78. The crisis facing UK retail and food businesses | Sarah Bradbury

Summary

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Podcast Summary:

James Reed: All About Business – Episode 78
The Crisis Facing UK Retail and Food Businesses | Guest: Sarah Bradbury, CEO IGD
Release Date: May 11, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, James Reed sits down with Sarah Bradbury, CEO of the Institute of Grocery Distribution (IGD), to discuss the multifaceted crisis facing UK retail and food businesses. Together, they unpack workforce challenges, the impact of societal trends like new weight loss drugs, the evolution of the food sector, and IGD’s initiatives to prepare and attract a new generation of talent. The conversation is practical, candid, and solution-focused, aimed at business leaders, policymakers, and anyone interested in the dynamics and future of the UK's all-important food industry.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Understanding IGD’s Role and Impact

• What is IGD?

  • IGD is a charitable institute over 120 years old, dedicated to uniting the food sector—from agriculture to retail—around common standards and challenges.
  • It operates both a charity (the convening and standard-setting arm) and a commercial side (subscription-based business intelligence for global retail trends).
  • [01:57|Sarah Bradbury]: “We have two parts of our organisation. We have a commercial side which actually funds the charity… a subscription service for retail and for shoppers… that then helps the insight drive action.”

• The Importance of Collaboration in Food

  • IGD acts as a bridge, helping various industry “silos” (retail, manufacturing, agriculture, FMCG) work together for strategic progress and long-term resilience.
  • [06:47|Sarah Bradbury]: “We work across and try and work with the more progressive people as well. Some industries are moving faster than others, but they all need to rely on each other.”

Critical Challenges Facing UK Food Businesses

• Volume Decline & New Consumption Trends

  • The sector has historically relied on volume growth, but this is stagnating due to various factors, including consumer health consciousness and the rise of weight-loss drugs (e.g., Ozempic).
  • [13:12|Sarah Bradbury]: “Volumes are not growing at the pace that they have in the past.”
  • [14:22|Sarah Bradbury]: “We think that it could be up to about 30% less [consumption] but depends on your starting position.”

• Potential Transformation from Weight-Loss Drugs

  • The increasing use of GLP-1 agonists in the US and their potential rise in the UK could fundamentally alter consumer behavior, especially regarding snack foods and total calories consumed.
  • [14:35|Sarah Bradbury]: “It could be transformational for the industry… Is it going to change the quality of what you eat?... We definitely know that it makes a big difference from a snacking perspective.”

• Sustainability & Land Use

  • Balancing the need for food production with climate initiatives (like solar panels on agricultural land) is a contentious issue.
  • [18:54|Sarah Bradbury]: “Good agricultural land where the soil can be looked after and we can produce for ourselves—that shouldn't be what's got a solar panel on top of it.”
  • [19:58|Sarah Bradbury]: “Fields, I'm not so sure [about putting solar panels].”

Workforce Crisis: “The Quiet Crisis”

• Structural Shortage

  • Food and drink businesses are suffering from a growing labor and skills shortage, exacerbated by an aging workforce, unattractive industry perception, and rising costs (e.g., wages, national insurance).
  • [22:19|Sarah Bradbury]: “Despite lots of years of effort… structurally it's getting even harder to get the workforce that we need.”
  • [23:10|Sarah Bradbury]: “Retail's obviously got an awful lot of people in it… an aging population… we're not a sexy industry to work in.”

• Misconceptions About Careers

  • Many young people are unaware of the range of roles and career mobility available across the food sector—from tech and AI to marketing, engineering, and analytics.
  • [24:19|Sarah Bradbury]: “We've got engineering jobs, jobs that involve new technology… marketing, finance, analytics, supply chain, environmental jobs…”

• Entry Points & Social Mobility

  • Sarah highlights the importance of entry-level jobs, work experience, and social mobility in the sector.
  • [25:11|Sarah Bradbury]: “I was a graduate trainee at Harrods and I was the Christmas teddy bear coordinator…”

Current Initiatives & Actionable Advice

• Feeding Britain’s Future (Relaunching June 2026)

  • IGD’s initiative to connect schools, universities, and businesses, aimed at increasing awareness and participation in food sector careers.
  • [27:13|Sarah Bradbury]: “Three things: get involved; make your mark campaign, really trying to talk to children where they are; and get involved in at least one of the interventions…”

• Call to Action

  • Businesses are urged to offer work experience, participate in career outreach, and signpost job opportunities—especially via IGD’s website.
  • [27:54|Sarah Bradbury]: “Come to the IGD website. It's under our social impact side. It will be across the front of the page…”

• Integration with Government Policy

  • Close collaboration with policymakers on long-term land use frameworks, agricultural plans, and new vocational qualifications (T levels, V levels).
  • [28:38|Sarah Bradbury]: “Those T levels, apprenticeship reforms, they're going to be important for our sector, but they're going to take a while…”

Purpose, Technology, and the Future

• Sector Purpose & Appeal to Youth

  • The sector needs to highlight its vital national purpose (feeding the nation, sustainability) to attract young, purpose-driven talent.
  • [36:24|Sarah Bradbury]: “We're an area with purpose. So when we think about young people that want to change things… the food industry is one of them.”
  • [33:31|Sarah Bradbury]: “People listening also encourage your children… Parents don't encourage their children to come into our sector because they… haven’t experienced the amazing opportunities that we've got.”

• Technological Innovation

  • Robotics, AI, and new food processes are seen as growth areas and sector differentiators for emerging professionals.
  • [35:26|Sarah Bradbury]: “AI, robotics, novel food processes, they're all going to help us move forward…”

• Employer Adaptability

  • Encouraged to be flexible and innovative in how they recruit and support young people—meeting them “where they are,” e.g., on social media and with modern working practices.
  • [38:05|Sarah Bradbury]: “We need to target different interventions… try and understand, be more inclusive from some of the policies...”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “[Volumes] could be up to about 30% less, but depends on your starting position.”
  – Sarah Bradbury, on the impact of weight-loss drugs on food consumption [14:22]

• “Fields, I'm not so sure [about putting solar panels].”
  – Sarah Bradbury, on balancing farming and sustainability initiatives [19:58]

• “Despite lots of years of effort… structurally it's getting even harder to get the workforce that we need.”
  – Sarah Bradbury, on the food sector’s labor crisis [22:19]

• “It's a sector double the size of the NHS as a private employer. There really is opportunities at all different levels.”
  – Sarah Bradbury, on the scope of the industry [33:31]

• “We're an area with purpose. So when we think about young people that want to change things… the food industry is one of them.”
  – Sarah Bradbury, on the sector’s appeal [36:24]

• “Collaborating, uniting and convening is something that wakes me up in the morning.”
  – Sarah Bradbury, on her personal motivation [44:43]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 01:57 – Sarah Bradbury introduces IGD and its history
• 07:52 – Commercial side: Retail Analysis and global insights
• 12:18 – Biggest challenges in UK food system
• 13:37 – Weight-loss drugs and their impact on consumption
• 15:54 – Health, quality of diet, and industry adaptation
• 18:34 – Land use and sustainability: solar panels vs. agriculture
• 22:14 – Workforce Crisis: “The Quiet Crisis” report
• 24:19 – Range of jobs and entry routes in food sector
• 27:13 – Feeding Britain’s Future: how to get involved
• 28:38 – Government, qualifications, and the future of training
• 35:14 – Technology and future growth areas
• 36:24 – Attractiveness and purpose of the food sector
• 38:05 – Employer approaches to young people
• 44:13 – What gets Sarah up on Mondays (personal motivation)
• 45:29 – IGD CEO Forum and sector-wide leadership

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Final Thoughts

James Reed and Sarah Bradbury present the UK food sector as at a critical juncture: facing a quiet crisis on the workforce front, compounded by shifting consumption patterns and sustainability pressures. Yet, with concerted sector-wide partnership, government backing, and purposeful outreach to the next generation, there is optimism for a resilient and dynamic future.

For businesses, policymakers, and potential sector entrants, the repeated message: get involved, collaborate, and recognize the essential role and opportunity in the food sector.

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Find out more:
Visit the IGD website to engage with Feeding Britain’s Future and related social impact initiatives.

Transcript

[James Reed]

Welcome to All About Business with me, James Reed, the podcast that covers everything about business, management and leadership. Every episode, I sit down with different guests who bootstrapped companies, masterminded investment models or built a business empire. They're leaders in their field and they're here to give you top insights and actionable advice so that you can apply their ideas to your own career or business venture. The UK food industry employs millions of people, yet many businesses say they're struggling to find the next generation of workers. Today on All About Business, I'm joined by Sarah Bradbury, CEO of the Institute of Grocery Distribution, an organization that has spent more than a century helping shape the future of the food sector. We discussed the workforce challenges facing the industry, how businesses can attract young talent, and why the food sector may offer more career opportunities than many people realize. Well, today on All About Business, I'm delighted to welcome Sarah Bradbury. Thank you for coming in, Sarah. Sarah's the Chief Executive Officer of the Institute of Grocery Distribution, IGD for short, and she took that position in 2023 after a long career of 25 years in retailing. And you've worked for a number of the premier retail companies in the country. I believe you've worked at Harrods, Marks and Spencers and Tesco's and Aldi. So a really good cross section there, which I'm sure we'll be able to talk about. Sarah, for those who aren't familiar with I G D, what is it and what do you do? Because I think it's fascinating and I'm really looking forward to exploring this whole industry which is so important to all of us and maybe we forget that with you this morning.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Thank you, James. Thank you for inviting me in. So IGD is a purpose driven charitable institute. We've been around for over 120 years. We were founded to help grocery talk to each other at that time and kind of work more collaboratively together. In the 70s, we also folded in the Institute of Manufacturing. So we started to become a broader organization really to help the industry unite, convene, come together and make a difference. So we have two parts of our organisation. We have a commercial side which actually funds the charity, so. So that's a subscription service for retail and for shoppers so that we can really understand what's happening in the retail industry and what's happening with customers and how they're feeling shopping. That then helps the insight drive action.

[James Reed]

All right, there's masses I want to ask you about from what you've just said, so let's start with the charity side of it. It's over 120 years old. It was originally set up, as you said, so grocers might talk to each other. I mean, why was it useful for grocers to talk to each other? I mean, what were they. What was it. What was it beneficial that they talk to each other about? Because I suppose some listeners might be thinking, well, we don't want grocers colluding and pushing prices up to our detriment. What were they talking about that was, you know, noteworthy?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Well, I think there's two things that are really people don't understand, which is around when the barcode was created, somebody had to try and then help people work together, understand how they could implement it, how they might work.

[James Reed]

So when was that?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Oh, I don't know.

[James Reed]

Barcodes are long standing.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah. So the barcode's been around for a long time.

[James Reed]

It had to be right across the whole food sector.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah. So it could be used and scanned in whatever shop in whatever way. And that was something that people had to really work together. More recently, actually, do you remember when people started putting front to pack labeling on?

[James Reed]

Yes.

[Sarah Bradbury]

So that's a voluntary initiative and the industry wanted to make sure that it was easy for customers. So if whatever shop you go in, it's fairly similar and they could understand what it was trying to do. But somebody really had to bring people together in order to try and work out what the rules are going to be and how people.

[James Reed]

So. So there's a sort of common language.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah, yeah.

[James Reed]

I mean, you mentioned earlier on the way in, you know, what is butter? Yeah, I mean, so they had to sort of define what butter is, for example, I mean, because that was interesting, because when you start thinking about it, what is butter?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So it was more around how you would. What shapes and sizes you would sell things in. So were people going to agree around it's 250gram block of butter at the time, still is today. So they were kind of some of the earlier conversations, how is our industry going to help shoppers show up, et cetera. And now obviously it's, how do we help the industry move forward with all the challenges that it's got?

[James Reed]

Yes. So, Sarah, just to help me understand further, if IGD was to disappear tomorrow, what in the food industry would stop working?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Well, nothing would stop working. We're a fabulous industry that works at fast pace. I think the challenges that are facing the food industry need to collaborate and need to work across the system. And we're the Only organization that works across the whole of the food system. So I think pace of change would not be as fast if it wasn't for the US bringing people together.

[James Reed]

So over the long term, you think this industry strategy might suffer?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

And that's a key focus for you?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah. So uniting and convening the industry to deliver a thriving food system is critical. And actually IGD bringing the economic resilience, sustainability, workforce and health all together to really help us from a. What is the long term good growth plan? I think that's the important piece that we play.

[James Reed]

Yeah. I mean, because food is different in many ways to other business areas. Because it is a system, isn't it? The system is really critical here. And I'm thinking about other business lines and that's not quite the same.

[Sarah Bradbury]

I think the unintended consequences are not always seen in all the silos.

[James Reed]

So what are the silos?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So we have a very strong retail sector. We have a very strong manufacturing sector. We obviously have a strong agriculture sector. And then we have the FMCG side as well. But really working across those generally retail want to support farming. And then you've got the people in the middle that are driving and doing the production side as well. So really working across all of them and interplaying where some are competitors and some are not.

[James Reed]

And what's unique about you is you take a whole system view.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yes. And we work across and try and work with the more progressive people as well. So I think that's the other part. Some industries are moving faster than others, but they all need to rely on each other. So how can we work with some of the more progressive, thoughtful parts of the system?

[James Reed]

So they're all interdependent to a degree. When you say progressive, what do you mean?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So some have different priorities to others. So you could have people that are very determined to get to net zero who are in the same area that are not focusing as much. But actually you need everybody to move together in order to get the country, quite frankly, to the right place.

[James Reed]

So you have to be quite persuasive.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yes, we have to try.

[James Reed]

Yeah, I can see that. Okay. So setting standards and conventions and a common language was where it started. I can see how that's so helpful. And then you said there's this commercial side that does research and supplies information for a fee, I guess.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yes.

[James Reed]

How does that work and who sort of uses that service?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah. So on the commercial side of the organization, we have two subscription services. One is called retail analysis. And we have analysts that go to 43 countries around the world and they'll bring back the best of retail. So we can understand what's happening either in California or over in Australia. Where is kind of the new and interesting parts of retail? What are people doing on pricing, what are people doing on promotions? So that it really is a hive of information that people can go in and understand what's happening in countries.

[James Reed]

And this is available online, is it for subscribers?

[Sarah Bradbury]

It used to be books, but nowadays it's obviously an online subscriber service.

[James Reed]

That's amazing. So how many countries?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So it's from 43 different countries.

[James Reed]

That's really interesting. So any interesting insights popped up lately you've seen?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Well, I think that the, the interesting is the interconnected stores. So how do people hyper connect, whether it's from their phones, whether it's in small shops, large shops, how are people using that technology to shop differently and then how do you put kind of the promotion side on top? So whether it's through retail media really in different ways, when shops were obviously set up, it was just literally you walked into your one shop. But now how people connect is very, very different. So that's really what we're watching quite closely, the role of AI. And how does that change?

[James Reed]

Do you know a young person who dreams of becoming an entrepreneur? In Britain today, There are nearly 1,000,018 to 24 year old who are currently not in education, employment or training. This is simply not good enough. We want our young people to be doing meaningful work for their well being and for the well being of the whole economy. I want to do something about this, which is why Today, on Reid's 66th birthday, we're launching an important new initiative. Reid is going to give £20,000 to 66 young entrepreneurs to help them expand their businesses. We want to encourage young people to set up shop and start their entrepreneurial journey right now. So please visit reed.com entrepreneurs to find out more. Reed is an entrepreneurial family business and to celebrate our 66th birthday, we want to support the next generation of entrepreneurs. So it was interesting, I was just thinking this the other day. So grocery has gone from, you know, you'd go into a shop 120 years ago and someone would be behind a counter and you'd ask for a list of things and they get them for you. To going to a supermarket where you fill up a trolley.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

To now going online and putting in a list of things and they'll get them for you. Sort of become a virtual version of the original.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

Which is quite Interesting. It is evolved, is that right? I mean, that's just a perception, but

[Sarah Bradbury]

no, I think it's a really fair assumption. There's been. There's been such a massive change and now you don't even have to book for someone to deliver it the next day on some of the fast delivery services. You can just be thinking about it in your kitchen and someone will deliver it to you.

[James Reed]

So who are the subscribers to your business service, then? Who would be your typical customers for that?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So we have over 400 customers. We have retailers from many different parts of the world and we also have manufacturers, brands. I think when I used to be on the commercial side, people would bring IGD data into me, there'd be photographs into me. So if they was selling me a certain product, they could show me how other people were merchandising it around the world.

[James Reed]

Ah. So people use that to assist them in their own promotions. So were you a buyer?

[Sarah Bradbury]

I was. I was on the commercial side for a long time. Yes.

[James Reed]

All right. I used to buy media a long time ago. Yeah. So. Yeah, so that's interesting. So, and your trustees, I was looking of the charity come from a number of substantial, largely retail companies, I think, but then there were some food producers.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah. So we're really lucky, actually. We have trustees and directors of the organization and we have both from retail, from manufacturing, and actually we've now got a couple of charity leads that are joining us as well. They really help us guide the direction of the organization and obviously bring stimulus and interest in as well.

[James Reed]

So it's interesting, you look all around the world, but your focus is the uk, as I understand it. What are some of the biggest challenges currently facing the UK food system in

[Sarah Bradbury]

your view, Sarah, The UK food system, it is one of our greatest national assets, but it's going through a huge amount of change and it touches every home, every community that we work in. But at the moment, there's low volumes. There's climate change, there's economic challenges, geopolitical challenges, there's an awful lot.

[James Reed]

So, hang on, you say low volumes. What do you mean? People aren't buying as much or.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Our industry has always worked on volume growth. It's been a growth game. The margins are very, very small. So it is a kind of volume, like, for. Like. It's been the way that the industry's worked. Volumes are not growing at the pace that they have in the past.

[James Reed]

So was that because people aren't eating

[Sarah Bradbury]

as much or so they're just not growing as much? There's still kind of the volume.

[James Reed]

What do you mean though? How does that happen? Because, well, the population hasn't grown as much.

[Sarah Bradbury]

So at the moment we've got challenges coming in from a health perspective. We've also got the unknown of what's going to happen with these GLP1 drugs as well coming in. So with the other.

[James Reed]

You mean Ozempic?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yes, yes.

[James Reed]

That's what. So people literally aren't eating as much because of those.

[Sarah Bradbury]

So we don't know the impact it's totally going to have. We're actually doing a big longitudinal study at the moment to understand what people are saying versus what they're really doing. Are we going to be the same as America?

[James Reed]

What's happened there?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So in America we believe that like almost 18% of people are actually taking weight loss drugs.

[James Reed]

Right. And how much does that reduce their sort of volume in your terms? Consumption? I mean if normal was 100 or before was 100, what's it dropped to?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So it all depends on the individual and it does.

[James Reed]

And that, I mean that's your on average, I mean. Well, that's what this data, you've obviously been analyzing this.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah, that, that's the million dollar question that everyone wants to answer. So we think that it is could be up to about 30% less, but depends on your level that you' your starting position.

[James Reed]

So this is transformational.

[Sarah Bradbury]

It could be transformational for the industry. It's something people are really, really watching. Is it going to change the quality of what you eat? Is it going to change your longer patterns of what you're going to eat? Is it going to change your snacking? We definitely know that it makes a big difference from a snacking perspective. Is it going to be different out of home versus in home? Where are the big reductions going to

[James Reed]

take place and what's your sense?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So I have a hope that it will help people eat less and better.

[James Reed]

Less and better.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Is the, is the hope healthier? Yes. So healthier.

[James Reed]

What do you mean by that?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So the real critical part is to ensure that you are having nutrient dense foods so that a kind of every calorie counts so that when you're really thinking about what you're going to eat, you're going to be eating less, but what is it going to be? And to make sure that you've got high quality meat, to make sure you've got loads of vegetables, to make sure you're balancing your diet. That is the, the kind of goal really. And you can see at the moment there's lots of different retailers trying different ranges to see can they adapt to that new market. So I'm hopeful that it will help us make the transitions that we need to do across the food industry.

[James Reed]

Because, I mean, critics of the food industry would say over the last 50 years, you know, the processed food and surplus sugar has caused obesity. What would you say as a spokesperson? I'm not trying to catch you out here.

[Sarah Bradbury]

No, no.

[James Reed]

So, I mean, but is it, is that. Is this now being corrected?

[Sarah Bradbury]

I suppose, I suppose if you listen to Summer, if you listen to. So Chris Witty, he would say it's a plaster. It's not the right thing to do because we should be ensuring that we've got a healthy nation. I think.

[James Reed]

Well, he would say these drugs are a plastic.

[Sarah Bradbury]

He would, yes, he would say. I think he was in the Guardian the other week to basically say we need to make the nation eat the right food, help train people properly, help make sure they know what nutritional standards would be in order to make sure people are healthy versus giving them an injection to stop them eating too much. I think the food industry has a role to play. The food industry has been really supportive around some of the NHS ten year plan to have mandatory reporting to really help a level playing field. Because the difficulty is if you're, if you want more sales people don't eat two apples if they're sat on the desk, but they might eat two KitKats or Mars Bar.

[James Reed]

All right, okay.

[Sarah Bradbury]

So I think it really is thinking about. The food industry desperately wants to help the nation be more healthy. But it's how they're going to go along that transition. But I think everybody knows the transition needs to be had.

[James Reed]

So. So a big challenge is volumes. Volumes are flat or falling.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

And I mean your. The food industry has some substantial segments to. It doesn't.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

We've mentioned retailing, but.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

What are the other blocks in the chain that you represent? I suppose. And how's this affect them? What's the. Oh God. I'm thinking of farmers and manufacturers.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah. So. But we obviously work across the food system all the way from agriculture through to retail out of home. What we do try and do is try and help work across the system. So it's quite new thinking, but working to understand one thing might help one and not the other. So how do you have a fair transition into the new world that we need to be in? So if we think about economic resilience is really important. A lot of these are low margin organizations, so we need to make sure we've Got a. Strengthen the food system. When we think about the environmental sustainability and the change that we need, we know that we've got to look after the land better, help support the kind of the future journey to net zero from a population diet.

[James Reed]

Hang on a minute. I mean, what do you think about putting solar panels over fields everywhere? Because, I mean, that would have been a productive agricultural asset. It's now not. It's now helping net zero, apparently, but it's not a farm anymore. I mean, this is a big issue in the countryside.

[Sarah Bradbury]

It definitely is.

[James Reed]

And that's a difficult one to sort of balance, isn't it?

[Sarah Bradbury]

I mean, we aren't going to have more people in the country. We need to feed the nation more, we need to produce more at home. So I think kind of what land is being used is a really important part. So actually is good agricultural land where the soil can be looked after and we can produce for ourselves. That shouldn't be what's got a solar panel on top of it.

[James Reed]

But when farmers get sort of told that you get 100,000 a year income for doing this. Well, we know that farmers don't make that much money farming typically. It's quite tempting, isn't it? It's a bit like your KitKats on

[Sarah Bradbury]

the desk, I think. I think that's a very fair challenge. But I do think kind of with some of the change, that the sustainable farming initiatives are trying to balance that out a little bit. So farmers are going to be paid more proportionately. And I quite like the phrase of kind of, how do you land share so that you're using the right land for producing food and then you're using other parts of your farm for other areas too, while creating as well.

[James Reed]

I mean, I think putting solar panels on roofs is a good idea.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Absolutely.

[James Reed]

Fields. I'm not so sure.

[Sarah Bradbury]

I'm not so sure either.

[James Reed]

You're not so sure either, so. Well, that's interesting. So. So it feels like this is a challenge sector for a number of reasons. I mean.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

I mean, you only have to watch Clarkson's farm to see how hard farming is. And, you know, there's been a lot of protests from farmers saying they're struggling and. And then you're saying the retailers volumes are.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

Are not growing. What other things are on your mind?

[Sarah Bradbury]

I. I think it's worth saying we are a brilliant industry. So actually, the food industry adapts so much and you only need to think about COVID around how everybody worked together. I was fortunate enough to be working at Tesco at the time. And it was an unbelievable experience to how we were pivoting to support society where we are. The challenges are not insurmountable. It's how do people kind of work together. So I think if we think about.

[James Reed]

And that's your role here, really, you're a convener.

[Sarah Bradbury]

We convene. We work very closely with government, we work very closely with trade associations. And I think the more people can work together, I think the more the industry moves together, the more they move faster and broadening out kind of all of the conversations we have to just involve more people so that it's not kind of competing areas is better.

[James Reed]

So how might government help you say? I mean, are there some messages you're sending in their direction?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So we're very lucky because we work with the government on the food strategy side.

[James Reed]

Right.

[Sarah Bradbury]

And there definitely is. There's kind of land use frameworks that are just coming out. There's work around agricultural 25 year plan. There is.

[James Reed]

What's that?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So that. That's work in progress at the moment.

[James Reed]

25 year plan.

[Sarah Bradbury]

So really to help profitability of farms, to really make sure that the. The future that's needed from a sustainability perspective so that we've got the soils for the future, so that we've got the farmers for the future because they're retiring as well. And to make sure there is that balance in the transition across the board. I think the other important thing to talk about as well as population diet is the workforce challenge. And that's what I'm keen.

[James Reed]

Yeah. You've just published a report called the Quiet Crisis.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yes.

[James Reed]

So is that about this?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yes, I think.

[James Reed]

So what is. So talk me through the workforce challenge.

[Sarah Bradbury]

So the food and drink workforce quite crisis really talks about the long term structural workforce problem that we've got within the food sector. So despite lots of years of effort across industry and government, we know that structurally it's getting even harder to get the workforce that we need.

[James Reed]

In which areas are you thinking?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So the labour and skills crunch really is all the way from supermarkets through to farms. So we know that there is rising costs, there's increased strain and rising costs of what? So rising costs in the system. So whether it becomes an across workforce specifically.

[James Reed]

Well, you're talking wages, national insurance rates, all of that stuff. Yeah, yeah.

[Sarah Bradbury]

So retail's obviously got an awful lot of people in it. So they've been hit really hard with national insurance changes. And then we've got an aging population. We know that lots of workers are retiring and we know that we're not a sexy industry to work in.

[James Reed]

But so how are you going to make yourself sexy in a sense? Because I mean, clearly we need people to grow food and to run shops and keep the show on the road in the future, don't we? I mean, that's vital.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Definitely. But people don't know about our industry. So we did a piece of.

[James Reed]

What do you mean? We know about Tesco's food, you're absolutely right.

[Sarah Bradbury]

But they don't think. Think of our industry as one to come and work in. So people don't know about the roles that we've got within our industry. We actually did a piece of research recently that said 72% of people weren't interested in coming to work in the food and drink sector.

[James Reed]

That means 28% are.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Absolutely.

[James Reed]

That's quite a good number.

[Sarah Bradbury]

It's a good start. But we also found out that 78% of people were interested in jobs they just didn't know were in our industry.

[James Reed]

Right.

[Sarah Bradbury]

And I think that's kind of the.

[James Reed]

What sort of things are we thinking?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So when people are looking at purpose driven jobs, whether people are looking at new technology, they don't think of us as kind of we've got more and we've got engineering jobs, we've got jobs that evolve new technology from an AI perspective, we've got. You can move up within our industry. We've got marketing, we've got finance, we've got analytics, we've got. Got supply chain, we've got environmental jobs. So when people are thinking about kind of what needs, what they'd like to do for the future, quite often they don't think, oh, the food industry might have that. And actually the beauty of our industry is you can move from a social mobility perspective as well, starting many different jobs. I mean, I, I was, I've been fortunate enough to run advertising, I've been able to run.

[James Reed]

What sort of. What was your first job in retaining.

[Sarah Bradbury]

So I was a graduate trainee at Harrods and I was the Christmas teddy bear coordinator.

[James Reed]

All right, okay. So. So there you go. So you started on the shop floor.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

I mean we've had other people on the podcast who started on the shop floor, you know, through what were then YTS schemes. Youth training.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Oh, yeah.

[James Reed]

Who are now CEOs.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

I mean it seems to me that retail is a really good entry point for young people because you learn a lot.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

You have to work on your feet.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

And you have to deal with a lot of customers. That's good experience. For any, any business in the future. So I'd certainly recommend retail to people

[Sarah Bradbury]

to consider and it's a lot of fun and it's relatable as well. I think that's the other great thing.

[James Reed]

I used to work in an ice cream van at Thorpe Park. It was fantastic and I really enjoyed that job. And it's interesting, those sort of jobs, I think, yeah, get people going. So I. I think it's interesting you feel that they don't look at it.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah, do.

[James Reed]

Is there an issue here with younger people, you know, when in the past 15, 16 year olds would do Saturday jobs in stores, Is that not happening so much or is because that seems to be an entry point where you get started? Yeah, I don't come across quite so much now.

[Sarah Bradbury]

There's not as many of those around and there's. BRC have recently done a report about that being a challenge, especially with the national insurance changes. We actually launched something in 2012 called Feeding Britain's Future, which really was about getting people into understanding about work, giving them the skills that they needed. When we are looking at some of the challenges today, people don't get work experience either. So how can really our industry, but also others work really closely, especially with government. With new careers and enterprise around, how do we get people to experience?

[James Reed]

So you've just mentioned that you want to relaunch Feeding Britain's Future, which first started in 2012. In doing that, what's your ask of business? What do you want from business?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So there's three things that I'd really like. One is to get involved, so sign up to the initiative and supporting us. The second is around make your mark campaign, really trying to talk to children where they are. And the third one is get involved in at least one of the interventions. So whether that being the work experience side, whether it's collaborating with universities, really helping us to get on the careers platform, so all the jobs that we need for our industry, one of those interventions would be brilliant.

[James Reed]

Okay, so if I'm a business and I've heard this, I'm interested in this. I am personally. Where do I go to find this? Where do I go to sign up? Is there a website or a URL or what's the address?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah, so come to the IGD website. It's under our social impact side. It will be across the front of the page as well and then we'll get in contact with you from there.

[James Reed]

So that's the ig, the website, Institute of Grocery Distribution. For anyone listening. Yeah, go there and you'll be signposted.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Great.

[James Reed]

Well, I'm very interested in these new V levels, vocational levels that have been announced that. That are going to sit alongside A levels. And I'm sure there'll be a retail or there should be a food industry fee level. You should be asking for that and then you'll have a good interface with schools. Are you going to do that? Yeah. Is that something on your. On your. On your agenda?

[Sarah Bradbury]

I think.

[James Reed]

Because I think fee levels could be a really important development that would help young people progress, whether they wanted to do a degree, an apprenticeship or just go and get a job.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah. I think those, those T levels, apprenticeship reforms, they're all going to be really kind of important for our sector, but they're going to take a while, I think, to actually move through. I mean, it's not essential to have done food, obviously, through, through school and university, but at the moment there is no A level for food science.

[James Reed]

No. Well, there should certainly be a V level for retail food and it could be an A level too. I agree. And. And I think that at least helps young people grow in awareness of what the possibilities are and start to develop relationships with local employers and businesses.

[Sarah Bradbury]

It also gives them the skills at home. Back to the obesity conversation.

[James Reed]

Yeah.

[Sarah Bradbury]

You know, skills actually provide for themselves

[James Reed]

and their family and cook healthily.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

So that would be a good development.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

So your, Your. Your future project, what's it called? And when.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yes.

[James Reed]

You're going to relaunch this, you said.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah. So Feeding Britain's Future. We launched back in 2012 with 150 companies and at the time, it was really to help get skills into school, so. So people recognized our sector, but also give them the skills to do jobs. And so we had 30,000 children that we worked with when we launched. Since then, we've actually been in schools with 15,000 children every year. We've been quite quiet about it. We've got some brilliant supporting companies that help us so they get that real life and younger people kind of coming in and talking to them. But actually, at that time, there was an unemployment problem for young people. Clearly we have the same challenge, unfortunately.

[James Reed]

Again. Yes.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yep. So it feels the right time to be relaunching. So we'll be relaunching in early June. We're hoping to work. We've already got a lot of organizations very keen to work with us and there's really kind of five parts of that. So that is to join us on the make youe Mark campaign, which obviously you helped Us with last year, but to really focus directly to where children are, to make more awareness of actually the jobs that are available, because that's very limited on some of the careers websites at the moment, we're going to be working more closely with universities, but crucially, getting every. Every organization to think about how do they start with work experience, so how do they help partner with careers and enterprise, really get young people?

[James Reed]

So the message for business owners is to think about work experience, opportunities and creating them and you'll help push that along and bring people into it. Yeah, that sounds a really good initiative. Feeding Britain's future. So it's actually about the future of the people rather than the food in this case.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yes.

[James Reed]

Yeah.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Because we do know, don't we, that if people don't have a good start in life, then the rest of their life is challenged. And I think if people of the children that are out of work at the moment or the young people that are out of work, I think one in four of them have not had any role.

[James Reed]

No. And 16 of young people are out of work, which is higher than continental Europe now, which is. It's really worrying. But the concern is, if you don't work in your 20s, it's quite likely you weren't in your 30s, 40s and 50s. So that's something that needs to be tackled urgently. I agree.

[Sarah Bradbury]

How do we inspire them? How do we see opportunities and how do we actually just get them started somewhere?

[James Reed]

Yeah.

[Sarah Bradbury]

And then they can build from that.

[James Reed]

So there's quite a lot going on at the moment in terms of reviews around this. So I'm hopeful that, you know, there'll be a convergence of policy and business.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

Energy to change it. But we are challenged, aren't we, by these costs? I mean, you've mentioned them.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

You know, every other conversation I have with a business person, they mentioned national insurance.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yep.

[James Reed]

So doesn't that need to change? I mean, can we sort of persuade government to do something about cost? Because it seems, you know, cost is a fundamental aspect of business. And what I mean, to have a sort of focus on reducing costs would be helpful, wouldn't it?

[Sarah Bradbury]

I think the. Look, there's lots of skills gaps, there's lots of areas that need to have people in jobs. So I think in the food industry specifically, we're going to be creating new models, we're going to be working differently in the future. And we've also got. I think we're finding that filling jobs is taking a lot longer than it has before. So there are jobs There we just need to start getting people into them, training them and then seeing kind of the opportunities ahead. So we can't deny that there's kind

[James Reed]

of cost pressures, but there are jobs there. I think that's important to stress.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

So. So people listening should.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

Be encouraged by that.

[Sarah Bradbury]

And I think people listening also encourage your children. You know, what we find is people avoid our sector. Parents don't encourage their children to come into our sector because they. If they haven't experienced the amazing opportunities that we've got, you know, we. We are, as an industry, double the size at least, of their of the nhs from being the biggest private employer. You know, there really is opportunities at all different levels.

[James Reed]

So how many people work in the sector, then? I mean, that's suggesting several million.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah. So we are the largest private employer in the uk.

[James Reed]

As a sector.

[Sarah Bradbury]

As a sector, yeah.

[James Reed]

So it's interesting, your role, Sarah, is not business specific. You're seeking to build a whole sector here, which is, as an entrepreneurial endeavor, is massive, isn't it? I mean, it's quite impressive. So. So what. What are the key levers that would help you really help deliver a thriving food sector in the uk?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So I think the more people work together and the more that they can help share what we do, share the stories, the journeys that people have been on, get people in to see the work experience that you've talked about, really sign up, be part of the challenge together. The more we can all help each other, because there are limited resources in order to, from a financial perspective, but the more we can talk with one voice, be one industry, collaborate more and help each other, then the easier it's going to be for our sector to be a sector that people want to join.

[James Reed]

Right. Is. Is technology changing it a lot? I mean, because we hear about AI sort of taking jobs away in other spaces, but maybe your sex is protected from that somewhat.

[Sarah Bradbury]

So there are six areas, really, that we think kind of skills for the future can help us. So technologies, absolutely. Adopting technologies is going to be one of them. AI, robotic robotics, novel food processes, they're all going to help us kind of move forward. But there's regenerative and sustainable production, there's loads of jobs in that area. Improving population, health through the way that we're creating food, that's going to be something that's going to need an awful lot of work going forward. And then embedding the whole circularity, how are we going to use the whole of products as well as everything that goes on in manufacturing, moving forward. So there's lots of different areas that are going to be growing. You're going to be needing different skills and we're going to be needing to boost productivity as well.

[James Reed]

So for people listening, thinking about where they might want to work, there's a

[Sarah Bradbury]

range of opportunities there and we're an area with purpose. So when we think about young people that want to change things, think about what the future needs. The food industry is one of them.

[James Reed]

So you've stressed purpose more than ones that. That's striking to me. Is that because, I mean, clearly food is very important to all of us.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

And there's obvious purpose in that. But do you think young people particularly are looking for jobs with purpose? Is that something.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah, so some of our research has definitely looked at one. Young people want to work differently. That's still going to be a challenge.

[James Reed]

In what way?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So the way they work, the way they want to be move between jobs, between areas, the hours they want to work, those things are all going to need our industry to adapt because we're slightly more traditional today. But there is lots of roles, whether it's from a STEM perspective, whether it's shop floor perspective, whether it's moving around. But the purpose element is when we're thinking about climate change, resilience, food cannot be taken for granted like it has been in the past.

[James Reed]

No, definitely not. So looking forwards into the future, I mean, you've obviously got your new initiative, but what. What have you learned about young, I mean, talking about young people, so barriers that they might face in terms of coming into the world of work. And how can companies, maybe you, you suggested a, you know, an emphasis on a little bit more flexibility, but how can companies be sort of engaged and supportive of young people in ways that perhaps they're not at the moment?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So I think we need to target different interventions. So whether that be back to the kind of work experience or how we go and talk to them differently, try and understand, be more inclusive from some of the policies that people work with and address kind of some of the more persistent barriers. So I think attractiveness is clear. Key understanding where attractiveness, as in attractiveness of our industry, how do we show up, how do we talk about it, how do we show the progressive nature of our industry? There's definitely a where and how to be visible in schools and in later careers, and then there is thinking about the kind of work that they want to do as well. So how do we position that work differently as an intervention as well?

[James Reed]

I mean, it's a difficult Problem, isn't it? Because we've just been talking about 16% of young people out of work, which in the old days you'd think would make them hungry to go and look for a job. And then you have to make yourselves more attractive to encourage them to come and apply. I mean, there's a funny mismatch going on here, isn't there? I mean it sounds, that sounds like a big problem.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah. I wonder whether we, how do we

[James Reed]

sort of unlock that.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah, I wonder whether we're actually meeting young people where they are. That's some of the research that we're looking at with others at the moment. So is it that we have to talk to more people? You, you would probably know this better than me on TikTok. Where are they looking for jobs? Because currently we don't, we don't seem to be getting through to them well enough. They must be looking somewhere. What are they doing with their time? I think that some of the questions has been quite interesting that people have been.

[James Reed]

Have you, have you, have you been able to surface any insights on that?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Not quite yet.

[James Reed]

Not yet, no. Because, yeah, I think that will be interesting. I think businesses getting closer to schools makes sense.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

And we have evidence through Reading Partnership that where children at school are exposed to visits from businesses and talks with, you know, local companies that they're much more likely to go on and get a job successfully just because they have a bit of basic understanding.

[Sarah Bradbury]

We, we'd done some similar research actually with some of our schools programs and it was showed that 86% more likely to kind of get a job if they've been exposed over three times to different industries.

[James Reed]

Yeah. So is there anything else that policymakers can do to help make the industry more attractive to young people?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Is there a. I think, as we've just said, there's lots of different interventions happening, whether it be T level, V level or the apprenticeship side. I think we've got to see how they flow out. But I think there's definitely more in apprenticeships that needs to be done, especially in the food industry from a flexibility perspective and making it more bite sized learning, helping people use education in work more proactively.

[James Reed]

Yeah, I mean, I think. So what you're saying, I think is that there are some things that have been announced that are hopefully going to come forward successfully, such as V levels, you know, gold standard apprenticeships, the T levels that once in place will be helpful.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

So a lot of attention needs to be given to ensure that that's delivered successfully, executed successfully. Doesn't it?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

Because I mean, that could be a generational change if it's done well.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah.

[James Reed]

Or it could be an announcement that's forgotten in three years time if it's not. I think you have a role to play in helping that happen, don't you? As an organization?

[Sarah Bradbury]

We're, we're not. We're trying to work on more of the. With careers and enterprise. On the career side, I think people like British Nutrition foundation are working with the. Within schools.

[James Reed]

So you'd separate curriculum from careers.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah, I mean they clearly come together and actually we are, we're working with some of the food sector at the moment of how do they, how do they help educate in schools? But I do think that they're slightly separate if. If today's problem is helping people get into work.

[James Reed]

Yeah.

[Sarah Bradbury]

The food industry has roles that people can get into work. That's kind of a bit more of our, our area at this moment in time, but I think how. More collaboratively, how does the industry work closely with government to help that all industries work more closely with government to make sure the solutions are the right solutions to help people in the future the better.

[James Reed]

And what about the hospitality end that you're involved with that as well?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yes. UK hospitality have been part of our make youe Mark campaigns as well. I think they are a brilliant industry and they work very closely in order to really get people in on those kind of Saturday jobs, evening shifts or whatever as they move along. And that's definitely. They talk about the progression and the opportunities from that side. But yes, the work we're doing here is really to try and be across the board and help everybody and you can move within. Within our industry as well.

[James Reed]

Very good. Well, I wish you continued success with that, Sarah. Thanks for going to talk to me. And for young people, I think it's a brilliant industry to enter because there are a whole range of opportunities and you accumulate experience pretty quickly if you're working in a store or in a restaurant or on a farm and, and they're lifelong skills that you learn. So I think they're really good. So I hope that you are able to spread that message and, and the young people listening will give some thought to your industry as, as a possible place to go and work. I always ask two questions at the end, Sarah, of my guests. The first is because we at Reid Love Mondays is what gets you up on a Monday morning.

[Sarah Bradbury]

I'm really passionate about what I do. I love working across the industry. I feel my role is a complete privilege to be able to support our brilliant industry, uniting and inspiring them. I'm very energetic, so nothing's ever enough. So I do work very hard because I think there's more that can always be done. So collaborating, uniting and convening is something that wakes me up in the morning.

[James Reed]

Collaborating, uniting and convening sounds like your mantra, is that right? Sounds like that's a phrase you've used, which is. Is a good one. So. And my last question, which is in my interview book, why you 101 interview questions you'll never fear again is where do you see yourself in five years time?

[Sarah Bradbury]

I'm only two and a half years into this job and I think the IGD is a unique place to work. I could probably still see myself working at IGD in 5 years time. I think we've got so much more to give the industry. Being a CEO is a privilege. I work across 30 CEOs as part of a CEO forum. We work really closely with government and.

[James Reed]

Yeah, hang on, when you say that, that's interesting. You work across 30 seat. What do you mean?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So I run a CEO forum four times a year. Okay.

[James Reed]

And one of these CEOs are from where?

[Sarah Bradbury]

So from Tesco, Sainsbury's nephew, President Coke, nestle. You get 30 together together in a Chatham House environment where we often.

[James Reed]

You can't tell us what you say there.

[Sarah Bradbury]

No. But the.

[James Reed]

So they, they help each other.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yeah, it's brilliant. We clearly have a lawyer in the room to make sure that we're doing the right thing. But actually really understanding the different challenges of different businesses and all to move to the same direction, whether it's from an economic resilience, environmental health, all the big challenges facing our industry, I can help them work together and work with government. So that is an absolute privilege in my role.

[James Reed]

That must have some challenges because I know in our industry there's some pretty strong rivalries. I don't know. You would think you'd be half pleased to see a competitor, but not totally.

[Sarah Bradbury]

I'm thinking, yeah, 100%. Of course there is. But I think people leave their business mostly at the door. So it really is a. People understand that we'll get better together. The industry, when they're moving in the same direction, which generally people want to, it's more helpful and it also creates that level playing field. First mover is not always an advantage. It can actually, when you're changing the way things are done, be more difficult.

[James Reed]

Yeah. So who sets the agenda for that? Do you?

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yes, I'm lucky. At the moment, I work with Simon Roberts as the president, so he helps me with that.

[James Reed]

Very good. Well, thank you. And I wish you continued success with that.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Thank you very much.

[James Reed]

We all want good food.

[Sarah Bradbury]

Yes.

[James Reed]

Thank you. Sarah, thanks for coming in to talk to me. Thank you, Sarah, for joining me on All About Business. I'm your host, James Reid, chairman and CEO of Reed, a family run recruitment and philanthropy company. If you'd like to find out more about the work of the Institute of Grocery Distribution, IGD or read, you'll find the links in the show notes. Thank you for listening and see you next time.