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- [00:00]
Brian Buffini
Give me just a minute. What if I told you you have a jail sentence and you don't even know yet because you haven't showed up to court? This is what it means to be in debt. You're serving your sentence and you haven't even had your trial yet. Let's get straight to it. Debt can feel like it's running the show. It tells you what you can and can't do, where your money goes before you even see it, and how long it'll take to get ahead. And the longer it sticks around, the more normal it starts to feel. But it doesn't have to stay that way. I'm organizing a jailbreak. Stay tuned. Top of the morning to you. I'm Brian Buffini. You know, most people don't end up in debt overnight. And they don't get out of debt overnight either. It tends to build slowly. A decision here, an unexpected expense there, and before you know it, you're juggling payments, feeling stretched, and wondering how it got this far. If that sounds familiar, you're not alone. You're also not stuck. What would your life look like if your money was fully yours again? No payments hanging over your head.
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No.
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No pressure in the background. Just clarity, flexibility, and the ability to make decisions based on where you and your loved ones want to go, not on what you owe. That's what getting out of debt really represents. So this conversation is about more than just numbers. It's about freedom. It's about building a plan that moves you forward and creating habits that keep you there in today's blueprint. Just like in my favorite movie, the Shawshank Redemption, we're going to tunnel our way out of debt and head for our own CE Antoneo called financial freedom. Debt didn't start with banks or credit cards. It started with a simple social Someone gets value now and promises to pay later. Growing up, my favorite cartoon was Popeye. And there was Mr. Wimpy. And he'd always say, I gladly pay a Tuesday for a hamburger today. Exactly what we're talking about with debt. The first clear written evidence of debt comes from ancient Mesopotamia, where clay tablets recorded obligations in goods like barley and later in silver. Centuries later, a debtor's prison was created. A prison for people who were unable to pay their debts. Until the mid 19th century, debtors prisons, they looked awfully like workhouses, were a common way to deal with unpaid debt in Western civilization. In today's world, we have a different prison. Credit cards, car loans, student loans, mortgages, and even your part of the national debt. The average credit card debt in the U.S. today is $6,700 at an average interest rate of 23%. The average car debt is $13,800. The average student loan is 39,500. The average mortgage, 258 grand. That's higher amongst millennials, where it's 320 grand. And your average part of the national debt is $110,000. You didn't know you owed that much, did you? That's why, ultimately, over half a million people file bankruptcy every year. They just want the pain to go away. One of my favorite quotes is, the only man who sticks closer to you in adversity than a friend is a creditor. Charlie Munger. He was Warren Buffett's partner. He said, once you get into debt, it's hell to get out. Don't let credit card debt carry over. You can't get ahead paying 18%. What would old Charlie say if he knew it was 23? Ogden Nash said, some debts are fun when you are acquiring them, but none are fun when you set about retiring them again. We talked about ancient Mesopotamia. Well, the richest man who ever lived wrote a book called Proverbs, and he said, the rich rule over the poor and the borrower is slave to the lender. All pretty depressing stuff. Well, it is if you just stay in it. You know, they say that high blood pressure is the silent killer. When someone has high blood pressure, they don't really feel bad. They don't really notice it on any given day unless they check their blood pressure. And that's the way debt is. You buy things you can pay later. And America's entire consumer economy is built on this. We now have young people today in Gen Z. They're financing T shirts, they're financing concert tickets. It's crazy stuff. I want to give you an example of a man I had a chance to help years ago in San Diego. Here I've done a lot of construction work, and so I'll buy and fix properties. I own a lot of properties myself. And over time, I developed a relationship with a Serbian contractor that led to many, many people in the Serbian community doing work for me over the past 30 years. So they call me the unofficial mayor of St. Petka's Church here in San Marcos. Well, one of the gentlemen came to me years ago.
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He was a recent immigrant from Serbia,
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and in order to get here, he had gotten into debt. He hated the idea of being in debt. And I said, well, tell me what your work life's going to look like
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and so on, so forth.
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So he told me he worked for this one contractor during the week, but on Saturdays, he took personal jobs, handyman stuff, contractor work. He averaged working 46 Saturdays a year. So I encouraged him to take every time he worked a Saturday to set that money aside until he was debt free.
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It took him two and a half years.
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As he was getting ready to be debt free, we went for a nice. We had a lunch and a drink, and he said, what should I do now? And I said, keep the exact same formula, only this time, use those Saturdays not to pay off debt, but to actually invest and grow. So over the next 10 years, he invested his money. He bought some great stocks like Apple and Tesla. Nvidia did very, very well, and he just bought his second property for cash. He started out in a hopeless place. He did the work, he set aside the funds. He got out of debt. And then the same way he got out of debt, that same pressure he used to build his fortune. And you can do that, too. So here's my blueprint for getting out of debt. The first thing you do is put all your focus on one debt. Okay, so list out all the debts you have, and then I typically pick the debt with the lowest balance. Now, some people will argue over you should go after the highest interest rates. And that does make sense, except the lower amount does a couple of things for you. It gives you a sense of momentum when you pay it off. The second thing it does is it frees up the amount that you had dedicated to that debt every month into what we call the rollover plan. I'll talk about that in a second. So put all your focus like a laser. I have five debts. I'm going to pay off one. You go, oh, I've got $39,000 in student loans. I have a $14,000 car loan. I have four credit cards, and one of them is 450 bucks. Yeah, get after the $451. Because the second principle of how to get out of debt is a plan that we've used in our coaching program for 30 years with people called the Rollover Plan. Now, I'm going to give you an overview of this, but if you really want to delve into this, we have this brand new website you need to check out. It's called thebrianbafinishow.com it's fantastic. And all 695 past episodes of our podcast are there and they're archived. It's also where if you want to check out, if you're listening to this in an audio format in a podcast, the way you always have. Go there and you can subscribe to this as a YouTube show. And again, if you subscribe to the YouTube show, you'll be able to see it, you'll be able to connect it, and also helps us out greatly. But go there to see the rollover plan, because the rollover plan is this. Let's say I pay off the lower
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credit card debt and it has 50
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bucks a month of a payment. You keep your budget the same, which means you're already allowing for that $50 a month, and then you pay it off against the next debt. So whatever you can put together to get out of debt, once you pay off a debt, you take that payment plus how much you were planning on paying extra to get out of debt, and they roll over together. Now you pay off the next debt. Let's say that was $100 a month payment.
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Now you have the $100 payment to
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that credit card, you have the $50 payment to the first credit card and how much extra you already had set aside in your budget to pay off debt. So now you're rolling it over. You're rolling it over. When people get this, the positive momentum starts to get working for you. Charlie Munger's right. It's hell to get out of debt. The these payments are already in your budget. So when you use the rollover plan, it starts to snowball, it starts to advance for you, and so you start to get out of debt very quickly. My buddy Dave Ramsey teaches a version of this. I develop one, obviously, for my clients, and again, the principles are ancient, been
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around a long time.
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So episode 119 is Get out of Debt Forever. So I would listen to that and it really outlines in detail how to use this rollover plan. The third part of the blueprint is become debt free and invest. You see, you maintain your lifestyle and all your debts are built into your budget. You already survived. So then what do I do? Well, all the money I was spending on debt payments and getting out of debt, now I take that money. Just like we taught my Serbian contractor friend. I take all that money and I use it to invest. Now what happens is the compounding effect starts to work for me, not against me. When you're under the pressure of debt, you get to experience what Albert Einstein
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said is compound interest.
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Compound interest, he said, was the eighth wonder of the world. Those who understand it, receive it, and those who don't pay it. When you owe money, that compounding effect is working against you. And it's going to drive you into the ground. When you get debt free and then start to invest, compound interest starts to work for you and it starts to grow over time. And that's how fortunes are made.
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Interviewer
All right, Mr. B, earlier you gave some statistics that are pretty intense, not only when it comes to the amount of debt carried, but all of the ways it can compound. Credit cards, student loans, mortgages, car loans. You've talked about good debt versus bad debt. But what if it's all emotional debt rooted in performance or ego?
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Brian Buffini
Well, it's never all one thing or the other, Right. There's, there's necessity, right. So someone's trying to improve themselves in life so they get themselves a student loan because they were told, you get the degree, you get the job. I've been a very unpopular lad for a long time. And you know this story since you grew up, I was like, okay, you know, there's benefits to college. But I know this. Of the thousands of employees I have hired, very few of them are using their degree. I believe there's some social development stuff that's beneficial. But in today's world and with AI, so many people just, it's the next step. And you know, growing up in Ireland, it wasn't a guaranteed next step. So at 15, you maybe went to a trade or you went into playing professional sports and you were an apprentice or you decided to go the academic route because you were going to go to college. You had to make that choice at 15. And in America, it just seems like it's the next thing to do, like middle school, high school, college. And the next thing, and the next thing is of course we get into debt for it. It's interesting. I have people in the coaching world in real estate balk at paying six or seven grand for coaching program. Who paid 100 grand a year for a degree they don't use. You know, I had a lot one time his, his parent, his parents were immigrants from Poland and they served their whole life. And he went to Harvard and he got an MBA at Harvard. And he told me, I learned more in the two day Turning Point retreat that cost 500 bucks than I did at Harvard about business.
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Interviewer
Yeah.
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Brian Buffini
So I just think it's a matter
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of now if you're in that debt,
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you're in that debt because you're trying to do the right thing. I think a house is good debt. A house, good debt.
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Why?
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Because it controls your expenses. Like you don't control rent. You know, you, you've heard all the Stuff on social media. Well, you had to negotiate with your landlord, my rear end. So that is only ever going to go up. So if you buy a house, you control the payment and what can happen, you can pay down that mortgage and you can also benefit from appreciation. So to me, house is good. Debt, cars, I don't love car loans. I don't love car loans. Now, if it's a difference between someone being able to hold down a job or not, I understand. But going out and getting a car and jacking it up and 72 months to pay it off, not good. And then the credit cards, 90% of credit cards pay. Payments are, I can't afford it, but I can finance it. We're spending money we don't have on things we don't need to impress people we don't know. And culturally, like the government, the banking system, the structure is all built on us being a consumer society. If you ever hear the projections, how is the consumer, the consumer price index, consumer confidence, it's how much confidence does that have the consumer to get into debt? And I'm telling you right now, you go back through the last 10 presidents, you'll hear them talking about the consumer and the consumer debt. We're a consumer economy. Well, a lot of that consumer stuff, I never forget it when I first came to America, like I was trying to buy a mattress. I was renting a room in a guy's house, I need to get a mattress. And I went down the store and they told me there was, I could
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buy a mattress that day and I'd have no payments for a year.
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And I remember going, what in the world is that? And then I started asking them questions and sure enough, you're financing the price of the mattress and it's going to cost you four times what it would to take you five years to do it and all that kind of stuff.
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So there's a hell of a lot
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of keeping up with the Joneses. There's a consumer pressure. You know, we buy brand new cars and drive them off the lot and they're worth a third of what they were an hour later. Not good investments. So, you know, there's a reason Dave Ramsey and I are friends. You know, he gets a lot of crap from a lot of people. But he's right about the credit card debt. I mean, I just say this, if you're going to go into debt to 23% like that, usury is considered anything beyond 10%. Usury is in the Bible, is a sin. And in usury, in certain Countries used to be you used to be sent to jail for usury, but not if you're a bank that has a credit card. 23%, right? So the rule of 72 says if I'm trying to find out my investments, right? So let's say I'm getting 8% return on investment. I divide it into 72. That means my money will double in nine, right? So if I have $100,000 at 8%, it'll be $200,000 in nine years. Well, what if I have $100,000 in short term debt at 23%? We'll divide 23 into 72. It means that debt doubles in three years. And that's where most people are. And what are they doing? They're financing a bed, they're financing a car, they're financing clothes. Kids now are financing pizzas, they're financing concert tickets, right? Payday loans and pay now, pay later. I mean, it's, it's shocking. And so the bottom line is the compounding goes against you. So at some point in time, you just got to say, you know what? I'm good, I'm good. I don't need to keep up with the challenges. I don't, you know, the car is fine.
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I don't need.
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Or I don't need the S model. The C is fine. I invest hard in investments in real estate, and I believe real estate debt is good if it's managed properly. But I'd say the other stuff, it's like playing Russian roulette. And I haven't had credit card debt in 30 years. And I teach it and I speak against it. You know, it's funny, you remember Mastermind, when we had Neil Armstrong, we brought 5,000 people to Vegas. You know, we brought 5,000 people To Vegas, and Vegas asked us not to come back the following year because I taught budgeting and I taught credit cards so people didn't go gambling. So the casinos are like, hey, we loved you, but we don't want you.
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Come back next year.
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We want people who are going to throw the money in slot machines. So I am strong about this, and yet a lot of it is emotional. And what happens is this. Here's what happens. I never forget this. My brother Kevin had a roommate. Kevin bought his first property. And Kevin's a softie, right? So he'll give his shirt off his back. So he has this roommate who's going through a tough time, and your man can't pay his rent. So now Kevin's taken on the pressure. This guy's rent. Well, I walk in one day, I'm picking up Kevin to go to the airport, and his roommate's there, and he had a pizza box, and he had a bag with two new pairs of jeans. And I asked him a couple of adult questions. I said, you can't pay your rent, but you're buying new jeans. And he goes, well, the rent's a lot more. And he goes, he said, I'm already in debt, and I just needed to do something to feel good. And I said, well, I'll tell you what I'm going to do with the feel good, which is I'm going to help my brother out. If you can't pay your rent in the next 25 days, you might want to sell those jeans and you want to find somewhere else to live. Now, Kevin was never going to say it to him, and I'm the badass, of course, but the bottom line is your man is spending money on new jeans and can't pay his rent. He's buying boxes of pizza, okay? Instead of make yourself a sandwich, get a Starbucks cup instead of buy yourself some Maxwell House. It's serious business. And so we just have become this debtor nation, this consumer thing. We throw it on, throw it on, no problem. And then you wake up one day and you have 5, 600,000 bankruptcies a year because the pressure gets so big.
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Interviewer
I mean, so along those lines, like, you were just talking numbers. I think a lot of times when people talk about debt, people automatically think of a number. Can you go deeper into that a little bit? Like what debt costs you beyond just money?
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Brian Buffini
Great question. As my mentors, Zig Ziglar used to say, money can buy you a bed, but it can't buy you a good night's sleep. So, for example, I serve an industry in real estate that's all flash, and you're managing our social media accounts and you see all the stuff that's put out there, you would never think that 50% of realtors are behind on their taxes. So when you're behind on your taxes, by the way, those guys are bad news to owe money to. They pursue you. They can garnish you your wages and commissions. And here's what it's like. Psychologically, you feel like Indiana Jones running from the big rock. Like that debt is there all the time. So it's the irs. It could be the student loan people, it could be the car loan people. Let me say this so you know the story of your dad in a motorcycle accent owing all the money.
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So I Owed all this money.
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I was, I, I didn't have any money, I didn't have insurance. So the bills would come. And I never forget the most aggressive people were the people who took me on the ambulance to the hospital. Like you hear the ambulance chasers and attorney, the ambulance debt collectors were the worst. And I would have the bills I was living in. The little cottage you've seen in University Avenue was a big old mantelpiece. And the bills came in, I put them in the back. And when a bill fell off the front, that's when I read it and opened it. Okay, so that was my system. I always had a system for everything. No money to pay, but I'm like, I'm going to do it. And I decided I was going to be broke two days a month. The day I got the bill and the day I read the bill. Other than that, I was going to try to live as if I was a debt free person, to try to think clearly. Well, I remember getting to the point that I wouldn't answer the phone. I was married to your mom for 18 years and this is when we still had landlines. And one day I'm in the kitchen and the phone rings and I'm just doing my thing and I don't move. And she does. And you know your mom, she'll never say a word about it. She answers the phone, talks and she hangs the phone. She goes, honey, do you know that in our 18 years of marriage you have never answered the phone in our house? And I'm like, really? She goes, like never. She goes, you're just standing right next to that. You're a very considerate man. You always are taking care of me. But when the phone rings, you never have to pick up the phone. And that was psychologically because 25 years before when I picked up the phone, it was a debt collector, so I didn't even know. And we were living on a mansion on top of a mountain years later. But that psychological pressure and tension from being called by bill collectors. I wouldn't answer my own phone.
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So the thing about it is, I
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think that people don't understand when they get debt free and financially squared away, how much freedom it creates in your, both your heart and in your mind. And it allows for more creativity, it allows for more innovation. If you're spending all your day thinking about your debts and what you owe and the pressure of that and the pressure, how do I do this? And rob Peter to pay Paul and whatever else, that's what your mind is working on. As opposed to some great innovation, some great creativity, some great skill that you have. So you're giving away, the worry is taken away to creativity. So the truth of the matter is, you know what happens is people get debt free and then back into debt like a yo yo over and over again. Kind of like being overweight and then getting, you know, getting back to normal and underweight and whatever else because they get used to being in debt. What I discovered is when I got out of debt with your mom and never went back was what? That's when all the great innovations came from. That's when all the freedom came. That's when the ability to innovate a company like buffining company or do these other things or investment strategies or charitable strategies and all the things we came up with. And your mother and I used to have very, very tough conversations when we first got married because we were in debt when we first got married. Well, those aren't conversations we have anymore and haven't had them in.
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I don't know if you guys have
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ever heard us having a money conversation. Right? I just think the emotional energy, the physical energy, the creative energy expands enormously when you control the money. And of all the things we teach, spiritual, family, business, financial, personal money's the easiest thing to control because it's just numbers, it's just rates of return and it's just having a discipline and that's. I'm excited. Like all the kids, you guys all use the Monarch app. They need to sponsor our show. Those people helping them out. But you know, we have all the kids using it and they're all using it and they've. You guys have your own money in your own right. Y' all manage your money really well and you're not under that pressure. So you can like, okay, what is it I want to do with my life? As opposed to most people, that decision is made for them.
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Interviewer
It seems easier to get out of debt when you don't have a ceiling on your earnings. But what about for everyone that isn't on a commission based job and their salary is fixed? What advice can you share there?
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Brian Buffini
Far more millionaires have a job than own a business. Far more. And it's the lie that's peddled all the time. Why? Because the constancy of a paycheck is very, very powerful. That's what compounding is. Compounding is about constancy.
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So here's the key.
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I make this, I spend this and what I have is a surplus.
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I have the taxes taken out, all
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the people who work for Buffining company. We don't hand them a check and then say, pay your own taxes. We take the taxes out for them. So now they're not in debt to the government. They have their money if they're wise. And we teach budgeting at our company.
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Oh, by the way, we have all
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kinds of budgeting systems in our company because healthy financially, employees do a much better job. We have a very generous 401k. Just got an award for one of the top 401 plans in America for how much we contribute. I've had dozens and dozens of Buffini millionaires. People who worked for me who retired as a Mainer know and had a job working for a Bavini company. So the truth of the matter is if you're on a fixed expense, then, then you've got more certainty. It's a lot harder for people in the commission business because they might have three commissions one month and none the next. So those are the people that have to work harder. And that's why we need coaching and that's why we need, you know, help them with their financial plan and everything else. And then you can do a little side hustle. You go, okay, everything I make on
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that is going to go here. Right.
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You're still doing a bit of training on the side and whatever else. We're great. All that money should be going towards investing. And then you guys are living off your, your 701010 plan. Right. Live on 70%, save 10%, give 10%, invest 10%. I've done a lot of programs on that.
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Interviewer
Yeah, that's awesome. I think it's going to help a lot of people.
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Brian Buffini
Yeah.
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Interviewer
Thank you.
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Brian Buffini
Yep.
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Welcome to coach them up live. We're here on location in Mali at the site of our peak Experience event. 500 of our all time favorite clients
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who are just great people, great producers
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with a lot to share and have been with us a long time. And Debbie's been with us a long time. Tell everybody who you are, where you're from, how long you've been in the business and how long you've been with us in coaching.
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Debbie Nestam
My name is Debbie Nestam. I'm from Jersey and I've been in the business for 20 years. Been in coaching for 15.
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Brian Buffini
By the way, notice she says Jersey, not New Jersey. That's the way you're able to tell the foreigners. That's right.
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That's great. What's your business look like? How many, how many deals do you
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do on an average year?
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Debbie Nestam
So I have a small team on an average year myself, I do anywhere from 75 to 95 deals.
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Brian Buffini
Amazing.
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Debbie Nestam
Yeah. And my question.
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Brian Buffini
Yeah, okay.
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Debbie Nestam
So I've had a lot of life happen over the last couple of years.
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Brian Buffini
I know a little bit about that.
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Debbie Nestam
Right. And a divorce, taking financial responsibility for some people, that probably wasn't a great decision. Making decisions emotionally in the financial world. Right. And in that process, I've have some debt. Right. And it's not just about. I'm working on the budgeting, I'm working on all the mechanics of the financials right now. But. But it's the debt cycle more than anything else. And it's when it was two incomes, no problem.
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Brian Buffini
Yeah.
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Debbie Nestam
You pay it and you go on. And now it's not two incomes and it's just me. And I'm responsible for a lot. And so the mindset of, once you dig out of this hole now, how do you not fall back into it?
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Brian Buffini
Great.
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So first of all, bless you.
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You're an absolute superstar agent.
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Thanks.
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And I think it's great when, you know, so many people have this image
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of, oh, my gosh, if I could
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do 75 DLZ, my whole life would be perfect. I'd move to the Bahamas.
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I just.
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You know what I mean?
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Debbie Nestam
Right.
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Brian Buffini
And so here you are going, man, I've had a lot of life. It's gone sideways on me.
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So. And so forth.
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So first very important thing here, because I love you and you're our superstar. You're going to give yourself a little grace, huh? Okay. Probably not great at that. You made decisions from an emotional place because your whole freaking life was turned upside down.
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Totally. So you need to first have empathy for yourself. You did the best you could and
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made the best decisions you could at the time.
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Now with hindsight, you're like, oh, there's a bit of an emotional reaction. Y. I'm Irish and Italian.
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Nitro and glycerin in the same body.
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You think I've ever made emotional decisions?
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Debbie Nestam
Right.
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Brian Buffini
I made some decisions that I'm, you know, it took me six years to pay off.
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Debbie Nestam
Okay.
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Brian Buffini
So I understand.
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Debbie Nestam
Okay.
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Brian Buffini
So first of all, this is key.
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You gotta have empathy for yourself.
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You did the best you could with
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what you had at the timeframe.
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Debbie Nestam
Right.
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Brian Buffini
Secondly, here's the lay of the land. Okay?
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I'm a big girl.
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Debbie Nestam
Yep.
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Brian Buffini
This is what I committed to. And I'm a guy.
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Look, I have. I've had all my parents on the payroll, family, friends, hundreds of employees, this charity, this. I bought a school.
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I bought a school during a recession. Like, what are you doing, Buffaney? I've done all these things.
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So it's like, okay, now it's like,
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this is the lay of the land. The next phase is not emotional. The next phase is practical. You need a plan.
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Debbie Nestam
Yeah.
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Brian Buffini
So this is the size of the debt. Here's the rates involved. Here's the debt. Interest rates involved.
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Debbie Nestam
Yep.
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Brian Buffini
And here's my assets. And here's my income.
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Debbie Nestam
Yep.
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Brian Buffini
And now, going forward, you're going to
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make good business decisions. You're going to put a plan together. Who's your coach now?
- [28:03]
Debbie Nestam
Julie Gardner.
- [28:04]
Brian Buffini
Julie Gardner. Amazing.
- [28:05]
And you've had some. You had Rob McFarlane.
- [28:07]
Debbie Nestam
I have.
- [28:07]
Brian Buffini
And Gail Pillion and Game Pillion. I mean, these were just. Robert McFarlane was the first coach in
- [28:12]
Buffini Company's history in 30 years. So you've had all this put into you.
- [28:17]
Yeah. You're a great producer.
- [28:19]
You just a little bit.
- [28:20]
One of the things that makes you such a great agent. Remember the phrase my mom used to
- [28:23]
say to me, get off the cross,
- [28:24]
we need the wood?
- [28:25]
Do you think that might apply to you?
- [28:26]
Debbie Nestam
Maybe a little.
- [28:27]
Brian Buffini
Because you're taking it on board for people. You're used to taking responsibility. It's what makes you a great agent. And so now you've taken on this responsibility, so now you can take care of yourself. So you need empathy for yourself. Number two.
- [28:42]
Like, I'm so glad you're here.
- [28:43]
Debbie Nestam
Yeah.
- [28:44]
Brian Buffini
I'm so glad you're here.
- [28:45]
Debbie Nestam
Yeah.
- [28:45]
Brian Buffini
You're gonna. And like you said, you're gonna bump into some other giant producers who've had a bit of life happen the last few years. And then we're gonna put a plan together and we're gonna chip away at this plant. It's not going away overnight.
- [28:56]
Debbie Nestam
Right.
- [28:57]
Brian Buffini
You gotta have the plan together. Now I'm gonna give you the answer you really want. The reason this will never happen to you again.
- [29:03]
Never.
- [29:05]
Is because how painful it. The level of pain, frustration and anxiety you've signed on to. It's like, hang on a second here. Now you can get away with it now, right. Okay.
- [29:18]
15 years from now.
- [29:19]
Debbie Nestam
Yeah.
- [29:19]
Brian Buffini
10 years from now, you can't make
- [29:20]
decisions like this because the clock's running.
- [29:22]
Debbie Nestam
Yeah.
- [29:23]
Brian Buffini
And your ability to earn and drive
- [29:24]
and produce starts to change.
- [29:25]
Interviewer
Right.
- [29:27]
Brian Buffini
So you're good. You've been through tougher stuff than this, by the way.
- [29:31]
And now we're going to have a plan.
- [29:32]
But from this point going forward, you
- [29:35]
and Julie are going to sit down, you're going to have a conversation. Yeah.
- [29:37]
You're like, Julie, what do you think? Right before you pull the trigger, you're
- [29:42]
going to go, okay, Julie.
- [29:43]
Debbie Nestam
Yeah.
- [29:44]
Brian Buffini
Here's what I'm thinking.
- [29:44]
What do you think?
- [29:45]
You just need that extra person.
- [29:47]
Debbie Nestam
Yeah.
- [29:48]
Brian Buffini
You need the plan to pay down the debt. Listen, now this is another piece you
- [29:52]
need to celebrate every debt you pay
- [29:53]
off, even if it's a small one. Yeah, you're going to celebrate. You're going to connect.
- [29:59]
That's a goal.
- [30:00]
Boom, chip, boom, boom. Gone.
- [30:02]
Girls night out.
- [30:03]
New dress.
- [30:03]
Debbie Nestam
Right.
- [30:04]
Brian Buffini
Weekend away, whatever it is, let's go
- [30:06]
to the next one.
- [30:07]
Chip away, chip away.
- [30:08]
You're also very competitive. Right. So we put a plan together. We're going to get you debt free in three years. We'll probably do it in two and a half. Yeah. So I just want you to know you're going to be fine.
- [30:15]
Debbie Nestam
Yeah. It just sucks to be there. Then get out of it and never do it again.
- [30:20]
Brian Buffini
So here's the thing.
- [30:21]
You know, this is what life is about, Right. Do you think it's possible that there's
- [30:26]
something for you to learn through this process?
- [30:28]
Debbie Nestam
I think we have to learn it until it hurts and then so it doesn't come back.
- [30:32]
Brian Buffini
There it is.
- [30:32]
Right. And that's. Unfortunately, I'm kind of learned the hard way type person. Yeah.
- [30:36]
I read the books and try to avoid it.
- [30:37]
And so this one you'll never do again.
- [30:39]
Debbie Nestam
Yeah.
- [30:40]
Brian Buffini
So sometimes it's out of a sense of over, over owning, too empathic and people pleasing.
- [30:51]
You put those three together, you take on other people's responsibilities.
- [30:54]
Debbie Nestam
Right.
- [30:54]
Brian Buffini
So right now you have a bunch of debts that you didn't even get into that are someone else's, but it's your responsibility to pay them off.
- [31:00]
Debbie Nestam
Right.
- [31:00]
Brian Buffini
We're not doing that anymore. This is what it is that's done.
- [31:04]
That decision's made.
- [31:05]
Debbie Nestam
Right.
- [31:05]
Brian Buffini
That dog's gone.
- [31:07]
But going forward, you're going to own the decisions going forward. So hey, I ain't going back into this.
- [31:11]
I'm not only going to get debt free.
- [31:13]
So now what we're going to do
- [31:14]
is as you're paying off these debts.
- [31:16]
Debbie Nestam
Yeah.
- [31:16]
Brian Buffini
We're going to get you investing even more and we're going to switch you from the debt to the investor. Because now the dynamic is you need to have the net worth and all these investments to the point that it
- [31:26]
says, I'm coming here when I want.
- [31:29]
Debbie Nestam
Right.
- [31:29]
Brian Buffini
I'm going to Bermuda when I want.
- [31:31]
I'm going to take time off what I want.
- [31:32]
You know what?
- [31:33]
10 years from now, I don't be
- [31:34]
selling 80, 90 homes.
- [31:35]
Debbie Nestam
Right.
- [31:36]
Brian Buffini
I don't sell 40.
- [31:37]
Debbie Nestam
Right.
- [31:37]
Brian Buffini
And I want to have people that can handle the others.
- [31:40]
What if I told you not only
- [31:41]
have I walked in that, but I have hundreds of people, I've walked in
- [31:44]
that all the way to selling their business.
- [31:47]
One of these days, you're going to be debt free. But you're not just going to be debt free. You're going to be a debt free and an investor. You're going to end debt free with all of these memories and all this wisdom now. And you're going to not only help yourself, you'll be able to help other people. You're a champ.
- [32:02]
You're a star.
- [32:04]
And life happened to you.
- [32:06]
Yeah.
- [32:06]
Empathy. Got a plan. We're going to celebrate the wins. Okay.
- [32:11]
Debbie Nestam
Thank you, Brian.