In Conversation: DAVID LONGSTRETH

Summary

Podcast Summary: Jokermen Podcast - In Conversation with David Longstreth

Episode Details:

• Title: In Conversation: DAVID LONGSTRETH
• Release Date: April 4, 2025
• Host: Ian (Jokermen Podcast)
• Guest: David Longstreth, the creative force behind Dirty Projectors

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Introduction to David Longstreth and His Latest Endeavor

Ian welcomes David Longstreth to the Jokermen Podcast, highlighting David's significant contributions to the music world, particularly through his work with Dirty Projectors. Ian expresses excitement about David's latest project, Song of the Earth, describing it as a "crazy, wild, huge, heavy, orchestral composed symphonic piece" (00:00). He praises the record as "one of the coolest, craziest, most unexpected, best records I've heard this whole year" (01:30), setting the stage for an in-depth discussion about its creation and impact.

The Genesis of Song of the Earth

David Longstreth delves into the origins of Song of the Earth, explaining that the project began as a collaboration with his German conductor friend, Andre Deritter, from the chamber music group Stargaze (04:45). The idea was to create a piece that melded orchestral and symphonic elements, a departure from David's usual rock-oriented work. He shares how the project was initially conceived during the COVID-19 pandemic when life circumstances, including his wife's pregnancy, influenced the timeline and his creative process (06:00).

Quote:
"It starts off as just a chamber music commission. And for me, there was something about that that was a little bit of a gauntlet thrown down to myself, which is like, can I make a piece of music that's not an album?" (06:30)

Influence of Mahler and Transition to Songwriting

David explains his inspiration drawn from Gustav Mahler's Das Lied von der Erde (Song of the Earth), highlighting its blend of orchestral song form and symphonic structure (07:50). He reflects on translating classical Chinese poetry with Buddhist themes into his work, aiming to capture the essence of nature and transformation without explicitly focusing on climate change.

Quote:
"I found that over the course of writing about just trying to do nature poetry, like Buddhist nature poetry, but write it kind of like, as me, I just found that like, this is weird. This is weird to write about mountains and trees and stuff." (08:50)

Evolution of the Project and Integration of Songs

Initially intended as a purely orchestral piece, David recounts how Song of the Earth evolved into a collection of songs. This transition occurred as he realized that his natural inclination was to write songs, leading him to merge orchestral compositions with lyrical elements. The result is an album that balances grand orchestral arrangements with accessible songwriting, creating a unique listening experience.

Quote:
"From late 2021 until when I finished it last year, I was trying to find the arc within that... It was really working on transitioning from a piece of concert music to a collection of songs." (09:30)

Recording and Performance Challenges

David discusses the complexities of scoring music for live performances, particularly the challenges of ensuring that orchestral scores are precise and executable by musicians unfamiliar with the piece. He contrasts this with the spontaneity of rehearsing with a band, where improvisation and "happy accidents" play a significant role.

Quote:
"With scored music, it's exactly the opposite. The score needs to say literally everything just complete, like written out instructions for people that you may have never met before." (14:21)

Collaborations and Artistic Influences

The conversation shifts to David's collaboration with Andre and the influence of conducting on his music. David praises Andre's ability to bring organic flow and emotional depth to the performances, contrasting it with the rigid structures often imposed by modern recording techniques.

Quote:
"The way Andre ebbs and flows with time was magical. It sounds, again, self-evident. Of course, music does flow organically. But so much of the music that we listen to that's recorded this century is recorded to a clock." (44:10)

David's Substack and Broader Creative Pursuits

David introduces his Substack, Well Tempered Zealot, explaining the play on words with Bach's The Well-Tempered Clavier. He shares how writing serves as a complementary process to his musical endeavors, allowing him to explore and articulate complex ideas that inform his compositions.

Quote:
"The pun doesn't really go anywhere about it, but I started liking that combination of words... writing invites me to drill down on, like, well, wait a minute, what exactly am I thinking about." (47:08)

Reflections on the Music Industry and Personal Optimism

Ian and David reflect on the current state of the music industry, touching upon San Francisco's evolving tech and artistic scene. David conveys a sense of optimism about the city's future despite recent challenges, emphasizing the sunlit beauty and the potential for artistic resurgence.

Quote:
"Time to be alive up here." (18:36)

Future Projects and Ongoing Creativity

Looking ahead, David hints at the possibility of expanding Song of the Earth into a four-part series, indicating that the project is far from complete. He expresses enthusiasm about future recordings, balancing the grandeur of orchestral works with more straightforward songwriting.

Quote:
"Maybe Song of the Earth is actually four parts. And I've just made the first one. That's how I've been feeling recently." (61:21)

Closing Thoughts and Highlighting Favorite Tracks

In the concluding part of the conversation, Ian shares his personal connection to the track "Gimme Bread," describing how it resonates deeply with him during everyday activities like cooking. David expresses appreciation for Ian's support and enthusiasm for the album.

Quote:
"Gimme Bread is just like, I can't... that song, man, just fucking knocks me on my ass every time." (62:52)

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Final Remarks: Ian wraps up the episode by encouraging listeners to experience Song of the Earth, performed by Dirty Projectors and Stargaze, praising its visionary and bold accomplishments that align perfectly with the spirit of the Jokermen Podcast.

Quote:
"Neither fantastic visionary, big, bold accomplishments. Exactly what we're always looking to listen to here on Jokerman." (67:34)

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Conclusion: This episode of the Jokermen Podcast offers an intimate glimpse into David Longstreth's creative process, exploring the intricate blend of orchestral composition and songwriting that defines Song of the Earth. Through thoughtful discussion and insightful quotes, listeners gain a deeper appreciation for the artistic journey behind this ambitious project and the collaborative efforts that bring it to life.

Transcript

[Ian]

Welcome back to Joker Men in Conversation. I'm Ian. Today, joined by making his first solo appearance on the Pod. He's come through several times with his brother Jake. It's David Longstreth, better known as the mastermind madman behind Jody Projectors, who are back today, actually, as this episode drops with their first record in several. Well, I say their first record. You'll hear a little bit about this in the Conversation. Dave is back with his first record, which may or may not exist exclusively under the Dirty Projectors aegis. A Song of the Earth, A Man. A crazy, wild, huge, heavy, orchestral composed symphonic piece. You know, it is not a rock record, if that's what you're coming in to expect. Although it does have, you know, touches clearly made by a rock musician. I think I would say one of the, honestly, like, coolest, craziest, most unexpected, best records I've heard this whole year. Big listen, big swing, but totally connects. Some of these songs are just unbelievable. Anyone, anyone who's been listening for a while knows that Dave's appearances on the program, some of the best that we ever get the pleasure of publishing. This one, this one hopefully lives up to his high standards on Jokerman podcast. Here's Dave. So I just. We all went to Tulsa the other day for Bob, you know, starting the.

[David Longstreth]

I saw. I saw some of the documentation of that.

[Ian]

It was hell of a. You ever been to Tulsa?

[David Longstreth]

No, I've never been.

[Ian]

It's, you know, it's quite a place. You should go. You should go. You know, it's interesting. I don't know that I'm planning to go back anytime soon, but, you know, for Bob's stuff alone in the center, it's cool. Yeah.

[David Longstreth]

Can I just. Can I pause there, please? So that's where his sort of archive is.

[Ian]

It is, yeah.

[David Longstreth]

And do we know why he put it in Tulsa?

[Ian]

It's a little mysterious. It's right next door. It's part of the same organization, actually, as the Woody Guthrie Archive, which has been there for years. Woody was born maybe an hour away in Okemah, Oklahoma, I think, and so that's why his shit is there. And from what I understand, I think Bob just kind of liked the idea of his archive being part of the same building, same organization as the Guthrie Archive.

[David Longstreth]

That's cool.

[Ian]

Paying tribute to, you know, to the man, one of the men at the root of it all. So anyways, but we're flying in to Tulsa and I've been listening to the record, you know, a lot. And specifically I've Found it to be like, an incredible experience to be listening to on an airplane, weirdly, which I'll maybe say a little bit more about shortly. But Tulsa was like, Oklahoma. Texas area has been going through a terrible drought for, like, the last several months. And those same winds that ripped through Los Angeles, you know, in January, not the Santa Ana's necessarily, but the same force of winds have been coming through that area these days. And so we're flying into Tulsa and I just start seeing smoke on the horizon there. And we get closer and closer, and there are. There's a second fire, third fire. I think by the time we landed, there were like five separate. Not huge conflagrations necessarily, but like five separate wildfires just, like, burning beneath the plane as we're coming down into Oklahoma. And I'm listening to the record as we're coming into it, and it's just like. I don't know, it felt so kind of essential and vivid and real all of a sudden. That's not necessarily the experience everyone's gonna have listening to the record, but for me, it just like, man, it hit so hard at that moment.

[David Longstreth]

Wow, that sounds very powerful.

[Ian]

It kind of speaks to where we're at today. Can you maybe just tell me, just talk about the genesis of the project for you, which began not as a record, but as, I think, the first live performances at Disney Hall. Right.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah. It started actually as a collaboration or an idea of a collaboration between my buddy Andre Deritter, who's a German conductor, and me a bunch of years ago. He has this group called Stargaze. It's kind of like an indie chamber music organization, chamber music ensemble. And, you know, every time I've gone over to Europe for the last decade or something, you know, we'll meet up for. For a coffee, and he'll be like, oh, David, we. We. We have to get you to write a piece for us. Or I'll be like, oh, man, I want to write something for you guys. And. And so it kind of came together during. During COVID where. Yeah, like, actually, Teresa, my wife, was. Was pregnant at the time, and. And I got this call from Andre and he was like, we're gonna. We got it together. You know, we got the commission together, so you can write this piece and we can premiere it at the Hamburg Elbphil Harmony in October of 2021. And I was so distracted with. With Teresa being pregnant at the.

[Ian]

Sure.

[David Longstreth]

That I was kind of like, oh, okay, yeah, that sounds great. Awesome, awesome news. And then I kind of forgot about It. And, and then. So, yeah, I really, I really kind of came at it when, when Alma had just been born and she was, she was a newborn. It was the first thing I did when I sort of got back to work after, yeah, three months or so. But. But yeah, I think the original idea was kind of like, for some reason I had been. The idea was kind of like a tracing of this Mahler orchestral song called Daslied von der Erde, the Song of the Earth, which was Mahler's last big, maybe last completed work, full stop. And for Mahler, this was a union of the, of the, of the two main forms that he had worked on over the course of his life. The, the, the orchestral song and then the, the symphonic form, you know, and he wanted to draw these into some kind of unity. The libretto, the words for Dasli von der Erde are these contemporary German translations of classical Chinese poetry. And so they are. The words are sort of Buddhist and circular and yes, suffused with, oh, like a sense of like, longing around. Maybe longing is exactly the opposite of what it is, but anyway, some sort of focus on transition state change, you know, moving from life to death or, you know, from decay into rebirth. And there's like a lot of nature imagery. There's a lot of, you know, the, the leaf falls from the branch and, and lands on the, on the mirror, like, surface of the lake. And so I wasn't even, you know, when I, when I came to it, I wasn't thinking about like, oh, what I'm. I'm going to write about climate change, you know, sure, it sounds like a terrible idea, but I found that over the course of. Yeah, like, writing about, just trying to kind of like do nature poetry, you know, do, do, you know, Buddhist, Buddhist nature poetry, but write it kind of like, as, as me, I just, I found that like, this is weird. This is weird to write about mountains and trees and stuff like that.

[Ian]

Sure.

[David Longstreth]

And so anyway, long, long, long winded answer of saying it just kind of happened.

[Ian]

It's. I mean, it's kind of unexpected to me, to be honest. Like, you know, it's fucking. I guess I haven't said this yet to you. It's amazing. This is like one of the best records I've listened to in quite some time. And I'm like, honestly kind of like. Because I'll be honest, like, when, when I see this isn't the first time we've had like, you know, indie rocker, which. I'm using that phrase in big quotation marks for lack of A better term does something kind of outside, different, big picture, moving into classical. And sometimes when you see that, you're like, ah, this is gonna be. I don't know about this. It might be biting off a little more than can chew. And this is just like. I mean, man, the first time I listened to it and everything kind of comes together and hits in Gimme Bread. I was just like, holy shit. This is like. This is happening for me.

[David Longstreth]

Oh, man. Thank you so much. That means a lot to me and I'm really glad that you connect with it. That's awesome.

[Ian]

I mean, it feels bracing and real and vital, per the experience I was just talking about earlier. But just on a musical level, it fucking rocks also. I don't know. Is this something that you like? Because this is very different than BT orca. Swing Low, you know, rise above anything. Like, is this like something you felt like you were working towards over time or ever had in your mind as something you were going to achieve? Or is it. You know, did you kind of surprise you?

[David Longstreth]

I think maybe both. Maybe both. I think I always had it kind of going, like, in the back of my head, something like this. Like, you know, I studied some. Some orchestration in college and. Excuse me. Yeah, I studied orchestration in college and I had a spell maybe in. In high school where, you know, I was just obsessed with. With. With classical music, you know, and that's like the stuff that I was really, really into for a couple years. Just like instrumental, you know, know, scored music and so, you know, and actually, like, sometimes, like, just figuring out what the arrangement is all about for any song, and it might end up in a totally different place. But sometimes I'll write just kind of like. Kind of like a scored version of the arrangement just to see, like, what are the parts again? And like, what's. What's. What does it do? What can it do? What does it not need, actually, maybe that kind of thing. So it's a. It's like, to make like, scored music has been. It's been part of it for me, but I think. I think it, you know, maybe like. I get what you mean too, that this record is like a little bit. It feels like a left turn or a little, little bit, you know, And I think Covid. I think that's. I blame Covid.

[Ian]

Finally something good came out of that shit.

[David Longstreth]

Just like being so many months deep in. In just like isolation or whatever, and just being like, well, whatever, Like, I'm just gonna make this orchestral record.

[Ian]

Sure. Did you like. So you. You Were talking a moment about a moment ago about like, writing music. Is this. Is there like a whole, like. Is this written in, like, class? Is there like a big booklet of like, all the music written on paper for this?

[David Longstreth]

Oh, yeah, yeah. Wow.

[Ian]

Yeah, I guess there has to be, right? Because you've been performing this with orchestras.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, yeah. There's two versions of it. There's the chamber version, which is basically what the album is, which is like. Yeah, chamber ensemble. I think it's like 14 musicians. And then there's the version that we rescored for LA Phil, which is like, you know, whole big orchestral, like sort of explode. Like taking the chamber version and exploding it and. Yeah, I mean, also, like, at the same time that I was working on. On this, I was making this movie score for my friend Isaiah. And so all of a sudden I didn't expect this to happen. But like. Yeah, like, coming out of COVID and like the tail end of COVID coming out of was just like all orchestral music for me all the time. And the experience of like, scoring, because the score for Isaiah's movie is like, very kind of like. Yeah, it's just like traditional orchestral kind of score and so. And that really sort of like got my. My focus up about just like what a score needs to do in order to be like, truly playable. Yeah. It's crazy. Making scores is insane. It's crazy.

[Ian]

It seems in, like impossibly challenging to me, you know, as sort of an idiot myself.

[David Longstreth]

It's just a different skill set. But it's like crazy because, like, you know, when you're. When in rehearsing a band or something, the I. The. The real focus is getting it into muscle memory, you know, just playing it until it feels really good. And, you know, maybe you're playing it so that you can seize some sort of happy accident along the way and embed that into the. The structure of the arrangement or something like that. But I mean, as you can imagine. Yeah. Just with scored music, it's. It's exactly the opposite. Like, the score needs to say literally.

[Ian]

Everything just complete, like written out instructions for people that you may have never met before.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah. So that like, you know, on the first note, they're just playing it, like, absolutely correctly. It's just a very different. Different ethic. Yeah. It's crazy.

[Ian]

Is the, Is the score for the movie a David Longstreth score? Is it a dirty projector score?

[David Longstreth]

It's David Longstreth.

[Ian]

It's David Longstreth. And this is Dirty projectors.

[David Longstreth]

This Is David Longstreth performed by Dirty Projectors and Stargaze. I wonder if convoluted, but it feels kind of reflective of what it is.

[Ian]

Well, I wonder if you can maybe explain how you're. Because I just, you know, we're taping this a couple days after this fantastic New Yorker profile written by Anna Weiner, who wrote a great book, Uncanny Valley. Yeah.

[David Longstreth]

And also a resident of the Bay Area.

[Ian]

Yeah, I met her actually when we were up at the Point Reyes shows and I didn't even realize that was her time, but when we were all hanging out after one of those shows, we were talking a little bit about the Jews thing that we did earlier this year and she was. We were talking to her about that, but I didn't even realize that was who it was. It's, you know, kind of small world. I read that book, you know, when it came out a couple years ago. Fantastic book.

[David Longstreth]

Isn't it a good book?

[Ian]

Yeah, it's so good. It feels like the, you know, I don't know, like already kind of nostalgic, you know, and maybe that's the wrong word for it, but like the, the world that she paints there, which is like a 2010s memoir of like, you know, tech startup scene in San Francisco, like that already feels completely gone and consigned to the past, probably for the best, to be honest.

[David Longstreth]

That's it. I mean, I have questions about that. I want to ask you about that.

[Ian]

I would love to answer them for you.

[David Longstreth]

Well, yeah, I mean, so as. As a. As a resident of the. Of the Bay, do you live in sf?

[Ian]

Yeah, San Francisco proper.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, right there. So, yeah, I mean, her book sort of charts. I wouldn't exactly call it the sort of wild eyed optimism of the beginning of the moment or anything like that, but her, her arc is roughly one of like interest and curiosity and good faith to one of realizing or just coming to terms that it's just dystopian bullshit.

[Ian]

Yeah. Disillusionment.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Which, like. Yeah, but are you saying, are you saying it feels nostalgic in that a lot of just that startup moment altogether is just gone?

[Ian]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I guess nostalgia, you know, maybe has too warm of a connotation to it. It just like that. I think the world that she describes in that book already feels so far gone from what reality is today. Which, you know, Lord knows there's still plenty of techies and bullshit up here, but like a lot of that, fortunately, thank God, has like kind of been again the bubble the bubble part of it is bubble popped. You know, a lot of the people that were here just for jobs and to be tech, you know, addled assholes have been there in Austin, they're in New York, they're fucking wherever. And you know, I kind of feel like. I feel like the city's, you know, due for a come up at this point. I'm excited to be here these days.

[David Longstreth]

Whoa. I'm hearing some tentative optimism about the bay.

[Ian]

Yeah, you know, I know, I know it's hard to, hard to believe, especially with what you read in the. The lying fake news media these days. But listen, man, it's like 62 and sunny out there. The wind is blowing, the sun is shining. I was like picking weeds in my front yard today. It's beautiful. Time to be alive up here.

[David Longstreth]

Oh, I love to hear it.

[Ian]

I know Jake lived here. Did you live here for a while?

[David Longstreth]

I never did, no. Yeah, Jake was up there for art school and a few years after, but. And I would go and hang with him, visit with him. And our parents are, you know, up north of there. But no, and actually Teresa, my wife, always talks about, she's a Northern California person and she's always like, I. Or she says, like, I always imagined that I would live in San Francisco at some point. It's like the city of my mind, she says. And just, you know, the moment of her grow, you know, growing up coincided with, with the tech explosion and the explosion of like rents and the, and the exodus of artists that everyone, you know, that everyone associates with the city now.

[Ian]

Yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, the scene that was here, there was a great scene, like 2010ish of girls obviously came out of that John Dwyer and the OC's scene, Castle Face stuff. And like, that's just all gone.

[David Longstreth]

Nobody, none of those guys live there. Yeah, my buddy, my buddy Kyle Thomas King tough opened for Ty Seagal on their tour of the west coast recently. And they played in some crazy beautiful theater in SF proper. And Kyle was like, yeah, it's just sort of strange. Like, you know, Ty came up in sf, but, you know, he doesn't live there anymore. None of his crew lives there anymore. It's just.

[Ian]

Yeah, I think it's just kind of generational and like, I'm sure that there's gonna be. There is already probably a new wave of, you know, kids and bands and stuff that are being put together that I think is gonna lead to something at some point. But you know, we're, we're aged out of it. At this point.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I love the optimism. Yeah.

[Ian]

You know, you gotta try to be optimistic about something these days.

[Unknown]

For the greatest will be bent in our cake with a coin to take heritable utopia my apples are put on is a bridge to what I become.

[Ian]

Where were we? I was gonna.

[David Longstreth]

We were talking about Anna Weiner. Talking about. Oh, yeah, the New Yorker profile. Yeah.

[Ian]

So in the profile, you know, part of. There's tons of stuff. There's actually a couple points that I would love to touch on about that. That I didn't even know. You know, going into that. You know, part of the profile touches on kind of the amorphous, evolving nature of the entity that exists as Dirty Project. You know, like, we were just talking about, you know, the David Longstar score for the movie. This is. This is Dirty Projectors performs David Longstar. I wonder if you can just kind of, I don't know, to the best of your ability, explain how you conceive of yourself under your name versus the Dirty Projector's, you know, umbrella.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, I mean, I really have no good. I really have no good answer for it.

[Ian]

Perfect.

[David Longstreth]

Oh, I think you're catching me at a moment where hopping from one lily pad to another a little bit. You know, I guess I think that there were. I. I started Dirty Projectors, you know, way, way back in the turn of the century, really. And there were. I don't know. I can't really, like, speak credibly to how aware I was of. I was aware of the microphones. Maybe I'd heard of the Mountain Goats, you know, these sort of, like, home recording projects that presented as bands, you know, that sort of, like, cheekily had the name of what would be a band, but it was actually just one dude with some headphones and a Tascam Porter studio. And so that, you know, that's the way I thought of Dirty Projectors. And when I started putting bands together, it seemed like I really had this vision of just like, I wanna. I wanna. I wanna, like, cover the waterfront. I just want to have an absurdly, like, broad, like. Like canvas musically, you know, I wanna. I wanna. I wanna make, like, string quartets. And then I wanna make fast, you know. You know, power trio records with the. With the fucking Fender Champs turned up to 11. I want to. And I. And I just figured that it would put together different groups based on what I was into at the time. And, you know, that's what I'm. That's what I've done. And I think with. With calling this record David Longstreth, performed by Dirty Projectors and Stargaze. I think it sort of like. It speaks to the kind of, like, circuitous path that these songs have taken into being becoming an album. You know, the fact that this started off as this. As just like a chamber music commission. And for me, like, there was something about that that was a little bit of a gauntlet thrown down to myself, which is like, can I make a piece of music that's not an album? Can I make some. Can I make some music that aren't songs? You know? And so I intended it to be a kind of like, you know, a piece of concert music for this group, Stargaze.

[Ian]

Interesting. Yeah. I mean, the reference point that I. And maybe it's just because I'm in Beach Boys world these days, but, like, the rep. One of the reference points that I have for this, that is like, the clearest connection. And it's not a clear connection at all, really, but, like, you know, like Smile, for instance, you know, Brian and Van Dyke, where it's just this kind of flowing piece, and, like, I'm listening to it on itunes or whatever, and it's got, you know, individual tracks chopped up. You can listen to this one, that one, whatever. But, like, that's not really what's going on here. Right. You really should just press play and listen from beginning to end. And, yeah, I mean, it seems like such a different kind of muscle to me, you know, to stretch and. And so knowing that, like, Dirty Projectors as avant garde, interesting, confrontational as. As any Dirty Projectors record has ever been, it, like, none of them really bear any resemblance to, you know, this.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, I think it is the way to listen to the record top, top to bottom. I mean, you can listen to it however you want. You know, you can. You can just put it on Raised Brow, the very last song, if you want to, but that's how I'm thinking of it. Yeah. Yeah. And there's. It's a little bit cheeky to break it up the way I did at some points, but also, you know, it's intended a little bit to help people find their way in to what could be a sort of dense and forbidding thing otherwise, you know, so. But, yeah, I mean, yeah, I love the Smile reference. And for me, like, that actually, to me, like, that is really the way I found my way into an interest in. In scored music in the. In the. In the first place is through Pet Sounds and. And the myth of Smile I never heard. I could not find Smile as a Teenager. I had only Smiley Smile, which I love.

[Ian]

Sure.

[David Longstreth]

But through Pet Sounds. Through Pet Sounds and Revolver and sergeant Pepper and just being fascinated by, like, whoa. Like a Clavic chord, you know, on, like, four. No. 1, the Beatles song, you know, or being like, you know. Oh, like, Brian is using, like, an English horn. He's doubling an English horn with a harmonica. Like, that's such a crazy sound, you know.

[Ian]

Sure.

[David Longstreth]

And the idea of using these tonal colors to express these sort of, like, interior truths, you know, that really hit me when I was a teenager. And so just kind of, like, casting about for other music like that. For some reason, I didn't. You know, like, I. I started with the Beatles and the Beach Boys, and from there to explore, like, the Zombies or like, the Left bank or something. Didn't feel. It wasn't, like. That wasn't leveling me up. That wasn't a stronger, you know, dosage of this thing. And for some reason, I fell into. I found these Mahler songs, you know, not. Not Song of the Earth at that time, because that one was too crazy for me, but the songs of the Wayfarer and this thing called Ruckert Leader, the settings of this poet named.

[Ian]

Yeah. Ruckert.

[David Longstreth]

So in a way, yeah. I mean, I'm telling this very elliptically, but. So after this first premiere of the first version of Song of the Earth in Hamburg, Germany, I kind of took a step back from the whole thing, and I felt like, as a piece of chamber music, if that's what this is, I don't know if it's. I don't know what to think of it. I don't know if it succeeds or fails. I don't really know. I don't have a strong sense of, you know, of where I landed with it.

[Ian]

Interesting.

[David Longstreth]

But. But if I think about it in terms of, yeah, my Sort of, like, North Star, then I can see that this. This thing isn't done yet. And so after that first premiere is when I had this sense of, like, to bring it back to what you were saying. 1. As a. As a. As a piece of music that. That starts somewhere and ends in a different place. The arc. The arc is not right. And then as a. As a collection of songs, and I was, like, trying not to make songs, but it was really sort of me being like, oh, you know what? I write songs. And, like, I tried to not make these songs, but they are songs. So just letting them turn back into songs and then finding the arc within that is. Was the work really of, like. Of like, you know, from. From late 2021 until when I finished it last year.

[Ian]

Interesting. So this is different than it was. Different music. Some different music at least than it was in the initial Homburg performance.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, it. Yeah, there's a bunch of stuff that I. That I axed. That I killed. I rewrote or. Excuse me, I wrote a bunch of new stuff, and then I rewrote a lot of what was there, and then just sort of. I had to, like, it was like a puzzle that was put together wrong, you know, so. So, yeah, there's a lot of. Just a lot of judging.

[Ian]

You said you didn't know how you succeeded or whether you succeeded initially. And like, now. I mean, now with this. And you're doing these performances at Disney Hall. I was talking to Jake at one point about it. He said that, like, they were just fucking unbelievable. Do you feel like you succeeded at this point?

[David Longstreth]

I. I mean, this is weird to. To say. And it comes against the backdrop of, like. You know, most times when I finish a record, I really am like, what is that? You know, there's a. And it makes sense later. But often. Often when I. When I finish an album, it's a bewildering experience. And this one, you know, for better or worse, I followed it through. I followed all the threads through to the end, so I have a better sense of where. I feel good about it. Yeah. I feel good about it. Yeah.

[Ian]

That's great. Is this going to. Is this gonna be performed again?

[David Longstreth]

Ah, it's a good. I mean. Okay, good question. It's a good question. How would you. How do you want to see. How would. Do you want to see it live? And how would you imagine it?

[Ian]

That's a good question. I mean, I want to hear some of the music live, certainly. I mean, I would love to see the whole thing, you know, I would have loved to have been one of those Disney hall shows, you know, when it. When was that? Last fall? Last summer or something like that?

[David Longstreth]

It was last March. It was about a year ago.

[Ian]

About a year ago.

[David Longstreth]

Exactly a year ago, yeah.

[Ian]

Wow. Okay. I mean, that would have been amazing. Obviously expensive to put a show like that on, I would imagine. I do feel. I mean, you were talking about this a moment ago, like, you know, you ended up accidentally writing songs for this, even though you didn't necessarily mean to write songs. And I feel like a lot of this music could work. Would work kind of pulled out. Pulled out of context and presented live in whatever fashion. You know, Whatever fashion. I mean, the shows I don't know if you've played more shows recently, but I don't think so. But, like, you know, the. The Point Reyes stuff you did where it was literally, it was just like, you just like, recreating all of BT ORCA or Swing Low.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah.

[Ian]

Crazy to me that you're able to just do that.

[David Longstreth]

I ended up feeling what those point. Like, I assumed that everyone would understand that that's like a perverse thing to do.

[Ian]

Yeah. I mean that. I thought that was kind of. The point is, like, how radically can I demake these incredibly complex, just like knotted records just by myself with an acoustic guitar and a piano?

[David Longstreth]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, maybe it's that way. I think that, you know, it's tricky. It's tricky to put Song of the Earth on. We're in conversation with, you know, some, like, institutional. I had this weird idea where, you know. Well, in the New York article, I'm talking about this idea that, like. Oh, like, maybe uncertainty and fucking terror about what we're doing to the planet is actually the sort of subtext of a lot of movies and songs and books and whatever right now. And it's like, not the. It's not what the. What the thing is ostensibly about, but it's just. It's. It's the. It's the sort of animating, you know, beating heart of the. Of the thing just below the surface. So. And I'm, like, distrustful of. Of, like, things that announce their subject. You know what I mean? Because it seems either like it's gonna be something quite shallow where there simply is no subtext.

[Ian]

Right.

[David Longstreth]

Really driving it along, or the subtext is actually something that's not what we're being told it is. And so. And I feel I'm. I'm a little bit wary of this with Song of the Earth because again, in my mind, I kind of, like, I was cut side. Sort of like, I'm remaking this Mahler thing from 100 years ago. That's what I'm doing. And then through just following that idea where it went, oh, this is actually maybe about fire and. And climate and all this stuff. And then the way. The way that I'm talking about it on podcasts and stuff like this, like, you know. Yeah, like, were. It's being treated as though this is the text. Climate is the text of Song of the Earth. And like, hey, in the case of the David Wallace Wells song, which is the first song that we put out. It is. It is. But so I'm also a little bit like, all right, if that's the. If that is now the text of the. Of the album, what is the subtext?

[Ian]

What's the subtext? Interesting.

[David Longstreth]

And I've begun to think that maybe the subtext of the record is actually the fragility of institutions.

[Ian]

Huh?

[David Longstreth]

But maybe I'm only thinking about that because, yeah, we're talking to various institutions, you know, we require these institutions to put this show on, or at least that's how we're trying to crack the nut so far, you know. And so we're talking to various orchestras and sort of presenting. Presenting bodies in various cities in the United States and Europe. And it's just these places seem so fragile. And so, you know, they've got the best of intentions, but it's very difficult to do anything, to make anything happen on any kind of a time frame, man. And so it's an interest. It's a bracing encounter. It's.

[Ian]

Yeah, I mean, it sounds like it.

[David Longstreth]

It's a bracing encounter.

[Ian]

Fragility of institution. That's. You know, we don't. We don't need to go too political here, but that's a relevant concept in. In many arenas of modern life, for better or for worse these days.

[David Longstreth]

I don't know what.

[Unknown]

I want that I want that I want that I want that I want that I want that I want that I want that I want that I want that I want that.

[Ian]

It sounds. I mean, it seems to me, you know, the music here, and judging by what you were saying a moment ago, you know, the text of the music is what it is at certain points throughout. But, like, you know, what you're talking about with some of the Brian stuff, Beatles stuff, I get the sense that, like, part of the enjoyment and fulfillment in making a record like this was kind of playing with a different, you know, like, different palette, you know, going into watercolors instead of oil paints, to use an analogy. And so, like, instead of just. Just like guitar, bass, drums or whatever, you know, organ, keyboard, you know, maybe the odd trumpet. Like, this is all new kind of. Or not new, but different, I should say, you know, tools to make the. To make the record. Was that part of it?

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, yeah, for sure. I love the. I love the colors of. Of the orchestra. You know, I love also not to like, maybe overuse this concept. Maybe there's a better word for it. I don't know. The. The specificity of these acoustic instruments. You know, they're string. They're a string quintet, you know, and they can play. They have different techniques. There's different bowing techniques. There's Soul Tosto, you know, there's, there's, you know, there's just a. There's like a pizzicato. There's. There's. I'm so brain. I'm very brain dead right now.

[Ian]

Listen, you could be making all this up and I would just be sitting here nodding my head like, yep, he knows what he's talking about.

[David Longstreth]

There's no, you know, and there's something, you know, these, these sort of like creaky, you know, handmade instruments that were sitting that we're going to arrange together in a pattern in a room. And there's something so rich ritual, I guess, so ancient about it that I think is, really, is really, really special, you know, and the idea that it's really down to people's ability to listen and respond to one another, to become a unit, a cooperative unit in bringing this music to life. And that. And that, you know, the word the notes on the page might be a given, but within that there's a world to be made just by the spirits of the people involved in the making is an idea that. And like, you know, on the one hand that's so self evident, like that's what music is, right? It's like people sitting next to each other and playing together, listening and responding to one another. But yeah, there's something about chamber music and I guess specifically like, you know, acoustic in this way that really, that really sort of like strips everything else away. That being there with Stargaze, the chamber group that I recorded with made just made that so starkly clear to me. How. Yeah, it just, it felt so fresh and like, also I do. I had this. I had a bit of an experience just watching Andre. You know, I've known Andre for a super long time at this point. I think we met in Australia in like 2010 or something like that. But watching him conduct this music, I think it was a quiet revelation for me in the sense of maybe just zooming out a little bit before making this record. Probably the prior, I don't know, close to 10 years of music that I've been working on, recording, you know, collaborating on other people, doing some sort of like co writing, co producing this kind of thing. When you're recording and when you're writing, the grid of the. Of Pro Tools or whatever, the program you're recording in is just taken for granted. And the grid is a, is a clock, it's a metronome. It's rationally divided time. And to be recording this music without A metronome. And for Andre's conducting to be a huge feature of the dimension of the music was. It took me by surprise, the way he ebbed and flowed with time was magical. And it sounds, again, self evident. Of course, music does. This music flows organically. But like, so much of the music that we listen to that's recorded this century is recorded to a clock.

[Ian]

Click track.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, click track. And this feature of music to ebb and flow is like. Has been. You know, I'm gonna sound like kind of like conspiracy theorist or something, but it's been. It's been suppressed. It's been suppressed.

[Ian]

Human doesn't want you to know about it.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's being redacted, you know, from the conversation. And so anyway, that's a huge feat that. I don't know even how I started talking about that, but, like, to me, the way time moves on this album is like one of the most exciting things about it. And that's. And that's all. That's all. Andre de Ritter.

[Ian]

Wow. I mean, that's a fascinating concept because, like, you know, listen, I'm going to reveal myself as just a complete oaf doofus about classical music. Anything that's like, composed and conducted and stuff. But I've always, you know, I've seen some orchestras and stuff, and I'm aware, you know, like Dudamel, for instance, is like, universally regarded as, like, the conductor of the moment. At least he's leaving Los Angeles for New York, I think, next year. But, you know, I gotta confess, I've always kinda wondered like, you know, what are they really doing up there with their little. But hearing you talk about it now, you know, I feel like I'm starting to get a bit of a sense for it.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, I mean, you know, I don't even. I don't know that much about it myself. And I mean, yeah, like there. I remember reading a quote from Verdi, who was like a, you know, Italian opera composer in the second half of the 19th century. I remember reading this quote from him where he's writing a letter to somebody and I think he's maybe an old man at this point, but he's sort of incredulous about the idea that, like. And the audience even applauded for the conductor. He thought it was ridiculous. So at some point, you know, like an orchestra, or when it was maybe smaller, was just feeling its own internal time and it was more anarchic or it was more egalitarian. You know, at some point, probably when the orchestra got to a Certain size, somebody was like, no, we need to have somebody, you know, beating out the time.

[Ian]

Sure.

[David Longstreth]

But yeah, it's like the interpretation. The interpretation. And yeah, I think it's a big. Watching Andre, I was like, oh, this is, this is a big thing.

[Ian]

Start again. Yeah, this is Real tempered Zealot.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah.

[Ian]

What does that mean?

[David Longstreth]

I don't. Well, I don't know. What.

[Ian]

Okay.

[David Longstreth]

What does it mean to you?

[Ian]

I, you know, it's an interesting. So I'm. You've started a substack. Everyone's moving to substack these days. And that's the title of it. And you've been posting fantastic stuff on there, I gotta say.

[David Longstreth]

Oh, thanks.

[Ian]

It's. I mean, sitting here just talking with you, it's an enjoyable experience because you kind of just like your speech almost kind of sounds like a dirty projector song. And so I'm just kind of moving in unexpected interesting directions at a moment's notice. And I feel like you're reproducing that on the substack. Is that, I guess, just what's the drive there?

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, well, to start with the title of it, to me it's, you know, it's sort of a. It's a riff on well Tempered Clavier. You know, this cycle of piano music in all 48 keys that Bach did. You know, right around the sort of like, as I understand it, the moment when tonality was being codified. I think Bach almost did it as like a show, as a showpiece. Like, listen, you can write in any key. You can write in any one of these keys. 12 major keys, 12 minor keys. This is what the piano. This is what the well tempered Clavier can do. And, and like, yes, a well tempered in that context has to do with like, yeah, like temperament as opposed. Well tempered as opposed to just, just intonation and this kind of thing. And, and I, Yeah, I love that idea also though of just like temper, temperament and like equanimity. And so there's. It's kind of a pun that just doesn't go anywhere about. Yeah, like, you know, Bach representing the entire universe of possibility, the breadth, a full, a full scope of the range of expressible things, you know, almost in this well tempered Clavier. And then just, you know, juxtaposing that with the idea of a zealot. So anyway, yeah, I just, the, the pun doesn't really go. It's not really a pun because it doesn't really go anywhere. But I don't know, I started liking that combination of, of. Of Words. And then, yeah, like, you know, I often have no idea what I think until I start writing it down, you know, and writing it down really. Really invites me to drill down on, like, well, wait a minute, what exactly am I thinking about? And things like word choice start to matter, and sort of a sequence of thoughts can be. Can be. Can be put together, or thoughts can be put into a sequence that moves, you know, from one place to another. I just. I love that about writing. And so, you know, well tempered Zealot is just a place where I'm sharing a little bit of that, you know?

[Ian]

I love it. It's as. As someone who, you know, I've done my fair share of writing, and I'm trying to get my ass off the ground on Substack two. It's like, such a man. Writing can be such a bitch sometimes, I gotta say.

[David Longstreth]

It takes so long.

[Ian]

It's so much work. It is so much work compared to. I mean, this is. I love doing this, but, like, you know, you and I getting on the horn and just, like, hanging for an hour or so, like, is so much easier than, like, trying to write. Like, I get an hour's worth of writing about this record versus an hour's worth of this conversation. Like, you get so much more of the conversation, and it's just. I love it. I love writing it, but it's. Man, it just fucking, like, pounds me down sometimes.

[David Longstreth]

It takes so long. It takes so long, and it's. Yeah, it can be so hard, but part of me is sort of like. Well, yeah, like, it's hard. It's hard. It's hard to figure out what you think. It's. It's difficult. I mean, you know, I don't know. Yeah. I mean, for. For me to be. For me to be just, you know, for us to be talking, you know, extemporaneously for. For this length of time. Maybe you get a range. Maybe you get a more nuanced sense of. I mean.

[Ian]

Yeah.

[David Longstreth]

Speaking is different than writing. I guess that's all I'm saying. I like writing, I think, also because it's so difficult. And I saw. Yeah. I mean, I saw your substack about. About fashion.

[Ian]

Mm.

[David Longstreth]

I saw one entry. I was like, oh, man, I love this.

[Ian]

You know, trying to. Trying to branch out. Trying to expand the presence out there.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah. You were talking about pants, and I was like, I need to think more about pants.

[Ian]

I've started doing that, you know, the last couple years, and it's just been sort of like, it's a New wormhole for me to go down. Just the same way that like, you know, I'm talking about every shitty Beach Boys has been. It's a dangerous game.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

Just over breath.

[Ian]

Okay. The Kanye thing. What, where, how, when, what was it like?

[David Longstreth]

So that started. I forget exactly how. I think my manager at the time was. Was kind of buddies with. With Rick Rubin.

[Ian]

Sure.

[David Longstreth]

And so it started with me just going out to Rick's house.

[Ian]

Shangri La.

[David Longstreth]

His house, not the studio. It wasn't Shangri La. It was like his house. Got it and just like sitting there and we would like listen to some mute. Like for me it was like early versions of Lamplit Prose and the self titled record. I was making those two albums at the same time and just listening to those things and just talking. And from what I remember, it was like we mainly talked about the Beatles. I think we mainly talked about the Beatles because, you know, yeah, Rick loves the Beatles and. And then, yeah, at one point he, you know, he was. He was maybe executive producing what. What Kanye was working on and he was sort of like, would you want to, you know, see if you could help out what they're working on? Yeah. Oh, yeah. So that's how. How it happened. But, you know, I don't know. I really, I don't. I really don't need to talk about Kanye.

[Ian]

That's fair. It's a touchy subject these days.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Ian]

What's your impression of Rick? I've always been kind of like, you know, you hear some people and they're like, this guy is brilliant. He's, you know, one of the great musical thinkers of the last. However long. You talk to other people and they're like, you know, it's sort of a put on. You've worked with the guy, you know, I feel like he's got sort of a heavy aura, kind of heavy vibe to him.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, no, I think that's right. Well, actually, when we were talking about conducting earlier, I was thinking of. Exactly. I wasn't thinking about Rick specifically, but I was thinking about the role that a producer can or can't play. You know, May or may not play. I guess is a better way of saying that.

[Ian]

Sure.

[David Longstreth]

So my experience of Rick is just that he, He. How can I put it? He, he. In talking. I think when the, when the subject went around to. To like, yeah, you know, songs that I had in progress or things like that and, and he would maybe ask me a question and then I would talk about it. He. He sort of allowed me to see in the silence around what I was saying, this sounds so trippy, but maybe just in. In. In his role as a. As a. As a. As a. Is this Socratic dialogue where you only respond in questions? Is that what Socratic dialogue is? In his role as somebody, as a conversationalist? And, you know, there's a certain kind of selflessness maybe that he's able to take on that just allows you to see more about, you know, what your whole kind of thing is at that moment, if that makes any sense.

[Ian]

Yeah, I mean, it almost kind of sounds similar to the way you were describing writing. Like, sometimes I don't know what I'm thinking and I have to write in order to figure it out. Like being in dialogue with Rick or maybe having him ask you questions and then searching for answers. Like, it almost kind of seems like a similar mental process to me.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think. I think so. Yeah. Where. And if I had to describe a distinction between the two, if writing is really about drilling down on. Drilling deeper into specificity of an idea or of a concept. I think what I took from these conversations with Rick, and I haven't spoken to him in many years, not for any reason, but we just fallen out of each other's orbit or whatever.

[Ian]

Yeah, sure.

[David Longstreth]

People just. Was this. Was this more like a zooming out rather than a zooming in. You can see. Oh, man. To me, this album is the whole world right now. And then. But wait a minute. Like, now I can see, like, this is based on a set of ideas or assumptions that are themselves, you know, locust in. In a. In. In a particular region. You know, this is quite small, truly. And maybe that's good, or maybe. Maybe I can open it up, you know, so, you know, I. Yeah, I mean, I think that. Yeah, I think that he's very. I think that he's very. I. You know, I think that he's. He's. He's the real deal, basically. I guess. I guess that.

[Ian]

Yeah, I mean, the results speak for themselves, you know, right down the line from American recording, the Johnny Cash stuff, to Yeezus, to, like. I mean, the Last Strokes record, for instance, you know, which came out at the beginning of COVID I think it was probably the best thing they put out in 15 years. And, you know, it's coming.

[David Longstreth]

I need to spend time with that. What's that called?

[Ian]

The New Abnormal. Terrible title. The COVID is literally just a Basquiat painting, which, you know, Basquiat is a great artist, obviously, but, like, it. It doesn't even say the Strokes. It's just like a detail of a Basquiat paint, has, like, no relation whatsoever.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah.

[Ian]

And it came out, I think, honestly, like, I don't know, April 2020. So, like, really, like, the worst possible time for anything to come out.

[David Longstreth]

Right.

[Ian]

But it's. It's got some bangers on it. It's got some bops.

[David Longstreth]

Wow. And have the Strokes put out an album since then?

[Ian]

Nope, that was it. That was fucking half a decade ago. Wow. Yeah, that was.

[David Longstreth]

I mean, that was a similar experience to. To the Dirty Projectors record prior to Song of the Earth. Sure. Yeah. Putting that. Putting that one out. Putting out the first single from that on March 28, 2020, man.

[Ian]

Snake bit, man.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah.

[Ian]

That's good. Good times. Or. Or not so good time. You're. You're. You're writing a new record right now, right?

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, yeah, a couple of them. I mean, I have too many songs.

[Ian]

You know, That's a good problem to have.

[David Longstreth]

It is, yeah. Yeah, it is. Yeah. I. Yeah, I am. I'm really. It's been a season of release releases. Both the Isaiah's movie the Legend of Ochi is coming out April 25, and Song of the Earth, you know, I think, will be out by the time maybe on the day that. That this joker, man.

[Ian]

Yeah, this is dropping April 4th.

[David Longstreth]

Yep. And. And, you know, both of these things have consumed, like, the last several years of my. Of my life. So it's just right now I'm in this sort of, like, I don't know, a little bit of this tube around the release of these things. But I'm excited to get back into that. Into the recording of albums. Yeah. Songs. Yeah.

[Ian]

I take it the next whatever record records are not gonna be, you know, orchestral singular pieces based on Mahler.

[David Longstreth]

No. No, they're not. Yeah. I mean, these are. Yeah. They're like. They're smaller, small. They're kind of. Yeah. Like just simpler. Simpler things. Which feels so good right now. But then at the same time, I do. I have been having this feeling of like, oh, man. Maybe Song of the Earth is actually four parts.

[Ian]

Four parts.

[David Longstreth]

Four parts. And I've just made the first one.

[Ian]

Whoa.

[David Longstreth]

That's how I've been feeling recently that.

[Ian]

You'Re setting yourself up for quite a lot of work, my friend.

[David Longstreth]

I just feel like I didn't get to the heart of the matter here. I didn't get to the bottom of it. I didn't get to the bottom of it.

[Ian]

That's crazy. I mean. I mean, that's great to hear. That there's so much more gas in the tank on this, but, like, as dense and well realized and honestly, like, kind of tiring and not in like a. You know, I'm getting tired of this. I'm bored with it. Just like this thing takes you on a journey, man. There's ups and downs and loud shit and quiet shit and soaring heights and depressing depths. Boy, to hear that you haven't gotten to the bottom of it after this much after this month, that's amazing to me.

[David Longstreth]

It's a world. It feels like a world.

[Ian]

Yeah. Feels like an earth.

[David Longstreth]

There we go.

[Ian]

Boy. Well, hell of a record. I don't want to eat up too much more your Sunday, especially when you're hacking up. Hacking up along over there.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, well, yeah. I mean, Ian, amazing talking to you. Yeah, we can. Yeah. I mean, what is your. What song? You know. Yeah, like, what's. I'm so curious, actually about, like, how you're interacting with the album. Like. Yeah. What you're. What you're feeling from it. Like, do you have a favorite song? Do you have a standout?

[Ian]

It's gonna sound like I'm cheating right now because it's the first song on here and be like, oh, yeah. He's only listened to one song on this whole thing. But, I mean, Gimme Bread is just like, I can't. I've been just walking around. I listen to a lot of the music that I listen to, like when I'm cooking dinner, like, cleaning up, and I'll have a glass of wine or something. And so I start to kind of feel myself and have a good. And I'm just like, the last however many weeks, I've been making pasta or cooking chicken or whatever and just. Just going, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Just like under my breath as I'm doing that. I feel like my wife is, like, looking at me like an insane person. But that song, man, just fucking knocks me on my ass every time.

[David Longstreth]

Oh, that's awesome.

[Ian]

It's huge. And that, I mean, that, to me, feels like one that you would. I don't know, I guess you'd need. You'd probably need more than just you up there doing it the way you did, like the Puen Reyes stuff. But, like, that is one that would totally work in a, you know, more traditional dirty projectors rock set.

[David Longstreth]

We did, you know, when we were rehearsing for the La Phil show a year ago, we did a bunch of shows, maybe two or three at Union Pool.

[Ian]

Oh, sure.

[David Longstreth]

In Williamsburg. And it was kind of like it was this just like, so shambolic acoustic, spindly stripped down, a world that I. That I love. To me, it's my favorite. It's my favorite place to be where there's just like, no net. And it's. It's. It's, you know.

[Ian]

Yeah, walking the trapeze.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, we're walking the tightrope. But it's also. We're performing together just, you know, one acoustic guitar barely mic'd and Mike Johnson just, like, barely hitting the snare drum behind me. And then. Yeah. With Felicia and Maya and Olga. And I loved playing that way. And to me, like, there is a there. I. When I play that way, I really am like, oh, this feel. This feels. I love this as dirty projectors. And this feels like dirty projectors to me in a way. Maybe more than, like, trying to put up a, you know, a loud, like, festival set or something like that right now at this point in my life, but. So maybe. Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, I don't. Yeah. Like, in terms. I'm just thinking aloud now about, like, trying to play it live when so much of this album really is about the color and about the arrangement of the. Of the group. There is something. There's something not. Not confrontational, not contrarian, but there is. It's asking. I mean, I guess it's asking something of the listener to be like, hey, will you meet us at this place where it's the songs, you know, but, you know, reduced to their. Like their. Their. Their. Their just the. This is the raw food version.

[Ian]

They're like bass components. Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. I mean. Yeah, you're talking about the point. Rage shows being sort of an exercise in perversity. Trying to put those together solo, put those records. Songs together solo. It feels sort of like a similar challenge to me trying to put this music together. And even if you're playing in a full band, but with so much going on and relying on chamber groups and written music and stuff, even when you have a full unit, you know, in a rock context at least, trying to do Gimme Bread seems, you know, it seems equally perverse, I would say.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, yeah, but Give me bread would kind of. It might be good as a big. As a louder.

[Ian]

I think it would. Rock, man.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, yeah, we should do that.

[Ian]

Would kill shifting shale stones. Also towards the end, it's just like a minute or. I mean, that's what it says on the. On the itunes thing. It's, I guess, hard to determine where exactly it ends and begins, but like, the. The the. It's. It's a nice, quiet, calm, meditative moment, I think, moving towards the climax of this record. I just love. I just love it. Cool drink of water.

[David Longstreth]

Yeah, man. So cool. Thank you.

[Ian]

Thank you. Give it a spin, folks. Song of the Earth, Dirty Projectors performs David Longstreth and Stargaze. Do I have that right?

[David Longstreth]

Something like that.

[Ian]

We'll fix it in post. Thanks, Dave. Thanks again to the man, David Longstreth. The record is Song of the Earth, I guess, you know, if you're looking at it on Spotify or something. Dirty Projectors, however you want to look at it. Dave Longstreth, 30 projectors somewhere in between both. Neither fantastic visionary, big, bold accomplishments. Exactly what we're always looking to listen to here on Jokerman.

[Unknown]

Be of forests, that's the green of beyond the blue of oceans, that's the blue of dream. The blue of dream was dream dreaming the blue Such a blooming wolf dream. Now the night stretches out over the city Asleep the stars all safeguard over heaven but the earth is just ours to safeguard.