Jermaine Dupri on Kris Kross & Da Brat, dating Janet Jackson, Usher’s Confessions & Mariah Carey

Summary

Podcast Summary: Joe and Jada – Episode featuring Jermaine Dupri

Episode Title: Jermaine Dupri on Kris Kross & Da Brat, Dating Janet Jackson, Usher’s Confessions & Mariah Carey
Release Date: July 10, 2025
Hosts: Joe Budden and Jadakiss
Guest: Jermaine Dupri
Duration: Approximately 100 minutes

---

1. Introduction to Jermaine Dupri

The episode kicks off with Joe Budden and Jadakiss introducing hip-hop legend Jermaine Dupri, setting the stage for an in-depth conversation about his illustrious career and personal experiences in the music industry.

Notable Quote:
Jadakiss [04:15]: "This is a special edition right here. You got a historic, legendary hip hop pillar in the building."

2. Early Career and Fresh Fest Experience

Jermaine Dupri delves into his early days, recounting his first experiences with Fresh Fest at the age of 12. He shares insights into performing alongside iconic acts like Run DMC, Grandmaster Flash, and The Fat Boys, highlighting the challenges and excitement of being a young artist on tour.

Notable Quote:
Jermaine Dupri [06:10]: "This was the first rap tour appearance."

3. Transition from Dance to Rap and Producing

Initially a dancer, Jermaine discusses how he shifted his focus to rap and production. Influenced by mentors like Jam Master Jay and Grandmaster D, he began writing and producing music, marking the beginning of his influential role in shaping hip-hop.

Notable Quote:
Jermaine Dupri [10:46]: "Jam Master J taught me how to DJ. Like, really. Like, really hands-on."

4. Breakthrough with Kris Kross and Crisscross

Jermaine narrates the creation and success of Kris Kross, emphasizing their unique appeal as young rappers. He explains how their debut single "Jump" became a massive hit, selling over 8 million records and establishing Jermaine as a formidable producer.

Notable Quote:
Jermaine Dupri [15:27]: "They sold 8 million records at 12 years old."

5. Expanding Horizons: TLC, Usher, and Mariah Carey

Expanding beyond rap, Jermaine shares his ventures into R&B, discussing his pivotal role in producing hits for TLC, Usher, and Mariah Carey. He reflects on the challenges and triumphs of working with such diverse and talented artists.

Notable Quote:
Jermaine Dupri [69:28]: "Mariah was like, 'I want a song that feels like that.' And that's what we did – 'Always Be My Baby.'"

6. Influential Collaborations and Stories from Tours

Jermaine recounts memorable moments from touring with Michael Jackson, including the collaborative energy and the creative process behind iconic performances. He also touches on his interactions with other legends like Jay-Z, highlighting mutual respect and inspiration.

Notable Quote:
Jermaine Dupri [48:25]: "When he said, 'deep in the south, kicking up top game,' I was like, he's talking about me."

7. Navigating the Music Industry: Delusional Records and Independence

Discussing the evolution of Atlanta's music scene, Jermaine critiques the "delusional" mindset prevalent among artists who rely solely on major labels. He advocates for an independent approach, emphasizing negotiation and entrepreneurial spirit to sustain and grow within the industry.

Notable Quote:
Jermaine Dupri [85:48]: "The independent mindset... it's the biggest delusion going, right?"

8. Reflections on Iconic Hip-Hop Groups and Legacy

The conversation shifts to reflections on legendary groups like New Edition and Boys to Men. Jermaine extols New Edition as the greatest musical group in history, praising their collective and individual successes post-group activities.

Notable Quote:
Jermaine Dupri [91:54]: "New Edition is the greatest group in music history, period."

9. Personal Growth: Health and Wellness Journey

Jermaine opens up about his personal decision to adopt a vegan lifestyle almost 25 years ago, inspired by conversations with Quincy Jones and Ray Charles. He discusses the importance of health and wellness in maintaining longevity in the demanding music industry.

Notable Quote:
Jermaine Dupri [102:31]: "I gotta kick in because I felt really, really... I wasn't ready to go."

10. Closing Thoughts and Future Projects

As the episode winds down, Jermaine shares insights into his upcoming projects, including the "Magic City" album, which serves as a soundtrack to his documentary. He emphasizes the importance of authenticity and staying true to Atlanta's rich musical heritage.

Notable Quote:
Jermaine Dupri [87:59]: "We got what we want... That's what I'm saying."

---

Key Takeaways:

• Influential Beginnings: Jermaine Dupri's early start in Fresh Fest set the foundation for his future success in hip-hop and R&B.

• Pioneering Producer: Transitioning from dancer to producer, Jermaine played a crucial role in launching Kris Kross and shaping the sound of major artists.

• Industry Insight: Advocates for independent artistry and strategic negotiation over reliance on major labels, aiming to preserve Atlanta's unique musical identity.

• Legacy and Respect: Deeply respects groups like New Edition for their collective success and enduring legacy in the music world.

• Personal Commitment: Emphasizes the importance of health and wellness, reflecting on personal experiences that influenced his lifestyle choices.

---

Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Jermaine Dupri [06:10]: "This was the first rap tour appearance."

• Jermaine Dupri [10:46]: "Jam Master J taught me how to DJ. Like, really. Like, really hands-on."

• Jermaine Dupri [15:27]: "They sold 8 million records at 12 years old."

• Jermaine Dupri [48:25]: "When he said, 'deep in the south, kicking up top game,' I was like, he's talking about me."

• Jermaine Dupri [85:48]: "The independent mindset... it's the biggest delusion going, right?"

• Jermaine Dupri [91:54]: "New Edition is the greatest group in music history, period."

• Jermaine Dupri [102:31]: "I gotta kick in because I felt really, really... I wasn't ready to go."

• Jermaine Dupri [87:59]: "We got what we want... That's what I'm saying."

---

Conclusion

This episode provides a comprehensive look into Jermaine Dupri's journey in the music industry, offering listeners valuable insights into his creative process, influential collaborations, and perspectives on maintaining authenticity and independence in a rapidly evolving landscape. Through engaging storytelling and candid discussions, Dupri underscores the significance of perseverance, adaptability, and personal well-being in achieving and sustaining success.

Transcript

[Jermaine Dupri]

Okay.

[Joe Budden]

Have you heard about this? Last year, Degree changed the formula for their Cool Rush deodorant. Their fans rebelled and wanted the old scent back. And Degree listened. That doesn't happen often. They admitted that they effed up and are bringing the original Cool Rush scent back. And it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp and fresh. There's a reason it's the number one men's antiperspirant and is back in Walmart, Target and other stores for under $4. So try it and see what the fuss is about. Head to your local stores to try the OG Cool Rush for yourself.

[Jadakiss]

Making money moves should be easy. And that's why there's Cash App. It's fast, safe and honestly, just way more personalized than other apps out there. No extra hoops to jump through, no extra stress. All of the tools are right there to help you cash in.

[Joe Budden]

Plus, sending money with Cash App actually feels safe. They look out for you. If something seems sketchy or they see you might be sending money to a potential scammer, they'll warn you and make you think twice before you hit send. It's like having a personal bodyguard for your cash.

[Jadakiss]

You can even spice up your payments with custom text, stamps and backgrounds. Because why should paying your friend for brunch be so boring?

[Joe Budden]

If for whatever insane reason you don't already have Cash App, download it from your phone's app store. Sign up and enter our code JoeJada in your profile. Send $5 to a friend and you'll get $10 just for getting it started.

[Jadakiss]

For a limited time only new Cash app users can use our exclusive code to earn some additional cash.

[Joe Budden]

For real.

[Jadakiss]

There's no catch. Just download Cash App and sign up. Use our exclusive referral code Joe Jada in your profile. Send $5 to a friend within 14 days and you'll get $10 dropped right into your account. Terms apply. That's money. That's Cash App.

[Joe Budden]

Hello, it is Ryan and I was.

[Jermaine Dupri]

On a flight the other day playing.

[Joe Budden]

One of my favorite social spin slot games on chumbacasino.com I looked over the.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Person sitting next to me and you know what they were doing.

[Joe Budden]

They were also playing Chumba Casino. Everybody's loving having fun with it. Chumba Casino's home to hundreds of casino style games that you can play for free anytime, anywhere. So sign up [e-mail] to free welcome bonus. That's chumbacasino.com and live the Chumba Life.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Sponsored by Chumba Casino. No purchase necessary. VGW Group void, where prohibited by law, 21 + terms and conditions apply.

[Ryan]

Millions of people have turned to Claude, the AI assistant from Anthropic, because it just feels different. Where other AIs often sound a little robotic, Claude has been designed with special research that informs its character, meaning that Claude just gets it when it comes to empathy and emotional intelligence. That's why Clawd has become the if you know, you know, choice for dating advice, career coaching, gathering your thoughts for those important life decisions, and more. Give Claude a try for free at Claude.com. that's C-L-A-U-E.com and let us know how you feel. The difference, the volume.

[Jermaine Dupri]

All my mind was that I'm gonna make this record with Jay Z. That's all I was thinking about. I'm gonna make this record with Jay Z. I ain't know what the record was gonna be, but I'm like, I'm gonna make this record with Jay Z. And long story short, he came to Atlanta and I went to pick them up. And when I'm. When I'm driving to the airport to pick him up, I'm listening. Can't knock the hustle. And when he say, deep in the south, kicking up top game, I'm like, he's talking about me. Who is he talking about? I'm riding, I'm thinking. He talking about me. He say, switching four lane. I'm switching them. By the way, I'm in a Bentley. So as soon as he come out of the airport, I say, yo, I'm gonna sample this part. This gonna be our song. And he's like, all right.

[Joe Budden]

It'S Joe Crack the Dawn.

[Jadakiss]

It's your boy Kiss. You know what it is, The Joe and Jada Show. This is a special edition right here. You got an historic, legendary hip hop pillar in the building. With no further ado, ladies and gentlemen, make some noise for my brother, Jermaine Dupree.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Hold up, hold up. Because this ain't a regular show, guys. This is royalty. This is not even. This, this. This is a pyramid. You know what I'm saying? It's a whole pyramid of Egypt sitting up. I'm telling you the truth.

[Jadakiss]

I didn't say one.

[Joe Budden]

Like, I couldn't sleep last night, you know what I'm saying? Because I was so excited. I mean, we love all our guests, but this is a different.

[Jermaine Dupri]

He.

[Joe Budden]

He's got the blue Leroy glove.

[Jadakiss]

This is royalty, right?

[Joe Budden]

This is royalty right here. So you. It's an honor to have you on the Joe and Jada Show. Taking the chance with our little podcast. You know, we the rookies of the year, most likely to succeed. But thank you for coming up.

[Jadakiss]

My brother. You already know how we go. We going, we going to give a little. We going to go on a little time capsule for the people that might not know because you know, we, we living in a time where you have knowledge right in your hand. But some people prefer to look up shoes and look up some there instead of getting some knowledge sometime. Now you stopped attending school in middle school to go on tour. Just talk a little bit about what that experience was like for some people that might not know what going on tour is. And for just a young ass kid stopping middle school to go on tour, what. What was that even like?

[Jermaine Dupri]

I mean, I ain't actually know that's what was happening, you know, I mean, it just, it just was going like I was dancing. So, you know, the Fresh Fest was the first time they ever had a Fresh Fest anywhere was in Atlanta and they had Run DMC and all of them. This is the first shows on Atlanta. Shout out to Ricky Walker. He's the person who actually created the Fresh Fest.

[Joe Budden]

Fresh Fest is Run dmc, obviously.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Houdini, Fat Boys, Houdini, Curtis Blow, Grandmaster Flash. This was the first rap tour appearance.

[Joe Budden]

This is the golden incredible. There's never been an error better than this, according to me. But I mean, just my opinion, I always feel like, you know, when people start these debates, I'll be like, yo, that is it. Those are the pioneers. But go ahead. You was a dancer and you made it on tour.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. So they had a. They also had a, you know, the Dynamic breakers, the New York City breakers, they had all these breaking crews on there as well. So it was like dancing and rapping. But they needed a opener. This was at a time when, you know, they need an opener. You don't get no money. You just go out there and waste time, burn the time off. Right?

[Joe Budden]

It was still like that in 93.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Go ahead. That's it. So I'm like, cool. I ain't tripping. I'm like, I'm 12 years old, so I don't care. I'm going on stage. This is the first time I ever seen this many people in the arena. They gave me opportunity to go out there and do like, probably had like three minutes just me dancing. That's a long time, by the way.

[Jadakiss]

Hell yeah.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Dancing. You ain't got no routine. You just like.

[Joe Budden]

I can't believe they had cameras back There, like they got you dancing to some of them shits, like on camera. You know how vital that is right now?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Well, BCR take, what is he.

[Joe Budden]

I seen you dancing. I seen you personally. But hip hop. How would you get hip hop in Atlanta? Because he. In New York, it was only pirate. It was only. Not even. It was. It was red alert once a week and Mr. Magic and then Awesome 2 overnight. How do you get the new shit? How did you get the new music? The new hip hop that was coming down, how did it get to the atl?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Well, it wasn't there when I started. This was, this was. This was pre all that, you know what I mean?

[Joe Budden]

So how you dancing?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Like how you know, I mean, breaking was everywhere. Yeah, breaking was everywhere. You watching breaking, you watching, you know, B Street, B Street and these movies. But I was doing talent shows, you know what I mean? So I started doing talent shows. I was doing Michael Jackson and talent shows. So Michael Jackson routine, be like two minutes, you could do it. Two minute Michael Jackson routine. I started doing Michael Jackson and then I started paying attention to hip hop and I seen like, oh, I could add this, and I could add this. I just started learning things. But I still wasn't like, great. I just was good because I was 12, right? You know, little kids, they get away with it.

[Jadakiss]

They get a little more of a passion.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, go ahead. He's like a clown at the circus, you know what I mean? Go ahead, do what you gotta do. So I was winning talent shows and that's what happened. So I started winning all these little talent shows around my, you know, around Atlanta, or I come in second place or whatever it is. And so they was like, you know, they was like, yo, let him. Let him go out there and do what he got to do. So I went up on the stage and I did my perfect little time. I got off. I wasn't tripping, you know what I mean? I hit. They made them hit they time. And they was like, you know what? We need to keep somebody to do this. And I'm like, you know what I mean? And I wasn't even paying attention to everything that came with it because I didn't know nothing about me getting out of school and all this. I tried to do the right way, but this was so early in, like life. Atlanta had never had an artist that would go on tour at 12 years old. So we didn't even have a school system thing that was set up where they could take my grades. And while I was on the road and count Them as credits. I mean, I did all the work, and I had a tutor, and we tried to do it, but when I came back, they was like, we can't accept this. You got to do it. You got to do that grade again. I'm like, oh, nah, no, great. And after that, I had already been to 50 cities at 12. So I was like, oh, no, I'm done. I'm done. I got. I gotta figure this out. I gotta figure it out. So then the second year, I was on the Fresh Fest for three years. 84, 85, and 86. And in 86 is when I started rapping. I added a rapping to it. And by then, it was a guy in Atlanta named Shadi, who was actually from the Bronx, who was actually. He came to Atlanta. He. He started bringing.

[Joe Budden]

He got mad every time they mentioned the Bronx on the show. He might be a slight. Oh, yeah, it might be a slight hand.

[Jadakiss]

Just everything's for the Bronx. From the Bronx. If you ask him, what do you.

[Joe Budden]

Want me to do? Yeah, Sha D was from the Bronx.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yes. Yeah, so. Yeah, you know, so. So Shadi came. He started, you know, he introduced me to what the Zulu nation was. All of this, you know, hip hop, Right. But I. I couldn't rap. I still couldn't do, but he taught me how to, like, write my rap. So he wrote my first rap when I was on the. On the Fresh Fest, and I started doing the rap and perform, you know, performing the rap. And then that's when the. You know, the rest of the guys, Houdini and all of them, they start seeing that I was more into that than dancing. So then Jam Master Jay taught me how to dj. Like, real. Like, really hands on.

[Joe Budden]

Jam Master J.

[Jadakiss]

You heard that?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. And then Grandmaster D started showing me tricks, and I just started learning from the best.

[Joe Budden]

Like, you know, Jam Master J, man, he taught me a lot, you know. And when I was coming up and, you know, I had a little flo Joe, I ain't never wanted to leave the Bronx. And he kept talking to me, yo, you ever been to Detroit? You ever been to Chicago? You ever been like. He was trying to turn. You need to get out there, Joe. So you get. You only want to be in the Bronx. And so rest in peace, Jam Master Jay.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

So I. I want to get back to this one thing. When hip hop came to Atlanta, how did it get to Atlanta?

[Jermaine Dupri]

The migration.

[Joe Budden]

The migration of a lot primos from Texas. And Prim Primo said his cousins used to drive over there with tapes of Mr. Magic and Red Alert. I'm just trying to establish.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, basically it was like the migration of a lot of New Yorkers start coming to Atlanta. Like I said, Shaadee is from New York. So it seemed like more and more New Yorkers start coming to Atlanta and then you start seeing little parties and these pop up that was like, oh, this is hip hop. But then it was also like the artist was coming, the artists were coming. More and more artists was coming to Atlanta. Then they had a dance show in Atlanta that was only our local dance show. Right. And it just, you know how it was coming in and out. We still only had a radio station which was B103.

[Jadakiss]

They only play rap, Jack the rap. That's the first time I ever been in any like that.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So we have, you know, once the station, they only play hip hop on Friday night for an hour.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, that's how I go.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So on that Friday night, in that.

[Joe Budden]

Hour, I was right there like, kids don't understand. They got the on their phone like, like water.

[Jadakiss]

You start to stay up. You used to have to be on point.

[Joe Budden]

I never forget how Khaled drop. Wow, wow W on a Thursday. Friday I was like in Paris somewhere at a show and they threw that on and the whole crowd was like, wow, wow, wow. I was like, you know, it makes you think about what? You only heard hip hop on Friday and Saturday. I'm like this across the world in one day. But at that time we have to look for it. Yeah, right.

[Jadakiss]

The tissue and the tape over the cassette.

[Joe Budden]

You know, me, I, you know, grew up in the Bronx. And so, you know, my guys, man, you know my guys, we had like a public phone in front of the building. And they used to break the public phone and use the electricity to put the boombox. So the bigger guys shout out to AJ GP Crago, rest in peace, my brother. They used to put the boombox up and then they played the awesome two that was at four in the morning like that. So I would be a kid out the window listening to the overnight. Like they would play whole other kind of music, underground music that they wouldn't play with Red Alert.

[Jadakiss]

So there was like Mr. Beat on stretch before.

[Joe Budden]

Yes, they were. Yes they were.

[Jermaine Dupri]

And so see, I I so in 86, I met Chad Elliott. And Chad Elliott was part of Charles Stettler crew. And when, when the fat that contest in Crush Groove, Chad came in second place.

[Jadakiss]

Yep.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, he came in second place. Right. So they put. So Chad, I mean, Cha Stetler was like, we need to put this kid on the tour. If y' all got Jermaine on the tour, right? So then they worked out for Chad to get on the tour as well. So then me and Chad met, and we. You know what I mean, we hit it off, and then we start hanging out. And then I moved to Brooklyn with him and stayed at his house on Eastern Parkway. That's when I start, like.

[Joe Budden]

You know, I was a kid. I never forget I was a kid. And my aunt, my grand. My godmother, she lived in Brooklyn on East New York in Summit. She had a little house. But I remember the kids. I used to spend all summers in Brooklyn, and the kids was like, yo, come. And we went to the projects and they had a jam and they played this record.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Record.

[Joe Budden]

And I. I guess I grew up. I just didn't know, right?

[Jadakiss]

But.

[Joe Budden]

But they played this record where I actually walked up to the dj and what? And it was SOS Band. It was, baby, we can do it. Take your time, do. And I was just like, that must have hit every endorphin in those. Like, I was like a kid, but I was like, yo, what the Is this? Like, this shit is crazy. I felt like it was only a Brooklyn thing, right? But you in Brooklyn, you caught everything.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So you.

[Joe Budden]

You was here.

[Jermaine Dupri]

You caught it. Yeah. And I learned. I learned, like, what was the difference between where I, you know, in Atlanta and New York immediately? Because they was bricking me with everything I had on. You know what I mean? They was telling me I look like a country bum. They was. I was, you know, in East New York, was saying, oh, no, they don't care. And I was going to the same way.

[Joe Budden]

They don't give a. They talk about your mom's walking in the building, everything.

[Jermaine Dupri]

That's crazy. I got chased by Decepticons and all that.

[Joe Budden]

So you was outside?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Outside.

[Jadakiss]

He was fast, too.

[Jermaine Dupri]

If you have to get away from nothing, yeah.

[Joe Budden]

At what point it goes down? Because me, personally, right, this is something I'm gonna go to my. My deathbed with. 20 something years ago, I moved to Miami, right? And every time I go to atl, I argue with myself. Did I make the right thing? Should I have moved to the atl? Feel so at home in the ATL Home.

[Jadakiss]

It's got a lot of restaurants you like?

[Joe Budden]

Nah, we love the restaurants. It's just, you know, I love black people. I love the entrepreneurialism. I love that they all just divide, help each other. The vibe is great, you know, the weather's everything. Just every time I go to ato. I argue with myself. Like, I just be like, damn, I was off to be here, huh?

[Jadakiss]

It's hard. I keep extending my stay with me when I. Forever.

[Joe Budden]

You see what I'm saying?

[Jadakiss]

Two more days. You need two more days. That make me think I should just. It gotta out here. What's up, y'?

[Jermaine Dupri]

All? It's going down.

[Jadakiss]

Friday, July 11th. Netflix and most valuable promotions are bringing the fight the whole world's been waiting for.

[Joe Budden]

It's the trilogy. The biggest fight of all fights. Continue, continue.

[Jadakiss]

You already know it is on the past fights. Katie Taylor is chasing ultimate glory. Amanda Serrano is fighting for redemption and revenge. This is more than a fight. It's the first ever women's boxing trilogy in the world. Is watching.

[Joe Budden]

Do not move your seat off of Netflix and go get popcorn or go get a soda because somebody is getting hit through the ropes.

[Jadakiss]

That's a fact. Live from the iconic Madison Square Garden in New York City is Taylor versus Serrano. One last time. It's about to get personal. You don't want to miss this smoke. The stakes, the sky high, the rivalry, legendary. Who will win?

[Joe Budden]

Serrano's gonna win this one. This is about to go five. Netflix gonna have to sign the next fight, too.

[Jadakiss]

Check it out. If you are not tapped into this fight, what are you even doing? Watch Katie Taylor versus Amanda Serrano. Friday, July 11th at 8pm Eastern, 5pm Pacific live only on Netflix. Soaked up hip hop. You've seen the difference in the demographics of New York, hip hop and ATL. Then you went back. You still young at 17. You discovered Chris Cross. Yeah, I was. Did you think it was gonna work? What was he. Was you rolling the dice or how. What was you going through at that?

[Jermaine Dupri]

I mean? Well, Chris Cross actually was like a the works of me getting to that spot. So I had. I had a group prior that was called Silk Times Leather. That was these two girls. It was called black Silk Times Leather.

[Joe Budden]

Silk Times Leather.

[Jadakiss]

Silk Times Leather.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. They actually were the girlfriends of Houdini that I met on tour.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, shoot.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Right? Wow. So I met them when we was on tour, and they was like, we from Atlanta. And I'm like, from Atlanta. So I was young, and I'm like, y' all can come pick me up. You know what I mean? Like, whatever, Whatever. Y' all could come drive around. I'm like, oh, I got some girls that I can hang out with now in Atlanta. You know, that's what I'm thinking in my mind. And then I think, Herbie had just put out Salt and pepper. So this was like girls that was paying attention to this, and some kind of way, we started having a conversation, and I never produced a record in my life. And the girls was like, you know, we want to do what Salt and pepper doing. And I'm like, you should let me produce. You know, I never did. I don't know why I even said it, but I just was paying attention to what Herbie was doing, and it seemed interesting. So I started really paying attention to what he was doing. I'm like, oh, he writing the raps, he making the beats, all of this. And I'm like, I could do it. So I started trying to do it, and I did it good enough where I got them a deal. They got signed to Geffen Records, right? So they actually was the first rap group in Atlanta to have a real major record deal. Wow. Wow.

[Joe Budden]

You pulled that off and then you. And then you go into Crisscross.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Jadakiss]

So, Chris, what happened with them, though?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Not so. So we didn't really have a lot of success, but we had enough success where I got, you know, I got $15,000 so I could get some real equipment, because I ain't have a door. So when I got my real equipment, that's when I started making better beats and started getting more and more into it. Then one day, me and the DJ is a female named Dolomix. We went to Greenbrier Mall, and they had an article in Jet magazine about the female rappers at that particular point in time. And one of the Chris's seen. One of the Chris's moms saw Dolomix and was like, I know that girl. I just read about her, right? But I seen the kids and they was walking around the mall, and people was paying attention to them. And I'm like, what's wrong with me?

[Joe Budden]

They had charisma.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I'm like, why don't. I don't know these niggas? I'm thinking they must be on the Disney Channel or something. I'm like, why is people acting like this? So I keep watching. Move around, move around. They going in Foot Locker. They going to Foot Action. They doing all the rap. I'm like, who is this? And girls is giving them free cookies at the Cookie Company. I'm telling you, I'm walking around watching them.

[Jadakiss]

It was lit before.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Lit. I'm in there. So I'm like, finally walk up to him. I'm like, yo, who are y'? All? And I was like, what do y' all do? They like, we don't do nothing. I'm like, why? Y' all get why they're giving y' all and all this in the mall? They like, Cause we fresh. And I'm like, oh, wait, what? What? I'm like, do y' all rap? And they was like, rap? They said that to me? Like, yeah, yeah. Who would rap? That's how they said it to me. And I'm like. And my mind just start going crazy. Like, if these rap based on what they got going on, it's over with, right? So then I got their number. And luckily, they mom vouched. Cause she's like, he's somebody. Because I know that girl that's with him, right? She didn't. She hadn't put it all together, but she. She know what I'm saying? She had one of them New J moments where dude was like, yo, I know that dude, right? So that's what she was doing. She was like, I know him. So I got the number and I started calling him. Like, yo, y' all come over my house. We're gonna start making music. They was like, come over your house. You know what I'm saying? So they was really on some, you know, little hood boys that was like, we ain't going over this house. Like, why we going over his house? So I had to get. I had to convince them. So I had to go pick him up from school every day and, like, become their homie. Like, and let them see, like, I'm really with y'. All. You know what I mean? So we start kicking it, and I start, like, driving, watching them in the back seat. And I play records, and I play a record. Like, Ice Cube or something was crazy at the time. And they was back there rapping the lyrics. Like, they wrote them. They know this. They ain't never seen the lyrics before how they know it. They, like, rapping it. Like, they really rapping. And I'm thinking, like, damn, if I write a song for them and it sound good, like they could do Ice Cube. And they learn it like this. They got this, right? So I just started trying to figure out how that was gonna happen. I. You know, I wrote so many songs that they hated, and I never got that reaction. I just had to keep going, keep going, keep going, keep going. And then I wrote this song called Little Boys in the Hood. And they liked it because of this concept. Like, I finally got to where they wanted. Okay, now you talking about shit we want to talk about. I was trying to do, like, kitty shit at first, and I was like, and they started telling me about how they, you know, in a school, kids, 12 years old, was walking around with their socks, and they socks was doubled up because they had cracking them selling, you know what I mean? So I started hearing all these stories about these little kids in the hood. So I'm like, you know what? When they be doing the news, they don't ever talk about what the kids have to go through and what they see, right? So I started trying to write about that based on what I was hearing them say. And from the deal that I had with Silk Tom's Leather, I had met this engineer named Joe the Butcher, who actually owned Roughhouse Records in Philly, right? So that's the only person I knew in the music industry that I could call and be like, I got a project, right? So I did the Little Boyz n the Hood, and I sent it to Joe, and he was like, yeah, I want to sign him. And I'm like, oh, shit. You know what I mean? I got it, right? So he gave us a development deal. It wasn't a real record deal. It was a development deal to see if we can make some better records. And, like, the night before we had to go to Philly to do, like, record these songs, I wrote Jump. I knew it. When I, like, in the first 29, 30 seconds. Yeah, yeah. I'm like, if they pulled us off.

[Joe Budden]

Second, you, you know, you hear that shit, you just like, yo, this shit. This shit jumping. Whose idea was it for them to wear the clothes backwards?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Mine. Cause, like, Left, I was living at my house at the time.

[Joe Budden]

This is what I want to talk about. This is what I want to talk about.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Like, Left, I had came to my house as a. As a rapper from Philly.

[Joe Budden]

And she was from Philly originally.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, she from Philly. And she met this guy named Ian Burke. And Ian was, like, the only guy in Atlanta that I knew that was, like, moving around. He was like an A R manager. Slash, he was everything, right? And if you knew Ian, Ian connect you to somebody else. So then Ian called me one day. He was like, yo, I met this girl from Philly. She raps. She a young girl. I'm gonna bring her to your house. He brought her to my house. I liked the way she rapped, but I was trying to do the crisscross thing. But I was like, yo, I'mma fuck with you when I get through this. And I ain't have no deal. But I had all these people believing that I was gonna do it. So Left, I was staying at My house, without my mom even knowing left. I was like, living in my closet. Cause she ain't really had no place to stay, so she was staying over there. And one of the songs I did for Kris Kross, I sampled Michael Jackson and Paul McCartney. The girl is Mine, right? And I was. Think I could make a song about y' all arguing about Lisa? And then Lisa was gonna rap about shit, right? And that idea I had, but it never came to life. I kept trying to get it. I couldn't. You know what I mean? But I never couldn't figure it out. And my writing was terrible at that time.

[Joe Budden]

Question I have for you. Who's an artist that you slept on and became a big boy or big girl in the game that you wasn't ready or things wasn't right? They tried. Like, you know, Eminem gave me his demo six times. And, you know, we ain't never seen no white boy pop off like that. So I guess I was sleeping, you know, after he blew up, I went to dinner with him. He was like, you know, I gave you my demo six times. And I was like, what? And he told me everywhere he gave it to me at who's an artist that you could have signed? And you was like, damn. Or you wish you could have signed?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Well, I mean, I tried to sign Ludacris, but I had a. I had an office full of employees, right? And at this point in time, I was feeling like my office felt like I was controlling everything. So I went there one day and tried to have an A R meeting. And I asked them about Ludacris, and they all said no. And I tried to go with what my office was saying.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah.

[Jermaine Dupri]

You know what I'm saying? I try. I'm thinking, this is what you're supposed to do. This is. You gotta let the people in the office work. They was like, Nah, J.D. don't sign him.

[Joe Budden]

And I'm like, well, you know what? They probably slept on him because he started in the radio.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Nah. But I had. I had already. I did something for Madden. So the first Madden game with music, I did it right? And they called me and they was asking me. They asked me.

[Jadakiss]

Silence. Inflection with the silence.

[Jermaine Dupri]

They asked me for somebody to rap on it. That was animated, right? And I'm like, well, I'm not animated like this. But Chris was doing these radio things, right? And I heard him. I kept hearing him do these radio commercials. He was really, really animated, right? And I say, chris, come do this. This Madden. This little Madden thing. I'm doing for the video game. And that was the first time me and Chris worked together. But he wanted me to sign him, and I wanted to sign him, you know.

[Joe Budden]

You know what's crazy? There's this guy who does commercials, but he don't rap. You don't be hearing them. He be like, 1-800-you crashed your car, Top Dog. Yo, I love this guy, man. I don't have no clue of. Every time I ask commercial, I turn it up. Like, I be hearing, you crashed, you gone, your girl left you, your leg is sideways. Yeah, top one 800 to get you. I'll be like, yo, this dude is crazy. So I know what you saying.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Saludicris. Right? At what point it turned from hip hop to R B?

[Jadakiss]

I go to the Bratford right after.

[Jermaine Dupri]

No, right. Right after Crisscross, the explosion of Kris Kross, right? I was just like, well, we got.

[Joe Budden]

The Brat, we got Crisscross, we got Bow Wow, we got Usher, we got Mariah, we got Bone Crusher, we got Listen.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So after. After Crisscross, I didn't want to be labeled as a one box producer, right? So I was like, I gotta do an R B project. After Kris Kross success, I ain't know if it was gonna work. This is the first time I ever did it, But I just knew that that's what I wanted to do. I didn't want to be put in a box. So ESC Project was the first album R B record that I had ever written, produced, or anything, and brought them girls to my house and body on.

[Joe Budden]

Down to the sk.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. You hear it sound like a rap song?

[Joe Budden]

Yes.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Kick.

[Joe Budden]

Yo, bro. You know, I used to be scared to fly, so I used to drive everywhere to Miami, to everywhere. And so I got a certain kind of, like, respect for certain groups because, you know, it get hard on that 95 around South Carolina when you start seeing Pedro. And they'd be like, pedro and you gotta. And that Escape, man, they got me through a lot of drives. That. That Escape was different. So you so Escape. You wrote all that?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. So I'm saying I was taking still from hip hop. Like, kick off your shoes and relax your feet. That was Run DMC line. I just was doing what I thought you ever wrote.

[Joe Budden]

You ever. You ever wrote an R B song? No, I never wrote an R B song. I never. Like, I never had. I always thought I could.

[Jadakiss]

He just. He just broke it down. I could do it.

[Joe Budden]

Sometimes Beyonce has some witty lyrics where I be like, yo, Jay must have been right in that studio and gave her a bar. Like, I hear it all the time in her music where I'm just like. She's talking that. I said, oh, Hov. Must have been in that studio, gave her a bar. You know, it's just. You know. But it's something I always wanted to do because I'm a lover, not a fighter, B. Yeah.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I mean, like I said, if you take it, if you just listen to it, it's the same thing. Ultimately, you just have to figure out the melody. But other than the melody, writing rap and writing a song is pretty much the same.

[Joe Budden]

You know, LaFace goes down to the ATL, right? They're not from there. Right. Like, Babyface is where from? Indiana. And. But they set up shop. They fell in love with atl, but they let everybody work with the artists they signed. You know, he would go to. You go to Rico Wade.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Go to Dallas Austin. Right. And so what are some of the songs you wrote for tlc? Another artist that wasn't actually your artist?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Well, TLC was my group first before they even signed in the Face.

[Jadakiss]

Another one.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Like, you know, you got. You gotta remember, Left, I was at my house, right? So then Ian brought. Ian brought Tion to my house, and then they met at my house, and they was called Second Nature before they was called tlc. And I would have. Now, this is what I do regret. I regret my mind not moving fast enough. Because if I. I could have had TLC and Chris Cross at the same time, but I was too young to know to be.

[Joe Budden]

He was learning the game.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I know.

[Joe Budden]

It was God's timing, too, to believe it or not. It was like, it wasn't for you. Like that.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. You know what I'm saying?

[Joe Budden]

It was God's timing.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I had so much energy for the guys. I wasn't giving the girls a lot of energy. And they went and had that conversation with Pebbles, and they was like, you know, they had a meeting. So if you see the TLC movie on VH1, when left, I make this phone call. She called me in that movie.

[Joe Budden]

I saw that.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, they cut me out, but they.

[Joe Budden]

No, no, no, no. But I saw that movie.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Y. She called me to be like, J.D. they want to sign us. What you want to do? And when she said that, I could have been like, nah, I got y'. All. Let's do this. But I was. I started thinking like a producer. I started thinking like, shit, if they get signed, I could do a bunch of songs on their album. Right? Instead of just trying to hold Them and be like, let them sign on my label. So I was like, go ahead, do the deal. So they first album, I did a song called I Could Do Bad By Myself. On the second album is when I did more and more work with TLC than I ever did. But really, really, a lot of that, me working with LaFace came from Usher's second album, the My Way album. I did the whole album, basically, another one.

[Joe Budden]

And so Usher was up here. So I remember when he was all around New York as a kid, they snuck him into clubs, everything. Everybody. This we did. I forget what. What was out. Jodeci. But they also had, like, hip hop, I think. Was it Black Rob's wall or is it too. That was too early. Yeah. No, because I'm trying to tell you, there's only very few records like Black Rob's Whoa or Ballin by Jim Jones. There was very few records when I was in a club that just. Everybody lost their mind. And I remember meeting Usher for the first time as a kid in the club here, and they had something out there that was stupid. And I remember Usher there, and I was like, damn. And that was.

[Jermaine Dupri]

But any case, this was partying bullshit days back then.

[Joe Budden]

This was.

[Jadakiss]

He's going back before you talking about.

[Joe Budden]

I know, I know, I know. I'm just like. I remember Usher as a kid out here in New York and seeing them all over. Yeah, but this guy. So the second album, so you sit down with Usher and. And. And you say, yo, I'm gonna make a classic.

[Jermaine Dupri]

No, no, I don't say that.

[Joe Budden]

What you said.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I don't know what's gonna happen.

[Jadakiss]

You gonna make some music.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I actually don't know what's gonna happen. I just know that, you know, I think they tried to make an album with Dallas. They tried to make an album with Puff, and the album that they wanted for his second record, it didn't work. So they actually tell me that they was on the verge of dropping him if it didn't work with me. Right. I ain't noticed, though. I started hearing this after the fact. So, you know. But they was like, you know, we want you to do what you did with Kris Kross, with Usher. We want you to take him to your house. You know what I mean? Make him your artist. And I was like, all right. I never did this before with the R B. I never produced nobody male R B. So I don't know what the song's gonna sound like. I did Escape.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, shit.

[Jermaine Dupri]

But I. I ain't never do it with A male artist. So I ain't know what the song was gonna sound like. So he came, we start kicking, I started talking, and I started figuring out, okay, he just like Kris Kross, almost like, he pick up instantly. If he love it, he really get it. You know what I'm saying? So I'm like, okay, if I write songs for him that he love, he gonna sing it. He gonna sing it with his all. Yeah, right. But I still was writing songs like raps. Seven o' clock on the block I'm in my drop top cruising the streets. These is rap lyrics.

[Joe Budden]

In the streets. When you talk about all these kid stars, right? Something that keeps. Maybe because it's you, but something that keeps popping up to me is Monica. Right. She was just a young girl out there, and she's saying, like, you skipping the breath.

[Jadakiss]

I wouldn't hear.

[Joe Budden]

I'm not saying we got the Brat. We got too much to talk about.

[Jermaine Dupri]

But I'm just going.

[Jadakiss]

She quits.

[Joe Budden]

You want to go.

[Jadakiss]

Ahead. We hear about the Brat at it.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Go ahead with the Monica. Let me hear where you go.

[Joe Budden]

I'm just saying Monica was a little girl with a big voice.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

And she became a superstar just like that at first. Did you know, like, when you.

[Jermaine Dupri]

When you heard she was Dallas artist.

[Joe Budden]

I know.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, yeah. I was breaking a lot of bread down there. I knew. I knew she was hot, though. I knew she had it. And she was like. She was a ghetto girl that Dallas was trying to take into the Whitney Houston space. And she had the voice to go into that space. Not. I want nobody take it wrong. We're saying she's really.

[Joe Budden]

No, no, no, no. She was. She had the voice to go there.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

There's no question about that.

[Jermaine Dupri]

But I never thought I would work with her either. I didn't have no idea I ever worked with Monica.

[Joe Budden]

What joints you did for Monica?

[Jermaine Dupri]

I did the first night. That was the first song I ever did with her.

[Joe Budden]

The first night.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Yo, let me tell you something, boy. This ATL royalty is that. Let's go to the Brat. I love the Brat. That's my sister. We not. Let's go to the Brat. Let's go to the Brat. First female to sell a million records.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Rap up.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So the Brat situation.

[Joe Budden]

How do you find the brat from Chicago?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, yeah. So brat. Brat met Crisscross when they was on their second tour. Yeah, they was on. They was on another tour after they went on tour with Michael Jackson. They was on another tour. Right. So they went on. They went on Tour. And they had, like, what's his name? Ed Lover. And from all love raps, right? Dr. Dre, like the host of the tour. And they'll call people up on the stage and rap as an intermission between, you know, I think MC Light and Crisscross, right? Because they had put MC Light at the opening for them and shout out.

[Joe Budden]

To MC Light, my mom's just passed away. I love you, Light.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Living legend Brat came on the stage and rap, and I wasn't there. And they called me right after Light Skinned. Because I remember, like, yesterday, he called me like, yo, this female rapper, she went crazy in Chicago. And I'm like, I don't care about no female rapper. Like, don't nobody like female rappers. This is what I'm saying. Like, this one. No female rappers popping off besides Salt and Pepper. Like, and in like, street fashion of us driving around, we weren't listening to no female rappers in our cars. Like, that just wasn't what happened. So I just like, nah. And I thought, like, me messing with a female rapper was gonna be the first time that my little success story was gonna go wrong. Cause I was like, I just did.

[Joe Budden]

You was on a roll?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, I just did crisscross. I did escape. And I was. You know what I'm saying? I was moving. And I was just like, nah. Female rapper. I can't do it. So. But he kept pushing me, and I was like, all right, tell her to come to Atlanta. She came to Atlanta, and she told me to come to the hotel and meet her. I went to the hotel, like, to meet her, like, have a conversation with her. And I'm like, I'm gonna take you to my house. Cause this is where my studio was. So I'm driving her from downtown Atlanta to College Park. And I stop and get gas. And I stop and get gas. I go in the gas station. I come back. She put a tape in the car while I was inside the gas station place. Pants. I came back, turned the car on, and the tape started going. And I'm like, what the fuck is. Who is this rapper? And it was her. And I was like, wait, who? Wait, who is this rapper? And the way she was rapping on the tape, I was like, oh, shit.

[Joe Budden]

She was not playing.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Nah, she wasn't playing. She was really rapping, like, she's coming for it. This wasn't the type of rap I thought. Thought this was. Like, she was really rapping, like, really Chicago style, like, Twister and all of that. Like, that type of shit. And I'm like, that's you? And she was like, yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Also, you was producing, like, west coast sounding beats for the Brat.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, but I hadn't started.

[Jadakiss]

I didn't know what he was about to do.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I didn't know what I was gonna do.

[Joe Budden]

He did it, though.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. I didn't know what I was gonna do. So I took it to my house. I'm like, I like you. I'm gonna sign you. And honestly, Brat Project was, like, the hardest project for me because I couldn't find that thing yet. I couldn't find. I would make a song and I play it for people, and it was like, yeah, whatever, Whatever. And then I just stopped paying attention to who she was. Like, she'd be outside my house and, like, it was cold. So we. We, like, take all the swim, like, all the water out of the swimming pool. And she'd go down in the swimming pool and smoke weed because she couldn't smoke in my house. And she was down in the pool smoking. And I started realizing, like, oh, she. She, like. She a female. Like. Like a little Snoop Dogg. Like, she smoke Reed. Like, chain smoking before anybody, like, really by herself. And I'm like, we should put this in the music. And I just start seeing, like, this was what was happening. It's. You know. And I mean, I'm influenced by what's going on in hip hop, so I ain't. You know. I mean, and I saw. You know, I'm listening to Dre, I'm listening to what's going on, and I'm listening to Snoop. Snoop is doing his thing. And it was kind of like. It wasn't like. Cause the first song we came out with wasn't funk. It was more or less like it was the Isley Brothers. I just flipped sleeping in my. I mean, between the sheets. But what I did was I started realizing that if you play the sample over, it gave you a different texture to the music. So when you start playing the music over, that's when people start thinking it was, like, west coast music. But it wasn't West Coast. It was just. Just in between the Sheets, right? Because we had. I remember we had in between the Sheets, and then Biggie. Them had Big Papa, right? And Big used to come to me all the time, be like, man, what did you do to your beat? That sounds different than my beat. And he just had a sample. I had more, you know, I mean, I almost had, like, more. Yeah, different things. I could take the bass. I could do whatever I wanted to do because we played it over, right? And I think that's where people start. You know, it was.

[Joe Budden]

We.

[Jermaine Dupri]

We ran with it because the song was called Funk Defy, but it wasn't. It was the Isley Brothers record.

[Jadakiss]

That's it.

[Joe Budden]

So Funk Defied.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. And that's the first time I started rapping on as far as people. First time hearing me. And that's because I was in there writing the raps and I was in there writing and I was just playing around. Like I. Playing around like, I'm gonna say this and you say this. And it started going and was like back and forth, back and forth, and everybody was around. It was like, y' all should do that. And I'm like, nah, I don't want to rap that. Right. I'm still trying to stick to just. I'm a producer. I'm. I'm going, I'm doing good. I'm not getting ready to start doing this. We're not going to mess this up, right?

[Joe Budden]

That's around the time they. They Suge Knight was like, you want producers in your video rapping?

[Jermaine Dupri]

No, no, this was before that. It was almost that fast forwarding too much. This was before that. So. Yeah, so. So we get to the front of Funk the Fire come. I was there and this brat. Brat record go crazy. Funk the Fire record go crazy.

[Joe Budden]

Too crazy.

[Jermaine Dupri]

And Brat album. She became the first female solo artist to have a platinum album.

[Joe Budden]

That was crazy, man. Shout out to the brat. Her wife.

[Jadakiss]

Y' all co wrote that?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. Yeah. Because that's when I saw, you know, I mean, I start. I was. I was writing, but then I started remembering, like, you rap. I already knew what. You know what I'm saying? So we just start figuring that out. Back and forth motion, right? And I write one part and then she grab it and understand where I'm going. And this.

[Joe Budden]

Just take it from, you know, Tip told me tiny road scrubs. Yeah, Scrub, isn't it?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. Her candy.

[Joe Budden]

He said he was on the passenger side.

[Jermaine Dupri]

No, I'm sure. I'm sure.

[Joe Budden]

That's crazy. Gag. Kiss Gag. I know. I'm jumping all up.

[Jermaine Dupri]

You know, I got a beautiful conversation.

[Jadakiss]

This is very knowledgeable.

[Joe Budden]

I'm with. With you, brother.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I'm with you. So. So then, like, I'm running around now with Brett and I'm rapping. Fun is big. So I'm performing with her everywhere we go, right? And I'm like, I still don't want to rap, but. But I'm. I'm writing more raps now because I'm hearing myself on the radio, and I'm rapping. I'm starting rapping. And then all my friends like, J.D. you should make y. You should make an album. And I'm like, no, I don't want to make no album. I'm just gonna keep doing what I'm doing. But I start making, like. Like, fake songs in the studio. Like, I'd be writing a song, and I'm thinking I'm gonna give it to somebody else. But I damn near finished the song, and my friends just start listening to it in the car, and they like, yo, you should make this a real song. One thing led to the next, to the next, to the next. And then I did my first album, Life in 1472.

[Joe Budden]

You want to know what's crazy? Is there's something going on down the other side of town. You got the Goody mom?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Not yet.

[Joe Budden]

Not yet. You know what? I'm gonna let you control. Get you ask questions, man.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Are you listening to this, man?

[Joe Budden]

Not yet.

[Jadakiss]

Ahead of time.

[Joe Budden]

So they're not ringing off yet?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, not yet. Nah. Nah, not yet. This all, like, you know, how do I know this?

[Jadakiss]

And you older than me.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, this. It seemed like that by a couple of candies. It seemed like. It wasn't like that. It's an argument about that now. Like, people don't understand. Crisscross came out before outkast.

[Jadakiss]

Facts.

[Joe Budden]

I know that, but I didn't know. I didn't know that Goody Bob and Rico Wade and the family wasn't cooking up.

[Jermaine Dupri]

But that's what I'm saying. You got to think about it.

[Joe Budden]

Like, New York.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Crisscross came out before outcast. So you got to think about where the stretch was, right? It's like this. Crisscross and outkast. So Outkast came. I mean, Goody mob came out after Outkast, after Outcast. Success.

[Jadakiss]

You ain't know that.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. You ain't know that.

[Joe Budden]

No, no, no. I always thought the Goody mob. I'm. That's why we learned it. I always thought the Goody people think I'm signing a big pun. You understand? Not.

[Jadakiss]

There is.

[Joe Budden]

I'm telling you. They asked me. I'm thinking Goody mob birth. Outcast.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Outcast came out first. Yeah. Outcast came out first, then Goody Mob.

[Joe Budden]

Wow.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, that's amazing. But that's after gag. Good timetable.

[Jadakiss]

No, he was talking to you.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yes. You know, we went into this space of me starting rapping, and me and brat started doing, like, going back and forth doing things. This, that, and the third. And we did the Sleeping In My Bed remix, right?

[Jadakiss]

That shit was monster.

[Jermaine Dupri]

We did the Sleeping In My Bed remix. This was like the first song that New York had really, ever, really, really embraced. That I did. Now, you gotta think from this whole time when I was staying here in New York, I had sometimes level. And I took them to see red. I took the record, the red alert.

[Jadakiss]

And.

[Jermaine Dupri]

And Chuck, chill out. And Chuck, chill. I was like, nah, nah, nah. This ain't no I can't play. Take that country back.

[Joe Budden]

Chuck's still like that.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Oh, yeah. So. So he ain't. I always had this thing where I kept trying to check my record in New York.

[Joe Budden]

Radio 2025.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Chuck still be doing that?

[Joe Budden]

Yes. I listen to him that week on bls.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, I like this. I like that.

[Joe Budden]

He never changed.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. But by the way, that made me to want. That just made my. Me just like, I gotta get a record in New York. Like, I gotta get a record in New York. So I just kept. I wasn't thinking about Sleeping In My Bed being that record. But I was. I always wanted a record that. When I got to New York, I turn on Hot 97. I hear my music, right? So Sleeping in My Bed became like one of the hottest records in New York. Flex was playing it at the Tunnel. It's an R and B record. They weren't playing no R and B at the Tunnel, right? He was playing this. He's like, jd, you gotta come do a party at the Tunnel. Sleeping in my bed is going crazy. Right? Right? So sleeping in my bed, going crazy. And then we had the. The. The photo shoot. The great day in Harlem. Remember that? With all the rappers out there. All y' all was out there, right? Looking like a baby on a.

[Joe Budden]

On a picture that's in my store right now in the Bronx. You looking like a baby out there.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. So this. So we. We. We come to New York and go to Harlem, do this. And then that's when I met Hov, right? And on my way to the shoot, I'm listening to Clue tape. And Hov took the Sleeping in My bed beat. And he took my cadence of. Y' all wanna dance? I'm gonna make it dance. He took all of that and did a freestyle. So then I'm in the car like, oh, this nigga know me.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, he fuck with you.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I'm like, he really know me. He done paid attention to my whole shit. So I wasn't thinking, like, when I seen him, I'm gonna say, let's make a Record. But somewhere in my mind, that's what happened, right? So when I seen him out there, I'm like, yo, I heard you just do my whole little flow on that Clue tape. You need to come to Atlanta. We make a record record. And he's like, all right. He gave me his number. So I went back home. All my mind was that I'm gonna make this record with Jay Z. That's all I was thinking about. I'm gonna make this record with Jay Z. I ain't know what the record was gonna be, but I'm like, I'm gonna make this record with Jay Z. And long story short, he came to Atlanta, and I went to pick them up. And when I'm. When I'm driving to the airport to pick him up, I'm listening to Can't Knock the Hustle. And when he say, deep in the south, kicking Up Top game, I'm like, he's talking about me. Who is he talking about? I'm riding, I'm thinking. He talking about me. He say, switching full lane. I'm switching them. I'm. By the way, I'm in a. I'm in a Bentley.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, yeah, you caked up by then.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, I'm in the Continental Tea, by the way.

[Jadakiss]

Not just a Bentley, Continental tea.

[Jermaine Dupri]

You know what I mean? I'm in the Continental team, going to the airport to pick him up.

[Joe Budden]

And I'm super.

[Jermaine Dupri]

And I'm. I'm all out the window. I'm driving like this. I'm doing everything he's saying in there, Switching four lanes, screaming through the sunroof, money, anything. I'm like, this is me. I'm definitely telling you. That's all I'm saying. He talking about me. So as soon as he come out the airport, I say, yo, I'mma sample this part. This going to be our song. And he's like, all right. And he's thinking about what I'm saying. And then all the way down the street to my house, down Old national to my house, he just got quiet. And I guess he zoned in on.

[Joe Budden]

His verse, started writing his.

[Jermaine Dupri]

He didn't even hit a beat. I ain't playing no beat for him. I had an idea here. We got to my house, I hit the beat, and I said, this. What we gonna rap over? He's like, all right, let's go. I'm ready. And I was like, what?

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, that's crazy.

[Jermaine Dupri]

How this work. And I thought this was gonna be trash.

[Joe Budden]

Jada would have moved into your house. Jada, take his time. He done moved into your house for a month before he gave you that verse. You crazy, J. Take his time.

[Jadakiss]

There you go. Capping.

[Joe Budden]

Now I'm capping.

[Jadakiss]

I just flew to Atlanta for other and went in studio and gave him verse.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Questions? Yes.

[Jadakiss]

Is that in fact or not?

[Joe Budden]

Yes, yes, yes, ladies and gentlemen. I gotta with the God, but my thing is he's one that could catch.

[Jadakiss]

Me come over kissing money, ladies for me. Drop this for the brat.

[Joe Budden]

Money ain't the thing up here. Felt like that was the mergence of down south in New York.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Like. Like it was.

[Joe Budden]

You know, it felt like that was the. The.

[Jermaine Dupri]

It was.

[Joe Budden]

And y' all was talking that shit. Legendary.

[Jadakiss]

Great.

[Joe Budden]

You know, whose idea was the video and all that? The video was crazy.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Everything about that. It was me, Hov and Free, Shout out to Free May. And yeah, we was just like. We was trying to just figure out how to do the dumbest shit we could possibly do at that particular point in time. You know what I mean? And we were supposed to have a horse race where we both was riding a horse. But, like, I ain't riding no horse. And I'm like, should I ride the horse? You can put. Put your girl on the horse. I'll race her. And we. The way we started talking to each other, that's how the video was. Like, all right, we'll bet a hundred thousand. Let's go, right? So then everything was just like, let's, let's. Let's. Let's do it. Let's go over top. So, yeah, we wrecking Porsches and everything at the video shoot. Real life.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, yeah. So y' all was just jumping out.

[Jadakiss]

Another one.

[Joe Budden]

So at what point do you hear outkast?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Well, outkast is out at this point. Outkast is out. Like, outkast came out. Outkast was out. Like I said, outkast came out right after Krish Kross. So they actually was like, brat Outkast. And they. In that little era, all of that came out around the same time. Like, 94. Kris Kross came out in 92. So Outkast, I think, like, they came out and that's when they won. They won the award at the Source Awards in 94.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, yeah, I was there. That was that night. I was there, brother. I was sitting right behind Outkast. Right in front of Outkast was the 69 boys. Nas was sitting right in front of me.

[Jermaine Dupri]

You really remember.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, I'm at the. I'm strapped in the Sauce Awards. Like, keep it real. With you, I got the Animals with me. I'm up in there. You know what I'm saying? So I saw where Outcast won that. That award, and they just got up and I wasn't. I was up on Outcast, but I didn't think they were the kings, right? So I. I knew they was nice. I knew they was repping that atl, but I ain't. When they won, who they won against, Wu Tang. They want one against some serious people up there.

[Jermaine Dupri]

That was a new artist award, though, right?

[Joe Budden]

See? Yeah, but they. It was. It was around the same time. But when they won, I remember them getting up, they did like a little one, two step. They went. Because they didn't think they were gonna win in New York like they did. So when they won, it was. That was a major. That was like Biggie on stage going, brooklyn. We did it. We made it, right? It's like when outkast won, if you wasn't there, you in the atl. You seen when they won that on tv.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I was there.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, you was there?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

So what? That must have been like in the whole entire south, where they, like, the south got something to say.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I mean, for me, I didn't feel it like that because I had already said what I had to say. I had already been saying what the south got to say, right? But this was more or less like, you know, like, what niggas don't understand. I ushered in young in rap. When I brought Kris Kross in the game, it was no young people rapping. Young people didn't even want to rap, right? It was all old niggas. So old niggas would never give young niggas no credit. It Crisscross came out, they first album, they sold 8 million records. So niggas don't ever be like, really, like, talking about this. Like they want to give all crisscross credit to somebody else. They sold 8 million records at 12 years old.

[Joe Budden]

That's a lot of records, man.

[Jermaine Dupri]

They sold 4 million jumps.

[Joe Budden]

Well, on that wall, you know, his studio, he got a wall with nothing but platinum diamond.

[Jadakiss]

Call it the studio. I'll call it the Museum Sound art exhibit.

[Joe Budden]

You walk up in there, you know, you. You stepping in some. How many millions, man? Cuz, Kiss don't let me ask you that. He like to be hungry.

[Jermaine Dupri]

He said he got it, but it's.

[Joe Budden]

A lot of millions.

[Jermaine Dupri]

See? I mean, it was one time, it was at like 400, 500 million, but that's. That was like 10 years ago. Now that we got this streaming. I know it's way more than that.

[Jadakiss]

Confessions. Before I even get a riot, how. What was you and the staff shout out to B. Shout out to everybody. What was. What kind of zone. What did y' all set out to do? Cuz I. If y' all just say, yo, we about to cook up some and go diamond and take over the whole. Every piece of the world, y' all accomplish that to the T. I don't think that's what y' all did.

[Jermaine Dupri]

No, no. Well, I mean, you got. So we had 8,701 first before confessions, right? Shout out to that and definitely. Yeah, so. So 8701. We wrote you Got It Bad. Real. So you Got It Bad. The successor. You Got It Bad was just like. It was the beginning of it. Like, it was like, okay, listen, we make. After. After you got a bad success, we went back in the studio for Confessions. The mentality was that we had to finish off what we thought you Got It Bad did, right? So Usher was talking about a song. Like he felt like his relationship was going through this situation. He wanted it to burn out. Like, just let it. Bur I'm gonna have to go through the pain. And he was telling me this, and I. I couldn't really grasp what he was saying because I went. I haven't gone through that type of situation. But I was trying to. And I was trying to figure it out. And he told me this, and he left. And I sat there for a minute. I kept thinking about him, like, let it burn, Let it burn. And I kept saying, like, oh, okay. When the feeling Nobody. I started trying to figure out what the words were. And then I got it. And I called him back. I said, I got it. I got it. I got the hook. So he came back to the studio, and we did Let It Burn first, right? We did Let It Burn first. And then he started saying he was going through this thing where he couldn't really work in Atlanta. Let's go to la. And I'm like, nah, here we go. This is the. I thought we was. This was.

[Joe Budden]

Everybody go through a phase. You think you thinking he gonna block his own blessings, right?

[Jermaine Dupri]

I'm like, here we go. I know I'm thinking about me. Cause I'm. I'm. I'm like a. I want to be where I can grab all the records that I need. Any ideas, it's all in my studio, right? For me, as far as being creative, I don't want to go nowhere because I know I'm gonna forget Something. I'm gonna leave some more. I can't find something. Yeah, right. So he like, let's go to la. And I'm like, ah, cool. I'm going. We go, we go to Brandon's way and we get out there and my man that was with me, he was talking to me about girls and side girls and relationships and this, that and the third. And I just kept saying that's all bad. Like everything you talking about is all bad. And Usher came to the studio and we started talking about some things, but then he left and all I kept remember, he was like, yo, let's come back tomorrow. And I was like, man, nah, I can't let LA beat me. I get like a writer's block. I feel like I got a writer's block basically. And you know, it's really, really bothering me because I already felt like it was gonna happen when I got to la.

[Jadakiss]

So not to cut you off, that happens to me in la. I needed, I can't just go there and go straight to the studio. I gotta, I gotta cry, I gotta be, I gotta, some gotta happen. I can't, I don't got the same fluidity in the studio in LA that I got anywhere else. And I don't know what it, I don't know what it is. It takes a while for me to get. I can't just go there and be kissed off the rip.

[Joe Budden]

So, yeah, I never really successfully wrote in la.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Never.

[Joe Budden]

Me, myself never hit one out the park in la. Yeah, like you, you know, I've wrote there, but it wasn't.

[Jadakiss]

Blackout was recorded in LA on xl. This is it right here, baby. That's probably.

[Joe Budden]

No, he was recording out there.

[Jadakiss]

Verse I'm talking about for me, X album is the, the best I was able to.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So, yeah, so I, I, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm going through this thing and I'm struggling. So I'm like, I told the engineer, give me a copy of the beat because I made, we made the beat. Me and. Because he made the beat. And I think I, I know, I know the beat, right? I just don't, I ain't got the words. I can't figure it out. And I, and, and I'm thinking about saying stuff that I don't think Usher's gonna wanna say, right? So I'm thinking like, that he ain't gonna wanna do this because, because this ain't what his life is, right? He ain't going through this. So I'm like. But that's What I want to say, but I'm thinking like, this ain't gonna work. So I take the beat and I get in the car and I'm getting in the car, I'm riding down Melrose and I'm thinking like, I swear I knew.

[Joe Budden]

Damn.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I'm thinking, I'm thinking like, I ain't got the words. I can't. So I start thinking about usual suspect, right? Kaiser Sojay was in the jail. He had a words for the story. He just start looking for the words on the board and try to create the story. So I'm like, I'm gonna try this. And that's what I started doing. I'm looking at signs on Melroses, all kind of going, right? So I get to the light, I think on third and the Beverly Centers in front of me. And that's when I say, every time I was in la, I was with my ex girlfriend. Every time she called me, I told him, baby, I'm working. No, I was out doing my work. I was hand in hand in the Beverly center, like, man, not giving a damn damn who sees me. And I'm thinking like, oh. And I'm just grabbing this. Everything I see. I would have never said the Beverly sun in that song if the Beverly sun wasn't in front of me. I'm trying to do the Kaiser Soze, right? So as I get through that verse, I'm like, I. I'm like, I got it. Everything is everything Everything I've been doing is all bad I got a chick on the side with a crib in the ride I've been telling you some mineralize Ain't nothing good, it's all bad I just want to confess and that's where confessions came from. When me saying I just want to confess all of this that I've been doing is bad. We ain' confessions that if I would have said that I want to confess to you Everything that I've been doing is bad. So it's like my time. I'm saying this gonna be the first R and B record where the actually tell a girl it. Yeah, you ain't got even ass. Yeah, I'm her. This what I'm doing. I got a crib on the side with a chick on the side with a crib in the ride I've been telling you so many lies Ain't nothing good, it's all bad I ain't know where he's going. I just felt like day, that song.

[Joe Budden]

Feels so good to this day.

[Jadakiss]

Oh, bad.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So that was the Beginning. That was the beginning. I had to drive all the way to Malibu because everybody had left the studio and I couldn't record. I had to remember. I had to memorize all of this. Yeah. I had to keep going, right? So the next day, it's like, we gotta hurry up and get to the studio. So I put it down. Put it down.

[Joe Budden]

You ain't write it down.

[Jermaine Dupri]

No, I'm driving and writing in my head.

[Joe Budden]

I forgot too much.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So we get back, we do all bad. And then Mark Pitts, like, what happened after, you know, after this situation, what happened with the chick on the side? Then it hit me, it's like, oh, damn, she got pregnant. This is like my real life, right? The chick on the side get pregnant. I know this story. Like, I really know this story. I ain't got to write this, right? So that's when we like, okay. I'm like, this is gonna be part two. And part two became these Are My Confessions. And you. If we wouldn't ever got to that, if we wouldn't have, did we? So we did a part two of a song that never even came out. Wow.

[Joe Budden]

So that was part two to the part one. That was the response.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

And you ain't even do the first one.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Well, we did it, but it didn't come out. LA didn't put all bad on the first. He didn't put it on the album. He put it on, you know, me on the repackage.

[Joe Budden]

You know, you name it some big names, right? So you saying LA Reid, you're saying Mark Pitts, who decides what comes on the album?

[Jermaine Dupri]

LA Reid on the face. I mean, you know, at that time, Aristotle, you know, that was his. That's his.

[Joe Budden]

He'd be like, I want this, I.

[Jadakiss]

Want that shot caller.

[Jermaine Dupri]

That's his job. That's what he's doing. And that was his space. Like la, you know, putting the albums together.

[Joe Budden]

Saw like a. Like a old interview with R. Kelly and he said he would do like a hundred songs and listen to all of them and pick out the 12 on the album. Like, you know how hard that had to be.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

To like, there's probably some gems left on the floor. Right?

[Jermaine Dupri]

But that's what I'm saying. Like, I. I never even understood why LA didn't even put both versions. He didn't want. He ain' put all bad. And I'm like, you know what's crazy is that people gonna listen to this and they're hearing the second story, they don't even know where it came from. But I couldn't figure. I. I couldn't figure out how it work.

[Jadakiss]

Genius.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, it was.

[Jadakiss]

It was like crazy genius.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

So.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So that was the beginning of Confessions.

[Joe Budden]

I think Big Pun. Right.

[Jadakiss]

If you think about it, though, J.D. that's how movies they. Sometime they make you watch the movie backwards.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, that's a. Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

And he was ill. He said he did the Kaja Soul. Say he had writer block, so he was looking at signs. It was like driving around.

[Jermaine Dupri]

But you can't. You ain't got it. You know what I mean? Like, if you under pressure, that's. That's all I remember about that movie is that dude was in the. You know, I mean, in the jail. The dude asking him questions and he. He's under pressure.

[Joe Budden]

Made a whole story with him.

[Jermaine Dupri]

He just looking at stuff and he.

[Joe Budden]

Like, oh, that's crazy.

[Jermaine Dupri]

If you could put it together to make it sound good, that's what I started trying to do. Do.

[Jadakiss]

That was it.

[Joe Budden]

That's crazy. So I gotta ask, you think Big Pun, because his. His biggest crush in the world was Janet Jackson, right? You got Janet Jackson at her prime. Was it her prime?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Okay.

[Joe Budden]

She was six, packed up and all that. At that time, that was. There was a Janet that went crazy at one point, that she just became the baddest. I know that.

[Jadakiss]

Since Good Times.

[Joe Budden]

Can I say can? Can. Can.

[Jadakiss]

She the prophet.

[Joe Budden]

You caught her at the time. She went crazy. Right. And so. And I don't know. Let me ask.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Crazy before that.

[Joe Budden]

Let me ask you a question. Well, if she went crazy before that, it was enough to make you say, let me holler.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, right.

[Joe Budden]

The confidence to holla at Janet. Well, I don't know, because.

[Jadakiss]

Did you just hear what he said? He did from 12.

[Joe Budden]

No, no, I understand that's. It's Janet Jackson. No. Okay, well, you got the confidence. I ain't got. Now, let me ask you a question. You ever got checked by. Can I say something? See, I'll tell you. He's on his. On this.

[Jadakiss]

I can't let you get away with this.

[Joe Budden]

This ain't that, and that ain't this Cracking kiss. Michael Jackson never pulled you on the side and said, yo, you dating my sister. You know, this, that, you. So he never check. He don't get involved in his sister's love life.

[Jermaine Dupri]

No, but. But Jackie. I think Jackie did. And then Jackie.

[Jadakiss]

Jackie want to smoke a lane, they.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Just let me know.

[Joe Budden]

Like, I mean, somebody. But at the same time, with your sister, you might. You most like. I used to sit in front of my sister with a baseball bat. She hated me my whole life. Guy come to visit her and I'm sitting right in forest projects with a baseball bat looking at the dude like they had no time before you met him.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Anything before you even met him.

[Joe Budden]

I don't give a. At that time, I was one of them crazy Puerto Ricans that you was like, yo, I'm dating this chick is a crazy Puerto Rican with a baseball bat staring at me. No, no, at the house. You know, yo, miss, can I come visit your daughter? I'm sitting there with the baseball. My, my, my, my sister never got over that from me, you know what I'm saying? Because it was whack. It was whack. So he never stepped to you like that?

[Jermaine Dupri]

No, but in the house, you had have to pick a side, though, between Michael and Janet at that particular.

[Jadakiss]

That's how it was.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, you had to pick a side like if you was on the Michael side or you was on the Janet side.

[Joe Budden]

And so there was family competition.

[Jermaine Dupri]

It was 100%. Just imagine if it was six Jermaine Duprees. Yeah. Atlanta up.

[Joe Budden]

So that shit was like control.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So like Jackie, me and Jackie, we hit it off. Jackie told me, he was like, you know, we the first in LA with Ferraris. And I'm like, what you have to think about that?

[Joe Budden]

Oh, that's what he said.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, just think about.

[Joe Budden]

That's a fact, though.

[Jermaine Dupri]

No, but I'm just saying you can't.

[Jadakiss]

In LA to ever have with Ferraris.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Black. Yeah, yeah.

[Jadakiss]

They was the first.

[Joe Budden]

They the first alien in the living room, bro. These guys, you leave it to us. Anything they did, we. We believe.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, for sure. So I mean, you have the, you know, he's just breaking it down for me, like, you know, I mean.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, you didn't know that. That's why I'm telling you. It took a lot of co host to step to Janet Jackson. When that world heard Jermaine Dupree was dating Janet, he was like this.

[Jadakiss]

Yes.

[Joe Budden]

You know how many was like, oh, I wish I had the heart to talk to her. Yo, I just, you know this, you know, you know, Raul recipes always told me Jlo gave him a look one time. Time we shooting a video with Jayla, he would tell me all the time like, shut the up. She ain't look at you lying.

[Jermaine Dupri]

But by the way, that's all it looked at me. That's all I'm saying.

[Joe Budden]

I'm telling you, I respect it because of you. I said Jlo did not look at you, Raul. And he really. He went to his grave with that story. He really believed that.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Why I said the money and thing. She look, she go, it's. It's bye bye.

[Joe Budden]

She look, she go, for sure.

[Jadakiss]

You ain't got to say no more.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

I mean, damn.

[Jermaine Dupri]

As I still live, I live by that today. She looks, she go, that's it. That's what it is.

[Joe Budden]

She looks, she go, it's a rap now.

[Jadakiss]

After you now. Confessions. Cause I gotta be on the journalist side. Cause he. He keeping it on.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, you've been asking. You've been asking. I want to stay on such. You've been asking all the questions.

[Jadakiss]

Say this with about time.

[Joe Budden]

All right, I'm with you.

[Jadakiss]

Listen, Mariah, how'd y'. All. The mc, you. You just seem to hit everything out of the park with everything you create for her. And with us.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I mean, what a. Mariah was like, the first record I did for Mariah was Always Be My Baby, right? And. And I love that song.

[Joe Budden]

You will always be my baby.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Honest.

[Jadakiss]

Oh, that's just forever.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So that's the first song I did for. And. And shoot, she came to me, like, she told Tommy, like, I want to work with him. Because she liked just kicking it. She liked Escape, and she wanted a song that felt like that. And that's what we. That was my attempt to give her, like, a Just kicking it was Always Be my Baby. Right? And then that's what we formed our relationship, and we just started working, working, working. And then when LA signed her to Def Jam, he started working on Emancipation of Mimi. And I wasn't on it, and he called me and he was like, oh. He told her his favorite song. His favorite Mariah Carey record was Always Be My Baby. And she was like, well, JD did that song. And he was like, well, you need to go to Atlanta and see JD and he sent her to Atlanta. And the first record we did was. It's like that. And. No, the first record we did was Can I get your number? And I'm singing on the record because I was gonna. I wanted her to do the part, but when she heard it, she was like, I'm not doing that. You stay on the record. And I'm like, I don't. I'm not singing on the record. She's like, no, stay on the record. So I ended up staying on this song. Can I get your number? And then me and B. Cox, we did shake it off. So we did Can I get your number? And shake it off in the same little like, two days. So they went back, she came back to New York, she played these two songs for la. And he was like, go back. He's like, hold up. This, this, this, this feel like where we need to go. You need to go back. Go back to Atlanta one more time. So then they called me. He's like, she coming back. And he was like, J.D. you still ain't make Always be my baby. And I'm like, I don't. I can't do that again. I don't know. I don't think I can do that again. So he came and I. Knowing that he wants his record, that feel like, Always be my baby. So. So immediately I'm like, we gotta make a ballot. That's what he looking for. He looking for a ballot. And we made We Belong Together.

[Jadakiss]

And I'm on the remix.

[Joe Budden]

We belong Together. Thank you. I can't sleep at night.

[Jermaine Dupri]

And then we did this like that, too. That same little session. But We Belong Together's director, you know.

[Joe Budden]

What'S crazy is my favorite singer of all time is Luther Van Jo. Rest in Peace. And this morning I woke up and I played the performance of Luther in London with Mariah. Now, I've seen videos of Luther singing with Whitney Houston where he had to encourage her. Like, yo, Whitney, come on. Like, he was giving a pep talk. Kaluta different, but a young Mariah Carey went over there and went toe to toe, like a Muhammad Ali fight in that performance. And it was just like, yo, it. Like, she wasn't scared of Luther. She was a young girl.

[Jermaine Dupri]

That's Mariah Carey, man. She. She different.

[Joe Budden]

You know what's crazy? Before the world was BMFs, it was so. So deaths.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, for sure.

[Joe Budden]

And so I. I remember going to Atlanta. It's so. So. Yeah, Atlanta, right. And then it turned into bmf.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Well, they got a sign across from me across on the other side.

[Joe Budden]

They got the sign across the other side.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. I ain't. No, this. I'm just saying the signs was like.

[Jadakiss]

A lot of people think encouragement for them.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, a lot of people think that they. We switch signs. My sign, my sign. Stay right there. They was like.

[Joe Budden]

Like, that was like unauthorized, to be honest.

[Jadakiss]

Well, we knew we was gonna.

[Joe Budden]

He could kind of call it world El Chapo. Like, gotta be kidding me, right? I used to think they was police or something. At first. They'd be like, yo, get with them. I'll be like, what? Yeah, they paying crazy money for features. And this. I'd be like, I see them in the clubs. And all I see, yo, this is just. No way these guys are doing it. Like, they thought they were legally selling drugs or something, right? And so. No, no, I'm telling you, they come to Miami, 20 white cars. Lamborghini, white, Ferrari, white. Cullinan, white. This white truck, white. This Tuesday, sky blue blues. Well, Phantoms, sky blues, Ferraris.

[Jadakiss]

They was just doing a different color.

[Joe Budden]

They had a birthday party where they was. They had tigers in the club, bro. Full fledged. They was doing.

[Jadakiss]

First time I ever seen that. 175 homers. Imagine.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Let me say this. Atlanta. Atlanta allows you to do that. Like, Atlanta is the only city in America where you can go to, too. And you're gonna see black people with money that don't sell dope. I'm talking about money.

[Joe Budden]

No, I'm with that.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So ultimately. Ultimately, what Meech was doing blended in so well that it didn't feel like what you talking about to us.

[Joe Budden]

Me coming from the Bronx.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

[Joe Budden]

I knew there was some indictments coming soon.

[Jermaine Dupri]

See, that's what I'm saying. It didn't feel like that.

[Joe Budden]

I knew it. Like, the back of my hand ain't.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Feel like that to us. Because I'm saying, if you pull up the Linux square right now, mad rich.

[Joe Budden]

Black people, the whole L square look like.

[Jermaine Dupri]

They look just like. What you talking about?

[Joe Budden]

That's probably the only bag I never took. Like, they was like, yo, we got the bag. He want features. And I was like, I took that.

[Jermaine Dupri]

It was a beautiful.

[Joe Budden]

I was terrified.

[Jadakiss]

What's up with this Magic City album and Doc?

[Jermaine Dupri]

All right, so the Magic City album. Album. Initially, we did a Magic City documentary. And I didn't have. I had. I got a new deal with Hyde. A Social Death Hyde. But I didn't have my deal, right? And I was just doing a documentary as an executive producer. And then I signed my deal in between us putting this doc out, and I was just like, it's crazy that we ain't doing something with the music, right? So I had conversation with Scooter, and I'm like, I think my first project should be a soundtrack from this Magic City documentary. And he was like, yeah, that's. Yeah, let's do that. And. And we called Stars, and we was like, yo, we gonna do a documentary. We do soundtrack. And they was like, we don't really do soundtracks like that. And I'm like, what? And I'm like, this is what the club is about. The club thrives off the music. The music moves the Club, so you gotta make it go. And they weren't really, like, sold on doing the music. Right. But I'm sold on it at this point. I'm going. I'm going. I'm starting to call artists. I'm trying to do what I gotta do. So then I was just like, you know what I thought about out when I was working on American Gangster? The songs that in American Gangster ain't in the movie, right? So the American Gangster album, it says Jay Z, American Gangster. I mean, inspired by American Gangster, the movie. But the songs that's in there is not in the. In the. In the movie. So then I was like, we could do this. We could just make a Jermaine Dupree album inspired by the Magic City documentary. So that's basically what. That's where we at right now. It's a new jacket.

[Joe Budden]

I gotta ask you a question, though. Jada hates this, but giving it to you. Top five dances of all time in Magic City.

[Jermaine Dupri]

White Chocolate at the top.

[Jadakiss]

White Chocolate. I gotta go write these down because I gotta Google these people.

[Jermaine Dupri]

She's in the documentary.

[Joe Budden]

All these people.

[Jermaine Dupri]

They all in the documentary? Yeah, they all in documentary.

[Joe Budden]

All right, let me get four.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I don't know if I can. Top five too many.

[Jadakiss]

CEO, man.

[Joe Budden]

It was a girl named Sugar. It was a girl named Sugar in there.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. Sugar. Oh, he thought it was a girl named Sugar. Sugar. Yeah. Sugar. Round.

[Jadakiss]

None of them shouldn't dance no more.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Magic's had its. Its time. Like. Yeah. Yes. But. But White Chocolate, I feel like it's of all time. Is all time at the. She's number one. She the one at all time.

[Joe Budden]

So they don't. They done threw the most money at White Chocolate ever.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Because, you know, the Cribs is affordable. Them girls is probably buying acres of. No, I'm telling you the truth.

[Jadakiss]

I know you are.

[Joe Budden]

Like, they was out there. This was.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I mean, I spent $10,000 every Monday for 20 years straight in. Easy.

[Jadakiss]

Take the signs off now.

[Joe Budden]

I made the song make it Rain.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

I didn't go to strip club for about three years till it got played out.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Old.

[Joe Budden]

No, they was killing me. Like, every time I walk in to be like, I'll play the Superman song. The lighter. Come on, man. Mr. Rain is here. I'm like. And it was never enough because you may make it rain. They want you to keep. I was like, yo, guess what? It's not good for me to go in the strip club because they get. They putting major peer pressure on me.

[Jermaine Dupri]

But see this is where you got to walk. You got to walk from. You got to walk from the VIP section. Section, and you gotta go holla at the dj. You got to get away, you know? I mean, you can't stay in that light.

[Jadakiss]

Yeah, it's a part. It's a play. You can get stuck somewhere stuck in that light.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Everybody watching you.

[Joe Budden]

Magic City.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Gotta get out that fish floor, huh? Nah, Magic ain't got no second floor.

[Joe Budden]

It had a second floor.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Oh, no. They got a little step up.

[Joe Budden]

That's where I met Jeezy for the first time. The little.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Little step up.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, that was as far that. That's as low as you could go up in that. You know what I'm saying?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, a little step up.

[Joe Budden]

What.

[Jadakiss]

What made you. You want to do the rap game? Like, what. What inspired what? Say, yo, I want to get some kids with some.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Oh, the rap game, not the rap. Well, it wasn't really my idea. It was. It was an idea that. That, I think, like, Flavor Unit, they had the idea before Shout out, but I just was the person that had produced kids before, and they didn't know nobody else that they thought could pull off that part. So the. The idea they had, they already had the idea. But when they came to me, that's when I started FL telling them, like, this is what we gonna do. And then my reach about getting the artists and all of this, I just took over the show from that point. And once I. You know, after we got through the first season, I realized what we was doing, and I was like, oh, I got this. I'm getting ready to run this up. Cause I seen that, you know, I seen how many people was paying attention to it. And I also saw, like, once again, it was, like, an opportunity for the younger generation to step forward and be a part of hip hop in a way that they weren't ever. You know, when I was a kid, it wasn't happening. Or even somebody else, even, like, Bow Wow. Bow w. Coming in the game. At the time. When Bow Wow came in, it still won no kid rappers. You know what I mean? When he came, it was still one. Nobody else out that was at 12 years old doing what he was doing. So it's like Bow Wow to me.

[Joe Budden]

Was like LL Cool J of the.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Kids, 100 facts, 100%. And the. The. The. The. The third album, when I wrote, like, like you, that's what I was trying to get to, like, you know, that was his.

[Jadakiss]

When I'm alone in the.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, I was trying to get to that, like, you know, he was dating Sierra, so I was just like, we gotta make all these songs for the girls. All these songs out of my system. Like, you. All of these records. I did. You know him and Chris Brown, shorty like mine. I just start making all of these songs about the girls.

[Joe Budden]

Power's crazy. Like, certified. Like, nutso.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Yo, I'm telling you, I'm on tour with him, and they sat me everywhere we went. They had, like, me in 101, 102. I don't know why they gave me Bow Wow. He randomly just knock on my door, and I'll be like, yo, Bow Wow, what's up? And he start reading scripture. He's certified. Like, you can't. I met some crazy. He's like, Keith Murray crazy.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Murray crazy.

[Joe Budden]

I'm telling you, Bow Wow. Some of the. He say private is out of control. I'm just like, no, no, it is private. I ain't say what he said. I'm just telling you.

[Jermaine Dupri]

By the way, you don't know how.

[Joe Budden]

Many times I said it, right? Bow Wow. I was like, yo, he's 7:30. Like, I turned around like, yo, this guy. Like, he said, ignorance is bliss with Bow Wow.

[Jermaine Dupri]

What's interesting about Bow Wow Wow, this Bow Wow is a real rapper.

[Joe Budden]

Yes, he is.

[Jadakiss]

Like.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Like, literally. I'm saying literally. He was on. He was on Arsenio when he was six years old. He. He has the longest rap career in rap than anybody. Don't nobody ain't pay no attention to it. He's been rapping longer than anybody, and he's still on the radio and still got songs playing in the club. He's been rapping longer than anybody else that's in rap right now.

[Joe Budden]

That's crazy.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I signed him when he was 7.

[Joe Budden]

Superstar. I always thought he was Snoop Dogg's son or some.

[Jermaine Dupri]

He basically was.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah. Because we was like, little bad. Wow. You just don't know, you know, that Y' all catch. You gotta relax.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So kiss.

[Joe Budden]

I got a question.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I got a question for you. Because I, you know, I've been. I'm making this Magic City album, and I have to ask people prior to me making the records if they beefing with somebody or whatever. Whatever. Because I. And I only do this. And I only do this because I didn't this with you. Right?

[Jadakiss]

No, but you did a good thing. I mean, you have. You kind of, like, fixed it before we fixed it with that song.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So I. I did Hating, Hating your blood, right? I did the song hating your blood And I put Kiss and Freeway on the same record in the middle, speaking to us in the middle of the heat without speaking to them, right? And I wanted the record to be just me and Kiss. I ain't want Freeway to rap. I just wanted Freeway to do the hook. This what I heard in my head. So I had got KISS verse. I had Freeway come to the studio and he's like, I'm get to get my verse on here. And I was like, nah, I, I, I just want you to do the hook. I wasn't really paying no attention to me telling him nah. And his man and his, you know, his arch enemy got a verse going.

[Joe Budden]

That, that beef was nuclear Jada. You and, and Beanie and Freeway and all them going back and forth like that. That, that might have been one of the greatest lyrical beefs of all time.

[Jermaine Dupri]

So somebody I know, somebody had to say something about this.

[Joe Budden]

Serious.

[Jadakiss]

No, no, no.

[Jermaine Dupri]

It was a crew.

[Joe Budden]

I'm somebody in the crew.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Somebody in the crew had to say something. Somebody in the crew said something about this. J.D. that crazy.

[Jadakiss]

The song was knocking. So it didn't, it didn't really bother followed me. And our beef. It wasn't. We, we had love. We started with love. So it wasn't, it wasn't one of them things. Like, not. It wasn't one of them. We're gonna die. I'm saying it wasn't like.

[Joe Budden]

So, yeah, I think on this, my.

[Jadakiss]

Trust was in you with the song. So I know you. You got the billion dollar ears. So if you hear me.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Whatever you.

[Joe Budden]

Your is the extendo clip.

[Jadakiss]

I really like that. I didn't really.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Now I got, yeah, I got the, I got the KISS rule. I have to ask now that I'm making these now you gotta do it.

[Joe Budden]

But, you know, I think I'm gonna add a little segment. It's called Delusional Records.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Delusion. Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Because, yo, lately I like, I actually like that. Yeah, no, no, this bit out of control.

[Jermaine Dupri]

You definitely need.

[Joe Budden]

By the way, I definitely need to do.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, you definitely need to do that. Because I was trying to think, like I said, I've been doing this record, this, this Magic City album, and I'm only using artists from Atlanta. Right. I'm only, I'm only doing records with artists that's from Atlanta. It's the whole soundtrack. So the first single is with ti2 chains and, and dro I never had records with any of them. Like, never had records with them. Right. And crazy as the energy keeps going with this. I keep seeing people Say, JD Bringing the city back. This what the city need. Blah, blah, blah. And what ultimately hurt Atlanta music scene, because people talk about why the music scene ain't like it used to be. What ultimately hurt Atlanta's music scene is delusional records, right? Break that down for me and the independent mindset, huh?

[Joe Budden]

To find what you so from my side.

[Jermaine Dupri]

It's the independent mindset, because all the artists that all the people in Atlanta love, love, they not independent, and they ain't not paying no attention to it. So they delusional to believe that they gonna be like these people. It ain't gonna never happen like that. It's not gonna happen. It's the biggest delusion going, right? And everybody keep trying to pump, like. Like, I swear I was talking to myself before I came over here to this interview, and I was saying, like, you know, like, if you look at Beyonce, right? My dad signed Destiny Shy to Columbia. He was the president of school.

[Jadakiss]

So.

[Jermaine Dupri]

My dad used to work in Columbia Records. This was one of the things that he, you know, this was one of his. This is one of his puts right there. Shout out to OG Yeah, Shout out to my dad. But I say this to say that Beyonce has been signed to Columbia Records for 25 years, right? Or longer. The outro, right? But Steve Stout got a record company that's independent United, Mets and Stout and Hove, his partners, right? You would think that if it's so green on the other side, why wouldn't Beyonce get out her deal and go sign with Stout or anybody else for that matter, right? And the delusion is that it's a delusion in there. And whatever your delusion is, it's a delusion in there. And that's what I'm saying. All these artists, Lil Wayne, Drake, Kendrick. I don't care who you talking about. If they on that list, they signed to a major and you could talk about they got a better deal. And that's the. That's the part I'd be trying to make people understand. Like, we got out of this space of, like, being. We got into this entrepreneurial space, and we got out of making deal space. Like, you can make a deal. You ain't. You ain't gotta. You don't have. You ain't gotta own it. You can go in there and make a deal. You could tell exactly what you want. If they with you, they gonna take it it. If they don't, you just keep walking right like this. This. When I. When I just heard you talking about that. You getting paid to talk you can't believe that, right?

[Joe Budden]

It's unbelievable.

[Jermaine Dupri]

That's what I'm saying. But you. You doing. You got what you wanted.

[Joe Budden]

Yes, that's a fact.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Exactly.

[Joe Budden]

Well, we got what we want.

[Jermaine Dupri]

That's what I'm saying. Y' all got what y' all wanted.

[Jadakiss]

You know, you don't get what you asked for. You get what you negotiate.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, you gotta. You gotta negotiate. And that's, that's. That's what has hurt Atlanta. Atlanta's spirit was. Was that if Dallas Austin wouldn't have got a deal, then Kevin Wells would go get a deal, then Devine Stevens would get a deal, and then Polo the Don get a deal. And it was like. Was going out here finding big, big, big, big bags. And then it got to a point where like, oh, well, them. We gonna do this by ourselves.

[Jadakiss]

Yeah. All right. I like to see it.

[Joe Budden]

Delusional recommend deal. Put me on. He was one of the first to move down to Atlanta. Atlanta from New York. Diamond D, Keith Sweat went down there, right? Bart. Who?

[Jermaine Dupri]

My man, Bart.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, your man went down there. A lot of guys moved down there. But the part of my delusion is right, so Aaron Hall's brother, right? You know what?

[Jermaine Dupri]

You ain't even got to say it. You gotta say it.

[Jadakiss]

I think I'm gonna get low on this.

[Joe Budden]

Yo, yo, kids, yo. I'm just saying, when the brother, the, the, the. The Damien hall, what did he do? He know what the I'm talking about. He said God was the greatest group of all time.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Now God feel like that.

[Jadakiss]

Go ahead, let me hear what you.

[Joe Budden]

What's the greatest group of all time?

[Jermaine Dupri]

No addition.

[Joe Budden]

Hello. Can you stand the rain?

[Jadakiss]

No, but can you?

[Joe Budden]

Hello. Now, you gotta be delusional to think.

[Jadakiss]

You know somebody in a group.

[Joe Budden]

You want to know what's crazy? Two days ago, we in my pool, right? Friends, family, I brought this up and everyone said New Edition. That wasn't even a brainiac thing because, you know, my. My favorite group of all time is Boys to Men. But still everybody said New Edition.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Now let me say this on the show right now. New Edition is the greatest group in music here history, period. They the greatest group to ever come out. White, black, I don't care what it is. They the greatest group to ever come out. Reason being, everybody went solo and went platinum. Everybody, everybody. This ain't happened with the Jacksons. This ain't happened with the Four Tops. This ain't happen with Temptations. This ain't happened with the Backstreet Boys. This ain't happened with NSync, newer days, they got BBD, they went platinum. Ralph Tresvant went platinum. Bobby Brown sold them 10 million records. Johnny Gill, nobody in their crew didn't eat. And they all went solo and they all came back.

[Joe Budden]

Because I got real cool with him. We still cool, but we got cool for a time. And I love that, you know, I love seeing my OGs doing great. You know, I'm waiting for him at the Waldorf in la, and the man pull up in the Bentley, come out with the Bottega bag with this.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I see Johnny Gill.

[Joe Budden]

That's how I like to see my OGs. I don't like to see my OGs, you know, in hip hop. A lot of the OGs up in the pockets. But I love to see Johnny Gill pull up with that on Doing fun. What happened? Kiss?

[Jadakiss]

Nothing.

[Joe Budden]

Stretching. You stretching?

[Jadakiss]

Yeah, my elbow. I hurt my elbow.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Nah. But for real, they. They the greatest. They the great. The greatest group. We gotta. We. We should treat New Edition betterment. New Edition is the greatest musical group to ever come out. I'm talking about all of these groups. I'm talking about the who. I'm talking about the Rolling Stones. I'm talking about all of these artists. If you go. I'm talking about all of these bands. You can say the Rolling Stones. You can say all them. None of them have all they artists, they hold about the Beatles, everybody.

[Jadakiss]

Whoever did die with Diamond.

[Joe Budden]

You know, when white people get something, they hold on to it.

[Jadakiss]

Whoever they got.

[Joe Budden]

J.D. when white people get something, they hold on to.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Well, we need to do the same thing.

[Joe Budden]

New addition is that they still outside of Elvis house right now.

[Jermaine Dupri]

You said what?

[Joe Budden]

They still in Elvis house right now, taking tours right now. I'll tell you, them white people, they won't let that go.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, but we need to do the.

[Joe Budden]

Same with you now. We need to do that with.

[Jermaine Dupri]

No, I'm telling you because you talking about Boys and Men. Boys and Men came from Bivs.

[Joe Budden]

Yes, they did.

[Jadakiss]

Favorite group. When your favorite group was your favorite.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Group.

[Jadakiss]

How could you take them? The guy that made them. I don't even. You didn't think about that?

[Joe Budden]

No, no, I'm. I'm just being honest with you.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I'm.

[Joe Budden]

I'm. I'm. I'm a New Edition worshipper. I'm just saying, you know, vocally, man, that boy to men, man, that's hard.

[Jermaine Dupri]

That's.

[Joe Budden]

That's. That's. That's a hard one.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Voice.

[Joe Budden]

The Men and they, bro.

[Jadakiss]

They got the. They got. They. They do but just with New Edition did.

[Joe Budden]

No, no, New Edition put them on. So there's no question. I'm. I'm agreeing. I'm just saying. Damen hall.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Shout out to Damien.

[Joe Budden]

Listen, we had Jim Jones.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I honestly. What? What?

[Joe Budden]

No, we had Jim Jones up. Yeah, y' all a where that started out.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I just let him keep talking.

[Joe Budden]

No, you see what he said Kiss. They tried.

[Jermaine Dupri]

They tried.

[Jadakiss]

He's on my side. You let him keep talking.

[Joe Budden]

What do you want me to do? Stop him? I try to stop him. The man kept talking. We tried.

[Jadakiss]

I tried. Like Josh on With Little. Listen, I tried.

[Joe Budden]

Let me tell you something. I realized that man was determined to do that. And he waited for any. If we would have said Serena Williams or Venus, he would have said, said, yo, I'm better than Nas. Like, he just was waiting for that. That numb eyes you pulled up, the.

[Jadakiss]

Little guy that did the comparison.

[Joe Budden]

And what I would have said. And what I would have said was, hey, it's an honor to be compared with the rap God. Any normal person would have said.

[Jadakiss]

It's nothing about.

[Jermaine Dupri]

With that little truth.

[Joe Budden]

We have a whole new segment called Delusional Records out here.

[Jadakiss]

You invented that episode.

[Joe Budden]

This out of control out here. Like, you. You a guy like you, you've been there since the Fresh Fist. You. You got Instagram. You see some of this sometimes and you just like, you know this.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I mean, it happened to me every day because it's like a lot of the things that I lived through as a child, whatever, it ain't around no more. So it's hard for people to even grasp what I'm talking about. Right. It's like, it's supposed to.

[Joe Budden]

That's why shows like this is very important.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Like, as opposed to my studio. Studio. That's a crisscross poster and it says, you know, on tour, Michael Jackson. And people come in there and they.

[Jadakiss]

Like, I know that happened.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. Crisscross went on tour. Michael Jackson, like. Like, I wrote it up there. Like I did. Like this actually happened. Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

You want to know what's crazy is I think if they did a movie of anybody who had interactions of any kind with Michael Jackson Jackson, I would tune in every day. Like, you know what I'm saying? I'm so intrigued by mj. That's why I asked you if he said you got any ill stories with mj.

[Jermaine Dupri]

He was Michael Jackson at all time, though. At all times. Michael Jackson was Michael Jackson at all times.

[Joe Budden]

Even behind the scenes, cross on tour with how that.

[Jadakiss]

How the. That.

[Jermaine Dupri]

No, he wanted him on tour with him. He wanted. That's called for. He wanted. I mean, you know, he's all on Sony, but, you know, Jump was. Jump was huge, right? It was just a big record. And Mike, like, He like rap, but people ain't, you know, I mean, they. They wouldn't really find. They didn't know that that's what he was into. And he. He was like, that song, them kids, they got it, and he took them on tour. And we was having this argument about it, because I don't think there's nobody else that rap that's ever open for Michael Jackson besides Kris Kross.

[Joe Budden]

No, no. I remember Heavy Duty with Janet Jackson. I remember Biggie had to join with Mike. But nobody did that. You know, I got a crazy story. I don't know if it's mine to tell, but my man 5001 guy, 5001.

[Jadakiss]

He got that budget for that, right? 70, some kind of crazy budget, and they never came out or something.

[Joe Budden]

God, 5001. Rodney Jerkins calls him. Shout out to Ronnie Jerkins, legend, all that Brandy, all that. So he tells him, yo, come to the studio. I got an important customer for you. I can't tell you who. So guy goes to Sony studio or something. He got his little notebook with him. He about to take the measurements. It could have been anybody. He said. He went to the bathroom and he told Poppy, you know, Poppy cut up all the. Right? So he told Poppy, poppy, we're going to meet somebody famous. It's like, chef, if I. If I would have told you, but I don't know. He was like, we're going to meet somebody famous. Calm down, Poppy. Don't get too excited. He didn't know who. So he said he went to use the bathroom and he was about to piss, and the biggest guys opened the bathroom door and was like. They looked and all the. They was like, all right, you could come in and safe. And Michael Jackson walked in. God, 5001. Pissed on himself. Pissed on him. And he had the pad in his hands, like, trying to cover. He was like, poppy, let's go. Poppy, let's go. He never got the measure, mj. And then he pissed on himself and ran out of there. Poppy. Poppy, let's go. Poppy was like, yo, what? What happened? We gotta go. I don't know what the I'd have did if I met Michael Jackson. Like, I'm not gonna lie to you. I don't know. Whatever. All I could tell you is Michael Jackson, the day he died, I had to pull the truck over I was in the Bronx and I start crying for like an hour.

[Jadakiss]

Do you know. Do you remember if you remember vaguely. It did mad when Mike died. It stormed rain hell or we was on my block under the thing it did. It's like a bro, he was talking to the heavens. All type of.

[Joe Budden]

I'm gonna tell you a cap story right now, and nobody's gonna believe me if you wasn't tuned in.

[Jermaine Dupri]

In.

[Joe Budden]

The Taliban took a day off for mj. I'm telling you. It was on CNN Impact saying, yo, I'm trying to tell y'.

[Jermaine Dupri]

All.

[Joe Budden]

Yo, yo, I'm.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Oh, my God.

[Jadakiss]

Let me hear this. I gotta hear you out, my brother.

[Joe Budden]

I'm just trying to tell you, cuz I'm not sure if everybody. I'm a CNN had. Whether they lied and it was propaganda or whatever it was. When MJ died, they said that the Taliban took a day off and they had them dancing around a boombox in the mountains. The Taliban was in there trying to do the Michael Jackson. MJ was the biggest in the world ever created.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Oh, Jesus Christ. Take a day off. It's great.

[Joe Budden]

CNN said the Taliban took a day off and they had them dancing around the box. I'm telling you.

[Jermaine Dupri]

I will say this, though, when I talk about, like, being on tour, Michael, it's hard for me to even have a conversation with people because they don't actually even be, like, wanting to believe what I saw, right? Like, you know, like Chris Brown, right? He got the thing where he, like. He's on the thing. He flying over.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, no. He's flying through the head.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah. Michael had a jet pack that he used to put on at the end of Billie Jean, and he flew out the stadium and left.

[Jadakiss]

No cap.

[Joe Budden]

You saw it. You saw it. Don't believe me.

[Jadakiss]

He was.

[Joe Budden]

I'm not gonna lie. I seen it.

[Jadakiss]

They got.

[Joe Budden]

My Dominican man, my brother, Omega. Fuel the man. Omega was the biggest, like, regular before, right? Telling you, he showed me it. He came to studio in Miami. Omega was big, but he dissed the Dominican government. They don't let him come over here no more. He came to us. He thought he. He was the first guy to say, I'm never going back. So he used to come in my studio all the time. Lamborghinis, Ferrari. Omega's the first. First big. Like, I don't want to say, but he was like a bad bunny at that time, right? Selling out Madison Square Guard. So he came one day and showed me that on YouTube or something, and he said he was going to do it. He said, I'm doing the stadium. I'm going to fly out the stadium. He said, you see Michael Jackson, he's flying out the stadium. He showed me the.

[Jadakiss]

Where did he land that?

[Jermaine Dupri]

He went back, it went back to the backstage and the car was back that way and they was gone.

[Jadakiss]

Who taught him how to do that?

[Jermaine Dupri]

I actually don't believe it was him. You know, I mean, I'm like, this is, this is a little dangerous, but.

[Joe Budden]

Every show going over, I'm not gonna lie to you. God bless Chris Brown trying to die on that thing. He not just flying in the air. He's like, you ever seen like little kids diving in a pool trying to crack their head? Like, dude, you like, like every time this guy's flying in the air doing fl 100 miles per hour. Chris Brown, like he believe in them wires or whatever he doing on that because he test the speed. I dare you. Test the speed of him and anybody else who did that. Chris Brown is doing it on st. Like he tr. I, I swear to God, I look at it and I'll be like, yo.

[Jermaine Dupri]

But he has to go that fast to get across this stadium. It's too big, man.

[Joe Budden]

I ain't doing none of that.

[Jadakiss]

Before we get out of here, we can't let you go without talking about health and wellness. You turn vegan. So some years ago got products, ice cream drinks and. Tell us about that.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, so I mean I've been VEGAN Almost, almost 25 years of the 23 years now.

[Joe Budden]

No chicken, huh?

[Jermaine Dupri]

No nothing.

[Joe Budden]

No chicken, no beef.

[Jadakiss]

Do you know what a vegan is?

[Joe Budden]

No. Pescetir. No, no, none of that.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Plants.

[Joe Budden]

Scott want to live a long time.

[Jermaine Dupri]

And I, and I, I actually, I actually went vegan. I was at Quincy Jones phone's house and Ray Charles. Ray Charles. So he was talking to Ray Charles and Ray Charles. This was Ray Charles on his death.

[Joe Budden]

Ray Charles.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Yeah, Ray Charles on his deathbed. And Quincy was paying all his bills on the doctor bills and Ray Charles called him from, from the hospital. Ray was like, quincy, I'm done. I'm just gone and die. And Q was like, no you're not. I'm paying for the best doctors and all of this to come over here. And they was having this crazy ass conversation on the phone and Rachel's like, nah, nah, we done all the girls. We done did. We done did it. We done, we done ate all the steaks we could possibly do. He was really like, he was like, I'm ready, I'm tired. I ain't gonna keep going through this. And Q was like, man, cjd, that's why you gotta take care of your health. Don't be doing no drugs. And he. When he told me that, it just was like, click. I gotta. I gotta kick in. Because, you know, I mean, I felt really, really. I felt bad because it was Ray Charles basically saying he was done and Q was trying to keep him alive. He was doing all he could do. But Ray Charles, you know, he was on heroin. He just. He. Whatever he was feeling, he was ready to go. But I. But it made me say I ain't ready to. You know, I ain't ready to go. And I sit in the studio so many hours, and we eat Waffle House and this, that, and third and all this. That ain't good for you. It ain't. It ain't good for you if you sitting around and you ain't doing no exercise.

[Joe Budden]

I'll be honest with you, man, if I can't eat a steak or no like that, check me out. What is it?

[Jermaine Dupri]

Rocco.

[Joe Budden]

Styles P. His brother took me to some in Miami. He was like, this is. I ran out of there, ate peanut butter crunch so fast.

[Jermaine Dupri]

And House.

[Joe Budden]

He said, look at you. You're walking in like you're mad. Yo, I must have walked in with the ice girl. I was like, Styles, my brother, he was like, look at this cucumber gazpacho. I was like, yo, I'm getting the out of here to that peanut butter cucumber so fast.

[Jermaine Dupri]

Oh, my God.

[Joe Budden]

I've been able to do a lot of things. I really don't. You know, I. I don't smoke. I don't really. I don't. I. I can't do eat.

[Jadakiss]

You can't eat?

[Joe Budden]

You gotta vegan, man. I got. I gotta. I gotta taste that. You know what I'm saying?

[Jadakiss]

With that being said, oh, my God.

[Joe Budden]

This ain't that and that ain't this.

[Jadakiss]

Yeah, it's cracking. Kiss. We want to thank our guest, Jermaine the Pre for coming on the Joya Royalty.

[Joe Budden]

The volume. Okay? Have you heard about this? Last year, degree changed the formula for their Cool Rush deodorant. Their fans rebelled and wanted the old sim back. And degree Listen, that doesn't happen often. They admitted that they effed up and are bringing the original Cool Rush scent back. And it's exactly how you remember it, Correct? Cool, crisp, and fresh. There's a reason it's the number one Manzani Purse Sprint, and it's back in Walmart. Target and other stores for under $4, so try it and see what the fuss is about. Head to your local stores to try the OG Cool rush for yourself.

[Jadakiss]

Making money moves should be easy. And that's why there's Cash App. It's fast, safe and honestly, just way more personalized than other apps out there. No extra hoops to jump through, no extra stress. All of the tools are right there to help you cash in.

[Joe Budden]

Plus, sending money with Cash App actually feels safe. They look out for you. If something seems sketchy or they see you might be sending money to a potential scammer, they'll warn you and make you think twice before you hit send. It's like having a personal bodyguard for your cash.

[Jadakiss]

You can even spice up your payments with custom tab text, stamps and backgrounds. Because why should paying your friend for brunch be so boring?

[Joe Budden]

If for whatever insane reason you don't already have Cash app, download it from your phone's app store, sign up and enter our code JoeJada in your profile. Send $5 to a friend and you'll get $10 just for getting it started.

[Jadakiss]

For a limited time only new Cash App users can use our exclusive code to earn some additional cash.

[Joe Budden]

For real?

[Jadakiss]

There's no catch. Just download Cash App and sign up. Use our exclusive referral code Joe Jada in your profile. Send $5 to a friend within 14 days and you'll get $10 dropped right into your account. Terms apply. That's money. That's Cash App.

[Ryan]

Every business has an ambition. PayPal open is the platform designed to help you grow into yours with business loans so you can expand. Expand and access to hundreds of millions of PayPal customers worldwide. And your customers can pay all the ways they want with PayPal, Venmo pay later and all major cards so you can focus on scaling up when it's time to get growing. There's one platform for all business PayPal Open grow today at PayPalOpen.com loans subject to approval in available locations Millions of people have turned to Claude, the AI assistant from Anthra, because it just feels different. Where other AIs often sound a little robotic, Claude has been designed with special research that informs its character, meaning that Claude just gets it when it comes to empathy and emotional intelligence. That's why Claude has become the if you know, you know, choice for dating advice, career coaching, gathering your thoughts for those important life decisions, and more. Give Claude a try for [e-mail] com that's C L A U D E Com and let us know how you feel the difference?