How Brian Walshe Thought He Would Get Away With Murder with Annie Elise

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Juicy Crimes with Heather McDonald

Episode: How Brian Walshe Thought He Would Get Away With Murder with Annie Elise
Date: December 17, 2025
Host: Heather McDonald
Guest: Annie Elise (of "Tend to Life")

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Main Theme & Purpose

In this episode, Heather McDonald sits down with Annie Elise to discuss the highly publicized and sensational case of Brian Walshe, accused of murdering his wife Ana Walshe. The episode delves into the circumstances leading up to Ana's disappearance, Brian’s shady activities, their troubled marriage, the alleged murder, and the subsequent (somewhat bumbling) “cover-up.” The tone is classic “Juicy Crimes”: darkly comedic, engaging, and steeped in relatable, real-talk about love, betrayal, and the importance of never letting your Google searches implicate you.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Setting the Stage: The Walshes’ Relationship & Juicy Crime Elements

• Juicy Crime Markers: “It has the affair, the marital struggles, the cleanup, some truly unhinged and insane Google searches. It really is jam packed.” — Annie Elise ([01:56])
• Ana Walshe, successful businesswoman, commuted between D.C. and Boston; marriage faltered after Ana bought a D.C. townhouse and started an affair with her realtor, William.
• Age gap: Brian was 50, Ana was 39 at her disappearance ([06:04]).
• Brian: house-arrested for selling counterfeit Andy Warhol paintings — “He was kind of the loser in the relationship... She was definitely the breadwinner, the driver.” — Annie ([07:50])
• Ana was the family’s main provider; Brian avoided prison by claiming primary caregiver status for their three young boys ([08:24]).

2. Downward Spiral: The Days Before Ana’s Disappearance

• Ana wanted to move to D.C. and build a life with William; Brian became aware of the affair through her texts, actions, and his own Google searches.
• Heather: “She made this great sacrifice so that he wasn’t literally behind bars. What a regret.” ([09:30])
• Brian’s damning Google searches: “What's the best divorce attorney in Washington, D.C?”/“cheating wife gets impregnated...” — Annie ([10:07]).

3. Ana’s Last Known Movements and the Crime Timeline

• Ana spent Christmas Eve (2022) with her boyfriend, not her kids — a major source of marital contention ([11:09]).
• New Year’s Eve: small dinner party at Walshes’ home; last time Ana was seen alive by anyone other than Brian ([11:53]).
• Heather draws parallels to other New Year’s Eve crimes, noting the frequency of passion-fueled violence as years change ([12:05]).

4. The Aftermath: Google Searches, Cover-Up, and Investigation

• Early New Year’s Day hours: Brian’s searches included “how long before a body starts to smell,” "how to embalm a body," "10 ways to dispose of a dead body…” ([14:23]).
• Heather lampoons the “criminal stupidity” of searching such things on a synced device: “I am so thankful that these criminals are so stupid because it’s the blueprint right there and it happens time and time again and they never learn.” — Annie ([15:10])
• Brian’s searches synced across his devices and even onto his son's iPad ([15:32]).
• Ana’s workplace contacted by Brian claiming she left for D.C. on Jan 1, which was quickly disproved by evidence ([18:53]).

5. Shopping Sprees & Mounting Physical Evidence

• Brian filmed buying >$450 of cleaning supplies (bleach, hammers, buckets, etc) at Lowe’s, all within hours of Ana’s disappearance ([19:00]).
• Heather quips: “Why is it that the only husbands that get an itch to buy cleaning supplies are the murdering ones?” ([19:42])
• Continued trips to Home Depot, HomeGoods: purchase of tarps and rugs, ostensible parallels to the film "Unfaithful" ([29:27]); disposed of rugs and heavy trash bags laden with bloodstains at multiple dump sites ([29:50]).
• Annie: “Her body has never been found. I believe... he probably beat her so badly and knocked her teeth out, hoping... they wouldn't be able to identify her...” ([20:45])

6. The Defense's Strategy & Holes in Brian’s Story

• Defense: Brian claims Ana died in her sleep, he panicked and dismembered her to avoid being blamed ([30:23]).
• Annie dismantles this, emphasizing Google searches and evidence demonstrating premeditation: “Even that story starts to get dismantled because his Google searches before she apparently had what they're calling an unexplained medical incident... his literal search: how to get away with murder, not just the TV show.” ([30:55])

7. Legal Proceedings & Forensic Evidence

• Brian arrested early and initially faced three charges: first-degree murder, concealment, lying to police; pled guilty to the lesser two, maintains innocence on murder ([32:14]).
• Investigators found significant forensic evidence at dump sites: gloves, bloody towels, hazmat suits, Ana’s jewelry, boots, and purse ([33:00]).
• Heather: “It is pretty hard to get away with these killing of your wife murders lately. It's gotten a lot harder.” ([33:57])

8. Jury, Trial, and Potential Outcomes

• Trial expected to last 2–3 more weeks (as of recording) ([39:36]).
• Annie predicts conviction, calling evidence “overwhelming” ([39:36]). Motive: cheating, finances, custody — and Brian’s panic at losing control.
• Annie: “Now you’re leaving your children without a mother and without a father if you go to jail for the rest of your life... If you truly were thinking about the kids, you wouldn’t ever do something that could potentially jeopardize their entire future...” ([40:39])

9. What’s Next: The Defense’s Last Gasps

• Potential jury doubt would require some extremely compelling, as-yet-unrevealed medical history — highly unlikely ([44:31]).
• The defense may contemplate putting Brian on the stand, but it’s uncertain ([44:55]).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Heather, on New Year’s Eve murder rates:
  “People need to figure out what they're doing on New Year's Eve. If you're not in a good place with your partner, maybe go spend New Year's Eve somewhere else and not get to that heated, drunken... It's also such a weird time of the year...” ([12:58])
• Annie, on criminal stupidity:
  “I am so thankful that these criminals are so stupid because it’s the blueprint right there and it happens time and time again and they never learn.” ([15:10])
• Heather, on murderous husbands and cleaning supplies:
  “Why is it that the only husbands that get an itch to buy cleaning supplies are the murdering ones?” ([19:42])
• Annie, on dismemberment:
  “It takes an incredible amount of force to dismember somebody. And it’s also a very personal type of crime...” ([26:15])
• Annie, on crime, motive, and child impact:
  “If you truly were thinking about the kids, you wouldn’t ever do something that could potentially jeopardize their entire future of not even having either one of the parents...” ([40:39])

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Related Case Digressions

• Discussion segues into the Karen Read case, highlighting Annie’s involvement, legal mishandling, and the upcoming civil lawsuits ([45:27]-[53:36]).
• Annie plugs her new podcast “Tend to Life,” with a mention of the bizarre Rebecca Zahau case and implications about systemic flaws in certain controversial suicide rulings ([53:48]-[55:06]).
• Heather expresses appreciation for Annie’s personal stories and family updates, maintaining a light, friendly closure ([56:47]-[58:29]).

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Case Overview and Red Flags: [04:16]–[11:53]
• Brian’s Google Searches & Cover-Up: [14:23]–[20:45]
• Shopping Sprees and Evidence: [19:00]–[21:28] and [29:27]–[30:08]
• Defense’s Strategy & Legal Process: [30:23]–[32:47]
• Forensics and Technology in Crime Solving: [32:47]–[34:45]
• Trial Status and Predictions: [39:36]–[40:48]
• Karen Read & Related Cases: [45:27]–[53:36]
• Plug for Annie’s Podcast & Final Thoughts: [53:48]–[58:29]

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Summary Takeaway

This episode is a true “juicy crime” — marital betrayal, financial desperation, shockingly traceable cover-up efforts, and grim comedy from both hosts as they lambast the stupidity and tragedy of it all. The evidence against Brian Walshe appears overwhelming, especially in the digital era, underscoring both the limits of modern criminal cunning and the sad, often selfish calculus in family crime. Annie Elise’s insight, combined with Heather’s trademark wit, makes for a compelling recap for anyone fascinated by the intersection of true crime and contemporary life.

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Transcript

[Heather]

Foreign.

[Anna]

Hello and welcome to Juicy Crimes. I have my friend and she is a queen in the crime world with her hit podcast serial. Did I say it right? You did.

[Heather]

I should have never named it that.

[Anna]

Like, honestly, no, it's such a clever one. It's just like you have to think about all the syllables. But, you know, obviously it's done you just fine. You've built an incredible, you know, podcast and live shows and you really explain crimes well. And I like your take and I wanted to have you back on the show. You've been on the show a couple times and we're friends. But mostly because I was intrigued about this crime out of Boston and in doing a little research, I saw you were well versed in it. And this involves one of my favorite kind of crimes. Of course, every crime is sad, okay? But as far as the juicy elements of a juicy crime, I always say it's usually a crime of passion, involves some type of marriage where the people seem relatable to you and possibly living a picture perfect life. And then some people make some wrong moves and these, you know, their whole lives are ruined. And this was a pretty wealthy family. The woman went missing. There is an affair. There was a crime prior. There is a cleanup, a trial. Let's get into it. Why don't you walk us through this? This trial that's currently happening in Boston and the man on trial is Brian Walsh. So let's get into it.

[Heather]

This case, to your point, has it all. It has the affair, the marital struggles, the cleanup, some truly unhinged and insane Google searches. It really is jam packed.

[Anna]

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[Monet X Change]

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[Heather]

Meet the computer you can talk to with Copilot on Windows Working, creating and collaborating is as easy as talking. Got writer's block? Share your screen with Copilot Vision to help spark inspiration and use Copilot voice to have a conversation and brainstorm ideas. Or maybe you need some tech help with Copilot Vision. Copilot sees what you see. Let Copilot talk you through step by step guidance so you can master new apps, games and skills faster. Try [e-mail] copilot so Brian and Anna Walsh got married back in two I believe it was 2015 but they started having some issues by 2022 and she was very successful. She worked in D.C. and they lived in Boston or in Massachusetts but she worked in D.C. so she would always go back and forth and when she bought a townhouse in D.C. so that she had somewhere to stay during all of her work weeks she actually kind of fell in love with the realtor and so they started so is an.

[Anna]

Element I love yeah real estate element and that you know yeah you you're showing houses there's some when I was a realtor there was flirty stuff going on and I believe I I the guy was just on the trial just had to be test did testimony but was he married or his marriage was.

[Heather]

Falling apart too he was Married. I believe that it was falling apart, but we haven't heard a ton of details of that. But he and Anna were definitely making plans to have. Build a future together. So I. I mean, I think that leads. It leads me to believe at least that he definitely planned on leaving his wife.

[Anna]

And are you. Can you tell me the age difference between Anna and Brian, her husband?

[Heather]

Yeah, Brian's 50 years old, and when she disappeared, she was 39 years old.

[Anna]

Okay, well, that's not a huge age difference. Are you. No. Is this his first wife?

[Heather]

You know, I'm not sure. I believe. I'm not sure. That's a great question. I believe it was. They have three kids together. I don't believe he has children from a previous marriage, so I would have to double check that. But they do have three small kids together. And yeah, they got married in 2015 and had been together for about seven years before it all started falling apart. But I have to say, I think one of the reasons of why it began falling apart is Brian was kind of shady in his own right. He was trying to sell counterfeit Andy Warhol paintings online. He got caught. He ended up having to. He pled down with some federal crimes with that. And he was on house arrest as all of this was happening. And when Anna disappeared New Year's Eve.

[Anna]

In 2022, which was interesting about that because I read up on that part too. Again, how so many crimes that we cover have a little something in common. Is that a crime? I recently covered on Juicy Crimes involved an art world dealer guy who also, after he went missing and obviously concluded that they murdered him out in Palm Springs. He was also selling fake art, which.

[Heather]

Look, I'm not in the art world and I don't know a thing about art, but I would imagine that's pretty ballsy to try to sell a Warhol or any counterfeit art, because I think people in that industry, they would be able to clock it a mile away. That's not something that I think you can necessarily fake that easily. And obviously you couldn't because Brian got caught.

[Anna]

What was his job prior to that?

[Heather]

I don't remember what he was doing from all of my research. I mean, I hate saying it, but he was kind of the loser in the relationship. He was. She was definitely the breadwinner, the driver. I think that when she finally met this guy who had sold her the townhouse, who I also believe she loosely had worked with William, he was much more attractive than Brian. And so you have this kind of loser, deadbeat husband who's on house arrest for trying to get away with selling counterfeit paintings. And then you meet this successful, handsome man and you start to get taken by that.

[Anna]

And also how just embarrassing for your family if you've got three kids. You're probably in multiple schools, doing multiple activities, knowing people throughout the town. And here your husband did this like, shady grifter thing. And what I read is that once he was on this house arrest thing, yet she had to work for her job in D.C. that they couldn't move altogether to D.C. because he was doing his time with being on home arrest. And so they made it that he. And the reason he got house arrest versus going to prison was they agreed he was the primary caretaker of the kids.

[Heather]

Yes.

[Anna]

And that even though she was working in D.C. and, you know, able to kind of pursue this other affair and the man she had the affair with said that was really disturbing to her. She wanted to be that everyday mom. So here she made this great sacrifice so that he wasn't literally behind bars. What a regret.

[Heather]

I know.

[Anna]

Had she not done that and been like, go to your time because I'm gonna be with my kids. It was probably his idea being someone that's like a swindler. He probably figured that out. And now she's not even. You know, she's sacrificing the most important job, motherhood for this fucker.

[Heather]

Mm. Well, and I think that that's really what the catalyst became because I think she was now, at this point, actively making plans. She wanted to move her three boys to D.C. to live with her. She had spent Christmas Eve with William. She was actively.

[Anna]

William is the affair. Okay. Boyfriend. Okay.

[Heather]

She was telling. Actively telling her mom she wasn't happy with Brian anymore. And I think that BR caught wind of this. Actually. I know he did because of his Google searches. He started searching on Google in the days leading up to her disappearance. What's the best divorce attorney in Washington, D.C? he started Googling her boyfriend's name. He also randomly searched a very niche specific type of porn. He searched cheating wife gets impregnated by the person she's sleeping with. And this. All these were all happening the same day. I know.

[Anna]

That's so weird.

[Heather]

Yeah, I know. Which it's like, do you. If that's what you like. But it's so weird. So I think that Brian realized he was losing grasp over Anna and she was preparing herself to leave and take the boys. And I think that that is what brought everything to the surface on New Year's Eve.

[Anna]

And so you said she spent Christmas Eve with her boyfriend. Lover. So she wasn't spending Christmas Eve with her kids?

[Heather]

No, and I guess that that was also a point of contention, which, understandably, from Brian's point of view, because he fe. Like, she wasn't spending enough time with the kids because she was traveling back and forth. She was back for Christmas, but the boyfriend was texting her. I believe he sent her a photo of him skiing on Christmas Day, but she was with him on Christmas Eve.

[Anna]

So then you're. Wait, so you're not sure when she then returned to the home with the kids between Christmas and New Year's?

[Heather]

It was between. Yeah, it was between Christmas and New Year's Eve.

[Anna]

So all we know is that on Chris on New Year's Eve, that was the last time other people had seen or heard from her.

[Heather]

Yes, she. They had a. Like a small New Year's Eve gathering, like a dinner party with a couple of close family friends at the house. And that was the last time anybody aside from Brian says that they saw her.

[Anna]

That's another thing, and I'm sure you've realized this too, in covering crimes, and especially in my case, juicy crimes of passion. Sadly, there are a lot of murders that happen on New Year's Eve. Probably a lot of wicked fights, Probably a lot of people finally saying, I'm not going to live another year with you, fucker. And I'm calling the, you know, divorce attorney and whatever. One case I remembered, it was a New Year's Eve party. Something went down. There's been, like, date lines and 48 hours on it. And the man said that the wife went in and killed herself. And there was. The family always thought, I don't think that she would do that. But it was New Year's Eve, they had a party. They were drinking. People had left, and, you know, Silence.

[Heather]

Yeah.

[Anna]

And then people thought, oh, they didn't have a good marriage, or there was threats of divorce or whatever it was. Um, people need to figure out what they're doing on New Year's Eve. If you're not in a good place with your partner, maybe. Maybe go spend New Year's Eve somewhere else and not get to that heated, drunken. It's also such a weird time of the year that after Christmas, you're kind of waiting for your New Year's to come. It's in a weird, emotional place to be. And then especially, I don't love New Year's Eve.

[Heather]

I've never loved New Year's Eve.

[Anna]

I don't either. I am actually going to a wedding which I'm thrilled to go to but I was actually excited that I got invited to a New Year's Eve wedding because I don't like New Year's Eve and I like a plan. I don't like going to like a fancy restaurant that's like a pre priced thing. I don't like trying to find six couples. I don't also like going to bed at 9:30 and not doing anything.

[Heather]

There's a lot of pressure on New Year's Eve.

[Anna]

That's why I'm like I'm glad someone's having their their wet. It's better to go to a wedding on New Year's Eve than to to declare your divorce or die on New Year's Eve. That's for sure.

[Heather]

Amen. Amen.

[Anna]

Okay, so let's get to people leave that dinner party. Nobody knows what happens. What happens New Year's Day. Do we get any word, any googles from him?

[Heather]

Yeah. So basically yeah something happened between midnight and 4am and it's unclear exactly what time that was but and I'll read you some of these specific Google searches between 4am and 6am Brian starts Googling how long before a body starts to smell. How to stop a body from decomposing. How to embalm a body. 10 Ways to Dispose of a dead body if you really need to and how long somebody has to be missing in order to be declared dead or inherit their money. Which is important because he still owed a lot of restitution in the art case. And Anna was like I said, the breadwinner and she had a lot of life insurance.

[Anna]

How has this guy never watched one episode of Dateline in the last 30 years?

[Heather]

No, you know what Heather? I say all the time the Google history it will get you every time. But I am so thankful that these criminals are so stupid because it's the blueprint right there and it happens time and time again and they never learn. And his searches and they were done on his personal device but because the Apple accounts were synced they also synced to his son's iPad.

[Anna]

And let's also talk about how many affairs and things have been caught since schools have issued every child have an iPad because when you sign up for the iPad it has to be through the parents account. And I mean one of my favorite iPad scandal stories in the school is is and it was told to me by a third party but it was reliable is they the kids were in church and the iPad was going off and it was very Sexy photos like, of, like, genitalia. And so they call in the parents, and right there in front of the principals, they realize it was the mom texting her lover.

[Heather]

Oh, my gosh.

[Anna]

Vagina.

[Heather]

Like, here's the deal. Nobody should be exchanging nudes anymore in this day and age.

[Anna]

That's another thing.

[Heather]

Honestly.

[Anna]

What are you doing?

[Heather]

No. And it's like, I don't know if I'm just getting old, but it's like, I don't want to see that. Like, I don't want you sending me that.

[Anna]

I mean, it's just so, like, what is that? And then. So. Okay, my question is because I was like, okay, so let's say you do want to Google something for whatever reason, but whether you killed someone or you're thinking about it, you don't want it to come back to haunt you. Even if you go to, like, the public library and they really, like, research you and figure out where were you a week before even that could be traced. Is there any untraceable way to look up stuff?

[Heather]

I mean, there is, but I'm not going to tell you on this episode. I'm not going to give listeners the blueprint.

[Anna]

Will you tell me after?

[Heather]

Yes, yes, I will.

[Anna]

Yeah, because I'm like, I duplicated and I feel like any even. And then like a burner phone. Doesn't a burner phone, like, not have Internet?

[Heather]

Yeah, most of them don't. They're just like the little flip phones. But still with that even, it's like you can trace where it was purchased. Everything is traceable for the most part now, unless you really know how to do it and get away with it.

[Anna]

Okay, so he is Googling these things that are so incriminating. And what is. What is the. Are how old are the kids? And are they being questioned at all the boys?

[Heather]

I believe they are 2, 4 and 6.

[Anna]

Oh, that's very young.

[Heather]

Yeah, maybe not exactly those ages, but those are the ages that come to mind. So they are. Yeah, they are young. Maybe two, six and eight. Something around that.

[Anna]

Okay, so how does he spend his New Year's Day besides day he's making.

[Heather]

All those Google searches, early morning hours. Then he says to. Then he calls her workplace looking for her, to which her boss is basically like, she's not here. Is like, why? Can't find. Is like, well, if your wife is missing, you should call the police. You know, like, figure it out.

[Anna]

Why would she be working on New Year's Day? What is her job?

[Heather]

So she works in the real estate world. As well. Not a realtor. I think she does something with like, just like the business admin piece of it.

[Anna]

Oh, God.

[Heather]

So he said later to the investigators that she had a work emergency come up. She was initially supposed to go back to D.C. on January 3rd, and she had a flight already booked for that, but he told them she had to go earlier. So I saw her New Year's Day morning get into a ride share or a taxi and head to the airport.

[Anna]

Which is also totally traceable.

[Heather]

Exactly. And they disproved that immediately.

[Anna]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Heather]

There was no rideshare activity, no taxi, no flight to D.C. that she was on. So that was obviously disproven immediately as well too. So all of that started happening in the early morning hours of or morning to afternoon of New Year's Day. Then he starts to go in the evening to start the COVID up. And so allegedly. And so he is seen on CCTV footage at Lowe's, which is like a Home Depot hardware store, and he's buying over $450 of cleaning supplies, Clorox, bleachers, a hammer, cutting shears, mops and buckets, a bunch of stuff to now start putting his plan in motion of everything he researched earlier.

[Anna]

But I just want to say, you know, why is it that the only husbands that get an itch to buy cleaning supplies are the murdering ones?

[Heather]

No, I said the other day when I put my episode out on this for the trial recap, I literally said, I'm like. And I think this goes to show, men don't normally buy cleaning supplies because who's going to Home Depot to buy all the cleaning supplies?

[Anna]

Just like, I just had some New Year cleaning right now.

[Heather]

Exactly.

[Anna]

And I heard when he's on this shopping spree, is it true that one of the sons was with him?

[Heather]

I didn't see one of the sons with him, but he was wearing a black, like Covid style mask. And that's another thing.

[Anna]

Those Covid masks are also a helpful way to get away with things too.

[Heather]

Yep.

[Anna]

You know, you just look like you're like a very conscious person. Oh, I have a cough. Let me put on this mask while I buy cleaning supplies for the COVID up of the murder. I did. So. So he's got receipts. He gets a credit card. Yeah. He signs up for the credit card that day. No. Yeah.

[Heather]

He's such an idiot. But it's like, we love to see it. So he starts getting all of the supplies to put his plan in motion the following day on the second. He searches some more stuff on Google he searches is a hacksaw, the best tool to dismember. Can you be charged with murder without a body? Can you and can you identify a body with broken teeth? He also searched with partial broken teeth, which I could be wrong. Ana has never been found. Her body has never been found. I believe that he, that he probably beat her so badly and knocked her teeth out, hoping that they would, they wouldn't be able to identify her that way. But then maybe the root was still in there or something, which is what led to the Google search of can they be identified with partially broken teeth?

[Anna]

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[Monet X Change]

Round because Monet X change from sibling rivalry is here with an announcement. This episode of the podcast is brought to you by Google Gemini. Now listen, the girls over at Google said Monet tell the children. So I'm telling you, us college students, get Google Gemini's pro plan free for one year. Use the best model in the world for multimodal understanding. So whether you're uploading a video to get feedback on your presentation, uploading a photo of your homework to ask for help, or transcribing notes from a lecture you missed, Gemini 3 Pro can help. And baby, if I had this in college, oh, she would have been unstoppable. Picture it. Monet X changed in the library. Uploading picture of my music theory homework. Like Gemini, please help a diva out. Or recording my rehearsal videos for feedback instead of crying in the practice room for three hours. This would have been life changing. Now back to the goods. Sign up to get more access to Google's Most accurate model, Gemini 3 Pro. Unlimited image uploads. Pro level image editing, higher limits in NotebookLM, Gemini in Gmail and Docs. Two terabytes of storage and more. You heard me, two terabytes. That's enough space to store every vocal warmup, drag race look, and every photo your aunt sends you of her plants. Visit Gemini Google students to to learn more and sign up. Terms apply.

[Anna]

What's so crazy is when someone has a crime of passion or plans or whatever, they're not a serial killer. They're not someone who killed and got paid for it from the Mafia. I'm like, maybe somebody like that. You know, sometimes you see it, 30 years later, this guy got arrested and he had this beautiful wife and family. Who would have thought that he killed his first wife or killed this girl he dated? And you're like, God, how did you compartmentalize that for 30 years? And I'm kind of like, I can see how people can do that. They can justify it, whatever. But not if you go and then dismantle. Dismantle the body or dismember the body. Not if you pull out the teeth. I mean, it's one thing. Oh, my God. You know, like in the. The movie. Did you ever see the movie Unfaithful?

[Heather]

I love that movie.

[Anna]

So that was a perfect example of a movie. And I am going to ruin it for you guys because I've told you, it's been on your juicy scoop movie list for years. And if you haven't seen it, you're stupid. But the husband approaches the lover, and the lover, he sees that there's this snow globe that he realizes his wife gave to the lover that was very significant to their relationship. And he's so out of his mind that he hits it and he ends up killing the guy and. With his head. And then he rolls it in a carpet and gets rid of him. And it's such a great movie. Because you. You. You empathize with the husband. You see what happened. Maybe he didn't. It was a snap decision. I don't think he went over there to kill him. But now what do you do with this situation? And that is the thing. Like roll it up in a. In a. A rug and get rid of it to. Then.

[Heather]

I know it's. There's life.

[Anna]

It's just. It gets so. That part of. To me is insane. Anyone that's ever dismembering something.

[Heather]

Well, and I think too, because it takes. And I'm not trying to be overly graphic here, but it takes an incredible amount of force to dismember somebody. And it's also a very personal type of crime. Not that the murder itself wasn't personal, but you are right there up close and personal with a hatchet or a hacksaw. And it takes an incredible amount of strength and something we don't know, obviously, at this point, because Ana has never been found, and because he is saying he's not guilty, we don't know where this took place. I would argue probably at his house, whether it's in the garage or basement or whatever. Meaning his three boys were in the house as he was allegedly dismembering their mother. It's horrific to think about.

[Anna]

So, okay, so then he also calls the lover, right?

[Heather]

So I haven't seen where he actually spoke to him on the phone.

[Anna]

Okay, so this is what. Maybe this just came out now because I was like getting. Because the. The boyfriend says that. I think it was January 2nd. He sees a call come from Brian and he's like, oh, shit, you know, I haven't heard from her for two days. Maybe they've gotten in a wicked fight. Maybe it's gotten revealed because at that time, it was the lovers understanding that he was unaware of their affair and they were keeping it quiet until their plans could be made. So he's like, I'm not answering this phone. So he lets it go to voicemail. And another call comes in. Maybe a second call comes in. That one goes to voicemail. And the voicemail, he says, hey, this is Brian. I'm worried about Ana. Could you just let me know if she's. If you've been in contact with her? Because I have not heard from her. So then he does go over to the condo, sees that she's not there, and he does contact Brian. Not ever admitting we're lovers or whatever, but just, I got your message, and she has not been to the condo, and I have not seen Her. Because I don't think at that time he thought, could this man have killed him? I think he was like, oh, I better just be helpful, because this woman who I love is missing.

[Heather]

I wonder if that maybe there's any overlap with. Because they did work together, if that is who he had also called that day to ask where Ana was, when then that person responded and said, if your wife is missing, you need to call the police. I wonder if there was some overlap there. And that way identified him. Yeah. As the lover. Possibly.

[Anna]

Yes.

[Heather]

Well, so, yeah. So on the second. He's making more of those Google searches now to put his plan in motion. And like, how do I dismember this body? So he gets all of his information and his intel and then he goes back to the supply store, this time to Home Depot. And this is where he is once again wearing surgical gloves and a mask. And he buys more tarps, drop cloths, more buckets, more cleaning supplies, a hammer, a hatchet, all of these things. Then that same day goes over to Home Goods, and just like unfaithful, he buys three different rugs.

[Anna]

This involves Home Goods and Lowe's.

[Heather]

Home Goods, Lowe's and Home Depot.

[Anna]

Is there any Costco situation here? Because that's also an element of Juicy Scoop that and juicy crimes that I love. So he gets some rugs from Home Goods. Oh, my God. And then are the rugs then replaced in the house that anyone could recognize?

[Heather]

They didn't notice anything replaced in the house. But later, when they saw him on surveillance footage going to several different dump sites and garbage sites, landfill type places, and he was disposing of very heavy trash bags, and there was some carpeting that was thrown away too, which had blood stains on them.

[Anna]

So what I. I read that the defense is that he. He did admit to dismembering this body, but said that he woke up and she was dead next to him. Died mysteriously in the night.

[Heather]

Yeah.

[Anna]

And he panicked that he would. Might have been accused, which is kind of a weird, juicy thing, because I always think, what if that ever happened to me? What if you woke up and your spouse that you weren't getting along with was suddenly dead?

[Heather]

I mean, my first thought wouldn't be like, oh, God, and dismember them right now.

[Anna]

No, it wouldn't. But I always kind of wonder, like, you know, yeah, of course I'd call the police. I'd call the ambulance. You know, my husband, I know I didn't kill him. But like, yeah, yeah, it's.

[Heather]

But even that story Starts to get dismantled because his Google searches before she apparently had what they're calling an unexplained medical incident. Before that even happened. He was Google searching the attorneys, the boyfriend's name, the weird porn stuff, I mean, some super bizarre things. And so, yeah, he says she must have died in her sleep from this unexplained medical incident. I started nudging her when I woke up, nudged her harder than she fell off the bed. I noticed she was dead and I panicked and wanted to cover it up. So, okay, let's just roll with this on this. You panic, you're freaked out, you're scared you're going to get blamed. So then you would search how to dismember, maybe all of these things. Why would you at all ever search how to embalm a body, how to stop a body from decomposing? Do. Is there. Do you need a body to be charged with murder? Like, then there was one search where he had searched, like, can you be charged with murder for this? If she accidentally died, you're not doing specific Google searches about inquiring regarding murder. That wouldn't be on the table. It'd be, how do I cover this up? How do I conceal this? Not how to get away with murder, which was his literal search. How to get away with murder, not just a TV show, his literal search.

[Anna]

So when did they suspect him?

[Heather]

Pretty early on. He was suspected very early on and was arrested. And then his trial was supposed to start the beginning of December for all three of the charges. The first degree murder charge, concealment of a body, and false statements to the police. So right before the trial started, that's when he pled guilty to the other lesser two charges. And then he's on trial right now just for the murder charge, but he's still maintaining that he's innocent.

[Anna]

And I guess the defense is we don't know what she died from. So you should.

[Heather]

Yeah, because there's no body.

[Anna]

Yeah, you should believe him. And I wonder if they're going to bring up things like did she have a history of, you know, try to bring up any kind of health, anything, like if she had a heart, everything they can.

[Heather]

Yeah. Yeah. But even if, even if it showed that she was a smoker, a drinker, hard drugs, whatever it is, that still doesn't explain. Explain the searches, the supplies that he bought, the search, the Google searches before she went missing, all of these other things that clearly illustrate motive and opportunity to get away with this. I mean, in the trash bags that they recovered from the Dump site. They found gloves, bloody slippers, towels, rags, a hazmat suit, like a full tieback suit that he probably wore when he allegedly dismembered her, part of a necklace that she used to wear, a purse of hers, and boots that he said she was wearing when she got in the taxi that morning. But they found those recovered at the dump site. So they have found so much evidence, they just have not found her body yet. And I don't know where he could have put that to get and to where it hasn't been recovered yet.

[Anna]

It's interesting that this was. That his first thing was, you know, his first mistake of saying she got in an Uber and got on a plane when she didn't. And I do think it's like, what makes. What makes you decide? That's the thing after you kill someone. Like, if we're just getting in the mind of a murderer, like, I would definitely now Boston is very cold at New Year's time, so I guess an excuse of saying she, you know, wanted to go on a morning walk or whatever, and then one other walk and we never saw her, you know, and that's another thing. Most people have a ring camera. We would have seen the ring camera. Like, so it is pretty hard to get away with these killing of your wife murders lately. It's gotten a lot harder.

[Heather]

It is. Technology is definitely not in your favor at all anymore. And I don't know if you saw this in any of your research, but I know we talked about Karen Reed before and all that, and Michael Proctor was one of the lead investigators in the Brian Walsh case as well. And so the thought was that the defense would possibly bring that up, which they are not going to argue that.

[Anna]

Saying that he's such a bad investigator, his stuff should be thrown out.

[Heather]

Yeah.

[Anna]

Oh, interesting.

[Heather]

Yeah. And it was supposed to be Judge Kennedi over his trial, but then they switched it out.

[Anna]

Was that the Karen Reed judge? Oh, yeah. And so we're on day seven, I think, of this trial.

[Heather]

Yes.

[Anna]

And so if he. If he gets off for the murder and he has to go to prison for the lying to the police and wasting their time and dismembering of the body, do you know what kind of time he's looking on for that?

[Heather]

I don't know what the exact sentence would be, but it is significantly less in other cases that I've covered where people have been found guilty of just either concealment of a body or dismemberment of a body. I. The max that I think I have seen is a couple of years that they get. They don't get much time, which is kind of crazy to me, like for desecrating a body, that you wouldn't get more time than that. But I wonder if the main success doesn't fall on you.

[Anna]

Yeah, I wonder if in those cases you probably are an accomplice who was under the power of whoever made you do it and you turned and said that. You know, I was just there. Which is when I've been talking about the David case right from the start. I said, I bet there's another person that they're either thinking is involved or is spilling the beans or about to spill the beans in which they did this for David or David did it, and then they were part of the dismembering and the cleanup and putting it in the trunk. And they're trying to figure out, okay, if we get this person to tell the whole story about David, then they'll. They would probably only get a certain amount of years because you would, you know, show, oh, they were coerced or they were an employee or they were the cousin or they, you know, whatever. Speaking of that case, what do you think is happening there?

[Heather]

I can't believe there hasn't been an arrest yet. I mean, I understand why, because her body was so badly, Celeste's body was so badly decomposed that they couldn't identify not only cause of death, but manner of death. And talks reports tend to take a long time to come back as well. So I understand why there haven't been charges filed yet. But speaking for myself, I think the writing is pretty much on the wall with what happened there. I think to your point, there was probably somebody in his entourage or camp that assisted either in the crime or the COVID up. I've also seen that there's a thought that potentially she overdosed and then they tried to clean it up and hide it. But I think that one is pretty clear in my opinion, what probably transpired there. And so I would imagine that once all of the, you know, the talks report, every, anything that they could get back from their forensic testing comes back, that's probably when they will have more of an ironclad case and when they would file charges. That's my guess.

[Anna]

Yeah, definitely. And Doug, here we have the limu emu in its natural habitat, helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual. Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug. Uh, limu is that guy with the binoculars watching us.

[Monet X Change]

Cut the camera.

[Heather]

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[Anna]

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[Heather]

Well, I'm letting go of the worry that I wouldn't get my new contacts in time for this class. I got them delivered free from 1-800-contacts. Oh my gosh, they're still so fast.

[Anna]

And breathe. Oh, sorry.

[Heather]

I almost couldn't breathe when I saw the discount they gave me on my first order. Oh, sorry.

[Anna]

Namaste. Visit 1-800contacts.com today to save on your first order. 1-800-contacts. Okay, let's so this case is day seven, is there, with Brian Walsh? Is there any idea of when they think how much more days it'll be?

[Heather]

Originally it was estimated to be four to six weeks, but now I'm hearing that it may be done in as little as two or three. And I don't think that they're going to have to present much more. I think that the jury will probably get it right and he will be convicted. That's my guess. I've seen crazier things happen, though. I think we all did. I mean, look at Casey Anthony. But I think that the evidence is overwhelming in this case. He had the motive, too. I mean, she was cheating. There was the money involved in it. She was going to take the kids to D.C. and leave. And it was just everything, I think, reached a boiling point after New Year's Eve. And he snapped and then in a frenzy started googling, searching, buying things, trying to cover things up as much as possible. And in these cases, unfortunately, it's like I always say this, but think about the kids in this, too, because you, your argument could be that you did this because you were blinded by rage, because she was going to take your children away. You love your children so much, you only want to be. But now you're leaving your children without a mother and without a father if you go to jail for the rest of your life. Or. And so it's I just feel like that argument never carries weight for me because if you truly were thinking about the kids, you wouldn't ever do something that could potentially jeopardize their entire future of not even having either one of.

[Anna]

The parents or the defense says, you know, no, he. They had no discussion. I mean, that could be the other thing. They had no discussion. I mean, I wonder if the prosecution is going to show that we know that her mom said that she had said, no, I'm not happy with him. But if you're presenting him with this narrative that everything was fine and he woke up and she was despondent and dead, and then he's like, oh, my God, they're going to think I did it. Because everybody always thinks the husband did it. How can I just make this go away and make it look like she's just a missing person so that my kids and I can continue on with our lives? And this way the kids can hope that she's not dead. I'm just thinking of all the narrative, you know, of like. And then, oh, I wasn't. Obviously this wasn't a good idea, but this is where his mind was. I mean, maybe that's it, because if he's really saying nothing happened, it wasn't a crime of passion. I didn't even know that she was cheating on me. I think thought this guy just worked with her. I had no clue. I. Yeah, it's been a struggle because I got caught for this stupid crime. But, like, we had a great New Year's Eve. People were at our house. Like, that's where it's going to get, I think, juicy. Maybe if there's any witnesses from the New Year's Eve dinner party, if there's anybody that can attest to, oh, no, he knew. She told me that he confronted her on the 28th of December or whatever, you know?

[Heather]

Well, the Google searches prove that. I mean, if I were the prosecution, I'd be like, then why on the 27th of December was he googling, what's the best state to divorce a man?

[Anna]

What?

[Heather]

William Fasto. The boyfriend's name porn. With a cheating wife. You knew that she was cheating, obviously, based on those Google searches, and you knew that she was likely filing for divorce based on those searches, so. And that's three days before this happened. So there's no way he can really play off the. We were happily married. I had. It was all unbeknownst to me that she was having an affair. I had no idea. I love my kids. And then I just panicked because his searches and his digital footprint prove otherwise.

[Anna]

I always think of that kind of thing of, you know, Scott Peterson with Lacy. Like, look, you know, I was cheating. I wasn't. I was thinking, maybe this is not going to Be my wife for eternity. So when I came back from fishing and she was missing, maybe I wasn't that sad. Like, I'm always like, is that what someone else. Some man's offenses? So it's like, maybe in this case, when I woke up and she was.

[Heather]

Dead, I was like, good, she's a cheating wife.

[Anna]

She's a cheating wife.

[Heather]

Good.

[Anna]

I'm glad she's dead, but I'm not going to get blamed for it. And so that's what happened. I mean, it'll be kind of interesting to see. I'm sure he won't take the stand because they never do. But, you know, obviously the defense can try to display that. Like, did you just have, you know, weird luck that, like, you know. Yeah. I mean, there are people whose spouses die and they have not filed for divorce, and they're not that sad about it, and they did not kill them.

[Heather]

Absolutely.

[Anna]

So there is that. I mean, of course I think he's guilty, too. I just love trying to figure out what could be something that could be so convincing that you'd be like, I do have some doubts. And I think, yeah.

[Heather]

And that's all it takes is one person.

[Anna]

I think it would have to be some type of medical history. Like, she had a weird heart murmur and her mother had a heart attack and she had just started taking heart medication. And it would have to be so compelling. And even then, I don't think you could convince me of otherwise. But, like, that's what I'm kind of curious to see what they're gonna say.

[Heather]

It is interesting because last week the defense did allude to him possibly taking the stand, which really shocked me, too, because they basically said, well, we're excited for his side of the story to be shared. Which, of course, that would be through the defense presenting it, but the way that they worded it, it did, I don't know, cast a little bit of question as to, is he going to actually take the stand as like a Hail Mary? Give it your best shot. What. What do you have to lose at this point? But we haven't heard confirmation either way. But to your point, usually more times than not, they won't take the stand.

[Anna]

Yeah. And then. Okay, so let's go back to Karen Reed a little bit, because you were very involved in that. You went to Boston, you hung out with Karen. She was aware of your coverage and everything. And she. Have they. Has she now filed the lawsuit? Where are we with her suing the police?

[Heather]

There's a lot of court cases going on Right now she's going to be doing civil suits against all of the players in that case, from attorneys to friends to everybody at the house party. There's also the wrongful death suit from John's family against her. There's.

[Anna]

Oh, they're still going forward with that there.

[Heather]

Yeah, it's very messy right now in the whole civil aspect of the Karen Reed case. And I told. I said from day one with her team, her family there, when I went to court, I said, look, I'm covering this case, but I want you to know I don't. I don't know what happened that night with John. I truly don't. And I think you and I have talked about this offline and. But I said, but I don't think that there is enough evidence to convict her. That's where I stand. Whether she did it or not, I still don't know and couldn't definitively say one way or another based on my opinion. But I do know that there was not enough strong evidence to convict her of that. And these investigators and detectives, they fumbled every step of the way with their cover ups, their disposal of phones and their lies. I mean, they are the ones that tainted this investigation. So even if she did did it, even if she did do it, I think that it's their fault that she got away with it. That's my opinion.

[Anna]

And even if she did back up into him, which when I would say that people just. She could not. Because this person. Okay, I get it. But even if she had, I think we can all agree it wasn't an intentional thing. And then. And sometimes when I've talked a little bit about it, then someone will correct me on. I'm like, yeah, but I just think it's so weird that she woke up. And maybe you know this part because this was what I talked about recently and someone was like, no, you're wrong about that, Heather. When she woke up after she came home, he never came out. She's like, fuck you, you're having a good time without me. I don't know if you're a swinger or flirting with other girls. Fuck you. She comes home, she leaves all the horrible drunk messages, which is very indicative of a normal drunk woman with a boyfriend who she thinks is disrespecting her. So that's good. The one who murders calls and says, hey, baby poo poo face, where are you, honey? I'm making the cinnamon rolls for your kids and just didn't know if you fell asleep at your friend's house. Or, you know, so. So she does all that. But when she woke up that next morning, was it that she called the. The girls?

[Heather]

Yeah, she called the girl saying, where's John? He didn't come home. What's going on? And she was panicking.

[Anna]

And so where I mixed it up is because I was like, now, why would you panic so much? If you thought, he's drunk, he's cheating, why would you immediately, no, he must be dead somewhere. Why wouldn't you just think he is either in another woman's bed or he's passed out drunk at someone's house? I know that if I was in that position, I would assume those things. I wouldn't think if he had a car. I would think he got in a car accident and died. But since he didn't have a car, she dropped him off. I was like, either he cheated or he's passed out somewhere. And her panic was, we got to go back to the house because he could be dead. But then someone said, no, it was them, the girls who said, we'll come get you.

[Heather]

They said that they were going to come pick her up. They said they would come pick her up and drive her back over to the house, and they would go and look for John together. But I think now. I think.

[Anna]

Sorry to interrupt. I. Now, I do think that is highly suspicious on the girls parts. The. The. The sister of the homeowner and the other friend, because again, if you were partying all night and your friend was, like, called you drunk, I don't know where he is. You'd be like, it's five in the morning.

[Heather]

Yeah, he'll turn up.

[Anna]

Let me call around. Let's see what happened. Chill out. Take a shower, Karen. Like, you wouldn't immediately be, oh, my God, let's get in the car and see if he's in the snow somewhere. Like, that's what was so weird. Think about all the times our friends have called us, you know, worried about their man. It is not. Let's. I think he was killed last night. That's not where we go.

[Heather]

Yeah, I don't think you jumped to that conclusion right away. And I don't think that that's where they, like, landed immediately. There were a lot of calls back and forth trying there and figure it out. And then they basically were like, all right, you're obviously, you know, super anxious right now. You are. You can't be in. You're not in any state to drive. We're going to come get you. And then as they were driving and as they were pulling up to the house where the party was. That's when Karen jumped out of the car because she said she spotted him in the snow and ran over to him.

[Anna]

But.

[Heather]

And there are a lot of things though still too. Not just, not just what, the way the investigators handled it and all the shadiness there. But the injuries didn't match, being the glass didn't match. There were so many things that. To where a lot of people do still argue she was factually innocent, but there is still a very large part of the community that believes that she did this. There's so much divide still.

[Anna]

But does anybody think that she did it on purpose?

[Heather]

A couple people with intent, but there's a couple people who think that, like, yeah, she was raging, she was pissed off, so she did it on purpose and then left. I think if she did hit him, if, if, if. I think that she was probably just wasted, maybe had her music up a little bit. Was it, you know, hit reverse instead of hit the gas really fast, didn't realize anything and like took off. I don't think it was like this premeditated type of thing. That's my opinion.

[Anna]

Are there going to be just like the Long Long Island Lolita? 25 years ago, there were three different movies that came out back when made for TV. Movies were the thing. ABC, NBC and CBS all did a movie and each was from a different perspective. One was the Amy Fisher's point of view. One was the Buttafuoco's point of view, which he was innocent, you know, loved his wife and this girl was a weirdo. And one was a little of both. And that was like a reporter's thing. I thought that was so interesting. And I feel like there's gotta be several projects in the works.

[Heather]

Oh, there are many that I know of personally that are in the works.

[Anna]

And I wonder if they're aware of the other projects happening. Who's gonna get out there first and what kind of point of view is it gonna be?

[Heather]

You know, I think if they're smart, they do it as like a three part setup, similar to how they did American Nightmare with Denise Huskins, where it's like we're gonna, in the first episode, make it look like Karen's guilty. You're gonna think she did this, that she was premeditated. She's guilty. Second episode, we're gonna make it look like she's totally innocent. Third episode, we're gonna blend the two together. You guys figure it out.

[Anna]

Yeah. And what is going on with that weird Family and stuff where the house was. I know they sold it, which was very suspicious. And they were like, oh my God, we're getting tortured. You know, were, you know, our kids are being tortured. What's. Do you know what's going on with them? And they are now being sued.

[Heather]

They're being sued and they have lawsuits as well. Or I don't know if there's actually, I may have misspoken there. I don't know if there's lawsuits. But there are current charges right now against some other people who were involved in the Karen Reed coverage for witness intimidation, for going to them and going to their place of business and different things like that. So they all are still very much entrenched in the legal system and court filings and everything that's going on with there. It's just not the criminal trial anymore for Karen.

[Anna]

Got it.

[Heather]

Wow.

[Anna]

So tell us a little bit about where people could find you and what other things. Are there any other juicy cases you're working on that we should like, be aware of?

[Heather]

Yeah, well, actually I just released one today on my new podcast feed, Tend to Life, which stems from my original YouTube channel. And it's about this girl, Rebecca, who was found. It's very similar to the Ellen Greenberg case. I don't know if you're familiar with that. Reminds me of that she was stabbed in the back of her head and neck.

[Anna]

Oh, yes.

[Heather]

And they ruled it as a suicide.

[Anna]

And now there was a couple part documentary on that where she had a fiance and they lived in this apartment.

[Heather]

He had a lot of strong political ties with his family. A lot of shady things, which I've spoken with Ellen's parents as well, and I did a whole episode on that. I can't believe that they haven't overturned that yet and that they are doubling down saying it's suicide. And this case that I just put out on the podcast today is similar. It's in Southern California at a mansion. And this beautiful woman, Rebecca, was found bound by her feet, her hands, naked, hanging suspended from the second story balcony. It was ruled a suicide even though she was bound her like her own feet and hands and was nude. And then there was a note that was painted on the wall. Very ominous. Like what they're saying was the suicide note, but it was this very cryptic message and none of it makes sense and it's still being ruled as she did it. Do you know what I'm talking about?

[Anna]

Yes, that one we covered. My sister and I covered that for Juicy Crimes a couple years ago when we only put it on Patreon. And it is such a bizarre story because of this tragedy that happened prior to it in which she was the girlfriend but, like, stepmother and under her watch, the little boy fell to his death. And so there's a lot of different philosophies of if she did do this, is it because she was so distraught about feeling responsible? Is it cultural suicide, shame because she was, like, Asian? If that could be any tie to it. Was the. Was his brother involved who lived on the property? Well, it is. It has so many different. That's. I'm glad you did a deep dive on that because it is one that I just don't know that we'll ever know.

[Heather]

You can go down the rabbit hole on it for sure. And we definitely did because, yeah, her death was then within just a couple of days, not even of the little boy dying. And it did look like there was shame and guilt possibly for that because it happened under her watch. But then the manner in which she was found, how she was found, the note left behind, the footprints on the railing and the direction that they were facing, it doesn't make sense. It really, really doesn't. So, yeah, we put that one out this week, but other than that, I still have. Seriously. And now, yeah. Tend to Life. And we put out new episodes every Tuesday and Thursday, so.

[Anna]

Great. And how's your cute family?

[Heather]

They're good. Thanks again for being so flexible today. I had to go do crafts with Emmy.

[Anna]

And the cutest thing that you did this summer was when your son said, I want to take you out on a date.

[Heather]

Oh, my God. It was the cutest thing ever. He told he. My son and I, like, are just very close. People probably think it's unhealthy. But yeah, he's 6 years old and he had said, I really want to take you on a date. I want to dress up. So I pulled up Amazon because I was like, we're not going to, like, buy anything fancy. And, like, he picked his outfit. He picked a little white tuxedo, so we had that shipped in and he wanted to wear that. So I get dressed and I take him to the Palm. And we were in New York at the time and it was just us because I took him at, like, his dinner time at 5 o', clock. So it was just us in there. And he was so cute. He had, like, the little bib. And then when they came with it and they were buying into it, too, they, like, loved it. So when they came with the check, he was all, can I have your bank card. And so he took it and slipped it in and paid them and, like, felt like the man and all of it. It was just the cutest thing ever.

[Anna]

I just thought that was such a cute idea and such a sweet thing that he, like, saw that and thought that would be fun. Because there is that time when you're a little kid where you're like, I would. I want to marry daddy. And you're like, well, you can't. I remember, like, my mom telling me that, and I was like, well, why? Why can't, like, you just don't understand or, you know, I want to marry my brother or whatever. And it's so innocent and cute and then wanting that experience. I just thought that was the cutest video that you've ever done. And he's so good looking.

[Heather]

Thank you. Thank you. He's my little guy. I love him so much.

[Anna]

Well, it's awesome to see you. I hope you have a great Christmas with your family. Thank you.

[Heather]

You too. When you're down in OC next, you have to let me know and you have to come in and be on the podcast.

[Anna]

Oh, yeah, absolutely.

[Monet X Change]

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[Anna]

The lookout for scams.

[Heather]

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