davis]

Caught between a federal investigation and the.

[Host/Announcer]

Violent gang who recruited them, the women.

[Garrison Davis]

Must decide who they're willing to protect and who they dare to betray. Once I saw the gun, I tried to take his hand and I saw the flash of light. Listen to the Chinatown sting on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or anywhere you get your podcasts.

[Mia Wong]

Michael Lewis here. My book, the Big Short tells the story of the Buildup and birth of the US housing market back in 2008. It follows a few unlikely but lucky people who saw the real estate market for the black hole it would become and eventually made billions of dollars from that perception. It was like feeding the monster, said Eisman. We fed the monster until it blew up. The monster was exploding. Yet on the streets of Manhattan, there was no sign anything important had just happened. Now, 15 years after the Big Short's original release, and a decade after it became an Academy Award winning movie, I've.

[Ed Helms]

Recorded an audiobook edition for the very first time.

[Mia Wong]

The Big Short story.

[Ed Helms]

What it means when people start betting against the market and who really pays.

[Mia Wong]

For an unchecked financial system is as relevant today as it's ever been, offering invaluable insight into the current economy and also today's politics. Get the Big Short now at Pushkin fm Audiobooks or wherever audiobooks are sold.

[Host/Announcer]

And we're back. Harrison, tell me. Tell me something less horrific than what James just told us before. Mia's tariff section.

[James Stout]

I missed a pot. I missed a pot. Okay, do you. Do you want to guess how they were making money for part of this? According to the indictment, this is the.

[Garrison Davis]

Texas men who wanted to invade the island. How are they making money?

[Host/Announcer]

Crypto.

[James Stout]

No, it's worse than that.

[Garrison Davis]

That's a good guess, Sophie.

But you said it's worse than that. Oh, no.

[Host/Announcer]

Manipulating cam girls.

[James Stout]

In a sense, it appears they were producing child sexual abuse material.

[Garrison Davis]

Oh, yeah. Wow.

[Host/Announcer]

This is one of the worst. I mean, obviously it's still allegedly, but.

[Garrison Davis]

Like, this is one of the worst.

[Host/Announcer]

Things I've ever heard, and I don't even know how to react.

[Garrison Davis]

Huh.

[James Stout]

Yeah, he was. He received. He was prosecuted on the UCMJ.

For that previously this year. Yeah, I was prosecuted in. I'm just reading a task and purpose article which builds on the indictment, but there it says so. He was arrested in July and has since been court martialed. Ah. So good times. Good times in the.

[Host/Announcer]

Wow.

[James Stout]

In the Air Force.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah. Well, I can't. I can't believe the Air Force has done something wrong.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

Finally, the first light on our proud and glorious Air Force.

Maybe the biggest national news story kicked off the day before Thanksgiving not just because of what happened, but then all of the fallout that has resulted from this incident, which James will report on afterwards. But yeah, let's go back to the day before Thanksgiving or. Two National Guard troops from West Virginia on assignment in Washington, D.C. it's a part of Trump's crime crackdown. Were shot on patrol a few blocks away from the White House, other Guard members fired back and tackled the shooter. One of the national guard members, a 20 year old named Sarah Beckstrom, died from gunshot injuries on Thanksgiving. The other 24 year old, Andrew Wolf, has so far survived, remains hospitalized.

[Host/Announcer]

Wow.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

A 29 year old man, Romanula Lockenwell, is charged with first degree murder and assault with intent to kill. The criminal complaint alleges he shouted al Akbar as he fired. Locknwell came to the United States as a part of Operation allies welcome in 2021, which moved US assets out of Afghanistan as the Taliban gained control of the region. Lockenwell was later granted formal asylum under Trump. This past April, friend of the alleged shooter told the New York Times that Lockenwell joined this CIA backed paramilitary squad, Unit 03, to earn money for his family and get medical training rather than for ideological reasons. And when he returned from stints with the Zero Unit, his personality changed and he was less socially outgoing. To quote from the Times, quote, Lockenwell told others in his village that he had been shaken by seeing so many bodies and bloodshed in his role with the 03 unit. Quote.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

According to a volunteer who worked with his family, Lockenwell's mental health started rapidly declining in early 2023. He begun self isolating, withdrawing from work and family, stopped paying rent and faced eviction in 2024. This volunteer wrote in an email to an immigrant nonprofit group which was obtained by the AP in the New York Times, which reads that Lock and Will quote, has not been functional as a person, father and provider. Since March of last year. 23. His behavior has changed greatly, unquote. When Lockemal emerged from quote, unquote dark isolation, it was to engage in, quote, unquote, reckless travel, according to this volunteer, long, seemingly pointless road trips across the country.

[James Stout]

Yeah. And he seems to be behaving in a way that like, like you said, suggest he has some PTSD or like.

[Garrison Davis]

No PTSD from, from engaging in combat. This is very common among veterans and mental health support for specifically these people in this, in this paramilitary unit probably doesn't exist. Right. It's not exist the same way it does for veterans of the United States military, which already is a lacking service.

[James Stout]

Yeah, yeah, that's. Yeah. I mean these, the shit that these guys did was dark. I've included in the, in the show notes a link to a Human Rights Watch report, but like there's a reason that they weren't specifically under, in theory they were under the, the Afghan like Ministry of Defense command But in practice, they operated outside either chain of control. They did kill or capture missions. There are multiple reports of them killing everybody in a house and then it being the wrong house. Like, really stuff that is going to stay with someone. Right. Unless they're like, you know, pretty nuts.

[Garrison Davis]

No. Extremely horrifying.

[James Stout]

Yeah. Terrifying stuff. Pretty much immediately after the Trump administration.

Began calling for various immigration restrictions. Based on this, right now, it's worth noting that Luckenwell entered the United States as part of Operation Allied Welcome. Right. But then he received asylum under the Trump administration. So that would have been this year. Right. Like, I'm not entirely sure why he went asylum rather than Special Immigrant Visa. And both the pathways that are open to Afghan people.

[Garrison Davis]

Right.

[James Stout]

SOV has some benefits, but also it has some different things that they'd have to jump through. Like one of them would be, I believe, to get an officer to write a recommendation. And maybe CIA folks aren't into doing that. So following this, the US Immediately began to call for a crackdown on Afghan migrants. And as we'll see more broadly on migrants, I think it's important to contextualize this globally because it's part of a crackdown on a nation which has seen nearly half a century of war. Right. 90% of the 10 million people who fled Afghanistan reside in Pakistan or Iran. I've reported on this before on this show, but Iran has deported more than a million Afghan people since 2023. Right. And they have very few pathways to permanent residency anywhere. Like among refugees, Afghan people have it particularly difficult. On Tuesday, the U.S. cIS Citizenship and Immigration Services issued a memo ordering its employees to place on hold all asylum green card and citizenship form applications from quote, unquote, high risk countries and to investigate all arrivals from them since 2021. They are also placing a hold on all Forms I589, which is the application for asylum and for withholding of removal, regardless of where the person is from. Right. So we have this specific halt on asylum for Afghan nationals. Who comes first? And then following that, we have these 19 high risk countries. The high risk countries are listed in Presidential Proclamation 10949, which was issued back in June. I'll just read out the names. So people are Afghanistan, Burma, Chad, Republic of the Congo, Equatorial Guinea, Eritrea, Haiti, Iran, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Yemen, Burundi, Cuba, Laos, Sierra Leone, Togo, Turkmenistan and Venezuela. If you recall us covering this back then, you will remember that the reason cited in that proclamation is percentage of visa overstays. This doesn't have anything to do with risk. Right. Other than risk of overstaying one's visa. They do not justify the inclusion of these countries based on the potential for people there to do terrorism. Right. At least not all of them. Yeah, it's worth pointing out, I guess, that percentage visa overstays isn't that useful of a figure because if you have 10 people and one overstays, then that's only one person. But it's also a 10% overstay rate. Right. So it doesn't look at raw numbers. Nonetheless, this would mean from the way I'm reading it, that any application with these people on it might be paused. So that could include like if someone had applied to have a spouse or family member come over and obtain legal status. Right. Or if someone was sponsoring someone and they were a dual national, they're like a Burundian American, for example. We will see how long this lasts. Trump has previously failed to get a total asylum ban, but for the meantime, this is catastrophic for people attempting to seek asylum or permanent residency in the US the only sort of upside that I can see on an upside but not terrible thing is that I don't think this would pause the work permit clock. So people have been listening to my series this week. They will have learned about the work permit clock because this is government action, not an action from individuals. I don't think it will pause that clock. I guess to just wrap up the migrant crackdown stuff. Trump announced via a truth that quote, I am as president of the United States hereby terminating, effective immediately, the temporary protected status program for Somalis in Minnesota. In the Thanksgiving message, he also repeated a number of claims about migrants and used a slur to describe Tim Walls.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah, he called him R word. And I think it is worth saying.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

He has reiterated this multiple times on camera when asked by reporters.

[James Stout]

Yeah, great stuff.

[Garrison Davis]

And this is specifically in reference to reporting which has come out of Minnesota about a series of like fraudulent claims based on like COVID 19 food and housing assistance programs this state was running and people who were abusing those programs for their own financial benefit. And some of these specific instances are now being used to attack the entire Somali community in Minnesota.

[James Stout]

Yeah. It's worth noting that the percentage of the Somali community which is on TPS is very small. It's probably a few hundred people. I don't know how those Covid assistance programs like overlap with one's immigration status. Right. But it's worth noting that it's also worth noting, like I've linked to the statute in the show notes, the Somali TPS extends until March of 20, 26. It probably won't be renewed then.

[Garrison Davis]

Right.

[James Stout]

That's what the Trump administration has been doing is sunsetting tpss for all kinds of people. The statute does not give the President power to, to end the tps, certainly not on a state by state basis.

[Garrison Davis]

Right, yeah, that's a good point.

[James Stout]

The notice of revocation would appear in the Federal register and the TPS would then have 60 days. If it was being revoked, the people would have 60 days to act on that information. Right. You can't just post it. That's not how this works. As of today, when I checked the Federal Register, the last entry for the Somali TPS was its renewal last year. So there appears to have been no actual legal action taken on this. But nonetheless there has been ICE enforcement. Right. There are videos of ICE officers specifically asking people if they are Somali in Minnesota, which is troubling. I think that's about all the ICE crackdown stuff I have. Guess Greg Bevino's in Louisiana now. So there's been a lot of discussion this week and House hearings about the drone strike that began the United States campaign of drone strikes against small boats in both the Caribbean and the Pacific.

[Garrison Davis]

Right. So called narco terrorists, James.

[James Stout]

Yeah, so, yeah, I think so called is doing a lot of work there. There seems to be a lot of debate about whether Pete Hegsest directly ordered a second strike on survivors from the first strike. Heges denied this saying, quote, the thing was on fire and it exploded. You can't see anything. This is called the fog of war.

[Garrison Davis]

That's not the fog of war. Yeah, it's not what it means.

[James Stout]

You're not at war. You're in a suit in a room watching a TV screen.

[Garrison Davis]

It doesn't refer to like literal smoke and fog. I'm sorry, this is like absurd.

[James Stout]

Yeah, this is a ludicrous claim, Right? Yes. There have been times where I have been in places. Like for instance, I was in Rojava a couple of years ago and we were being bombed. Right. The way for me to get information, it was better for me to like go online and find stuff because the access to information on the ground in conflict times can be difficult. That is not the case when you're in D.C. watching a screen readout.

[Garrison Davis]

Right.

[James Stout]

That is why we have people who are not in combat making these decisions. The White House has claimed that Admiral Bradley, who was JSOC commander at the time, ordered the strike. Tom Cotton today claimed that two people in the video were trying to roll the boat to get back in the fight.

[Garrison Davis]

What?

[James Stout]

That's not a thing that one can do. Like, they're not in. Just to be clear, they're not in, like a kayak here. Like, this is in what I would call a cigarette boat. Like, like a fast speedboat. You can't roll those like that.

[Host/Announcer]

I don't understand.

[Garrison Davis]

They were not engaged in combat?

[James Stout]

No. Like, I don't see any evidence that these people were equipped to, like, certainly not to fight against a drone. Right.

[Garrison Davis]

No, I guess. Why does this matter? Right. Because these people are dead regardless.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

Why does the emphasis on this second strike matter more than simply attacking them the first time? Why is. Could this result in Hegseth being in a degree of trouble? Why are they so defensive about the second strike?

[James Stout]

Fair question. It is a very clear violation of the US Military's own law of War manual, which I have linked and the Geneva Conventions. To kill someone who's demonstrably hors de combat.

[Garrison Davis]

Right.

[James Stout]

Like out of combat, I. E. A shipwrecked sailor, I. E. A wounded soldier who's thrown away their weapon. These people were very clearly not fighting. From every report that we've seen, this has been part of the way that war is conducted for centuries. Picking up shipwrecked sailors after sinking a boat, etc. I'm not saying this has always happened. The US has done double tap strikes for a long time.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah.

[James Stout]

There has been. I should just clarify. I guess there has been some debate about the semantics of the word double tap. First of all, that's not important. What is important is that they killed people who were not fighting, who are out of combat, and who are clinging to a burning shipwrecked boat. A double tap does generally refer to a strike and then a subsequent strike which is focused on killing the people who came to rescue the people hit in the first strike. There was no one to rescue these people. But I don't think that, like, that's. That's not what's at stake here.

[Garrison Davis]

Right.

[James Stout]

That. That is. It doesn't matter what term we use to describe this other than war crime. There were double trap strikes at the time that I spoke about when I was in Rojava, where they did bomb ambulance crews. And. Yeah, that is absolutely reprehensible. But what happened here is also reprehensible as it's being recounted to us. Eventually this video will come out, I'm sure. More broadly, the United States seems to be signaling intent to continue its campaign against Maduro, saying it will begin land strikes, quote, unquote, soon.

[Garrison Davis]

What?

[James Stout]

Yeah. Like, this is Extremely worrying.

[Garrison Davis]

Right.

[James Stout]

Like yeah, Trump, of course, the great peace president who has ended what is it, like nine wars?

[Garrison Davis]

Trump the Dove, I think is what he prefers to be called.

[James Stout]

Sure. Okay, perfect. It's a hell of a visual. Um, the people of Venezuela are the ones who are going to suffer. Right? Like it's not going to be regime officials for the most part.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah.

[James Stout]

Venezuela is a vast, mountainous, jungley country. It's an easy place for us to do land war. Not a particularly easy place for us to do drone warfare either. You know, I've written a lot about the, the United States drone campaign in Syria and the disaster that was. Right. And the amount of, of what they consider to be acceptable civilian casualties. We don't have any indications from this DoD or like from Hegseth that like he will seek to minimize those. Right. Like this, this could be shaping up to be a disaster for the people of Venezuela.

[Garrison Davis]

I mean, yeah, I find it unlikely that Hegseth will actually fall into trouble. International law, because of this, people always get away. And I mean you can see how Trump already hardened number of war criminals earlier this year.

[James Stout]

And in his first administration.

[Garrison Davis]

Right, and in his first administration.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

As much fun as it is to, to be like, haha, I, I'd like to, I'd like to see old pate Hegseth wiggle his way out of this jam.

[James Stout]

Yes, he will.

[Garrison Davis]

I think he's expected to do so quite easily.

[James Stout]

I mean international law doesn't exist for, for people in the global north. It's a thing that they do to prosecute African people for the most part. But yes, very unlikely that we will see Hegseth and the Hague for this. Still bad though.

[Garrison Davis]

We'll go on another ad break and be right back.

[iHeart Advertising Representative]

Run a business and not thinking about podcasting. Think again. More Americans listen to podcasts than ad supported streaming music from Spotify and Pandora. And as the number one podcaster, iHeart's twice as large as the next two combined. So whatever your customers are into true crime, sports, comedy, culture, they'll hear your message. Plus, only Iheart can extend your message to audiences across broadcast radio. And all this reach means everything. Just think about the universal marketing formula. The number of consumers who hear your message times the response rate equals the results. Now let's get those results growing for you. Think podcasting can help your business? Think iHeart streaming radio and podcasting. Let us show you at iHeartadvertising.com that's iHeartadvertising.com or call 844-844 iHeart one more time. Call 844-844-IHeart and get podcasting working for you.

[Ed Helms]

Hey, it's Ed Helms and welcome back to snafu, my podcast about history's greatest screw ups. On our new season, we're bringing you a new snafu. Every single episode.

[Host/Announcer]

32 lost nuclear weapons.

[Garrison Davis]

You're like, wait, stop.

[iHeart Advertising Representative]

What?

[Eliot Khani]

Ernie Shackleton sounds like a solid 70s.

[Ed Helms]

Basketball player who still wore knee pads.

[James Stout]

Yes.

[Ed Helms]

It's gonna be a whole lot of history, a whole lot of funny, and a whole lot of guests. The great Paul Scheer made me feel good. I'm like, oh, wow, Angela and Jenna.

[Garrison Davis]

I am.

[Ed Helms]

I am so psyched you're here.

[Host/Announcer]

What was that like for you to soft launch into the show?

[Ed Helms]

Sorry, Jenna. I'll be asking the questions today.

[Garrison Davis]

I forgot whose podcast we were doing.

[Ed Helms]

Nick Kroll. I hope this story is good enough to get you to toss that sandwich. So let's see how it goes. Listen to season four of SNAFU with Ed Helms on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Host/Announcer]

Jingle bells, jingle bells Jingle all the way.

[James Stout]

Yo, yo.

[Ed Helms]

Can we get a Thanksgiving first?

[Garrison Davis]

I'm hungry.

[Host/Announcer]

Hey, y', all, it's Kadeen and Deval, the hosts of Ellis Ever after podcast.

[Ed Helms]

This holiday season, whether you're cooking for the family, out buying gifts for the.

[Host/Announcer]

Kids, or crowded in holiday traffic, tune out the noise and tune in to to Ellis Ever After.

[Ed Helms]

On Ellis Ever after, we get real with our crew about family. If you feeling like you feeling that's.

[Garrison Davis]

Probably cause you a good parent friendship.

[Ed Helms]

Be careful what you put in your body. Move your body and love it the way you love them cars, that house.

[Garrison Davis]

Them clothes, them shoes, love yourself, them.

[Ed Helms]

Brunches, love and marriage.

[Host/Announcer]

You know what's become attractive to me? And it's because I've self corrected and I guess I detoxified myself myself. Accountability, like it has become mad attractive. So attractive to me and everything else in between. I've told my most embarrassing moment on this podcast before, which was me taking a in a Ziploc bag.

[Ed Helms]

So listen to Ellis Ever after on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[James Stout]

It's okay not to be okay sometimes.

[Ed Helms]

And be able to build strength and love within each other.

[Eliot Khani]

Thanksgiving isn't just about food. It's a day for us to show up for one another. I'm Eliot Khani, host of the podcast Family Therapy, a series where real families come together to heal and Find hope. What would be a clue that would be like. I've gotten lots of text messages from him. This one's from a little bit better.

[Host/Announcer]

Of a version of him because he's feeding himself well. It's always a concern, like, are you eating well?

[Garrison Davis]

He's actually an amazing cook.

[James Stout]

There was this one time where we had neighbors and I saved their dog and I ended up inviting them over for food. And that was like, one of my proudest moments.

[Eliot Khani]

This is family therapy. Real families, real stories on a journey to heal together. Listen to season two of family Therapy every Wednesday on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Garrison Davis]

All right, we are back. We would like to now expand and clarify some of our previous, previous discussion of Zoron's White House meeting with Donald Trump and some statements around ICE raids and ICE detainers. Let's start by clarifying this 170 serious crimes number.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

While answering a question, Zoran said, quote, we discussed ICE and New York City, and I spoke about how the laws we have in New York City allow the city government to speak to the federal administration about roughly 170 serious crimes, unquote. This 170 number is in reference to Local Law 58, Administrative Code 9 dash 131, which was passed in 2014 and strengthened new York's sanctuary laws and required that they only honor ICE detainers when presented with a judicial warrant issued by an Article 3 federal judge or federal magistrate judge based on probable cause, and when the subject of the detainer and warrant is either listed in a terrorist database or has been convicted of a violent or serious crime. Now, the term violent or serious crime refers to a list of approximately 170 crimes which is listed in Local Law 54.

[James Stout]

I think there's a five year limit as well. Right. Like, it has to be within five years.

[Garrison Davis]

So there's a number of, of like.

[James Stout]

They like, stack on each other.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah. Like there's, there's, this is just a, one of, of many, like, amendments strengthening their sanctuary laws. And I'm mentioning it specifically to Clarify where this 170 number comes from and where people can find all of their criminal codes that are listed, which is again, approximately 170 crimes.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

And the change that this local law did is that this person does not have to just be accused of one of these crimes, but actually be convicted or listed in a terrorist database.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

And these are mostly like violent felonies.

[James Stout]

Yeah. The law that Garrison refers to lists them by penal code number. So I'm working on expanding those into a list of, like, words that human beings can understand.

[Host/Announcer]

Yeah, sure.

[James Stout]

Just because I think people generally don't understand sanctuary protection. The sanctuary laws are not like a. They're not the same in every state. They're not the same in every city in every state. And I think a lot of people have an understanding of them which could do with being improved. So I'm going to probably do a whole episode on that. I think with regard to the. The list of crimes in New York, I would prefer to do that as a print piece because it's just better if someone could find it on the Internet. And that doesn't work as well with podcasts. Other stuff regarding this, just so people are aware. Right. Like federally, one could be deported for a huge range of crimes, from violent crime to theft over $10,000 to a vast range of quote, unquote crimes involving moral turpitude. The problem, of course, is that we have 50 different states with 50 different sets of laws and we have to map federal regulations onto them. There is some Supreme Court case law about how we do that. Crimes involving moral turpitude can be things that you might consider extraordinarily minor, like turnstile hopping. Yeah. I'm going to do a whole episode on these because again, I think you could see in that press conference. So when Zoran spoke about immigration, Trump tried to move the topic to deporting criminals.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah.

[James Stout]

And the people who are being deported as criminals. Whilst the DHS Twitter feed wants to highlight people who've been convicted of murder and things that. That's by far like an edge case.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah. And I think that's why he mentioned the 170, like serious surveillance crimes and like, specifically that those are the ones that the New York sanctuary laws do have this quote, unquote, cooperation on. And like in. In a meeting, Zoran said that he and Trump talked about how current ICE operations in New York City have, quote, unquote, very little to do with serious crime. With these, with the crimes listed on these detainers.

[James Stout]

Yeah. And that's a broad thing across the United States. Right. Like even, you know, we spoke about this a couple of weeks ago, but like, if you look at Charlotte, right. Where they have. They are legally bound to honor all ice detainers by HB10, you've still got ICE out and about raiding people and you have sheriffs complaining about ICE not picking people up. Right. The detainer. I guess I should explain what a detainer is as well. A detainer is an extra 48 hour hold. It doesn't mean that you just, like, lock them up forever. It means that you hold them for 48 hours such that ice can come in and collect the person. Because ice is so focused on, I don't know what you want to call it, grabbing people off the street. It seems that they're not collecting these people. There's been some pushback on straight up economic grounds in some states because detaining people is quite expensive. Right. So detaining people for long periods of time and ICE just not showing up, I can see how not to give support to sheriff's departments or whatever, but, like, rural sheriff's departments, which are on limited budgets, would start to get pissed off after a time about holding people. But, yeah, that is what a detainer is.

[Host/Announcer]

Got it.

[James Stout]

ICE doesn't necessarily have to abide by local sanctuary laws. And what we have seen is that, like, cops are cops and they will make mistakes, and if someone gets handed over, you can't take them back if the cops fuck that up.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah. I mean, this is part of the other things that Zurong campaigned on to, like, strengthen sanctuary protections. And specifically, in the section of his policies on, quote, unquote, Trump proofing New York City, he talks about, like, ending illegal ICE cooperation on Rikers island, where ICE is currently stationed, which does go against sanctuary laws. And you talked about ending that, as well as providing $165 million in funding for immigration legal defense services in the cities, which would be a massive increase than what is currently provided.

[James Stout]

Yes.

[Garrison Davis]

As well as just, like, limiting interactions with police.

[James Stout]

Right.

[Garrison Davis]

Because the more you interact with the police, the more likely is that you might accidentally or quote, unquote, accidentally get put into trouble, even though, you know, police in New York are not supposed to ever ask someone that what their immigration status is or. Or cooperate with ICE requests that do not, you know, fall under these. This. This specific container law. But I mean, in terms of, like, ways to limit interactions with police, this goes back to some very basic ideas on, like, you know, addressing the economic conditions that create crime in the first place, as well as the Department of Community Safety, which Zoran intends to create, which will provide new mental health services, crisis response, and homeless outreach outside of the nypd.

[James Stout]

Yeah, like not criminalizing homelessness and not criminalizing parking are probably two of the most meaningful things that you can do to limit police interaction. Specifically police interactions from documented people.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah. And I mean, in terms of, like, turnstile hopping or, like, fare evasion, it's, it's complicated in New York. I mean, this isn't going to be a. Something that they honor a detainer for. But in terms of like, you know, just talking about like the. Yeah. How weird and specific each state's laws are. Like, turnstile hopping can be a misdemeanor crime in New York due to, due to like theft of services. It can also just be a civil infracture. It can in it. But it's up to the officer to decide whether they want this to turn into a criminal misdemeanor or a civil infracture and just pay a hundred dollar fine. Even. This has like, caused confusion among like immigrants and immigrant rights attorneys over like dealing with like old, old fare evasion cases and being like, does this now like disqualify me from certain things or does this like, you know, present a threat of being deported if I, if I declare this in like whatever, like citizenship or the green card meeting they may, they may have scheduled.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

And yeah, not, not criminalizing fare evasion would be huge. And, and if someone's able to make, you know, free buses, that'll do, you know, a considerable dent in preventing cases where far evasion could be used as like a pretext to federally deport someone.

[James Stout]

Yeah, yeah. Because that person or that person could leave New York and be somewhere else. Right. Or they could just get swept up in ice. Workplace raid. And that could be used as a, as a pretext. Like there are many reasons why even if it's sanctuary protected, that person could still be vulnerable because of that prosecution, like you said.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah. I mean, and those sorts of raids are still happening in New York. An attempted raid happened in Canal Street.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

Last week. It was prevented from being carried out by people who literally blocked ICE from leaving the parking garage that they were in. And NYPD then arrested a few protesters. It remains to be seen how Zoron will handle incidents like this going forward. He still does not become the mayor for about 30 days. Right. But a spokesperson for the mayor elect has said that Soren, quote, has made it clear, including to the president, that these raids are cruel and inhumane and fail to advance genuine public safety. New York city's more than 3 million immigrants are central to our city's strength, vitality and success. The mayor elect remains steadfast in his commitment to protecting the rights and dignity of every single New Yorker, upholding our sanctuary laws and de escalation rather than use of unnecessary force, unquote. I believe that last sentence could be read as in reference to the police conduct while handling anti ites protests.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

Quote, unquote de escalation rather than use of unnecessary force. But this is not something that they have talked about much.

[Host/Announcer]

Curious to see when he's actually the mayor, what will happen here.

[James Stout]

Yeah, yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

I mean, that's, that's, that's a part of, like, what governing is going to look like in this case, which is just kind of.

[Host/Announcer]

Sure.

[Garrison Davis]

It's hard to say. We've never really had a high profile, like, you know, DSA person who previously advocated like, defunding or abolishing the police become the mayor of the city.

[Host/Announcer]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

And I think this kind of relates to like, so much of what the project in New York is around New York City, DSA and Zoron to rather than just like, you know, be like chasing electoral cars and then crashing once you have control. Exorin's more interested in like, actually running the city and providing a legitimate example that democratic socialist policies can deliver on promises for workers and improve life in New York. And if this project succeeds, it can be pointed to and replicated by others. And there's a very strict focus on, like, making sure that he's able to succeed on a section of like, economic policies. He's not in a federal position. Right. He's not running on abolishing isis. He can't as the mayor of New York. And like, I think it's very unclear right now, like, what a politics of abolishing ICE really looks like outside of like this, like, contemplative, like, reflexive and like judgmental politics which falls further and further away from, like, taking steps to do action. Right, Yeah.

[James Stout]

I mean, politics, abolishing ICE looks like the United States up until 2001. Right. Like, we didn't have ICE.

[Garrison Davis]

Well, but like, from now, like, what would it mean to actually stop deportations completely? Like, what will that look like? What can be done politically to do that? Right. And Zorin's not doing this because Zoran's the mayor of New York City. He cannot run for president. People in his orbit could run for the House and Senate and push forward bills to do this, and they might over time, but, like, there is a difference between being the mayor of a local municipality and like, what a legitimate politics of, of actually stopping our current process of deportations. What that really looks like and how to actually achieve that which very little thought is being put put towards among the American left right now. And it, and it kind of, it falls back on these, like, reflective or like, contemplative statements.

[James Stout]

Yeah. There have been proposals put forward for a long time on what it would look like to create better legal pathways and fewer deportations. Right. Like those have existed.

[Garrison Davis]

Sure.

[James Stout]

Like, you can look specifically at what people were trying to get Biden to do in 2020. Right. Which he obviously completely failed to do. Yeah. And in fact made things much worse. But, like, those policy proposals exist and they're well thought out and well planned from people who've been working in the space for decades. Right. What Mamdani can do is like, what they call in political science, like, the coattails effect.

[Garrison Davis]

Totally.

[James Stout]

Right. As a very popular candidate, people can ride on his coattails. And I think it's important in that sense that he continues rhetorically to oppose what ICE is doing, which, like that statement you read, did. Right. But it's very important that he, if he's able to successfully have his administration in New York and like, we, we will see how goes in that regard. But if he is and there is an electoral project that can arise based on that, then, like, yeah, it is very important that they remain in lockstep that, like, we are not going back. We're not going to have a Democrat come President 28 and just do a Joe Biden again. Right. Where things get worse. Like. Yeah. So in that sense, I think it, like, it needs to be something that everyone in that movement retains. I guess, like, not uniformity is the wrong word. You know, but you know what I mean, it continues to be something of a North Star for whatever is emerging to the left of the dnc.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah. And like, I also, like, I guess clarify some things I would have said last week and not claiming that sheerly the, the process of honoring these detainers will, like, vaguely, in a causal sense, results in less ICE raids in the city. I mean, these detainers are, they are legally required even under the sanctuary laws, to be. To be followed. And I think part of what Zorro was doing was trying to redirect the president's thought away from these larger raids to these specific serious crimes. And I think in some of this is based on Trump kind of has like, the last person in the room syndrome of he kind of just likes or, or, or, or follows or parrots whoever the last person in the room was and like what they told him. I'm not saying that, like, honoring these, these legally required detainers is like, is simply harm reduction in that sense. This is more so in reference to the ongoing negotiations between Mamdani and Trump to limit ICE action in the city outside of these Detainer requests, which do address serious crime, which Trump and Mamdani saw as a point of commonality on is they. They want New York to be a safe place for people focusing on that as opposed to these general ICE raids. And there's been, like, some slight movement on this. Raids have continued, but there's been slight movement in terms of Trump, at least for now, pulling out of his plans to deploy National Guard to assist ice. And like, that is the. The single point where we see some movement on.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

And this will be something that in terms of raids like on Canal Street. Well, we'll see if this actually makes a larger impact once he takes office and continues these negotiations.

[James Stout]

If National Guard are assisting ice, is that like, because they can't directly do the immigration enforcement? Right.

[Garrison Davis]

Well, I mean, assisting ICE in the way that they have in Washington, D.C. yeah.

[James Stout]

Like, in terms of like, quote, unquote, protecting officers or quote, unquote. Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

And, you know, the proposals to do so in Chicago and Portland, which are caught in like, legal limbo, but I mean, the Portland was more specifically for the ICE facility.

[James Stout]

Yeah. Protecting federal buildings kind of deal versus.

[Garrison Davis]

In Washington D.C. they were like, on patrol with ICE. Like, they were like, roving around and.

[James Stout]

Doing roadblocks and shit.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah. And like much of this, quote, unquote, crime crackdown, as Bridget's reported on our show, really is actually a way to do like, enhanced immigration enforcement.

[Host/Announcer]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

There's a lot of fear in New York and discussions with people in New York on, like, how are we going to handle this happening here? Yeah. And this is like the one point of movement that we've seen is Trump pulling out of these plans, which previously were quite certain he wants to go one by one and invade these cities.

[James Stout]

Yeah. New York, you also have the added factor that New York is technically in that border enforcement zone. Right.

[Garrison Davis]

As is Chicago.

[James Stout]

Yeah. I guess most of these places have been Chicago. Portland is Los Angeles is because of the Los Angeles they deployed Border Patrol. That's another thing that it could happen in New York, but thus far hasn't on a massive scale. But yeah, it remains to be seen. Right. Trump has this operation at large that Bovino controls that he could deploy to New York and it'll be deployed to Boston, where Michelle Wu has taken a different approach.

I guess we'll have to continue waiting and seeing. It's really heartening to me that people showed up in New York as well.

[Garrison Davis]

Oh, yeah.

[James Stout]

That people in New York showed up on Canal street like that is.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah. And prevented ICE from doing Any detentions or arrests? Yeah.

[James Stout]

And I think like they, they like like ice eventually had to leave to New Jersey. Is that right? Like they had to go through the. The tunnel or whatever. Like to tunnel?

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah, the tunnel of shame.

[James Stout]

Yeah, yeah. But like that, that is like that is what kept those people safe. Right? Like they didn't have to wait for Eric Adams or Mum Downey or anyone else. Like it was members of their community.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah, yeah.

[James Stout]

Which is cool. Talking of communities, do you want to talk about the campus campus community and how freedom of speech is under threat on our campuses?

[Garrison Davis]

Well, freedom of religion is under threat, James.

[James Stout]

Okay.

[Garrison Davis]

Religion to.

[James Stout]

Freedom to.

[Host/Announcer]

I'm so, so tired. So tired.

[James Stout]

To cite a vibes based interpretation of the religious.

[Garrison Davis]

I mean yeah, this. Unfortunately this story didn't infringe upon my freedom to not read horrible college essays.

[James Stout]

Gary said. That is a freedom that I have not had for many years.

[Garrison Davis]

No, no. And this is why I'm interested in your thoughts on this. A transgraduate instructor has been suspended from the University of Oklahoma after issuing a failing grade to a student's assignment to write a 650 word response to a study on if gender conformity is linked to popularity or bullying in middle school. This 20 year old psychology major, a junior, wrote in her response that she does not consider bullying a problem because quote, God made a male and female and made us different from each other on purpose and for a purpose, unquote.

The response was entirely personal opinion. It does not even properly cite specific like scriptures in the Bible. If like, if I was to write like an unhinged like, like Christian response, the least you could do is cite specific things. Should that be valid? No, but even this was not done.

[Host/Announcer]

It's like Bible fanfic.

[James Stout]

These are the vibes I get from Jesus.

[Garrison Davis]

Well, yeah, she just. She just gestured to her own interpretation of biblical gender roles.

[Host/Announcer]

Right, sure, sure.

[Garrison Davis]

Quote. Women naturally want to do womanly things because God created us with those womanly desires in our heart, unquote.

[James Stout]

She's women like, like females. I guess. Maybe, maybe she was going for.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah, it's. It's all circular reasoning like this all. All based on. Based on these like you know, biblical gender roles. And later the essay goes on to self contradict itself on ideas of gender norms versus gender stereotypes. And it's all just very poorly written. James, did you read the whole essay? No. Okay. It's not, it's not long. We do are not going to read it all on air.

[James Stout]

I'll read it right now.

[Garrison Davis]

I want you to Read the whole thing and just. Just give me.

[James Stout]

Drop it in the chat.

[Garrison Davis]

Your immediate thoughts? I dropped it in the zoom chat.

[James Stout]

You have to understand that I might experience, like, what's called a trauma reaction.

[Garrison Davis]

It's only two pages.

[James Stout]

Okay, so it's based on a review of an article.

[Garrison Davis]

Based on a review of an academic study.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

On if gender conformity impacts bullying or popularity in middle school.

[James Stout]

Okay.

Jesus Christ.

[Garrison Davis]

That's what she said, but not yet.

[James Stout]

She hasn't cited him specifically.

[Garrison Davis]

No, she never cites Jesus.

[James Stout]

Yeah. God.

[Garrison Davis]

Mm.

[James Stout]

Oh, hell yeah. I love it when they get into, like, Hebrew.

[Garrison Davis]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Host/Announcer]

Yes.

[James Stout]

I'm just getting. Penultimate paragraph. What class is this in?

[Garrison Davis]

Psychology. A psychology course.

[James Stout]

I'm gonna sign this for a psychology class.

[Garrison Davis]

Wow.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Host/Announcer]

Can I just read, like, the last part out loud?

[Garrison Davis]

Okay, Sophie, you can. You can read the last part.

[Host/Announcer]

Yeah, yeah. My prayer for the world and specifically for American society and youth is that they would not believe the lies being spread from Satan that make them believe they are better off as another gender than what God made them. I pray that they feel God's love and acceptance as who he originally created them to be.

[James Stout]

So if you really inhabited that role beautifully, like.

[Host/Announcer]

Thank you.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Host/Announcer]

Thank you.

[Garrison Davis]

Previously in, like, the. The paragraph before I.

[Host/Announcer]

Do you want me to do it?

[Garrison Davis]

You could do it, Sophie.

[Host/Announcer]

I unfortunately feel like I could. Really?

[Garrison Davis]

You're gonna be better equipped. Yeah.

[Host/Announcer]

Embody this horrific person. Society pushing the lie that there are multiple genders and everyone should be whatever they want to be is demonic and severely harms American youth. I do not want kids to be.

[Garrison Davis]

Teased or bullied and stuff.

So, James, as a college. College professor, what is your thoughts on this?

[James Stout]

It's just a bad response to the question. Right. There is not a single citation. The person has not done what they were instructed to do. They have just. It's a classic example of that. You have answered the question you wanted me to ask, not the question I have asked genre. And in this case, like, I'm. I'm presuming there was some kind of rubric for grading. Like, it seems like a. Like a. The sort of assignment that you would set once a week. Right. I don't know if it's an online course or they're just using an online lms, but the comment is clearly from an online lms.

[Garrison Davis]

Yeah, they do have the rubric and that TPUSA published. The rubric was that you must write this 650 word reaction paper demonstrating that you have read the assigned article and includes a thoughtful reaction to the material presented in the article. Please remember that your reaction paper should not be a summary but rather a thoughtful discussion of some aspect of the article. Possible approaches to reaction papers include a discussion of why you feel the topic is important and worthy of study or not, or an application of the study or results to your own experiences.

[James Stout]

That's a broad prompt than I had otherwise imagined. Yeah, go ahead.

[Garrison Davis]

Other section is reaction papers are graded on a 25 point scale and are evaluated based on the following. Does the paper show a clear tie to the assigned article? 10 points. Does the paper present a thoughtful reaction or response to the article rather than a summary? 10 points. And is the paper clearly written? 5 points. The best reaction papers illustrate the students have read the assigned materials and engaged in critical thinking about some aspect of the article.

[James Stout]

Yeah, I mean, they. The way you would do that is to reference the article more than in the first line of your paper and then never again.

[Host/Announcer]

Right, sure.

[James Stout]

Which is what this person has done here. At no point do they quote from the article, mention anything specifically the article says other than that it was very thought provoking. And then they've seen the word gender and just gone off like a dog after a squirrel. Right? Yes. And then completely gone off on one about God. Yeah, that's a pretty broad prompt. It's broader than I would generally write a prompt, but that's okay with different approaches. They haven't specifically said in the prompt that they want people to cite their sources, which I normally do, but yeah, they haven't really shown any engagement with the article. Right.

[Garrison Davis]

This isn't a freshman. This isn't a software. This is. This is a junior. Well, well into this semester. The response from the instructor was, quote, please note, I'm not deducting points because you have certain beliefs, but instead I'm deducting points for you. Posting a reaction paper that does not answer the questions for this assignment, contradicts itself heavily, uses personal ideology over empirical evidence in a scientific class, and is at times offensive. While you are entitled to your own personal beliefs, there is an appropriate time or place to implement them in your reflections. I encourage all students to question or challenge the course material with other empirical findings or testable hypotheses. But using your own personal beliefs to argue against the findings of not only this article, but the findings of countless articles across psychology, biology, sociology, et cetera is not best practice. Unquote.

[James Stout]

Yeah, so this is a science class, I guess, right, Leigh? Like this is not a scientific response. It is. Yeah, no, entirely vibes based.

[Garrison Davis]

Before becoming a National news story. This grade was reviewed and approved by another instructor. This isn't just one instructor who happens to be transmitted. This isn't just their personal grade. This was reviewed by another instructor. But on Thanksgiving, TPUSA used this story to start a media blitz targeting this quote unquote mentally ill professor, this graduate student instructor, which has resulted in her being placed on leave. As the university reviews this incident concerning illegal discrimination based on religious beliefs.

[James Stout]

That's not what that is. Right. Like, like I have watched the short form video about discrimination many times over my years instructing students and like this person wasn't discriminated against because of their beliefs. They were discriminated. They weren't discriminated against. They were graded for their response which.

[Garrison Davis]

Was poor for failing to follow the rules of the assignment. And again not, not even as like a freshman who needs more clear like.

[James Stout]

You know, first year at uni.

[Garrison Davis]

Like no. Yeah, this is, this is, this is a psychology major in her junior year.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

Writing this response as a part of. It's as a part of a scientific, as a scientific psychology course where it's not about science at all. You're just talking about your own impression of what God wants out of gender roles and citing. Not, not even citing but like pointing towards the Holy Spirit and the heavenly Father.

[James Stout]

Yeah. And some Hebrew shit that you've translated. I know that most instructors who teach at universities now are very concerned about exactly this. Right. About a student writing a paper which is just bad and then them going to the pretty much TPUSA specifically. Right. And being like, yes, they came against me because they hate Jesus. And I can imagine that that is worse for trans and gender non conforming and otherwise queer instructors from conversations. Right.

[Garrison Davis]

Like no, absolutely. And like TP USA first gained popularity for its like professor watch list where people could report their like woke liberal professors. And this is, this is a core part of the TPUSA model is, is attacking academics and people who work in university in this instant has like caused speculation of like how much of this essay was genuine versus was this intentionally bad essay to provoke this response which we. We can't, we can't.

[James Stout]

You gotta wonder that.

[Garrison Davis]

But the student has like risen to the ranks of like a minor conservative celebrity in these, in these past two weeks.

[James Stout]

Yeah.

[Garrison Davis]

Because of this incident. And is doing like tpusa like speaking. Speaking appearances, news appearances. There's been dozens of articles across right wing outlets on this. It's. It's turned into a legitimate story for them.

[James Stout]

Yeah. I do want to say as well like, it appears Gareth and I discussed this before, but it appears that this person is a grad student and not like a.

[Garrison Davis]

Not a tenured professor.

[James Stout]

Adjunct. Yes. Certainly not tenured. Right, sure. Therefore they are much more vulnerable and they have many fewer protections than a tenured professor would have. I don't know if they're unionized. It depends on where they're teaching.

[Garrison Davis]

Right, but like University of Oklahoma, that is questionable.

[James Stout]

Yeah, I mean, possibilities points to know. But like this is a serious fucking problem for anybody teaching in these fields. Right. Especially graduate students. Like I say, especially. I mean, imagine you're a graduate student on a student visa, right? Like, how do you approach teaching this when you know that you could end up on the tpusa Instagram.

[Garrison Davis]

It's trying to chill speech, right? This is, this is part of what they're doing. They're turning this into a free speech crusade for religious discrimination. But what this is actually doing is chilling speech at universities by making it so that you can't teach certain topics, especially if you happen to be trans yourself. Otherwise tpusa in the right wing media ecosystem is going to turn your life into a living nightmare.

[James Stout]

Yeah, I've repeatedly seen a First Amendment cited in reference to this. This has not got anything to do with the First Amendment. Like the First Amendment doesn't give you the right to get a good grade for saying what the fuck you want. That's, that's not in the First Amendment. But yeah, like Garrison said, it is chilling speech.

[Garrison Davis]

Good news. Oklahoma University Workers United is a union.

[James Stout]

Sick. Okay, cool. And it includes grad student instructors.

[Garrison Davis]

Unclear.

[James Stout]

Okay, hit us up O U W U and let us know.

[Garrison Davis]

Before we close, I do want to mention another story that's happened this week which is going to prompt of a future episode probably next week. The online gambling platform Kalshi. I've never said it before. I'm saying Kalshi has that a serial partnered with Kashi. I don't even know what you're talking about anymore. But the online gambling platform Kalshi is partnered with CNN and CNBC this past week to allow the news companies to use, quote unquote, real time prediction data for TV news segments and online content. This is not entirely surprising if people have been watching CNN like I have, like a complete maniac. Because specifically this, this past November, like this whole election season, news pundits on CNN have been using betting odds in place of polling data to weigh the likelihood of candidates winning elections. This has become an increasingly common practice, specifically at cnn. And now it appears Spreading to other news platforms like cnbc. How she announcement of the CNN partnership reads. Quote, CNN chief data analyst Harry Entin is an expert in translating what data and polling are saying on any given issue. And through this integration he can tap into real time prediction markets data to better inform and fact check his reporting, unquote. What? Back checking his reporting with gambling data. Gambling odds from people who are betting on. Like if people are going to starve in Gaza. Right. This is the sort of, this is the sort of stuff that they, they bet on on Kalish. Not just who wins elections. Absurd.

[James Stout]

Jesus.

[Host/Announcer]

I like that you've pronounced the name of this company several different.

[Garrison Davis]

See, I used to call it Khalif. This is the problem. I think it's. I think it's Kalshee. I think, I think Kalshee is correct. Yeah.

[James Stout]

There is one possible benefit to this. Will it stop Nate Silva being so fucking annoying?

[Garrison Davis]

No, it'll cause it to be more annoying. James. How can you not see that? This is, this is a part of the nature silverification of everything. And this is, this is what I want to talk about in the full piece. But no, There was a Cena News segment in October 2025 where this data analyst talked about how the odds of Democrats winning the midterms are going down via citing the Cauchy odds. And then he did like three minutes of analysis using selective midterm voting data from 2017 and 2018 to support the movement in the gambling odds. Like that was the core piece of data he was trying to explain the fog.

[James Stout]

How big is this marketplace?

[Garrison Davis]

Pretty big.

[James Stout]

Pretty big. Okay. So I couldn't just come in with like 500 bucks and tip it.

[Garrison Davis]

No, no, not. It depends on what you're doing for like these sorts of big, these like big races. No, but part of the real problem is, is if you're just tuning in to CNN and reading the graphics, it's really hard to tell that this, that these are gambling odds. Yeah, you're just seeing big percentages and they, they're only going to mention that it's from quote unquote betting markets or prediction markets, like once at the beginning of the segment. After that they treat the numbers like actual polling data. So it's really, really manipulative. Um, and unless you're like super paying attention to this whole segment, it'd be very easy to interpret these like gambling numbers as genuine. As genuine poll information.

[Host/Announcer]

Wow.

[Garrison Davis]

It's incredibly dangerous to democracy and overall kind of bad and fucked up and it's going to be spreading The Kalshi competitor Poly Market partnered with X the Everything app and Yahoo Finance earlier this year to integrate their quote unquote prediction data into content on X and Yahoo Finance. It's only going to become more and more common.

[Host/Announcer]

Well, you're going to do a long form episode on this.

[Garrison Davis]

I will, yeah.

[James Stout]

This sucks. I'm just looking at this website now. It's bad.

[Host/Announcer]

This sucks. I don't like this at all.

[James Stout]

If you would like to email us, you can do so by reaching out to to coolzonetipssroton me.

[Garrison Davis]

That does it for us that it could happen here. We reported the news and now you can bet on the news. We reported the news.

[Host/Announcer]

It could happen Here is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from Cool Zone Media Media, Visit our website coolzonemedia.com or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can now find sources for it could happen here listed directly in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.

What do you think makes the perfect snack?

[James Stout]

Hmm, it's gotta be when I'm really.

[Ed Helms]

Craving it and it's convenient.

[James Stout]

Could you be more specific when it's cravenient? Okay, like a freshly baked cookie made.

[Ed Helms]

With real butter available right down the.

[James Stout]

Street at am pm. Or a savory breakfast sandwich I can grab in just a second at AM pm.

[Host/Announcer]

I'm seeing a pattern here.

[James Stout]

Well, yeah, we're talking about what I.

[Garrison Davis]

Crave, which is anything from am pm.

[James Stout]

What more could you want?

[Ed Helms]

Stop by AMPM where the snacks and drinks are perfectly craveable and convenient. That's cravenience AM PM too much good stuff.

[Garrison Davis]

Greatness doesn't just show up. It's built. One shot, one choice, one moment at a time. From NBA champion Stephen Curry comes Shot Ready. A powerful never before seen look at the mindset that changed the game. I fell in love with the grind.

[Ed Helms]

You have to find joy in the.

[James Stout]

Work you do when no one else is around.

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Success is not an accident.

[Garrison Davis]

I'm passing the ball to you. Let's go. Steph Curry redefined basketball. Now he's rewriting what it means to succeed. Shot Ready isn't just a memoir. It's a playbook for anyone chasing their potential. Discover stories, strategies and over 100 never before seen photos. Order shot ready [e-mail] don't miss Stephen Curry's New York Times bestseller Shot Ready available now.

[Eliot Khani]

Thanksgiving isn't just about food. It's a day for us to show up for one another.

[Ed Helms]

It's okay not to be okay sometimes and be able to build strength and love within each other.

[Eliot Khani]

I'm Elliot Khani, host of the podcast Family Therapy, a series where real families come together to heal and find hope.

[Host/Announcer]

I've always wanted us to have therapy.

[Garrison Davis]

So this is such a beautiful opportunity.

[Eliot Khani]

Listen to season two of Family Therapy every Wednesday on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Garrison Davis]

Wishing the holidays could come early. If you own or manage your business, they can. With help from iHeartradio. People are already shopping for their loved ones and hunting for deals wherever they can find them, including right here. They're listening to the radio. They're listening to podcasts. They could be listening to you. Don't wait for everyone else to kick off the holidays. Get your best season of the year up and running today. Call 844-844-IHEART or visit iheartadvertising.com.

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[Host/Announcer]

Guaranteed human.