#1770 Pivot to Health

Summary

Juicebox Podcast: Type 1 Diabetes

Episode #1770 – Pivot to Health
Host: Scott Benner
Guest: Sonya Young (Board Chair, Diabetes Canada)
Date: February 13, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode centers on practical, real-life strategies for living boldly and fearlessly with diabetes. Host Scott Benner welcomes Sonya Young, Board Chair of Diabetes Canada, for a wide-ranging conversation about her later-in-life diagnosis, handling misdiagnosis, diabetes stigma, technology, relationships, and advocacy work. The discussion is infused with humor, candor, and a shared commitment to supporting others in the diabetes community.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Sonya’s Diagnosis Story: Late Onset & Misdiagnosis

• Diagnosis at 50, not 15:
  Sonya shares her unique journey, being diagnosed with Type 1 diabetes at age 50 after first being misdiagnosed with Type 2, a common error for adults.

  "I am the board chair of Diabetes Canada. That came about because I wanted to join the board after I was diagnosed at the age of 50. That's 5-0, not 15, with type 1 diabetes. And that was after being misdiagnosed with type 2." (02:14)

• Misdiagnosis Experience:
  Her symptoms (blurry vision, exhaustion) were initially attributed to age, ethnicity, stress, and work lifestyle; the correct Type 1 diagnosis came only after treatment for Type 2 failed.

  "It was the... knee jerk reaction of 'you're Asian, late 40s, early 50s, you must have type 2.' She prescribed metformin, told me to get a blood glucose meter... but it wasn't working." (17:55)

• Impact of the Correct Diagnosis:
  Sonya felt immense relief upon finally getting the correct diagnosis, noting the sense of blame placed on people with Type 2.

  "The first thing I felt was a sense of relief that it wasn't type two, because that meant it wasn't my fault." (20:14)

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The Mental Load of Diabetes: Decisions, Exhaustion, & Daily Realities

• Daily Decision Fatigue:
  Both Scott and Sonya discuss the constant stream of decisions and mental effort required for T1D, from tech malfunctions to travel prep and everyday logistics.

  Scott: "When I hear that line about people with diabetes make... 186, 304 different decisions every day. There is part of me that feels like that's just social media. And I have to remind myself... That number might be right. It might be low." (07:00)

• Tech Trouble on the Road:
  Sonya describes a travel mishap leading to severe DKA after tech failures and insulin delivery issues.

  "My sensor kept cropping out. I accidentally pulled off my pod. We had to put a new one on in the parking lot. [...] All that to say I ended up in severe DKA that night and ended up in the ER." (08:16)

• Resourcefulness & Humor:
  Sonya shares how she uses her diagnosis to her advantage when possible, e.g., jumping restaurant lines when running low.

  "I wave at the hostess, and it's in the red. It's like, lady, I need a table now... So, you know, make it work for you if you can." (13:04)

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Living With Diabetes: Relationships, Advocacy, and Stigma

• Adapting Relationships:
  Sonya talks about how she and her husband navigated her diagnosis and, more recently, his own T2 diagnosis—blending support and independence, even having friendly competitions about A1C and tech preferences.

  "I'm fairly independent, so this was mine. I am managing it. He doesn't even follow me... His first things out of his mouth is, do you need juice? And I'll go, no, that's the microwave." (24:28)

• Stigma and Guilt:
  Both discuss widespread diabetes stigma and misconceptions—especially the false blame placed on people with T2.

  "I didn't realize how stigmatizing diabetes actually was. I think because I'm at the age where I don't really care what people think about me anymore." (41:45)

• Work & Identity:
  Sonya credits her diagnosis with helping her break away from an all-consuming legal career and find meaning in advocacy.

  "Being diagnosed with diabetes probably saved my life because if I hadn't... I'd have kept working at the law firm and probably keeled over at my desk at some point... This really forced me to take stock of, well, what do you really want to do?" (45:42)

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Advocacy, Community, and Diabetes Canada

• Sonya’s Role:
  As Board Chair, Sonya stays deeply involved in policy, research, and support initiatives. She emphasizes the value of peer communities, research, and keeping guidelines up to date.

• Keeping Up With Science:
  She notes the inherent lag between patient experience/DYI solutions and guideline adoption, due to the need for empirical evidence.

  "They're always going to necessarily, I think for safety reasons, if nothing else, be a step behind." (36:14)

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Technology: DIY Looping, Automation, and Sleep

• Building Her Own Loop:
  Despite no tech background, Sonya successfully builds and uses a DIY looping system—highlighting the empowerment and improved sleep that technology delivers.

  "The one thing it did is it let me sleep through the night. Oh my God. The first time I got through like the solid eight hours... If nothing else." (56:06)

• The Work of Balance:
  Both acknowledge the tension between striving for great time-in-range and not letting diabetes dominate life.

  "I want to be 95% time in range. And my endo looks at me and goes, yeah, or you could actually have a life, right." (58:59)
  Scott responds: "I think you can have your 95% range and have a life, too. You just have to put the work up front..." (59:14)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On Late Diagnosis & Stigma

• “The first thing I felt was a sense of relief that it wasn't type two, because that meant it wasn't my fault.” – Sonya (20:14)

On the Mental Load

• "It's the whole exhaustion from dealing with the extra 186 decisions a day when I'm fighting with the loop and when the sensors are crashing out." – Sonya (02:58)
• "I saw the area, looked around, found food, looked at the line—how long would it take me to get it started?" – Scott (07:40)

On Hospitalization & Advocacy

• “I had packed everything on that trip except my ketone meter, so that will never happen again.” – Sonya (15:55)

On Career Change

• “It took a little bit of something kicking me out the door.” – Sonya (47:41)

On Perfectionism & Diabetes

• “Giving yourself permission to slide a little is a pretty dangerous slippery slope...” – Sonya (60:26)

On Diabetes Community Power

• "People helping people. Kind of all in it together." – Sonya (67:04)

On Making Meaning from Challenge

• “Being diagnosed with diabetes... forced me to take stock of, well, what do you really want to do? What can you do that's going to allow you to manage this disease so you can actually live?” – Sonya (45:42)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Diagnosis Story & Misdiagnosis: 02:14 – 21:01
• Travel & DKA Incident: 08:16 – 10:57
• Impact on Work & Life Balance: 41:45 – 54:24
• DIY Loop, Sleep, & Technology: 55:38 – 56:15
• Discussion of Stigma, Advocacy, and Community: 41:45 – 66:45
• Diabetes Care System & Guidelines: 35:23 – 40:32
• Diet, Food, & Family Support: 25:19 – 27:05
• Final Reflections & Recommendations: 65:20 – 67:06

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The Episode’s Tone and Takeaways

The episode maintains a conversational, honest, and warm tone—balancing humor and gravity. Both Scott and Sonya are frank about the daily grind and emotional burden of diabetes, but they keep the focus on actionable hope, collaboration, and resilience. Sonya’s story offers relatability, inspiration, and practical insight for anyone touched by life with diabetes.

Essential Takeaway:
Embrace community, leverage technology, and never underestimate your capacity to pivot—whether that means adapting your career, attitude, or approach to care. Be bold with your insulin, and don’t let stigma or exhaustion dull your commitment to living well.

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For more resources and community:
Visit JuiceboxPodcast.com to find calculators, guides, and support groups, and consider joining Sonya and the hosts in supporting, advocating, and boldly living with diabetes.

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Transcript

[A]

Friends, we're all back together for the next episode of the Juice Box Podcast. Welcome.

[B]

My name is Sonya Young. I live in Toronto. I am the board chair of Diabetes Canada. That came about because I wanted to join the board after I was diagnosed at the age of 50. That's 5 0, not 15, with type 1 diabetes.

[A]

Hey, do you need support? I have some stuff for you. It's all free. Juicebox podcast.com click on support in the menu. Let's see what you get there. A1C and blood glucose calculator. People love that. That's actually, I think, the most popular page on the website some months. A list of great endocrinologists from listeners that's from all over the country. There's a link to the private Facebook group, to the Circle community. And we have a fantastic thing there, American Sign Language. There's a great sign language interpreter who did the entire Bold Beginning series in as myself. So if you know anybody who would benefit from that, please send them that way. Just go to juiceboxpodcast.com and click on Support. While you're there, check out the guides like the Pre Bolusing Guide, Fat and Protein Insulin calculator. Oh, gosh. Thyroid GLP Caregiver Burnout. You should go to the website. Click around a little bit on those menus. It really. There's a lot more there than you think. Nothing you hear on the Juice Box Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise. Always consult a physician before making any changes to your healthcare plan. The episode you're listening to is sponsored by usmed usmed.com juicebox or call 888-721-1514. You can get your diabetes testing supplies the same way we do from usmed. A huge thanks to my longest sponsor, Omnipod. Check out the Omnipod 5 now with my link omnipod.com juicebox you may be eligible for a free starter kit. A free Omnipod 5 starter kit at my link. Go check it out. Omnipod.com Juicebox terms and conditions apply. Full terms and conditions can be found@ omnipod.com juicebox my name is Sonia Young.

[B]

I live in Toronto. I am the board chair of Diabetes Canada. That came about because I wanted to join the board after I was diagnosed at the age of 50. That's 5 0, not 15 with type 1 diabetes. And that was after being misdiagnosed with type 2. This happened back in 2017. So I gather misdiagnosis at my age is not an uncommon thing.

[A]

So about nine years You've been living with diabetes?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. Does it seem like, does it seem that long?

[B]

Some days it feels like forever, and some days it's like this just happened. And how did it turn my life so upside down?

[A]

What do you think impacts how it feels? What makes it feel like it's forever?

[B]

I think it's the whole exhaustion from dealing with the extra 186 decisions a day when I'm fighting with the loop and when the sensors are crashing out. And it's just the general diabetes distress, I think, that a lot of people go through and it's just a slog or it's like 10 at night and I just want to go to bed and my pod goes, hey, it's expired. And it's just that extra bit. Packing for a trip. I used to go on business trips with a carry on suitcase for two weeks all over the world. Now I have a carry on suitcase with just the extra diabetes supplies and I'm forced to check luggage in, which annoys me greatly. So the only advantage to that is, though, I can get just about any liquid through. Through a security at the airport.

[A]

Arden just left the house like 20 minutes ago, and she's helping a friend today. So her friend is in fashion and Arden's gonna go model a bunch of clothing for her and just stand there and I guess look pretty while they. She gets her picture taken. And you know, she left with so much clothing. Like, she actually, she looks like she's moving back to college. Right. And you know her. The car's packed. It's. There's lights in it and cameras and clothing and all this other stuff. And then this little bag that has extra low snacks, it has insulin, two pumps, two CGMs, because she's driving, you know, about an hour and a half from the house.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And I swear it's. I take your point because most days I think nothing of it. I'm like, here's the bag, go ahead and go. Right?

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

But there are some times I see her leave with that bag, like she's going to go out, I don't know, with friends for the evening, and I see that bag go in the back of her car and I do feel terrible she has to carry it with her.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

So I can't imagine actually being the person who thinks like, if I don't bring this bag, then, you know, something's going to go wrong and then I'm going to have to, whatever, it's going to interfere with my day. So I take your Point.

[B]

Yeah. And what drives me crazy is because I switch between a knapsack and a purse and. And my luggage, and inevitably, the one thing I need is the one thing that's not in the bag.

[A]

Didn't make the transfer.

[B]

No, it didn't. Somewhere along the line, my insulin pen vanished, and suddenly my pot had crapped out. Or. Or I didn't bring enough low snacks. And it's just. Yeah, it's just not good.

[A]

I'll share something here. And if Arden hears it, I hope she takes it in the spirit of me sharing with other people and not complaining. But my wife and I went on a cruise last week, and we did three excursions. Dominican, Puerto Rico, and Tortola. And did three different things. And my. Every time we got done at the end of the day, one of my takeaways from the day was, this was so much easier because Ardyn wasn't here.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I did. I felt terrible about that. And I also thought that, like, we got done doing this. This thing. It was beautiful, actually. It was a system of. It was a cave system on the shore of the ocean, but it wasn't actually a cave. It was fallen boulders that created a cave system. That makes sense, right? It was very, very cool. And it was a lot of walking and climbing and traversing, and we got done and went to, like, you know, a little beach where there was, you know, some people selling stuff, and. And my wife was. As soon as we got there, I. I found the food, and I assessed how long the line was, and I thought, why did I just do that? Because I'm not hungry. And then I realized, like, I would have already been prepping to make sure Arden had food if she needed it after we did this exercise thing. And then instead, we sat down and screwed around and bought a T shirt and talked to a vendor and messed around before we left. I came out of that thing, saw daylight, looked around, saw food. And my first thought was, how long's that line? If I needed to get to food, how long would it take me?

[B]

So anyway, it adds an entire layer on top of everything else. It sucks up a lot of brain space sometimes.

[A]

Yeah. I think it's important for me to share that. Not just. Maybe not even for the people listening, but for myself, because I have to admit that when I hear that line about people with diabetes make. Everybody makes up a different number. 186, 304 different decisions every day. There is part of me that feels like that's just social media. And I have to remind Myself. That number might be right. It might be low, you know, it might be. You know what I mean? Like how it feels. It almost feels like it's just somebody's tagline to make their meme pop or something like that, but it's a real thing and it happens to me and I don't even realize it, you know?

[B]

Yeah, it just becomes a. It just becomes a reflex.

[A]

Yeah. I'm telling you, I just, I saw, I saw the area, looked around, found food, looked at the line. How long would it take me to get it started? I. I felt myself like wondering where my wallet was. Like that whole thing. Like, you know that if Ardyn was with us that it's possible that 10 minutes after we stopped we would have heard beep, beep, beep, you know, and oh gosh, maybe she's low from the activity. Anyway, that was terribly depressing. Why are we talking about this? What else should we talk about?

[B]

I could make it even more depressing.

[A]

Get to it, Sonia.

[B]

Cool. We actually went on a trip in the fall and we went through the Rockies. So we took the train from Vancouver up to Jasper and then picked up a car. Car and drove down the highway down to Banff. And. And so one of the hikes we did was the valley of the 10 peaks. Now doing a hike when you don't usually do that much exercise and you're trying to figure out how much food you should bring along is a bit of a challenge. My sensor kept cropping out. I accidentally pulled off my pod. We had to put a new one on in the parking lot. I don't think I did it right. We ended up in Edmonton that night having dinner with my cousins at some place that was just carb loaded. All that to say I ended up in severe DKA that night and ended up in the ER.

[A]

Really?

[B]

And yeah, that was the fun 18 hours of, of the end of our trip. So. And it was just because there were so many new inputs, I think I just. And a perfect storm with my tech failing. Because tech is great until it isn't. I had never been in severe dka. Like when I got diagnosed it was just the usual, I'm really thirsty and, and got sent for blood tests and my A1C was 11 type of thing. But this was, this was full blown. And I thought, oh man, when people have kids that get diagnosed that way, it just must be so terrifying.

[A]

Yeah, well, it definitely, I mean, just their stories, you know, forgetting that I even have my own personal story about that happening to a child Hearing other people's. It's frightening sometimes.

[B]

Yeah. Like, I didn't think it was that big of a deal until I got back. And a friend of mine said, oh, yeah, she. She knew somebody whose daughter was 6 when she was diagnosed and ended up in the ICU for three days. And I thought, holy crap.

[A]

Because I didn't.

[B]

I got out of there in 18 hours. I mean, I was doing pretty good.

[A]

Yeah. And you think it was just because you maybe just didn't get the new pump on correctly?

[B]

I think I. Well, I have a frozen shoulder, so I had to put it on a new spot. So I asked my husband to put my. It's. It's an omnipod dash, so to put it on. And I think he was so tentative that it was. It stuck to me, but I don't think it was. It was on securely enough for the cannula to have gone in.

[A]

Sure.

[B]

And then when I went to. Because I had been hiking and we finally ended up at dinner and I was pretty low, I threw in a bolus for a bunch of food because this was one of those Brazilian steakhouses with the side dishes that all had carbs in them. And. And then I accidentally did it twice.

[A]

No kidding.

[B]

So, yeah, I double bolster myself for some reason or another. Anyway, so, yeah, it all. It all. It's fine. I'm fine now. But it was not a fun experience. And. And it's never fun when you're doing it and you're not anywhere near your home either.

[A]

So I want to know more about that. But let me tell you this. I don't think Arden would mind me sharing. The other night, we had food brought in, and then Kelly was like, it's going to take forever. Like, can you go get it to speed it up? And I was like, yeah, sure. So I, you know, picked the food up, and again, I did the same thing I always do. I texted Arden, I'll be home in five minutes with the food. Like, just right. It's kind of like my, hey, if you haven't pre bolus, this is your reminder that it's already too late. And that was it, you know? And a couple hours. A couple. Two hours later, she starts to get, like, we're sitting around and she starts to get low. And I look over at her when the beeping happens, and you can see the confused look on her face like, I shouldn't be low. What's happening?

[B]

Right. Yeah.

[A]

So I didn't, like, interfere. Right. But I did open my app and look, and I Thought, oh, it's weird. She bolused and then it. Then she bolst again, like. Like five or ten minutes, like, later, right. I said, arden, did you eat enough to cover the 50 carbs? And she said, I bolus 20. And I was like, no, you bolus 20 and then 30. And she. And then you could see her. And she went, no. Did I?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

She really didn't know. You know, we fixed it. It wasn't like a big deal. But I think this really goes towards what you were talking about. Like, I mean, she's adept at this. This is not. Not her first day. And just maybe there were people around. We were all talking. People were running to get food. It's a couple days before Christmas. And she just, you know, bolus five minutes later, thought, like, who knows? Maybe I texted her and said, hey, you know, I'm on my way home with the food. And she thought, oh, I have to bolus forgetting that. She just did, you know.

[B]

Yeah. And. And sometimes you just hit the wrong number. Like, even last night, I thought I bolus for 60 grams. I turned out I only bolus for 30 grams because apparently I'm dyslexic when it comes to three sixes and eights. And then. And then after a couple hours after dinner, it's like, why the hell am I at 16? But, you know, so. Mmos. But it happens. Although sometimes if you are running low, it. It can get you out of the lineup at a restaurant. So I have done that, y'.

[A]

All. I gotta eat right now. You don't want the.

[B]

I wave at the what? At the hostess, and it's in the red. It's like, lady, I need a table now. And she's like, oh, my God, okay. And, you know, then I just. I get a table. So, you know, make it work for you if you can.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. And all you weirdos out there thinking you're going to make yourself low to get a seat faster. Please don't do that.

[B]

Yeah, no, don't do that. I don't recommend it.

[A]

Well. Oh, gosh. I said I wanted to hear more about something from you, and then I thought after I say this, but then I forgot. Do you remember what it was going to. What?

[B]

You were talking about DKA in the er, so.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah, I'm sorry. I'd like to know a little bit about that experience in the er. Did you feel like they knew what they were doing? Did you even have enough energy or wherewithal to care? How much does your husband understand it to Help. This episode is brought to you by Omnipod. Would you ever buy a car without test driving it first? That's a big risk to take on a pretty large investment. You wouldn't do that, right? So why would you do it? When it comes to choosing an insulin pump, most pumps come with a four year lock in period through the DME channel and you don't even get to try it first. But not Omnipod 5. Omnipod 5 is available exclusively through the pharmacy, which means it doesn't come with a typical four year DME lock in period. Plus, you can get started with a free 30 day trial to be sure it's the right choice for you or your family. My daughter has been wearing an Omnipod every day for 17 years. Are you ready to give Omnipod5 a try? Request your free starter kit today at my link omnipod.com Juicebox terms and conditions apply. Eligibility may vary. Full terms and conditions can be found@ omnipod.com juicebox find my link in the show Notes of this podcast player [e-mail] I have always disliked ordering diabetes supplies. I'm guessing you have as well. It hasn't been a problem for us for the last few years though because we began using USMED. You can too. Usmed.com juicebox or call 888-721-1514 to get your free benefits. Check. US MED has served over 1 million people living with diabetes since 1996. They carry everything you need from CGMs to insulin pumps and diabetes testing supplies and more. I'm talking about all the good ones. All your favorites, Libre 3, Dexcom, G7 and pumps like Omnipod 5, Omnipod Dash Tandem and most recently the Eyelet pump from Beta Bionics. The stuff you're looking for, they have it at usmed888-721-1514 or go to usmed.com juicebox to get started. Now use my link to support the podcast that's usmed.com juicebox or call 888-721-1514.

[B]

My husband understood enough that if I gave him instructions, he followed them to the letter and he was very good. And the poor man sat there while I threw up nine times so and didn't flinch once. So I'll give him credit on on that one. The problem I found was they were. They were very nice people. They were great. The triage nurse was fabulous. But and when I got in there my heart was pounding at that point And. But then it settled down. He took my blood sugar. It was high, but it wasn't outrageously. Outrageously high. And I was coherent, so I was probably less coherent than I normally am, but I can fake coherent pretty good. I sat there for five hours, and I had packed everything on that trip except my ketone meter, so that will never happen again. So I finally broke down because it was at a university hospital and I knew the director of the diabetes institute there. And so I actually emailed him at 5 in the morning, and he replied 12 minutes later, told me to take some insulin. I got in there and I had an endo resident looking at me going, yeah. So I got this phone call and got hauled out of bed at quarter to six in the morning. And he's looking at me like, who the hell are you? And that's how I ended up getting the help. And they were fabulous. Like, they knew what they were doing. They pushed the IV fluids, they got me back up to where I needed to be so that I could actually get on a plane the next day and go home. They were amazing.

[A]

Well, that's great. I'm happy when anybody has it. Where was that again?

[B]

It was in. In Edmonton. So Alberta? Yeah.

[A]

Is that outside of your province?

[B]

Yes. So I'm in Ontario. I'm actually in Toronto, but. And. And we were in Edmonton visiting my cousins, and it was just. It was literally the last dinner before we were going home the next day. So.

[A]

Yeah, it's really something. So I want to go back to you getting diagnosed. So were you misdiagnosed in the beginning?

[B]

I was, yeah.

[A]

How did that happen? What was that process like for you?

[B]

So I had been, you know, I. I'm a. I was a lawyer. I'm semi retired now, but I was a corporate finance lawyer and for a global law firm. And so I was traveling a lot, and I developed, like, the crappy late nights, no weekends, bad eating habits, chronic stress habits, and. And my eyesight was getting worse, and I thought, oh, my gosh, you know, that optician screwed up my new prescription. I, like, I didn't recognize the signs for what they were until I sort of look back on it. And. And so I thought I was just, you know, severe jet lag because I've been traveling. I went from London to Brussels to Beijing to Hong Kong, and home again in the space of two weeks. And I was cranky and tired. I happened to go for my annual physical and told my family doctor that my eyesight was getting kind of blurry. So she sent me to my optometrist who actually said, you either have cataracts or diabetes, and since it's both your eyes, I'm pretty sure it's diabetes, and sent me back to my GP and she sent me for lab work. That's when we figured out an A1C of 11. So it was the, I think the knee jerk reaction of your Asian. You are in your, you know, you're in your late 40s, early 50s, you must have type 2. She prescribed metformin, told me to get a blood glucose meter, but then she referred me to an endocrinologist. That was the assumption then was I had type two. Like, I showed up with a report from my GP saying she probably is type two. So that's what they tried treating first and nothing was working. I mean, it worked for a little bit because I think I was still honeymooning after about seven months of me having turned my entire life upside down from diet to exercise and whatever, and getting increasingly frustrated. And he put me on a long, like on a basal insulin, which I thought I was a failure at this because now I have to make, you know, I've started to have to take injections. And then he finally looked up one day and sort of went, did we ever test you for type one? They never did the antibody test, and so they did. And that's when we figured out it was actually type one.

[A]

How long did you live like that?

[B]

About seven, eight months.

[A]

Seven or eight months. Did things change pretty drastically when you got the type 1 diagnosis or.

[B]

It did, because I think here's the thing, and this sort of goes to the whole diabetes stigma thing is he phones me and he says, you have type one. And the first thing I felt was a sense of relief that it wasn't type two, because that meant it wasn't my fault.

[A]

Really? Yeah.

[B]

Which is a completely asinine attitude, but I think not uncommon. Which is why I think a lot of people tend not to admit they have diabetes because of the reactions and the circumstances and the misconceptions. And I think those feelings of failure are probably pretty common. So, yeah, I mean, I think it.

[A]

Feels even more universal after you describe what your job was to be perfect. I know I don't know how that sounds to other people, but, like, you come off as a bright, thoughtful, like, you know, well intended person. And. And I would imagine being an attorney. Sounds like you're moving around the world dealing with a lot of people making a lot of decisions, I have to admit. Like, I was like, oh, I can't believe she had that feeling too. But I guess it is just a human reaction to anything.

[B]

Yeah, I think so. And I'm a bit of a control freak, right?

[A]

No, stop.

[B]

But it was funny because he, he called when he called me with the type 1 diagnosis was the day before I was supposed to fly to Austin, Texas actually for meetings. So I convinced them all that I was a responsible person. I had read all the relevant chapters of the, you know, Using Insulin by John Walsh. I could manage with insulin pens. I promised to show up for an appointment when I got back and long story short, it didn't go well and I ended up coming home early. So. And it, because I don't think I at that point recognized what kind of change it was going to make to my day to day living.

[A]

So.

[B]

And getting the type one diagnosis I think was easier to manage in terms of okay, I can now do something and I'm actually seeing results. I'm not, I haven't got that frustration going on. I got my A1C down to like a decent. I'm. I run it usually around a six. I, you know, I'm more or less in range when I as you know, 80, 85% of the time. Christmas is a different story. But I also just listened to the bolas for Christmas snacks and I really want to try puppy Chow now. Anyway. I never heard of it either.

[A]

I did not know what anyone was talking about when they said that. It's funny visually I understood it like, like I know I've seen it in a bowl somewhere, but I didn't, I had no idea anybody would have called it that or, or I didn't have any context for how popular it was with people. Your parents have type 2? Anybody in your extended family?

[B]

No, a couple of my cousins have type two, my grandfather, my mom's side actually we think he had type one, but this was back in Hong Kong in I don't know, like the 20s and 30s. And so a Asian culture, you don't talk about these things. And then B. I think it was just, he just. By the time I knew him, he had. Was pretty much legally blind from diabetic retinopathy. He was on insulin from the age of about 53 onwards. And so that's where I think it sort of came through that, that side of the family got it.

[A]

Okay. Is there any other autoimmune or would you not know? How about like, do you have anything else? The thyroid or anything like that?

[B]

No, no. This, this is the only thing. I have another cousin who's allergic to just about everything on the planet, but other than that, you know. No.

[A]

How long have you been married?

[B]

Oh, gosh, 24 years.

[A]

Okay. Okay. And kids? No kids.

[B]

No kids. Dog.

[A]

Dog. And that's too much.

[B]

Dog is my kid. He's 80 pounds of enthusiastic Belgian shepherd, so.

[A]

Oh, my gosh.

[B]

It's enough.

[A]

It really is enough. I was going to say, like, you married for a fairly long time. Right. And I didn't ask you how old you are. Do you mind if I do?

[B]

I'm, I think, just slightly older than you, which I. Therefore, I get all your cultural references. I am 58.

[A]

Oh, okay. Okay. So you're 58. You've been married for 20. Oh, you. You were busy making a little life for yourself, and then you found that. Yeah. Then you found that boy. Right? Yep. Yeah. Okay. And then. Okay. But you've been married a long time. So when something like this happens, I mean, obviously it's not a thing that's gonna, like, fracture your marriage or anything like that, but it must change it somehow, right? Like, is there not a part of you that feels like you don't want to put this on him? Is there not a part of him that wonders how much of this is yours, how much he belongs in it? Can you give me some context for that dynamic?

[B]

I'm fairly independent, so this was mine. I am managing it. He doesn't even follow me. Nobody follows me. If there's a beeping sound of any source in our house, then his first things out of his mouth is, do you need juice? And I'll go, no, that's the microwave. I think he recognizes it's there. He will do whatever I ask him to do, but he won't interfere. Fear.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And then he just recently, I think it was last year or so, got diagnosed with type two. So, yeah.

[A]

Couldn't just let you have your own thing?

[B]

Of course not. Had to have his own. And I looked at him and I said, yeah, your doctor's going to give you Metformin, probably recommend something like Jardiance, and then tell you to go on Ozempic. And he's like, okay. And he goes. Goes to this doctor comes back and said, what did he say? He said, well, here's a prescription for Metformin. You probably should go on Jardiance and think about going on with mpic. I said, thank you very much.

[A]

Awesome.

[B]

And he's on a freestyle Libre, too. I'm on a Dexcom. We sort of have a little bit of a contest of whose System's better. Whose A1C is better? No, it's just me being competitive.

[A]

Interesting. Does he want your help? No. No.

[B]

He will. No. Well, to be fair, he did ask questions, especially when he was initially diagnosed. He did ask questions because he was trying to understand things. And I think diet wise, we probably already adjusted quite a bit because of my diagnosis. So we use Dreamfield's past. We use, you know, as parboiled rice. More. More vegetables and less carbs, if. If possible type of thing. And he was never one for sweets. And as long as we don't keep the potato chips in the house, I'm good.

[A]

Sonia, you and I have that in common.

[B]

Oh, my gosh.

[A]

My wife, she will not take my word for this. If she didn't buy a potato chip, I'd never eat a potato chip again in my life.

[B]

Right.

[A]

But if you put one in the house, I am sure as hell going to eat it. Yeah. And I said that to her, and she's. You're blaming me for your lack of self control. And I'm like, I am not. I'm just telling you how it is. I ran out yesterday to do a little last minute Christmas shopping. And on my way home, I was hungry, and everybody's running around. Arden and Kelly are Christmas shopping, Cole's working, and I'm like, I want a piece of grilled chicken. And so I stopped at the grocery store. I grabbed grilled chicken as I was. I grabbed chicken to grill. As I was walking out, I realized that I had only seen a couple of eggs that morning when I made my eggs. So I grabbed a dozen eggs, and I stood in the line with the eggs and the chicken under my arm, and I thought, oh, if I live by myself, this is what shopping would look like. I would just eat chicken every day. Every once in a while, I might be like, I might have a steak. And then that would, like. That would be the end of it. But no, no lie. You bring chips in here. Is Scotty going to eat the chips?

[B]

Heck, yeah.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. And that's something. I've never heard somebody else say it like that. Like the way I think about it before. Thank you. Thank you for. I don't know what you just did for me, but you made me feel.

[B]

Validating your chip addiction. I don't know, something.

[A]

Validating is definitely the right word. I don't know what we validated exactly.

[B]

I'm not sure either.

[A]

Okay, so you're using it. He's on. Did he. By the way, I don't mean to jump off of you. But, like, did he end up on a glp?

[B]

Yes, he just started it.

[A]

Just. Okay. Does he have weight to lose? Or is this just. It's about blood sugar.

[B]

No, it's about blood sugar.

[A]

Okay. I'm so interested. I'm so interested about how dosing is going to change over the next few years for this stuff, too, because right now those doses are set up just, you know, to get, like. So they could get through the FDA and say, this works. This works. This works for, you know, for weight loss, which is where they, you know, kind of, you know, even for. For blood sugar control. But there's definitely people who are taking more than they need and it's impacting their hunger when it doesn't need to. And I think there's going to be some definite changes about how it gets.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

You know, dosing, I have no.

[B]

I admit I'm a little bit concerned, and I'm kind of keeping an eye on him because he doesn't have the weight to lose. So if he's on whatever dosage is recommended and he's going to start losing weight because he's not hungry anymore, that's. That's going to be an issue. Right. So. And. And I. He's not the only one, I'm sure, who's type 2 and doesn't need the weight loss necessarily. So.

[A]

No, I'm sure.

[B]

Point.

[A]

You just have to remember to eat. I mean, and I have to say, I'm. I don't know if I'm close to three years now, but I'm well over two years, and I have come to a really interesting place where I don't want to say, eat through it. I can't overeat. I eat and then I'm full, and then I stopped. But I do have the ability to eat more. Not a lot more, but a little more right there, which I would have told you at the very beginning I could not have done. Like, once I was full, I had to stop. Now I can kind of go a little farther. So, like, you know, if I need more protein, I can eat a little more chicken. I could have a little more beef, like, whatever. Like that kind of thing.

[B]

Right.

[A]

I always wonder, like, where people's lines are, because the enjoyment factor for food is different now. And not bad, but it's different, you know, so.

[B]

Yeah, that's interesting. Like, I'm a foodie. He's not, so. But it'll be interesting to see.

[A]

Yeah. What happens to him.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Do you have any insulin resistance?

[B]

No, I don't. I'm actually. My basal rates are actually relatively low. I think so.

[A]

Okay, awesome.

[B]

I'm usually fine. I just usually. Well. And they again, Christmas snacks. And I came to. I had to come to Jesus moment when Jenny said like A cookie was 30 grams of carbs. And I was trying to delude myself into thinking There were 10 or 12.

[A]

So I don't know why I'm always high.

[B]

Yeah, it's like, why with the shortbread?

[A]

I think we undervalue carbs a lot when we're counting, you know.

[B]

Oh, hugely. And I suck at pre bolusing, so.

[A]

Yes, that's. That's a. That's a double whammy then. So you talk about the podcast like in. In loving tone. Like, how long ago did you find it?

[B]

I found it at the beginning because I was okay. I mean, was a corporate finance lawyer and I due diligence and I was diving all into the. I went down that Google rabbit hole like nobody's business. And then I actually heard your podcast mentioned on another diabetes podcast, and so I gave it a try. And it's really listening to the pro tips and the bold beginning. Well, back then, it was before the bold beginnings, you know, just getting started on. I didn't know the difference between a basil and bolus, to be honest. Why would I? Never had any reason to.

[A]

And.

[B]

And then, you know, listen to I love the ascot and Jenny, because it was like, yeah, that is an answer to. I joined the Facebook group when it was only like, what, 10,000 people?

[A]

No kidding. Yeah. You've been around for a long time. That's awesome.

[B]

I've been around for a while. I actually, when I've had other people get diagnosed, I said, go listen to the juice box podcast.

[A]

Thank you.

[B]

We are the senior VP of mission at Diabetes Canada. He is relatively new. Shout out to Shane. And I sent him to your podcast.

[A]

Oh, I love that. Thank you. I just got an email from somebody. I found it in my junk folder. It's such a funny email. Like, she is telling me how much the podcast has helped her. She's been listening for like almost five years. Like, just effusively nice about it, but sprinkles in about every three sentences that she doesn't like me. I spent the morning, I was looking at my wife and my wife's like, what's the face? And I was like, I'm reading something. Hold on a second. And I got done reading and I said, why would you send somebody fan mail and tell them that you don't like them in the same thing. And she goes, you know that happens all the time to you. And I was like, I know. I'm like, I just. I don't know why you would do it is all. I. That's the part I'm confused about. I mean, honestly, it's like if I walked up to you and went, oh, hi, I love your top. And you went, thank you. And I said, your face is terrible, but I really do love that shirt. And you said, awesome, thanks. And you said, it's no problem. Your pants is great, too. And you. Oh, I really appreciate it. So why is your hair like that, though? And like, it was. It's such a good time this morning with that.

[B]

Oh, that's funny.

[A]

Thank God. I dug through my junk mail. I never go in there. I usually just delete it, but I was. I went through and I was like, oh, look, this is an email. Let me find it. Let this person on me two days before Christmas. I don't know. I want someone to explain it to me. So if you're one of those people and you hate me, but you listen, please, come on. I'd love to understand that part. So it's really all. I don't listen to one thing. I don't like the. Right.

[B]

Well. Right. Because it's.

[A]

Well.

[B]

And I usually do the podcast while I'm walking the dog, so. And I will occasionally talk back at it while I'm walking the dog. But, yeah, if you don't. If I don't like the person, that podcast is not on my list.

[A]

What a weird thing. Like, I. For. For. I think she said, four and a half years she's been listening. I was like, oh, I appreciate it. I hope everybody. I don't care if you like me or not. I just keep listening. It was on the heels of a post yesterday where a new listener said, oh, I tried my first episode, and I found him to be condescending. And I was like, awesome. Welcome. Then one lady who I know really like, listens a lot or is very connected to the show, she jumps in. I'm used to her. She's a little cantankerous, so I'm okay. She jumped in to say what a horrible ego I have, but I was like, what is happening? Anyway, it was. It was like the best part of my week. Really, really cool. So you found it. Oh, by the way, whoever, like, whoever's podcast said my name. Like, what a mistake. She probably didn't go back to yours.

[B]

Well, to be fair, I did. Oh, did you?

[A]

Oh, okay. Well then, then, hey, then you should. Look, look, it doesn't hurt anything to pump me up, so continue that. No.

[B]

Okay. Yeah, no, I listened to a few. I, Yeah, I listened. I. I need to know these things. I need to, I need to understand what's going on, which is great. What? Because as I said, I'm on the board of diabe, which is basically the Canadian equivalent of the ada.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I was at the professional conference last month. I got to sit in on, on the, on the meetings and listen to, you know, sort of the latest and greatest in clinical practice and meet some of the researchers. So it's been, it's been amazingly fun actually.

[A]

How long will you do that? How long will you be because you're a volunteer, how long does that go for?

[B]

So I joined the board in 2021, which. And then. Which was during the pandemic, which made it interesting. And it's two, three year terms and I will be chair until April of 2027.

[A]

Nice. What does that mean? Like do you oversee things? You help events come together?

[B]

No, I basically chair the board meetings and then I keep in touch with the CEO and sort of act as a bit of a sounding board or just to be there if they need to and just basically to go to the conference or go to events and say thank you for coming out and thank you for supporting the organization because it invests in resour research, it provides all sorts of services, it owns the clinical practice guidelines. Like it's, it's everywhere.

[A]

So how do you find the, the machine's ability to stay current with what's happening? Is it by nature always going to be a little behind the curve?

[B]

Sorry, what do you mean?

[A]

What do I mean?

[B]

The machine?

[A]

I. Yeah, yeah. The professional diabetes space, like.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Versus what people are on the ground are doing, I guess, for their health.

[B]

I find it's always going to be behind for the reason that they need empirical evidence before they will endorse or support a position. Which is fair. Right. Because we're all doing it, going, hey, if I do this, this works and I've got absolutely no reason for telling you why. It just does for me. And different hacks will work for different people. With them, it's the well does aid work. We need to see the research, we need to see the data, we need to see the results. And by then we've all diyed.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So they're always going to necessarily, I think for safety reasons, if nothing else, be a step behind, I mean, as.

[A]

It should be But I'm wondering, like, from your perspective, it's interesting, right, because you have a professional perspective for their perspective and you have your personal perspective. Do you wear two hats on that? Do you find yourself frustrated by it but understand why or does it not frustrate you to see? I have two great examples from the last handful of years. One I've shared a number of times. Really well respected doctor makes this big announcement a couple of, I don't know, maybe a year and a half ago, and he, I mean, he made such a big deal out of it. And he said that if you lower your CGM target, your A1C will come down. And I was like. And he was like, we've done 10 years of research. And I was like, awesome. I, I figured that out. Like 10 years ago. I figured it out and then I said, oh, that's right. And then it worked. And I told somebody else they would happen for me too. And I went, awesome. We've got a rule. Let's move. Then the more recent one is these organizations right now sending out their newsletters like GLP1 medications just came out yesterday. Yeah, yeah. And they're, oh my God, this new thing, have you heard about it? I'm like, again, three years I've been using it. And other people have been using it longer than that, going back to Rebelsus and, you know, Jardiance and that kind of stuff too. I get frustrated by that because I think they're not really surprised by the impact of glp. Say, I know some of these people, they're very bright people. They've been paying attention for years, which means that they've gotten up every morning and sent out another newsletter that said some bull that isn't going to help anybody when they knew they could say something that would help them. And five years later they go, oh, here it is. And I don't, I find that frustrating. I really do. So anyway, I don't mean to drag you into it, but.

[B]

No, no, but, but it's interesting. So the, the endos and the certified diabetes educators, they're pretty, for the most part in some cases, but they don't, not all of them live with it on a day to day basis. So I think, for example, at Diabetes Canada, a lot of the staff actually live with Type one or type two or have kids that live with Type one. So they're super invested. Like, this is not just a job, it's a passion. It's really something like that. But then you have people that it's interesting from more of a scientific research career perspective. And then you have the GPS that, you know, have to diagnose everything under the sun and don't really understand diabetes necessarily.

[A]

Well, is, is Canada similar? Like, so here Ada kind of like lays out their rules. They just, they just sprung them on us again the other day again, like, you know, they were another one. Like these GLPs, they're magical. Like, awesome. Thanks for, thanks for getting on board. But is it the same way? They're like, you know, because the gps, they just don't move if the, if the rules, if the rule book doesn't say so. Most gps aren't going to say it out loud even if they know it. So does that happen in Canada too? I mean, I would think there's part of me that believes you're going to tell me it's probably more strict there than it is here.

[B]

So there, as I said, there are the clinical practice guidelines that Canada has, which is similar to what the ADA puts out in terms of rules. And so the latest one was that everybody should be offered, Everybody with type 1 should be offered the option of an automated insulin delivery system.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

It's like, well, duh, right? But that was after the empirical research and whatever, whatever the problem is, you can stick them in the guidelines. But if that GP is not reading those guidelines, it's really not going to help anybody in that respect. So my best friend, whose name is Patty, and shout out to Patty her data type 1, her sister just got diagnosed, went to the GP in the small town, who basically gave her a prescription for insulin and, and Ozempic and sent her on her wake. And it's like, what was she supposed to do with that?

[A]

Yeah, thanks for all the input. Now you've got tools and no idea that the hammer's for the nails.

[B]

No. And you have no idea what you're doing with them. And it's been a struggle to find the proper healthcare provider that can actually give her the tools and the education that she necessarily needs. Like, I'm doing it with the, oh, hey, that just sounds wrong. And go get a cgm, like, but that's just me, based on my life experience.

[A]

Hey, when we set this recording up before we hit play, I say the same thing to everybody I interview, so much so that I could probably record it and not know the difference. And when I tell people, you guys listening don't know this, but I'll say to them, look, just make a decision up front about using people's names. Don't tell me your neighbor Patty Six times. And then later email me and say, oh, I shouldn't have said Patti's name. I should have. I should have just said my neighbor. When I said that, did you think, oh, my God, my best friend's name is Patty 100%.

[B]

And I was totally going to use her name. And it's Patty with an I, not a Y. I just thought that must.

[A]

Have freaked you out. You must have been like, this guy's clairvoyant. This is insane.

[B]

I know.

[A]

And I don't know why I use that name, by the way. I have no clue. My mother in law's name is Pat, and other than that, I don't know a person on the planet named Patrick. And. And yet that I. Every day I. That's what I say to people. That's crazy. Oh, my gosh. All right, well, look at me. I wonder what else I know that I don't know. I know.

[B]

It's a little frightening, isn't it?

[A]

I mean, I've been frightened for a while. So what made you want to come on the podcast? I mean, after listening for so long.

[B]

I think I wanted to. To, basically. I think I have had a unique experience in terms of getting the misdiagnosis, then the diagnosis. At my age, I couldn't just have a midlife crisis and go buy a sports car. No. I had to get a chronic disease. And just my experience being a little bit closer to the organizations, the healthcare providers, and I think learning a lot about just. I didn't realize how stigmatizing diabetes actually was. I think because I'm at the age where I don't really care what people think about me anymore.

[A]

Yeah. What a great time to be. But part of our life, by the way.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. And. And then I've learned to use, you know, my T1D is kind of a tool when I lean into, like, as I was saying, if I go through security at airports, if I'm trying to jump the line, like, I just, I lean into it, I'm happy to admit. And plus, I. After private practice, I. I retired from the firm because you cannot manage type 1 as a newbie and try to run a full time transactional practice. And I joined one of my clients, which is an investment bank that specializes in health care. So, you know, I don't. Nobody cares that I have diabetes. In fact, they use me as sort of the guinea pig. When people, like startups come and say, hey, we've got this great diabetes kind of solution, and they send it to me and I look at it going, what's this one and two Other people there have type two and modi. So it's, it was never a big deal. I keep insulin in the fridge at their office. But there are people. And when, when I looked at. We did the Diabetes Canada did a survey, a stigma survey. And so there are people who won't admit to their employers that they have diabetes because they are afraid it's going to impact their job.

[A]

And it does sometimes.

[B]

And it does.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I think the stats were something like 90% of people living with, with T1D and 70% of people living with type 2 have experienced some sort of shame and blame for having diabetes.

[A]

Yeah, I believe that I'm of two minds there. Like, there's part of me that thinks it's funny. I think it's the podcaster. Part of me thinks, like, go out there, don't be afraid, tell people, shine, that whole thing. But then I realize if you were my kid, I might be like, hey, why don't you try not bringing that up until you get the job? Yeah, yeah. And then once you get the job, be ready because somebody's going to treat you differently. I'd be talking out of two sides of my mouth if I talked about that. I really do think you should tell everybody and not be ashamed. I think you should inject at the table, blah, blah, blah. But I also wouldn't tell a soul at a job at all. Interview. That's interesting, isn't it? From a lawyer's perspective, if somebody's treating you differently, obviously there's, there's avenues to take. But you have to understand the minute you do that, you, you now have an adversarial relationship. You almost have to take it if you want to keep working. Right. Like, I mean, I mean, you can say that people can't retaliate if you, you know, if you, I don't know, bring a charge or go to HR or something like that. And you're right, but that's, it's not how people work. It's still going to come back at you, I would think.

[B]

No, I mean, I think the second you go to HR with a complaint or you go to the Human Rights Commission and file a complaint, you, you, to your point, you change the relationship. You're not, you've, you turned it into an adversarial relationship as opposed to a, you know, I'm part of the team type of, of environment.

[A]

So even though they did it, but still it's not how. You're not the machine. They are so.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Right.

[A]

You're the grist in the mill. They're the mill and they're gonna grind you down. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. You're not, you're not winning that. I. When I see people do that, I'm like, they. I'm like, oh, that's not gonna end well for you. I could think of it more of from a social thing, like, I'm happy that there are people out there swinging hands and doing what's right and everything, but, you know, at the very end, I don't think you can expect to have the same relationship afterwards.

[B]

No. No, I don't think so either.

[A]

Tough one. So when you say in your note that turned it into something meaningful, did you mean with your work, with your advocacy work, or was there something else that you think has been impacted by your diabetes?

[B]

I think a couple of things. I think actually being diagnosed with diabetes probably saved my life because if I hadn't had this chronic disease that was turning my life upside down, I probably would have kept working at the law firm and probably keeled over at my desk at some point from just stress and all the bad habits that came with my life. This really forced me to take stock of, well, what do you, what do you really want to do? What can you do that's. That's going to allow you to manage this disease so you can actually live? Well, when I finished, when I retired from private practice that first week, my blood sugar levels improved by like 15%, I bet, because the background chronic stress was gone because I had done that. And then I saw the posting for the, the board vacancy at Diabetes Canada. I thought, hey, I was the board chair for another organization here in Toronto, which is an anti poverty organization. I was coming off of that board anyways, and I was looking for, probably for another volunteer position, and this popped up and I thought, well, that's serendipity, being able to volunteer and to see how much work they do and how many things, you know, in terms of programs just for people living with diabetes. They run camps for the, you know, type one kids, they do the clinical practice guidelines. They're running, running advocacy programs all the time there. It's. And being able. And being able to get close to the researchers, too. And I've been able to tour a couple labs. So you had Dr. Peter Thompson on from Winnipeg? Yes, and I actually met him in his lab because I was, I was there able to do a bit of a tour like, things like that. I would have never gotten the opportunity if I hadn't Volunteered, so. And it was, and he's a lovely, lovely guy. But having that opportunity was, was really cool.

[A]

Yeah. That's awesome. Don't give me numbers. I'm not asking for specifics. Okay. Prior to being diagnosed, could you have afforded to change careers and if so, what kept you doing that thing that was so stressful?

[B]

Yes, I could have. And I think inertia, you know, oh, I'll just do one more deal. Then I'll go, oh, I'll just do one more. Whatever I'm gonna, I'll do, I'll do this until I turn whatever age I think I. And so it, it's an all encompassing career and most of your life is spent at the law firm or, or somehow involved in that. It's not a 9 to 5, Monday to Friday type of job. So to pull yourself out of that is, takes, I think it, it took a little bit of something kicking me out the door.

[A]

And there's no downside to the change you made?

[B]

No.

[A]

Monetarily, your lifestyle, anything like that?

[B]

No. I mean, because again, we've been married, we don't have kids, so. And kids are expensive. I'm sure you, as you are well aware.

[A]

Oh my God, we just talked about this. My wife and I were standing in the airport and I said, can you imagine how much money we'd have if those kids weren't in our life? Right. Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

So no kids. It's a lot easier to do. It's something that I was lucky in terms of I had healthcare coverage. When I went in house with one of my clients, they had just started covering CGMs back then. It was kind of, of interesting when the insurance company asked me for proof that I still had type 1 diabetes the following year. And I said, oh my gosh, you guys found a cure. That's awesome. Let me know what it is.

[A]

Why, why are you hiding it from me?

[B]

Yeah, why are you hiding from everybody? So they never asked me for proof from a doctor ever again after that. It led me to make meaningful, sustainable changes to my lifestyle. And, and I don't think I could have done it while running a pretty busy practice because at the time I was, I was running the corporate group in the Toronto office. It was, I was pretty involved in terms of just the North American practice group. It. You kind of, you get sucked in there and it's hard to pull yourself out without a darn good reason other than I'm just really tired now.

[A]

Yeah. My wife has a job that feels a lot like that feels when you Describe it. And, you know, we're constantly talking about, like, how long can you possibly do this for? And, you know, and we went away. Like, she and I just went on a. Basically, there's. I have that Juice cruise coming up in June. The cruise ship. Ship had me out so that I could experience the ship so I could come back and, you know, tell you guys about it and hopefully entice you to come over. So I got. Not a free trip, but I had to pay my taxes, and still, you know, I had to pay, you know, airfare and that kind of stuff, but it was much cheaper than it would have been. I didn't have to pay for the stateroom. And so Kelly and I, you know, we went. We. We don't go away enough. And I said, look, we have this opportunity, you know, something I'm going to do for work, so you can come along. And she came, and I would say that for maybe three weeks before we left, she was upset that we were going away, really, because work. What am I gonna do? Like, that whole thing, like, there's gonna be a gap of time. And then. Then she does the. I'm not even gonna turn my phone on. Like, the. The big declarative. Like, it's not gonna happen. And, like, that's it. I have a clean, you know, clean break. But for two days, I look over at her, and she's just rubbing her clavicle like. Like the top of her chest, and I'm like, I wonder when this stress is gonna stop. You know what I mean? And maybe towards. Took four days, and then she was relaxed, just like that. And then on the flight home, I saw her open up her phone and get tense, and she was like, yeah, she's got work to do, and we're only working for a couple of days. And then it's going to be Christmas and she's going to have off a few more days, but it doesn't matter. It came right back. And for somebody who doesn't have a job like that, I don't know that they can completely understand it. The weight of the world is a great way to put it, you know.

[B]

Oh, 100%. I used to travel with a laptop. I would sit in the back of tour buses on conference calls. I would. You know, I remember standing somewhere in San Juan. I think it was the old fort or whatever, again, on a call. I would hang out, sit in the hotel room and draft things. It was. It turns your life upside down. So, I mean, I'm. I'm lucky living with this there, at this point, there's a bunch of, you know, significant advancements I don't think I could have coped before. You know, CGMS and hybrid closed loop systems and rapid acting insulin and all that stuff. Right. But I'm very lucky. I think the general lack of awareness, access and affordability is, is a huge barrier for people and it puts, and in turn, it puts like incredible pressure on the healthcare system. Right. So.

[A]

Well, I think it's very commendable whether you've got forced into the change or not, that you didn't fight it and you, and you did the thing that you thought was better for you. You.

[B]

Yeah, because it's all about me. Yeah.

[A]

Let me tell you why, Scott. It's because I'm most important. Okay.

[B]

I'm most important in my life.

[A]

Yes. Don't give me one wish from a genie. You're not getting world peace. But no, but seriously, it's, it's a, it's a leap to make. Like, there's something to having a meaningful job where you're in control and you feel powerful and just to like, you know, give it away is. It can be tough, especially when you feel like other people are counting on you. And I'm assuming you're one of those people who has knowledge in their head that everybody else doesn't exactly have in the organization. And you know that.

[B]

Yeah. And it took a while to let go. And I remember the first week after I finished private practice because, you know, attorneys bill by every six minute, like six minute increments. And I realized that for the first time in my life, life, nobody cared what I did all day, so I didn't have to justify my time to anybody. And it was a little disconcerting.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, it was like I was just kind of cut adrift.

[A]

Yeah. Like, like during COVID when you didn't know what day it was.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And you were, you were sort of like, does it matter that it's Wednesday? I'm not sure I say this a lot, but it's been really impactful on me. I'm not happy that Covid happened, but that piece of it I really found beneficial. Like not caring that the week is starting, the week is ending. This is the middle of the week, this is the weekend. I don't have any concern about that anymore. And I find it, I find it very invigorating, actually.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I just think of myself as being alive. I don't care what day it is. And it really, I don't know, it's Helped me a lot. I don't know why exactly. I haven't really examined it. I just know that I feel better not feeling the pressure of, like, this constantly starting and ending cycle.

[B]

Yeah. And. And I. And I kind of. And I said I knew I would know when I'm fully retired, and I don't think I'm quite there yet. When a weekend is no longer a weekend, to your point.

[A]

Yeah, it's just the day. And then you can get bored and start complaining about it and go back to work. It'll be awesome.

[B]

Yeah, exactly.

[A]

I'm just gonna consult, not consulting.

[B]

Well, okay. To be fair, I did my best friend Patty with an eye and I actually started a little side business. I mean, nobody's retirement is gonna. Gonna, like, profit off of it, but it just for fun and because I can't do nothing.

[A]

So I feel like I'm lucky because the thing I do is it's so playful to begin with, really. Do you know what I mean? Like, it's. It's not. I don't really feel like I'm working. It doesn't mean that I don't. I don't give a lot of hours to something, and there are times when I wish I could. Like, I do feel like I can't walk away from it. To your point, it's not the same as, you know, writing a brief on the back of a tour bus or something. But, you know, I'm. I'm on a walking tour of Puerto Rico the other day, and I'm managing the Facebook group at the same time. Time.

[B]

Right.

[A]

You know, or, you know, somebody's like, oh, you put. There's an episode and there's something wrong with the description. I'm like, okay. Or I'm. I'm scheduling recordings with people for, you know, weeks from now and stuff like that, or companies or I'm getting ready to go do something for Omnipod at their. At their headquarters. And like, you know, I had a lot of conversations during my vacation about that. And so, you know, it's not the same. I don't know. It's almost fun. You know what I mean? Like, I'm. Yeah, I'm like famous adjacent. So it's kind of fun, you know, so. But. And I. So I feel like I could do this, you know, for as long as people are interested in me doing it, honestly. Nevertheless. Okay, so you were managing with. I mean, it sounds like you're using a diy. Are you wearing Omnipod with, like, loop? What are you doing?

[B]

I am so, you know, I was listening to, listening to you and Kenny Fox talk about it and sort of going, oh, that's what's happening there. I'm a little bit terrified because I'm pushing 60 and I have an Apple developer certificate. Like I don't the hell I'm doing. But the Loop and Learn group has got amazing videos and documentation. So I managed to build it and managed to. It's on my phone and my watch and it works. It works. And you know what? The one thing it did is it let me sleep through the night.

[A]

Awesome, isn't it?

[B]

Oh my God. The first time I got through like the solid eight hours and then it was just. Yeah. If nothing else.

[A]

Yeah, I'll say. I don't care if you're using a DIY system, if you use Omnipod 5 Medtronic 780G, if you use Twist, if you use Tandem Control IQ, wait till you see how you, how much better you get to sleep. It's just really fantastic. So, yeah, and a much bigger deal, like I don't get to talk about it enough anymore because it doesn't happen to me any longer. But in the beginning of the podcast, like I was sleep deprived in a really terrible way and it was, it had incredibly terrible impacts on my health. I try to remind people all the time I didn't know it was happening, that a health decline happens so slowly that you just sort of slip, slip, slip and never realize that you've moved. And that's where I was with sleep. Until one day, like I was just laying in bed in the middle of the night and you know, I think something will woke Kelly up and she's like, what's going on? And I'm like, kelly, I'm gonna have a heart attack. Like I was sitting there and like my chest was just thumping and she's like, what's wrong? I'm like, I'm so tired and I, I just, I'm so goddamn tired. And I just, I feel like I'm gonna die. And you know, not too long later, some nice lady comes on the podcast and says, you should try this. And I tried it and I was like, oh. And then I slept. So. And now I'm a completely different person. So it's, it's pretty. I've been able to put it, put so many things in my life in order since the advent of, of an algorithm based insulin pumping system. It really has just freed me up to pay attention to a lot of other things.

[B]

That's great.

[A]

Yeah, it's awesome. I'm not telling you you need it or you have to have it or whatever, but try it. See if I'm not right. If you don't agree, then whatever, give it back or. Or, I don't know, throw it out the window. But it. I think it's worth a shot, and it seems like Sonia agrees. So.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Are you looking forward to anything with your diabetes, or do you feel like you've got it in a place now where you're like, okay, this is stasis. This works well, kind of just running in the background now, or do you still have ceiling above you?

[B]

No, I'm. I'm still. Because I'm a total control freak. I spent the first six months with the loop fighting it. You know, it's like. It's like when you talk back to the GPS system in your car, it's like, no, I'm not turning that way. And then it does that, you know, recalculating in that disapproving tone of voice. Like, been fighting it and just, I think, learning aspects of it. As I said it. It's great when I'm not trying to bolus for something, but I take the Zen approach to bolusing and sort of go, eh, that looks like 60 carbs. You know, it's so. And sometimes I'm right and sometimes I'm wrong. Just trying to get. And plus, I'm just a perfectionist in some respects, and I want to be.

[A]

Be.

[B]

You know, I want to be 95. Time and range. And my endo looks at me and goes, yeah, or you could actually have a life. Right? And so it's. It's things like that just. I'm trying to get a little bit more control on. On the numbers.

[A]

So. So I find it's funny. I. When the doctors talk like that, I get the intent, and I don't disagree with it, but I also don't think it's completely an honest statement. I think you can have your 95% range and have a life, too. I just think that there's. You have to put the work up front, like, the work, or you'll chase it all the time. And that, to me, is the thing. Like, it's one of the things I still like. I think people have the most difficulty wrapping their head around. Even when I'm talking to Arden sometimes. Like, I don't know how many times I can say to somebody, it's not just about diabetes. Like, this is a life rule. Work in the beginning makes less work later. If you ignore Something and then try to engage it once it's tumbling. That's going to take more time and more effort and give you more failure than if you just get ahead, stay ahead. Yeah, yeah. And it's so much. It gives you so much more freedom. So I don't disagree with a doctor, but I would love to take a doctor that said that and make them listen to the pro tip series and then see if they'd still have the same exact intent when they said it. Like, that's not just your doctor. I. I just think that in general, like, I'd like it if they understood a little better about how to address things before their problems.

[B]

Yeah. And I think sometimes giving somebody or giving yourself permission to slide a little is a. Is a pretty dangerous slippery slope, because how. How far are you gonna let yourself slide?

[A]

It's. It's possible that. Yeah. I, I tell you, I learned eight, nine years ago from an episode where this woman, the way she put it to me, they told me that, you know, 70 to 120 was okay, and when I got to 130, I thought, oh, that's so close to 120. 20. And then before she knew it, she apologized the way. And then she had herself in a position where she was like, what's just 200?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I said to her, I was like, but you're at blood sugar, right? Like, she's talking about taking care of her son, if I remember right. And I said, but your blood sugar right now is probably 80. She's like, yeah. I'm like, well, 200 is 120 points more. It's over 100% more than that. And I think it was that conversation. It hit her, but it also hit me, like, that idea of, like, again, that slow drift away from something that you don't realize is happening. And I take your point, but at the same time, I also take a doctor's point who says, or you could live your life.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I believe there's a way to live your life and not give away your health. I think there's a balance in there if you have the right tools and the right. The right ideas.

[B]

So I think. So you can work yourself up into a frenzy if you're trying to hit perfection and you gotta. And you can't. I mean, the 47 factors and whatever, however many, and your own body and just going through life and changes and whatever, whatever, you're always going to be on the losing end of that. But I think it comes down to as well, is just looking at the Numbers and recognizing that it's just data and you can react and tweak and do whatever in response to the data but the data shouldn't make you feel bad about yourself.

[A]

How much about your job do you think and that you're imagining good at your job? Like how do I mean this? I have a friend who's a cop and in the beginning he always thought he was right about everything because the rules were on his side. And I wonder if that does that not apply to being a lawyer where you, there's rules and then you just have to figure out how to position yourself around the rules to make them work for you. And if that's a feeling of like that's a thing I do, I can do that. And how, how frustrating must that be? When diabetes tells you it has rules in the beginning but then clearly doesn't.

[B]

It's a completely. It's the secret rules. I spent 30 years trying to head off all the potential, I guess bad results for a client. Yet like the goal is to protect the client to make sure that nothing was going to go wrong with their deal that you'd covered every possibility. I spent a lot of time imagining the worst case scenario so that I can head them off at the pass. Which causes a lot of anxiety when you kind of stop being a lawyer and you're just living your life and all of a sudden you know you've got no outlet for that. Yeah, it was, it's a, it's necessarily having to take the conscious decision that of I can't control this a hundred percent but I can do the best I can so I can lead a decent life and not end up with diabetes related complications later in life. Because that's the other danger is you can let it slide now because there's no immediate consequence. It's going to be 10 years from now when you're suddenly you can't see out of your right eye.

[A]

You know, it's a big, it's a big sticking point for me too. I, I all, I come at it from the perspective of, of why is there such a robust Type one community online but not such a robust Type two community. And I, I think that really is it that right there that a person with type 1 does not have time to ignore something. Right. They're going to have a pretty, you know, a pretty terrible impact pretty quickly if they use insulin.

[B]

Wrong.

[A]

And they're still, and they are still open to that long term issue. Whereas a type 2 might not again might be in that slow drift and not see it. It the same way. Are you just using lawyer to be colloquial with me? Colloquial with me? Aren't you a barrister or a solicitor or something like that?

[B]

Well, in Canada, you're both a barrister and a solicitor, so it's in England where they actually split the two.

[A]

Oh, okay. But that's how you. If you introduce yourself at home and somebody said, what do you do for a living? You'd say, I'm a lawyer. Oh, you would say that. Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

All right. Yeah, that's Canadian stuff's going right out the window.

[B]

No, I will never say an attorney.

[A]

Have you ever been in a room with somebody in a powdered wig?

[B]

No, no, no.

[A]

That would be England.

[B]

That would be England. But the royal. But they do do the robes when they go to court. I don't go to court because I'm more of a solicitor end of things as opposed to barrister. But yeah, the litigators will. Will show up in court in robes. Just. They don't have to wear the weird wig.

[A]

They don't have to wear the word right.

[B]

Which I'm sure must be really hot.

[A]

And itchy, but I mean, how could it not be?

[B]

Exactly. It'.

[A]

Well, I'm having a nice time, but have we talked about everything that we're supposed to talk about? Do you have other stuff? I want to make sure I don't miss anything because you are probably, like about 100 times smarter than me. So I'm assuming you have stuff in your head all lined up in order.

[B]

No, I think we covered just about everything. I think diabetes is just such a huge problem. You've built a good community around the Type one community here and just, I think. Thank you for that. And thank you to Jenny as well. I think I've learned more from Jenny than any CDE because I listen to you guys every week as opposed to my every six months appointment. So, yeah, I think it's important that everybody just. I think the whole goal is to just, you know, keep your quality of life on a good level and optimal health, you know, supportive systems, and. And part of that. And I think a large part of that is a community, so.

[A]

Well, I appreciate that. I was, you know, you thanked me. I was getting ready to thank you. That was. That's lovely. I'm trying very hard to do exactly that, and I'm thrilled that it's working. I could say every day, but I see people helped about every 30 minutes. It's just awesome. You used the word inertia earlier in Kind of a bad way. Like, what kept me in that job might have been just inertia, but I feel like the same inertia keeps this thing moving. It feeds it, it. You know, it allows me to go away for a couple days, not look at it as closely. It still works well. There's a lot of people at help in the background that you don't see, but a group, experts and admins and stuff like that. On the Facebook side, there are days I feel like I've put it in such a place that if I just said, hey, guys, it's yours. I'll be back in a month, I think it would be okay, you know? Yeah.

[B]

Oh, no. A hundred percent. And I think so. For example, the Facebook group, I actually went on when I was on the G6 and not the G7s, and I said, I keep putting in sensors and I keep blowing them. And so I put the what am I doing wrong? On the Facebook group. And 20 minutes later, somebody said, you have to wait at least six to 11 minutes before you put in the next answer is people helping people.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Kind of all in it together.

[A]

Really cool. It really is. You called it. You said diabetes is a problem. You fumford around a little bit trying to explain what you were saying, but, like, was there more to that or did you just start inarticulately?

[B]

A little bit inarticulately, but I. I think that it is way more widespread, I think, than people realize. So, like, I think there's like over 4 million people diagnosed with diabetes just in Canada.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

There's disproportionate impacts on. On radical racial groups and in Canada and indigenous communities. And if we don't get people the preventative treatment and catch them early, you're going to crush the health care system.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. So I wish we meant it when we said that the healthcare system needs to be preventative and not reactionary, but we don't actually mean that. We just say it and. Yeah, yeah. By we, I mean the people making the rules and the money and all that stuff. Yeah, it's. It's the thing they say. Oh, it's just, you know, we're always chasing it. Like, if we were just trying to get ahead of it. Yeah, we'll go ahead and get ahead of it. Oh, we can't. The rules keep. So I can't bill for that. Like, you know, it's not how it's set up. It's all just kind of bs, I think. So I'm afraid to keep talking to You. Because you bring out, like, the more articulate side of me. And I think people are listening now, and they're going to be like. Like, did he say that? She started her conversation inarticulately. I thought he was a big dumbass, so I am. I'm a big dumbass. It's okay. Ha ha. I'm so stupid. Let's go. But, yeah, I think if I talk to you much longer, I'm gonna out myself as maybe having more thoughts than I.

[B]

Well, I'll try to keep your secret. Except you just told everybody.

[A]

Hopefully they could. Honestly, the idea is, if they can't figure it out, I. I don't know. They're probably not listening to begin with. So you're really. You're lovely. I. The one thing I didn't dig into, if. If you don't mind, if I can take five seconds. Your Chinese background. Is that right? That's right, yeah. And so you talked about, like, type two being kind of a cultural issue, like I'm very accustomed to. And I've had a number of conversations with people from India, but again, that's still. It's Asian still. But I never. I guess I didn't think of Chinese as having the same issue. But is it similar? Similar?

[B]

Yeah. I think Chinese, South Asian, black communities, they all have, I think, up to twice the prevalence than. Than your white Caucasian population.

[A]

Geez.

[B]

And it's cultures where you don't talk about these things.

[A]

Yeah, that's the thing you said. Now. Now I'm remembering. So culturally, like, if you have an illness, you don't tell people why? Because they'll think, I don't know.

[B]

It's. It's just in families. Right. They don't even talk about it. Like, I never knew that my grandfather went on insulin when he was 50 until my aunt told me two years ago. And it just happened to be a conversation, and it just kind of came out. So they don't. Like, trying to learn your medical history is kind of tough.

[A]

Yeah, I just had something happen, and there were a person that I know where somebody in their family got very sick, and no one told him they were keeping it from him on purpose for no reason that I can. I mean, I listened to the story backwards and forwards. I can't understand why they would have done that. Like, why on a phone call, how's everything? Like, if I got on the phone with you and I just said, hey, how's your husband? And the answer was he was hanging from his feet over a cliff. And you went he's good. It was like that, and it went on for weeks. And I thought, like, is that familial? Is it cultural? Like, what the hell is that? That. But it freaked me out. If there's something wrong with me, I'll tell you in three seconds. Listen, wait. You hear the first month of next year, where do you hear the crazy thing that I, I, for some reason admitted to? You're gonna be like, oh, Scott, you found the line. Why did you tell people that?

[B]

Why did you cross it?

[A]

Well, I'd have kept that. You might be going, like, oh, my family might have a point. Point. Maybe some things should be kept to yourself. Anyway. Okay, well, I mean, that's a difficult thing to deal with. And you don't have kids, so you're not gonna be able to break that chain.

[B]

No, no.

[A]

Yeah, well, you'll find another way. You'll, you know, do it through your. Your advocacy.

[B]

I tell everybody everything that's wrong with my dog to the point where my husband thinks it's hilarious. So, you know, every.

[A]

I don't know what's wrong with my dog, but I think it's a mental thing. I gotta tell you, watch him fly all over the place today. I was like, just stand there for a second, like, oh, my God. Nevertheless. Okay, well, I hope you have a very happy holiday. Thank you so much for doing this with me. And I really do appreciate. I didn't come right out and say it, but I really do appreciate the. The length of time that you've put into listening to the show and that you, you know, it. It's culminating here with you coming on and sharing your story. I hope it continues to do whatever the show does for you. I hope it continues to do it for you, and I think your conversation will. Will help that to happen for somebody else. So I really appreciate your time.

[B]

Great. Thanks a lot, Scott.

[A]

It's a pleasure. Hold on one second for me, okay?

[B]

Sure. Yep.

[A]

Arden has been getting her diabetes supplies from US MED for three years. You can as well usmed.com juicebox or call 888-7211. My thanks to USMED for sponsoring this episode and for being longtime sponsors of the Juice Box podcast. There are links in the show notes and [e-mail] to us Med and all the sponsors. A huge thanks to my longest sponsor, Omnipod. Check out the Omnipod 5 now with my link omnipod.com juicebox you make may be eligible for a free starter kit. A free Omnipod 5 starter kit at my link. Go check it out. Omnipod.com Juicebox terms and conditions apply. Full terms and conditions can be found@ omnipod.com juicebox okay, well, here we are at the end of the episode. You're still with me. Thank you. I really do appreciate that. What else could you do for me? Why don't you tell a friend about the show or leave a five star review? Maybe you could make sure you're following or subscribed in your podcast app. Go to YouTube and follow me. Or Instagram TikTok. Oh gosh, here's one. Make sure you're following the podcast in the private Facebook group as well as the public Facebook page. You don't want to miss please do you not know about the private group? You have to join the private, private group. As of this recording, it has 74000 members. They're active, talking about diabetes, whatever you need to know. There's a conversation happening in there right now and I'm there all the time. Tag me. I'll say hi. Hey. I'm dropping in to tell you about a small change being made to the Juice Cruise 2026 schedule. This adjustment was made by Celebrity Cruise Lines, not by me. Anyway, we're still going out on the Celebrity beyond cruise ship, which is awesome. Check out the walkthrough [e-mail] Juice Cruise the ship is awesome. Still a seven night cruise. It still leaves out of Miami on June 21st. Actually, most of this is the same. We leave Miami June 21, head to CocoCay in the Bahamas, but then we're going to San Juan, Puerto Rico instead of St. Thomas after that. Basteria. I think I'm saying that wrong. St. Kitts and Nevis. This place is gorgeous. Google it. I mean, you're probably gonna have to go to my link to get the correct spelling because my pronunciation is so bad. But once you get the Saint Kitts and you google it, you're gonna look photo that says to you, oh, I want to go there. Come meet other people living with type 1 diabetes, from caregivers to children to adults. Last year we had a hundred people on our cruise and it was fabulous. You can see pictures to get at my link juiceboxpodcast.com juicecruise you can see those pictures from last year there. The link also gives you an opportunity to register for the cruise or to contact Suzanne from Cruise Planners. She takes care of all the logistics. I'm just excited that I might see you there. It's a beautiful event for families for singles. A wonderful opportunity to meet people, swap stories, make friendships and learn. Have a podcast. Want it to sound fantastic? Wrongwayrecording. Com.