It Could Happen Here – "Trump’s Hepatitis Vaccine Lies"
October 9, 2025, Cool Zone Media & iHeartPodcasts

Episode Overview

In this episode, host Mia Wong sits down with Dr. Kaveh Hoda (hepatologist, co-host of House of Pod) to unpack the latest surge of disinformation and policy destruction in U.S. public health, particularly focusing on falsehoods about the hepatitis B vaccine promoted by President Trump and RFK Jr. The conversation explores how anti-vaccine ideology has moved from the fringe to federal policy, the devastating real-world impact of these changes, and the bizarre rabbit holes of recent public statements on vaccines and public health.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Collapse of U.S. Public Health (04:08–05:56)

• Systematic Dismantling: Mia frames the episode as a revisit to ongoing coverage of the “annihilation of the entire US medical establishment at the federal level,” now being overseen by “fringe anti-vaccine cranks.”
  • “It is being systematically dismantled…and are now running like, the most sophisticated…public health institutions that have ever existed.” (Mia, 04:16)
• The Importance of Chaos: Dr. Hoda acknowledges the backdrop of “chaos” as the only reasonable response to the present state of things, both as catharsis and as a public duty.

The Anti-Vax Playbook: MMR and Autism Myths Resurface (05:52–09:20)

• Trump and RFK Jr.'s Announcements: Both made widely covered, baffling claims that vaccines cause autism and ADHD, leveraging disproven studies and conspiracy thinking.
• Trump's MMR Remarks: Trump suggested again that the MMR (measles, mumps, rubella) vaccine should be split into three separate shots.
  • “Trump actually really harped on vaccines and his thoughts, his medical opinion, and his advice on how to manage vaccines. It’s truly bizarre.” (Dr. Hoda, 06:31)
  • Key Fact Check: No medical evidence supports splitting the MMR vaccine; doing so increases the risk of missed doses and outbreaks.
  • “The more you split these things up, the more likely you’re gonna end up missing doses…measles is bad. Lower vaccination rates quickly lead to outbreaks.” (Dr. Hoda, 07:14)
• Wakefield’s Discredited Study: Mia briefly reviews Andrew Wakefield’s fraudulent study, clarifying the original split-vaccine claim was for self-interest—Wakefield tried to sell his own vaccine.
  • "It's literally an industrial complex...They're all trying to sell you something. That's the whole thing." (Mia, 09:04)

Media Manipulation and Dilution (09:54–11:14)

• Clip-Editing of Trump: Both note that media outlets often over-edit Trump’s rambling vaccine statements, making him appear more coherent than reality for manageability and palatability.
  • “The version people are seeing is not the version where he’s just sort of completely ranting incoherently…” (Mia, 11:09)
• Fire Hose of Nonsense: Dr. Hoda coins the phrase for the unrelenting barrage of misleading info.
  • “The fire hose in this of Nonsense. Yeah, Title of my first album, Fire Hose of Nonsense.” (Dr. Hoda, 11:21)

Trump’s Hepatitis B Vaccine Misinformation (16:55–19:47)

Fundamental Misunderstandings

• Trump’s False Claim: Trump asserted hepatitis B is solely sexually transmitted, suggesting infants don’t need the vaccine—pushing for the vaccine only at age 12.
  • “He talked about breaking up the hepatitis B vaccine…things that doctors would have a little pause to say so strongly.” (Dr. Hoda, 17:55)
• Science Reality: Dr. Hoda explains hepatitis B is transmitted not only through sex or needles but also commonly mother-to-child during birth, through household contacts, shared razors or toothbrushes, and more.
  • “There are other modes of transmission for getting hepatitis B, not just sex, like Trump was saying. So I think that’s super important to be clear.” (Dr. Hoda, 24:51)

What Hepatitis B Really Is

• Education Segment:
  • Hepatitis B = viral inflammation of the liver, millions affected worldwide.
  • Serious impacts include chronic infection (especially if contracted as an infant), cirrhosis, liver cancer, and lifelong consequences.
  • “If you get it when you’re young and your immune system is not super robust…it’s very likely about 90% or more…you’ll get chronic infection from it.” (Dr. Hoda, 20:50)
  • The vaccine, introduced for infants in 1991, led to a 94% decrease in U.S. children and adolescent infection rates by 2004—a major public health victory.

Bizarre Policy Proposals

• Age 12 Vaccination?
  • Trump’s reasoning presumes children do not contract hepatitis B in non-sexual ways—a dangerous, scientifically invalid premise.
  • “Why does he think that's okay then? Does he think that kids are having sex at the age of 12 and that's okay? Why did 12 become the number for him?” (Dr. Hoda, 27:01)
• Stigma as Policy Tool: Mia notes the stigmatization angle: using the “sexually transmitted” label to rationalize rolling back childhood vaccination.

Consequences of Delaying or Limiting Vaccination

• Delaying (as with MMR) leads to more missed doses and declining immunity, increasing outbreaks.
• “The more likely you are to not do it at all and have decreased uptake.” (Dr. Hoda, 28:33)

Who’s Running the Show Now? RFK Jr., Dr. Marty Makary, and the ‘Second Hell’ of Appointments (37:45–41:51)

• RFK Jr. at HHS:
  • “My line on it was millions will die and we are so incredibly on track for millions to die from just this guy and his people being put in charge.” (Mia, 40:14)
• Dr. Marty Makary at FDA:
  • Known for the misleading claim that medical errors are the #3 cause of death in the US—a factoid with questionable data and enormous persistence in anti-vax circles.
  • “It's like the herpes of medical misinformation because it always comes back. No matter how many times it gets disproven…” (Dr. Hoda, 39:01)
  • This anti-intellectual, contrarian style replaces even the previous era’s “incompetent but passive” agency heads with active disassemblers: “How wild it is that we long for the days of Rick Perry.” (Dr. Hoda, 37:21; Mia, 37:25)
• Bottomless Barrel:
  • "The bar is so low that, like, you have to go digging to get under the bar….The bar truly is below hell. There’s like a second hell down there…” (Mia, 41:26)

Silver Linings and Hopeful Notes (42:47–45:11)

• Get Vaccinated: Dr. Hoda encourages everyone to pursue all available recommended vaccines, despite mounting institutional obstacles.
• On Questioning Science:
  • Not all public skepticism is bad; scientific discourse requires nuance, honest curiosity, and patient exploration. The Tylenol-autism question had some foundation for scientific exploration, but evidence disproved a causal link.
  • “I encourage people to…find trusted sources and look at those and learn about them yourself…There is some good coming from this.” (Dr. Hoda, 44:48)
• Power in Numbers:
  • “There are more of us than there are of them. There always have been…we can be that reversal one person at a time.” (Mia, 45:11)

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On the Firehose of Misinformation:

  • “The fire hose in this of Nonsense. Yeah, Title of my first album, Fire Hose of Nonsense.” (Dr. Hoda, 11:21)

• On Vaccine Policy Changes:

  • “If you didn’t know that there was another means of transmission, what he said is reasonable…But it’s just wrong.” (Dr. Hoda, 29:49)

• On Public Health Leadership:

  • “We put the worst people in charge of quite possibly the most important part of our country.” (Dr. Hoda, 40:07)

• On Social Hope:

  • “I see more and more people who care about science…there are bright spots out there, and that’s what I cling to.” (Dr. Hoda, 44:48)
  • “Their ability to shape the world is disastrous…but as a minoritarian force…is always going to be limited and is always going to be in danger of simply being reversed.” (Mia, 45:11)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Annihilation of Medical Establishment: 04:08–05:56
• Breakdown of Trump’s Vaccine Lies (MMR): 06:13–09:20
• Media’s Role in Shaping Perceptions: 09:54–11:14
• Trump’s Hepatitis B Vaccine Statements: 16:55–19:47
• What Hepatitis B Really Is: 19:47–25:07
• Modes of Transmission & Why Childhood Vaccination Matters: 25:29–28:33
• RFK Jr., Marty Makary, and Collapse of Medical Authority: 37:45–41:51
• Silver Linings & Civic Engagement: 42:47–45:49

Tone & Style

The atmosphere is darkly comic, sardonic, and frequently incredulous, befitting the theme of “collapse as it happens.” Mia’s dry, almost gallows-humor approach is balanced by Dr. Hoda’s more earnest medical perspective, but both share a palpable frustration veined with determination and hope.

Summary: This episode pulls back the curtain on how fringe pseudoscience has not only infiltrated but overtaken frontline public health policy, focusing on the immediate dangers and absurdities of recent hepatitis B vaccine disinformation from the highest levels. It also supplies practical, clear medical information, encourages critical thinking, and holds out hope for grassroots resistance and eventual reversal.