Where to Save in 30s and 40s?

Summary

Podcast Summary: Jill on Money with Jill Schlesinger
Episode: Where to Save in 30s and 40s?
Date: June 11, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this engaging episode, host Jill Schlesinger, CFP®, and executive producer Mark address a listener’s (Ann, from North Carolina) practical concerns about optimizing savings strategies in her 30s and 40s. The episode centers on balancing high earnings, retirement saving decisions, handling large cash balances, and future planning for family and real estate. Ann and her wife, both high-income earners with a young child, seek tailored advice on Roth vs. pre-tax contributions, 529 college savings, use of brokerage accounts, and estate planning, all while considering a future home upgrade.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Listener Profile & Financial Snapshot

Timestamps: 03:32–08:25

• Ann (36) and her wife (41) earn approximately $200K and $450K yearly, respectively.
• They have sizable retirement savings, brokerage accounts, and about $560K in cash.
• One child (6 months old); possible plans for a second child.
• Already maxing out pre-tax 401(k)s and self-employed 401(k).
• Considering funding a 529 plan, future home purchase, and consolidating multiple old accounts.

Quote:
A: “You guys are rolling in it. I love this. Do you have kids?” (04:36)

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2. Identifying Savings Buckets

Timestamps: 04:48–09:45

• Jill emphasizes importance of “buckets” for different savings goals: retirement, college (529), house down payment.
• Ann hasn't funded the 529 yet and is deliberating between current needs and future planning.
• Mark and Jill recommend considering out-of-state 529 options since North Carolina confers no unique benefits.

Quote:
A: “That’ll be one bucket of savings, right? ...You really want to make sure you can afford this summer travel.” (04:57)

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3. Spending Habits and Free Cash Flow

Timestamps: 09:08–10:09

• Ann reports family expenses around $20,000/month—largely attributed to childcare.
• Jill and Mark reassure Ann that high expenses during early parenthood are normal and, importantly, temporary.

Quotes:
A: “Do you feel weird about that number?” (09:16)
B: “A lot of it is childcare ...I don’t think we’re gonna push that down very much.” (09:22)

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4. Large Cash Position: Problem or Prudence?

Timestamps: 10:40–12:26

• The couple holds about $560K in cash, driven by conservative instincts and anticipated need for a new, pricier home.
• Jill encourages using excess cash efficiently: e.g., “superfunding” the 529 plan or planning down payment flexibility for future home.
• Mark seconds diversified allocation, reminding about the five-year gift tax exclusion for 529 plans.

Quotes:
A: “You have the money. Right. You know, it’s not that—” (11:20)
C: “You can use...Utah. And I think that Maryland has a good one...” (11:22)

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5. Balancing House Upgrade vs. Other Goals

Timestamps: 12:36–15:52

• Ann contemplates buying a $1.5–1.6M home in two years.
• Jill models possible down payment scenarios, advocating balance between home liquidity needs and not overcommitting cash.
• Estimated carrying costs for a $800K mortgage are discussed (“about five grand”/month at current rates).

Quotes:
A: “So, even if you said, I sell this house and ...take 600 grand out of the house, out of the old house...” (14:17) C: “About five grand.” (14:51)

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6. Roth vs. Pre-Tax Retirement Contributions

Timestamps: 16:07–19:12

• Mark strongly advocates for using Roth 401(k) options despite Ann being in the high tax bracket, citing long investment horizon and existing substantial pre-tax balances.
• Jill recommends a “hedged” approach: Ann should switch her workplace contributions to Roth for the remainder of the year, test impact on take-home pay, then consider incorporating the Roth option for her wife’s solo 401(k) next year.

Quotes:
C: “We’re in the highest tax bracket there is. I wouldn’t tell you to do something I don’t do myself. We do everything Roth.” (17:13)
A: “The argument is actually that your tax bracket may never go down... You guys are super-duper savers.” (18:15)

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7. Accounts Consolidation & Organization

Timestamps: 20:56–21:12

• Jill reminds Ann to roll over and consolidate old workplace retirement accounts for better oversight.
• No pressure to merge personal versus joint brokerage accounts, but recommends at least unifying platforms for easier management.

Quote:
A: “Just make sure they’re all in the same place ...One view.” (21:01)

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8. Insurance and Estate Planning

Timestamps: 21:44–22:59

• Both have life insurance through work but may need additional coverage, especially for Ann’s self-employed wife.
• Wills and estate plans not yet completed—a gap Jill stresses must be remedied to protect their child.
• Strong admonition to “spend that cash on a lawyer and get this done.”

Quotes:
A: “If something happens to you guys together, you do not want ...the state of North Carolina deciding who gets your kid.” (22:22)
A: “Go spend some of that cash on a lawyer and get this done.” (22:55)

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9. Final Thoughts & Encouragement

Timestamps: 23:01–23:30

• Jill congratulates Ann and her wife for exceptional financial stewardship—mostly “icing on the cake” fine-tuning remains.
• Mark punctuates with “Unbelievable” in admiration.
• Open invitation for listeners from all life stages to submit questions, not just “gold star kind of people.”

Quotes:
A: “You’re amazing. You guys are great, Mark. Incredible, right?” (23:26) C: “Unbelievable.” (23:29)

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Notable, Memorable Quotes

• “You guys are rolling in it. I love this.” – Jill (04:36)
• “We need the childcare. That’s not gonna change.” – Ann (09:38)
• “We do everything Roth. I haven’t done pre-tax in well over a decade.” – Mark (17:13)
• “The argument is actually that your tax bracket may never go down... the people who save like you rarely go down in a tax bracket when they retire.” – Jill (18:15)
• “Go spend some of that cash on a lawyer and get this done.” – Jill (22:55)
• “These two are like, these are gold star kind of people. My goodness.” – Jill (23:30)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Listener Introduction and Financial Background: 03:28–08:25
• Conversation on Spending/Childcare: 09:08–09:45
• 529 & House Fund Decisions: 11:02–15:52
• Roth vs. Pre-Tax Debate: 16:07–19:12
• Accounts Consolidation Advice: 20:56–21:12
• Insurance & Estate Planning Gap: 21:44–22:59

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Tone and Highlights

• Jill is candid, supportive, and gently humorous—at times playfully chastising, but always constructive and jargon-free.
• Mark’s practical, personal approach (sharing his own Roth strategy) instills credibility.
• The discussion balances empathy for young families with rigorous financial sensibility, offering concrete steps and psychological reassurance.

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Actionable Takeaways

• Consider superfunding a 529 plan when excess cash is available—but balance with impending large expenses (e.g., home purchase).
• Optimize future tax management by shifting new retirement savings into Roth accounts, given high and likely persistent tax brackets.
• Consolidate old retirement accounts for clarity.
• Secure comprehensive estate plans and life insurance protection, especially as new parents.

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For more actionable advice or to ask your own money question, visit jillonmoney.com.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

Hi Jill. Hi Mark. Good morning. I'm good, how are you?

[A]

Great. What can we do for you?

[B]

So I'm calling today with a need for some help on savings strategy. My wife and I, we have access to a self employed 401k with, with the higher contribution limits and we are just struggling with, with how do we approach that. It's a big number that we can put in savings. Um, and, and trying to strategize around it for the next, you know, let's call it decade and a half of our, of our working lives.

[A]

Okay, sounds great. How old are you, ann?

[B]

I am 36 and wifey 41.

[A]

Okay, and so who's self employed? Both of you?

[B]

No, just my wife.

[A]

Okay, and how much is she earning approximately? Like, you know, don't just give me like an average. Don't go crazy on the, you know, upside.

[B]

About 450.

[A]

Wow, Mark. 450, North Carolina. I'm feeling like there's a lot of saving to do. And how much are you earning right now?

[B]

About 200.

[A]

Great. You guys are rolling in it. I love this. Do you have kids?

[B]

One child, yeah.

[A]

Well, that'll start eating up a lot of your money. How old is the kid?

[B]

Six months old only.

[A]

Exciting, very exciting. So six months old. Do you have a 529 account established yet?

[B]

Not yet, but of course it's, it's on the list.

[A]

Okay, so that'll be one bucket of savings, right? Oh, don't forget to sign up for a Trump account by the way. You know that?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Okay. Do you think you'll have more kids?

[B]

It's possible.

[A]

I want, I want a determining yes or no. I'm just kidding. I want to know when and I want to know who. And we need another baby Mark or little baby Jill. Okay. So, and are you. You have access right now to a retirement account through your work?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

What are you doing in that account? Are you putting pre tax or are

[B]

you doing a Roth right now? Pre tax? Maxing it out. But I do have a Roth 401k option.

[A]

Oh, but boy, I bet you, you guys are making a lot of money, though. This is the problem.

[B]

This is the question.

[A]

Yes, this is a problem. I understand.

[C]

No problem.

[A]

Okay, calm down over there. Just. He's. Just to be clear, they're like popping right there in the 35% bracket. But. Okay, let's see what they've done so far. Mark, before you say no problem. Okay, so. And how much have you put into the pre tax? 401k that you have?

[B]

That I have 665.

[A]

665. And it's all traditional, right?

[B]

Yes. I do have two rollovers from old account. From. Yeah, workplaces. Traditional is 43 and Roth is 56.

[A]

And where are those, those old ones? Are they floating around or did you consolidate them?

[B]

Oh, they're in a Vanguard.

[A]

Okay. Amazing, by the way. Like, you're 36 years old. You've just absolutely killed it, which is great. Do you also have a brokerage account?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

What do you got in there?

[B]

I have 148.

[A]

Okay. Also Vanguard, Fidelity. Oh, it's okay. No, no, you're like Fidelity.

[B]

Fine.

[A]

They're both good.

[B]

There's a lot of accounts.

[A]

Okay, well, we're gonna make sure we can try to, like, consolidate, probably also just to manage it. And you're managing everything yourself, right?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Okay, great. So your traditional, the old retirement, your old traditional, the old Roth, the brokerage at Fidelity, is that all the investments on your side of the Ledger?

[B]

A small HSA with 15.5.

[A]

Okay, great. You guys keep your money separate. Like when we say the brokerage, is that your brokerage or is that a joint?

[B]

We have both. So that there. She also has a brokerage.

[A]

Okay, let's talk about her assets. What do we got?

[B]

401K. 384.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Brokerage? 237.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And that's it.

[D]

Okay.

[A]

And do you guys own a home?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

How much would you guess it's worth?

[B]

About 900.

[A]

Is there a mortgage on it?

[B]

Yeah. 250.

[A]

What's the interest rate on that mortgage?

[B]

399.

[A]

Oh, God bless you. Do you have any other property rental property, share of something, family, blah, blah, blah. Anything like that?

[B]

Nope. We. We. We sold that one.

[A]

Okay. Let's talk about your family, because you're Young and so now I get to ask you the uncomfortable question of you guys are killing it, doing so well. Do you have to take care of aging parents?

[B]

Not at this time. We're not expecting to.

[A]

Okay. Does that mean that you guys could potentially inherit some money or. Not necessarily.

[B]

I don't want to. I don't want to bank on it. Yeah.

[A]

No one has a trust fund with. That's already. Has $10 million in it.

[B]

No.

[A]

I'm sorry for both of you. Really hard. Okay. So do we have everything that's laid out so far?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Okay, how important is it for you to fund the 529 plan?

[B]

I think pretty important.

[A]

Okay, good. So how much are you guys actually spending on a monthly basis right now? Approximate. I know you got a kid, so, like, there's. It sort of moves around. But what do you. What are the expenses look like?

[B]

It's a big number. It's about 19amonth.

[A]

Let's call it 20. Because I like round numbers. Sure, but you make a lot of money. Do you. Do you think that that's too much? Do you feel weird about that number?

[B]

I recognize that it's a big number, but a lot of it is child care. And so, you know, I don't think. I don't think we're gonna. We're gonna push that down very much.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Years.

[A]

Right. Especially if you're both working full time. I mean, we need.

[B]

We need the child care.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Temporary.

[A]

Temporary. Mark says no worries.

[C]

Three, four years, it'll be gone.

[A]

Yeah, Yeah. I mean, but then another one's coming behind that, so don't. Don't.

[C]

Yeah, that. That will derail that.

[A]

Yeah, that's. That's where I am. Okay. So when you guys look at your free cash flow. So you're putting. You're maxing out your retirement account. She has. So is she using a uni 401k a solo for a 1k right now?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Okay. And what is she contributing into that?

[B]

So last year we maxed it out at about. I think last year it was 69, and this year it might be 72, but. But, yeah.

[A]

Okay, that's great. Is it. Does it feel like, oh, when we do that, that's sort of a hardship, or how does it feel?

[B]

No, it actually feels like we. I mean, we do have a lot of free cash at the end of the month. You haven't asked about cash yet.

[A]

Oh, yes, I forgot about that. Let's do our cash. Let's do cash on hand.

[B]

Let's not. So this is where things have gone off the rails a little bit. And so cash on hand, we have about 560.

[A]

All right, well, we got our 529 plan funding. Does North Carolina have a decent 529 plan?

[B]

No, they don't. They don't have any extra benefits of doing. Doing it here.

[A]

But, Mark, what's your favorite 529 these days? What do you.

[C]

Well, my favorite is the one that I use because I get a tax deduction, but she doesn't have a tax deduction. So she can use any plan that she wants.

[A]

You can use.

[C]

It's always New York, Utah.

[A]

Utah. And I think that Maryland has a good one because it's hero price. They have a good one. But it would be kind of cool if you could. Could just push a ton. A chunk of money. Only because you have the money. Right. You know, it's not that to me. I don't know. Like, you can do. Your gift tax exclusion is $19,000. Right. Times two, which means you can put 38,000. You should be able to do 38,000 times five into this plan. Okay. Which would be kind of great. That would be kind of a fun way to burn up a couple hundred grand of your cash and pop it in there and then you don't really have to worry about it for some time. I don't know.

[B]

Do it all at once.

[A]

Yeah. Okay.

[C]

So what's with all. What's up? What's with all the cash, by the way?

[A]

They make so much money, they don't know what to do with it.

[B]

I think that the issue is that we. We both. Both started with. With large cash accounts and both kind of had that conservative. Want a large emergency fund. And then you put the two of us together, and we've put this. You know, we've known it's a problem, but.

[A]

Yeah, but we. But, like, how do you feel? Could you. Could you and your wife get behind putting, like 180 or 90 grand and in one lump sum? Like, just do it. Get it done. We don't need the money for 18 years, so.

[B]

Yeah, well. Well, there's. There is a. Well, what I didn't say yet is we. We do think we need a new house in the next couple of years.

[A]

Oh, tell us more. You can't. Can't live just busting out of your $900,000 house kind of.

[B]

I hear you. It's a great house.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But I could. There is a world where we might move. And so we have this hypothesis of saying, oh, but we might need the cash for a down payment. And so we keep kicking the can down the road of how much would

[A]

I have to pay to put you into a house you like probably 1.5 or 1.6. Okay, 1.6. But you wouldn't pay for it in cash anyway.

[B]

No, I mean, but I think we,

[A]

what we have you put a chunk down. Like you would say, like. Yeah. Okay, so even if you said I sell this house and what's my time horizon? Couple three years.

[B]

Yeah, call it, call it two years.

[A]

Two years with. And do you think this is more likely or not? You can, you, we're going to tease you, but you should do what you want to do.

[B]

I think it's, I think it is more likely. I think we recognize that we would be giving up a really good set of numbers here, whatever. To take on a bigger mortgage. Yes.

[A]

Okay, but wait a second. In this instance, okay, so we, we. Okay, so I get that you need to leave some money in cash for that, but if you sold your house right now, right, and you, you have a $900,000 house, you pay off your loan. So you have, let's call 50 of moving stuff. So did you put any money into this house?

[B]

Nothing substantial.

[A]

Okay, so let's just say you take 600 grand out of the house, out of the old house. Let's say you put another 200 grand down and now like even like worst case, we're refinancing. Instead of like a million, you can get an $800,000 mortgage and it's going to suck. Mark, what's the payment on an $800,000 30 year fixed which you may or may not do. I'm just going to put it like a 30 year fix. 800,000 at 6%. 6 and a half percent. 6 and a half. What's that payment, principal and interest?

[C]

About five grand.

[A]

Okay, so what's your current payment is whatever. Probably like I don't know, probably two. So it's like 20, 25, but like so big deal. You can totally afford to do this. But it does argue to make sure that you keep an extra couple hundred grand in the cash account. I wouldn't put down more than half of this as a. I don't even know if I would do half. But just because you're both sound kind of somewhat risk averse when it comes to the house part of it. But you know, if interest rates are at 5% when you're doing this, maybe I would only put 600 down. Maybe I wouldn't take any of the money. But I get that you want to keep some flexibility. So right now, are you putting, if you look at your monthly spend, right, your 20 grand, you're maxing out your retirement accounts. You're putting in 69. It'll be 72,000 this year. You've got money that's going into your brokerage account. Are you also adding to the cash account in addition or not? Yeah, you are. How much would you guess?

[B]

That's a hard, I don't, I don't have that exact number, but probably after the brokerage, maybe 20 annually. I don't know, it's, it's not a huge number because we're, we are pushing a lot. We're trying to be smarter about the brokerage. Brokerage now.

[A]

Okay. Yeah. Now let us get back to a few things. I, I, so whatever. Even if you just said I'm not adding to the cash account and you'll be able to do the house now, I'm not worried about the house at all. And I'm sticking with my 529 plan. Lump sum. Get it in there. Do it now. Mark, would you like to make the case for Ann and her wife to use? I presume she has a 401 that has a Roth option. Would you like Ann to give up her juicy tax deduction and walk away from that? Would you like to make the case for it?

[C]

Gladly. By the way, I will say, you know, yes, you, you want to super fund the 529 and if you, for whatever reason, if you wanted to preserve that money for the house down payment and put a, you know, a lot down on the house, I would be fine with that. If, you know, the baby's so young. If you put in ten grand a year from here on out, you'll be fine come college time. So however, however you want to do it. Yeah, I mean, look, I, I practice what I preach. We're in the highest tax bracket there is. I wouldn't tell you to do something that I don't do myself. We do everything Roth. I haven't done pre tax in well over a decade. You guys make so much money already. You're so young. You, you alone already almost have a million dollars in pre tax money. What do you think is going to happen? It's just going to continue to grow and grow and grow. So maybe don't do it all at once because it's going to be a little bit of a shock to the paycheck. But I think the goal is that you, you'd really want to be in Roth.

[A]

But I. For the wife's self employed 401k, you should be able to do a Roth version of that. Where is that self employed 401k held? Is that fidelity?

[B]

I don't, I, I don't know. But I, I do know that there is a Roth.

[A]

Okay, good. Okay, just want to make sure. Because some places were like a little slow on that. Okay, here's how I would do it. Here's the thing that I would think about. As Mark said, you already have a lot of money that is in traditional. Maybe you start by not doing hers. Right. We don't deal with hers, we first do yours. Because the hit is not going to be as dramatic. So that, you know, if you said, you know what, on my 200 grand, I am going to go into Roth. The argument is not just that you've already have a million dollars. The argument is actually that your tax bracket may never go down. Because what we do know is the people who are saving like you guys, you guys are super duper savers, like, incredible. The thing that we know is that the people who save like you rarely go down in a tax bracket when they retire. And that's kind of the dirty secret. And, you know, maybe it's possible, but I doubt it because you got a long way to go. So what about kind of hedging the bet and saying, let's start number one by you saying, at least for the rest of this year, use the Roth option. You. Are you already done? Did you already max out for this year?

[B]

No, not yet.

[A]

I, I do it monthly. So switch over, see how that feels.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

Just see how it feels.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And then you can maybe, as Mark said, start to do it with your wife's next year. Maybe you don't. Maybe you just. You, you want to see how things roll. You want to see how the house goes, you want to see how the cash flow goes just to get used to things. Ideally, if, if we had our druthers, we would try to figure out how to get as much money for you guys into that Roth option because you already have a bunch of money saved and it's gonna be fine. You're gonna be great no matter what. You're gonna be able to buy your new house. You, you're going to be able to fund either one or two college educations, depending on what happens next. You are going to be able to manage your taxes. All of this is great news. Nothing bad is happening. It's as you said when you came on, which is like we just kind of want to get our head straight on like the priorities of how to save and what kind of, what represents the best opportunities for you. And I think that you're doing a job. Good. Great, great job. I love the, I love that there is money in the brokerage. The cash account, I think will, will fix that up. You start using the Roth and we kind of see how it goes. It's very. To me, no bad decisions are going to be made. I think that we're kind of talking about like the icing on the cake. We're just trying to give you a way to bring this wonderful financial picture that you've put in front of us and just make it a tiny bit better just by cleaning a few things up. And just for old accounts that are floating around, just make sure they're all in the same place. Like you have this old traditional account, this 43 grand. Right. I don't know. Like, I would probably just roll it into. Is your current plan a good plan?

[B]

I think so, yes.

[A]

Just roll the old plan into that.

[B]

Okay. Yep. Be able to see it all.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, that's it. One view. One view. And then when you start using your Roth at work, you can take that old Roth, roll it in there.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Right. And then. So as much as we can get you guys, I don't. Listen, I don't think you have to met. You do not have to blend your brokerage accounts between the two of you. That's not. You don't have to do that. But just in the same. Whoever's managing the money, like just keeping it in the same place is very helpful. Okay, so you can see it all. And then we'll look into 529 plans and what else? Oh, how. Let's talk about some insurance and estate planning, that kind of stuff. So do you have life insurance?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

What do you got?

[B]

We have insurance through our employers.

[A]

Okay. But nothing additional.

[B]

Nothing additional. I think, I think our workplace plans are pretty good.

[A]

Okay. And she's self employed though. Is she doing it through her work herself? Like she has a million dollars of coverage. She makes a lot of money if she, like something happens to her. You need, you need insurance?

[B]

Yes. No, I think again, I think her coverage is pretty good.

[A]

Okay, got it. Next question. How about wills?

[B]

I, I know that shame on us for coming on without having them done, but. No, they're not. They're not.

[A]

I mean it's fine because you have a six month old. I'm sure that that kid is perfectly happy managing the money. Don't worry about it. They'll be fine. Most importantly, I tease you. I apologize. I don't. You have. You must, must get this done. Because if something happens to you guys together, you do not want. I. I will not throw shade towards the state of North Carolina. However, you do not want the state of North Carolina deciding who gets your kid. Yeah, that's just not okay. No. So you guys have resources, you have money. Go spend some of that cash on a lawyer and get this done.

[B]

Okay. Absolutely.

[A]

All right. You feel. Do you feel chastised? You're so good everywhere else. It would be annoying if you'd done everything right. I mean, you don't want to like that.

[B]

I left that for you guys.

[A]

I know. See that. You just like. It's like, no, thanks. Just, you know, see how they did that. Mark an and her wife, they, like, set us up and we just came in for the spike. We're playing beach volleyball with their financial lives. Boom. Done. Anything else we can do for you?

[B]

No, that's it. It's really helpful. Thank you very much.

[A]

You're amazing. You guys are great. Mark. Incredible, right?

[C]

Unbelievable.

[A]

All right, gang, if you've got a question, things are not as good as Ann and her wife's. That's okay. We talk to regular people also. These two are like, these are gold star kind of people. My goodness. So get in touch with. With us, though. Go to jillonmoney.com, click the contact us button. Write us a note if you want to come on the air. Check that box. Don't forget that you can subscribe to this show on the Odyssey app. You can also check out our other show called Money Moves on the Odyssey app or wherever you find your favorite podcast. Try to put your hands metaphorically on someone's back. Someone needs a pat on the back. Change your work, change your wealth, change your life. Thank you for listening and we'll talk to you tomorrow. Tomorrow.

[D]

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[A]

The Second World War is the largest event in human history.

[C]

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[A]

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