What to Do With Pension Lump Sum?

Summary

Episode Summary: "What to Do With Pension Lump Sum?"

Podcast Information:

• Title: Jill on Money with Jill Schlesinger
• Host/Author: Audacy
• Episode: What to Do With Pension Lump Sum?
• Release Date: February 20, 2025

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Introduction

In this episode of Jill on Money with Jill Schlesinger, executive producer Mark Tularsio welcomes listeners and introduces the show's mission to help individuals make informed financial decisions. He emphasizes the availability of resources such as their free weekly newsletter and the premium subscription service, Jill on Money Live, which offers live webinars and exclusive content.

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Caller Introduction: Jody from Minnesota (04:20)

Mark Tularsio receives a call from Jody, a 46-year-old professional from Minnesota, seeking advice on managing a pension lump sum she elected a few years ago. Jody is contemplating her retirement plans and wants to ensure she makes the most strategic financial decisions.

Mark Tularsio [05:04]: "What's going on? How can we help you out?"

Jody [05:04]: "I have a pension through my employer, but a couple of years ago, I elected to do the lump sum rather than the monthly payments..."

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Financial Assessment (05:04 - 10:28)

Mark delves into Jody's current financial situation to provide tailored advice. He inquires about her income, retirement accounts, and existing savings.

• Current Income: Approximately $101,000 annually.
• Retirement Accounts:
  • 403B: $80,000 with ongoing contributions to secure her employer's match.
  • Roth IRA: $35,000, primarily funded from the proceeds of selling her house a few years prior.
• Savings: Maintains a checking and savings account with a couple thousand dollars for emergencies.
• Expenses: Recently sold a horse, which cost her around $1,200 per month.

Jody [05:04]: "I have a Roth IRA that I have. I have about 35 in it."

Mark Tularsio [07:05]: "I love when people say this, Mark. They're like, ah, just 80 grand. Like it's nothing."

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Strategic Financial Advice (10:28 - 14:15)

Mark provides Jody with actionable steps to optimize her retirement savings and prepare for future financial stability.

1. Maximize Roth IRA Contributions:

   • Advice: "I think you should start putting in that money into the Roth."
   • Action Plan: Allocate approximately $550-$580 monthly to fully utilize the Roth IRA's annual contribution limit.

2. Increase 403B Contributions:

   • Current Contribution: 4% to receive employer match.
   • Recommendation: Gradually increase contributions to 6%, then 15%, in manageable increments to enhance retirement savings.

3. Boost Emergency Savings:

   • Advice: "Build up your checking savings a little."
   • Reasoning: Strengthen the emergency fund to cover unexpected expenses without derailing long-term savings goals.

Mark Tularsio [10:28]: "Maybe you could make it like 1500 a month. I don't know."

Jody [09:55]: "I definitely."

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Managing the Pension Lump Sum (14:15 - 17:16)

Mark outlines the best practices for handling the pension lump sum, ensuring Jody leverages it effectively for her retirement.

1. IRA Rollover:

   • Suggestion: "Create an IRA rollover account that will receive the funds from both the 403B and the pension."
   • Implementation: Utilize Jody's existing relationship with Fidelity to simplify the rollover process.

2. Investment Strategy:

   • Recommendation: Invest the lump sum in diversified index funds across various asset classes to ensure balanced growth and risk management.

3. Early Retirement Considerations:

   • Discussion: Assessing the viability of retiring early based on current savings, anticipated pension payout (~$275,000 by age 58), and potential reliance on a partner's income.

Mark Tularsio [17:16]: "The easiest thing to do is to create an IRA rollover account that will receive the funds from both the 403B and the pension and then you invest it accordingly."

Jill Schlesinger [17:17]: "That's it. It's not very complicated."

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Addressing Potential Future Scenarios (17:16 - 18:25)

Mark emphasizes the importance of flexibility and regular financial check-ins, considering life changes that may impact retirement plans.

• Scenario Planning: Considering the best-case scenario where Jody retires with sufficient funds and the backup plan if she needs to rely solely on her savings.
• Adaptability: Encouraging Jody to continuously assess her financial health and adjust her savings and investment strategies accordingly.

Mark Tularsio [18:23]: "That's it. It's not very complicated."

Jody [18:25]: "Yeah, totally."

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Conclusion

Mark wraps up the episode by summarizing the key points discussed with Jody, reiterating the importance of maximizing retirement contributions, building an emergency fund, and strategically managing pension lump sums through IRA rollovers and diversified investments. He encourages listeners to utilize the resources available on their website and consider subscribing to Jill on Money Live for more in-depth financial guidance.

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Notable Quotes

• Mark Tularsio [10:28]: "I think you should start putting in that money into the Roth."
• Mark Tularsio [17:16]: "The easiest thing to do is to create an IRA rollover account that will receive the funds from both the 403B and the pension."
• Jody [15:54]: "Definitely."

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Key Takeaways

1. Maximize Retirement Contributions: Fully utilizing Roth IRAs and employer-matched 403B accounts can significantly enhance retirement savings over time.
2. Strategic Investment of Lump Sums: Rolling over pension lump sums into IRA accounts and investing in diversified index funds is a straightforward and effective strategy.
3. Build and Maintain Emergency Funds: Ensuring sufficient liquid savings can provide financial security and flexibility in unexpected situations.
4. Regular Financial Reviews: Continuously assessing and adjusting financial plans ensures alignment with evolving life circumstances and goals.

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For more personalized financial advice and resources, visit jillonmoney.com.

Transcript

[Jill Schlesinger]

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[Mark Tularsio]

Welcome to the Jill on Money show. It's Thursday, February 20th and we are here trying to help you make better financial decisions. Or maybe just give you a little.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Bit of a hall pass.

[Mark Tularsio]

Say hey, you know what, you don't have to worry about the thing that is worrying you. Just get in touch with us and maybe we can work it through with you. And the easiest way to get in touch with us is to go to our website jillonmoney.com while you are there you'll see in the upper right hand corner there is a contact us button. When you click that button a form will pop up. That is the email that we will receive. Tell us what's going on and if we can help you out from that email. Of course, we do email episodes every now and then. But if you want to join us on the air live, check the box. And executive producer Mark Tularsio, the best executive producer in the whole wide world. He will do everything else. Hey, while you're on the website, do me a favor. Check out a couple of things. First of all, our free weekly newsletter comes out every Friday. Mark does such a great job compiling important stories that you may have missed that actually could change or help your life out on the financial road to wellness. The other thing you should check out is our subscription service. It's called Jill on Money Live. And this is a service that costs money. I'm sorry, gang. Some things are free here. Some things cost money. And this one will cost you 45 bucks for the next 12 months. What do you get for that? You get four quarterly webinars. Live webinars. And you can participate in those. You will get content that only lives behind our paywall, the back catalog, all.

[Jill Schlesinger]

That stuff for 45 bucks.

[Mark Tularsio]

And our next webinar is coming up so soon. It is on Thursday, March 6, at 7 Eastern Time. Our special guest will be Ed Slott. He is a CPA and IRA expert. He's the man who really introduced the Roth to us and our whole listening audience and all the power of the Roth. We always knew about it, but he made the case for why so many of you really should be using a Roth. So if you would like to participate in that webinar again, you've got to subscribe to Jill on Money Live. Okay, right now, let's get to you. It's time to go to someone who will help me and Mark really get through the cold New York weather that we are enduring. Jody's on the line from Minnesota. Jody, does it make you crazy to hear us complain about this? I mean, you know what cold weather is, right?

[Jody]

Yeah. 17 below. This morning when I got. So.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay, I'm gonna be quiet now. I'm gonna be quiet. I am, because.17 below. So what's your best tip about staying warm? If you have to go out? Like, I have a dog, so I have to go out. What's your big tip for us?

[Jody]

I always preset my vehicle and this bundle up the hat in this layer up because it's cold. This even walking 20ft.

[Mark Tularsio]

Oh, my gosh. I know. And I. I myself, I'm a big believer in the hat and the layering for sure. And I have like, amazing gloves. I Think that's the. That to me is the big one, which is. I always wear a hat, but if.

[Jill Schlesinger]

You have like so. So gloves.

[Mark Tularsio]

No, not going to cut it. All right, Jody, thank you for all of your weather tips. Now let's get on to what I can do for you. What's going on? How can we help you out?

[Jody]

So I had a question. I have a pension through my employer, but a couple of years ago, I had elected to do the lump sum rather than the monthly payments, installments. And I'm always from retirement, but just still a discussion of like, you know, thinking about my future, of when that time comes, what would be the best thing to do when I leave my employer and get that lump sum.

[Mark Tularsio]

Oh, that's. This is exciting. Are you close to that period where you might get out of work and go into the.

[Jody]

Probably 10 or 15 years. Ish. Or more or so. I, you know, but this is like part of our, you know, I look at my spreadsheet, my finances and my other, you know, my 403B and I have a Roth and all that fun stuff. And it just kind of like. I'm a planner, so it's nice to have a vision of what might be a good place to park that when that day comes.

[Mark Tularsio]

Yeah, you're. You and me both. So, Jody, how old are you?

[Jody]

I'm 46.

[Mark Tularsio]

And are you married? Single? Partnered?

[Jody]

I have a partner.

[Mark Tularsio]

Do you and your partner combine your finances when it comes to planning for retirement, or you. Are we just talking about you alone?

[Jody]

Just me.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay. So let's talk a little bit about what's going on. You said sounds like you got a lot of stuff cooking. The pension has already. You've already elected that. In other words, that was an irrevocable choice. Is that right?

[Jody]

Correct.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay, so let's talk about how much do you earn right now?

[Jody]

Right. At about 101 right now.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay. When you make contributions to retirement, you're putting money into the pension and then also into a deferred comp. Both.

[Jody]

I'm just putting money into my. I have a 403B through my employer as well. So I'm just putting like the 4% to get my match through them. And then I don't think anything comes out of our check to go to the pension.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay, got it. How much Money's in the 403B right now?

[Jody]

I only have about 80,000 in there.

[Mark Tularsio]

80,000. I love when people say this, Mark. They're like, ah, just 80 grand. Like it's nothing. Okay. It's good. That's good. Thank you.

[Jody]

I should have more, though. That's why I say that.

[Mark Tularsio]

Oh, come on, back off on yourself, people. You guys are so hard on yourselves. What else do you have going on?

[Jody]

And then I just have a Roth IRA that I have.

[Mark Tularsio]

Oh.

[Jody]

I say probably. I think there's about 35 in it.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay, and are you contributing to that on an ongoing basis?

[Jody]

I am not. That's where I parked money from when I sold my house a few years ago.

[Mark Tularsio]

Got it. Okay, so we've got the 403B and the Roth IRA. What else is going on? Do you have a brokerage account or a checking and savings account?

[Jody]

I just have a. Like a regular checking and saving account. So I just keep a couple grand in my savings, you know, for emergencies type situation.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay. And that's it. So these are the three big accounts that you have, the 403B, the Roth IRA and the checking savings. Right, Correct. Okay. And do you know what the lump sum right now for the pension is? Or do you have an estimate of what it would be when you leave?

[Jody]

I played. They have a calculator that I kind of played around with. And if I left, I looked at like, say I was like 58, I think, kind of medium of the road there. And it would probably. I mean, I get. Obviously it's an estimation depending on the future markets, but it said like around probably 275.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay. All right, that's great. Okay. And then what else is going on? You said you sold a home. Do you. Do you own a new home or are you living with your partner in their home? What's the living situation?

[Jody]

I live in my partner's home.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay. Do you pay rent or anything like that?

[Jody]

No.

[Mark Tularsio]

What a nice partner you have.

[Jody]

I buy groceries.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay, that's fine. That's okay. And you guys have kids or no kids?

[Jody]

No kids.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay. And no plans for kids?

[Jody]

No.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay.

[Jody]

No, not at all.

[Mark Tularsio]

Come on, you could still.

[Jody]

Kids.

[Mark Tularsio]

So you could go. You could go. You could squeak out, you know, 46. You could still make a case. Right. Okay. So in your. As you move forward, I'm just wondering, out of the 100 1000, the 4% is going into the 403. Otherwise there's not a lot of. I mean, like, you don't have a lot of other money that you're saving, Is that right?

[Jody]

Correct.

[Mark Tularsio]

Where's this money going? I mean, you don't spending it all on groceries?

[Jody]

No. Well, actually, I had a. I had a horse that I just sold Him. And that was a major expense of mine.

[Mark Tularsio]

Aha.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Aha.

[Mark Tularsio]

So that. That. So do you think that you can start to put more money into either the 403B or maybe even contribute to the Roth?

[Jody]

Definitely.

[Mark Tularsio]

How much can we really count on for this? I mean, I don't want to be glib about it because I don't want to spend your money, but let me spend your money. How much was the horse eating? How many oats and dollars?

[Jody]

I would say probably he costs a thousand. Twelve hundred dollars a month. Probably.

[Mark Tularsio]

Whoa, whoa.

[Jody]

It's a cheap hobby.

[Mark Tularsio]

Oh, man, that's rough. 1,000 bucks a month. Okay, so the. I think that the easiest thing to do just given your, you know, kind of where you are for tax filing would be to use the Roth. So at the very least, I think you should start putting in that money into the Roth. I mean, right now you're seven grand in there. And then I guess. Where's the 403B held? Just out of curiosity, what. What organization?

[Jody]

Fidelity.

[Mark Tularsio]

Oh, that's a good one. So maybe. Okay, so I have three things that I want you to concentrate on for your thousand to twelve hundred a month. Or maybe even. Maybe you could make it like 1500amonth. I want you to max out your Roth IRA every year. I really. I think this is going to be very important for you. You can just put in like, whatever 550 or $580 a month. You'll be able to max that out. You can do it monthly very easily. You also need to increase the amount you're putting into your 403. So I know they give you that match on your contributions up to 4%, but, you know, maybe could we go to at least 6% for now? Okay.

[Jody]

Yeah.

[Mark Tularsio]

And then everything left. I want you to build up your checking savings. Does your partner make a bunch of money? Do. Do. In other words, I'm your light on your emergency reserve fund. Okay. But I don't want to go crazy with this. If you're actually with somebody who is. Is your emergency reserve fund.

[Jody]

Yeah.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Yes.

[Mark Tularsio]

Yes. That person makes a lot of money.

[Jody]

Yes.

[Mark Tularsio]

I like that in a partner. Believe me. Mark and I both vote for that as a partnership. It's very good. So I think that I'd like that checking and savings, though, to get beefed up a little. So I think if you've got your 1200amonth, let's say that, you know, putting five or 550 bucks a month into your Roth, then, you know, put 3, 4% more so you want to get your contribution. What I'd like you to do is get that contribution to your 403B up to 15%. Doesn't happen to happen all at once. But it would be great if you said, okay, let me do. You know, here we are, it's February. Let me increase it at least by 2%. So 2%, and then you're putting your Roth money away and then build up your checking savings. If in a few months you're checking and savings, you've built it up to more like, you know, 7, 8, 9, 10 grand, right? Then you're gonna slowly increase that 403B instead. So if you went from 4 to 6, go to 6 to 8, then go 8 to 10. But every few months, check in with yourself. See, you know, hey, how's my cash flow feel? That's important. Now, why did you mention age 58 for the pension lump sum?

[Jody]

Well, because I messed on the dates between, like, I was 55 and 60.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay.

[Jody]

And so I just kind of picked the middle of the road there.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay.

[Jody]

And I want to retire early because my mom passed away at 66, and I just kind of have the back of my head. She never really retired. And I, you know, worry about that.

[Mark Tularsio]

I worry about that. I worry about that for you. But I also worry that you are. I mean, unless your mother has a condition that you've inherited, the retiring early sounds like, great, as long as you have enough money to retire early. And so if I look ahead, you know, for 12, 13 years from now, you know, you'll get that 275, maybe it's 300 in the pension. You'll have a 403B. But, like, that's not enough money for you to retire on your own. I'll tell you that right now. So if you're telling me that, you know, oh, I really don't want to count on my partner when I think about retirement, I can be very clearly lay out for you that that's. You will not have enough money to retire on your own if you're living on whatever it is, five or six grand a month. If you are in the back of your mind thinking, you know what, no, we're probably going to be together, and I don't really need to have that much money saved because my partner has a, you know, I'm not paying for this. That, the other thing. But if it were just you alone, Jody Singleton, no way this is going to work. But if you have a partner who you're committed to and this relationship is like, you're not going to have to pay for housing. Like, if really the only thing you're paying you're. You're doing is like having a few bucks on the side because your partner is wealthy, then you're fine. But if it's you alone, I don't know, I don't think it works. Does that make sense to you?

[Jody]

Yeah, totally.

[Mark Tularsio]

So, I mean, doesn't mean you should stay with a person. I'm just saying stay with us.

[Jody]

We like each other, so there's that.

[Mark Tularsio]

So, I mean, liking each other is good. So I do think. But I think a lot of times we'll get people like in that. That are similar in your situation where it's like, hey, look, we're not married. We. Things are really good today. But I don't know if I want to actually count on the fact that this is like my. The one forever and ever. Not that everyone, anyone knows who the forever and ever is. In that case, then, you know, I want you to balance this idea of taking care of yourself a little bit. Putting more money into savings, putting more money into the Roth, putting more money into the 403B and hopefully you are in great shape that like you say, well, you know, we both decided we're retiring together, it's 15 years from now. And you know what, Jill? The stuff that I have saved, it's just all gravy. I don't even need it. So if something changes, though, I do want to hear from you for sure. Hey, what happens like right now if you were to not, not to say that this is going to happen, but if you broke up right now and you had to pay for like, your own housing, you know, you rented and stuff, how much do you think you'd need to spend out of your 101 grand? Like, do you think that five or six. Was that. Was that what you were doing before you moved in together?

[Jody]

Well, I was kind of lucky. I had a pretty cheap house before, so I think like, you know, I like a $600 mortgage payment or something like that.

[Mark Tularsio]

But now that's gone. So if you had to rent right now, what would it be?

[Jody]

I don't know. Probably I was. I work remotely, so I. I can just pick up and go somewhere cheap if I. Okay, so I'm like 1500 bucks maybe. I don't know. Okay, so like stuck to this location where I'm at, so I'm really lucky in that regard. So.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay, so if we just like, thought if you're like housing and Your stuff and you're remote and you'd figure it out. Like, you'd work longer if you had to. You would like not to. But, you know, if that's, if that's sort of on the horizon, then I think you're in good shape. But again, if you're just. If it's just you, you have to be willing to kind of to adapt. That's what I would say. And listen, all of us have to do that, right? But in your case, specifically, I think that, that it sounds like you're willing to do it. Let's get. Beef up the emergency reserve. Let's beef up the Roth. Let's get that 403B. You know, really getting, get money in there. Every couple. I want you to, like every few months, check in with yourself. Hey, I'm now at 6% three months from now. See how it's going. See how it's going. Is there any other, like, do you have parents? You said your mom has passed away. Is your father still alive?

[Jody]

Yes.

[Mark Tularsio]

Do you think you'd have to take care of your dad for any reason?

[Jody]

No. And he is. He's a thousand miles away.

[Mark Tularsio]

Okay. Okay. So as long as you know, I just want to make sure you don't have any obligations that are outstanding so far. So then if you're willing to adapt and put some money away, I think you're in good shape. Now let's fast forward. When you're 58 years old, 60 years old, you've got a lump sum. The usual pathway is to take that money, roll it over into something called an IRA rollover account. And since you already are at Fidelity.

[Jill Schlesinger]

It'S very easy to do.

[Mark Tularsio]

You can just stay with Fidelity. And then you would invest it in probably three or four different index funds. And that's it. I mean, we'll talk between now and then. Cause I feel like I'm gonna hear from you again. But if your life changes, we'll know what to do. If you are in the situation where you're retiring early, right. And your partner's like, you're it, babe. We're in this together. Like, let's do it. And you don't need to touch your money. There may be different ideas about what to do with that money. It may be worthwhile converting it to a Roth ira, but we don't know yet because it's so far in advance. So when someone has a lump sum retirement account, whether it's a pension, an old 403B, an old 401K, the easiest thing to do is to create an IRA rollover account that will receive the funds from both the 403 and the pension and then you invest it accordingly, just like you mentioned. You meant you invest your 403B right now a little bit in a few different asset classes. Usually use index funds, call it a day. That's it. It's not very complicated.

[Jody]

Okay.

[Mark Tularsio]

Does that make sense?

[Jody]

Yep. Yep, it does. Thank you.

[Mark Tularsio]

A horse. Twelve hundred dollars a month. Her horse cost her twice as much as her mortgage. Just to put that in perspective, gang. Oh, boy. Okay. Hey, if you're like Jodi and you need some help figuring out what to do for your future and you're like that spreadsheet, you notice how Jody says, I have my spreadsheet. You are like my spreadsheet junkies. You guys, I love it. If you need some assistance or you don't really want to have a spreadsheet, just want us to create the spreadsheet for you. Go to jillonmoney.com, click the contact us button and write us a note if you want to come on the air. Check the box. And also check out all the content that lives at Jill on money. Money.com. hey, gang, just a quick programming note. Also, remember how we used to do seven days a week? We loved our seven day a week, but then we were like, oh, you know what, let's chill on the weekends. We're back to weekends, but you've got to subscribe to our other podcast, our Money Watch podcast. We are going to start dropping on the weekends, Saturdays and Sundays. And what we're doing with that podcast is a little different. We are going to focus on people who need a little. I almost say. I was going to say remedial, but like a back to basics. We are looking at people who really want some help in understanding some of the foundational issues that we kind of gloss over in this podcast. So if you've got young folks who are starting out, if you are friends with people who are not as sophisticated as you. I say sophisticated, but it's not really sophisticated, but not into this as much. Make sure that they all. And you subscribe to the Money Watch podcast podcast, you can subscribe to it on the Odyssey app because we're all in one big family Odyssey right now. It's so exciting. Or wherever you get podcasts. So subscribe to Money Watch. I don't know when we're going to start dropping Saturdays and Sundays, maybe beginning of March is what I'm thinking. Anyway, this podcast is exciting. Because we love you and we love having you come on with us. Always, always lift someone up. Change your work, change your wealth, change your life. Thank you for listening. I'm talking. Talk to you tomorrow.

[Jill Schlesinger]

For decades, real estate has been a cornerstone of the world's largest portfolios. But it's also historically been complex, time consuming and expensive. But imagine if real estate investing was suddenly easy. All the benefits of owning real tangible assets without all the complexity and expense. That's the power of the Fundrise Flagship Real Estate Fund. Now you can invest in a $1.1 billion portfolio of real estate starting with as little as $10 4700 single family rental homes spread across the booming Sun Belt, 3.3 million square feet of highly sought after industrial facilities. Thanks to the E Commerce wave, the flagship fund is one of the largest of its kind, well diversified and managed by a team of professionals. And now it's available to you. Visit fundrise.com jillonmoney to explore the fund's full portfolio, check out historical returns and start investing in just minutes. Carefully consider the investment objectives, risks, charges and expenses of the Fundrise Flagship fund before investing. This and other information can be found in the Fund's [e-mail] Flagship this is a paid advertisement. Hi, this is Jill Schlesinger. I used to own a small business and now I talk to a lot of business owners like you who know that having the right partners in place can help you take your business to the next level. Partners like American Express that give you access to world class business and travel benefits so you can get more for your business wherever it takes you. With the Amex Business Platinum Card, you can earn 1.5x Membership Rewards points on select business purchases and you can get complimentary access to more than 1400 airport lounges worldwide wide, including the Centurion Lounge so you can keep running your business while you're on the go. See how the Amex Business Platinum Card gives business owners like you the tools and rewards that can help move your business forward. Terms and points Cap Apply. Learn more at americanexpress. Com Amex Business.