The Woman Behind the Armor

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Keep It Positive, Sweetie

Episode: The Woman Behind the Armor

Host: Crystal Renee Hayslett (The Black Effect Podcast Network and iHeartPodcasts)
Guest: Keisha Lance Bottoms (Former Mayor of Atlanta)
Release Date: May 31, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this deeply honest and uplifting episode, host Crystal Renee Hayslett sits down with Keisha Lance Bottoms to discuss Bottoms’ memoir, The Rough Side of the Mountain. Rather than focusing solely on her public-facing roles as a political leader and mayor, Bottoms brings listeners into the personal struggles beneath her polished exterior—family, childhood trauma, shame, faith, health battles, marriage, motherhood, and the pressure of being “the strong one.” Together, they examine the cost of success, courage to confront vulnerability, healing, and the journey to showing up as one’s whole self. The conversation is equal parts revealing, empowering, and practical, offering a roadmap for owning your story.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Early Life: Values, Family, and First Lessons

Front Porch Stories Game (05:01–06:40)

• Keisha shares formative sayings and memories from her Atlanta childhood:

  • “You only have to tell the truth once.” (05:28 KLB)
  • Strong sensory memories: “Smells of baking cakes...and fried chicken. Chicken frying.” (05:43 KLB)
  • Traveling with her entertainer father around the world was “normal.”
  • Her grandmother taught faith by example, not preaching.

• Evolving definitions of strength:

  • “Strength used to mean being strong. I now know it means being powerful.” (06:43 KLB)

2. Why Write the Book? Storytelling as Healing

(07:12–08:09)

• Writing was both about telling her personal story and rediscovering herself after office.
• “This is the purest form of my story…If nobody else reads it but my family, and it makes them proud, that will be enough.” (07:56 KLB)

3. Resilience & the “Rough Side of the Mountain”

(08:24–11:40)

• Bottoms discusses family upheaval after her father's incarceration:
  • “Coming home from school and seeing my dad being led away in handcuffs…this extraordinary life was taken away in an instant.” (08:30 KLB)
  • Her grandmother’s mantra—“All things work for the good of those who love the Lord”—helped her see these challenges as foundations for empathy and courage.
• “Not that I would wish that on our family at all, but…I know it’s given me compassion…I’ve lived it literally.” (09:38 KLB)

4. The Burden of Shame, Secrecy, and Wearing the Mask

(11:42–18:14)

• Childhood trauma taught her to “wear the mask” (referencing Paul Laurence Dunbar).
• Family expectation: “What goes on in this house stays in this house.”
• As a child: “I never wanted to be the problem, which meant I didn’t always share my problems.” (15:24 KLB)
• Internalized stress and health: Discusses fibroids, fertility challenges, and how stress in Black women can manifest physically.

5. Breaking the Silence, Owning Your Story

(17:00–19:32)

• Only after running for mayor did she feel relief in sharing her story publicly.
• “Once I began to tell my story publicly, I was stunned how much relief I felt. It was like shedding pounds of weight and baggage.” (18:06 KLB)
• Audience connection: Others would share similar stories of addiction, financial struggle, incarceration.

6. Trauma, Eating Disorders, and Healing

(19:35–23:47)

• Bottoms reveals her experience with sexual abuse (“the neighbor who used to inappropriately touch me”) and how it fueled eating disorders.
• “Eating disorder is about so much more than weight. It’s about control…that was the thing I could control.” (20:43 KLB)
• Therapy helped her connect body image issues with unspoken trauma:
  • “When we don’t resolve issues...at some point they start to rot.” (22:27 KLB)

7. Being Strong vs. Being Powerful for Black Women

(22:53–24:47)

• Cites her therapist: “Strong women push through…they die. Powerful women stop, feel, process, learn the lesson, and then...move on.” (23:06 KLB)
• Shares practical example of losing a business contract and letting herself process sadness before moving on.

8. Separating Identity from Trauma & Self-Forgiveness

(25:01–26:29)

• Encourages others to separate what happened to them from who they are and practice self-forgiveness:
  • “If God offers me grace…and forgives me, then why wouldn’t I forgive myself?” (25:43 KLB)

9. On Success, Sanding Down, and Imposter Syndrome

(26:34–28:21)

• Realized during mayoral campaign how she’d “sanded herself down” to fit in or avoid scrutiny.
• “If I have to dim my light for you to feel better, that’s something wrong with you, not with me.” (28:09 KLB)
• Also discusses “purging” friendships that require you to dim your light: Tyler Perry’s advice, “Everybody can't go where you're going.” (28:35 KLB)

10. Motherhood and Fertility Struggles

(36:44–41:19)

• Candidly describes IVF, numerous surgeries due to fibroids, heartbreak, and ultimately adoption:

  • “Unless you’ve been through it, you cannot begin to imagine how taxing it is physically and emotionally.” (40:08 KLB)
  • “Had I not been through any of that…I would not have adopted the four wonderful children that I have.” (41:06 KLB)

• Her children as anchors:

  • “They are my level setters....For me, the biggest lesson has just been priorities.” (41:50, 42:32 KLB)

11. Marriage, Partnership & Enduring Friendship

(42:44–48:16)

• On her husband and their 30+ year relationship:

  • “We’ve never given up on each other at the same time.” (44:09 KLB)
  • “He has always seen the best in me, when I didn’t see it in myself.” (48:00 KLB)

• Their friendship is the foundation: “The beauty of our relationship is sometimes you’re here, sometimes you’re here, and it may all be in the same day, sometimes the same hour.” (44:32, 44:39 KLB)

• Balancing leadership at home with partnership:

  • “When I was mayor…I’d come in with what he called all that aggressive mayor energy. He’s like, ‘Hey, hey. It’s Derek Stan. Leave all that at the mailbox.’” (48:40 KLB)

12. Faith and the Role of Spirituality

(50:44–52:07)

• Faith as an anchor—lessons from her grandmother about trusting God’s plan even when life is hard.
• “Some people think of faith as meaning you gotta be perfect…I say I’m a big sinner. But I know that God still loves me, often in spite of me.” (51:34, 51:48 KLB)

13. Running for Governor: Calling, Purpose, & Public Service

(52:11–56:59)

• Discusses her decision to run, driven by a sense of calling and prayerful reflection:

  • “When God has a calling on your life, it’s difficult to ignore it. And for me, that calling is to serve.” (53:22 KLB)

• Navigated personal grief—including the loss of a cousin—during her campaign launch.

• On her record:

  • “I fought with every single thing I had for the people of Atlanta and…across this state…It doesn’t mean every decision I made was perfect, but I tried my very best.” (56:16 KLB)

• Stepping away from mayoral office for health and family reasons—not out of weakness, but strength.

  • “If I had four years left…what about my kids? What about me?” (58:15 KLB)

14. Leadership Challenges, Politics, and Being Real

(59:32–61:44)

• The complexities and compromises of politics:
  • “People expect perfection from politicians….It is difficult…when you have to fight on all sides.” (59:55 KLB)
• Urges listeners, especially Black women, not to check out of voting or activism:
  • “A vote to stay on the couch is a vote for the other side…If you get 75% of what you want, that’s a win.” (62:10 KLB)

15. Unapologetic Self-Care & Final Reflections

(62:25–63:55)

• “I am most unapologetic about choosing me.” (62:42 KLB)
• Choosing to rest or set boundaries isn’t selfish—it’s necessary survival, especially after recognizing her father’s early death.
• “This S may be on my chest, but sometimes it gets crooked. Just take a minute, straighten it back up—girl, you’re good.” (63:46 KLB)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “You only have to tell the truth once.” (05:28 KLB—a foundational lesson)
• “Everything I am is because of everybody I came from and everything they went through.” (11:29 KLB)
• “A sentence for him was a sentence for us too.” (13:49 KLB—on her father’s incarceration)
• “Strong women push through...they die. Powerful women stop, feel, process...and only then do they move on.” (23:06 KLB; see full quote above)
• “If I have to dim my light for you to feel better, that’s something wrong with you, not with me.” (28:09 KLB)
• “We’ve never given up on each other at the same time.” (44:09 KLB—on marriage)
• “If God offers me grace and forgives me, why wouldn’t I forgive myself?” (25:43 KLB)
• “A vote to stay on the couch is a vote for the other side.” (62:10 KLB—on civic engagement)
• “I am most unapologetic about choosing me.” (62:42 KLB)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Front Porch Stories/Childhood Values: 05:01–06:40
• Book Writing & Storytelling: 07:12–08:09
• Resilience/Rough Side: 08:24–11:40
• Family Shame/Secrecy: 11:42–18:14
• Healing & Vulnerability: 19:35–23:47
• Strong vs. Powerful: 22:53–24:47
• Self-Forgiveness: 25:01–26:29
• Imposter Syndrome/Sanding Down: 26:34–28:21
• Motherhood/Fertility: 36:44–41:19
• Marriage & Friendship: 42:44–48:16
• Faith: 50:44–52:07
• Governor Campaign: 52:11–56:59
• Political Realities: 59:32–61:44
• Unapologetic Self-Care: 62:25–63:55

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Episode Tone & Style

The discussion is intimate, wise, candid, and gently humorous, with Crystal’s warm encouragement drawing out Keisha’s personal vulnerabilities and hard-won insights. Both women speak with clarity and faith, mixing laughter with moments of deep truth.

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Who Should Listen?

• Anyone interested in authentic conversations about healing, leadership, Black womanhood, motherhood, marriage, and faith.
• Those navigating the intersection of public success and private struggle.
• Listeners seeking encouragement, permission to rest, or support in owning their full stories.

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For further reflection:

• Order Keisha Lance Bottoms’ memoir The Rough Side of the Mountain and download the Keep It Positive, Sweetie Reflection Guide (see show notes for links).

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“What I appreciate most about this conversation is it’s not just about leadership, but about always having to be strong and composed, while still carrying very human things underneath it all.” (63:55 CRH)

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Transcript

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

This is an I heart podcast. Guaranteed human.

[Wheezy]

This is wheezy. WTF from Decisions, decisions, ladies. Let's talk about taking control of our sexual health. That's grown woman energy. You may think HIV affects someone else somewhere else, but the truth is it's impacting our community and some of us are being hit harder than others. Black women make up just 13% of the women in the US yet account for nearly half of new HIV diagnoses amongst women. Taking care of ourselves is community care. Know your options, ask questions and protect your peace and your body. That's using your power. Sponsored by Care for the Culture from Gilead Sciences. Pressure has a way of revealing what remains steady. In the latest Nissan campaign, the Nissan

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Rogue was tested to the extreme to

[Wheezy]

demonstrate that it's built to last through

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

durability and reliability challenges inspired by real tests and conducted by Nissan engineers. Brutal potholes, a steady force of water, even a jet powered sandstorm.

[Wheezy]

Each challenge inviting a deeper look at

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

how quality, durability and reliability hold their ground in real world conditions. Every test was 100% real.

[Wheezy]

No CG, no AI.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

To see how the Rogue held up,

[Wheezy]

visit nissan-duordability.com Peace to the planet.

[Malcolm Glabel]

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[Chris Renee Hayslett]

All?

[Malcolm Glabel]

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[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Calling all my sweeties to the forefront. I'm your host, Chris Renee Hayslett, and this is the Keep It Positive Sweetie Show. Welcome to Keep It Positive Sweetie, the place where we heal, grow, and learn together. Today's guest is someone people may know through leadership, politics, and public service. But in this conversation, we meet the woman beneath it all. Through her memoir, the Rough side of the Mountain, she opens up about family, shame, childhood trauma, faith, motherhood, and parts of herself she once felt she had to smooth over in order to succeed. This isn't just a conversation about leadership. It's a conversation about humanity, healing, and what it means to finally show up as your whole self. I'm honored to be sitting with Mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms. Before she became mayor of Atlanta, a national political voice or a leader through some of the country's most difficult moments. Keisha Lance Bottoms was a little girl from Atlanta navigating family secrets, faith, grief, and the pressure of becoming strong too early. And in her book, the Rough side of the Mountain, she tells that story with honesty, vulnerability, and grace. From childhood trauma to marriage, motherhood, leadership, and reclaiming the parts of herself she once thought she had to leave behind, this memoir is deeply personal and profoundly human. So, sweeties, please give a very warm welcome to Mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Thank you.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Thank you, thank you, thank you. I'm so happy you're here today. I was so excited when they said, would you be interested in interviewing Mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms? I'm like, what? First of all, you calling me.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yes. Now, I am so honored because, you know, I'm such a fan.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Same me, too.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Not just of your work, but you are just an incredible person.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Thank you.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And for as beautiful as you are on the outside, it's your inner beauty that shines most of all. So I'm glad to be here.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Thank you so much. I know you are busy, busy, busy. So the fact that you made time for us, we really appreciate it. So excited. We're going to get into your new book, the Rough side of the Mountain, but I Want to first open up with a quick game called Front Porch Stories. We're taking it back to little Keisha. So I want you to think about the first memory lesson or story that comes to mind when I give a phrase. Okay. The first one is, what's a saying from your childhood that still lives in your head?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That still lives in my head. You only have to tell the truth once.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

That's good. Yeah, that's really good. What's a smell that instantly takes you back home?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Smells of baking cakes.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

We talked about cake today.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And fried chicken. Chicken frying.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Your mom owned her own salon. What was your favorite style for her to do on your hair?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Ooh. I used to rock an asymmetric. Really? And it was stacked on one side, so. And I see those pictures now online. I'm like, wait, are we back?

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Honey, Everything. I feel like everything repeats itself, right?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That's right.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah. So for sure, the next one is what is something your family did growing up that you thought was normal until you got older?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Definitely traveling with my dad around the world. My dad was an entertainer.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Really?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And wherever he went, we went.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

That's amazing.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Who taught you the most about faith without preaching to you?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

My grandmother, for sure.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah. I love that strength used to mean this, but now it means blank.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Oh, I'm so grateful to have learned the difference between being powerful and being strong. So strength used to mean being strong. I now know it means being powerful.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

That's good. I love that. Thanks for playing along.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Thank you.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I love that. So you've written this book, and it really feels like a collection of lessons, memories, and pieces that really shaped who you are today. With writing this book, I want to ask you, was this more about telling a story or about meeting Keisha again?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

It was both. When I started this book, I left being mayor of Atlanta. I wasn't thinking about running for office again. So it really is the purest form of the story that I could have told, because I didn't do it in the lens of some political opinions about how it was written. It is very different than I initially envisioned it. I was gonna write these series of essays called Lessons My Mama Told Me Things My Mama said or something like that. And as I began to get put pen to paper, my team essentially said, you have an incredible story, and you should tell it.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And it was a love letter to my family, to my community, and I'm just. I'm so proud of it. And when I finished it, I said, if nobody else reads this but my family, and it makes Them proud. That will be enough.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah, no, I'm. You made a lot of people proud, so, yes, we're all proud of you. You open up with the gospel song Rough side of the Mountain. I remember hearing that song when I was a kid. And you connected to the idea that the rough side gives you something to hold on to.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That's right.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I want to know, when you look back, what did the rough side teach you that the story smooth side could have never taught you?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Oh, wow. So when you asked a question about smells and things, it's all from my grandmother's kitchen. Yeah. And she used to have this radio in her kitchen or either on tv. We see the commercial, the Rough side of the Mountain, and that tune is always in our heads. But I didn't have an appreciation for it. But I opened the book by talking about coming home from school and seeing my dad being led away in handcuffs. And this extraordinary life where we traveled the world in an instant was taken away. And my grandmother used to always say, all things work for the good of those who love the Lord. And I didn't see it then that these challenges is replacing ballet lessons with visiting my dad in prison, watching my mom struggle, watching as a single mother having this. This life of luxury removed literally in an instant, I didn't realize how resilient and how strong it was making me.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah. As a kid.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And so much of who I am today is because of that. Not that I would wish that on our family at all, but. But I know it's given me compassion. I know it's given me courage, and it's given me an ability to see things from a different lens than a lot of other people do, because I've lived it literally.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah. And I do believe that the levels that you have climbed, I believe that that empathy has allowed you to see from a lens that a lot of people in your position would never see from, because they haven't experienced that.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

So that is. Yeah. That's incredible.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I know what a prison smells like. I know what it looks like. I know what it's like to have to take that bucket of water home from the hair salon to flush the toilet because the water is off.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Wow.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

You know, and these are things that so many people experience on a daily basis, but for so many of us, they see us as we are and not who we have been.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes. And they don't still stay with you.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah, that's right. That's right.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I love that. Was there a time where you tried to detour the Mountain and not take

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

the hard route every chance I got. And it. And for me, I was always a hard worker. I always wanted to do my best because I didn't want to have to struggle the way that I saw my parents have to struggle. But it also meant wearing that mask that Paul Laurence Dunbar talks about. We wear the mask that grins and lies. So I wanted people to think, oh, no, I woke up just like this. This is how I've always been. And, no, you know, I don't understand all of that. I've never been there. But you realize at some point, one wearing that mask is exhausting.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Because it takes a lot of energy to put on airs.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And then I'm very grateful to have come to the full circle realization that everything I am is because of everybody who I came from and everything that they went through.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

So it makes me proud.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And even though my grandparents aren't here, my dad is not here. You know, I just hope that they are smiling down and they are proud, too. My mom, I was with my mom yesterday, and she's like, oh, I'm on the podcast part of your book where such and such happens. I'm like, how many times have you read the book? And this is probably her ninth time reading it, and she says each time she sees something different and she still cries when she reads it.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Wow. Your mom. First of all, I just love her. She is the best. I met her at an event, I think it was last year, and she's so sweet.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Thank you.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

She is a rock star. You talked about your father being arrested. You were eight years old.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

This was a moment. Everything shifted.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yes.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I want to know, at that age, how are you dealing with that emotionally?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Well, first of all, my dad was an extraordinary human being. He was a wonderful man who loved his family deeply. My dad struggled with addiction. I later learned I didn't know it at that time. And my mom even told me he said to her once, when they were at the height of their entertainment status, they would give them something to stay up at night and they would give them something to sleep at night and give them something to wake up in the morning.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Whoa.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

So, you know, and for too many entertainers, that's a story, especially of that generation.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah, we've seen it. I mean, we didn't live it, but we saw it in movies.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That's right.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I'm like, wow, that was very common.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That's right. And so, you know, so I write about his incarceration, his selling drugs, when his career began to Wane and not knowing how else to make ends meet and his struggles with addiction and, you know, for so many people, I say in the book, a sentence for him was a sentence for us too.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right. Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Because everything changed for us in that moment. And it's, you know, it's life altering in so many ways. My parents divorced while my dad was in prison. But also this lesson that sometimes really good people make bad mistakes. And it's not because they don't love you.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

It's just because in that moment, they just can't find the power to do any better.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And so there were so many lessons for me in that.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Learning to forgive my dad, learning to give him grace, learning.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

When did you learn that? Because as a child, were you harboring certain feelings towards him?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Oh, my gosh. I internalized so much.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I write in the book about experiencing my eating disorders, what I now know is called depression and anxiety and feeling like you had to walk out the house every day with that mask on. Because I grew up in a household where it was what goes on in this house stays in this house.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I think that's every black household. That's the same way.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

You better not go out telling our business. You better walk out that door looking like everything is okay.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

It's stifling and it's debilitating.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

It's a lot to put on a person. Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And at 8 years old especially.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That you have to walk out the house and look like everything's okay when really everything is falling apart.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right. We talk about when children experience trauma very early on. Do you think that that was the beginning of becoming the strong one in your family that you still are today

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

in a healthy and unhealthy way? Because I never want it to be the problem. Which meant I didn't always share my problems, didn't share my feelings, but also feeling like I had to be responsible for everybody. And that's a heavy burden for a child.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And it's not that anybody put it on me. I put it on myself and. And it began to manifest itself in my life. I write about my fibroids and having these fibroids that were described as my uterus being the size of a four to six month pregnancy. These debilitating fibroids that had a lot to do with my inability to carry a child.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And you know, fibroids are often associated with black women.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

They are disposable, described as bundles of stress.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Isn't that crazy that we're the ones that you mainly see it in.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That's right. Because it's believed that. That we're carrying all that stress in this one place.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

So I unpacked a whole lot in this book. Right. About my fertility journey.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes. The.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Probably more than a dozen surgeries. I say probably because I lost count.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Jesus.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

At some point. Point. Ultimately, having a partial hysterectomy, making the decision to adopt children, and just the unhealthy ways in which I internalize stress.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right. Yeah. No, it's really tough. One thing this book does, you honestly talk about what happens in the house stays in this house. You hold on to the secrets and the misplaced shame. I want to know, at what point did you realize that you were carrying so much that was never meant for you to carry?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

You know, I don't know that there was a single moment that I realized that it just became too heavy to carry.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And for me, it was speaking it aloud, which was not until I ran for mayor of Atlanta.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And realizing that so many people had a misconception of me. And a lot of that was of a part about hiding. Hiding who I was.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And. And meaning, you know, people saying, oh, you're aloof. Well, that's often just a guard. That's a guard for insecurity.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

You know, feeling like you got to walk in the room and, oh, let me. Let them not really see who I am and what I am, because they may not like me.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Wow.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And once I began to tell my story publicly, I was stunned how much relief I felt.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

It was like just shedding pounds of weight and baggage.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah. And I'm sure in that you also probably found people that like, man, I thought I was alone in this. I'm going through the same thing.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Let me tell you. I never knew so many people's parents had struggled with addiction and struggled financially, had gone to prison. So many people would come to me and share their stories. First time I ever publicly talked about. Second time, I was at an elementary school, and a parent came to me, and she told me her daughter's father had just gone to prison. And this little girl was like, the star student of the class, and she just had tears in her eyes. She said, you don't know how much it meant for her to hear you say that. And the little girl just came, and she just wrapped her arms around me. She didn't say a word. She just.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

She didn't have to.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

She didn't.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

That's what this platform is about. It's about sharing stories. So that people can feel seen. Because a lot of times people don't have the voice or feel like they have a right to speak up about how they're feeling. These conversations help people feel seen. So I love that you are opening up, sharing your truth, because there are so many little girls that will hear your story, be like, oh, my gosh, I thought it was just me, you know?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

So I love that we're able to open up about this.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah. Because I write about the neighbor who used to inappropriately touch me.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And again, not wanting to be the problem, never telling anybody. And how many children are afraid to speak up.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And can't they carry that shame?

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

They do. Yeah. So many. You opened up about. You talked about anorexia and struggling with bulimia. People look at you and you're like, she's this successful woman. She's confident. She's got everything going for herself. What's the danger in becoming so good at hiding that nobody can even recognize when you're hurting?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Oh, so many dangers there, because you are. You feel as if you're the only one and you're struggling alone. And I write about telling, in separate occasions my mom and who's now my husband, then my boyfriend about that. I'd never told anybody, and they were both like, well, that's stupid. You do what now and then, just shutting up about it and not speaking about it again. And I laugh about it because they love me more than anybody on the planet.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

But for black families, this concept of somebody struggling with an eating disorder. And an eating disorder is about so much more than weight. It's about control. It is those things you can control and those things you can't control. Body image is a part of it, but for me, that was the thing I could control. Control.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Oh, my gosh. How old were you when you started struggling with this?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I was probably 12 or 13. And it went on, on and off, probably through my sophomore year of college.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Wow. Yeah. I've had friends. I never struggle with that because I just like to eat all the time. But I never turned down no plate. But I had friends who did struggle with that, and I couldn't. Like your mom and your husband or boyfriend at the time, I couldn't wrap my mind. I'm like, why would you do that? But now that you break it down, and for anybody else who's dealing with this, this is a better way to put some language behind it and understand these may be the reasons why you're doing this so you can actually get ahead of it because I couldn't understand at that age, like, why would you do that?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And even connecting that. Having my therapist helped me connect it to the neighbor who used to inappropriately touch me and my shame of my body because I was very curvy, very young, and I had never connected those dots. And I never thought that. I thought I had moved on from that too. But we realized when we don't resolve issues when we just keep packing them apart away.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

You know, it's like packing a refrigerator with some food. At some point it's gonna start to stink and spoil.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Oh, that's a good analogy. Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And that's what happens when. When you pack your issues away and you don't deal with them, at some point they start to rot.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Absolutely. Do you think that high achieving women have become experts at performing strength because that's what they feel like everyone expects aspects of them.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Let me tell you about my therapist, and I've been quoting her so much publicly. Yeah. I need to put it on T shirt. Dr. Rosa Turner. Ash.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Wow.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Said there's a difference between being strong and being powerful. Strong women push through. They have heart attacks, they have strokes, they have high blood pressure and they die. Powerful women stop, they feel, they process, they learn the lesson, and then, and only then do they move on. So many of us are strong. So for me, it was. This is what the women in my life do. They put on the clothes and the hair is done and they just keep going no matter what. They don't process, they don't feel.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And learning the difference has just been so empowering for me.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I recently like so many women, we talk about these 300,000 black women who've lost their jobs. Well, for people like me who are self employed, contracts are everything. I recently lost a really big contract, so my first inclination was, was, girl, you're gonna be all right. Don't even think about that. Just keep moving. And then I stopped. I'm like, hold on. This is messed up. Yeah. And this is scary. And this doesn't feel great.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

So let. Let me process this. Let me allow myself to be in my feelings and then move on. Yeah. And surprisingly, it didn't even take me a day. But I had to pat myself on the back for having my pity party.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes. Cause you don't give yourself the grace to have one.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I never allow myself to have pity parties, but I had one that day.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Good.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And I felt powerful.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes. I love that. Yeah. And I feel like more women should take the time to do that. Because we are, we're like, I gotta keep pushing, I gotta keep going. I don't have time. Like nobody, nobody cares. That's the thought that keeps ringing in our head. We just gotta keep going.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That's right. Yeah.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I wanna know for the people that are listening, who are carrying shame or pain or trauma from their past, who have finally been able to separate what happened to them from who they are. Because a lot of times people, they kind of get stuck in what happened to them. What. Is there something you could say to them who are trying to separate from what happened to who they actually are?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

You know, there are so many things that we internalize as if it's our fault. Separate the two. Even when it is your fault, even when it is a self inflicted wound. For me, I think about the grace that God gives to me. So if God offers me grace and I believe in my faith that he forgives me, then why wouldn't I forgive myself?

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And I'm constantly saying to myself, well, girl, that's done now.

[Wheezy]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

In this powerful season, I know I got to process it and I got to learn to feel. I've got to feel it.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

But I'm like, girl, that's done. Forgive yourself and move on. And I would just say that to anyone. That same grace that if you are a person of faith, you believe God shows you that same grace that you would show your neighbor. Yes. Or family member. It's okay to show it to yourself.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Absolutely.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And for some people it may be writing it down in a book.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Sharing it with others. For some it just may be that conversation with yourself.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

On forgiving yourself.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Absolutely.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And being kind to yourself.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right. No, for sure. In the book you talk about sanding yourself down.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

And our sanding parts of yourself down. And I feel like a lot of people in the public eye do this and sometimes they don't even realize they're doing it where it's like, I'm dimming my light in certain areas because I'm too afraid. I want to ask you, at what point did you realize that success had started costing pieces of who you really are?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

You know, I take a lot back to running for mayor because I was so exposed in so many ways, subject to so much, for sure. Scrutiny and having to explain so much of who I was and what motivated me to do what I did. But I was always aware of what we now call imposter syndrome. Walking in the rooms going, am I really good enough? And these are things I'm saying to myself, never mind I was invited into the room. Never mind that they thought I was good enough. I'm like, girl, this jig is gonna be up. They gonna see that you really should, shouldn't be in this room. So it's, it's, it was more of a, a different times recognizing the sanding down.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

But then at some point just saying, and again I go back to telling my story saying like, wait a minute, like, you know, I'm, I, I am all that. And it's okay to be all that. Doesn't mean that I'm of part perfect.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

But it means that I'm just as qualified, I'm just as powerful. And if I have to dim my light for you to feel better, that's something that's wrong with you, not with me.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Exactly. That's good for you. I'm glad you got to that point.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And I was going to say, and also just lastly, purging friendships that require you to dim your light too, because that's something we all have to.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

You know, our good friend Tyler, everybody can't go where you're going. And that doesn't mean that it's because you think you're better than somebody else. I still have friends from kindergarten right in my life. But it means that when your purpose no longer aligns, sometimes you have to love people from afar.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

For sure. Yeah. And I've had that. I actually had a season of this podcast where we talked about purging season where I just felt like God was literally like pruning my entire life. And it was a really tough season to navigate. And I was like, goodness Lord, like, do I have to go through this? But it was, it was for the good, you know, and not all of that lasts forever. You know what I'm saying? Sometimes you just need a separation so that we can both grow mature. But some people do, they can't handle the altitude in which you're growing.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah, that's right.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah. So that's good. That's definitely something that I had to go through. When you look back at yourself from this perspective now, what are some things that you feel like you were hiding or trying to stand down because you were struggling with the imposter syndrome?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Not wanting people to know my struggles was one thing. Not wanting people to know that I struggle internally was another thing. And just, you know, when, when you are often the first. For me in, in my family, I come from a family of self made people.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yep.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Smartest people I've ever known. But when you go and you get that Degree. And you get that advanced degree, you're around another right group of people. You're like, oh, okay. You know, their background's a little different from mine.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

So I'm not always telling the story of my people.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Because maybe I don't feel like this piece of the puzzle fits in this room. But again, recognizing that's their problem, not yours. My problem.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Because my people were some strong.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Come on.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Resilient people who made a way out of no way.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

When they. They didn't have money passed down, they didn't have a formal education, and they still figured it out. And they did it with common sense, and they did it with hard work, and they did it with faith.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right. That's so good. I love that.

[Wheezy]

This is wheezy. Wtf from Decisions, decisions. You know, a lot of us grew up not fully trusting the healthcare system. And honestly, the system has given us plenty of reasons to feel that way. But now it's time for us to take control of the conversation, to take control of our sexual health. Learn the facts, ask questions, and advocate for ourselves. That's how we start changing the story. So let's talk. We like to think HIV is something that affects other people, but it is hitting our own community hard. Black women make up about 13% of women in the US but account for nearly half of all new HIV diagnoses around women. And being proactive doesn't mean you just don't trust your partner. It just means you trust yourself enough to stay in control. So know your options, ask questions, and protect your peace and your body. That's real power. Because protecting yourself isn't embarrassing. It's responsible. Sex is normal. Protecting yourself should be normal too. Actually, it's kind of badass. Taking control of your sexual health is grown woman energy. Sponsored by Care for the Culture from Gilead Sciences.

[Malcolm Glabel]

Hello. Hello, this is Malcolm Glabel from Smart talks with IBM. Today we're diving into a fascinating conversation with Stefano Pallard, head of fan development for Scuderia Ferrari. Hp, your pronunciation is.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

It's strongly American. It's more Scuderia Ferrari.

[Malcolm Glabel]

I'm still working on rolling my R's, but what I was able to learn from Stefano was the importance of engaging the Tifosi, the Ferrari superfans. In the digital age.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Ferrari fans and super fans want to be part of something, want to belong to something.

[Wheezy]

So they want to be part of

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

a community, and ultimately they want to be part of a winning team.

[Malcolm Glabel]

You've got Ferrari, which is a long history, design history, and now you're interacting in a kind of digital space. I'm curious how you balance those two traditions.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

When it comes to fan engagement, it's really digital technology. And digital channels are being able to create a deeper connection with our fans.

[Malcolm Glabel]

To learn more about how Ferrari and IBM are using technology to build deeper connections with fans, visit IBM.com/ferrari.

[Brown Girl Grinding (Shopify user)]

Okay, so quick behind the scenes moment about my business because people always ask me like, how do I actually run everything? So Shopify is literally the platform where I turned this tiny idea into a business. Before this, I was really just like popping up at any in person event, any vending opportunity I could, which I still do. But I wasn't really as focused online. I was like, you know, the websites are going to be too much to build out. I'm not like a super techie person, even though I can make things cute. And I didn't want to put up a website that would run my customers away. I wanted it to be efficient, to be easy. And Shopify helped me build brown girlgrinding.com out. Once I switched to Shopify, it finally clicked like, okay, I can actually do this. It's not about it being tough. It's about using the right platform to make it easy. Shopify takes all of the guesswork out. I build my own store, I manage my community, own my own customer relationships. Plus this is my favorite thing. Shopify gets my products everywhere. I'm able to link stuff through Google, YouTube, TikTok, Shop the Shop app, even ChatGPT and Instagram, which is very important for me. And Shopify's AI co founder, sidekick, game changer, let me tell y'.

[Malcolm Glabel]

All.

[Brown Girl Grinding (Shopify user)]

Right, so it's helped me not only optimize my site, it helps me look at my sales trends, it updates my product skills, all the stuff I'm absolutely not an expert in. But it's like having a genius business partner that never sleeps. And right now, the Bronco grinding storefront and the Black Effects storefront is busy and Shopify is handling all of the heavy lifting. I love that for us. I am pumped, like so pumped that Shopify is going to show up at the Black Effect Podcast festival this year

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

in a big way.

[Brown Girl Grinding (Shopify user)]

And I will be there preaching this platform to all of the small black owned businesses that partner with us. So if you've been sitting on an idea or if you're ready to scale, which you've already started, this is your sign. Go to shopify.com Ben if I can do it, you can do it too.

[Martha (Kohler Cast Iron Ambassador)]

When Kohler, the Global design leader in luxurious kitchen and bath products, came to me and said, martha, we need an ambassador for our timeless, elegant, durable cast iron products. I said, I'm in. Now let me see the factory. Weeks later, I was suited up in coveralls and work boots, walking through their Kohler, Wisconsin cast iron foundry. I stood next to the molten iron furnace, saw the hand applying enamel, and touched the gorgeous finished products waiting to be sent out into the world. Since 1883, Kohler cast iron products have been forged and finished by the incredible craftspeople right in Kohler, Wisconsin. I'll tell you, I gained a newfound respect and appreciation for Kohler's cast iron craftsmanship. So now I'm lending my discerning stamp of approval to my most beloved Kohler cast iron products for their durability, beauty and timelessness. Shop my Kohler cast iron favorites curated on Kohler.com bring the warmth, character and enduring style of these timeless products into your kitchens and bathrooms. As the Kohler cast iron ambassador, I say long live cast iron black women.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Especially when it comes to climbing the corporate ladder or being the first in these rooms. Do you feel like we feel like we have to be more polished, more educated and everything to even be accepted in those rooms?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

And why is that? I feel like there's always like a double standard when it comes to us.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Well, there is a double standard. There is a double standard. So I don't think that's all self imposed, but what I find, and we've seen studies that talk about men entering rooms or even applying for jobs. They can feel like they are 25, 40% qualified and they're like, I'm going for it.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And we feel like we gotta check all the boxes, cross all the t's, dot all the I's, to even present ourselves as a candidate. So part of it is self imposed, but there is some. This extra burden that's placed upon us.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That we can come with all the credentials and we can come with all the experience and we still have to explain ourselves and justify ourselves and sometimes even answer to people who we know aren't nearly as qualified as we are.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right. Yeah. No, I've definitely seen that happen before. I want to talk about your motherhood journey. You talk about ivf, you talked about the fibroids, which is something even I. I'm 43 now. Last year I went to the fertility doctor just to even see if I could have children because I hadn't been trying. But I was like, let me just see if I can even have kids, if I should try to freeze my eggs or what the case may be found out. I had fibroids as well. And she's like, right now, it doesn't look like there's any inside your uterus. We would have to do another procedure just to go inside and look around and make sure you're okay. Because if you do want to do IVF and freeze your eggs, then we need to go in and get those fibroids out of your uterus before we can actually plant one inside of you. And I was like, all this stuff we got to think about, you know, as a woman who has gone through that, you talk about losing count of the surgeries you had to have take us on that journey. And I know there's so many women that struggle with that. You know, I was struggling with it. Had no idea I was struggling with it. Because that's not something you find out. Just going to get to get a pap smear.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

No, it's not.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right. Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

So for me, and this was late 1990s, early 2000s, so even freezing eggs wasn't a common thing then. So I knew that I had fibroids. I had a surgery before. Like, I'd had a cyst on my ovaries. So I had a few minor things. But once my husband and I started trying and I write about having this exploratory surgery that then led to the scar tissue, that then led to this other condition that compromised my uterus and was ultimately believed to be the reason that I couldn't carry a child. And it was heartbreaking. It's one, it's expensive. Secondly, you know, for so many women, you feel as if you are not complete unless you. You complete that motherhood journey in this traditional way. So feeling like a failure as a woman, as a wife, and, you know, did I bring this on myself by letting them do this exploratory surgery? And then the pain and trauma of it all. I mean, these surgeries are painful. Painful.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Wow.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And then when you go through IVF treatment, then you are at the expense of it all. And it is just. It's such a process. You have to take shots every day at some point. You have to go to the doctor every day at some point. They retrieve the eggs, and then they. They do whatever they do with the eggs and the sperm, and then you get them implanted then. Yeah. I mean, it's. They're like multiple steps. And I'm not saying this to scare anybody or discourage them, but it is. It is something that unless You've been through it. You cannot begin to imagine how taxing it is physically and emotionally. And it was horrible for us because it didn't result in us having a child. But that being said, say it again. This rough side of the mountain, had I not been through any of that.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I would not have adopted the four wonderful children that I have. And I could not imagine being a mother to anybody else other than those four.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes, I love that. I can't imagine that's an extreme letdown, disappointment to go through all that. And then they say, sorry, you still can't have children, but your purpose and destiny was in those four.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That's right.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes. I love that. I do want to ask you, what is something that your four children have taught you that living the public life you've had to live could have never taught you?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

My four children keep me so grounded.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Kids will do that.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

They are my level setters.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Oh, I love that.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I mean, even on Mother's Day day, I had to go to the mall and look for some clothes for them to wear election night. And somebody said, don't you have somebody do that for you? I'm like, no, that would be me, because I'm still the mother for sure, you know? And for me, it's grounding because it just helps me prioritize really what's important. And for me, being a mother is really important. And my husband always says to me, you know, they're gonna make life decisions for you one day. Like, so you better always make sure they don't forget. They do not forget. So, you know, it's just. For me, the biggest lesson has just been priorities.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah, I love it to them. I love that. And I love you and your husband, Derek. I love your relationship. And y' all always together. You. I didn't realize that you guys been together 30 years, but, like, were friends first.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

We were. We used to study together. I was trying to introduce him to one of my friends. I said, she likes older guys. Like, talk to her. He was like, nah, I like older guys.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I love that.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And my mama was like, I think he wants to do more than study.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah, clearly. I love that. But I love. I love your relationship, and I love how you were friends first. How do you feel? Like that friendship helped shape the bond that you all have through everything that you've gone through and withstood the test of time, because a lot of things that you've gone through would break up the strongest couple. Like, even if he really wanted to have kids one way, and you're like, I can't. Certain things in your life and even running for mayor in office, those things can be straining on a marriage. How do you feel? Like that friendship really set the tone. And that bond that you. You have.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Well, all those things were straining on a marriage. And, you know, again, just what the. It doesn't mean that you go out in public and like, oh, by the way, Derek and I are not speaking today. You know, we're gonna walk in here holding hands. We hadn't spoken since yesterday. But the friendship. I say for us, the beauty of our relationship. Relationship. We've never given up on each other at the same time.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Oh, I love that.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Relationships. The best of relationships aren't perfect relationships. Sometimes you're here, and sometimes you're here, and it may all be in the same day, but that friendship, sometimes the same hour, you know, that friendship is what keeps us.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Connected, because we do like each other. We do love each other. We have fun together.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

We enjoy each other's company. So having that foundation has sustained us. And, you know, it's like. I'm like, he's crazy. And he's like, you were crazier. But it. You know, we just always find our way to each other. So I'm just grateful for that.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I love that. I love that in writing this book, I'm sure there's a lot of reflection and moments where. As you're writing, was there a moment where you just looked like, man, like, I really have a good husband? You know, like, there's moments where you. You know it. But, like, as you're writing, it's like, dang, he did all this. Like, this is. This is good, man. Savannah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Well, you know what? It is, because. Because in relationships, you remember the really good things that sustain you. And in writing this book, and I joke with him, I said, you need to pay me for how wonderful you came out in this book. He was like, I pay you every day. He's like, your life is a payment, but also thinking about, you know, I. How I want my kids to see their father.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

In our relationship, you know, I don't want to write the details about when we weren't speaking and not getting along. Not that you're hiding the truth, but, you know, he is my husband. He is the father of my children, and I will always hold him in the best light possible for my children and vice versa. He does for me, too.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

He just didn't write a book yet. He said, I write my book.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

We'll be waiting for It. You can.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Come on.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Keep it positive. Tweet and we'll talk to you. I know he's gonna watch this. Like, what were y' all talking about? But there were so many moments where Derrick recognized strengths in you that you didn't even recognize. I want to know how important is it to have a partner who sees things when you're doubting yourself.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Oh, my gosh. Derek has always seen the best in me in that regard. That when I didn't believe that I could do certain things, and I write about this, even we are in law school, and I said I felt like it was a continuation of my time at famu because I was still living my best FAMU life, but I was in law school and getting those first set of grades. I was like, oh, got to get it together. And him having this conversation with me about, you were smart, you're capable. Wow. You just. You gotta stop going out so much. I know.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

That's right. That's what the older man will do for you.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That's right.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Get you together.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Well, he later said he knew then he wanted to marry me, but he was not going to explain to people that we met in law school and I flunked out.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

So he was like, that would not be my story.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I'm going to need you to finish. But, yeah, you know, he's always seen the best in me.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And even when I didn't see it in myself. So I'm really fortunate for that. That's what a relationship is, should be, whether it's a friendship or whether it's a romantic relationship that people you are around see the very best in you

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

and bring that out in you for sure. You talked about your children. Grounding you is like, keeping you ground, not grounding you. Like, her kids aren't putting her on punishment. How they ground you. How has your marriage grounded you as well?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Well, you know, Derek refers to our home as Derek Stan, and he says it's a sovereign nation.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I know that's right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

So when I was mayor, you know, when I would come in the house with what he called all that aggressive mayor energy, he's like, hey, hey, it's Derek's Dan. You need to leave all that Derek at the mailbox. Like, don't bring all that aggression.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

In here. But, you know, it is difficult to. To kind of modulate those. You got to go out in the world one way, and then you got to come back in the house another way. And not in an effort to diminish me, but like, hey, you don't have to come in here fighting like you've been fighting all day. We don't have to fight in here too. You don't have to be aggressive with me. So you know, again, that. And thankfully Derek is. He ain't that in the politics. He supports me because it's me, but he's like, I just want to go to my good job, do my job, and I'm gonna be supportive of you as my wife. So that's helpful.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah, I love that. Derek. Stan sounds like a soft landing place for you when you come home. My parents had a rule, whatever like happens at work stays at work. So that the home felt more like home.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

So my mom would come in and she'd be like, I need an hour. So she would go in her room, shut the door. Then an hour's like, okay, what do y' all want to eat? Like, it was a totally different place. Yeah. But she would take an hour to herself because it was a lot. She worked at a hospital, so she saw so much and every day it was just like, it was a lot for one person to take. A lot of people don't understand what people at the hospital see on a day to day basis is not.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That's a lot to internalize a lot.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

So I didn't understand it then, but I mean, it was like, okay, you need it. That was just like a normal thing. Mom needs her hour. But as an adult, I get it now. Because when I go home and I don't have no kids, I'm like, I need an hour.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Well, yeah, sometimes you just need to decompress. Right. Because you're walking out in world and you're having to give so much. Sometimes you just need to take a moment to yourself.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. You talk about your faith and that is clearly a firm foundation that you stand on. You even dedicated scripture pages in your book. I want to know how has faith helped you in moments where you didn't understand at the time, but you had to really lean on God to get you through it.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Just always remembering what my grandmother would tell me, that it's going to always work out for my good. So even, you know, not knowing where provision would always come from, not knowing why things happen. Like grandmama always told me it was going to work out for my good.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And the other thing. And again with faith. Some people think of faith as meaning that you got to be perfect and that you're a holy roller. I say I'm a big sinner.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

But.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

But we all, we all are about

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

to say, honey, we all are.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

We all are. But I know that God still loves me, often in spite of me. And that was the faith that my grandmother taught me about.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes. Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And at some point, you know, with any child, you. You have to grow into your own faith.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And for me, many of these lessons that she had told me were I. I had to learn from myself at different times in life, for sure. Through my own experiences.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes. So now I want to talk about where we are today.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Oh, yeah.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes. You are now running for governor.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I am.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

First of all, what made you. Did you just wake up and say, I'm running for governor?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Absolutely not. I did not.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

How did we get here?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Well, you know, I was doing a lot of things that didn't involve politics.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I, you know, I produced the. The show over at Tyler Perry studios. I worked Ms.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Governor, by the way.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yes. I had the privilege of working at the White House. I was doing. Commentating for cnn. I was consulting. I was doing a lot of things, living my. My best free life.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

But the day after the presidential election, I went into prayer. Like, lord, what am I called to do in this moment? And I found a journal. I had written some notes, just having this real honesty conversation with God about, well, why do I have to run for office? Because the calling was in my heart.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

But my mind's like, girl, do you really want to get.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Walk back into that? Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That. And give up all these things that are making you comfortable. Right. But when God has a calling on your life, it's difficult to ignore it. And for me, that calling is to serve. And I prayed about what am I called to do in this season.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And I know from my time as mayor, I had to go fight on behalf of people.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

You did.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Didn't have the ability to speak up for themselves.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And I'm here.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

You are here.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And I know it's the right thing to do, because once I had the confirmation that this was the path I was to Tate, I hadn't thought about it. Again, really, was this the right decision?

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

What was the time period from, like, feeling that in your heart, praying about it to, like, this is what I'm going to do. Like, how long do you have to mull over it?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I wrote those notes sometime in November of 2024, because I came across it recently and saw it. I announced my run, I believe, in April of 20, 20, 25. And I was, you know, still tossing and turning about it. And again, you know, I remember even just before making that announcement, One of my dear cousins, who was like a. More like a brother to me than a cousin, told us that he was very ill. And we did know that he had been ill. He looked fine to us.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Us. Wow.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

But he took a turn, and he told us about two weeks before he passed that he had stomach cancer. And so again, it was this. Then I look at the pictures that I even took launching the campaign, and I can see the sadness in my eyes. But again, you know, the life.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I'm here professionally. I'm here personally, but remembering there will be these rough patches.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And you're gonna go up some rough patches, and they're gonna be some rough times, but just keep climbing. Yeah. And just keep holding on.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

So it was, you know, launching professionally, finally saying that out loud was very fulfilling, personally. Very painful. But it was, you know, again, these lessons of faith that my grandmother taught me.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah. No, I love that you were our mayor during one of the hardest times of my life through the pandemic and faced a lot of scrutiny. You're running for governor. What is something that you can tell people that. Because I know we've had this conversation and, like, what are things that you can tell people that are going to be different? That this is why you should vote for Keisha Lance Bottoms.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah. I'm a battle tested leader, and I fought with every single thing I had for the people of Atlanta and for the people across this state. And I did it because it was the right thing to do. And it doesn't mean that every day decision I made was perfect, but it did mean that I tried my very best. And, you know, even when people have asked me, well, why don't you run for a second term?

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

That's the question that comes up.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah. Yeah. I went into prayer about that, you know, reminding people I finished my term and I finished it strong. I did a poll just before I left the mayor's office that 68%.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Our internal polls showed me. So I knew the people of Atlanta were pleased with the representation I provided. And I write about this in my book. My dad died suddenly at 55. And I given everything I had to being mayor to the city. I was giving everything I had to my family. I write about even the night of the protest in Atlanta when I gave.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I remember like it was yesterday. Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

When I got home, my son. My son Langston was like, they ate all the fish. They ate all the fried fish because I was cooking. When I left to go to police headquarters, I came in and I fried fish and Cooked grits for him.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Oh, when I got home, back to mommy mode. It's like, back to still gotta. Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

So I'd given every single thing I had. But at that time, I had. I was pre diabetic, I was pre glaucoma, which I still am. I have to use drops now. I pre hypertensive, chronic inflammation. I gained 30 pounds. Like all these things. And I would think my daddy died suddenly at 55 if I had four years left.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

What about my kids? What about me? And making a decision not out of weakness, but out of strength. Like, I'm making the best decision for me and my family at this time. And what I will say now, having served in the White House, reconnecting, even with my therapist, and in making sure that I understand I don't have to sacrifice everything about myself for everybody else to succeed and to be happy has been empowering for me.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I think that's a message to all the women around the world.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah. So when your mom would come home and say, I need an hour, it means there are days where I have to say, you know what? I need a minute. And the old me would never, ever do that. I would rather died making sure that everybody else was happy and whole than live with thinking somebody else didn't get everything they needed out of me.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

That's so good. Yeah, I totally get that. A lot of people who don't understand politics, we see everything from the outside. Why are they doing that? Why didn't they do this? Why didn't they say this? What is something that you can share to help people who don't really understand politics understand what goes behind the decision making and how it doesn't all fall on just whatever you feel is right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

You know, people often expect perfection from politics, politicians, and, you know, even when I made the decision not to run again, I said, everybody's not going to understand it. It's not for everybody to understand everybody and always understand the. What it takes to be able to get things done. You sometimes have to negotiate, you sometimes have to give on things that you don't necessarily want to give on. But you see, the benefit is worth giving some things in return. And it is difficult as a politician when you have to fight on all sides. So as a Democrat, I'm already fighting with Republicans on so much, I want to have to fight with my people too.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Right.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Disagree with me, respectfully. Give me your input, respectfully. But to be attacked on all sides just makes it more difficult for people to lead. And I believe that's why you've seen so many people step away from politics and not for sure.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

You know, I've had the people at my house, I've had the people call me the N word and the people, you know, send inappropriate messages to me and to my kids. Kids. I've had the threats on my life, very credible threats from kidnapping to bodily harm. But I would say the vast majority of people who are doing this, it doesn't pay well. So you're not doing it for the money. You're doing it because you care. Because you care and you're trying to serve people. So just give people grace.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah, I love that. I love it. Thank you. I know these are questions that people want to know and this is a very important election. So much is happening with where they're changing different things around that are not for the black culture's benefit. So thank you so much.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And just reminding people, don't check out.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

This is time to check in. Dude, this is not the time to check out.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

Yeah. A vote to stay on the couch is a vote for the other side. You may not get everything you want, but if you get 75% of what you want, that's a win.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah. Better than none of what you want.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That's right.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah. No, I totally agree. So this season on keep it positive, sweetie. We are leaning more into being unapologetic. So I want to know with you running for office, your leadership, being a mother, all the things, what are you most unapologetic about in this season of your life?

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

I am most unapologetic about choosing me.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yes.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

So that means sometimes when I get home, if it's 5:30, it may mean that I put on my pajamas at 5:30. I'm not changing until the pre bed clothes. I'm not changing into the at home clothes. No. I'm putting my pajamas on and I'm getting in the bed. May mean that I'm working from my bed, but I'm in the bed because I'm tired.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

I heard that again.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

That old me. Yeah. I would have never thought of doing that.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yeah. And that really rang true when you talked about your father passing. And I realize you saying the reality check of I have four more years to the age that my father passed. What am I going to do to make sure. And I know how stressful your job is. That is literally like causing you to become sick. You know, so the choosing yourself. And I think that's a message to all women because we think we're a superhero and it's put on your cape and keep going, you know.

[Keisha Lance Bottoms]

And now for me it's taken time. Like yeah, this s may be on my my chest but sometimes it gets crooked. Just take a minute, straighten it back up like girl, you're good.

[Chris Renee Hayslett]

Yep, I love that. Mary Keelan sp, thank you so much for coming to spend time with us guys. Please go get her book the Rust side of the Mountain where books are available. I promise you you will not regret it. Thank you so so much. Thank you so much. Absolutely. What I appreciate most about this conversation is it's not just about leadership, but about of always having to be strong and composed while still carrying very human things underneath it all. And I think that's what makes the Rough side of the Mountain so powerful. Kesha, thank you so much for your honesty, your grace, and for allowing us to see the woman behind the armor. Thank you for tuning into another episode of Keep It Positive Sweetie. Be sure to grab your copy of the Rough side of the Mountain where books are sold. And don't forget to download the Season 11 Kips Reflection Guide at crystalrenehazel.com subscribe Share this Episode with someone who needs it. And if you need advice, positivity, or just want to share what you're going through, email us at keepitpositive outcomes gmail.com as always, stay blessed, stay encouraged, and keep it positive sweetie. I'll see you guys next time.

[Wheezy]

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