#1709 Two Shovels, One Headache

Summary

Juicebox Podcast: Type 1 Diabetes — Episode #1709

"Two Shovels, One Headache"
Host: Scott Benner
Guest: Dina (Clinical Child Psychologist, mom to two recently diagnosed kids with T1D)
Date: December 15, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode features a deeply candid and insightful conversation between host Scott Benner and guest Dina—a clinical child psychologist and mother to two children, both diagnosed with type 1 diabetes within a month of each other. Together, they explore the initial chaos of diagnosis, family genetics and risk, emotional and practical coping strategies, sibling relationships, and the complexity of cultivating resilience in kids (and parents) living with diabetes.

Dina’s expertise as both a parent and psychologist adds unique, nuanced perspectives, making this episode a valuable resource for families navigating new diagnoses, as well as those further along the journey.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Dina’s Family Story — Dual Diagnosis and Early Experiences

• Dina introduces herself as a mom to Zeke (13) and Ruby (10), both diagnosed with type 1 diabetes a month apart in 2022.
  • [02:38] Dina: “Zeke was diagnosed August of 2022, and Ruby was diagnosed a month later. September 2022.”
• Initial Symptoms Overlooked:
  • Zeke’s early signs were subtle—mood changes, tiredness, more urination and thirst—dismissed as growing pains or active lifestyle. Even with a physician husband and her own advanced training, they missed the signs.
    • [04:55] Dina: “None of it added up. We didn’t know what to look for at the time…We just were starting to notice some differences.”
  • Zeke’s A1C was 13 at diagnosis, but he was not in DKA.
• Rapid Succession Diagnosis:
  • Ruby’s diagnosis followed after noticing minor weight changes and a “wedgie” from loose leggings—something any parent might overlook.
    • [13:53] Dina: “That worry seed grew bigger. I said to my husband, ‘Something’s not right with Ruby.’”
  • Early detection: Ruby was caught at an A1C of 6.2.
  • “Mom intuition”: Dina’s gut propelled her to act despite everyone else’s reassurances.
    • [18:08] Dina: “It was the most validating and terrifying moment. Right. Of, like, I knew it. My mom intuition was right. I knew it, and I don’t want to have known it, of course.”

2. Genetic and Autoimmune Landscape

• Family history on both sides:
  • Husband’s sister has celiac and other autoimmune conditions.
  • Dina herself has thyroid dysfunction and mild vitiligo.
    • [09:06] Dina: “Now we put together all the pieces…”
  • Zeke has the “trifecta”: T1D, celiac (diagnosed a year later), and Hashimoto’s thyroiditis.

3. The Emotional and Practical Aftermath

• Feeling overwhelmed and learning on the fly
  • Dina describes the early days: “I felt crazy anyway…”; “I felt like a zombie in the beginning, like, just wandering around the house and everything felt…like somebody slapped me in the head with a shovel and then my head was ringing and they, then they were like, keep living while my head was ringing…” ([20:21])
  • Dina’s strategy: Compartmentalization at first—a lot of the emotional energy went into the kids’ adaptation, less for herself.
    • [22:09] Dina: "I think the truth is, is that I really do focus it on my kids. It doesn’t really work on yourself. Right."

4. Sibling Dynamics — Different Kids, Different Diabetes

• Two experiences, two personalities:
  • Each child’s diabetes presents and is managed differently, reflecting both their personalities and biology.
    • Zeke: sensitive skin, more “high-high/low-low,” matching his personality.
    • Ruby: more stable, prefers steady routines, less dramatic swings.
      • [26:08] Dina: “…all of their levers of independence and interdependence show up in diabetes management.”
• Impact on sibling relationship:
  • Shared experience has created intimacy and teamwork; Zeke would give Ruby her shots at school in the early days.
    • [27:31] Dina: “When Ruby was diagnosed, she would only let two people at school give her injections…the school nurse… and her brother.”
  • They also maintain a “totally normal sibling relationship,” including typical bickering.

5. Finding and Building Support and Community

• Community matters, but each family’s openness varies:
  • Some families are eager to connect, others keep T1D more private.
  • Dina describes finding community “in sneaky places”—social networks, a type 1 babysitter, a coffee meetup with another parent of T1D siblings.
    • [29:50] Dina: “I feel like I found my community in kind of sneaky places.”

6. Fostering Independence in Management

• Ongoing handoff of responsibility:
  • The family has routines for school-day management, with texts and emoji confirmations, and a gradual, individualized “slow handoff.”
    • [32:26] Dina: “We have all of these systems in place…Zeke uses a rocket ship emoji to let us know he's dosing; Ruby just texts dosing.”
  • Kids are highly motivated to master their own care but rely on parents for sounding board/support.
  • [34:32] Dina: “I tease in my professional life that I’ve coined very few terms…but one of them is, your kid is not in the book.”

7. Navigating Resilience, Privilege, and Coping with Hard Realities

• The concept of resilience:
  • Dina and Scott discuss both the celebration and “burden” of resilience in kids—a double-edged sword.
    • [40:57] Dina: “There’s part of me that loves when you tell me your kids are strong, and there’s part of me that feels sad that they have to be.”
  • Dina references Ann Masten’s “ordinary magic” research: having one adult hold a child “at the center of their world” is a key protective factor.
    • [54:29] Dina: “…if you make a difference in one little person’s life…it sort of transcended tragedy.”
  • Both acknowledge privilege, access, and the uneven playing field for resilience.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On missing the signs (reassuring for new families):
  [06:10] Scott: “So the two of you and your 17 years of combined schooling didn’t see the type 1 diabetes. That’s not comfortable.”
  [06:12] Dina: “You nailed it. Yeah, that’s exactly right.”

• On simultaneous recognition and dread:
  [18:08] Dina: “It was the most validating and terrifying moment. Right. Of, like, I knew it. My mom intuition was right. I knew it, and I don’t want to have known it, of course.”

• On living with two new realities:
  [23:24] Scott: “…it’s easy to say that both of your kids got type one, so there’s a new life to think about, but there’s actually two new lives, and you have to keep them separated … and they’re not the same. Is that right?”
  [23:44] Dina: “Oh, that could not be more right.”

• On the early days:
  [20:21] Scott: “It feels like somebody like slapped me in the head with a shovel and then my head was ringing and they, then they were like, keep living while my head was ringing…”

• On independence and gradual transition:
  [34:32] Scott: “I think about it like a slow handoff. There’s no rush to get to the answer… The goal is that by the time…you’re in your mid-20s, you find yourself thinking like, I know more than these old people…”
  [34:32] Dina: “There’s no book for that. And I think that’s the same answer here.”

• On “ordinary magic” and resilience (ref. Ann Masten):
  [54:29] Dina: “Kids who experience horrible, horrible things, trauma, tragedy, if they had one adult who just sort of held them at the center of their world… it sort of transcended tragedy… One adult makes a difference.”

• On insider vs. outsider community perceptions:
  [29:50] Dina: “I feel like I found my community in kind of sneaky places… our endocrinologists and our educators, most of them have type one and have been people in our world.” [56:22] Dina: “There’s just a relief in having a community that understands our experience…”

• On burnout and boundaries:
  [57:07] Dina: “I also experience a little bit of burnout sometimes with like the…content in general. Like, sometimes I need my diabetes info and I need to, like, get it and I need to get out…”

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Important Segments & Timestamps

• Intro & Dina’s background: [00:13] – [03:09]
• Family history, missed signs, and dual diagnosis: [03:43] – [11:33]
• How early experiences shaped management: [13:53] – [20:21]
• Parental coping strategies: [20:45] – [23:24]
• Sibling management and relationships: [23:44] – [29:50]
• Building community and network: [29:50] – [32:26]
• Independence in diabetes care; family-life adaptation: [32:26] – [35:22]
• Resilience, privilege, and every family’s journey: [40:57] – [54:29]
• Ordinary Magic & Protective Factors: [54:29] – [55:56]
• Using the podcast as support/reflection: [55:59] – [57:40]

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Tone & Conversational Style

Warm, direct, self-effacing, and honest—Scott and Dina balance humor and vulnerability, moving fluidly between laughter and hard truths. The conversation feels like a real-life, mid-crisis parenting kitchen table chat with empathetic candor.

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Actionable Takeaways and Summary Insights

• You can “miss” early signs—even as medical pros; don’t blame yourself.
• Family history of autoimmunity can play a role; early, proactive monitoring in siblings is vital.
• Kids’ diabetes will never be “the same”—each child, even in one family, needs unique emotional and practical strategies.
• Intuition and “hyper-vigilant” parenting can be both validating and exhausting; trust yourself, but seek support.
• Shared diagnosis can deepen sibling bonds in unexpected ways.
• Facilitate gradual and individualized independence; there’s no “book” or timetable—follow your child’s lead.
• Building a support community takes effort and openness—seek connections in both expected and “sneaky” places.
• Burnout is real—allow yourself to step back or “dose” your engagement with the diabetes world.
• Resilience isn’t innate—it can be fostered by anchoring a child with at least one unwavering adult presence.
• There’s comfort and solidarity in hearing others’ stories—seek podcasts, groups, or resources that “get it.”

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Closing Reflection:
This episode beautifully encapsulates both the chaos and the hope of early years with type 1, especially in families with multiple diagnoses. Dina’s voice offers a blend of expert knowledge and real life messiness, ultimately reassuring listeners: there are ways through the double-shovel “headache”—through connection, adaptability, compassion, and the “ordinary magic” of showing up, every day, for our kids and ourselves.

Transcript

[A]

As the holidays approach, I want to say welcome and thank all of my good friends for coming back to the Juice Box Podcast over and over again.

[B]

I'm Dina. I'm a mom to two relatively newly diagnosed kids with type 1 diabetes, and I'm a clinical child psychologist.

[A]

If you're new to type 1 diabetes, begin with the Bold Beginning series from the podcast. Don't take my word for it. Listen to what reviewers have said. Bold Beginnings is the best first step. I learned more in those episodes than anywhere else. This is when everything finally clicked. People say it takes the stress out of the early days and replaces it with clarity. They tell me this should come with the diagnosis packet that I got at the hospital, and after they listen, they recommend it to everyone who's struggling. It's straightforward, practical and easy to listen to. Bold Beginnings gives you the basics in a way that actually makes sense. If you're looking for community around type 1 diabetes, check out the Juice Box Podcast Private Facebook Group juice box podcast type 1 diabetes but everybody is welcome. Type 1 type 2 gestational loved ones it doesn't matter to me. If you're impacted by diabetes and you're looking for support, comfort or community, check out Juice Box podcast type 1 diabetes on Facebook. Nothing you hear on the Juice Box Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise. Always consult a physician before making any changes to your healthcare plan. Usmed is sponsoring this episode of the Juice Box Podcast and we've been getting our diabetes supplies from USMED for years. You can as well usmed.com juicebox or call 888-7211-5148, use the link or the number, get your free benefits check and get started today with USMED. Today's episode is also sponsored by the Eversense365 the One Year Ware CGM. That's one insertion a year. That's it. And here's a little bonus for you. How about there's no limit on how many friends and family you can share your data with with the eversense now app. No limits ever since. The podcast is also sponsored today by the Tandem Mobi system, which is powered by Tandem's newest algorithm, Control IQ technology. Tandem Mobi has a predictive algorithm that helps prevent highs and lows and is now available for ages 2 and up. Learn more and get started today at tandemdiabetes.com Juicebox I'm Dina.

[B]

I'm a mom to two relatively newly diagnosed kids with type 1 diabetes and I'm a clinical child psychologist.

[A]

You have two children in total.

[B]

I have two children in total. Correct.

[A]

And. Ooh, wait a second. How old are they?

[B]

So Zeke is 13 and Ruby is 10. Zeke was diagnosed August of 2022, and Ruby was diagnosed a month later. September 2022.

[A]

And when you named them, you were trying to get them their own Disney Channel TV show at the time or what? Zeke and Ruby, I mean, right? That seemed like something your kids would watch in the afternoon.

[B]

Not anymore. They're teenagers now. But maybe. Maybe once upon a time.

[A]

When you're on those Disney Channel shows, you have to grow up, get some sort of a drug habit, go off for a little bit, try singing for a little, come back, you're good. Not to put them in it. I don't think it would have worked out.

[B]

Yeah, not our vibe at all.

[A]

Zeke and Ruby. Okay, wait. So Zeke's diagnosed and then Ruby's diagnosed? How long afterwards?

[B]

One month.

[A]

It's not catchy, is it? I didn't.

[B]

They made me think it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Well, so I'm going to guess. Do I want to guess or do I want to let you go? Why don't I let you go? How did you notice? How was Zeke presenting? Like, what got you there?

[B]

Zeke was sick. He's a super active, athletic, busy guy, and he'd sort of slowed down. His mood had really significantly changed. And it was also the end of summer. We'd been traveling. We. He was, you know, just starting fourth grade, and he had a physical coming up. So my physician husband and I were like, man, he's probably fine. He was having some, like, leg cramps, which could have been explained by growing pains. He was drinking a few Gatorade water bottles a night, but he was a super active kid. Um, he'd had a few nights of, like, excessive urination, but again, like, none of it added up. We didn't know what to look for at the time. And, you know, thankfully, he wasn't so sick that he couldn't do the things he loved to do. We just were starting to notice some differences.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

He was, you know, at his physical. The pediatrician put some pieces together very quickly, and he was admitted with an A1C of 13. Ooh.

[A]

Hey. You told me what you do for a living. But your husband's a physician as well, so.

[B]

I'm a clinical psychologist.

[A]

I'm sorry.

[B]

Yep. And he's a physician.

[A]

Your English is so good that I said as well when I shouldn't have, and you were like, you're wrong. I'm not a doctor. And I was like, well, I'M a.

[B]

Doctor, but a different kind of doctor. To be clear.

[A]

I have to say, I. I said in the kitchen the other day, do you think I could get one of those fake doctor. It's like somebody could invite me somewhere to speak, and I could be a doctor. And my wife was like, oh, God. And I think she thought, it's possible he could make that happen. And then he'd try to get us to call him doctor, which I wouldn't, by the way. It all sounds like too much work for me, but honestly, if you said to me I had to do that, I'd be like, ah, it doesn't seem worth it. Tell me again, what is your husband. I'm sorry, Do.

[B]

He's a physician. He's an interventional radiologist.

[A]

Oh. Oh, okay. All right. So the. The two of you and your 17 years of combined schooling didn't see the type 1 diabetes. That's not comfortable.

[B]

You nailed it. Yeah, that's exactly right. Yes.

[A]

Should make other people feel better, don't you think?

[B]

Oh, so much better. Yeah. You know, we get that a lot. And it's one of our least favorite things that people say is like, oh, there's no better parents than you to do this. And we think really, like, I could.

[A]

Think of better people. Those people are called not me because not me. I'm not looking for this. Okay. So, I mean, with a 13A 1C, even though you don't think that there were a lot of outward signs. I mean, was he in DKA or did it hit him really quickly? How do you think that happened?

[B]

You know, I mean, the truth is, like, most things with diabetes, we don't know. He was not in DKA yet. He was very sick. And, you know, apparently we caught it. He was admitted. He felt really sh. Tty in the hospital. You know, he was pretty sick and. And had a lot of signs that, you know, his blood sugar was high for a long time. We, you know, of course, in hindsight, I think all parents do this of relatively newly diagnosed kids is like, we, you know, have racked our brains and looked at, like, we went away in June to the beach. Was he already sick? We can. We could think of some episodes where we felt like it was likely a really high blood sugar that was making him behave that way. But the truth is, we don't know and we'll never know. Yeah, you know, there was. There was no overt signs. It was just this constellation of weird things that, of course, turned out to be explained by diabetes. Zeke, subsequently was, you Know his everything was out of whack when he was admitted. He was subsequently diagnosed with the trifecta. So he has Hashimoto's thyroiditis and celiac, which arguably is maybe tougher to live with as a 13 year old boy. Diabetes.

[A]

Was there any illness in the house in the months prior to his diagnosis?

[B]

No, nothing. Not that we remember because, you know.

[A]

I'm looking for a reason why the sister pops off immediately afterwards. Like, did you both, like, did they both have like, you know, Coxsackie or something like that?

[B]

A virus, Nothing overt. We always wonder like, did we all have Covid and not know it? But we didn't know if we did. And there's no clear viral link in our family that we know of.

[A]

Let's go back through the family lives though. Like you, your husband, any autoimmune for either of you?

[B]

Oh, yeah, yeah, we have the sort of like low grade constellation on both sides of the family. Okay, so my husband's sister has celiac and has had like a long history of autoimmune stuff throughout her life. She's pretty open about. I have thyroid dysfunction. Really? That was onset with my second pregnancy. Hypothyroid and I was diagnosed with vitiligo, interestingly.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

I have a pretty mild case. It honestly, like, has never really affected me. But, you know, of course now we put together all the pieces that perhaps there was, you know, there's a little theme, but those are the. Those are the only known. I do have sort of maternal family history of thyroid dysfunction, but again, nothing that like raised eyebrows until now.

[A]

I joked with somebody the other day, I said, if every grandmom whose wrists hurt didn't have a baby, I wonder how much autoimmune there'd be in the world now. Because by the time everybody tells their story, eventually they get to a grandmother and like my grandmother had ra. Like there's always like one of those or very, very commonly. But your husband doesn't have anything directly for him?

[B]

No, not that we know of.

[A]

Okay. Okay. How did they get the triple diagnosis right there? Did they just run labs while he's in the hospital?

[B]

So he actually, his titers or whatever they draw for celiac were normal on admission. Everything else was out of whack. He was diagnosed a year later. So just like on his annual blood draw, a year after diagnosis, he was diagnosed with celiac.

[A]

Okay, so not right there. Not right then and there.

[B]

Correct. Yeah.

[A]

Is there, looking back, did he have celiac symptoms before the type one?

[B]

No, definitely not.

[A]

Okay. And thyroid the same, do you think?

[B]

I think, you know, it's kind of weird. It's this, like, curiosity that we don't check for this stuff in. In young kids.

[A]

Sure.

[B]

But there's no reason to believe that he did.

[A]

Okay. You manage with what, Synthroid?

[B]

Yep.

[A]

And it works for you? Like, your TSH is low enough. You don't have symptoms?

[B]

Yep, exactly. Both of us. Zeke's going through puberty big time, so everything is changing. So his dose is a little bit of a moving target, but I'm well managed right now.

[A]

Yeah. Is he growing well?

[B]

He's growing beautifully. You know, it's like, I really hate to talk about silver linings, because I just don't think that there's a lot of them here, but because he. They have so much medical management. We caught his celiac probably right away. He was very mildly symptomatic. And, like, he's been growing beautifully. My kids are huge. In fact, whenever we go to the. I'm five, two, and whenever we go to the endocrinologist, she says to me, remind me how tall your husband is. Like, how did you make these tall kids? So, yeah, I feel so, so grateful that he's growing incredibly well, and it never affected his growth or his health, honestly, because we caught it early.

[A]

Does Ruby have any extras over type 1?

[B]

No extras so far. She's standard.

[A]

She's standard. So tell me one more time. Zeke has diabetes for how long? And then you look at your daughter and think, oh, my God, it's happening again.

[B]

Yep. So he was diagnosed, and in the hospital, we have just, like, this awesome community of diabetes people in our world. So our endocrinologist is actually also a mom at our school, and I coached lacrosse at the school. So she came into Zeke's hospital room and said, coach, done. What's up? She has been our endocrinologist ever since. And she said, I think, as they say to everyone, you know, that this can run in families. Siblings are higher risk. And in that moment, it planted a seed of worry, but that's not that hard to do with me. And, you know, my husband, like, rolled his eyes and patted me on the back, and thankfully, Zeke was discharged, healthy and good to go. But, of course, that little seed of worry, I think, sort of bloomed in me. And so I'm, like, watching Ruby carefully, and she perhaps is drinking a touch more water, but I am so exhausted and strung out and anxious about everything at that point that, you know, I'm like, no way, no way, no way. And about A few weeks later, Zeke was actually playing baseball at the time and Ruby was at the game running around and she kept saying, mom, I have a wedgie in my leggings. Like my leggings are fitting funny. And I was like, okay, you know, these were leggings from the previous spring and this was fall. And I thought, why is my little 7 year old pants falling down? So I threw her up on the scale because I don't know, I've known her past weight and she had actually like lost a pound or two, which again, like normal life, no one would think anything of in my opinion. But of course that worry seed grew bigger and I said to my husband like, something's not right. Something's not right with Ruby. And he said, I'm sure it's fine, Dina, but if you're really worried, you'll take her to the pediatrician. I of course wanted to poke her finger right there and do ketones and do the whole thing. And he warned me mostly because I think he was really worried about me spinning out and he was worried about.

[A]

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[B]

You got it. Exactly.

[A]

He's like, oh, there goes my whole life, right?

[B]

And you remember, like, we're a month in, right? So like, even a dexcom change, like, caused great stress in our house. You know, just we were learning all the things, and so I felt crazy anyway, and I did. I did do exactly what my husband suggested. And we went to the pediatrician. Thank goodness it was our same pediatrician who kind of did the same thing, like, patted me on the back. Ruby remembers the story beautifully. She says it was a Tuesday. And I remember you took me out of school, and we told my teacher I was going to be right back because I just was going to need to pee in the cup at the pediatrician. And this is the moment everything changed. Really is. You know, she had glucose in her urine and her blood sugar was 300.

[A]

Wow. Wow, wow, wow, wow. How about that?

[B]

The pediatrician looked at me and all the blood rushed out of her face.

[A]

Yeah. And she said, oh, my God, Dina, you are giving your children type 1 diabetes somehow. Are you doing this? And please get away from me. Can you guys back up a couple of steps, please?

[B]

She's literally. She just, like, she didn't know what to say, right? And she just did not know what to say. And at this point, I have everyone's cell phones on speed dial, even the pediatrician. Our wonderful pediatrician was, like, calling me to check in on us after Zeke was diagnosed. So she didn't know what to do. And we had just been discharged. Like, I just said goodbye to all these people, like, the last thing I wanted to do.

[A]

Goodbye. There is no doubt that when you walked in, that Office. She was thinking, uh, o, this one's cracked already. Like, she. Like, she definitely thought you were crazy when you brought her in. Oh, yeah.

[B]

100%. Everyone did. Everyone did.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And it was the most validating and terrifying moment. Right. Of, like, I knew it. My mom intuition was right. I knew it, and I don't want to have known it, of course.

[A]

Of all the things to be right about, you know.

[B]

Yeah. But I just knew. I just had this weird sneaking suspicion. And so, you know, then the cascade. But we truly, like, call their endocrinologist on speakerphone in the pediatrician's office. And of course, she. I think her little science brain and research brain starts going like, ooh, did we catch it really early?

[A]

And it's.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Everyone was, honestly. Because it was. It was. I mean, Ruby was almost sort of in that, like, free space of could we do some mitigation? And, you know, her A1C, I think, was like, 6.2 at diagnosis. So we definitely caught it extremely early, unusually.

[A]

So the question has to be is, was she symptomatic? The day that Zeke was diagnosed, like, could you have, on that same day, said, check her, too, and they would have found something?

[B]

And again, like, what we learned, I mean, again, only. Like, you only know once, you know, is she was really spiking randomly. So it could have been that they could have just done a quick finger poke, and her blood sugar was normal, and we never thought about it. So, I mean, again, we'll never know.

[A]

Gotcha.

[B]

But it's very possible. And she, you know, she was discharged on just, like, a tiny bit of Lantis at the time, and then, honestly, progressed very quickly. We had a whole, like, buffet table in our little. In our kitchen of each kid had a poke plan, and they would. Their little ratios were up on a whiteboard, and I kind of went into pediatric psychologist mommy mode and got everybody comfy and situated at home, and that was our normal.

[A]

All of a sudden, you guys pivoted well. You think?

[B]

I mean, can anyone pivot well to this? Sometimes I say that we've, like, learned a new language overnight, but, yeah, we are. You know, my kids are resilient. I feel so grateful to be able to say that, but I think, you know, we pivoted as well as anyone has to pivot.

[A]

Yeah, no, I mean, I recall. I recall feeling like a zombie in the beginning, like, just wandering around the house and everything felt. I don't know, like, I've described it a ton of different ways, but the best way, I think is it feels like somebody like slapped me in the head with a shovel and then my head was ringing and they, then they were like, keep living while my head was ringing and I was like, what just happened? Felt like that went on for a little while.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. Gosh, that's. I mean, that's got to be overwhelming. I mean, I know you're, you're probably professionally as prepared for something like this as somebody could be, but does that transfer to you? Like, does, you know, does your background actually help you on yourself or do you focus it on your kids and, and it doesn't help you. When you think of a CGM and all the good that it brings in your life is the first thing you think about. I love that I have to change it all the time. I love the warm up period every time I have to change it. I love that when I bump into a door frame, sometimes it gets ripped off. I love that the adhesive kind of gets mushy sometimes when I sweat and falls off. No, these are not the things that you love about a cgm. Today's episode of the Juicebox podcast is sponsored by the Eversense365, the only CGM that you only have to put on once a year and the only CGM that won't give you any of those problems. The Eversense 365 is the only one year CGM designed to minimize device frustration. It has exceptional accuracy for one year with almost no false alarms from compression lows while you're sleeping. You can manage your diabetes instead of your CGM with the Eversense365. Learn more and get started today at eversensecgm.com JuiceBox One year, one CGM.

[B]

Good question, hard question. You know, I think the truth is, is that I really do focus it on my kids. I. It doesn't really work on yourself. Right. Like it doesn't really work on anyone. I love, generally speaking, hopefully if I separate my words, like no one listens to me, like if only. So no, you know, I think honestly it's only been after my head stopped ringing from my like double shovel whack that I think I've started to turn more towards really like intentional self care. But pouring it into my kids was easy and necessary, right? Yeah, it is true. You just sort of reach into all the spaces that you know how to take care of your kids and to help them adjust. And one of the things I've learned too is sometimes I tease that like their blood sugars mimic their personality Sometimes. But although I have two kids with type 1 who were diagnosed really at the same exact time, it presents differently, and it looks different in every body. And it's been just like a really interesting adventure and learning about what each of them needs and how to do right by them, both emotionally and psychosocially and medically.

[A]

So you really are learning. It's easy to say that both of your kids got type one, so there's a new life to think about, but there's actually two new lives, and you have to keep them separated. There's steps to take when it's him. There's steps to take when it's her, and they're not the same. Is that right?

[B]

Oh, that could not be more right.

[A]

How about that?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Yeah. So just like parenting, except day to day and never ending. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Because you have, you know, like, there's sometimes, like, the thing you say to one isn't the thing you would say to the other one in the same situation, but you even have time to figure that out as you're getting older. Also, you watch. Some parents don't figure it out. Right. Some parents have, like, this is my style. I apply it evenly over all of them, and some of them do better with it than others, but they don't bend. But you had to, because it's medical. So, like, you had to, like, figure one out, then figure the other one out. How long? I mean, this is only three years ago, right? Yeah.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

Are you there yet? Like, how would you describe where you're at currently?

[B]

I feel like every day is a new adventure. I think we're there most days as much as anyone can be there. Three years in, and as much as anyone can be there. Parenting, really like two teenagers, Right. Both kids are going through puberty. Both kids are exploring their independence and autonomy in life and in diabetes at the same time.

[A]

Right.

[B]

I think I don't. You know, does anyone ever really figure it out to the best of the best? Probably not. But we're trying really hard to get it right for each kid. And I love how you said that. It feels true to my experience, which is you really have to parent the kid you have. You also have to treat the diabetes your kid has.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Both at the same time.

[A]

I have to tell you, until you really said that to me, it's not that I didn't, I guess, academically understand it, but it's not a thing that popped into my head that it would be signi. It could be significantly different for one than the other. Like I would have believed you if you said, you know, you know, my daughter gets a period, so, like, there's. There's that, like, hormonal shift every month, but just the idea that it's completely the same and yet ultimately a little different, and that it's on you to remember that. I mean, I don't know how much your husband's involved in the management stuff, but it's up to you, you know, the two of you, to figure that out. And then it also must be confusing for the kids to watch their situations be very similar but different at the same time.

[B]

Oh, my gosh. Yeah. So. So, right. Yeah. My husband is intimately involved in everything, just as I am. And actually that adds another variable. Right. Like, dad does things one way and mom does things another way, and the kids know it just like they do in parenting. You know how parents will say, like, oh, go, I'm gonna go ask dad, because mom said no.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Same thing happens in diabetes. Right. So, you know, I put a pump on in a particular way. Ruby likes to squeeze in a particular way. All of their BL levers of independence and interdependence show up in diabetes management. So, yeah, it's all of those things at the same time. And they do have, as, you know, as everyone who's listening knows, they have their preferences in life, and those show up in diabetes, too. Right. Whether it's, like, the sites that they prefer or don't. Poor Zeke has super sensitive skin, so he has, like, a whole ritual of what we put on before the pump and how he likes it cut and the patches they prefer and all of the things, even how they run. Like, Zeke tends to sort of, I really say, often like his. His blood sugar often mimics his personality. He's like a high, high guy and a low, low guy. He's really like. And that is how his blood sugar looks sometimes, but it's. It doesn't faze him. Whereas Ruby is much more steady and prefers it that way. Last night, Zeke had a pump malfunction, and Ruby said, like, mommy, I don't. Like, I can't remember when I was that high, maybe two times, she said, you know, but she. It's just interesting how they. They. And they look out for each other and they care for each other. I think it's, you know, again, like, you don't want to have to share this with anybody, but they do have a shared experience, and they, you know, for better or worse, they're in it together.

[A]

Have you seen that change their relationship at all?

[B]

Deeply. Deeply. Yeah.

[A]

So they've kind of got each other's backs.

[B]

When Ruby was diagnosed, they both were still mdi and she would only let two people at school give her injections. The school nurse, who is genuinely like part of our family, and her brother.

[A]

Oh, oh. He'd come down and help her and.

[B]

He'D come down and give her a shot before lunch. Yeah.

[A]

That must be sweet, right?

[B]

I mean, yeah. Right. Like it's a, it's, it's just like what they did. So. Yes. Would, would I have ever dreamed that my like needle phobic, 10 year old son would be capable of doing that? No. No way. Um, and he did, you know, and so yeah, they, they do. They also have a totally normal sibling relationship, hopefully where they bicker and, you know, have all the normal sibling things and they look out for each other. We've also found we have this awesome babysitter who really doesn't babysit anymore. She comes and hangs out, but she has type one and they hang out with her and they all go low together and they all eat candy together. And so we try to find people to bring into our life who get it more profoundly even than my husband and I do.

[A]

Do you know a lot of people with Type 1 or just the babysitter?

[B]

You know, we know a few. There are a few people in our community. Not very many in our specific school, but we do know a few. And I've found. I don't know if this is your experience too, but we found like some people are really looking for people and community and other people are not, you know, so I've found a few people who have been really open and shared their experience. Actually another family with sibling siblings in our community. And when we were first diagnosed, like I met the mom for coffee and she brought me a huge bag of all their favorite candies for Lowe's and just in it together. I feel like I found my community in kind of sneaky places. So other parents who have kids recently diagnosed, our endocrinologists and our educators, most of them have type one and have been people in our world. So that the kids have. Zeke actually asked me recently, he's a big athlete, he was on lacrosse field and some kid came up to him and said, hey, you have type one too. Came home and he said, what do I say when someone says that to me? Like, what's the appropriate response? Like, yep, I get it. So, you know, we, we try.

[A]

I was watching game three of the World Series the other night and behind home plate to the right is a woman in, like, I don't remember how she was dressed, but I remember she was jumping around a lot and cheering and going crazy, and there was an omnipod in her arm. And it might be the only thing I could see while I was watching the game. I just kept thinking, like, oh, she has type one, and, you know, and she's just bouncing up and down and, like, you know, I don't know what she was doing. She was screaming and yelling. I don't know that in a million years, if Arden didn't have diabetes, if I didn't know all you guys, like, I don't think I ever would have noticed that thing on her. Ever.

[B]

No. And then. And now you notice it everywhere. Right? You have, like, little Dexcom radar.

[A]

Yeah. No, right away you're like, oh, there's a bump in somebody's, like, on the side of their pants. Or, like, you know, you can see CGMs on people. And it is interesting how it shifts your focus.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

How much are you involved in decision making for diabetes, for carb counting, for that kind of stuff, devices being put on, taken off, etc. And how much are they handling on their own?

[B]

Good question. Also, honestly, my kids are pretty amazing at working towards independence, and they're really motivated. So I think that, like, I feel grateful for that. I think that that's just intrinsic to their personalities. They're kids who are just, like, really motivated to mastery in a lot of things in the world, and diabetes isn't that different for them. I think that my husband and I have spent a lot of time really, intentionally talking about this question, specifically of, like, how much should we do and how much should they do? And I've learned a ton from you too, Scott. Like, listening to your journey and. And other people on the podcast, I feel like it's a real space where there's just not a right or best answer. So I feel like I'm always open to, like, what's the right thing to do. But generally speaking, the kids are very independent considering their ages, and they are also very reliant on us for being a sounding board. You know, we have all of these systems in place that it's, like, funny when you ask and, like, oh, what do we do? And then I think, oh, we do a lot of things. So when they go to school, we have a text chain between us and the nurses, and for each kid, Zeke at school, Ruby at school, and I text the number of carbs in their lunch every morning. My husband and I make lunches for them every morning almost. And the nurse thumbs up the text. And then the kids have little Zeke uses a rocket ship emoji to let us know he's dosing Ruby. Just text dosing. And sometimes it comes out dozing or doing or some funny little kid, you know, typo.

[A]

Wait till it comes out. I'm an adult, and I don't need your help with this.

[B]

You know, sometimes there are those passive messages, but we kind of like, have, you know, communication where they just report back. When Ruby does hot lunch at school, she takes a picture of her tray and takes a guess at the carbs. And 99.9% of the time, she's absolutely accurate, you know, so I think, like, we're building their independence. That's our goal, at least. And then there are times when we're originally from Colorado, so we go skiing a lot, and we. When we go skiing, they will say, like, you hold the phone. You do it like, I want to go have fun. And so as a family, we put on the giant red backpack and we just, like, go cruise. And the kids know that they're sort of leaving their management to us. They're always, of course, you know, and then they say, I feel low on the chairlift or whatever it is. But we're, you know, so I think we. We are hopefully sort of developmentally appropriately managing who's in charge and how. How we do it.

[A]

So are you thinking about that from a clinical standpoint or from a parenting standpoint? Do you have a mix? Because, I mean, I feel like I'm hearing you talk about the way I talk about it, but I don't have any, like, larger words to use. So, you know, seriously, I. I think about it like a slow handoff. There's no rush to get to the answer. You don't send signals. Like, at 12 years old, you need to know this, and by the time you're 14, you need to know that. It's just like, here are the things that I'm trying to impart to you. Some of them take longer than others. The goal is that by the time. I mean, I guess everybody thinks about it differently, but I think the goal is by the time you're in your mid-20s, you find yourself thinking like, I know more than these old people, and you're actually probably right, and you're making good decisions and you're okay, and you still have the autonomy to turn and ask somebody for advice or help or whatever if you realize you're. You're short somewhere. I think about life that way. I've applied that to type one, But I'm wondering if am I following a book that I don't realize I'm following, or am I following some sort of whatever my common sense says? Or does that make sense as far as an answer where there's no question mark at the end?

[B]

Yeah. And I wish there was a book. Right. I tease in my professional life that I've coined very few terms in my career, but one of them is, your kid is not in the book. Like, there's no book for that. And I think that's the same answer here. I can't ignore what I know professionally or more specifically just about child development. But that has, of course, helped me as a mom every step of the way, hopefully for the better for my kids. I don't know, my husband may disagree, but, you know, I think we just do the best we can. I think we also have to follow our kids lead when they are sturdy leaders themselves. I don't feel like I. You know, it's funny that you say that you. The language sounds different. You know, I feel like this is just my. My way of parenting, and I try to apply that. Like you said, just the diabetes, too.

[A]

I feel bad for you because I feel like there's things that could happen where you. Where you would be able to step back and go, oh, our likelihood for heroin use just went up 5%. Like, you know, like the Aces. Like, you know that Aces. I love that Aces list. I really do. Yeah. When Erica told me about that, I was like, oh, that's real. I was like, oh, thank you. Please tell me more about this. You know, because every. Everything makes so much more sense when you look at it. It also, for me, helps me, but I'm going to use a phrase that I don't think sounds natural coming out of my mouth, but, like, it helps me to give people grace when I see them struggling with things and, you know, we're doing something that's ponderous, and you're just like, well, how's he going to not have that happen to him? He's got these four things off that list. Like, this was definitely going to happen. How hard is that when you're raising a kid to see something happen and think, oh, we just got 3% closer to a problem, and, oh, my gosh.

[B]

I mean, I would be so screwed if I thought about parenting like that, Scott. So thank God.

[A]

I imagine. I'm just wondering if it happens or not, that's all.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, you know, every once In a while, in my darkest moments, I'll like, think about that, but I try not to in the sense that, like, I just try to be in the moment. And every parent catastrophizes, right? Like when your kid says something, you're like, oh, no, they're whatever is going.

[A]

To happen, death is coming. I can see it. Yeah. Yep. No.

[B]

Oh, my God. So, yeah, of course I can casterfriend just like every other mommy, maybe even more as a psychologist mommy, you know, because, yeah, of course you can't not think about those things. But I also. How about this to balance out your aces. I also think about resilience and I really try because it helps me sleep at night. Is like all the things that are terrible that happen when you have a young kid with type 1 diabetes and all the things that feel terrible as a parent being out of control or navigating, you know, all the things that you always talk about are also balanced out by their strengths. And truly, that is much more in line with how I like to think and the lens through which I see kids in general. I think I am better at my job because of that too. And hopefully I'm a better mommy because of it too, because they are so stinking strong and resilient and they have, you know, they're amazing communicators even when they're not. And they're, you know, blocking me or blacklisting me or until they turn. Figure out how to turn us off on Dexcom follow one day. But also, even that is sort of like, all right, well, good luck. That serves you.

[A]

Can I pick through you the way you think about resilience for a second? Because I'm a little of two minds on it. Because for you, using you as an example, right, you have two kids that sound like they're pretty bright. I mean, they come from, you know, their parents are both educated and, you know, in the, in the medical field. So I mean, to me shows a. An understanding and an ability to learn and retain things, etc. Makes sense to me that you're, you know, your apple might not have fallen too far from your tree. Although I've seen it. I've seen the apple fall, roll down a hill, go over a waterfall, and you think like, these two people couldn't possibly be more different. But it sounds like your kids aren't that much different. My point is, is if I was just talking about it from my perspective or, you know, you're talking about it from your perspective, the kids are resilient. They're strong. They're adjusting. This is awesome. This is how we've set it up. It's working. I also find myself as, like, a host of, you know, of a conversation that I realize is being heard by more people than just you and I. What about the people who don't have that? I hate that society thinks that you either are strong or you're not. Like, you know what I mean? Like, it's like a decision you made. Like, why don't you just be more resilient or try harder or, you know, who's going to carry the boats or whatever all those podcasters yell about all the time about how you're going to be awesome in the world and everything. Like, what happens when you're just not. You know what I mean? Like, for whatever reason, wiring, circumstances, trauma, whatever's happened to you before leaves you in a position where you're just not a resilient person. Like, shit happens to you and you fold, you go, oh, my God, I'm going to lay down now. I don't believe that to be a conscious decision. It reminds me very much of. I'm going to use this example for the rest of my life. Hurricane Katrina, which at this point now is. Might have been 20 years ago. I have no idea how long ago it was standing outside of my house talking to one of my neighbors, and he says, I don't understand why they didn't leave. And I said, can you imagine being so poor or. Or so something that with days notice, you could not escape, something that was coming to kill you? Why would you just act like, I can't believe that they didn't leave? How come you can't think, oh, my gosh, what's the situation they're in that didn't allow them to leave? And I think about the resilience the same way. I hope this is making sense, right? Like, totally. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, so there are plenty of people in the world who just, like, see you and you're 20 pounds overweight. And what they think is, you don't. You eat wrong and you don't exercise. What if that's not true? Like, what if you are eating right and you do exercise and you have a genetic issue and you're 20 pounds overweight? Or here's one. What if you don't eat well and you don't exercise, but you also have three jobs and you're broke? And I think, who cares? Like I say, who cares? I don't care how you got there. I, in a perfect situation, don't want to see a human being struggling for any reason whatsoever. Why don't we look for ways to help them? Taking this all back to resilience. I just don't know. Like, there's part of me that loves when you tell me your kids are strong, and there's part of me that feels sad that they have to be. Does that make sense?

[B]

It's my every day. Yes. It makes so much sense. And it's. Notice my knee jerk response was just to pivot away from the hard stuff, because if we sit there for too long, it is. Why do any of these kids. I just listened to one of your episodes on the airplane over the weekend of, you know, why did this have to happen? And we can spend lots and lots of time and most of us who are parenting in this space have. I think you bring up a really valid point, too, which is just like acknowledging and honoring our privilege in so many different spaces to have resources and access and support systems, all of those things.

[A]

Dina, can I stop you for a second? There's an irony about me. I want everybody to understand when you said that I. I both feel that way, and I get what they call douche chills from the. From the phrase, like, I, I. When you're like, we honored our privilege, I'm like, oh, God, I don't want to be a person who honors the privilege. I was like, I would just like to be a person. It's the wording that throws me. It's really interesting. Like, I 100% agree with you. You have to be able to look up once in a while and see just, you know, what you have skills, life, whatever. However your stew got made, it's resilient in this situation or it works against this thing. And I know that is privilege. I just. I'm like, I'm not from the. Part of the, Like, I don't know. I hate it when somebody says that.

[B]

You pulled for it, Scott. You pulled for it. And I had to say it because I felt like we gotta name it up front.

[A]

Although you're right. You're 100% right.

[B]

People don't leave.

[A]

When Erica uses, like, what I call therapy words, I think, oh, I agree with her. And I somehow, like, there's part of me that doesn't want. Want to be attributed to agreeing with her, but I do. It's because of the wording. The only reason I bring it up is because I think there might be a lot of people listening who have the same, like, reaction to it. And at the same time, I Think that they deserve the courtesy that comes with it.

[B]

So, you know, you taught me a new term. Douche. Chills now is forever cemented in my brain.

[A]

You don't know that word.

[B]

I don't know that. I don't know that term, but now I do. And, yeah, I mean, I feel like we have to just acknowledge it. So I don't. We don't have to use anything. Terms that give you chills of any kind. But I think it's worth saying, like, we have. We. We do. We are grateful for the resources we have.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And people can have all the aces in the world if you want, you know, like, all of the points against them and still be resilient. And so I guess, let me argue the other side.

[A]

When it gets hard, I expect you to stand up. I want you to. I want that to be your answer, whether it's easy for you or not, but Because I think that's the only answer. When a bully jumps on you and starts swinging, if you don't fight back, you're for sure going to get your ass kicked. So you might get your ass kicked fighting back. But again, I say, better going down swinging. Right. Like, you're not going to have a chance the other way. And there are going to be people who are listening, are like, well, listen, I have, like, clinical depression. I can't do it. I'm like, I'm. I'm not talking to you. You know, I'm talking to everybody who just kind of folds up. There's a moment in there, whether you realize it or not, where you. You really could just decide, like, I'm gonna stand up and get hit in the face. I'm not gonna get kicked in the side. And sometimes people don't do that. And it's hard. And I understand, like, sometimes it's the way their minds work just don't lend to fighting. We were talking about it last night. What were you talking about last night? The. Arden had a class. They were talking. I don't know the name of the. You're gonna know right away. The guy put people in a room, had them push a buzzer. They thought they were hurting people in the other room. What the hell was that called, that study?

[B]

Oh, it's like a social psychology experiment, but I do not know the name of the researcher.

[A]

Yeah, like, we were talking about it last night, and we kind of went around the room. What would you do if somebody put you on that button and you realized what was going on? And Arden looked at, like, she's like, dad wouldn't do it. Like, she's like, he just wouldn't. He. He'd say, that's stupid. I'm not doing that. She's like, I don't even know if dad would, like, go to the meeting. And she's like, but if he was there and someone said it to him, he'd say, you. I'm not doing that. And he'd stop. And then she kind of went to my wife, and we were like, well, you're kind of a people pleaser. Like, sometimes. Like, maybe if you got into that situation, thought you were doing the right thing, you know, you might do it for a little while. But I think. And we just went through our whole. We started going. I don't know if other people did this. We went through our extended family, like, oh, I think uncle this would do it. And, like, you know what I mean? And we found people in our lives that we think would gleefully have been, like, pushing the button, and some people who wouldn't, and, you know, all different things. So all that stuff about whoever it is you are, you know, when you're. You need to be resilient because typed on type one sucks. Like, I don't know what your first response is, but I know what your second one should be. And I do think that having that second response puts you in a better position to maybe not be. You know, find yourself on the ground getting kicked in the ribs. I don't know. I went on for a while there. Anyway, please tell me one thing that no one would know that gives you chills. Like, do shows, like, where you're just embarrassed. I will tell you mine if you tell me yours.

[B]

Ooh. Oh, this is going to take me a second.

[A]

What happens when you're like, oh, my God, this is very embarrassing. I wish this was not happening.

[B]

Like, what gives me the chills?

[A]

Not. Yeah, but not good chills. You understand where the phrase comes from, right?

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. No, but I. I'm trying to. Like, I'm trying.

[A]

I'll give you mine.

[B]

Okay, Give me yours, and then I'll think about mine.

[A]

Every time I hear the song Barracuda by Heart and the music pauses and they yell, barracuda. I get douche chills. I'm like, this is ridiculous. And I'm not unaware that it's a good song. It's the one part where it's done and then the music stops and they yell, barracuda. I'm like, I feel like we could have done something different in that spot, but Nothing that embarrasses you and, like, makes you upset for humanity.

[B]

It's, like, embarrassed for others. Yeah, I'm really.

[A]

Come back to it. Don't worry about it.

[B]

Yeah. No, now I'm like. I really want to have a good answer, but I'm. I'm.

[A]

I'm very judgmental about the heart song Barracuda. I just want to say that. And I had to sit through. I had to sit through them live one time to see black crows, and they sang that damn song and almost ruined my evening. Also, the black crows were excellent live back before the brothers realized they hated each other. I just want to say that too.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I'm sorry. Okay, so when you tell me your kids are strong and they're resilient, what do you mean by that exactly?

[B]

I mean, I think that you. You kind of nailed it when you said, I hope that their kids who go down swinging and also figure out how to get back up, you know.

[A]

Little water off the duck's back, too, right?

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I do a little turtle with my hand, and I say, it just rolls off your back.

[A]

Nice.

[B]

Yeah. I don't. I mean, I think. I don't. I agree with you. I don't. I don't think we know how we become resilient. In fact, during COVID I dug pretty deep, too, into, like, both research and also my own heart of, like, how are we going to get through this? So, you know, I don't. It's sort of an entity that we don't fully understand. So I hope to do it by, you know, like, showing them modeling and by also just, like, being there when they do fall down, because with type 1 diabetes, they do so much.

[A]

What did you come up with? What did you come up with during COVID Because I'll tell you.

[B]

Go ahead.

[A]

No, I would just give me a half a second, then I want to hear your thing. I just went with. Oh, we paused. Society. Like, I'm getting a break in the middle of my life is how it felt. And I know that's because I didn't have to go to a job outside of the house or something like that. There's a lot. Oh, my God. There's a lot of privilege in that. Sorry. But it's the right thing to say there.

[B]

Gotcha. Yeah, gotcha.

[A]

I make a podcast, so I was pretty much like, oh, you know, I don't know how much different Covid was than my regular life, because I don't get out of here enough to begin with. Right. But when everyone was in that same situation. Situation. Like, if you could kind of segment in your brain, the illness part. Right. Like, put that off to the side and say to yourself, well, like, I'm not old or particularly unhealthy. I think I'm going to be fine through this. You know, I felt pretty comfortable about that. The truth is, is we saved money for the first time in years because you don't realize all the things you're pissing money away on, like going to dinner or, like, little stuff like that that uses up more of your money than you think. Right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So, like, we're starting to save money. And I'm like, oh, my God. I said, kelly, I'm like, this Covid thing is going to make us, like, solvent. It's like, it's gonna be. And at the same time, like, life stopped.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, people. And I was like, oh, this is like a break from society. It's like a break from the grind. It went on too long, don't get me wrong. But, like, in the beginning, I thought that. Now when it got long, then it got worrisome, because then you're like, oh, my God, are they ever letting us at the hell out of here again? You know, like, is this gonna go that way? And. But even to that, I said to myself, nah, it'll end eventually. Yeah, like, just hang out and enjoy the break. And my kids were around more. Like, I found ways to look at it as, like. I mean, it wasn't positive, but I tried to find the positive in it as much as I could.

[B]

Oh, look at you. Sneaky, sneaky. Optimism and resilience there.

[A]

Exactly. No, I mean, I. I understand when people say that there's things about having type 1 diabetes they wouldn't give away. I've had conversations with people who say, like, you. You give them the magic wand. You say, if I gave you a magic wand, would you make your diabetes go away? Thinking everybody would say yes. There are people who. No. Because they think it's made them what they are or they identify with it at this point. It's interesting, but I'm sorry, during COVID you.

[B]

No, I think all of this is very relevant and so interesting, and I think about it a lot. For better or worse. You know, I guess I'll answer two ways, one specific to diabetes. Like, my husband and I often. People say, like, oh, you know, you two are the best suited to do this for anyone. And we often roll our eyes, and I often say, you know, you don't want to have to find out that you can do hard things well together, right? Like, I don't wish that for any couple. I don't want to have to put you to the test, but unfortunately, life happened and, like, we were put to the test, and I feel. I feel happy and extremely grateful that I have a partner who, like, does hard with me really well.

[A]

I don't know how to think about that part. I still can't. I'm getting older, and I still don't know how to think about that part. I'm adopted, right? My adopted parents get divorced. I grew up really broke. I think that all these things have a lot to do with how I get through life, and I'm happy about how I get through life. But once in a while, like, you throw on, like, I don't know, an app and you're scrolling TikTok and you see someone whose life is so vapid and. And devoid of any kind of friction whatsoever, and there is a part of you that's like, would I like to know what that feels like? Would I like to not have any context for the world? Maybe that would be awesome for a day or a little while or something, But I think when I come down to it, eventually I think, no, I think I'd prefer to be me and have context than not. But I also don't know what it's like to live unencumbered like that. Like, maybe it's awesome. You know what I mean? Yeah. Anyway. Yeah.

[B]

Well, I'll leave you with my last response to.

[A]

Yeah, please.

[B]

Resilience that I. That I did draw on, honestly. And, yeah, full disclosure. Like, I read the research. I was like, what are we gonna do for kids? I mostly work with kids, but I think it kind of relates to diabetes. And honestly, it relates to the podcast. Is what the research showed in early kids is there was sort of this, like, secret sauce for some kids, especially during horrible catastrophe. So, you know, Hurricane Katrina, probably Covid, although it was happening live time when I was reading this stuff, and there was one researcher named Ann Masten, and she came up with the term ordinary magic. And essentially, kids who experience horrible, horrible things, trauma, tragedy, if they had one adult who just sort of held them at the center of their world. She called it ordinary magic. It sort of transcended tragedy, or it helped them plant the seeds of what you're asking, what is resilience? How do we define it? The truth is, like, I don't know. I don't feel like I have a very good answer for you. But I do know that holding onto the idea that if you make a difference in one little person's life and be that person, it does matter. And I know it sounds. Yeah, a little douche. Douche.

[A]

No, I didn't get. I liked it. So hold them. I'll let you know what's douchey. And right now it's Barracuda. Okay. Thank God. The music just stops and they yell Barracuda. Psychologically, is it because the music gets quiet and I feel like it's turned. Like maybe I feel exposed during that. I wonder. That's not. For now. Hold a young person at the center of. How did you put that?

[B]

Oh, I don't know. I don't like to have to quote it again. Just sort of like holding a young person at the center of. Of your world, making them feel the most important. Just playing with them on the floor, getting into their little world and helping them feel seen when all these terrible things are happening around them.

[A]

Protected.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

A sense of home. There's a protector there. Somebody's got your back. That whole feeling like you. If an adult helps a child feel that way, what. What happens for them?

[B]

They are more likely to turn out okay.

[A]

Really?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Opposite aces list.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

Yeah, that's correct. Is there that?

[B]

Oh, yeah, there is that.

[A]

How come I've never wondered that?

[B]

No, it is. It's. Well, protective factors, I guess, is what we would say.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

But there's some cool new terminology for it, too, and I'm not. It's not coming into my mind right now.

[A]

I'll figure it out. I have a computer. I can.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, the protective factors. But one of them is just this ordinary magic, and I feel like, honestly, at the risk of sounding kind of cheesy, it's. It's like why I'm here. It's why I found your podcast. It's because I think if you sort of touch one person who then helps one kid, you know, seen or better, or that they can go down swinging, like you said. I think we've done right. You know, I'm. I'm also a psychologist, so I was trained to think that too, but I think it's how I always thought about the world.

[A]

Tell me about what. What about the podcast is attractive to you?

[B]

Just the feeling of, like, there's other people out there who get this. Yeah, there's other people out there who get me. I just listened to one of your little cute episodes about, like, how to bolus for oatmeal, and I was like, oh, it just feels like, yeah, you're Speaking my language. I don't have to explain myself. So there's just a relief in having a community that understands our experience, especially as parents.

[A]

Okay, is there something about how I do it or the way the conversations go that are particularly attractive to you? Or are you in one of those situations where you don't actually like me a lot, but you like the content? Or does that make sense? Because there are people who really don't like me that still listen to the podcast, which I find I think it's because I bring together the people they're interested in listening to. But, like, I mean, is it your thing? Like, would I be your thing if this was a podcast about something else? Or do you see what I'm asking?

[B]

I like you, Scott. That's what you're asking.

[A]

Oh, okay. That's not what I was asking, but that's okay. Good, Keep going. No, I love the way this is going.

[B]

I like your style. I like the conversations. I wish I had more time is genuinely how I feel. Like I don't have time to listen to all the things I'd like to listen to.

[A]

Sure.

[B]

And I also experience a little bit of burnout sometimes with like the. With just the content in general. Like, sometimes I need my diabetes info and I need to, like, get it and I need to get out, you know, Like, I think that's part of my experience is I'm gonna, like, lean in. I actually just was talking to a girlfriend on my way to meet with you, and she said you never talk publicly about diabetes. You know, we're not the family that like, does the walk and puts up all the Facebook things. Like, we just sort of. Again, I just kind of follow my kids lead on that. And so I don't like, wave my diabetes flag, my diabetes mommy flag around a lot.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And when I do, it takes a lot of energy. It's hiring. So I think I save my podcast, my juice box moments for like my sort of private, like, I need to fill my cup, I need to get my info. My husband does not listen. He's listened to a few episodes because I've like, hunted them his way. He gets really oversaturated really fast. And so I think, you know, I like sort of like the quick tips and tricks and things that I can stash away because I use them all the frickin time, like, all the time.

[A]

Good, good.

[B]

And then I also have to like, you know, consume with care, too, in.

[A]

Another episode that you haven't heard yet, but people listening may have just heard recently. I talked about being at a public event or a private event. Excuse me. Where I was speaking to about 650 people. And I was telling. I was responding to a question, telling an emotional story, and somehow one of the people in the audience has sympathetic. God, I forget what they call it now. Anyway, Gets chest pains and passes out if he gets filled with too much empathy. Syncope or. No, not syncope. There's a word they used. I can't remember what it was. Anyway, I'm telling a story, and I made a guy pass out. Just. Yeah, so. Yeah, so it was like, you know, he was okay. Like, he kind of lost it for a second. Came back. They were able to help him. It's a thing they know happens to it. He knows happens to him. He, you know, EMS came, but he didn't leave the premises. Like, the whole thing. That's not the point of the story. That was just enough for context for you. The story is this. This happens while I'm speaking. Like, I see motion out ahead of me. That's. I don't know how to put it. If you've ever been up on stage, you know, like the. You don't actually look at anybody. Usually pick a couple of people and look them in the face. If you're talking, I happen to be in a situation where I was lit, so you really can't see anything but silhouettes. And one of the silhouettes moved oddly, and I knew it. Like, I. Like your brain's. Like, that wasn't right. Like, the motion wasn't right. And I turned my head in time to hear somebody said, we need help. And so it all kind of devolves from there the way you would expect. You know, at first, people are calm. Then you see what's going on. Some people rush over to help, trying to get him out of the room to help him privately, but he can't make it. That makes them dump the 650 people out of the room into the. Into the hall. And so now we're out there mulling around. You know, EMS comes in with a gurney. It's all kind of scary and everything people are, you know, are experiencing this altogether. And 10 minutes later, they take him away. And like I said, he didn't even leave the premises. He was fine. And they move everybody else back into the room. And I go to the person running it, and I go, you know, if you get my mic back on, I can keep going. And she looked at me like I was a sociopath. And I thought, oh, my God, what's happening. And she goes, no, we're going to give everybody the hour off. You can do your other talk later in the day, but we're cutting this one short, and these people need time to process. And I was like, no, they don't. Just tell them to sit the down and we'll keep going. It'll be fine. I realized in that moment, I'm not a sociopath, at least not for that reason. If I am. But what I am is somebody who's been through so much shit that this was not upsetting to me. I was like, oh, we dealt with it. He's okay, let's keep going.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I really, for a half a second, looked out in the room, and I thought, I wish I could talk to all these people right now. I want to know how many of them were like, yeah, let's get to lunch so I can process this. And how many of them were like, yo, let's keep going. You know, Like. Like, okay, he's good. Like, life moves on. Let's go. And I guess I'm answering my own question from earlier, because I like that about myself. Like, I could have sat back down and just kept going. Like, this was not nearly the. This doesn't even, like, make my list of bad things that's happened to me. You know what I mean? And totally. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, I just want to tell you that that's. That's how I judged your husband. And then I went to this. I feel like your husband would have been like, a lot has happened here. We should take a break and then have lunch. Is he that person, or am I unfairly shining this light on him?

[B]

I think that it's more he. He really needs to. He's really good at compartmentalizing, and I suck at it.

[A]

Oh, okay.

[B]

And so. So he, like. He wants to, like, open the diabetes box, close the diabetes box, and then. Yeah. Then he wants to, like, go have lunch.

[A]

Is he protecting himself, you think?

[B]

I think, yeah, definitely.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Oh, yeah. It's too much. He's such a. He's just. Yeah. He's a deeply feeling guy, and you talk about it all the time. It also gets. I don't know, takes over all the little corners if you let it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I think it's also protective, you know, keep.

[A]

He's keeping it from being his entire life and maybe keeping himself from feeling that. Both of his kids were diagnosed with type 1 diabetes 30 days apart, and all the autoimmunes on his side of the family. Right. I mean, you've thought about that before. Right. It's his fault, not yours. I understand.

[B]

Well.

[A]

All I know is I have seen stuff and lived through it and pressed on to the point where what I just described you, which is me on stage with lights in my face with 650 people hanging on what I'm saying, and then this happens in the middle of the thing, and I just thought, like, all right, well, let's keep going. And I wondered, after I realized that about myself, I wondered how many people would judge me as callous. Do you know what I mean? But, like, in the end, that they couldn't keep going. I actually thought to myself, like, this is some white people right here. Just sit back down. We're okay. He's fine. They just told you he's fine. Keep going. Like, be an adult. Like, process it and let's go. But. And by the way, I want to say this, too, in case they're listening. I don't think they did anything wrong. I understand what they did. And from a professional standpoint, I probably would have made the same decision. Like, I just think that, like, talking about it and breaking it down like this, like, those were my internal thoughts. My internal thoughts were like, I can keep going anyway. Not the.

[B]

Well, there you go. That's the definition, though, right? The definition is like, you're right. Some people can't.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And I don't always believe it's because that they have their life experience. I think sometimes it's like an inside factor that we don't even really understand very well. Like, why are you a guy who can keep going? There's also a guy who would jump off the stage and go try to rescue that person, even though you have no business doing that. Yeah, right. Or that would be overly invested in that person's story and now have them on the podcast. And, like, there's lots of different ways to respond to that type of adversity. And you're right. Like, I. You just defined it for yourself. Like, I'm the guy who can just keep going. And it's not because you don't care or because you were told, like, he's okay. So we're going to just. Okay, we're going to move on.

[A]

I assessed it very quickly. I turned to the woman next to me who I knew knew him, and I said, does he have type 1 diabetes? And she said, no. And I said, well, then I ain't gonna be much help.

[B]

I have no business helping.

[A]

I mean, if that guy's blood sugar is low, y' all should Back up. I know what to do. Right. Like, but if that's not the case, then I'm not valuable here. And there are enough people around him that could help him keep from hurting himself or whatever, which. It didn't look like it was gonna happen anyway. And somebody had already gone for, like. Like, somebody had called for ems. Like, I was like, I should get out of the way. Like, I. At one point, I actually thought this was a private situation. I shouldn't even be looking at this. And, you know, once somebody had him, I walked out of the room. Like, I started leaving the room as they were saying we should all go outside. I was like, yeah, no kidding. We shouldn't be gawking while this is happening to him. Yeah. You know, Right.

[B]

Also very adaptive to just walk away. Right. Let people whose job it is to take care of him take care of him.

[A]

Five seconds later was out in the hall, and some lady was like, oh, my God. You were like, I'm so sorry your thing got cut short. And. And she started. It's funny how quickly it pivoted because this lovely woman got me outside, and she's like, I'm so sorry, I'm not going to get to hear the rest of what you have to say. She said, you're such an eloquent speaker. And I. Right away, like, I smiled and said, thank you. But ask people who know me privately. I've now been talking about that for a week because I don't believe myself to be an eloquent speaker. When she said it to me, I was like, oh, God, Like, I can't even begin to tell you what I. What? Like, the. The rabbit hole my head went down. Like, I was like, I'm not an eloquent speaker. What does that say about her? What does it say about me? Like, what is it? Like, how is she taking me? Like, well, how am I? Like, I. Why would she think that of me? Like, self doubt inside about that. You should. And please. He was still on the floor and I was in. I was already moving on to, like, another, like, thought thing. So, anyway, so you like the podcast because it's like, sameness. You can get some information from it, you can walk away from it when you need to, but it's there when you come. Am I. Am I about getting this right?

[B]

Yeah, perfect.

[A]

And I'm. I'm somehow entertaining to you, even though you're on the west coast, the podcast is huge in California, and yet I don't, like, think I'm always interested about that because I Do have. As much as I don't like to think of people as having, like, regional differences, I realize that that's actually true. I just don't like thinking about people that way. I prefer to think we're all kind of the same. But I get that. Like, I've heard people say that, like, I'm coarse or they call me east coast or something like that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, and I don't know what that means.

[B]

Yeah, well, that's a whole subculture. I am from. From Colorado. I went to school on the east coast and have stayed. I'm actually here. I'm here on your coast.

[A]

Oh, so you have both experiences.

[B]

Yeah, but I totally. Oh, yeah. When I went to college, people would say, well, like, where are you really from? Like, is that like. Like, you said you're from Denver, but, like, what's your address?

[A]

Nobody's really from Denver. That's a mountain, isn't it?

[B]

Yeah, exactly. Or. Right. Because if you're from Boston, like, you're really not from Boston. Right. You're from Newton or Needham or. Right. Like, no one's really from Boston.

[A]

Right. So.

[B]

Yeah, I think there are some. Some geographic stereotypes for sure.

[A]

Speaking of sneaky things, I. I love the way you just slipped in to make sure we knew you went to a good school in. In Massachusetts. That was nice.

[B]

There's a lot of schools in Massachusetts. Watch it.

[A]

I sniffed this right out. I know what you're doing. Don't you worry. Good job.

[B]

Scott. I am so sorry that I'm gonna have to hang up, but I have to get back to my office.

[A]

Oh, these freaking people and their jobs.

[B]

Well, you know, I gotta. I gotta get back. Someone's gotta bring home the bacon.

[A]

I'll say. Thank you very much for doing this. I thought. This is a really interesting conversation. I appreciate it very much. I hope you enjoyed it as well.

[B]

I really did, and I. I am extremely grateful. So thank you. Thank you so much for inviting me on.

[A]

No, you're. You're terrific. I'm gonna hit pause. Just give me two seconds and I'll let you go. Thank you. Are you tired of getting a rash from your CGM adhesive? Give the Eversense 365 a try. Eversensecgm.com Juicebox beautiful silicone that they use. It changes every day. It keeps it fresh. Not only that, you only have to change the sensor once a year. So, I mean, that's better. Head now to tandom diabetes.com juicebox and check out today's sponsor, Tandem Diabetes Care. I think you're going to find exactly what you're looking for at that link, including a way to sign up and get started with the Tandem MOBI system. Arden has been getting her diabetes these supplies from US MED for three years. You can as well usmed.com juicebox or call 888-721-1514 My thanks to USMED for sponsoring this episode and for being longtime sponsors of the Juice Box Podcast. There are links in the show notes and [e-mail] to us Med and all the sponsors. As the holidays approach, I want to thank all of my good friends for coming back to the Juice Box Podcast over and over again. It means the world to me. It's the greatest gift you could give me. Thank you so very much. Unless of course you want to share the show with someone else. Then that would be an awesome gift too. Or a five star review. I don't know. You don't really owe me a gift. But I mean if you're looking for something to do, you know, subscribe and follow, tell a friend, etc. Thank you. Merry Christmas. Oh my, did I get lucky. The Celebrity Cruise Line reached out to me and said, how would you like to come on a cruise before your Juice cruise so you can get a real good look at the Celebrity Beyond Cruise ship and share some video with your listeners? I said thank you. So that's where I might be right now. If it's December, let me actually find the date for you. Not 100% sure. I think I'm going in December, right before Christmas, you know, like, I don't know, like the third or fourth week of December. I'm sorry, I know this isn't much of an ad, but if you want to see video from me on the cruise ship, my wife and I are going to head out and really check it out to see what it's all about to grab some great video for you. Get it up on TikTok, Instagram and Facebook so you can see what you'd be getting if you came along on Juice Cruise 2026, which of course leaves from Miami on June 21, 2026. We're going to be going to Cococay in the Bahamas, San Juan, Puerto Rico, St. Kitts and Nevis. Do not miss it. It's a great opportunity to meet other people living with type 1 diabetes, to form friendships, to learn things and just swap stories. It's a relaxing vacation with a bunch of people who get what your life is like. And trust me, there's a lot of value in that. Juiceboxpodcast.com Juice Juice Cruise come check it out and go find my socials to see what that ship looks like. There's also a video at my link that's a kind of a ship tour for the celebrity beyond. And let me tell you something, if this ship is a tenth as nice as this video is, I am in for a great time and so are you. Juiceboxpodcast.com JuiceCruise come along, have a podcast. Want it to sound fantastic? Wrongwayrecording.com.