Back to the Office After 26 Years Remote

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Back to the Office After 26 Years Remote"

Podcast Information:

• Title: Back to the Office After 26 Years Remote
• Host: Jill Schlesinger, CFP®
• Release Date: June 16, 2025
• Platform: Audacy

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Introduction

In this episode of Jill on Money with Jill Schlesinger, host Jill Schlesinger delves into the financial implications of transitioning back to an office environment after an extended period of remote work. The episode centers around a listener call from Mary, a long-term remote employee facing mandatory office returns after 26 years of working from home.

Listener Call: Mary's Situation

Mary, a 56-year-old professional from Southern California, calls in to seek advice after receiving notice from her employer mandating a return to the office for four days a week. Having worked remotely for 26 years at her company, Mary planned to retire at 62, leveraging her husband's pension, which provides $66,000 annually. Her husband recently retired and has established a stable financial foundation with multiple income streams, including a pension, a "golden handshake," and substitute teaching.

Mary's Concerns:

• Mandatory Office Return: The sudden policy shift requires her to work four days a week in the office, disrupting her long-term remote work arrangement.
• Retirement Plans: Mary aimed to retire in six years but now faces uncertainty about extending her career to comply with the new policy.
• Financial Security: While her and her husband’s combined income exceeds $200,000 annually, Mary is concerned about the potential impact on her ability to retire as planned if she cannot continue working remotely.

Financial Analysis and Advice

Jill begins by understanding Mary's comprehensive financial picture, which includes:

• Income:

  • Mary's Salary: $120,000 with a 15% bonus.
  • Husband’s Pension: $66,000 annually with a 2% straight-line benefit.
  • Golden Handshake: $21,000 annually until July 2028.
  • Substitute Teaching: Approximately $18,000 annually.

• Expenses:

  • Monthly Expenses: Around $10,000, including $1,600 monthly travel costs.

• Assets:

  • Home: Valued at ~$1 million with a mortgage of $333,000 at 2.875%.
  • Retirement Accounts:
    • Mary’s 401(k): $1.169 million.
    • Husband’s Fidelity Rollover IRA: $354,000.
    • Additional IRA: $50,000.
  • Liquid Assets: $25,000 in checking/savings and $131,000 in CDs.

Jill recognizes that Mary is in a relatively strong financial position but acknowledges the stress and uncertainty caused by the sudden work policy change.

Key Advice Provided by Jill:

1. Evaluate Current Financial Cushion:

   • With substantial retirement savings and multiple income streams, Jill suggests that Mary and her husband are well-prepared to handle the transition if it extends slightly beyond the initial retirement plan.

2. Consider Early Retirement:

   • Jill encourages Mary to explore the possibility of retiring a few years earlier if feasible, leveraging their savings and pension benefits.
   • Jill notes, “It’s always worth it. Cause you get an automatic 8% increase” in Social Security benefits if delayed.

3. Supplementary Income Streams:

   • Mary could consider increasing substitute teaching or exploring other part-time work to bridge any financial gaps if retirement is delayed.
   • Mary: “I was thinking that I could perhaps do the substitute teaching as well. Probably earn about the same.”

4. Life Insurance Considerations:

   • Jill discusses the potential need for life insurance to protect Mary's financial future in case of her husband's untimely passing, recommending consultation with a financial planner.
   • Jill: “There is, there is a case to be made that we take your husband's rollover IRA or we take money from the brokerage account and we think about buying some life insurance.”

5. Engage a Financial Planner:

   • Given the complexities and potential wild cards in Mary’s situation, Jill strongly advises seeking a fiduciary financial planner to create a robust financial strategy.
   • Jill: “I really would encourage [Mary] ... to hire a financial planner ... because I think there's a lot of wild cards here.”

6. Explore Remote Work Alternatives:

   • Jill suggests Mary might seek roles within her company or industry that allow for continued remote work, mitigating the impact of the new policy.

Notable Quotes:

• Jill Schlesinger (05:05): “...you have not. It's not like tons and tons of money. And if you knew that you were going to get that 66 forever, then sure, no biggie.”
• Mary (12:09): “It is causing me so much stress and anxiety and just the upheaval.”
• Jill Schlesinger (17:20): “Mary, you're in really good shape. You guys have done a good job... you need some security in this, and I think you're going to need some plan...”

Conclusions and Next Steps

Jill concludes the conversation by reaffirming Mary’s strong financial position while addressing her immediate concerns about the return-to-office mandate. The primary recommendations include:

• Consulting a Professional: Engaging a financial planner to navigate the complexities introduced by the potential delay in retirement.
• Exploring Employment Flexibility: Investigating possibilities within her current role or elsewhere that might accommodate her preference for remote work.
• Bolstering Safety Nets: Considering life insurance and other financial products to safeguard against unforeseen circumstances.

Jill’s Closing Remarks: “If you have a change in your work life that has been thrust upon you, I think we're going to hear more and more stories like this. ... Think about hiring a financial planner ... You're in really good shape ... you need some security in this, and I think you're going to need some plan.”

Mary expresses gratitude for the guidance, and Jill assures her of continued support by offering to connect her with a reliable financial planner.

Final Thoughts

This episode poignantly highlights the intersection of career shifts and financial planning, emphasizing the importance of proactive financial strategies in adapting to unexpected changes in the workplace. Jill Schlesinger effectively addresses Mary's anxiety by providing actionable insights and encouraging professional financial consultation, serving as a valuable resource for listeners navigating similar challenges.

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For More Information:

• Visit jillonmoney.com for additional resources and financial advice.
• Subscribe to "Jill on Money Live" for access to live webinars and exclusive content.

Transcript

[Jill Schlesinger]

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[Jill Schlesinger]

Welcome to the Jill on Money show. It's Monday, June16, and we are here answering your financial questions. If you have one, just go to our website jillonmoney.com click the contact us button, write us a note, and if you'd like to join us live, check the box. Mark will do everything else. Hey, while you're on the website, check out our service called Jill on Money Live, our subscription service. I feel such a big girl when I say subscription service and paywall, things like that. Basically, if you give us 45 bucks for the next 12 months, you're entitled to join us for free. Four live webinars. We do them quarterly. You'll also be able to get the entire back catalog of those webinars, including the most recent one, which was incredible with Mike Quincy, the car guy at Consumer Reports. But you'll get the whole back catalog, all the different webinars we've done. You'll also get bonus audio and video content. Again, it's just 45 bucks for the next 12 months. So all that lives on our website jillonmoney.com today we are talking to Mary, who is on the line from Southern California. I feel like there's a song there. Mary, welcome to the program. What can we do for you?

[Mary]

I'm super excited to be here. I tell everyone that you are my friend Jill, when I'm talking about all the things, great things I hear on your program.

[Jill Schlesinger]

I would love that. I. Thank you.

[Mary]

You're like my best friend.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Oh, I have so many friends. I feel very lucky. You know, one of the reasons that this show is so much fun is that it's this immediate gratification. It's like this moment where I get to hang out with you for, like, I'm sitting at a bar stool, we're talking about your stuff, and then you're like, okay, bye. My. My husband. My wife's here. Bye. And you go. And it's kind of fun for me. So what can we do for you today?

[Mary]

I have been at my company for 30 years. I've been working remotely for 26. My plan. I'm 56. My husband, we have been together a really long time. We just got married last September.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Congratulations.

[Mary]

Thank you. He retired two years ago with a pension, which you love. And one of the reasons that kind of helped push in that direction to retire for him was that I could work anywhere and we have kids all over the country, slash world. So my plan was to retire when I was 62 in about six more years. But we found out from my work about a month ago that there is going to be a return to office with mandatory four days a week in office. Yep. So I'm just kind of trying to figure out where I'm at, how much longer, how long I have to suck it up and do it. I feel like we could swing it. It would be tight, but we could swing it. But my husband's pension does stop. If he were to pass away.

[Jill Schlesinger]

How's his health? If I dare ask brutally honest questions, he's very healthy. How old is he?

[Mary]

He'll be 65 at the end of the month.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay, so he'll be able to go onto Medicare, right?

[Mary]

Yeah, he's currently on mine. My benefits, like, we waived Medicare just since I'm working right now.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Got it.

[Mary]

But yes.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay. Now you get this notice from the company, which I'm so furious about these companies, I can't even tell you. I'm a furious on everybody's behalf because it's such nonsense. You've been doing this. Fine. I've looked at emails like this. And then a few months later, someone's like, oh, yeah, but my boss says I'm fine. Like, is there going to be. Is. Are we sure this is going to happen for you specifically?

[Mary]

Yeah, we are. And I've kind of gone down a bunch of different roads and they're, you know, Even people who are out of state, it's very. It's not being really applied super consistently. But there are people out of state that they're giving, you know, offers to either relocate or pay severance, which is cool that they are paying severance. And even in state, people that are more than like 50 miles away, they're making either come in or, you know.

[Jill Schlesinger]

I hope you're more than 50 miles away. Are you?

[Mary]

I'm not. Nope.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay.

[Mary]

Yeah, I didn't get a package.

[Jill Schlesinger]

How much money do you make right now, Mary?

[Mary]

My salary is about 120,000 and then I get a bonus of about 15% on top of that. And over the 30 years I've been the company that's pretty consistently paid.

[Jill Schlesinger]

What's your husband's pension look like?

[Mary]

About 66,000 a year. Little more than that gross. And there's a 2% not compounded straight line.

[Jill Schlesinger]

So annoying. Okay. Yep. How's your cash flow right now in this 200 plus thousand dollars for the two of you?

[Mary]

So he also has a. A golden handshake that will where he gets about 21,000 a year. And that's paid out through. There's about three more years on that probably to like July of 2028.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay.

[Mary]

And then he also is substitute teaching a couple days a week and probably conservatively about 18,000 a year on that. And he's planning on doing that for, you know, probably two to three more years. He likes it. Gives him something to do.

[Jill Schlesinger]

That's cool. So you've got like a good chunk of money coming in. What do your expenses look like?

[Mary]

About 10,000amonth, but that's with like, on average over the last couple years, about 1600amonth in travel.

[Jill Schlesinger]

That's great. That's fun. You have kids all over the country and world. You said that.

[Mary]

We do.

[Jill Schlesinger]

So do you guys own your own home?

[Mary]

Yes.

[Jill Schlesinger]

What's it worth?

[Mary]

It's worth a million. Ish. We owe about 333,000 at 2.875.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Any other real estate besides the primary?

[Mary]

No.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay.

[Mary]

There is one little thing to mention with the house, though. So if my husband were to pass away first with the house and I sell it, half of the money goes to his kids, so. Yeah.

[Jill Schlesinger]

All right. So you have a half interest. That's fine.

[Mary]

Yep, exactly.

[Jill Schlesinger]

They do. They don't have to kick you out. They're not. They can't kick you out of your half half. Okay, that's fine. Okay. So 10 grand a month. You got all this income. So some of it is going to end, but, you know, so far, so good. And your husband is, like, you know, doing his thing for the next few years, which is great. Now you're going to tell us about all the oodles of money that you guys have saved that will allow you to give the finger to the person who says you have to come in four days a week.

[Mary]

Yep. Okay. So I have my 401k. I have 1.169 million.

[Jill Schlesinger]

I'm going to call it 170.

[Mary]

My husband has a fidelity rollover IRA of 354,000.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Great.

[Mary]

He also has another IRA of about 50,000 that I am not the beneficiary on, but RMDs I'm sure will.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay.

[Mary]

And then we have checking savings about 25,000, and CDs about 131,000.

[Jill Schlesinger]

When you said you. You said, okay, 10 grand a month average, including a bunch of, you know, whatever, 18, $20,000 on travel. You want to keep traveling, though, right?

[Mary]

We do.

[Jill Schlesinger]

We're not gonna. What you're asking is, you know, how much do I really have to suck this up for? How long if I have to go in four days a week and, like, I want to keep living my life. Right.

[Mary]

Yeah.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay. Yeah. So if. Is there anything else that we should know about on your. Look at your balance sheet, like money, something you own, something you owe, or any other future income you could receive?

[Mary]

No.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay. Are your parents alive?

[Mary]

My mom's alive.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay. Do you have to take care of her maybe?

[Mary]

No. She also has a pension. Everyone but me, you know.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Oh. Thankfully, if you had a pension, I might say get your tush into the office. But let's see. Let say. Say, would you be willing, like your husband, like, let's say we. Looking at these numbers, is there a world in which you would be able to create some income after you leave this company?

[Mary]

Yeah, I was thinking that I could perhaps do the substitute teaching as well. Probably earn about the same.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay. So then we'd have 18 grand and 18 grand in substitute teaching, 66 grand in his pension. I'm not even including the 21,000 for. For his. That, you know, those. That extra payment for next three years. Just sock that away. Just keep building up your cash. Okay. Or put it. Do you have a brokerage account? Do you have any brokerage funds?

[Mary]

We do not.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay. So just sock that away in cash. That's fine. So if you could also substitute teach and we look at this, you know, you're not there yet, but it's pretty close when does your husband think he's going to claim Social Security or does he already.

[Mary]

He does not. And that was a question for you. We kind of thought that as long as he's getting that golden handshake through 2028, it probably he could wait.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Yes.

[Mary]

But then we didn't see a ton of difference between looking at the numbers from like 67 to 68. So I didn't know if it was worth it.

[Jill Schlesinger]

It's always worth it. Cause you get an automatic 8% increase. So what's his Social Security benefit at 68 or 70? Whatever.

[Mary]

At 68, it's 983.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay, 9.

[Mary]

And that was. That just really changed because of that. Them eliminating that windfall.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Yeah, the windfall elimination provision being scrapped. So that's good. That's money you didn't think you were going to get. What is your Social Security benefit at Your full retirement age? 67?

[Mary]

35? 95.

[Jill Schlesinger]

We have 11 years that we need to be thinking about. Right. During those 11 years, I mean, you have socked away a lot of money. So I don't want to sugarcoat, like, oh, you know, oh, you're poor or anything. That's not. But I'm. But you have not. It's not like tons and tons of money. And if you knew that you were going to get that 66 forever, then sure, no biggie.

[Mary]

Yep.

[Jill Schlesinger]

But that's not necessarily the case. And he might be in great health. So if you do had. If you had to work four days a week. I hate to do this to you. How long can you really last? Like, how many. How much could you really do this? Are you just, like, there's no way I'm doing it. I. I want to know what I'm dealing with.

[Mary]

I don't know. I mean, I'm not going to leave before I try it, you know, but I just. It's causing me so much stress and anxiety and just the upheaval. So I have worked 80% for years and years. So I work five short days. It's just that my whole life, you know?

[Jill Schlesinger]

Yeah, of course. It's like you've lived this for more than, like, almost three decades. Come on.

[Mary]

Yeah, exactly. So, I mean, I definitely want to try it. So, you know, my. My plan had been 62 before all this came up. And so I thought, well, could I suck it up and just do it till I'm 60? And, you know, with the numbers work then? And that's kind of what I'm wondering. It's just like, how long I have to suck it up. If I can't do it, how much money I need to make somewhere else. Yeah.

[Jill Schlesinger]

So are your max. Are you maxing out your 401k with a catch up contribution right now on your, on your 130 or 35,000 that you're making, are you putting in the maximum to your 401k?

[Mary]

No, I'm putting in 17% to Roth. And then on that bonus I put 10% to traditional just because it's taxed so heavily. And then I matched 10% all to traditional.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Okay. There's a million and a half dollars of retirement money that hasn't mostly has not been taxed.

[Mary]

Right.

[Jill Schlesinger]

And then you would be continuing to work for, I mean, let's say three more years. Let's not go crazy. Do you think that at age 60 or 59 and a half, like where do we, where would that. So we had a few years, the million and a half would grow. There'd be new money going in. You know, we'd get to, I don't know, let's 1 8. If presuming we're not in some horrendous, you know, bear market or whatever. And the reality is, could we, could we have, I mean we. You could potentially. This is so weird that I'm even saying this. There is a, maybe a case like if you could have bought life insurance, you know, to protect.

[Mary]

That's one of my questions. Yeah.

[Jill Schlesinger]

You know, there is, there is a case to be made that we take your husband's rollover IRA or we take money from the brokerage account and we think about buying some life insurance. The problem, I mean, what do we need life insurance for? The big issue is really in the next 10 years. Right. Because if in 10 years he passes away and you don't have that income and yet you're not receiving Social Security yet. That's the question. I don't know how expensive a 10 year term policy would be. It's probably really expensive for a 65 year old, but it is worth looking into and maybe even looking into some sort of horrendous policy that is a universal life policy. That's a paid up policy for a certain amount of money that would protect some portion of that. You know, talking this through and I'm wondering whether it makes sense for you guys. I mean, I don't know, maybe think about hiring a financial planner to help you through this period. I really would encourage that for you because I think there's a lot of wild cards here and we since we don't know how to protect. I don't have all the products knowledge that you would need for that, but I do think you're close. I mean, it just seems so arbitrary that they just like, oh, yeah, let's go back to work, whatever. And at the same time, you know, could you also find something that is in the same field where you could continue working remote? I don't know. That's maybe something to think about, but I really think, I think this is a financial planning kind of problem that could be solved. And, you know, I know I. I've met some great financial planners in Southern California.

[Mary]

Okay.

[Jill Schlesinger]

So I just was recently there and I think it, it would be, it would be kind of cool and helpful that if I could give you some folks there. I feel like this is not like a. Yeah, you're close. And no, I think there's like, you need some. You're going to need some security in this, and I think you're going to need a plan, but you are close. That is true. Okay.

[Mary]

Okay.

[Jill Schlesinger]

So I don't want you to get like, all bummed out. I'm not giving you the bum out yet, but okay, you're definitely, you're close.

[Mary]

Okay. Okay.

[Jill Schlesinger]

All right. What else do you need to know from me?

[Mary]

Is there a breaking point to, to like, of like how much to spend on something like that?

[Jill Schlesinger]

Like, well, it would really have to be. You can't have all of the liquidity soaked up from the rest of your money going towards this insurance policy because you have to live on the money. So there's a balancing act. It may not be that you could protect 100% of this pension, but even some part of it. Right.

[Mary]

Okay.

[Jill Schlesinger]

So you're not going to be able to be like, oh, I'm going to have a million dollar policy, boom, done. You know, but even if it were a fract of that, that would give you a lot more comfort, I think.

[Mary]

Yeah. Yeah, for sure.

[Jill Schlesinger]

So I think that, Mary, you're in. You are in really good shape. You guys have done a good job. This sort of feels like, oh, my God, I can't. It's sort of like when we talk to all those folks who are in federal government and they got like the pink slip and you're like, I was planning to do something very different. I think that for you, you should absolutely talk to a financial planner, a fiduciary, someone who's going to be like a normal person and take care of you. Okay.

[Mary]

Okay. Okay.

[Jill Schlesinger]

All right, so standby and mark's going to send follow up with you. I just sent. I'm about to send him an email. He doesn't even know this person. I like to give him. I like to keep him on his toes, Mary, you know what I'm saying? And I presume because you have this is, you know there are children from all over the place that you have your estate documents done, right?

[Mary]

We sure do. We just got them redone when we got married, so.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Great. Yeah. All right. Well, congratulations on the wedding and we wish you the best of luck. We'll send you a referral and you let us know how it goes. And if you don't like this person, we'll find you someone else. Okay, perfect.

[Mary]

Thank you so much.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Oh, of course. It's a pleasure to talk to a good friend like you. See that? That's right. Hanging out with you. If you have a change in your work life that has been thrust upon you, I think we're going to hear more and more stories like this. Mark, get in touch with us. Go to jillonmoney.com, click the contact us button. Let us know if you'd be willing to come on the air by checking the little box. It's so easy to do. And don't forget, while you're on the website, check out all of our content that lives there, including the free weekly newsletter. It's a substack subscription now. Free. Free. Free. Okay. And check that out. It's all on the website. You can subscribe to us on the Odysee app or wherever you find your favorite podcasts. Do me a favor. Put your hands, metaphorically on someone's back. Think about someone. Reach out to someone, text someone, call somebody. Old school school calling works. It's really worth it. People need each other right now. Change your work, change your wealth, change your life. Thank you for listening. We'll talk to you tomorrow. Buying a home in California can certainly feel intimidating. We hear from listeners all the time throughout the state and they want to know, where can they even start making. Many of them find that turning to a Realtor changed everything. Realtors can help buyers understand what they can afford. They can explain all of the steps that are involved in purchasing a home, and they can walk you through every detail, from making an offer to closing the deal. Working with a realtor can help you feel less alone or unsure about the process and that peace of mind that is the power of having a realtor by your side. Whether you're ready to move or are just starting to dream, don't go it alone. Don't let what you don't know stop you from starting your next chapter. Find your [e-mail] that's championsofhome.com I'm Emma.

[Emma Grede]

Greed and I've spent the last 20 years building, running and investing in some incredible businesses. I've co founded a multi billion dollar unicorn and had my hand in several other companies that have generated hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars. The more success I've had, the more people started coming to me with questions. How do you start a business? How do you raise money? How do I bounce back from failure? So it got me thinking. Why not just ask the people I aspire to the most? How did they actually do what they do? I'm so incredibly lucky to know some of the smartest minds out there. And now I'm bringing their insights along with mine, unfiltered, directly to you. On my new podcast, Aspire with Emma Greed. I'll dive into the big questions everyone wants to know about success in business and in life through weekly conversations. You'll get the tangible tools, the real no BS stories, and undeniable little hacks that actually help you level up. Listen to and follow Aspire with Emma Greed An Odyssey podcast available now wherever you get your podcasts.