#1754 Bolus 4 - McDonalds

Summary

Juicebox Podcast: Type 1 Diabetes

Episode #1754 – Bolus 4: McDonald's

Host: Scott Benner
Guest: Jenny Smith
Date: January 30, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into real-world bolusing strategies for eating at McDonald’s—focusing on how to properly cover high-carb, high-fat, high-protein fast food with insulin for people with type 1 diabetes. Scott and Jenny lean into the philosophy of “living well with diabetes.” They use the new Bolus Calculator (developed by Scott and available at juiceboxpodcast.com/bolus4) to model how much insulin is needed for various McDonald’s meals, providing numbers, methods, and some lighthearted banter around nutrition, judgment, and the realities of eating fast food with T1D.

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Key Discussion Points

1. Intentionality and No Judgment

• Scott frames the conversation as practical and non-judgmental: “Everybody's thing you put in your body, it's entirely your choice. I certainly just want you to cover it the right way, which is obviously the intent for Bolus 4 to begin with.” (02:37, Jenny)
• Emphasis on the approach: not technical, but about “how we think about it,” to help listeners understand the process, not just the math.

2. The “Meal Bolt” Methodology

• The show follows the “Meal Bolt” protocol:
  • Measure the meal
  • Evaluate yourself
  • Add the base units
  • Layer a correction
  • Build the bolus shape
  • Offset the timing
  • Look at CGM, tweak for next time
• Although not explicitly broken down at each step, the hosts keep this structure in mind while analyzing meals.

3. Staggering Fast Food Numbers

• The discussion kicks off with shock over just how many Happy Meals are sold daily in the US: “Two and a half to three million a day.” (04:03, Scott)
• Both hosts marvel at how much fast food is culturally normal, reinforcing the practical need for this episode.

4. Exploring the Numbers: McDonald’s Meal Calculations

Using Scott’s new calculator, they model several different McDonald’s meals to show:

A. Cheeseburger Happy Meal (06:03)

• 60g carbs, 16g fat, 22g protein, 475 calories
• Insulin-to-carb ratio: 10
• Sensitivity factor: 50
• Target BG: 90
• Blood sugar: 100, stable arrow
• Calculator result:
  • 6.2u up front, 2.3u extended over 4 hours (Total: 8.5u)
  • “Total dose, eight and a half units.” (08:47, Jenny)

B. Large Fries (09:08)

• 65g carbs, 23g fat, 7g protein
• Calculator result:
  • 6.77u up front, 2.35u extended over 4 hours
• “Hamburger Happy Meal and the large fry. Basically the same bolus as far as it goes.” (10:14, Scott)

C. Quarter Pounder with Cheese (11:04)

• 42g carbs, 26g fat, 30g protein
• Calculator result:
  • 4.4u meal bolus, 3.54u extended over 5 hours
• Jenny notes, “Everybody’s digestion…is a little bit different. So it’s one of those experimental [things]…” (11:53, Jenny)

D. Filet-O-Fish Meal (with Sprite and Fries) (20:26)

• 145g carbs, 34g fat, 21g protein
• Blood sugar: 80, falling arrow
• Calculator result:
  • 14.9u up front, 3.9u extended over 5 hours (18.8u total)
• Jenny: “I only use about 26 units a day, total. … That’s like, half my insulin for lunch.” (21:58, Jenny)

E. Double Quarter Pounder Meal (w/Coke) (22:17)

• 156g carbs, 57g fat, 53g protein, 1330 calories
• BG: 80, falling arrow
• Calculator result:
  • 16u up front, 7.25u over 8 hours (23:38)
• "You're not getting out front of this fat all day." (23:29, Scott)
• Jenny: “It's absolutely [possible]. The teenage guys that I work with many times need ... compensation for sometimes 8 to 12 hours after they're done eating.” (23:58, Jenny)

F. Four Piece McCrispy Chicken Strips (31:10)

• 24g carbs, 23g fat, 40g protein
• Calculator result:
  • 2.8u up front, 3.67u over 5 hours
• “The carbs actually require less than the fat and protein.” (31:18, Jenny)

G. Sausage, Egg & Cheese McGriddle Meal (w/hash brown, coffee) (32:42)

• 63g carbs, 41g fat, 21g protein, 1050 calories
• Calculator (average settings):
  • 6.7u up front, 4.53u over 8 hours
• As insulin sensitivity lowers (i.e., more insulin resistant):
  • “That same meal … in a more insulin-resistant person goes from 6.7 up front ... to 14.5 up front, 10.07 over 8 hours… If that person … was really only comfortable with 12 [units], you are going to spend the rest of your day with a high blood sugar.” (33:55, Scott)

H. Large Vanilla Shake (39:01)

• 133g carbs, 19g fat, 17g protein
• “If it was a 4.5 [insulin:c] ratio, 36 [sensitivity]: 29.5 up front, 5.3 over 4 hours—34.87 units.” (41:17, Scott)
• “85 total sugars ... 21 teaspoons of sugar” (41:54, Jenny)

I. Chicken Nuggets + Small Fries + Apple Slices for Kids (43:58)

• Carbs: 45; Fat: 21; Protein: 12
• Ratio 10, Sensitivity 50:
  • 4.5u up front, 2.37u over 4 hours
• “[No one] is extending these things. I think that's where they're seeing the rises later.” (46:17, Scott)

5. Understanding Fat & Protein Bolusing

• Many people under-bolus for fat and protein because they were “only ever taught to count the carbohydrates.” (12:29, Jenny)
• “Once I start using it, you see improved glycemic control…” (12:29, Jenny)
• The “Warsaw Method” is referenced for calculating fat/protein dosing, and links/resources are available at juiceboxpodcast.com.

6. Common Pitfalls and Practical Lessons

• Settings must be accurate for the calculator to work.
• Many people’s background settings (basal, carb ratio, sensitivity) may not be correct—there’s a tool for double-checking at juiceboxpodcast.com/settings.
• If you're not giving enough insulin, you'll be “nickel and diming it all day”—trying to chase highs for hours after a fatty, sugary meal (35:12, Scott).

7. Meal Customizations, Sauces, and Surprising Carbs

• Sauces can add significant (and often overlooked) carbs:
  • Sweet & sour: 11g
  • Honey mustard: 6g
  • Honey packet: 12g
• McDonald's website is praised for transparency of nutrition info: “This website is awesome. ... It is completely open and clear about what's in this stuff.” (37:03, Scott)

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Noteworthy Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On honest nutrition advice:

  • Jenny: "Have I said that before? Like please don't eat this. Maybe I have...I just want you to cover it the right way.” (02:37, Jenny)

• On shocking insulin doses:

  • Scott: “If this was me, I'm probably gonna lose my mind here. And get the bacon Quarter pounder with cheese.” (22:16, Scott)
  • Jenny: “The only thing that actually made me pause was the amount of initial, like 14 units.” (21:30, Jenny)

• On “hidden” bolus needs:

  • Scott: “Nobody is extending these things. I think that's where they're seeing the rises later.” (46:17, Scott)

• On fast food’s hidden sugars:

  • “Can you imagine if I sat you at a table and I dumped 21 teaspoons of sugar, and I was like, get it in right now. Make it happen.” (42:11, Scott)

• On cultural eating habits:

  • “I've had to drive south a lot...You get below about North Carolina, you're lucky to find a diet soda in a refrigerator at a gas station anywhere.” (25:51, Scott)

• On practical reality:

  • “In the end, you're going to eat what you're going to eat. I'm not in charge. Jenny's not in charge. But … just please cover it with a proper amount of insulin.” (42:49, Scott)

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Timestamps of Key Segments

| Topic/Quote | Timestamp | |---|---| | Bolus 4 method & setting up the episode | 00:00–03:11 | | Happy Meals—America’s love affair & mind-blowing stats | 03:27–04:10 | | Setting up the Bolus Calculator & first McDonald’s meal | 04:44–06:35 | | Cheeseburger Happy Meal: Numbers & calculator walkthrough | 06:35–08:47 | | Large fries analysis | 09:08–10:14 | | Quarter Pounder with Cheese walkthrough | 11:04–11:45 | | Importance of fat/protein bolusing (“Warsaw Method”) | 12:29–13:28 | | Filet-O-Fish meal, shocking insulin dose | 20:26–21:58 | | Double Quarter Pounder meal, soda, and extended bolus | 22:16–23:58 | | Chicken strips—fat/protein dominate bolus need | 31:10–31:33 | | McGriddle meal; How insulin need changes with settings | 33:06–35:12 | | Why people chase highs after fast food | 35:12–36:12 | | Dip sauces & hidden carbs | 36:30–36:34 | | Vanilla shake, teaspoons of sugar | 39:01–41:59 | | “No one is extending...” – kids’ McNuggets + fries example | 43:58–46:19 |

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Final Insights & Takeaways

• No moralizing: The episode steers away from telling listeners what (not) to eat; instead, it prioritizes covering whatever food is eaten appropriately with enough insulin and the correct timing.
• High fat/protein = longer insulin duration: Many McDonald’s meals drive huge insulin needs and call for multi-hour extended boluses, which many may not realize.
• Calculator as a tool: The Juicebox Podcast Bolus Calculator can help approximate needs—but only if you know and input your true, up-to-date settings.
• Settings matter: Double-check your insulin-to-carb ratio and insulin sensitivity; many struggle because of “wonky” settings, not just poor carb estimates.
• Transparency is good: McDonald’s (and the hosts) are celebrated for putting all the numbers out there.

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Closing Moments

• Jenny shares her “typical” healthy lunch for contrast: “Lunch today is cabbage…an avocado kind of dressing…and then a bowl of blueberries and some scrambled eggs.” (46:43)
• Both hosts express hope the episode is “fun but helpful,” and re-emphasize that knowledge and intentionality beat fear.
  • “I hope people had fun, but I actually think it was...helpful for people.” (46:35, Scott)
• Calculator and resources available at juiceboxpodcast.com/bolus4.
• The “Bolus 4” series and calculators are tools, not replacements for advice from your endocrinologist.

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For more, explore the episode series, calculators, and resources at juiceboxpodcast.com. Bold With Insulin!

Transcript

[A]

Friends, we're all back together for the next episode of the Juice Box Podcast. Welcome. While you're listening, please remember that nothing you hear on the Juice Box Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise. Always consult a physician before making any changes to your healthcare plan or or becoming bold with insulin. In every episode of Bolus 4, Jenny Smith and I are going to take a few minutes to talk through how to Bolus. Jenny and I are going to follow a little bit of a roadmap called Meal Bolt. Measure the meal, evaluate yourself, add the base units, layer a correction, build the bolus shape, offset the timing, look at the CGM tweak for next time. Having said that, these episodes are going to be very conversational and not incredibly technical. We want you to hear how we think about it, but we also would like you to know that this is kind of the pathway we're considering while we're talking about it. So while you might not hear us say every letter of Meal Bolt in every episode, we will be thinking about it while we're talking. If you want to learn more, go to juiceboxpodcast.com meal bolt in today's episode, we're going to head over to Ronald McDonald's and see what he's got to offer. This episode of the Juice Box Podcast is sponsored by the Contour Next Gen Blood Glucose Meter. Learn more and get started [e-mail] Juicebox Today's podcast episode is sponsored by Medtronic Diabetes, who is making life with diabetes easier with the MiniMed 780G system and their new sensor options, which include the Instinct sensor made by Abbott. Would you like to unleash the full potential of the MiniMed 780G system? You can do that at my link medtronicdiabetes.com juicebox I'm hitting record to tell Jenny this because I don't want her to be able to argue with me too much. Is like this is like asking your wife for something in public.

[B]

I feel like I feel backed into a corner.

[A]

Don't worry, you will be Will you help me do something today? And I know you won't have any trouble with this. I shouldn't joke like this, but I want to do some Bolus for some stuff that I know that you're going to want to tell people not to eat the whole time, but I'm going to ask you not to do that.

[B]

And I yes, 100% and I will say that. Have I said that before? Like please don't eat this. Maybe I have And I'm sorry if I've done that because every. Everybody's thing you put in your body, it's entirely your choice. I certainly just want you to cover it the right way, which is obviously the intent for the bolus four to begin with.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

So, yes. I, I don't want people to be like, oh my God. Jenny doesn't. Well, no, no, no.

[A]

I think your intention has been very clear. It's just this one's going to knock you over and I just want you to be able to breathe through it, that's all.

[B]

It's worse than the boba tea.

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

That one was kind of knocked me over. I was like, what?

[A]

I gotta tell you, I thought it was. I didn't think it was going to be. But as I picked through and looked at the things that I wanted to talk about today and some of the stuff I picked out, I, it's, I mean, it's going to be some significant insulin and, and some significant extensions and stuff like that.

[B]

But, but it's also stuff people are doing.

[A]

Well, here's what it came from. It came from me the other day, listening to somebody talk about something and they, they talked about how many Happy Meals are consumed in America. McDonald's Happy Meals. So today we're going to Bolus for McDonald's. Okay. We're going to pick out a few different things. Okay, I'm going to give you the number. Actually, let's let you guess. How many Happy Meals, cheeseburger Happy Meals do you think are sold daily in the U.S.

[B]

I don't. Oh my God, I don't even know. A million? I don't know. I have no idea.

[A]

Two and a half to three million a day. They think sales exceed about a billion annually.

[B]

Isn't that still on their signs? McDonald's like this many billions served or something?

[A]

I don't know. I mean, it's a, it used to.

[B]

Be when we were a kid, we'd wait for the number to change.

[A]

Yeah, it's a hell of a flex, I'll tell you that from a business perspective. But I heard that somewhere and I thought, okay, like, that means they're beaten. They're being eaten all the time. So we should talk about it like, you know, and so I am going to, I'm also going to, I'm going to put, I'm asking you to put yourself out. I'm going to put myself out here too. I've, you know, I've put together a calculator to, to help you Put meal boluses together. I've not made it public yet. I am going to make it public for this episode and. And leave it up. It's going to be behind a pretty big disclaimer you're going to have to click on before you get to it. But it asks you for your insulin to carb ratio, your insulin sensitivity factor, your target blood sugar. It sets a max bolus limit at 25 as a default. You can enter carbs, fat, protein, your current blood sugar, any insulin on board, if your arrow is stable, rising or falling, and then it will generate a meal strategy for you. Okay, so I'm gonna. We're gonna use that today while we're talking about this. Cool. So cool. Hold on a second, Jenny. Hold on to your hat. Okay, what do you want to start with? Should we start with. Do you want to start with a Happy Meal? Because I brought it up first.

[B]

Let's start with a typical cheeseburger Happy Meal. Why not?

[A]

Cheeseburger Happy Meal? Let's see. Well. Oh, here's the double quarter pounder with cheese. We'll get back to that. Okay. Menu. I have to tell you this. Huge props to. To them. They don't hide anything.

[B]

This website is all there.

[A]

Very easy to get through. Hamburger.

[B]

What website are you using?

[A]

McDonald's dot com.

[B]

Oh, McDonald's. Okay.

[A]

Yeah, it's very clear. Hamburger Happy Meal, 475 calories. Now we're gonna choose some, like, standard numbers to do these with today. So let's use insulin to carb ratio. 10. What do you think a common insulin sensitivity factor would be?

[B]

50.

[A]

50. Okay, we'll make that 50. I'm gonna make the target blood sugar 90. And I don't even want to make you guess, Jenny. A cheeseburger Happy Meal comes with milk, a fry, apple slices, and the burger.

[B]

Okay, okay. Does it still come with a prize?

[A]

I'm sure it does. Yeah, it does. Actually, there's a whole part of the website that like, tells you, like, what toy is available right now.

[B]

Oh. Oh, that's fancy.

[A]

475 calories. This is not cheese, by the way. This is the.

[B]

This is cheese food.

[A]

This is. Well, I'm saying this is the hamburger version of it.

[B]

Oh, okay.

[A]

Okay. Total carbs for this thing. You want to just, like, go ahead and guess, but you don't have to think about it. Just try to guess.

[B]

Sure. I mean, I'm assume this is just the burger one, not the cheeseburger one.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

The burger probably has about 30 grams in the bun. Would be My estimate, I expect, unless they've changed it, that their French fries are a small fry.

[A]

Yeah, it's pretty small, Right?

[B]

So probably also about 30 grams of carb for the french fries, the apple slices, maybe somewhere between 10 to 15 grams, depending on how many are in the package.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And milk is usually in a carton. About 12 grams.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So this carb. If you just want the carbs. I mean, I don't know if you want proteins and stuff too, as a guess.

[A]

Well, it has. It. It's telling us here that it's. It's 60 as a total.

[B]

Oh, wow.

[A]

60 carbs total. I'm gonna take them at their word. Total fat.

[B]

Really? For all of.

[A]

Wait. Wait till we get. Wait till we get to the bigger ones.

[B]

Maybe. Maybe the serving fries is smaller then.

[A]

Okay. 16 grams of fat, total protein, total 22. This is all listed on their website. I'm gonna. I'm also gonna give you all the benefit of the doubt that you've listened to the pro tip series already and your blood sugar is 100. I'm gonna make your current blood sugar 100. No insulin on board. Stable arrow. Okay. This says that you should start with a 6.2 unit bolus, and then you're going to need a 2.3 unit extended bolus over about four hours.

[B]

Total dose of fat and protein.

[A]

Yep, total dose. Eight and a half units.

[B]

And the 6.2 is because target is 90 and blood sugar was a hundred.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

That extra 0.2. Right. Okay.

[A]

Yeah. It's trying to. Trying to get you to Target.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Okay. So now there you go. That's a. That's a hamburger Happy Meal. Now let's pretend you're not a kid and you're like a. Like a regular person and you just want a French fry. Jenny, you just want a large fry, right?

[B]

A large fry.

[A]

Yeah. Well, your time of the month is coming. You're out on the road, you're driving around, you think, ooh, salt and Styrofoam. This is what I want.

[B]

Okay, I guess.

[A]

Okay. And we're gonna leave everything the same, but change the carbs. Now, in that large fry, there are 65 carbs.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

23 grams of fat. There's actually 7 grams of protein in there. So just a large fry. If your current blood sugar is 100, you have no insulin on board. Just the Large fry is 6.77 units. Yeah. And it's asking for a 2.35, extended over four hours for the fat, you'll think that's a little Heavy. Right. You think Warsaw is a heavy.

[B]

I was just curious what so. Well, we had a whole, whole packaged meal before that had, I'm assuming, about the same amount of fat in it as this does.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

To make it about the same for the fat protein extension, I think there's.

[A]

About 6 more grams of fat in this, but there's. There's less sugar in this.

[B]

Less sugar.

[A]

Yes. So there's no. So total sugars in the fries. Zero. Total.

[B]

And in sugars, be clear about that.

[A]

It says total sugar, zero, added sugar. Zero.

[B]

Right. Which means that these aren't no carbohydrate, they're just. I have no sugar added.

[A]

They didn't sprinkle any sugar over top of it. Yes, yes. There was more sugar in the Happy Meal because of the apples, I would.

[B]

Imagine, and the milk.

[A]

The little milk and the whole other thing. Right. But my point in doing this one next is the hamburger Happy Meal and the large fry. Basically the same bolus as. As far as it goes. Right. Now, why don't we do. Why don't we do just a Quarter Pounder with cheese or Royale with Cheese? If you've seen Pulp Fiction.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Yes, you have.

[B]

Many times.

[A]

My God. I know. Probably like once a year for quite some time. 42 carbs. This is just the burger. 26 grams of fat in the burger. Protein, 30. That's encouraging somehow. So just the quarter.

[B]

Did you know we're all supposed to be eating more protein and fat now?

[A]

Right? I heard that. Yeah.

[B]

Sorry, I had to sneak that in there.

[A]

So this. This just this Quarter pounder with cheese, 4.4 unit meal bolus with three and a half, 3.5. 4 over five hours. And you'll probably tell me five hours is a little long.

[B]

You think it might be, but it's a good. I would have guessed probably at least four.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Again, everybody's digestion in terms of that is a little bit different. So it's one of those experimental. But you go with what's recommended. And then you make. If this is your thing to do once a week on Friday on your way home from work, and that's what you like, then.

[A]

Right on.

[B]

At least you got enough experimentation time.

[A]

I. I'm telling you that I'm doing this a little bit because I want people to see that the calculator is kind of a quick, easy way to like, figure out some things. I also kind of want them to. To. I want people listening to think. Oh, I would not have guessed that much. Like, that's kind of. That's my kind of idea here?

[B]

Well, I know and I think it's, it's valid because it is something that over and over when I work with people individually, it comes into the discussion and there's, there's a piece that I can see in people's face, you know, when we're talking about it, that I never, I never thought about that. Even though we've had this fat protein piece already in the mix for several years now, it's been a little bit more forefront in discussing the impact I do feel. I do see that people still undercover it though, and I expect from a consideration of more worry that it's can I really need this much more insulin? I was only ever taught to count the carbohydrates, right? How is it that I missed covering so much and now that I start using it, you see improved glycemic control, which is fantastic.

[A]

Are there some people who just don't need to bolus for fat? Because they come to me online, they'll like, they're like, listen, I never need to bolus your fat. Or do you think their settings are just so wonky and they're used to giving themselves so much insulin they're covering it and not realizing it? Unlike other systems that will wait until your blood sugar is 180 before delivering corrections, the MiniMed 780G system is the only system with meal detection technology that automatically detects rising sugar levels and delivers more insulin as needed to help keep your sugar levels in range even if you're not a perfect carb counter. Today's episode of the Juice Box Podcast is sponsored by Medtronic diabetes and their MiniMed 780G system, which gives you real choices. Because the MiniMed 780G system works with the Instinct sensor made by Abbott as well as the Simplera Sync and Guardian 4 sensors, giving you options. The Instinct sensor is the longest wear Sensor yet, lasting 15 days and designed exclusively for the Mini Med 780G. And don't forget Medtronic Diabetes makes technology accessible for you with comprehensive insurance support programs to help you with your out of pocket costs. We're switching from other pump and CGM systems. Learn more and get started today with my link medtronicdiabetes.com juicebox the contour next Gen Blood Glucose Meter is sponsoring this episode of the Juice Box Podcast and it's entirely possible that it is less expensive in cash than you're paying right now for your meter through your insurance company. That's right. If you go to my Link contour next.com juicebox you're going to find links to Walmart, Amazon, Walgreens, CVS, Rite Aid, Kroger and Meijer. You could be paying more right now through your insurance for your test strips and meter, or then you would pay through MyLink for the contour Next Gen and Contour Next test strips in cash. What am I saying? My link may be cheaper out of your pocket than you're paying right now, even with your insurance. And I don't know what meter you have right now, I can't say that. But what I can say for sure is that the Contour Next Gen meter is accurate, it is reliable, and it is the meter that we've been using for for years. Contour next.com juicebox and if you already have a contour meter and you're buying test strips, doing so through the Juice Box podcast link will help to support the show.

[B]

A blanket answer would be that something else behind the scenes has likely not been tested without the amount of fat that they've been typically eating. I mean, high fat is usually deemed at more than about 20 grams per sitting, right? And at that point, the very good potential that you're going to see an impact in the later hours after that meal. Same thing with proteins. More than about 20, 25 grams of protein in a typical sitting or eating time, you have the potential to see a drift up later. Again, nothing to do with the carbohydrates that you probably really precisely counted. But as you said, I, I think that there may be the fact that people have just tested their background settings, their basal with some of the stuff in the picture that they didn't know was important to keep out to get a true base. So it's making up for an issue in a way.

[A]

Let me make your point. I just, I still had the numbers up from the quarter pounder with cheese. I deleted the carbs. So now the bowl says 0 carbs, 26 fat, 30 protein. It wants you to bolus 0.2 up front, but to set up a 3.54 unit bolus over five hours. And that's with no carbs whatsoever. Just the protein and the, and the fat. Right.

[B]

Which is. And if you're using this as an extended, which is what we're talking about from this recommendation. Right? An extended nature for those who are mostly eating either ketogenic or paleo, very low carb, higher protein or all very high fat. The idea is often covered with our insulin. So there is no extended need because that type of insulin hits in a very slow continual time period over the time that you would need coverage for these. And so it has been figured out.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. If you go to juiceboxpodcast.com, there's guides up in the menu and you choose fat and protein insulin calculator. It will, after you agree to the disclaimer, it'll explain the Warsaw Method to you in painful detail so that you can, you can understand it. There's also four episodes linked there that you can listen to about fat and protein and the Warsaw Method. And there's a small calculator there just to help you with fat and protein. Aside of, of carbs, that's not a, that's not the full calculator that I'm using here. I actually, I guess I'm going to have to decide on the link right now while we're talking because I'm going to want to put it in here. But first, Jenny, it's a special day. You've lost your mind. You've stopped at the McDonald's. Do you want.

[B]

It is a special day.

[A]

It's a special day. Do you want a big Mac meal? A quarter pounder with cheese meal, A bacon quarter pounder with cheese meal? A quarter pounder with cheese deluxe meal? A double quarter pounder with cheese meal? 10 piece nuggets. You're gonna pick the damn nuggets. Spicy McCrispy. Me spicy McCrispy. That's not easy to say. Or you want a fish filet. What do you want? What's Jenny gonna get? Because we're gonna do that one next.

[B]

If literally somebody was like you have to pick.

[A]

Well yeah, I'm forcing you to buy something at McDonald's. Which one are you gonna buy?

[B]

Which one would be the. It would be the fish.

[A]

You're such a baby. You should have picked a double burger. All right, we'll do the fish.

[B]

I don't eat other than fish.

[A]

People love the fish. Filet. Hold on a second. Fish fillet meal. 950 calories. Fair enough. 21 protein.

[B]

This is a meal. This isn't just oh Jenny, I have to eat a whole.

[A]

No, no, no. Listen to me. Fish.

[B]

Are you going to make me eat.

[A]

A shake filet o f no filet o fish meal. Right. It's got a Sprite with it and it's a classic fish sandwich. Hold on. Featuring a crispy fish filet patty made with wild caught Alaskan pollock with on melty American cheese topped with creamy McDonald's tartar sauce. That's not bad. There are 950 calories in the fish filet o fish meal at McDonald's with a medium Sprite and a medium world famous fry. So that you're going to get a medium Sprite, a medium fry. Jenny's going to drink soda and go to McDonald's in the same day. You're going to get a medium Sprite, a medium fry, and the filet o fish. Only 950 calories. But how many carbs? Just say the first number that pops in your head. A lot.

[B]

Oh, my. I don't. A lot.

[A]

145. A lot. There's 145 carbs in it. Okay.

[B]

And guess. Yeah, 150 would have been my 34.

[A]

Fat.

[B]

Fat.

[A]

Protein 21.

[B]

Let's make lower protein than I would have expected, honestly.

[A]

Well, it's probably not actually fish.

[B]

And then I'm going to hit says it's Alaskan pollock.

[A]

And because it's huge, any. I'm going to put a falling blood sugar arrow and I'm going to make your blood sugar 80 in this scenario. Okay. Because I figure you prepped before you got to the McDonald's. You're going to need. If your insulin to carb ratio is 10, your insensitivity is 50. You are going to need an initial bolus of 14.9 units and a Warsaw bolus extended over 5 hours of 3.9, for a total of 18.8 units of insulin. How many did you have yesterday? Insulin? Wait, she's throwing up in her mouth. Give us a second. Tell everybody. Jenny, you're a nutritionist, right? What'd you get that degree in?

[B]

The only thing that actually made me pause was the amount of initial, like 14 units. I don't. I think quite honestly, Jenny's stuttering you. Okay, I am stuttering because if I look at like, my stats, my total amount of insulin, honestly, in a breakdown is I only use about 26 units a day, total.

[A]

Well, you can splurge and get the filet o fish meal if you want.

[B]

To use half my insulin for food.

[A]

Yeah. Well, for lunch. Really? Now let's pretend that. Jenny, I'm going to. I'm going to be honest here. If this was me, I'm probably gonna lose my mind here. And get the bacon. Quarter pounder with cheese.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

But let's just pick.

[B]

You have to have a shake with it, Scott.

[A]

I would not. I couldn't. I'm a baby. Like, you know when people are like, you don't drink. That's crazy. I don't even understand being able to drink the volume of liquid that Somebody who drinks beer does. Like, if you gave me that much water, I'd be like, oh, I can't do all that. But let's just pick one. I'm gonna pick just from the photos, the one that looks like it's trying its hardest to kill you. So I'm going with the double quarter pounder with cheese meal. 1330 calories. You are going to get a beautiful medium Coca Cola with this. Okay. And Here we go. Carbs 156. The fat goes 57, protein 53. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you've, that you've, that you got a falling arrow going here. You're shooting for an 80 blood sugar. And this bolus for the double quarter pounder with cheese meal. If your insulin carb ratio is 10 and your insulin sensitivity is 50, is 16 units up front, 7.25 over eight hours. This thing, it's saying like, you're not getting out front of this fat all day. Do you agree with that idea that it could go up to eight hours like that?

[B]

Absolutely. The teenage guys that I work with many times need pretty considerable extended boluses or in whatever, excuse me, system. They're using some type of a compensation for sometimes 8 to 12 hours after they're done eating.

[A]

Okay, well, I mean you're hitting the, it's the fat, the protein.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The carbs and then the sugar from the soda too. I mean it's just, it's, it's, it's everything to think of total sugars in this meal. 80, 80.

[B]

I mean if there was one, I dare to say one quote, un healthy, potentially potential thing that you could do is just going to eat the food. Please just drink some water.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Don't put the stuff. Soda on top of it. Like, I, I mean that would be my, like one ask, like, just don't put the liquid sugar on it.

[A]

I'm, I'm hopeful that most people listening are like, I would not drink a regular Coke with this. But there's something to be said for the fact that McDonald's, when they're listing it on their website, believes that most people are going to. So that must be from their marketing and their understanding of what happens. Also, soda is, you know, I mean, you and I have gone over this before. Like, it is much more readily consumed than I actually thought. I actually learned something about myself this week, Johnny. I learned that, you know, in the Jurassic park film where they have the DNA kind of figured out, but they've got gaps in it, so they Figure they fill it with frog DNA. Right. I realize that when I think about other people and I have gaps in my understanding about what they do, I fill it with my, my sense ability. I didn't, I didn't realize that, actually. So, like, if I know, you know, 40% about who Jenny is, and I'm trying to imagine what you do in a situation, if I don't have the information about what you would do, I fill it with what I would do, which is probably a mental illness, I'm not going to lie. But like, so when I look, when I think about this stuff in my wildest dreams, I don't imagine getting a Coke with sugar. Right. But, you know, like, that's. A ton of people do that. I've said this before. I've had to drive south a lot for my kids, for school and stuff like that. You get below about North Carolina. Carolina. You're lucky to find a diet soda in a refrigerator at a gas station anywhere. Like, it just culturally turns into something different, you know?

[B]

Yeah. I think that also brings in. And you already said, like, within the group of large portion of people that listen to your podcast, my expectation is that the good majority of them don't drink a soda.

[A]

Yeah. But I bet you people go to McDonald's. I bet you people go to McDonald's with a lot of regularity. Right.

[B]

So I think even some of, you know, many of the people are probably like, well, I wouldn't drink the soda anyway. So let's adjust this. But now that we have a calculator, we can adjust it to what we would actually do. But in the greater. The reason it's up on the website the way that it is, as you stated, is because the small population who doesn't do it is. It's small.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

The greater population has something like this, as if it were water.

[A]

Yeah. I. And I even feel badly that they put the price up so much. Like McDonald's used to be a thing. Like you'd fly in there with five bucks and. And eat like a cake. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now it's. It's much more expensive than that. So I do think this is a good time for me to just ask you a question, let you talk for a half a second about this. Like, oh, these idea about these cat like a calculator. Right. Like this is it. Even if you're. So listen, the reason I, I made the other calculator to help you figure out what your settings are is because I also kind of, you know, after talking to people, think that it's possible a lot of their settings aren't right either. So there is a calculator up@juicebox podcast.com settings that will help you put it. You put your weight in. In pounds and it does the math for you to give you a starting spot for your. Your settings. It is not perfect. It's not going to be exactly right. But, you know, it'll at least give you the idea that if, you know, you think your insulin to carb ratio is 20 and it might look at it and go, you know, it looks more like this. You know, like, maybe you're. Maybe you're not right. Maybe you're having problems because your settings are off. It's a good place to start. It's not a rule. It's not, you know, it's not. It's not. God, it's not your. It's not your. But please see your endocrinologist. But, like, you know, you could still look and go, oh, maybe my settings aren't quite right. Or maybe they're good because this calculator is asking you to put in settings. It believes you're right when it's putting in the settings.

[B]

I was going to say just that it's the idea that if your settings are true for the most part, then this is the next step up. This is the. Yeah, I can feed it my information and it will give me something to work with. Is it going to be perfect? No, you're not saying that it is, but it is at least a step in the right direction of determining not only how much insulin, but, like, how long is this meal going to hit me. And I do have to think about that because otherwise, just counting the carbs up front, I will likely be frustrated beyond this meal.

[A]

Yeah, right. And. And I'm. I'm. I genuinely want to. I just want to be completely clear. I don't think this is a replacement for your doctor, for your common sense or for anything like that. I've just. I've had it.

[B]

It's a tool, Jenny.

[A]

I'm up to like, 1800 episodes. I've talked to a lot of people with diabetes, and I see where they. They trip up a lot of the times. It doesn't mean everybody does. Like, I put something up the other day that just explained pre bolusing and one person, like, you know, the post did great. Like, I mean, it's 66,000 views on Facebook. Okay. And it was just a little breakdown of, like, you know, some, like, big ideas around pre bolusing and a Place where you can go to hear more about it. Most people were like, thumbs up. This is great. Thank you. It helped me. One guy was like, that's not how it works for me. And I was like, valid. Completely valid. It doesn't work for you. I don't know why your digestion might be different. Maybe you've got a little gastroparesis going. Like, I have no idea. Like, it's not a blanket statement. None of this is a blanket statement for anybody. Actually, as I sat down here this morning, I got a text from somebody who's helping another person who's more newly diagnosed. And that person's been listening to, I think, pro tips, and they're panicking a little bit. They feel like there's so many things to remember. And the response back. And I think this person did a great job in support was, you don't have to do everything they say in that podcast. Right, Right. Like that's. That's kind of like the whole thing. Like, you just take the basics you need and build off of it. I'm saying the same thing here. So. But let's. Do you want to do a break? You know what we should do, honestly? Because there's going to be people that are like, I don't eat that garbage burger. Scott. I have the chicken, so let's do the McCrispy strips. I'm going to go a four piece and tell you that a MC.

[B]

Anything baked there?

[A]

Oh, I don't believe there's an oven anywhere. No, no, no, I don't. I don't. I don't think that's happening at all.

[B]

That's funny.

[A]

Yeah. Where would they put that?

[B]

I would also take too much time.

[A]

This is just the four chicken strips, 24 carbs, 23 fat, 40 protein. That's just the chicken strips. Nothing else with it. I'm going to make your. I'm going to give you a rising arrow.

[B]

How many pieces this again?

[A]

Four.

[B]

Just a four piece.

[A]

Four piece. That's. Geez. Wow. That's 2.8 up front. 3.67 over five hours.

[B]

Interesting the difference there, right? The carbs actually require less than the fat and protein.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. By. By. By a fair amount. By almost a unit. Right? Yeah. That's interesting. It really is.

[B]

Where you may have missed what's going on with this meal and you get frustrated and you think, well, they must be telling me the wrong information. The carbs aren't right on this. Or I keep missing on what's happening. Bolus this way, and this happens. Ebolis this way and I get too high, it stays too high, or whatever it is, it brings in the fact that we have to start really, really paying attention to how much of the fats and proteins and as I said before, the amount at which point you are likely to need to bolus for. See, I used your little bolus four.

[A]

Thank you. Yes, yes, thank you.

[B]

When you're going to need to bolus for the fats and proteins, honestly, because everybody may find that their digestive, let's call it, or body tolerance for an amount is a little bit different. This amount, you're fine, you're golden. You just bolus for the carbs and you pre bolus the right way and it all works out totally fine. Or you do an extended bolus for just the carbs and it works out beautifully.

[A]

Great.

[B]

But there's likely a tipping point.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. Hey Jenny, it's breakfast and you're going to get a sausage, egg and cheese McGriddle meal which comes with a hash brown and a coffee, in case you're wondering. Now here's the interesting thing. I bet you that there's nothing about the coffee that would impact the, the bolus. Right. And some people really need the bolus for coffee. So.

[B]

Correct. There's nothing to calculate.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

And this is your own experience with caffeine.

[A]

So taking the coffee out of it. 63 carbs, 41 fat 21 protein. Insulin to carb ratio 10, insulin sensitivity 50. Why don't we do something here? Like, let's, let's assume, like let's just look at this. Meal 1050, target 80. Right. The bolus is 6.7 up front, 4.53 over eight hours. For the, for this. What about I guess all the fat and the protein together? Okay, but, but that's just an average insulin sensitivity. Insulin to carb ratio, let me tell you, Let me put in Arden's carb ratio and sensitivity without a GLP.

[B]

Uh huh.

[A]

Arden's carb ratio without a GLP is 4.5 and her sensitivity is about 36. So that same meal, but in a more insulin sensitive person goes from 6.7 upfront 4.53 over 8 hours to 14.5 upfront 10.07 over 8 hours just by changing the sensitivity in the carb ratio that much. Again, all I want from you guys is to understand the impacts of your food, make sure your settings are right and make, and, and so because listen, if there's a world where a person needed 24 carbs, 24 units of insulin for a sausage, egg and cheese McGriddle meal. If that person needed that and looked at that number when I cannot possibly bolus that much, I'm comfortable with 12. You know, you are going to spend not just the next couple of hours, but the impact this is indicating could be over eight hours because of the fat and protein. You're going to spend the rest of your day with a high blood sugar and there's no world where you're going to go, I probably need like 14 more units. You're going to nickel and dime it all day long. I put in a unit, it went down, it went back up. I tried two. Like, I don't want to get low. No, like that. Yeah, that's gonna be the day.

[B]

And then if that person is the one who goes back and says, could I really have under counted the amount.

[A]

Of insulin and they're gonna go, no, I, I didn't undercount the carbs.

[B]

Yeah, I didn't undercount the carbs. All the information was right. It told me 24, but I was really only comfortable with 12 or 14. About half of it. Right. They put in, they see that they're stuck and as you just said, they're, they're giving these little tiny nudges of insulin a little bit. A little bit again. A little bit again. And nothing is really moving it. I would guarantee that at the point that it's finally come down, if they went back and they looked at their insulin give to correct it is likely at or slightly more because they were trying to correct a high, which is harder to bring down once it's stuck there.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

At least the extra amount that they should have given when the system told them how much it was going to give.

[A]

Jenny, you got to trust that what you know is going to happen is going to happen. And a million percent I agree with you. You know, just timing and amount. It's a lot of insulin, but timing and amount based against the food. Hey, let's do some fun things. One packet of sweet and sour sauce. Jenny, how many carbs?

[B]

Sweet and sour sauce, one packet. 15 to 2011.

[A]

The spicy buffalo, though. Only one. My friends get the spicy buffalo tangy barbecue sauce. 11 also. I don't know if you notice this, but in a lot of these places, if you ask for more than one, they'll charge you for them. Honey mustard six. And there's just a little honey packet you get, I guess for your tea or something that actually has 12 in it. This website is again, I want to give it to McDonald's. It is completely.

[B]

You've done a nice job.

[A]

It's open and clear about what's in this stuff. McCafe caramel machito. I don't know what that is. A large 200, 400 calories, 62 carbs, 14 protein, 10 fat. I'm not gonna throw it to the calculator, but that is. That. That's. Jesus.

[B]

I saw something fascinating the other day.

[A]

I would eat at McDonald's, and now I'm getting upset.

[B]

I saw something. It's probably been around for a while, but I. I don't go there. So I. It was just a commercial for. Advertising protein on top of your coffee.

[A]

Oh, okay.

[B]

Really? On top of your drink? That has a lot of calories is what I like. That's how my brain thinks about it. Right. Thinking. Well, this particular national chain is now putting like, protein foam on the tops of their coffee drinks to. I accept.

[A]

Try to make it sound healthy.

[B]

Right. Kick into the group of, you know, the. The widespread. I have to have in more protein. I need to up my protein. Well, gosh, look at that. I can get 12, 15, 18 grams of protein on my coffee drink, and now I've gotten more protein. But whatever else was in the drink probably wasn't something you needed.

[A]

Was this. Was this Starbucks?

[B]

It is.

[A]

I think I saw this. Yeah. Where'd I see it? I was watching Beast Games and. And they. And they.

[B]

You watch those, too?

[A]

That must be. I do enjoy Beast Games. Hey, the vanilla shake. Because you brought it up a couple of times. Come on, Scott, get a shake. The small shake, 480 calories, 80 carbs, 13 fat, 10 protein.

[B]

Go to the small one.

[A]

That's the. The medium is 570 calories, 97 carbs, 12 protein, 15 fat. That 97 carbs just hit me hard. The large vanilla shake. 780 calories, 17 protein, 830, 3 carbs, 19 fat. You want to do that one in the calculator? Let's go back to the 10 insulin to carb.

[B]

I was telling you to add it to your bacon. Something, something.

[A]

Yeah. Oh, that would have probably ended my life. So I'm going to go back to. I'm going to go back to. Here, let me give you something interesting here. I'm going to put Ardent Settings in on a GLP medication.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Okay. Insulin to carb ratio, 10. Insulin sensitivity goes from 36 to.

[B]

You're never going to be 5 or 80.

[A]

Yeah, it's about 90 on this, on, on that, on the GLP. I'm going to make her target 80. I'm gonna put in this large milkshake. One hundred and thirty three carbs, 19 fat, 17 protein. I'm gonna tell you that in. In Scott's world, her blood sugar is 80 in when this milkshake's happening and falling. I'm gonna tell you that in Arden's world, I don't think she knows what her blood sugar is when she starts. But. But there you go. It's 13.3 units up front, 2.39 over four hours combined total dose of 15.69. I'm going to go right back again and put her settings in without the GLP. 4.5, 36. I don't even.

[B]

Oh, my God. That's a lot of insulin.

[A]

So the 13.3 up front, 2.39 over four hours, goes to calculated dose, 34.87 units. This exceeds your max bolus limit of 25 units. You have to. The. The. The calculator is going to make you verify this is what you want to do. So I'll. I'll change the max bolus to 40 so that it'll give me the number. 29.5 up front, 5.3 over four hours, 34.87 units. If it was a four and a half. Insulin to carb ratio. 36. Insulin sensitivity.

[B]

That's a lot of insulin.

[A]

I mean, yeah, like a lot.

[B]

And it's not. It is not uncommon to have a milkshake.

[A]

Right? A milkshake and resistance.

[B]

Type of resistance ratios of 4, 5, or 6, along with correction factors that are 35, 40, 50. That is not odd, Jenny.

[A]

This concoction has 85 total sugars in it. 67 of them are added for fun. Tell the people how many teaspoons of sugar is 85 grams of sugar in teaspoon?

[B]

How many teaspoons tablespoons?

[A]

How would you tell cups? What's the way to tell people?

[B]

Yeah, no, I mean, you'd essentially divide it into teaspoons, and that's 20. 21 teaspoons and a little dash extra. There's a decimal in there, but yeah.

[A]

Can you imagine if I sat you at a table and I dumped 21. 21 teaspoons of sugar, and I was like, get it in right now. Make it happen. Right. Oh, okay. I'm not judging any. I seriously, I'm. We're trying to have fun here. I mean, I think anybody listening to this is like, these are ridiculous numbers, but this is the. This is it. And McDonald's.com has the menu. You can go look if you want to go check out the calculator. Just to do it for fun, just to give yourself some idea. In the end, you're going to eat what you're going to eat. I'm not in charge. Jenny's not in charge. But you should. At least Jenny said it once. We've been saying it for years and years and years in the Pro tips and the Bold Beginnings and everywhere else. I don't care what you eat, just please cover it with a proper amount of insulin. There's. If you're going to eat something unhealthy, at least don't have a diabetes unhealthy. Go along with it. Like, you know, let's just pick one kind of thing. Geez, the nuggets. Just do the nuggets real quick. Wait, is there a nugget meal? There should be a value meal with nuggets in it, shouldn't there?

[B]

I don't even know.

[A]

I know. You don't know. Yeah. Wait, no, that's the strips. There's no nugget meal. What a shakedown. Wait, McValue. What does that mean? Oh my God, Jenny, look at this. The McDouble meal deal. I mean, that sounds attractive. Okay, let's end with this. This is the value menu. Okay. Okay.

[B]

I have to say that I think a nugget meal has value in the listening world, your listening listeners. Mainly because there are a lot of kiddos and there are a lot of kiddos who like chicken nuggets. Yeah, that's just a favored. It is. So for sure.

[A]

Well, listen, I can do it very quickly even though they don't have it together. A four piece nugget. Watch me do this, Jane. Watch me math. A four piece nugget. First of all, let's put the settings back 1050. So 10 insulin to carb ratio, 50 insulin sensitivity. So let's see, the nuggets are 10 carbs, 10 fat, 9 protein. That is for, for four nuggets. Okay. Okay. I'll make the arrow stable. Nothing on board. So I'm just going to tell you up front, just those four nuggets. If your insulin carb ratio is 10, insulin sensitivity is 50, it's one unit up front, 1.26 over three hours. But now I can go back here on the McValue menu and go to and look at a small fry. So let's say you're going to give your kid a small fry and a small nugget and the four piece nugget. That's going to take your carbs to 41, your fat to 21 and your protein to 12. So now what was one unit now 1.26 over time for the nuggets, nuggets and Fries goes to 4.1 now 2.37 over four hours. That's, that's pretty quick there. And the apple slices, if you're gonna throw them on there. I don't know if I can find the apple slices here. Wait, sides, I got them apple slices. This website is awesome. That takes the carbs to 45. Actually, that's all, that's really the only change here is the carbs go to 45. So you're 4.1, 2.37 later goes to 4.5, 2.37 later. So that would be four nuggets, small fry and an apple. Four and a half units up front, 2.37 over time. If your carb ratio was insulin to carb ratio was 10. Insulin sensitivity was 50. Even if you just double this for a small kid and say the carb ratio is 20 and make the sensitivity 100, same meal, 2.25 up front, 1.19 over time. Nobody is extending these things. I think that's where they're seeing the rises later. And they're very likely. Yeah, yeah. Or they're counting on their algorithm to get in front of it. But the algorithm bolt most of these algorithms bowl as a percentage of need.

[B]

And so not everything on the ride.

[A]

Not the need itself. Yeah. All right, we've done it. Jennifer. I think this is actually. I hope people had fun, but I actually think it was. I hope it was helpful for people. It's a thing that's probably in your face all the time. 3 million Happy Meals a day are sold. Almost done.

[B]

Thanks for making me eat at McDonald's.

[A]

Yeah, listen, what are you gonna have. Tell people what you're gonna have for lunch. Stop it.

[B]

Just tell em for lunch today.

[A]

Yeah, what's lunch today?

[B]

Lunch today is cabbage. And like I've got a dressing that I put on top of the cabbage. It's like an avocado kind of dressing.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And then I'm going to have a bowl of blueberries and then some scrambled eggs.

[A]

It's 11:30. You've eaten already today or.

[B]

No, I have not.

[A]

No, I have not eaten yet either. I think I'm gonna go downstairs and poach two eggs and have a piece of sourdough with it, maybe little piece.

[B]

10:30 my time. So.

[A]

Yeah, it's a little early for you still okay?

[B]

Listen, sounds good.

[A]

I appreciate this very much. Thank you.

[B]

Thank you. Happy Friday.

[A]

Yeah. Having an easy to use and accurate blood glucose meter is just one click away. Contour next.com juicebox that's right. Today's episode is sponsored by the Contour Next Gen blood glucose meter. I'd like to remind you again about the mini Med 780G automated insulin delivery system, which of course anticipates, adjusts and corrects every every five minutes 24 7. It works around the clock so you can focus on what matters. The Juicebox community knows the importance of using technology to simplify managing diabetes. To learn more about how you can spend less time and effort managing your diabetes, Visit my link MedtronicDiabetes.com Juicebox okay, I decided on a URL for this for this calculator. Juiceboxpodcast.com Bolus4 B O L U S the number 4 Bolus4 if you're new to type 1 diabetes, begin with the Bold Beginning series from the podcast. Don't take my word for it. Listen to what reviewers have said. Bold Beginnings is the best first step. I learned more in those episodes than anywhere else. This is when everything falls finally clicked. People say it takes the stress out of the early days and replaces it with clarity. They tell me this should come with the diagnosis packet that I got at the hospital. And after they listen, they recommend it to everyone who's struggling. It's straightforward, practical and easy to listen to. Bold Beginnings gives you the basics in a way that actually makes sense. If you've listened to any number of podcasts or maybe watched a YouTube video, you're very accustomed to listening to the creator of that content. Ask you and sometimes just outright beg you without any feeling of self respect for you to follow. Subscribe, share an episode. The reason that happens in podcasting specifically is because podcast players don't have a sophisticated Recommendation engine like YouTube or TikTok does. They can't watch listener behavior and then give you content that you might like. Word of mouth skips that line completely. It's an instantly expanding reach engine and really the only thing I've ever found that helps to keep the Juice Box podcast growing. So subscribe and follow because that the algorithm understands. Set up automatic downloads. Listen to the show, but share it with somebody else. Leave a five star review. Make it a thoughtful review that the algorithm can understand. I really appreciate the time it takes you to do those things and I hate that I have to say this to you because I feel like an idiot. But subscribe and follow. Tell a friend, please and thank you.