539: Elevate From The Gray Slop In Your Head.

Summary

Jocko Podcast 539: Book Summary

"Elevate From The Gray Slop In Your Head"

Date: May 6, 2026
Host: Jocko Willink
Guest/Co-host: Echo Charles

Overview of the Episode

In this episode, Jocko Willink and Echo Charles dive deep into the idea of escaping "the gray slop"—the primal, emotional impulses in our minds that can cloud rational thinking. Drawing on neuroscience, leadership, combat experience, and everyday life, they discuss the constant internal battle between our animal instincts (the limbic system) and our higher cognitive functions (the prefrontal cortex). The conversation explores why detachment and discipline are essential to leadership, effective decision-making, relationships, and personal growth, and why mastering your emotions is so difficult—but crucial for success.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Understanding the "Gray Slop" (Limbic System vs. Prefrontal Cortex)

• Jocko introduces the concept: The "gray slop" is the limbic system—home to our animal instincts, raw emotion, fear, rage, and impulsive behaviors. The prefrontal cortex, by contrast, is our rational, logic-processing region ([00:05]).
  • Quote: “That gray matter… the limbic system… is the part of your brain with the animal instincts. It’s very fast, impulsive, irrational. ... The prefrontal cortex, this is the rational brain.” – Jocko ([01:45])
• Philosophers and scientists—from Plato and Descartes to Kahneman (Thinking Fast and Slow), Jonathan Haidt (the Elephant and the Rider), Steve Peters (The Chimp Paradox)—have all tried to map this duality ([02:50]).
• Emotional decisions (drinking, disastrous relationships) often feel logical to us at the time, but are really driven by our “gray slop.” This is why objectivity and detachment are hard ([03:30-05:10]).

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2. Examples of Animal Instincts in Everyday Behavior

• The limbic system drives tribalism, prejudice, status-seeking, and emotional pain from social rejection ([06:00-08:00]).
  • Quote: “The pain of social rejection is processed almost the same way as physical pain. ... That’s why people are so scared of it.” – Jocko ([07:20])
• Dopamine, instant gratification, doomscrolling, impulsive shopping, binge eating—all linked to animal impulses for short-term reward ([08:40]).
• Most people are “neck deep” in their gray slop without realizing it; maturity is learning to elevate above it ([09:10]).
• HALT concept (Hungry, Angry, Lonely, Tired): These states degrade decision-making, making us more susceptible to limbic control ([13:40]).
  • Quote: “We even have a combined name—hangry. When I’m hangry… just get out of my way, I need to get into the freaking KFC line.” – Jocko ([13:50])

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3. Detachment: Escaping the Gray Slop

• Detachment means seeing things objectively: Not letting animal instincts drive reaction.
  • Quote: “If you can elevate above it… if you can get out of your own limbic system, not only will you see the errors you could make, but you can see others’ chimp brain in action.” – Jocko ([15:04])
• Practical example: A bar confrontation. If you’re caught up in emotion, it escalates; if you’re detached, you can de-escalate ([16:15]).
• Most errors in relationships and business stem from leaders being ruled by emotion or ego—attempting to prove superiority in inappropriate contexts ([18:40]).
  • Quote: “We make stupid mistakes. When I try to prove a point in a board meeting... that doesn’t help me, doesn’t help Echo. The instinct is actually wrong when removed from this physical world.” – Jocko ([18:55])

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4. Combat Neuroscience Applied to Life

• Jocko reads from “Neuroscience for Combat Leaders” by Major Andrew Stedman. Core idea: Everything you do is an attempt to maximize reward or minimize danger. In combat, you must override your survival impulse with deliberate cognition ([21:30]).
  • Notable moment: “Everything you do in life is based on your brain's determination to minimize danger or maximize reward.” – Stedman/Read by Jocko ([23:25])

Mechanics of Stress and Brain Function

• Under stress, the limbic system “steals” fuel (oxygen, glucose) from the prefrontal cortex, degrading higher cognition.
  • Quote: “When the limbic system is heavily engaged... it will quite literally steal fuel from the prefrontal cortex, thus handicapping a leader’s ability.” – Jocko ([29:20])
• Stress inoculation: Exposure to stress increases capacity for cognitive control ([30:58-31:04])
• Examples of “losing your mind” in traffic or arguments are in fact losing prefrontal control to the animal brain ([32:20]).

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5. Tools & Tactics for Cognitive Control

A. Tactical Breathing ([40:30])

• Deliberately slow, deep breaths calm the body and begin to reclaim control from the limbic system.
  • “Only two automatic nervous system actions we can control: breathing and blinking. Breath rate is the first reaction to stress leaders can reign in.” – Jocko ([41:10]) B. Labeling and Reappraisal ([42:45])
• Verbally naming emotions and reassigning them (e.g., “calm, cool, collected”) activates the prefrontal cortex. C. Rehearsal & Visualization ([43:55])
• Mental and physical rehearsal creates “muscle memory,” helping performance under stress.

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6. Role of the Leader: Always on Parade

• “Leaders are always on parade.” – Gen. George S. Patton (Quoted at [60:59])
  • As a leader, your emotional state dictates the emotional state of your team, family, or organization ([61:02]).
• Composure spreads confidence; panic spreads panic ([61:37]).

7. Deliberate Decision-Making Environment

• In stressful (or combat) situations, leaders must physically and emotionally disengage to “zoom out” and assess, rather than react ([64:48]).
• Prefrontal tasks: Understanding, recalling lessons, deciding courses of action, memorizing plans, inhibiting distractions ([69:38]).
  • “Understanding, recalling, deciding, memorizing, inhibiting—these are the things that you’re doing.” – Jocko ([69:54])
  • “Inhibiting is selective focus… This is prioritize and execute all day.” – Jocko ([71:15])
• Training for stress: Repeated exposure and deliberate practice build cognitive resilience ([74:01]).

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8. The Irrational 10th—Harnessing (Not Suppressing) the Animal Instinct

• T.E. Lawrence’s “irrational 10th”: 90% of tactics are taught; 10% is unteachable, the “it” factor, governed by the ability to connect with emotion, intuition, and creativity ([82:53 onward]).
  • Applies to leaders, athletes (Michael Jordan, Jon Jones), artists (Ozzy Osbourne, Chris Pratt), and musicians: the rare ability to channel animal energy artfully.
• The “irrational 10th” is dangerous if uncontrolled (see tragic artist stories), but powerful if artfully managed ([86:19-90:00]).
  • Quote: “If you can detach more… you find a way to better recognize the power of that emotion and funnel it to the right spot where it can be utilized properly.” – Jocko ([107:38])

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9. Practical Life Applications & Closing Thoughts

• The "gray slop" drives self-sabotage: skipped workouts, junk food, scrolling, etc.
• You must not let emotion make your decisions, but can’t suppress emotion entirely—must artfully incorporate emotion, ego, and passion as fuel: “Like a nuclear reactor. ... You have to know when to put the carbon rods in to cool it down.” ([95:45])
• Actionable Advice:
  • Recognize when you’re in the “gray slop”
  • Practice detachment, objectively observe yourself and others
  • Use breathing, labeling, and rehearsal as tools
  • Accept the value (and danger) of emotion; artfully manage it
  • “Utilize emotions, but don’t let those emotions utilize you.” ([125:05])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On emotional blindness:
  “A lot of times they think they’re out of the gray slop, but it’s really like they're neck deep and it’s still interfering with their nose.” – Jocko ([06:40])
• On leadership presence:
  “Leaders are always on parade.” – Gen. George S. Patton ([60:59])
  “If you freak out, everyone’s gonna freak out.” – Jocko ([61:07])
• On detachment:
  “If you can elevate above it, you can see now Echo’s chimp brain in action…” ([15:04])
• On instant gratification:
  “The gray slop…wants dopamine right now. That’s why you’re doomscrolling, eating junk food, making short-term decisions that are bad.” ([08:40])
• On artful use of emotion:
  “Don’t let emotions control you. But don’t abandon them either—you need to learn to modulate, to tap in when needed, to back off when needed.” ([96:55])
• On the “irrational tenth:”
  “Nine tenths of tactics are certain and taught in books, but the irrational 10th...that is the test of generals.” – T.E. Lawrence (quoted at [83:36])

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [00:05] – Introduction of theme: Detachment, animal brain, and discipline
• [01:45] – Limbic system vs. prefrontal cortex explained
• [06:00] – How animal instincts show up in social behavior
• [13:40] – HALT states and decision-making
• [15:04] – Detachment: seeing your own and others’ chimp brain
• [21:30]–[31:30] – Combat neuroscience & how stress hijacks cognition
• [40:30] – Tactical breathing; practical tools for control
• [60:59] – “Leaders are always on parade”—emotional contagion & leadership presence
• [64:48] – Creating an effective decision-making environment
• [74:01] – Training to change the brain; stress inoculation
• [82:53]–[86:19+] – The “irrational 10th”—creativity, intuition, the “it” factor
• [95:45] – Nuclear reactor metaphor: using, not abusing, emotion
• [125:05] – Final action points: Detachment, artful use of emotion, leadership summary

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Final Thoughts

This episode is a comprehensive, engaging exploration of the internal battle between emotion and reason, packed with references to psychology, neuroscience, military training, and daily life. Jocko and Echo blend concrete strategies for self-control with philosophical insight and real talk, making the episode a powerful resource for anyone striving to elevate their thinking, lead more effectively, and live more intentionally.

Main Takeaway:
Master your mind by detaching from your animal instincts—don't suppress emotion, but harness it deliberately. True leadership and self-mastery come from this ongoing internal discipline.

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“Do not let emotions utilize you. Utilize emotions, but don’t let those emotions utilize you.” – Jocko ([125:05])

Transcript

[A]

This is Jocko, podcast number 539 with Echo Charles and me, Jocko Willink. Good evening, Echo.

[B]

Good evening.

[A]

So Leonardo da Vinci, he said there are three classes of people. Those who see, those who see when they are shown, those who do not see. I want to talk to you about something that we brought up on the underground podcast I coined. I called it on the, on the podcast Gray slope, gray slop, Gray matter. Like, you know, your brain is gray. Gray slop. This is, has to do with detachment, which is another thing. You know, I've been talking about detachment for years. Detach from the chaos, detach from the mayhem, detach from your ego, detach from your emotions. That's gonna make your life so much better if you can do that. But lately I've been looking around and I'm realizing how truly difficult that can be for people and at the same time seeing how important it is and how much it really fouls and jams people up. And when you look at someone, you know, like you and I've talked about, you see someone that's drinking too much and it's kind of bringing down their life and you can see it so clear, but they don't, they don't get it, or they're involved in a relationship that's a disaster and you explain to them, but they're like, no, no, no, no, like this time, or I can save her or whatever, whatever. The thing is, right? Those are all emotional decisions. Those are just being all. You're, you're all in your own gray slop. Your gray matter, your. Your, your core. So what is that? You know, this gray matter actually has. The gray matter that I'm talking about is called the limbic system. And we'll get into this some more later. But the, the limbic system is kind of the part of your brain with the animal instincts. The, the raw emotion. It's got the fear in there, it's got the rage in there, it's got the, the fight or flight things. It's very fast, it's very impulsive, it's very irrational. That's your limbic system. And then the other side, of course, you have the prefrontal cortex. This is the rational brain. This is the logic brain. Brain. This is what has, this is what gives you impulse control. This is what allows you to execute long term planning, which I know you like. Strategic thinking. Strategic is in your prefrontal cortex moderating your behavior so you don't go nuts. Is in your prefrontal cortex. And there's People been talking about this for a long time. You know, this is nothing new. When I talk about detachment, I'm not the first person to come up with this, right? No, dude, people have been talking about this. Plato, Plato had the chariot allegory and you had these two horses. One was the animal minded, the other one was the spirit and the, and the moral impulse. And, and the driver is reason that's supposed to guide those forces, right? So this is not, this is nothing new. Descartes had the, the machine versus the soul and the animal. The animal is just instinct and humans have the ability to override those instincts. You're supposed to have that ability in more modern times, like nowadays. Daniel Kahneman, he wrote a book called Thinking Fast and Slow. He breaks it down to these two systems. You know, system one is the fast, the automatic, the emotional, the intuitive. And then system two is the slow, deliberate, the analytical one. Jonathan Haight describes the elephant and the rider and his point in the elephant. The elephant's big and strong. Kind of like if your emotions are big and strong, they can override the writer. It's going to do what it wants. So that's a good, good analogy. We can take something away from that. Steve Peters, he wrote a book in 2012 called the Chimp Paradox, and then he wrote a children's book called My Hidden Chimp. And then he wrote a guidebook to go along with that in 2018, and he wrote a book called the Path through the Jungle. And he runs a consultancy which is called Chimp Management, because your inner chimp, when he calls the inner chimp, that's the thing that's going on emotion and going on animal instincts. And the frontal cortex is the human thing. So you got to manage that chimp in your head. So again, these are a bunch of. These are centuries worth of people that have talked about this and written about it, and clearly people understand it and they've been putting the word out forever. And yet it's very, very difficult for people to implement it, this detachment. And I don't think people. One thing I don't think people realize is how much influence that animal brain, that gray slop that's in your head, how much it really influences your logic and your rationality. I don't think people see that. It's not actually each of these examples, they talk about it as two separate things, but there's all kinds of little wires going between the two. And I don't sometimes don't think people recognize how much they feel like they're being Logical, but they're not. They feel like they're using their. Their human elevated, enlightened brain, but they're not. They're using the chimp brain. So we do things and we think. We kind of think that the animal instinct is kind of good because, you know, if you get. Something happens, you're afraid you can you get extra strength. You were just talking about before you hit record. You know, you see fighters that they're. They're exhausted, but then they knock the guy out, and all of a sudden they have all this.

[B]

Energy for the celebration.

[A]

Yeah, energy for the celebration. There's like a regulatory component that's going on, and then it overcomes it. But we get extra power when we need it sometimes, and it seems like it's helpful, but there's just so much more going on inside that gray slop. And I just don't think people recognize that. A lot of times they think they're out of the gray slope, but it's really like they're neck deep and it's still interfering with their nose. It's kind of getting little sprinkles into their eyes. And it's. It's just bad and it's. It's real, man. And this, again, this is not me saying my theory. This is like factual information. The amygdala, which is part of the limbic system, it wants us to categorize people as us or them. Right? That's part of our nature. That means prejudice. That means irrational polarization. That's why we get into clicks. Right? Social status. Social status, posturing or. Right. You. You might think that's like, oh, well, he's got a big ego because he's insecure. But actually, as an animal, higher status positioning means you get more food. It means you get better mating rights than the other animals. So you're actually genetically programmed to kind of posture up and act tough and show off. That's an animal instinct that you have. And by the way, how does it make you look? It makes you look arrogant. It makes you look stupid. Right? There's all kinds of things that translate this animal behavior that translates into our. What we think is oftentimes elevated behavior. This is stuff we talk about all the time. That's not fun, the feeling like, I need to be right, because if I'm right, I have more status. If I have more status, I have better, you know, position in the hierarchy. The urge to show off the pain of. The pain of social rejection is. You feel that there's. That's like a similar it's processed almost the same way as physical pain. That's why people are so scared of it. Hyper vigilance, negativity bias. Like we focus on bad news. You're genetically programmed as an animal to focus on bad news because good news won't kill you. Right? That's why we get hyper folks fixated on it. The resource hoarding means I need more. Why? Well, that's. It's a human instinct. That's why people do impulsive shopping. That's why people binge eat. That's why there's actual hoarders in the world that hoard things. Their whole house is filled with stuff that they will never, ever, ever need. Here's one. Displacement aggression. So when an animal gets stressed by a more dominant animal and it can't fight back because it knows it's going to lose, it turns and attacks weaker animals. Does that sound like something humans might do? Hell yeah, it is. So all these things play into it. And of course we got the one that we hear about all the time, which is again, pure animal instinct. It's instant gratification from the dopamine loop. Dopamine wants reward right now. It doesn't care about five days from now. It doesn't care about five years from now. It doesn't even care about five hours from now. It wants dopamine right now. So that's why you're doom scrolling. That's why you're eating junk food. That's why you're making all these short term decisions that are bad. It's genetically programmed into you. It used to keep you alive because you're like, I'm just gonna keep looking for these berries until I find them. So I get food. Or I'm just gonna keep going after this animal until I get it so I have food. I'm gonna keep chasing down this cave woman so I can procreate like all those things. And yet they made it into our world right now. And the people. This is what I think is interesting is I think people have varying levels of escaping their gray slop. And most important, it's difficult to see most of the people when you're just swimming in your own gray slop. Animal instincts. You don't see it. You don't. It doesn't feel different. You don't know it. You. It's not like the temperature drops and you go, oh, wait a second, just got cold in here. No, you're just like, everything looks the same except for you're really emotional now and you don't Say, oh, I see what's going on. This is my. I mean, this is the problem people have is they start getting emotional and they'll go, oh, this is an animal instinct of mine taking over, and I shouldn't allow that to happen. So, and, and people have varying levels of being able to escape their gray slop that's given them all these animal instincts. And by the way, when you're, when you're little, you're just in it. You know what I mean? That's why little kids lose their temper. That's why they get nuts. That's. That's why they even. A baby. What does it do when it's hungry? Screams. That's what they do. Now, as we get older, hopefully we don't scream as much. But when you're, you know, when a, when a little kid gets bullied, how do they react to it? Right. When a little kid is afraid, how do they react? Sometimes they cry, they freeze up. But then as you get older, hopefully you control those emotions. When you get dumped in 10th grade, I can't believe I got dumped. You know, and you crying in the school or whatever.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

When you get dumped when you're 24, you're like, okay, hey, it didn't work out. You're a little bit more mature, you have a little bit more control, but at least you hope. But let's face it, there's a chance. By the way, there's a reason that people get murdered after they get. After they dump someone, right? Because people just succumb to just gray slop and it's the end of the world and it's total emotion and it's ego and it's chaos and they go and kill people. So we're supposed to grow out of it, but it takes time. This is why, this is why a young male driver has a really high insurance. Because this, this dude is just. I mean, he's an animal, right? Yeah, he's just, how fast can I go? How. You know, I'm going to take risks. I'm going to make things happen. I think I can survive. I'm going to push the envelope. Hopefully over time, you, you get more and more elevated out of this gray slop and you get a little bit this, you know, a little bit of distance from it, but it still drives so much in people. And by the way, this is like one of those things where if you think, if you think you're not insane, that's the person that's insane, right? The person that's like, I'm not crazy. You know, like. No, no, that's the person you have to watch out for. This is the catch 22, the book catch 22. If you were, if you were sane enough to say, hey, I don't want to fly on these raids, then, well, it doesn't make sense.

[B]

So.

[A]

So when we're crazy, we don't know that we're crazy. And when we're caught in the gray slop, we don't know that we're caught in the gray slope. And so think about all the things that are in your head that drive decision making process. Right? Fear and anxiety. What does that make us do? It makes us freeze up. It makes us play it safe. What about anger? Anger drives us to the short sighted win. You're right. Like I'm right. Oh, that's great. That's a good way to win an argument with your wife. To show or approve. That's all it is. Greed. Greed's the other end of the spectrum now. You're just ignoring obvious risk. Or you got excessive optimism. These are monkey minds right here. Sadness when we're really sad. When someone's really sad, they lower the bar. They settle for less. Oh, this as good as I can get. Just an emotion. Need for validation. This is a, this is an animal instinct. And now you're doing things just for approval, making decisions so that you can get approval. Fear of rejection. What happens if you're fear of rejection, which is an animal instinct to have? Well, you don't step up, you don't take, you don't, you keep quiet. You know, I have to be right. I'm better than them. You know, this is an attack. There's so many mistakes that we make. I'll start tomorrow, right? Even, even conformity, the herd instinct, these are all things that, that will make us make bad decisions. I mean, how many teenagers have made bad decisions because of they're trying to conform with whatever everyone else is doing? This is peer pressure. There's a thing called halt, H, A L, T, Hungry, angry, lonely and tired. These things all disrupt your decision making process. We even have a, a combined name. Hangry. Right? When I'm hangry, people are like mad, just get out of my way. I need to get into the freaking KFC line asap. Get that Domino's pizza right now. That's hangry. But people make dumb decisions when they're lonely. People make dumb decisions when they're tired. So many of these decisions that bad decisions that we make, they're just rooted in this gray slop in this limbic system, in this chimp brain. And generally speaking, like I said, they're not good decisions. So here's something that I think a lot of people don't recognize. If you can elevate above it, right? If you can get out of the gray slop, if you can get out of your own limbic system, not only will you then be able to see the errors that you could make that are being driven by your animal instincts, but a huge bonus is that I can see now Echo's chimp brain in action. So, in other words, if I'm walking down the street and I see Echo Charles, and he mouths off to me, like, get out of my way, or something like that. My. If I'm in the gray slop, what am I going to do? Who the hell are you telling me, get out of your way? Maybe I push him, maybe I attack him. Maybe we escalate the situation. But if I'm elevated, if I'm enlightened above my own gray slop and I'm walking down the street and Echo says, get out of my way, I see that it is his animal instinct that is causing this behavior. And I say, oh, that guy must be having a rough day. Probably not much gain to interact with him. I'm just gonna, like, you know, move a little bit to the right and carry on. So when you. When you're not caught up in your own animal brain, you can see when other people are, but you want to. You want to see problems. Add alcohol, right? Which. Which unleashes our. Our chimpanzee brain. And now all of a sudden, you. You bump into me in the bar, and that is a challenge, and we're fighting. But if I'm elevated and you bump into me in the bar and I go, oh, hey, man, this guy must be having a rough day. Hey, sorry about that. And I can de. Escalate. Here's the thing. This doesn't only apply to, like, physical altercations. We do so many dumb things based on our ego and our emotions and our. In our chimpanzee brain that have nothing to do with physical interactions at all. And. And that's because the. The mind recognizes things that are rooted in physical survival, but they're not actual physical survival in today's day and age. In other words, like, hey, if I'm. I'm protecting myself, like, I have to have some animal instincts, but if I'm just protecting my ego, why, I don't need no animal instincts to do that. If I'm trying To show that I'm superior because I need to get more food for myself in a caveman situation. Okay, makes some sense. If I'm trying to show my superiority in a board meeting, you know what I'm saying? So that I can. So that I can prove my. My position in the hierarchy, it doesn't make sense to do it there. And so we make stupid mistakes. And by the way, by the way that those things. When I try and prove a point in the board meeting and make Echo look like he didn't know what he's talking about, that doesn't help me. It doesn't help Echo. It's not the right thing to do. So the instinct is actually wrong when removed from this physical world. This is why people talk down to other people. This is why people impose their plan on a group. Hey, do you. You need to do it like this. This is why people try and get the credit because I'm trying to improve my status. This is why people make little maneuvers to try and get the promotion because it's based on their hierarchical status and they want to. They want to rise up. This is why people escalate an argument instead of de. Escalating an argument. That's why they do it. This is why people talk instead of listen. It's all just monkey brain. It's all a bunch of emotion and ego, and we have to get away from it. And it's not easy. It is so intertwined. Again, the. The metaphors that I raised the elephant and the chariot and all these things, these are metaphors that make it seem like there's a really good, clear bifurcation between these two elements. But in my opinion, they are much more intertwined. There's little. There's little wires going all in between the two of them. And I, I found a good article about this. Now, the article relates to it somewhat, what we're talking about. It's from a combat perspective. But again, this doesn't just apply to combat. But I want to read some sections from this article. The article is called Neuroscience for Combat Leaders, and it's written by a guy named Major Andrew Stedman. And the little footnote about him, it says, Major Andrew Stedman, U.S. army, is an infantry officer and a student at the Command and General Staff Staff College, Fort Leavenworth, Kansas. Holds a B.S. from the U.S. air Force Academy. He must have switched from the U. S. Air Force Academy to the Army. His combat export experience includes two deployments to Iraq and one to Afghanistan. So this article is. Is called a brain based Approach. To leading on the matter Modern battlefield and I think you're going to see some examples of what I'm talking about and then we can extrapolate this combat situation to the the rest of our lives. Of course, everything in combat is more pronounced, so it should seem real obvious. In combat, when someone does gets caught up in their freaking animal brain, it causes real catastrophic situations, but makes us stand out. When we get caught up in our animal brain during an argument with our spouse doesn't lead to a catastrophic scenario, hopefully most of the time. But if you, if that's how you live your life, your life is not where it should be. So here we go, let's get to this article. Everything you do in life is based on your brain's determination to minimize danger or maximize reward. The brain wants to move towards things in life that give it pleasure or ensure survival and away from things that cause it pain or threaten survival. Combat demands that military individuals overcome this natural impulse to survive and move toward the danger. From this perspective, succeeding in combat is a measure of how well the brain copes with dangerous situations and performs tasks that ensure survival. The field of neuroscience has seen significant advances in recent years and the benefits of this knowledge can positively affect numerous disciplines, including combat leadership. Using functional magnetic resonance imaging, MRI surgical methods and experiment based approaches, researchers have revealed many of the biological processes that underlie our most basic emotional and cognitive behaviors, such as how and why we react to threatening situations, how our brains allocate energy to cope with competing demands, and how our senses interact with with our minds to create the world we know. So again, threatening situations. What's a threatening situation? Look, when we're reading an article that's written by an infantry officer, you think threatening situation is gunfight, IED threat, mortars inbound. But a threatening situation for a normal person is like oh, this guy's maneuvering and trying to get credit for the project that I led. That's a threatening situation, right? That's a threatening situation. And this is what triggers our limbic brain to kick into gear. Back to the article. Learning about brain function and physical reactions to stress does not simply inform the leader, but create self awareness that makes him better able to control these processes. Tactical level military leaders can use new knowledge to understand the effects of combat, anticipate and recognize cognitive reactions, and adjust their leadership abilities to succeed in difficult situations. They can do this by performing exercises to decrease physiological stress reactions, using emotionally controlled leadership to guide their organizations, and creating an environment to during battle that facilitates effective decision making. So we're going to force our brain out of the animal mode and into the logical mode when we're in stressful situations. That's what a combat leader is going to have to do. By educating soldiers about brain function and incorporating cognitive stressors into training, leaders can prepare their units to perform battle with emotional stability. But it is not just combat. If you can do this when you're having a conversation with your boss, when your kid is getting mad at you, when your kid does something stupid, which they're gonna do because they're a kid, you can react like an animal and do bad things, do think, do things that are going to have a negative impact on the situation. Or you can control your brain. You can get out of your own gray slop. Basics of the Brain Combat leaders need a basic knowledge of cerebral biology to understand the importance of the mind's function during combat. The two major areas most relevant to this topic are the limbic system and the prefrontal cortex. The former is the collection of brain regions involved in emotions, learning and memory. The latter is for higher level thinking. That's a prefrontal cortex actively influences body functions and performance inputs travel along pathways in both these systems and allow us to react to scenarios with a balance of emotion and reason. That's what they're supposed to do. Why does our emotion so often take lead so often? It's ridiculous. It's embarrassing for us as humans to let our animal instincts run the show. Located in the center of the brain, the limbic system primarily contains the thalamus, hypothalamus, hippopot, hippocamp, hippocampus and the amygdala and is the creator of emotions and memory. Its primary function is to interpret information sent from the body senses to the to issue emotional commands back to the body. The limbic system also sends data to the executive areas of the brain, the frontal lobe, for cognitive processing and receives instructions about about how the body should respond to the given situations. Sometimes the limbic system can independently respond to the world, like when we react to threatening situations. This occurs on a subconscious level when the amygdala, the fear and anxiety response center, compares data from the world with the hippocampus, which is the memory database of experience. The in if the incoming information corresponds to a threat that has been tagged as negative or dangerous, the amygdala immediately commands the body into action. We've all experienced this process when our reflexes have caused us to snatch a hand away from closing door, leap away from a snake. So there's some times where it's going to do something, and if you don't have control over it, that those times are going to grow, those times are going to be bigger than they should be. Right. You know, the classic thing that I tell people is if. If I said, hey, Echo, I'm going to be at your house when you come home, and I'm going to scare you, there's probably zero percent chance I'd be able to actually scare you. But if I just got in there and I tried to scare you, there's probably a really solid percentage that I would scare you. So that's. Having the cognitive pattern where you can get control of that quickly is very important. Back to the document. The more sophisticated process of the minds occur in a sheet of tissue just behind the forehead known as a prefrontal cortex. This is memory, judgment, planning, sequence of activity, abstract reasoning, impulse control, personality reactivity, surroundings, and mood. That's a pretty big, important block. Isn't it crazy? That just gets overrun all the time? Like, every time you see someone get road rage, they've lost their mind. Yeah, I actually. That's funny. You hear me say this when I. When I talk about someone losing their mind. And I've never thought about this until right now. It's when they've lost control of their prefrontal cortex. That's like. And. And I say that a lot. You know, I'll be like, oh, this dude just lost his mind. But the funny thing is, I say it when I'm talking about people that are doing something super emotional. Their ego is out of control. Like, someone does something. Oh, the dude, he lost his mind. You've heard me say this. I do this. But that's what I'm talking about. They've lost their mind. They've. They've. They've shut down their prefrontal cortex, and they're just full chimp mode, just going. This is the area that. This area. This area is what allows humans to solve math problems, develop abstract concepts, and ponder our own existence is also the area that military leaders used to balance risk in combat, develop courses of action, and create strategies to lead effectively. So there you go. That's what it's doing. It's got a little section in here. About every part of the brain is packed with blood vessels, and it talks about how it actually, the brain redirects blood and glucose to appropriate areas based on what's happening. This allocation leaves less fuel for other brain functions like cognitive control, which requires vast amounts of blood and glucose to operate. When the limbic system is Heavily engaged as it is during high threat stress of combat, it will quite literally steal fuel from the prefrontal cortex, thus handicapping a leader's ability to combat the situation with cognition. So think about that right there. You're losing your mind. You're losing your mind. And this is something that, you know, you can train to. It's. We. We used to call it stress inoculation. If you get put in stressful situations, often you eventually get used to them. And now it's not gonna need to steal so much fuel, so much glucose and oxygen for your. For your frontal cortex, because you're not freaking out.

[B]

That, that does explain panicking.

[A]

Oh, for sure.

[B]

Like where it's. It steals blood and nutrients from your prefrontal cortex and gives it to other parts of your body.

[A]

By. By the way, it gives it the part of the brain that's freaking out.

[B]

Yeah. So basically your prefrontal, the. Your decision making goes down. The rest of your. The other part of your brain, the. The panic mode, that part, the emotions is lit up, and then it feeds the rest of your body that it needs. You know how like, like when you physically, you know, you're running away from a dog chasing you or something like this, where you go, you'll spring right into action.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

But if there was no dog chase, you'd be like, bro, I'm not running nowhere. See, I'm saying. But all of a sudden you have this energy out of nowhere, spontaneous energy. Now that explains it.

[A]

Yeah. It also explains why people shut down. It explains why people do dumb things in the moment. It explains. It kind of explains crimes of passion. Right. Like, I'm so emotional that my prefrontal cortex, which is long term planning, is like, oh, if I do this, I'm gonna go to jail. My life is ruined. No, that's all shut down. And I'm just. I'm gonna pay this person back.

[B]

Yeah. So. You ever heard of this? And I always wondered if it's true. I can't help but believe that it is true. Where some people, they'll do a crime of passion or whatever, and then they won't get convicted because they were temporarily insane. Yeah. Something like this. Where. And then from what I understand, like when they evaluate the person, they literally don't remember.

[A]

I was about to say, like, sometimes people don't even remember doing it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And. And there's times where people do things, like in a combat situation, they don't remember.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Like, they don't remember that that happened.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

They were just in full Survival mode.

[B]

Yeah. So it doesn't even, it doesn't go into the part like the brain that, that has memory, the hippocampus, that creates the memory, like kind of Brad. It just shunted all the, the energy and nutrients to the other part of the body and it wasn't working for that moment. Yeah. So I'm saying, dang, yeah.

[A]

And by the way, you can see this a lot with your kids because your kids, you know, they're there. It doesn't take much to just shut down the thought and just become a little animal. Back to the doc. As successful business consultant and CEO David Rock explains in the book, your brain works. The degree of activation of the limbic system is the degree of deactivation of the prefrontal cortex. Brain research has shown that there are many more neural connections that flow from the amygdala directly to the prefrontal cortex than vice versa. Therefore, it's easy for our emotions to guide or suppress our rational thoughts. Hello everybody. This is our problem. This is cr. This is a crucial fact because military leaders must preserve cognitive functions when leading in combat. And by the way, guess what? Combat has all these things going on. Fear, anxiety, pressure, stress, not to mention physical stress. You're tired, not to mention you haven't slept in a day and a half or two days. The limbic system in combat. The limbic system is evolutionarily older than the prefrontal cortex. Primitively old, in fact. It helped. It developed to help man survive the ancient battlefield of predator versus prey. The limbic system has the chemical authority to initiate rapid response responses to threats and is good at doing so. The amygdala ignites, adrenaline flows to the blood, the pulse races, the eyes focus and rapidly scan for threatening movement. We hold unnecessary digestion, intense major muscle groups in preparation for a clash. The then the brain, teeming with blood vessels, redirects the available supply of oxygen and glucose rich blood to the limbic and motor areas so that we can react quickly in the impending fight. At this point, the mind is in its most basic survival mode. It has no spare energy to devote to solving geometry problems or pondering philosophical dilemmas. This biological decision to focus resources toward limbic areas during dangerous situations is what keeps us alive at a time when the cerebral problem solving approach would be fatally slow. But today's military leaders do not face the same world that our ancestors did. And by the way, you don't face the same world that our ancestors did. When you roll into a department meeting that's going to be tense and yeah. You'll roll in there and just shut down half of your prefrontal cortex. Or you've got a decision to make on buying a car and you're all emotional, excited about it and you just shut down your pre. Override your prefrontal cortex. Walking out of there with a twelve hundred dollar a month payment on a, on a, what is it, a 72 month loan.

[B]

But it's all relative though, right? You know how you're like, oh yeah, our ancestors, you know, and their environment so extreme. But like there's an element of certain extreme levels of things that you kind of get used to. So it's like, you know how, you know, Theo Vaughn has a, has the joke, right? Like, oh, we all have our Vietnam, right. Or whatever where it's like, it's relative to the person. So if you're not, if you start to get used to stuff, then yeah, you're going to be less sensitive. But so if the environment is extreme, there's a general. Like you're used to it on a certain level.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So you'll still have all these fight or flight stuff, you know, all this stuff, but it just takes a little bit more. Now nowadays it's not like that. We're just more sensitive. See what I'm saying? So the board meeting kind of seems like a little bit of a final boss.

[A]

That's what I'm saying. Yeah, that's what I'm saying exactly. Or not to mention when someone bumps into you on the, in the Vons shopping line, you know what I'm saying, and then maybe mouths off to you.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Now all of a sudden we got a situation. Animal comes out. While there are still many threats that require rapid reflexive action, leaders also have to manage countless streams of information, communicate over multiple technological, technological systems, balance political, military and civilian considerations, and lead hundreds of men and women in the process. Combat requires a coherent, rational mind. And it ain't just combat that requires that. Combat is full of stressful moments, initial contact with the enemy, rushing to secure an enemy terrain, or responding to an unexpected event that test emotional resolve. Those involved experience intense sensory input and encounter debilitating explosions, grotesque scenes and threatening enemy movements. As the limbic system attempts to keep pace with the environment, it starves the soldier's ability to maintain a clear mental framework, coupled with the typically exhausting physical exertion of combat. Soldiers are constantly or consistently at risk of degraded cognitive processing. I got a quote in here from JFC Fuller. He said in an attack, half of the men on a firing line are in terror. The other half are unnerved going into the leader in combat. Each duty position on the battlefield contains some balance of reflex and cognitive tasks. Some can be trained repeatedly and develop into muscle memory like loading and firing a weapon. Others are more cognitive in nature, like calling for indirect fire coordinating a synchronized attack, while each soldier has his own personal tactical situation to react to. Typical frontline riflemen operate in reflexive region while the cognitive component of the battle increases with the rank and responsibility. In this article, the term leader refers to any individual is responsible for leading several groups of soldiers in maneuver against the enemy and must manage multiple battlefield systems. This leader spends most of his time on the battlefield outside of his weapon sites. You've heard me talk about this 10,000 times. High Port your weapon. Look around. While the team and squad leaders are unquestionably leaders, they use battle drills and reflexive training to guide most of their actions will not have to rely on their abstract cognitive abilities during combat unless they are operating as an autonomous element. The platoon leader and the platoon sergeant are the first leaders that engage in more complex, complex problem solving than direct fire battle. The company level commander is squarely in the cognitive region with occasional moments that require reflexive action. The battalion level commander will rarely perform actions that are not based on premeditated cognition. What the what can these leaders do to mitigate physical reactions to stress that will inevitably occur? What methods are available to regain cognitive control and place the leader in a position to maximally benefit the unit? First, actively decrease the effects of stress. Second, infuse emotional stability into the organization. Finally, create an environment of that facilitates effective decision making. So he's going into this the things that you can do right, there's three of them Control the effect of emotional energy as combat will readily reveal. The body and mind undergo rapid changes when reacting to stress. While while moderate levels of stress improve functions like motor skills, stress can easily impair performance in cognitive areas where today's tactical leaders typically need to operate. Heart rate, blood pressure and breathing will all increase. Digestion will slow and nausea may occur. Speech may falter and auditory and visual cues may diminish. All of these effects are natural as the body emotionally reacts to the fight. However, leaders have a responsibility to control control the effect of emotional energy and remain calm in the face of danger. One proven combat used by law enforcement and military professionals is tactical breathing as one of only two automatic nervous systems actions that we can control. The other is blinking. Breath rate is the first reaction to stress that leaders can reign in. So you can actually go send it in the other direction. This is why people say, take a deep breath right immediately after significant stressor occurs, or just prior to entering a high stress environment, Simply take several successive deep breaths and hold each one for three to five seconds. As you breathe, visualize your body relaxing and remaining calm during the event. Although time may not allow leaders to take a long tactical pause, Simply diagnosing a rapid breathing pattern and forcing a couple of slow breaths will help decrease the body's agitated state. And again, this is something that I didn't learn, but I stumbled upon because when I would talk on the radio, I didn't want to sound like a panicked freak. So I would take a breath, and when I took a breath, guess what? Calm down. Another method of controlling stress is a concept called labeling and reapprisal, which is the act of naming the emotional state you are experiencing and actively reassigning a new emotion that that is more productive for the situation. Verbally identifying the emotions or reassuring yourself that loud activates the prefrontal cortex and begins to reclaim some of the power from the limbic system. Simple cue words like steady, stay focused, and relax are active reminders that can elicit a controlled behavior. And this is something I've been teaching lately. We have something called a ditty. Yeah, and we used to use the ditty for like, pistol work, right? You'd have a little thing that you would say to make sure you hit all these points of performance, you know, fast to the holster, thumb on the index turn point, you know, slack off the trigger, easy squeeze, front sight, focus. And you do that every single time. You'd say that diddy to you.

[B]

Was that, was that yours?

[A]

No, I just.

[B]

Everybody.

[A]

No, that's people that are different ones. I just made it up right now, and it probably wasn't a great one,

[B]

but not man sounded good.

[A]

But, you know, lately I've been saying, hey, if you start feeling like, excited, say to yourself, a little diddy, calm, going, relax, calm, cool and collected, Whatever. Something like that. You say, you know, slow, smooth, smooth is fast. Slow, smooth, smooth, fast, calm down, calm down. Like, whatever, say something to yourself is, is a good way to get yourself to calm down. A unit's motto can be another steadying phrase. Repeating these words can trigger confidence and strength in the face of trying, trying circumstances. More important, such statements not only have effect on leaders, but also filter through an organization to reinforce its members. The key is to talk to oneself into a mental framework that is capable of handling the highly cognitive experience of modern combat. Any military leader will readily support the practice of unit rehearsals before the operations. Of course. Rehearse, rehearse, rehearse. Do individuals not also have the responsibility to rehearse how they will react in combat? Professional golfers, divers, and other elites who rely on precise skills use a techniques called visualization to reinforce desired behavior. Likewise, a tactical leader can. Can benefit by visualizing himself performing with an emotional calm and cognitive clarity. A leader with. With clear vision of how he wants to perform will, as survival author Lawrence Gonzales put it, create a kind of memory of the future. It's an interesting com concept that the brain can access during combat. Like muscle memory, proper mental processes can become reflexive. You gotta rehearse, man. I recently relearned this lesson. I was in a movie.

[B]

Hell yeah.

[A]

And in this particular movie, it. It's kind of a long scene. And I don't say. I. I don't say anything until the end of the scene. I have two lines. But here's the funny thing. So, you know, I'm. I'm trying to be a professional, right? You think I'm trying to be a professional?

[B]

Sure.

[A]

Yes. I'm trying to be professional. It's a big deal when you're. When. When you're in something like this Hollywood scenario because they have to do it a bunch of times and everyone's on the clock and everything's getting all set up and the lights and the cameras and all this stuff. And like, if you screw it up, bro, everyone kind of.

[B]

They don't like that.

[A]

And. And no one says anything because they don't want to put more pressure on anybody, you know, because then people freak out, right? So everyone just. But it's like a. It's the heaviest, like, unspoken, like, weight of like, dang, like, I think I screwed up. And it's funny when someone screws something up, you know, the director. When I was on Billions, the TV show, there was three of us standing in this scene and we were doing it that we're doing the scene. And like, the. The. The director was downstairs. We were upstairs. He was downstairs. Like, all the cameras were upstairs, but he was watching it from downstairs. And like, somebody wasn't doing something. The what. The way the director kind of wanted it. And he, like. He goes, okay, you know, whatever. Cut. And then there's like a pause while the director walks up the stairs. And then he, like, says something to one of the actors like, hey, you know, maybe just, you know, a little bit more, like, gives him a direction. He's a director. Gives him direction. And then, you know, okay, cool. And then he walks back downstairs and we do it again. And then he's like, do a couple. Cut. And now the director's coming again. And, you know, he's like. And each time I was like, I hope he's not coming to talk to me, because everyone is watching and everyone's going though. With this actor freaking. Not nailing it. So you feel kind of bad. So, yeah, I'm filming this thing and. And I'm. I'm just. I have one. Two. Two sentences. One line. Right? Two sentences. And I haven't said them yet. We. We recording for, like an hour.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It's all the other individual talking, just delivering these lines. Delivering. Doing great job. Just all great and everything. And then they have to stop and reset all the cameras for a different angle because now it's. It's Jocko's turn. And believe me, bro, I'm a professional. And guess what I did. I memorized those lines in my head. I went through them in my head. I was like, boom, boom, boom. I went through him in my head, like, hundreds of times.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah.

[A]

Gonna be ready, bro. I'm a pro. Don't wanna. I don't. From filming Warrior Kid. I didn't. I know what it's like when someone. You know when you mess something up.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And Mick G's gotta roll in and say, hey, okay, let's do it. Well, okay, we'll do it again. You know, everyone feels it. The cameraman's lugging that thing around, and he's kind of like, bro, what is wrong with you? You had one job.

[B]

Yeah. It's real.

[A]

So anyways, this is now three, four hours into this, and it's finally. Now we go the other angle. And finally it's now my turn to deliver my line. And. And the first time I say it, I had not. Even though I memorized it, I hadn't spoken it. I hadn't actually said the words, and they were kind of like a little bit awkward. And I said it, bro. But I. I got. I got it done. I powered through it. But I was like. But it wasn't smooth.

[B]

It wasn't the performance that you. You hoped for.

[A]

It wasn't the performance that I don't think anyone was hoping. Right. But I got it done. Okay. But I was like, oh, you didn't say the words. You didn't actually let the words come out of your mouth.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And that's a bad move. So it's like when you partially rehearse something, and that's why what's interesting here is, like, you might have the idea of, like, oh, I'm gonna. If we get to here, I'm gonna give this command. Yeah, but if you've never actually said it, bro.

[B]

Right.

[A]

It might jam you up a little bit. And I got jammed up. Now, look, like I said, I, I, I, I just had to go into team guy mode and just get them words out because I didn't want to have to just throw away the take. Right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So I got the words out. Super awkward. I think they were, like, thinking maybe. Oh, maybe, you know, maybe Jock was trying to put a little stank on it. But I, But I was like, yo, I wasn't trying to put anything.

[B]

I was just trying to get the

[A]

words out of my mouth. But I learned that lesson, bro. You gotta, you gotta actually say the words. You can't just practice them in your head. Yeah, because that's another thing. I was alone. Like, there was no one to practice the lines with.

[B]

Yeah. And. Yeah. What do you do in the mirror or some. Something.

[A]

No, I just, like, was literally looking at it and just going over it, like, with, like, sitting in a chair just thinking the words.

[B]

How long did you have to, like, from the moment you got the, the. What are the lines? The script to the moment of perform? How many days? How long did you have to prepare?

[A]

I probably had weeks to prepare, but I only prepared for one day.

[B]

I understand.

[A]

I didn't need it. I mean, it's literally two sentences. It didn't take me long to memorize it, but I didn't say them.

[B]

Brass. I think even you preparing jammed you up, and this is why. So I have. You know how, like, you ever been in a situation where you're like, I'm

[A]

gonna let you continue. You're wrong, but I'm gonna let you continue.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Yep. Go.

[B]

Okay. Because I believe I'm right right now. But I'd be interested to see if I'm wrong. So you're right.

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

You don't seem like the type that would have this problem, but I've run into a situation where I'm like, shoot, I gotta bring this up. It's not even a big deal, but I just, I feel like it's the right thing to bring it up and, like, sort it out. Right. To whoever. Whether it be to your friend or your wife or whoever.

[A]

Right.

[B]

I got to bring this up. And then I'm like, all right, well, I don't want to bring it up in a way that Makes it seem like it's a big deal than it really is. You ever heard me say. And I. I know this. I say this all the time. It's like I consciously say that. I say, even me bringing it up is making it seem like a bigger deal than it really is. I always say that ever it's like a small.

[A]

Like that before so that you make a big deal out of it.

[B]

Yeah, because I got deeper, but only because in the spirit of understanding, you know. But then I gotta be like, hey, but the more I explain the bigger deal it seems. So now I gotta explain how it's not a bigger. And it becomes a whole thing. You see what I'm saying? So here. So that. And that's part of my point where if I'm like, okay, I already made the decision to bring this XYZ thing up, right? I already made that decision. So how do I deliver it in a way that makes it not a big deal? I said, well, but there. And there is a way to do that, right? But if you're gonna deliver something in a specific, specific way, it has to be natural. Otherwise it looks contrived. And then now you bring. You introduce another element of the whole conversation. Are you even. Are you being authentic? And it becomes this big deal, right. Which isn't a big deal. So you jam up your whole process.

[A]

Okay. I said you were gonna be wrong, but I think you're actually right in many cases.

[B]

So just to finish what I. What I jam myself up, beat in from time to time is I'll be like, okay, let me just practice in my mind how I want it to sound. And I'll go over it and over it. But that whole process of me going over it in my mind makes it a big deal to me.

[A]

But also in your mind. Yeah. Maybe if you would have rehearsed out loud saying the words. Yeah. There's one more element that comes into play.

[B]

I just say. I feel like that is true. But. Yeah. So besides that part of it, the point is, if you don't actually go through it, because that's what being natural is. When you're actually natural doing something, something you're. You're really used to doing it, so it's just natural. But if it's your first time ever doing it, no matter how simple or complex, you know, it is your first time actually doing it ever, and you've been thinking about it, Right. It's impossible to be natural.

[A]

Well, this is kind of a. The similar thing when we record stuff at Echelon. Front.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

In like, someone will be. One of the instructors will be like, oh, hey, you know, talk about COVID and move. And they'll be like, oh, you want me just to say blah, blah, blah. And they rattle it off and you go, yeah, that's perfect. Perfect, yeah. And then the red record light comes on. Boom. It came over a freaking disaster dot com, bro. This is stuff that they've explained thousands of times. They know in and out better than anybody. And boom, you hit that, they see that red light. Brain lock, bro. Brain lock all day. So I think that has something to do with it. I also think that if you really. I think that you. You reach a point in memorization where it does become. It will sound natural because you've memorized it and it's. Now it's coming out of your brain just like it was. What is it thought? You know, it's like, oh, I just thought of this. So I think if you partially memorize something, it. It's probably going to jam you up. But if you memorize it to the core, it's probably going to be beneficial. I'm not saying that you won't be a bad actor. I'm not saying you won't be like, saying the line. Any military leader will readily support the practice of unit rehearsals before an operation. Like, you might say it like a dork.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Or like in a very unnatural way and not know. There's a. Like, there's a reason that actors. There's a reason that some actors are good actors.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Because they could do it and it's convincing. Right.

[B]

This is my little theory.

[A]

Everybody thinks they could be a good actor, but it is. Is more tricky than a lot of people think.

[B]

So that. And I. I feel like at the end of the day, it comes. It kind of goes along with what I'm saying. So, like, think about the. This idea of. Of doing the thing right. So snowboarding, for example. I watch all these tutorials. Okay, put your way before I went. You know, and that one's obvious because it takes a lot of physical balance that you can't just learn on a video. You got to actually do it. It's just the nature. So that's like an extreme example. But just this idea of doing the thing. Xyz. So your thing that you had to do was say the lines, and how you did it was kind of up to you. Right. But you had to do the thing. Right. And in this case, doing the thing is. Is saying lines.

[A]

That's the doing that I didn't do. It.

[B]

You never did it.

[A]

I never did.

[B]

You can't make it look natural and you can't make it look authentic. You can make it look however you're quote, unquote, trying to make it look. Because it has to. It can't be contrived. That's it. Because technically, I'm sure, like these lines, there's probably a handful of ways you could easily set them and they would have been right on a bunch of different ways as long as it came out natural. Right? That's really what good, quote, unquote, good acting is.

[A]

But what's interesting is because of the role that I was playing, it wasn't actually me. You know what I mean?

[B]

Show your range, bro.

[A]

I've done plenty of things where I'm just straight up just being Jocko or some other named. Of a guy named Jocko who's just Jocko with a different name.

[B]

Way easier, right? Yeah, cuz you've done that many, many times.

[A]

But I'll tell you what, Proud said that that's. He's like, well, that shit's hard. Like.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And he was like, dude, you, you, you're. I think people, they, they, they start to act the way they think they are in their own head.

[B]

So.

[A]

Okay, that jams them up, you know.

[B]

Yeah, big time. Okay, so Sam Harris talked about this long time ago where it's like, okay, you use a certain part of your brain, like, you know, the, your habitual, I don't know, whatever, you know, you know all the parts of the brain here, but there's, there's like this part of your brain that, that does the habitual stuff. Walking, talking, you know, whatever, just habitual stuff. You don't have to like, okay, let me take my. This step or that. Okay, so that. And then there's the other part, which can still make you do the same action, but it'll be way more clunky. So like you ever hear this is where I really notice it. Okay. I walked up and down the stairs in my house a million trillion times. But if I'm carrying like a big TV or something, I'm like, bro, I can literally walk up and down these stairs with my eyes closed. But now I'm like, bro, if I take one wrong step, I'm dead. So now my, this other part of my brain is engaged.

[A]

Trying to manage it, Trying to micromanage your movement, it gets all jammed.

[B]

Exactly right. And it makes it worse. Like you're. I'm literally worse at walking downstairs now that this other part of my Brain is all engaged. That's what happened when the red light comes on, when they're videotape in the echelon front, who. You know, if you're jamming up your lines, that's what happens when they're saying action. You know, like all this stuff. Even if you're, quote, unquote, just being another version of Jocko, which you've been for however many years, you know, now this other part of your brain is trying to be Jocko. That's not the part of the brain that's used to being Jocko. See what I'm saying? So a good actor. This is what it seems like anyway. And I've heard people say this where, if you can just. They say it's not even acting. You just be you. So it's. It's essentially, you gotta, like, disengage.

[A]

He's getting deep, bro.

[B]

Disengage that.

[A]

Okay. All right.

[B]

I see how it is.

[A]

We go in there, huh?

[B]

Yes, I've heard. In fact. Okay. You know, David Fincher is right. He does, like. He did, like, seven Fight Club. Like, he's a director, right? So he's known from doing, like, an ungodly amount of takes. And then his philosophy is like, we make people. He makes people do the lines on set, in the moment, cameras running so many times that after. After a while, it's just like, all right, bro, I'll do whatever. You know, the lines coming out, the physical doing of the lines is just.

[A]

That's natural already because you did it. That's kind of what I said. If you memorize it to a point and you've done it over and over and over again now, it just. It's part. You're not thinking about it. You stop thinking about it and just

[B]

start doing it exactly right now. But it's in show business or whatever, how often do you get the opportunity to do it in the actual moment over and over and over and over again with everybody watching with the camera

[A]

guy, I heard, like, Clint Eastwood will be like, all right. Like, first take, he's like, all right, that was good. And they'll be like, hey, can we dig? We. No. Yeah, you did fine. Like, we're moving on.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, I'm sure there's so many different philosophies as far as approaching that goes, but it. To me, it made sense. And it. And it has a lot to do with. And I think, anyway, of what you ran into because you literally had zero reps. Yeah. Doing.

[A]

I had a million mind reps. Yeah. But not one single actual rep. And I got jammed up in that moment and, like, pushed. Just, just team guided out.

[B]

It's, it's like literally like me watching a snowboarding tutorial a million times. Never been on the slopes a million times, and I'm like, I know exactly what to do. I know when to do it. I know, bro. I got this down. I go on there, and of course I'm gonna fall down a little bit. See what I'm saying? I might have some good technique in principle, but it's a little bit. There's that, that experience by. That nuanced experience that needs to be there. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So what's that? So did they call you back or.

[A]

No, no, we did. I mean, the next one, I was good to go, and then it was just, hey, you know what? Do you wanna, what, what stank do you want on it? You know what I'm saying?

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. Did you, Were you, were you, like, kind of surprised? Were you, like, dang, I, I, I sucked more than I thought I would.

[A]

No, I was, I knew exactly what happened. Oh, you didn't move your lips and skip the words out. You just thought you could do it because you do it all the time. And now you try to do it. And it. And it took. Let's say, let's say. If the line was. Any military leader will readily support practice of unit rehearsals before an operation. It'd be like this. Like, my time to send the line is now. Any military leader will readily support the practice of unit rehearsals before an operation. It was, like, just clunky.

[B]

Yeah, I understand.

[A]

It wasn't like a throwaway. I didn't lock up where they're like, okay, hey, did you, you know, like, because you don't want to be that guy, dude. You know what I'm saying? You don't want to be that guy that just doesn't know what you're supposed to do. You didn't prepare, bro. It's unprofessional. Right. Sorry to be professional. Offense. So it wasn't a total drop of the ball. Yeah, but, like, I kind of fumbled it for a second, grabbed it, and, like, you know, went down immediately. I still caught it, but it didn't look great, you know, so that's why we rehearse, is what I'm saying. Rehearse.

[B]

The role play comes to mind. Like, you know, you guys like, hey, do a role play or whatever. Just how beneficial that is.

[A]

So beneficial. And what they're saying is rehearse mentally. Hey, if stuff starts Getting stressful. Oh, I'm in a high port. I'm going to relax. I'm going to take a breath. I'm going to look around. Like that right there. Say that out loud and then relax. Look around, make a call.

[B]

Relax.

[A]

Look, this is what I wrote on Seth Stone's window of his Humvee in 2005 in the desert. Relax. Look around, make a call. Follow these instructions. Dude. Okay, got it. Back to the doc. Infuse emotional stability and control into the organization. Leaders must discover ways to control their application of emotional energy. Their behavior is a compass for the unit, an indicator of what stress is allowable and appropriate for the situation. Okay, so they're looking at you as the leader. The first actions after a significant event, like an attack with an improvised explosive device device set the unit's tone for the engagement as a. As General George S. Patton counsels, leaders are always on parade. An uncontrolled yell, a high pitched radio call, or even a worrisome look can transmit stress and doubt to the unit. Conversely, leaders with composure and confidence despite stressful circumstances will infuse those traits into the unit. Commanders should be deliberate and concise. Leaders should objectively verify emergency information to avoid overreacting or acting too hastily. Again, these are great. You know, this is stuff I've been saying for years and it's just a great angle on it.

[B]

Do you mind repeating that part where he said, leaders are. Somebody's always on parade.

[A]

George S. Patton said, leaders are always on parade. Yeah, great one.

[B]

So kind of like everyone's always kind of watching. Yeah, they're watching you to you for demeanor, the whole deal.

[A]

And if you freak out, everyone's gonna freak out.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah, you're right. How br. That one kind of goes deep cuz, like, you know how, like, I think it might have been you. I don't know. It doesn't matter who, but it was like, yeah, once you kind of let your uniform slack or certain things slack just for your own personal self, people will like start to be like, oh, I guess we can kind of do that.

[A]

You know, that's true. But this is an even more acute moment, which is if you see me panicking. Yeah, yeah, you're gonna panic. If you see me acting calm, you're like, oh, okay, we're calm.

[B]

Right.

[A]

That's the way it is. That's what works with your family, too. When your kid falls down and scrapes his knee, if you go, oh my gosh, are you okay? The kid's not gonna be okay. But if you go, dude, that was awesome. Try it again. The kid's gonna be fine.

[B]

So, always on parade?

[A]

Yeah, always on parade. Neuroscience research reveals that there are methods leaders can use to do this. Noted author Malcolm Gladwell describes deliberate emotion in blink. We take it as a given that we experience that. That first we experience an emotion, and then we may or may not express that emotion in our face. We think of the face as the residue of the emotion. The process works in the opposite direction as well. So you can force your emotions through your facial expression. Emotion can also start in the face. An equal partner. It is an equal partner in the emotional process. A German psychology experiment revealed that people who were physically made to smile by holding a pen clenched in their teeth rated cartoons as funnier than people who watched the same cartoons while holding the pen in their lips, which prevented smiling. Facial expressions are not just a representation of emotions. They can direct emotions. Leaders can physically incite a more positive, relaxed emotional response in their bodies by intentionally forming a relaxed facial expression during combat events. This demeanor will also cue similar responses in the soldiers around them. There you go. Like, you have to. You have to impose your emotions on yourself.

[B]

That blinking thing is.

[A]

Well, this is freaking. For 10 years, you and I've been talking about a little something called normal face.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, I used to play this game with my own children to get them to not give away their emotions in stressful situations. If you make a face, if you break, you get smacked in the head with the cardboard roller from inside the Christmas wrapping paper.

[B]

Yeah. Hell yeah.

[A]

And it'd be funny. You know, the kids would be trying not to laugh. But that translates to everything that you're doing. Because, man, if you give away your emotions, your boss sees that you're mad. Your team sees that you're frustrated, bro. It's gonna spread. It's gonna cause problems. Normal face all day, brother.

[B]

You know, I noticed this in Back to acting for a little bit. Like, if you watch. If you watch certain movies, if the actors, let's say it's not as experienced and they're trying to deliver some like, like, deep, like, dope, like, freaking line. And then. But then they're blinking a little bit too much. It's like it doesn't land as much versus, like, you know, all these real intense actors, like a, you know, Daniel Day Lewis, like Tom Cruise or something like this, and they're like, going hard on some, like, monologue to somebody, bro. They don't blink at all. And it. Brad lands super hard or on the other side. If they want to imply like stress or worry. They won't put stress and worry all over their theatrics. They'll just like start blinking a little bit more and I'll be like, bro, that freaking sells it. Like you feel it, you know, with a close up just from the blinking. Or no blinking.

[A]

Or no blinking. There you go. Next section created an effective decision making environment. Regardless of when, rank, even in the midst of intense combat, leaders must create an environment that is conducive to making cognitive, not emotional decisions. They can start creating this environment by physically and emotionally disengaging from the immediate fight. You heard me say this a thousand times. Come off. Go to high port. Come off the skirmish line. This may mean finding sufficient cover for a local command post. A company commander seldom belongs in the hatch of his vehicle or exposed on the street, scanning for targets like a rifleman. Of course, desperate times will call for every gun to be in the fight, but only a handful of commanders will ever face the situation. The goal is for every leader to mentally zoom out from his personal tactical situation and take a more macro level view of the battle, preparing his brain to handle the impending cognitive challenges. This is what you need to do. And again, it's not just in combat. During that meeting, everyone start getting wild. Just ease your chair back, push away from the table, shut your mouth and listen to what's going on. Don't get involved in. Don't get on your gun, which is your mouth. Don't start firing your mouth off. No, listen. Assessment. The commander should use his space from the battle to focus on what he is trained to do, assess and analyze what has occurred, recognize friendly forces, vulnerabilities, predict what the enemy will do next, decide on feasible course of action, communicate the plan to the unit, and apply the appropriate leadership skills to inspire the unit to accomplish the mission. The specifics of these steps can include conducting rapid terrain analysis and land navigation using complex digital systems, calling for mortar, artillery or aircraft fires, establishing hasty. And it gives a whole list of things that you got to do. These are highly cognitive and require a steady mind. A leader needs to find a suitable environment where he can generate new ideas, new insights for each unique tactical situation encountered. Battle drills are of course, an effective method units use to survive the first moments of event. But the leaders must think beyond the battle drill and formulate innovative ways to beat the enemy. If you hear me talking at the muster, I'm like, oh, what's the first thing I did? Get on, you know, take cover, return fire, and then immediately get off the gun. Look around. You got a whole team that's shooting. You need to look around, make a call. As neuroscientist Jonah Lair explains in How We Decide, this is where prefrontal cortex really demonstrates its unique strengths. It is the only brain region able to take an abstract principle and apply it in an unfamiliar context to come up with something entirely original for a solution. It's very powerful. And then we got a. A model for cognitive battle. In your brain at work. David Rock explains that the mental processes relevant to performing work are understanding, recalling, deciding, memorizing and inhibiting. These are the things that are, you know what you're doing. Understanding. Following the initial shock of an attack. Understanding involves how a leader creates maps in the prefrontal cortex that represent new incoming information and connects these maps to existing maps in the rest of his brain. That's what we're doing. You're looking at terrain, you're looking at the enemy that initiated the attack. You've got pertinent data, you got the population considerations, you got maneuverability requirements, you got restrictions and friendly force disposition. Like these are all the things that you're mapping out and then recalling in battle. Recalling is a process of comparing existing situation with the database of stored knowledge in the long term memory of networks. These are the lessons that you've learned. These are the instructions that you've received. These are the experiences that you've had. These are doctrines that you've looked at. These are lessons learned that you've gone through. This is where perhaps a little phrase or a piece of advice comes into play like cover and move or take the high ground or keep it simple. Next up is deciding. A combat leaders brain engages in the deciding process when it chooses which recalled information will be most useful and applies it to real time in the world to build a new mental map. That's when we're making the decision and then memorizing. This was one that I didn't really expect. The other ones make sense. Right. David Rock describes a memory memorizing as holding maps in attention in the prefrontal cortex long enough to embed them in long term memory. Research shows that is impossible for our brains to simultaneously hold multiple complex concepts in working memory without degrading accuracy. For leaders in battle, memorizing is also in the internalization of a plan. Focusing on the concept of an operation, planned or hasty, creates familiarity that allows execution without redundant analysis or reference to written notes. Yeah. And what that boils down, that was kind of cool. My first deployment to Iraq, we were always Going to a different, like, ao, like, area of operations. You're Baghdad, but Baghdad's huge. I think I want to say Baghdad was like, nine times bigger than Ramadi. And so you'd be going to a neighborhood you'd never seen it before. And I would do a decent job of getting familiar with the battle map going in there, but not as good as we. Like. Once you're in Ramadi for four months, you're just like, I know where this is, and it just makes you better at it. I think if I went back in time, I would do a little bit more memorization of the battle maps. But what I would memorize would be, like, phase lines or this. The approach to the building or follow on targets. Like, I would. I would have chunks of it so that then. Then I understand it makes sense. Like, you don't want to have to be like, hey, we're moving to phase line be Bravo. And be like, hold on. Let me pull up my map and figure out exactly what it is. Oh, no, there's the. There's the. The building with the fence by it. That's phase on Bravo. Cool. So that makes sense.

[B]

And it gives you phase line.

[A]

Just. It's an area of an operation that you designate. For instance, hey, when we reach this, when we've got all our forces assembled, we're at the. At this phase line at this location. Hey, we're at phase line Alpha now. We've pushed through the target. The target secure. We're at phase line Bravo is. It's just a way of describing kind of the. Kind of the flow of an operation chronologically, but it's also physical. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. So, okay, so it's like a little designation of an Understood.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Area.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay, the next one, the last one is inhibiting. Inhibiting is the practice of selective focus when one actively tries not to engage certain mental maps because they're irrelevant or counterproductive. We call that prioritize next year.

[B]

That's the red light when they press record on a camera.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

You got to suppress.

[A]

Suppress that thing. But it's also prioritized, actually. Like, these things don't matter right now. These nine things over there don't matter. What matters is these two things right here. So inhibiting is practice of selective focus. This is prioritize and execute all day. The leader must. And he talks about some of the things that we got to suppress. Must suppress his learned tendencies, realign his mental perspective and develop new neural connections that will help him properly frame and respond to it. And then this author adds personalizing to these. I add personalizing, which is, which can apply to every moment of a leader's day. This is the application of leadership principles and personality attributes that will guide the organization to accomplish the mission effectively. Personalizing is the leader's conscious effort to prevent external influences from altering the foundation of character and leadership that he has consistently developed and that his subordinates have learned to expect. And then it talks about training for the emotional, emotionally stable fight. Training for combat is about changing the brain. Decades of neuroscience and by the way, what's cool, I've got, I've got, I got to see this over and over again. I got to see young SEAL leaders when they're going through training be, get caught up in the emotions and learn how to detach and start to be able to make really good decisions. So this is something that you can do. You can change your brain. Decades of neuroscience research have firmly shown that the brain is highly adaptable and that repeated activities designed to create specific behaviors like combat training literally change the cellular structure and strength of connections between neurons. So you can actually change these things. You can start to get some control over how much time you spend in the gray slop. At the rifleman level, training teaches soldiers to respond reflexively to situations that demand spontaneous conditioning response, such as engaging an enemy fighter at close range. And like mag changes and ready up drills. It is the same behavioral process that professional athletes apply to develop the fine tuned motor skills needed in competition. This learning process also applies to activities that demand higher cognitive ability, such as detailed planning for a combat operation or reacting to a complex attack. A way to train this capability would be construct an exercise that requires leaders to undergo physical or fear induced stress and then perform deliberate time constrained planning for an ambiguous situation. So you get better at these things. And again, I just said that. You see this and you've heard me talk about this before. In the military, they want to get you used to being afraid. So what do you do to get used to being afraid? Well, guess what I did. The first thing I did was climb over the low wall. You climb over the low wall, it's only like 12ft. You climb over it, you kind of dangle and you. The next obstacle, two obstacles away, the cargo net. The cargo net is like 50ft up. You got to climb to the top of it. When you get to the top of it, you got to climb over it. And at a certain point you've got to kind of like just let go and get to the other side. If you're scared of heights, you're not going to be able to do it. You got it? And even if you're not scared of heights, you got to overcome them. Or what? Doesn't matter. You got to go do it right. You got to suppress that feeling. And then by the way, a little further on the obstacle course course is the slide for life. Now you're up three stories. You're gonna dangle off the edge and slide down a rope. It's if you can't, if you're afraid, it's gonna be a problem.

[B]

The slide for life. The. You said you got a dangle on a rope. What did you slide down a rope?

[A]

Slide down a rope.

[B]

Like a zip line.

[A]

It's at an angle, it's like a zip line. But you're using your hands as the zip. And you, you pull yourself down like hand over hand.

[B]

Oh, okay. So you're kind of maneuvering and then

[A]

eventually do a commando stop style. Once you get to a certain point in buds, they let you like slide down on your stomach, but when you, when they first make you do it, you're like hanging underneath the rope. Like your legs are wrapped around the rope and you're pulling yourself.

[B]

How do you slide down on your

[A]

stomach if you're gonna just go look up commando style, Slide for life. And you'll see somebody doing it.

[B]

I'm gonna.

[A]

Or I think they even call it Australian style.

[B]

Hell yeah. Okay, all right, cool.

[A]

But eventually you get done with that. Guess what you're doing? Repelling off the tower. And then you're repelling out of a helicopter. Then you're fast roping out of a helicopter. And then you're parachuting. And your first parachuting a static line. And then eventually you're free falling and then you're free falling from high altitude with an oxygen and a rucksack. Each one of those things levels up the amount of fear induced situation. And then they do the same thing with shooting. Like the first time you're shooting your own static range. And then the next thing you're shooting, you know, on a static range with a little bit of movement. And then eventually you're doing live fire immediate action drills in the middle of the desert with rockets and grenades going off.

[B]

You ever been afraid of heights or had a thing against heights?

[A]

I, I think I have just the normal kind of natural like appreciation. But the weird thing is when you're parachuting, it doesn't feel like heights.

[B]

That, that's. And I feel, I don't, I don't Know, at the end of the day, but it feels like, yeah, if I feel like that's kind of one of the little tests.

[A]

I've been more. I've been more aware of the height when I was on a building or on a rooftop than I was ever aware of the height when you're. When you're jumping out of an airplane.

[B]

Yeah, I'm with you. The. The same deal where if I climbed up there, I don't get afraid of heights at all. If I like, you know, like a big cargo net or something like this. The only time I'm like, quote unquote aware where I'm like, ism, you're in a. Let's say a hotel or something. You're on a top floor, and then they just allow you out on the balcony. And I'm like, bro, this. There is very little barrier given how far down that is. You see what I'm saying? Like, someone could, like, fall over this balcony, just freaking fall. This whole, like an airplane or. Or something like that. It's almost like there's too much of a disconnect to understand that you're high up. You just seem like you're just sort of in a different world, you know? So you don't. But I feel like that's kind of the litmus test where if it's like. If people have this, like. Oh, like, they kind of have this panic mode when they're, like, way up in the air. I feel like, bro, if I felt from here, I would. I don't know. I'm not in touch with. It seems. I don't know. Interesting.

[A]

Makes sense. Continuing on, units should structure training to present multiple streams of information and detectable patterns of enemy activity that will teach leaders what to look for. So that's what we're doing, right? We're putting people in situations where they got to start going, wait a second. Doesn't really matter that there's. This is happening. What matters is that, like, we used to tell guys, if there was no shooting, like, the enemy stops shooting, stop shooting at you. Your instinct can't be, oh, cool, they left. Your instinct has to be. They're maneuvering. So that's the kind of thing you can train people to pay attention to. On the individual level, leaders should develop personal cognitive battle drills that better prepare them for mental challenges of combat. They should rehearse exactly what words they will use to report initial contact and what guidance they use anticipating issuing. In the opening moments of a battle, these drills create neural circuitry that is familiar to the brain when the actual event happens, thus making it easier to execute with calm and confidence. Leadership position themselves on the battlefield to facilitate their cognitive responsibilities. Despite mission, terrain or movement technique, leaders must discern what position allows them to survey all aspects of the fight as much as possible. They should directly observe their soldiers and get information real time without compromising their ability to keep a macro view. Conversely, soldiers expect to see their leaders at the proverbial front and cannot respect leaders who are never among them. Finding this balance is part of what makes command an art. Most importantly, all leaders have a responsibility to build a database of professional knowledge that will assist them in creating insight during stressful situations. They do this by studying doctrine, seeking instruction from mentors, being self critical about performance, recording new ideas, participating in thought thought exercises, discussing related concepts with peers, and reading professional works. You got to know history, you gotta have tactical options, you gotta have your personal experience. And if you have those things, you will be able to find creative answers on the battlefield. Because sometimes the answer is not in doctrine. The concept of brain based combat leadership deserves attention in both military and professional development courses and unit level education training programs. Rooms Teaching leaders what they will physiologically experience will better prepare them to maintain emotional stability and effectively lead others during combat. It's got a bunch of recommendations for the army in here and then here's the conclusion. Combat involves a wide range of events, dangers and sensory inputs that can easily overwhelm the unprepared mind. The first job of every soldier, regardless of rank, is to maintain his composure and react reflexively to the threat as required. Leaders, however, must go beyond the conditioned response to combat that we train on the live fire range. They must zoom out right, detach and adopt a macro level view of the battle, quickly analyze events occurring, decide on the appropriate response, coordinate complex systems and apply the appropriate leadership skills to accomplish the mission. These brain functions are among the most sophisticated processes that we humans can perform. Leaders who do not protect their own cognitive function during combat will find themselves short of the biological resources necessary to win. Meaning glucose to your brain and place themselves and others at risk. In this sense, knowing how to think could be a combat leader's most valuable tool. So what that whole article was about was trying to get leaders. Trying to teach leaders to detach from the monkey brain and use your brain to think and not be driven by your instincts, but driven by logic and reason. Now here's where I'm gonna give some additional information that is slightly contrary. It's not contrary, but you have to think about it. This is something I've always said. Detachment doesn't mean that you become void of emotions. In fact, emotions have to be part of the calculus. Your emotions, your team's emotions, your boss's emotions, all emotions need to be taken into account. Now, this does not mean that, that they drive our decision making process, but they have to play a role. They have to be in the calculus. Us, we have to be the driver, right? Here's my metaphor. We heard about a chariot. We heard about this. We have to have the steering wheel, we have to have the brakes, we have to have the gas. We have to know when is it a good time to add more emotion? Because sometimes we need to add more emotion to the situation. Right? You ever had a situation where someone's not getting it, like cornering someone in MMA and they're losing two rounds and they have one more round left and they go, I think the fight's going okay. No, that's not.

[B]

No.

[A]

You might need to, you might need to press the gas on the emotion. You also might need to take some of that emotion away, you know, in yourself. You might need to know when it's time to turn on the emotion, when it's time to pull some back. You might need to know what you need to control, when it's time to follow your instinct and when it's time to say, hold on, I need to, I need to pay attention to the logic here. That should be our goal. Our goal should be to have the steering wheel, have the brakes, have the gas, know when we need to push. No. 1. We need to pull back and learn how to drive and manage and modulate your emotions and your ego and your reason and your logic and utilize all those different inputs to create decisions and solutions and create actions. And of course, you can't do any of this if you can't detach. You'll never figure out anything that I'm talking about. If you are in the gray slop, you won't ever see it. You won't even know what I'm talking about right now. But you can't abandon emotions and ego and passion. You need to stay in touch with them, you need to stay connected to them, but you can't be controlled by them. And this is very, very difficult. Difficult. And, and it's also very, very important. So, T.E. lawrence, Lawrence of Arabia, famous British guy, archaeologist, he's a military officer. He became famous during the Arab revolt in 1916 and 1918 against the Ottoman Empire. And he had a, a quote in his book the Seven Pillars of Wisdom. Nine tenths of tactics are certain and taught in books, but the irrational 10th is like the kingfisher flashing across a pool. And that is a. That is the test of generals. And I saw a guy on Twitter X named Infantry Dort puts out a lot of good information. He had this quote up. But the point of this quote is, this is something that is very, very difficult to teach. This, that you can learn 9/10 of being a combat leader. You can learn from the books, you can learn from the schoolhouse, you can learn it on the drill field. Like, there's all nine tenths of. You can have it all dialed in, but there's a tenth of it. He calls it the irrational tenth, which is like, you can't. You can't teach it to somebody. Now, T. Lawrence does say you can get better at it, but it's very, very difficult to teach. But it's not only applicable to the military, it's applicable. Like, you hear about it in sports, right? In sports. I. I think you can correct me on this. You're more of a sports guy than I am. You hear people describing athletes that have certain intangibles, right? Hey, they're. They got this capability, they got this much talent, but they have intangibles. Michael Jordan, was he the tallest guy? No, like, he. But what did he have? He had something that we all have a hard time naming, and people will try and name it Court sense. Like, even Court Sense. What's that? Is that a thing? Like, are we going to name that? Like, is that. Can you just. Can I teach you questions? Court sense, right?

[B]

Right.

[A]

Maybe I can give you some. You get familiar with the game, but there's some people that have another level of it. Tom Brady. The famous videos of Tom Brady at the Combine, looking weak, you know, slow. But what did he have? He had some intangibles. Muhammad Ali, Lionel Messi, Deion Sanders. These people. Handsome and mma, we see it, right? Jon Jones, Johnny Bones Jones. What is he doing? Like, he's doing like, okay, we. We all know Muay Thai, we all know wrestling, we all know Jiu jitsu, we all know boxing. But all of a sudden he's doing something else, right? He's taking all those things and mixing in a way that we go, wait, no one taught him that. And Coach Jackson would say, like, no, he never saw him do that before. He just did it there in the moment. Fedor Emelianenko what is he putting together? How does he. How's he winning fights? Right? Hicks and Gracie, Marcelo Garcia into The jiu jitsu world, there's something going on there. They have these untangibles. They have these. These. These irrational tents that. It doesn't matter. You can't get them from the gym. And then in Hollywood, you get the same thing, right? In Hollywood, what do they call it? They call it it the. They call it the it factor or just it. Marilyn Monroe, Marlon Brando. Denzel Washington, right? Al Pacino. Chris Pratt. Chris Pratt, bro. You hang out with Chris Pratt and you go, oh, yeah. You're like, okay, there's a reason that he's Chris Pratt. There's something about him. He's got something. They call it. It. They call it the thing. But you. You. When you don't. You don't really know what it is. Like, when I was first going to meet Chris Pratt, I was going to a UFC fight with Jack Carr, and we were. We were flying from la. It was super cool, but it was my first time meeting, like, a real famous, like, Hollywood person. I was kind of like, oh, you know, I bet this guy's going to be like, you know how they portrayed Matt Damon in. In America, Team America World Police? You know, they kind of portrayed Matt Damon like. Like kind of just dumb or whatever. And so I kind of thought, you know, I don't know nothing about Hollywood. I'm like, okay, that must be the real assessment of these Hollywood people. So, but I'm, you know, I seen Chris Pratt and stuff, but I thought, you know, whatever, like, he's going to be kind of like that character caricature that they put forward in Team. Team America World Police. And then you meet him and you spend, like, five minutes around him and you go, oh, okay, okay, I get it. They're the reason that he's who he is. But no one. He didn't learn that in acting school. I don't even think he went to acting school. Right? He didn't go. He didn't. I don't think he was in the school plays and had the. The. The drama teacher, like, saying, no, you need to get a little bit more furrow in your brow or be a little bit quicker on your comeback. Like, I don't know none of that, but there's something there. And then you get like, rock musicians, right? Ozzy, of course, Elvis, Hendrix, Prince. Like, you know, these are people that. They just have some thing. And by the way, not just singers, but you people that are people that can play an instrument. If you go down to Guitar center and you put up, hey, I'm hiring a Guitarist. I need a guitarist that can play Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, Tool, which is hard as hell, and Rush, which is hard as hell, proficiently. Call this number I'll get in San Diego. I'll get 10 phone calls, and they'll be able to do it too. And one of the guys is like a waiter. One of the guys will be a construction worker. One of the guys will be a what, whatever, because they. They're really good at their instrument, but they don't have that little thing that Kurt Cobain had, which is take four chords and turn it into like a crazy whole album. So there is this unquantifiable kind of 10th or intangible, irrational 10th. And here's what I think is, especially from a leadership perspective, that thing is the connection back to the gray slop. The connection back to the gray slop, which is the ability to connect with someone emotionally, connect to that animal instinct, communicate with that. Like you ever. Even. What you're just talking about. Like, you see someone talking and they're getting people fired up. They're not talking to their logical. You never heard someone say, I want to go over the statistics right now? Like, they don't. That's not. That's not a fired up speech. The fired up speech doesn't appeal to that. What it does when someone has this ability, when they have that connection back to their emotional gray slop and they can modulate it properly, they can utilize it to write a great song, to lead people to improvise a martial arts move like they're to get. When they get done. Conor McGregor gets a hold of the microphone and everyone goes nuts because he's gonna connect in a way that someone else that doesn't have that ability to have problems or to not. Not get where they want to go. And by the way, sometimes some people can tap into it and. And they. But. But it's too much, right? And in the. Like, in. In the. In the entertainment business, you end up with Kurt Cobain, you end up with Jim Morrison, you end up with Janis Joplin, you end up with Amy Whitehouse, you end up Winehouse, you end up with Sid Vicious, you ended up with. With Jim Belushi, you end up with Heath Ledger. Like, these people are people that would tap back in, but then it would kind of like just get hold of them. So they. It's one of these things. You got to control it. You got to tap into it. But if you don't have control over it, it'll. And by the way, this happens with leaders Too. Like leaders that lose their minds, which I, you know, when you have a leader that's in charge of an organization. Organization, and they lose their minds, they were able, they used that tapping into their emotions and their ego to drive things and make things happen. But at a certain point, it takes over and they lose their minds. They, their, their prefrontal cortex just shuts down, and now their ego's running the show and it's a disaster dot com. So that's why you gotta, you gotta know how to win, to hit the brakes. You gotta know when it gas. You got to steer it in the right direction. And if you can, if you have the rationalization and you have the discipline to do that, you have the discipline to go, oh, hold on a second. This is about to be an egotistical decision. And by the way, when I stood up in front of the company, I said, we're gonna, we're gonna go into this market. Nothing's gonna stop us. And that was tapping into my ego and tapping into my emotion and connecting with other people's emotion because they all want to win, and I want to win because that's gonna do better for our survival in the world. And I'm going to tap into that. But then two months later, when it's like, hey, we got a decision to make on if we're going to continue to expend this money on this marketing campaign that hasn't done well, my ego might be saying, I know it's going to work, but it's not a good move. And you got to be able to. You got to be able to decipher and utilize the proper area of your brain, and you have to be the person that's controlling it. You can't let your emotions make decisions, but you can't leave them out of the decisions. And sometimes you got to press the gas on your emotions, and sometimes you got to press the gas on your ego. You ever seen some. An MMA fighter, as they're getting closer and closer to the fight, they start, Their ego starts growing. If it grows too early, they stop training. If it grows too late, they're not ready for the fight. They doubt themselves. They have got to figure out how to modulate these things. We have to figure out how we modulate these things. When someone can do that, that's a rare person, and that's going to be the person that rises to the top. But, you know, we, we're not counting on that over here. Not over, you know, Jocko's not over here. Just counting on all the doing it right, we're just trying to do better. We're just trying to do better. And in order to do better, in my opinion, we truly have to learn first of all to detach from that gray slop, that animal instinct which, by the way, drives so much in our lives. Okay, by the way, the workout that you didn't do, Grace, Lop. That's animal instincts telling you you're tired, telling you don't need to do it. The donut that you ate, immediate gratification. Dopamine, dopamine, dopamine, dopamine, dopamine. That's all it is. The gray slop is if we're not out of it, if we're in it, we're not doing the right thing. That's what happens. Letting our stupid animal instincts make decisions about our long term lives or without considering our long term lives. We cannot allow this. We have to get control. We have to detach. We have to elevate above the gray slop. We have to take control of our lives. And when needed, we artfully utilize the emotion and the ego and the passion. Like a, you know, it's like a little, like a little fuel, little nuclear reactor. It's real. Like it's burning. Those things are burning. But you can't let that fire get out of control. It's like a meltdown in a nuclear facility. You got to keep it. You got to know when to put the carbon rods into the reactor to cool it down. Sometimes you can't let it just run out of control. Or you can have a meltdown, which is terms that people use about someone having a freaking meltdown. Why is that? They let their emotion, they let their ego, they let their passion get out of control, set them on fire. But if you can control that, if you contain that energy and utilize it properly, you're gonna have a win. So think about that. And if you can do that, it is going to elevate every aspect of your life. And that's what I got. That's what I got for today. So pay attention to it. It's there. The chimpanzee mind is strong and it is loud.

[B]

Everything, you know, that it factor or whatever I feel like. And I was kind of going deep as you're explaining. I was like, bro, that's true. You know, like the, the ability. And you said something actually, which was spot on. A little bit later you said artfully, artfully, like, you know, take from the, the gray part, the gray slop. And then, you know, and kind of interchange them and whatever to create this kind of thing. I. It feels like it's like, with five minutes of thinking, obviously, but the it factor that. You know, that intangible, that. What is it? The 10? The something 10?

[A]

The irrational 10th?

[B]

Yeah, the irrational 10th. I think it has to do with some kind of lack of restraint or boundary, whatever that looks like, you know, like, I think in acting, they call it, like, self. Self consciousness. You got to let go of the self consciousness, you know? And I think. And even in sports, right, where you, like. You doubt, you're like, any competition, you have a healthy level of doubt for yourself, you know, kind of a thing. But then if you can, some people have it just naturally where they're like, I don't follow those rules. Like, even all the way down to their subconscious, like, they don't follow your etiquette. Like, Brad. Doesn't apply to me, you know, kind of a thing. So, like, okay, remember, okay, this MMA guy, he was. He was a black guy. He used to fight in. I want to say, he would, like. He'd do weird, crazy stuff. What Was his name?

[A]

Ed. 9 mil?

[B]

No. No. Yeah. No, it was. It was a different guy. We don't. I don't think we know him personally. He's. He was my younger brother's favorite guy. I think he had, like, silver teeth, maybe.

[A]

Yeah, Yep. Crazy horse.

[B]

Crazy horses. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Charles.

[A]

So he was wild.

[B]

Exactly. Right? So he's in wild. That's exactly what I'm saying. But he had this very specific thing where he wasn't like, he. He was the opposite. As far as his style goes. It wasn't this highly disciplined, you know? Like, think gsp, right? If you. If GSP comes out to win this fight, you're like, bro, this guy's game is just tight, you know, like, he's making all the right moves.

[A]

Bro, you. You're even more right than you know, you are. I. I've been back in the day UFC on the same card, GSP fighting. You could see, like, cutting weight. You would see him cutting weight, like. Like a machine.

[B]

Machine.

[A]

Just a machine. Just like, you know, checking weight. Like, no big deal. Like, no experience. Expression on his face, you know, just. Just so disciplined and professional. Yeah, you're like, okay, cool.

[B]

Like clockwork. Even his fights, like, yep, same thing. And you know, which fight was really, like, this guy came to, like, 100 win. Like, no risk, no this and that. Like, this was like, it. It's almost like, hey, if you're going to increase the probability of you winning. But to 100, you have to do all the right things, take zero risk, and do the right things and finish the fight.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

This is how he would fight, you know, it was his rematch against Matt, Sarah. When he lost him at Sarah, that second one, it was like, bro, this guy's not losing. There's no way he's gonna lose. So anyway, it was so calculated and so tight. Versus Crazy Horse Bennett.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Bro. The exact opposite, bro. But that still still won sometimes or a lot of times. Yeah. Yeah.

[A]

And by the way, he connected emotionally with so many people. He was a fan favorite, right? He's a fan favorite, but he didn't modulate it enough. And by the way, it didn't only apply to in the cage. It was also like, what was his lifestyle? Like, was this a guy that was, like, on the mats, training? No, he was, like, not on the mats. He was obviously a very gifted guy and he trained. But, like, that next level of discipline, there was more emotion. There was more crazy. That's why his little nickname was Crazy Horse.

[B]

So Maybe his irrational 10th was like an irrational, know, 30 or something like this, or for. It was. It was bigger than it maybe should have been as far as ideal. But as far as identifying that thing, he had a lot of that thing where he was like. He didn't have boundaries. He didn't have internal boundaries. Like, hey, maybe I shouldn't. Nah, he was sending it all. Just full send, like, good, good. This is what we're doing. This is what I'm doing, you know, and it wasn't like, I'm gonna timidly send it, because, you know, some guys,

[A]

they'll timidly send it, you know, Jeremy Stevens.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Another like, he. He was losing a fight, you know, and I was in his corner, and I had to. I had to go emotional with him and get him emotional.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And, dude, he got a mo. Because he's an emotional dude.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, and, dude, he tapped into that emotion. Freaking almost murdered a guy, you know what I'm saying? Just KO'd a brother because. But it was one of those things where his. He needed to tap into that at that time.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And. And that's a positive thing to have. But, like, you're saying, like, gsp, like, there was no. I don't remember. Maybe we could find a fight. We had to get into some, like, emotional level. But a lot of times, dude, GSP was just a machine. And same with, like, Fedor Emelianenko.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, you. Did you ever see an Expression on his face. It's like, no, not really. He was not fighting with any type of emotion at all. And that kind of became his. Made him so popular. Right. Like, like just like a Terminator. But yes, this, this thing is being able to figure out how much of this fire you're gonna let out and when you're gonna let it out.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And how you're gonna let it out.

[B]

The guys who just like I said, can put it together perfectly or because it has to be the perfect combination and then the first perfect, like back and forth with all the training, discipline, competitiveness, self confidence, like all that stuff. And then on top of it, that like lack of restraint where you can be like, no, I'm not gonna follow the protocol. I'm gonna, I'm gonna step outside of the protocol for this one. You see what I'm saying? So like, you know, Michael Jordan, I saw that were the, the best one. I, I think I can think of thought at the top of my head is Jon Jones because you know, like bro, he finished fights with a spinning elbow and just like how you, uh, who was it? Coach Jackson. Right, Greg Jackson. We were like, yeah, I never seen him do. But he has been. He's so creative, like minded with everything within the confines of his discipline for sure. Where he'd be like, oh no, I can send this and make it work. He doesn't have that constraint that I would have, bro. If I'm like, bro, I've never practiced that spinning elbow. Bro, I'm not going to try in a fight. Doesn't mean.

[A]

Well, this is an interesting thing because I was, you know, in the, in the publishing world right now. There's a lot of AI being published and one of the things about publishing or one of the things about humans is humans have an irrational tenth. Right. And I don't know that they can successfully put the irrational 10th into a A.I. can they say, by the way, I want you to throw in some random thought and process it in there. But it's, it's that it's random, but it's. Whereas AI is going to take. AI is predictable. You put in the input it's going off of. It's going to be. Here's the story, here's the thing. Because it's based on other things that have existed before. But a human is going to hopefully have this irrational 10%. The it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That's what makes a writer write. You know, I was talking to my literary agent a long time ago and she's really smart, studied at An Ivy League college, studied history and literature. And one day I was like, you know, like, why are you a literary agent? Not. Not like a writer? And she says, you know, I look at a paper and I don't really have anything to write about. And I was like, oh, okay. And which is weird because for me, I have, like, all kinds of, like, ridiculous ideas that I need to figure out which one I'm gonna invest in.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, but that's of a similar thing.

[B]

Yeah. So that. That we're. I think. Yeah, it was you. We just weren't recording where it was a while ago. We're. We'll talk about, like, you know, creative people right now. There's all different kinds of creature. I get it. But, like, you know, a lot of these people who we regard as, like, highly creative, they have this odd. This weird past, you know, where they've been through something, whether it be traumatic or just super dynamic in one way or another, that they can kind of draw upon which. And whether they know it or not. And I think that that's the struggle. I think that AI is going to have a hard time, like, replicating whatever. With enough time, who knows? But it's hard to replicate, like, someone's actual pet. Yeah. Okay, so AI will say a video, Right. I make an AI video and say, hey, do this. Make them feel this another. And they'll do it. And they did it. But I'm like, brad wouldn't really look like that. It wouldn't really feel like that. You see, I'm saying you're doing it too perfectly. So when you really.

[A]

Predictably.

[B]

Yeah, predictably, exactly. Right. If you really went through it, oh, you would know. There's little details of someone. You know, how, like, if someone's telling a story about, like, their friend and be like, you're talking about yourself right now. You see what I'm saying? Because, you know, like, there's something that kind of comes with it that is, like, so, like, inherently human that it's like you. You can't just replicate it. I can't describe it, but once you experience it, you're like, okay. And it's like, it's hard to, like, predictably recreate it out of nothing or imagination. Like, you kind of got to do it. Well.

[A]

It's kind of like before we hit record the. You know, we know what is in an amoeba. We know all the components that are in amoeba. We can put all those in a little dish and stir them together, but it doesn't come to life. That takes some other element. And so the idea, like, everything that you can put all these things into the AI dish, but like, there's something that, just like you said, like, there's something. It can look similar and sound similar, but at the end of the day, you're kind of like, well, it's not quite that thing. It's not quite there. So you gotta tap, you gotta be able to tap into it appropriately. Most people don't have a problem with this, by the way, but I, I do think most people have a problem with their. They're too emotional. They're letting their ego and all these emotions and everything run the show. But I think if you can detach more, I think people that detach properly, they find a way to better recognize the power of that emotion and funnel it and get it to a right spot where it can be utilized properly. Now, look, the, you know, like crazy artists, right, that burn in and they, they better to burn out and fade away, right? That's like, these people are crazy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And when they get enough success, they kind of, they can kind of carry on. But a lot of, like, how many people. You know, I, I talked about Jeff Lang, the kid I grew up with, who was smarter than me. I, I, in the book Final Spin, I kind of dedicated the book Final Spin to my friend Jeff Lang, who was smarter than me, funnier than me, better athlete than me. Like, just, just a creative, just a spark, just, just like fire. And he killed himself when he was 19 years old. And you're like, was that fire was just burning? So it was too much. Right? And sometimes, you know, how many people are like that and doesn't necessarily mean they have to kill themselves, but, you know, they, their fire wouldn't allow them to be in a band. It wouldn't allow them to even practice their instrument. It wouldn't allow them to, to sit down in front of a video thing and learn how to edit the stuff. They got too much of it. And it just doesn't like, it can't. Like what you, you know, Ozzy Osbourne, like, Ozzy Osbourne, he was like a, like, he just like this intense creative energy. And luckily, like, he got into Black Sabbath and, and became like. But if he, if that wouldn't happen to him, if he wouldn't have found those guys, if he wouldn't have found Bill Ward and Tony Iommi and Geezer, but if they wouldn't have, if that wouldn't have happened, where would he be? I mean, I can guarantee you he Wouldn't. We wouldn't know who he is. You know, he might have done a band here or there, whatever. But, like, you got to get in that moment and have the right ingredients, and then you got to get a little bit of luck and you got to survive it. Like, the fact that Ozzy lived so long, like, why didn't he die when he was, you know, 23 years old, all drunk, fall into a train? Like, there's so many. That fire is going to burn bright. And occasionally people can survive with it, but a lot of times and. And they can be successful with it, but a lot of times that fire ends up with people in jail, with people, you know, committing crimes, with people ODing, with people just. Just ruining their lives. The fire in the emotion and the ego. And by the way, we can say the same thing about ego. Like what? Ego drives a person to achieve things, but then when it goes out of control, all of a sudden they're embezzling money and they're doing all this. You know, they're doing terrible things because their ego can't be shut down. That fire is just too much. They can't control it. They don't know how. They never learn to modulate it.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, the Aussie, actually, a lot of the. The musical type, it makes sense, too. Jim Carrey went through a version of this where. So they have this. We'll just call it, for lack of

[A]

better term, the fire.

[B]

Right. So I was. As a fire, this fire inside of him, and he goes. He's. He goes crazy, right? No, we'll say Ozzy Osbourne.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And then, you know, he finds music or he gets into music early on. Right? So there's something about, like, music and maybe I would imagine just performing for the. For the world, you know, like, but truly performing, not being performative, but, like, truly doing your art as a performer for the people, and they're just loving it. There's something about that. So in music, let's face it, like, bro, I don't even really play music, and, bro, I'll listen to music and be like, man, this is like. Yeah, you know, to a point where it affects you emotionally.

[A]

That's what I was gonna say. You know why? Because they. Whoever that musician was, they tapped into that emotion. They pulled it out, they put it, they recorded it. And now when you hear it, this is the same thing to you. But they had to have the discipline and the control to make that happen. Now, look, occasionally you get a band that just takes. They have that one member, this Is why, like, the lead singer dies, the. Whatever, the guitarist kills himself. Like, crazy stuff happens, you know, like, we've had incredible musicians that they like. Chris Cornell, like, from Soundgarden. Here's this guy. He's at the top of his game, 50 years old or whatever. Iconic, but that fire caught up in them. Kel himself. You see what I'm saying? Like, it's. It's wild. So sorry I cut you off, but, yes, the reason that you echo Charles, that doesn't know how to play an instrument, you know, doesn't collect records, but you will hear a song and go, dang, dude, this one hits.

[B]

Yeah, there's a collection of songs that. And my kids will tease me about this where, like, if I find a song that I really like, I'll just play it over and over and over until I just don't like it anymore or don't like it as much. But. And I remember thinking myself. I think. I think there's something wrong with me in that way where, like, I don't like all music, you know, people are music lovers. I'm not a music lover, but I like certain songs, like, just still right now kind. So I don't know, maybe there's plenty of people like that. But now consider that, right? Where I think music has a way to affect people in that way. And a lot of people, I think, across the board, that's the way music works mostly now you're a person with all this fire in you, and you get to not only consume that, but you get to harness it and create it, you know, in the. And that fire is just driving it. So now it's this, like. You're almost like this lightning rod of fire and creativity. And then the medium is music that just affects. And, you know, it's affecting themselves, too. You see what I'm saying?

[A]

Because it's coming.

[B]

Let's face it, bro, a good song comes on that you really know, bro, you're seeing it. Like, if you're alone in your car or whatever, bro, you're singing it. Like, you're singing it, and it feels like you're actually singing it. See what I'm saying now go one step further, is you are the person really singing it, bro. It's like, bro, that can drive you crazy, I think. See what I'm saying? Especially if it's like. If it's literally coming from you, it's like, bro, it's too much power sometimes. You see what I'm saying? And then, not to mention all the fame and all this other stuff discombobulating your whole. Whole freaking mind in life. You see what I'm saying? So it kind of makes sense.

[A]

Yeah. And what? That. That's how you end up, I think, with that fire. Just. You're getting rewarded for that fire. Right? Like, you're getting. So then you just unleash it, and boom. If you're not careful, it's gonna get you.

[B]

Jim Carrey said he got to the point. I'm paraphrasing, that he didn't even know who he like was because it's kind of like, you know, he started off with, I just wanted to make the people around me laughter and happy. So he's like, starts doing this, and he likes doing it, and he's. It's working. So he takes it to the next level, and he's. You know, his creative mind is, like, doing this, and it's to this next level, and everyone just wants that. Jim Carrey making them happy and laugh. Then he's like, wait a second. If I'm not doing that, like, who am I? He focused so hardcore on it that he said, like, he didn't even know who he was anymore kind. And I was like, bro, I could. I could see it. I totally could see it. See what I'm saying?

[A]

Yep. Just getting, getting. Not only are you unleashing the fire, but everyone else is just throwing gas on it.

[B]

Totally throwing gas on it.

[A]

Chuck. Chuck. Well, detach from that emotion. Use it, but don't let it get out of control. Oh, that's what we got, by the way, when we do that, when we impose discipline into our lives, which, by the way, you know, when we crank up the music, when we're working out your music, your. Your workout can legitimately go better. That can happen. That's when you're tapping into your emotion. Sometimes when you let the emotion be, Hey, I feel like sleeping in today. Echo Charles. Which I know happened today actually. Sure, right.

[B]

Hey, sometimes we need a little bit more rest.

[A]

Not trying to call you out, but I'm calling you out.

[B]

Please. No.

[A]

You know what I'm saying? Why? Because the emotion was, I'm tired. The emotion was, I feel sore. And you let it win. You didn't impose logic knowing that a good workout before you came in here would have been better.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

All right.

[B]

I went for a run. Okay.

[A]

Oh, okay. Good, good. Well, hey, listen, if you're on the path, Cube trading you lift into a jiu jitsu, you're going to need fuel. We recommend Jocko Fuel. Check out jockofuel.com we have. We got protein by the protein. The best protein, the tastiest protein we got. Is it Cinco de Mayo today? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Get some of that horchata.

[B]

It's my mom's birthday today too, by the way. Happy birthday, mom.

[A]

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[B]

All the hype.

[A]

By the way, big H got one of the initial pairs and I'm going to say they are GTG form and function.

[B]

Foreign function.

[A]

And you know, girls can be quite picky about their genes.

[B]

Oh yeah, yeah. They know what they want and don't want, by the way. So it's actually a good guideline. Like, let's face it, you're a bad guideline, bro. You're just like, oh yeah, they function. You know, all this other stuff. I was like, bro, what about us who care about the aesthetic a little bit more than say jocko? See, I'm saying I think that's most of us, Jack. So it's good.

[A]

Originusa.com get some good to go.

[B]

Also don't forget about Jocko store. We're representing while we're on this path, right? This one equals freedom. We've got some good shirt. Five versions of discipline equals freedom Shirts on Jocko store. The idea of good, which is, let's face it, the classic from the beginning. If something happens that's bad, there is some good that comes out of it. So I'm saying you want to represent. We got three versions of good. Other stuff too. Good stuff on there. I made the shirts functional in the way so well that people say this is my favorite shirt. Not necessarily because of the design, but how it fits on me. I said my job was done well then. Proud of that. Thank you for that. Also a shirt locker which is different design every month. That's a subscription scenario. But I am releasing one more shirt from the shirt locker.

[A]

Which one?

[B]

Into the main.

[A]

Into the wild stream. What is it?

[B]

Sugar coated lies.

[A]

Is that that one right there?

[B]

Nope, this is a different one. Sugar would light the one. Yeah, I'm releasing now B. On the lookout for that. If you want to be notified, put your email gojoctore.com at the bottom. Put your email in that. I'll email you when it comes up.

[A]

So you can spam everybody.

[B]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no. I don't. I don't spam anyone. I've never spammed anyone ever in my whole life, ever. And I never will.

[A]

Dang.

[B]

I don't mean that.

[A]

I like that.

[B]

But I will let you know when it's live and when it's going live, even before it goes live. So you can jump on there whenever you want, saying you want to get it. You want to get the jump on it. You can. If you want to get back to it, you can. You do run the risk of it selling out though, because they do tend to sell out nonetheless. It's all on jocko store dot com. Check it out.

[A]

Also we got some books. Check out put your legs on by Rob Jones. Check out need to lead by Dave Burke. I've written a bunch of books about leadership with my brother Leif Babin. Written some other books for adults and kids. Check all those out. Warrior kid movie coming. Movie coming November 20th.

[B]

Hell yeah.

[A]

Right. Way of the Warrior kid movie starring Chris Pratt, who has it by the

[B]

way, has it big time.

[A]

Directed by Mick G. Kind of has it too, you know.

[B]

Legitimacy and authenticity.

[A]

Excellence.

[B]

Excellence.

[A]

Excellence and legitimacy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That's what Echo Charles. Oh. Because Echo Charles is in it too, by the way. Yeah, acting. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Stretch of a role. You know, playing a jiu jitsu black belt up there with the guillotine.

[B]

Being very supportive.

[A]

Yeah, dude, you did a. You did a great job. You brought a lot of excellence and legitimacy to the situation. We all, we were all very happy.

[B]

Thanks.

[A]

Primalbeef.com you need steak. Check out primalbeef.com and coloradocraft beef.com also echelon front we have something called the muster. We just got done with the muster. The Muster is a two day conference educational scenario where we Teach the skills of leadership is a skill. We teach the skills of leadership. Leadership is not something you're born with. It is something that is a skill that you can learn and you can improve. If you need leadership inside your organization, it would be an outstanding opportunity for you to come to the muster. The next one is in July and it is in San Diego. So that is a very cool place. We did it in the summertime. We know that people like to come to San Diego. So if you want to make it into a little family scenario, bring the fam out, you learn about leadership and the family gets a little SeaWorld, a little San Diego Zoo, a little beach. We're here daygo, as they say. So echelonfront.com if you want to check that out. Also extreme ownership. We have an online academy where we teach these principles and skills as well. And then of course, if you want to help service members active and retired, you want to help their families, want help? Gold star families. Check out Mark Lee's mom, Mama Lee. She's got an amazing charity organization. If you want to donate or you want to get involved, go to America's mighty warriors.org also check out heroes and horses.org and finally, Jimmy May's organization beyond the brotherhood.org if you want to connect with us, you can check out jocko.com and then on social media, I'm at Jocko Willink. Echoes Echo Charles Just be careful because that whole thing is filled with a bunch of spam crap trying to manipulate your brain. So what it is people paying money to get into your brain and get control of you. And you know how they attack you, by the way? They appeal to your animal instincts, your brain, Grace, your gray slop. That's why the thumbnails are what the thumbnails are. And I apologize for the freaking dumb ass thumbnails that Echoes made when he was experimenting with AI. And I'm like, bro, I asked you to stop doing those. No less than I would say eight times. I was like, bro, this is the dumbest looking, a high looking slop. And then I'd think I'd shut it down and then the next one would come out. It'd be me like on a stack of gold coins with a crown on or me in a business suit. I'm like, bro, and I get it because it was early in the AI. Yeah, it was early in the AI generation. So you were kind of like flexing in a way.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

But it didn't take long before you were. You were not flexing Anything.

[B]

Yeah, reverse.

[A]

So anyways, but that's what people do. They create these thumbnails. You didn't create thumbnails specifically aimed at your animal instincts, but whenever you see a thumbnail that's got like a female, you know, that's, that's in some skimpy outfit, right? That's. Or they put some fear into you, like a fearful title. Or you can win now. Like defeat anyone. Like those kind of things, the things you're missing. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

If you notice that.

[A]

Yeah, that's. Those are real AI Those. Sorry. Those are real gray slop attacks. And you fall for them. We all fall for them. That's why they get so many views. So just be careful when you're in that zone. Just be careful. Try and scroll with your, with your prefrontal cortex and you'll spend. If you, if you engage your prefrontal cortex, you'll be, you'll shut it. You'll go do something smart. Three, three scrolls later you'll be like, what is this crap? Yeah, but if you just let your, let your, your limbic brain just. It'll look at that all day, just like, oh, wow, it's amazing. Oh, it's incredible. Oh, that looks like a good meal. Oh, I'm going to learn something new. I didn't learn anything. I'm going to learn something that's going to change my own. I didn't learn it. That's what it is. So just be careful. That's what's happening there. And finally, thanks to all of our service members, Army, Navy, Air Force and Marine Corps, thank you for your service and sacrifice that allows us to live in freedom and live in security. Also thanks to our police, law enforcement, firefighters, paramedics, EMTs, dispatchers, correctional officers, border patrol, Secret service, as well as all of the first responders, thank you for your service and sacrifice that keeps us safe here on our soil. And everyone else out there. You got to be the one that's in control. Not your impulses, not your emotions, not your ego, but you. Your enlightened self. You with plans and goals and hopes and dreams and things that can only be achieved if you are holding a steering wheel. If you force yourself to overcome the short term, immediate gratification of the mind that satisfies. Satisfies you right now, but robs you of your future. And I'm not saying don't have emotions. You got to have emotions and you should utilize those emotions, but don't let those emotions utilize you. Do not allow that. And if you do that you will improve your lot in life. That's all we've got for tonight. And until next time, the Zeko and Jocko out.