You Can’t Cancel Gods Plans w/ LeCrae

Summary

Keep It Positive, Sweetie

Episode: “You Can’t Cancel God’s Plans” w/ Lecrae
Host: Crystal Renee Hayslett
Guest: Lecrae
Date: December 21, 2025

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Episode Overview

This live episode of Keep It Positive, Sweetie brings Grammy-winning artist and social thought-leader Lecrae to the stage in Atlanta for an authentic dialogue. Host Crystal Renee Hayslett and Lecrae dive into faith, personal transformation, cultural responsibility, overcoming judgment, and the dynamic intersection of Christianity and hip-hop. Lecrae shares how his journey and latest album encourage resilience and reconstruction—reminding us “you can’t cancel God’s plans.” The conversation is raw, honest, and filled with wisdom, humor, and inspiration for anyone navigating growth amid criticism or church hurt.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Lecrae’s Early Journey: From “The Streets” to Disciple

[06:52]–[08:19]

• Lecrae explains his unconventional path to faith:
  • Raised by a mother who was hurt by the strictness of church and distanced from organized religion, music became his creative solace.
  • Summertime “patio church” with his grandmother planted early seeds of faith.
  • Difficulties during school years and a longing for something deeper led to a “spiritual transformation.”
  • Humorous reflection:

    “I got three kids now. I probably would have about 12 more had it not been for Jesus. I’d have my own disciples. 12 disciples.”
    — Lecrae [08:13]

Redefining the Christian Artist Label

[09:18]–[10:44]

• Lecrae rejects strict genre labels, seeing himself as a bridge between the “greenhouse” (church) and “jungle” (mainstream culture).
• He seeks authentic engagement with both faith-based and secular audiences:

  “Some people burn down bridges, but some people walk across them... I want to be that bridge from the kingdom to the culture.”
  — Lecrae [10:21]

Remaining True Amid Criticism (Even from Christians)

[10:44]–[11:32]

• On backlash from both faith and secular communities:

  “People have tried to cancel me, but you can’t cancel God’s plans.”
  — Lecrae [11:09]

• Stresses that personal mission may be misunderstood, and that’s okay.

  “Everybody’s not going to understand your mission, but that’s why it’s your mission.”
  — Lecrae [11:25]

Navigating Judgment & Performing Faith in Public

[12:03]–[13:39]

• Both share stories of hurt from the Christian community.
• Lecrae encourages courage for those scrutinized in the public eye:

  “If you live for people’s acceptance, you’ll die from their rejection.”
  — Lecrae [14:48]

• Advocates for focusing on growth rather than appeasing critics.

Engaging with Culture, Not Culture Wars

[17:17]–[18:25]

• Lecrae warns against Christians being pulled into polarized culture wars:

  “You can never choose the empire over the kingdom... When we base our hope on things outside of the Lord, man, we standing on sand, that’s gonna sink.”
  — Lecrae [17:31]

• Reframes blame for societal hurt:

  “Don’t blame God for people hurts. God didn’t do that to you. Them broken people did. And He’s the only one that’s keeping you together in the midst of the pain.”
  — Lecrae [18:02]

Distinguishing Loving God From Fearing God

[18:43]–[19:29]

• Crystal notes many people claim to love God but lack reverence (“fear”).
• She shares:

  “It’s not to be scared of him, but to just be so in awe that you don’t want to let him down.”
  — Crystal Renee Hayslett [19:13]

Coping with the Digital Age / Media Overload

[19:29]–[20:18]

• Crystal describes stepping back from Instagram to preserve peace and productivity.
• Emphasizes intentional consumption, especially during spiritual practices like fasting.

Longevity and Relevance in Music and Ministry

[25:09]–[26:39]

• Lecrae’s advice for sustaining a 20+ year career:
  • Stay curious and keep learning.

  “If you’re not learning, you’re not growing. If you’re not growing, you’re dying.”
  — Lecrae [26:21]

• Importance of connecting with younger generations while keeping personal authenticity.

Healing from Trauma & Championing Therapy

[28:18]–[30:41]

• Lecrae is candid about his trauma and how therapy (in addition to faith) has been transformative.

  “There is a brain in your head, and there are people who understand the human brain... Therapy has really been the most transformative part of me.”
  — Lecrae [28:43]

• Speaks directly to resistance in communities of faith toward therapy:

  “Stop wearing your glasses. Stop taking your insulin... You got Jesus, right?” (sarcastic to prompt awareness)
  — Lecrae [28:48]

The Message Behind “Reconstruction”

[32:54]–[35:25]

• Lecrae’s 10th solo album is inspired by personal deconstruction and “church hurt,” encouraging others to start over and let God “reconstruct” their lives:

  “Sometimes we have built lives...on a solid foundation, especially if it’s the Lord, but some walls are cracked...We have to deconstruct that house to reconstruct the one we’re supposed to have.”
  — Lecrae [33:01] “God told me, like, ‘No, I need you to keep building. I need you to start over, reconstruct this house. I’m gonna do a work in it.’”
  — Lecrae [34:03] “Your story’s not over yet, so you can start over today.”
  — Lecrae [34:13]

Letting Go of Shame and Embracing Forgiveness

[35:25]–[36:05]

• Both Lecrae and Crystal encourage listeners not to let past mistakes or shame keep them from living out God’s plans:

  “If you’ve repented for it and asked for forgiveness, and you’re moving differently, God has forgiven you...Our shame is just the enemy’s way of keeping us from doing what God wants us to do.”
  — Crystal Renee Hayslett [35:43]

Prioritizing Family & Self-Care

[36:51]–[38:58]

• Lecrae shares his order of priorities:
  1. Relationship with God
  2. Personal mental and emotional health
  3. Marriage
  4. Children
     Then, career and external obligations.
• On family:

  “If I am not emotionally, spiritually healthy, I’m no good for her...My family only gonna get one me. The world can find another artist." — Lecrae [38:54]

Closing – Legacy, Encouragement, and Mutual Gratitude

[39:08]–[40:02]

• Lecrae encourages fans to stream “Reconstruction” and listen to his “Deep End” Podcast.
• He gives grateful recognition to Crystal:

  “A million little girls want to grow up to be actresses...But it’s difficult when you get there to leverage it and use it in a way that blesses people in a way that you’re doing. So thank you.”
  — Lecrae [39:43]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “You can’t cancel God’s plans.” — Lecrae [11:09]
• “If you live for people’s acceptance, you’ll die from their rejection.” — Lecrae [14:48]
• “Some people burn down bridges, but some people walk across them. I want to be that bridge from the kingdom to the culture.” — Lecrae [10:21]
• “Don’t blame God for people hurts. God didn’t do that to you. Them broken people did.” — Lecrae [18:02]
• “If you’re not learning, you’re not growing. If you’re not growing, you dying.” — Lecrae [26:21]
• “Therapy has really been the most transformative part of me...We are terrorizing our women with the unhealth that is living inside of us. And it’s not fair.” — Lecrae [29:31]
• “Your story’s not over yet, so you can start over today.” — Lecrae [34:13]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [06:52] Lecrae’s early life & coming to faith
• [09:18] Redefining the Christian artist label
• [11:09] On withstanding backlash: “You can’t cancel God’s plans”
• [12:03] Navigating public criticism & faith
• [14:48] Living for acceptance vs. true purpose
• [17:17] Warning against the “culture war”
• [18:43] Difference between loving and fearing God
• [25:09] Longevity in music & curiosity
• [28:18] The importance of therapy and mental health
• [32:54] The story behind “Reconstruction” album
• [36:51] Prioritizing family and self-care
• [39:43] Lecrae gives Crystal her flowers

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Final Thoughts

This episode is a testament to truth-telling, growth, and embracing imperfection on the journey of faith and purpose. Lecrae’s transparency about struggle, healing, and persistence offers inspiration to anyone wrestling with criticism or starting over—reminding us that God’s plans are bigger than the world’s judgments.

Transcript

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[Audiobook Narrator]

Chapter 18 Prince Lorian's voice gently wakes you from your dreams of him.

[Lecrae]

I can't face one more sunset without you by my side. Come with me and I vow your desires will be my North Star forevermore.

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[Chris Renee Hazel]

Calling all my sweeties to the forefront. I'm your host Chris Renee Hazel and this is the Keep It Positive Sweetie Show. I recently had the opportunity to interview Lecrae at a live event in Atlanta. We talked about faith and how he uses his influence for something greater. Let's get into that moment. How y' all doing, Atlanta? I got some sweeties in the house. I'm so excited to be here today. Thank you guys for coming out. The next person I'm calling to the stage. I've been on his podcast, the Deep End, but I'm so excited to get to interview him today. It's going to be a conversation. It's not even an interview. Ladies and gentlemen, please put your hands together and get real, real loud for my brother, Lecra.

[Lecrae]

What's up? What's up? What's up? What's up? What's up?

[Chris Renee Hazel]

How you doing?

[Lecrae]

Y' all look good. Y' all look good.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

They do.

[Lecrae]

Y' all look good, man. Look at y'.

[Matt Rogers]

All.

[Lecrae]

I love it. I love it. Thank you for having me.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Let's figure out how to sit here.

[Lecrae]

Yeah, I was. I was about to get down there and do the Electric Slide with him, but I, you know, I didn't want to be sweating before I got on stage.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Right. I love it. I love it. How you feeling?

[Lecrae]

I'm great, man. I'm blessed. I can't complain.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

I know that's right.

[Lecrae]

You know what I mean? Can't complain. I'm here sitting on your couch.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

It's my turn. Yeah, I got you in the hot seat now. But no, I'm really excited to talk to you today. You are from Houston, Texas.

[Lecrae]

H town. Any Texans in the building? No Texans. All right. It's all good. All right, there we go. Atlanta adopted me, though, so shout out to atmosphere.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

And our birthdays are nine days apart. October 9th and October 18th.

[Lecrae]

That's why we birthday twins.

[Matt Rogers]

Yes.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Yes. So on this inspiration celebration Sunday, I want to talk about how you have become Lecrae, the one that we all love, that we're big fans of. I remember when we talked on your podcast, you said that you didn't grow up in the church, so how did you find yourself growing closer to God at that young age, in your 20s?

[Lecrae]

Woo. Well, yeah, my mother was raised in church, and she was raised in a church that was a little too strict, so she wasn't allowed to wear lipstick. She couldn't go to sporting events. A lot of, you know, things like that. No pants, nothing. So for her, it scarred her, and she didn't want me to be scarred. So she said we not gonna do church because it messed me up. So I didn't grow up in church. I just grew up kind of Just me and mom doing our thing. I loved music, and she played music all the time. So I was constantly listening to music and being creative. And my grandmother, she was. You know, I would stay with her in the summers and she had church on a patio. And so in the summertime, you know, she would have me come to church on the patio with her from time to time. So I understood a little bit about who God was, but it didn't really click for me. And then when I got into school and just started going through some problems and wrestles, it was like Grandma's voice was in the back of my head saying, come on home, baby. Come on home. And that's when I had my spiritual transition, transformation. And then, man, I just let God take the wheel and the music did its own thing. And so here I am.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Here you are. Growing up, looking back at young Lecrae, did you think you would ever be a disciple of Christ?

[Matt Rogers]

No. No.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

What did you think back then you were gonna be?

[Lecrae]

I was in the streets. I was for the streets. You know what I mean? I was for the streets. I'm looking out in the crowd, making sure I didn't break hurt. Nobody feelings in this room. Just checking. I don't want no problems. That's the old me, okay? That's the old me. No, I really, you know, I was lost. I was just a wild individual, you know, I didn't know. You know, who knows where I would have been, you know, had it not been for God transforming me? Who knows where I would have been? I got three kids now. I probably would have about 12 more had it not been for Jesus. I'd have my own disciples. 12 disciples. But, yeah, man, God has been faithful, man. He's been good to me.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

He has. I love that. Now, through your music, you have effortlessly blended faith and culture. How has evolving in this space changed how you look at being a Christian artist? Because I've heard you talk on different interviews about how you label yourself. How has that evolved over the years?

[Lecrae]

Yeah, I look at the church as, like, the greenhouse. And the greenhouse is great. You can grow in there. It's safe. It's a bubble that's safe for you to grow. But I came from the jungle, and sometimes the greenhouse and the jungle don't communicate. Even though there's a lot of similarities. It's plants we both need to grow, you know? So I felt like I needed to be a bridge from the greenhouse to the jungle. And some people burn down bridges, but some people walk across them. And my goal was for people to be able to walk across. So I want to be able to have relationships with people, you know, in the hip hop industry and mainstream industry and then be that bridge so that if they may never step foot inside of a church, they may never step foot inside of, you know, any event that is as God oriented. So I wanted to kind of be that bridge from the world to the church, and that's kind of how I exist. So I don't do the labels. If you want to label me, go for it. I'm whatever you need me to be. But at the end of the day, I'm a bridge from the kingdom to the culture.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Yes, I know you've gotten a lot of backlash because of that. How have you been able to just stand 10 toes down on who you are when the. Even the Christians are the ones saying, you know, because I know that noise can get loud. How have you been able to just stay true to who you are?

[Lecrae]

Yeah. You know, sometimes you, You. You got to own what God has called you to be, you know what I'm saying? And. And people have tried to cancel me, but you can't cancel God's plans.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Can the church say amen? That's good.

[Lecrae]

You know what I mean? So. So for me, I'm going to be who I am and be that consistently. And you don't always. Everybody's not going to understand your mission, but that's why it's your mission.

[Matt Rogers]

Y.

[Lecrae]

You know what I mean? And, and I, and I understand that about myself in the end of the day. I like that. Okay, come on now.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Come on now.

[Lecrae]

Come on now. What are we talking about? But, you know, I'm following in the footsteps of the greatest leader in the world, and he was misunderstood, so to the point that they killed him, crucified him. You know what I mean? And so sometimes being who you're called to be means you're going to be misunderstood. But I don't want to waste time trying to explain myself to people who are hell bent on misunderstanding me.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Yes. So good. I remember I did your podcast and I was in a different space in my walk than I am today. And I remember calling you afterwards because it was so much in the comments and it didn't feel like the Christian community was a safe space for me. And I remember I text you and I was like, bro. I was like, these people are. Are crucifying me. And he was like, yeah, I forgot to tell you, my fans can be a little harsh, but I hope they're not living in glass Houses. And that still rings true because a lot of times we forget that we all fall short, you know? And I remember in that moment, I was just like, I don't want to talk about my walk anymore, because I knew I was still working on it. I knew where I was trying to be, but I wasn't there. And even in that small phrase that you said, it reminded me of, whoever is without sin cast the first stone. And when you said that, I was like, you're right. A lot of these people are. If they were living in glass houses.

[Lecrae]

Windows shattered, shattered, shatter.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Yeah, yeah. So it has helped me to walk in my truth. So I want to thank you for that.

[Lecrae]

Oh, no, absolutely, man. Listen, first of all, half of them wish they was in your position. You know what I'm saying? So cut it out.

[Matt Rogers]

Yeah.

[Lecrae]

You hear me? Cut it out. And then the other thing about it is, a lot of people don't understand how difficult it is to grow and to walk in the public eye. You know what I mean?

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Yes.

[Lecrae]

You got your mess going on behind the scenes, and nobody saw what you did and what you said and where you was at last night.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Come on.

[Lecrae]

But everybody know. But you're trying to do it in front of the world, and it's like, hey, man, cut me a break.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Yeah, it's crazy you said that. Because I thought about that. Just even how we live our walk, we talk about Christ out loud. And you, You've been very outspoken about your views on politics, the culture, the church, or like, the church community, everything. You name it. You've been very vocal about it to the point where it often puts a target on your back. Has there ever been a time or an instance where you said something and then you go home? Like, after seeing all the comments and the backlash, I just wish I never said anything.

[Lecrae]

Yesterday, tonight, tomorrow.

[Matt Rogers]

Right.

[Lecrae]

You know, the thing. The thing I've. I've begun to understand and to learn. So. So. So I'll tell you true story. I've been in some situations where, you know, I let people who don't really love me, who don't really know me, create too much pressure on me. And. And, you know, if you live for people's acceptance, you'll die from their rejection.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

So me on my street.

[Lecrae]

Yeah, yeah. So. So. So I let these voices that don't really know me, you know, influence my attitude, my perspective. So sometimes we do say things that we. We're like, man, I pro. I probably. I didn't think about that one. And, yes, we should be slow to speak and quick to listen. So there's. There's been plenty times where I've said something where it's kind of like, hey, maybe I should have. I should have slowed up. Like, one particular. I'll never forget this particular instance where, you know, this woman just really, you know, she was very political, and she just, you know, I was talking about unarmed black people being killed in the street, and she had her views, and she thought I was being too political and so on and so forth. And I think, you know, something inside of me said I need her to know the me that doesn't get seen on social media. I need her to see the version of me that, you know, Jesus still is working on. And so I may have used some choice words to address this woman via social media. And I thought to myself, I said, you know what? I didn't have to do that. And matter of fact, she didn't. She doesn't deserve, you know, she doesn't deserve that level of engagement and interaction. I'm wasting my time on this conversation. And so I've learned to just be quiet and let the people talk. That was a long answer to your question, but that was it.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

No, it's good. That's good. We talk about the current state of the world.

[Coca-Cola Announcer]

Yeah.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

And we are living in some scary times. It's like I'm reading my Bible and I'm seeing things play out in real time, you know? But I wanted to ask you because for me, in the past year, it feels like there has not been a conversation where Christ didn't come up. You know, it's like everybody is seeking the Lord. They're trying to find some type of hope or something to believe in, because everyone is just divided right now. But also, Christians have been turned away from the faith because of the church. What do you feel we can do as a Christian community to make Christianity a safe space again?

[Lecrae]

That's a good question. Okay, so number one, we can't get caught up in a culture war, y'.

[Matt Rogers]

All.

[Lecrae]

We can't. Like it's gonna be a culture war going on out there where it's right versus left or red versus blue or whatever it may be. But you can never choose the empire over the kingdom. Right? Don't. Because then the empire wins. That's how Satan operates. He don't care if the red or the blue win, as long as you are concerned with the empire and not the kingdom. And so when we get so caught up in everything going on, I'm not saying we don't fight. We don't vote. We don't stand up for our rights. But what I am saying is, when we base our hope on things outside of the Lord, man, we standing on sand, that's gonna sink. And I've been there to where I blamed God for all the chaos I saw instead of blaming the broken people around me. Don't blame God for people hurts. God didn't do that to you. Them broken people did. And he's the only one that's keeping you together in the midst of the pain. So that'll be my encouragement for folks going through.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

I love that because I know a lot of people are looking. That was great. A lot of people are looking for hope. Even me. I'm just the face of God during this time. And a lot. I hear a lot of people saying, I love the Lord. I'm like, but you don't fear Him. You know, it's a difference. Like, oh, you trying to preach, huh?

[Lecrae]

Chris Renee, preaching up here.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Stop, stop, stop.

[Lecrae]

Look at.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Let me.

[Matt Rogers]

Hold up.

[Lecrae]

Talk to me. You love him, but you don't fear him.

[Matt Rogers]

Huh?

[Lecrae]

Huh?

[Chris Renee Hazel]

You don't fear him, you know, And I think as I've gotten into my Bible, I hear his voice so loud, I can hear his anger in the thunder. Like, there's. There's been times where I'm like, I wake up and I'm like, you. You hear like, yeah, it's crazy. And it's not to be scared of him, but to just be so in awe that you don't want to let him down and you want to revere him in such a way. And you are so funny.

[Matt Rogers]

Keep going. Come on.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

But I think that that is the thing that people are missing. You know, they're like. They're searching for it. It's so much going on every time you turn the TV on. I'm even. I'm off of Instagram right now. And I look around the room, and everybody's on their phone, and it's like, you can watch in real time how, like, everybody's like, oh, my God, this happened. Or they're laughing. It's just, like, wandering aimlessly on Instagram. Like, so much time is going by, but also how you can be like, oh, look, this just happened. And something that is, like, very graphic, very disturbing. But we're so desensitized because it's, like, pushed in our face so much every single day. And this has been, like, the most free that I felt, just being disconnected and just living life and being productive and enjoying my peace, you know? Yeah.

[Matt Rogers]

Whoa.

[Coca-Cola Announcer]

What a vibe we've got, y'.

[Matt Rogers]

All.

[Coca-Cola Announcer]

As always, it's classic HBCU energy. Nonstop action. The band is rocking and the crowd lit. Chants echoing, drums beating, everybody showing that school pride. Moments like this, yeah, they call for an ice cold Coca Cola. Crisp and refreshing. That's a game changer right there. Mm. Yeah, that taste always hit the right note. Just like the band at halftime. Passionate fans, school colors everywhere, and an ice cold Coca Cola. That's a winning combo. No matter the place, no matter the moment. Everybody knows fan work is thirsty work. So grab a Coca Cola and keep that HBCU pride going.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Peace to the planet. Charlamagne Tha God here now. You know, the end of the year is when, like a lot of business owners, I really lock in. All right, this is the time to set the foundation for next year. You got new ideas, new product drops, new goals. And when I'm building anything meaningful, I need the right tools. That's why I always tell folks, especially black entrepreneurs and small black owned businesses, shopify is the move, okay? We use it at the Black Effect Podcast network, and I've seen firsthand how it helps creators and business owners grow with confidence. Entrepreneurship is very important to me, okay? There's nothing wrong with working for people. There's nothing wrong with partnering people. But you should strive to own your own as well. And Shopify can help others grow into entrepreneurs. It's like having a whole team behind you. Your chief of staff, your personal assistant, your co founder, all in one platform.

[Matt Rogers]

You.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Whether you're running a side hustle or a full storefront selling locally or worldwide, Shopify takes all the guesswork out. Shopify brings everything into one place. You can sell on your website, on social media, and even in the real world. Like some of our partners at our Black Effect Festival coming up in April, wherever your people are, Shopify makes sure your business can meet them where they're at. Plus, you got Shopify Sidekick and their AI tools. Total game changers. I love how it's like having an assistant giving you insights, content, ideas, edits. Shopify's got your next move covered.

[Matt Rogers]

Social media.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

So let me ask you this. If you're ready to take the next step in your life, whether it's merch, products or anything in between, get on shopify.com BEN. That's shopify.com BEN and make it happen. It is time to stop putting off your future and start your new role as your own boss today.

[IBM AI Representative]

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[Matt Rogers]

Matt Rogers from Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang. This is Bowen Yang from Lost Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang. Hey Bowen, it's gift season. Ugh. Stressing me out. Why are all the people I love.

[Public Investing Announcer]

So hard to shop for like me?

[Matt Rogers]

Exactly, honey.

[Lecrae]

I'm easy.

[Matt Rogers]

But you're right, holiday gifting is stressful. And all the gift guides out there are boring and uninspired. Wait, what about the guide we made in partnership with Marshalls where premium gifts mean incredible value? It's Giving Gifts, a series of guides filled with premium gifts at great value for everyone on your list. Yeah, Cause if I see one more for the dad who likes golf list, I'm out. Right? How about something for the people who actually surprise you with categories like best gifts for the mom whose idea of a sensible walking shoe is a stiletto. Psst. She wants a pair of stilettos Or Best gifts for me that were so thoughtful I really shouldn't have dying to see what those are. And you won't believe their prices. Just wait till you see what else is in there. It's basically a one stop shop for everyone. You know, I started Bookmarking half the list for myself, Honestly, this is the guy for the 2025 holiday gifting season. Check out the guide on marshalls.com it's giving gifts gift. The good stuff at Marshalls.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

So you are known for your music. You did your first studio album in 2004. Two decades. Like, you've been in the game for a minute.

[Lecrae]

I was a kid.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

You was a kid, but you is grown now. How did you navigate what can be called a niche lane? You know, because you people, a lot of people are here. 2004, that's a long time ago.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

To still be here and still relevant, which we're going to talk about in a second.

[Lecrae]

But, yeah, you know, I think part of it is. Part of it is being curious. You know, I never. My mother is 70 years old and she's. Her TikTok is more popping than mine is, you know, because she's still curious, she's still engaged. I think a lot of times we get older and we get stuck, we just say, I'm done. I don't have to think about nothing else no more. I'm just going to live here. But the world just is going to keep on going. And I'm not saying you got to keep up with every trend and so on and so forth, but I do think it's important to always stay learning. If you're not learning, you're not growing. If you're not growing, you dying.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

You know what I mean?

[Lecrae]

Yeah. So for me, it's just, I just want to learn. And part of learning is staying connected to the culture, listening to younger artists, listening to some stuff and saying, that ain't for me, but God bless you. And then just doing what I do, you know, in the midst of it.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Was there ever a moment where you're like, okay, I got it, because you get that shiny new thing, and it's like, okay, what's next? Or, wow, like, I sacrificed so much to get this. Was it worth it? How did you feel in that moment? And did you have a premonition like that?

[Lecrae]

Yeah, I think when you are so. I think most successful people, you probably attest to this because you're very successful in yourself. Most successful people are fighting through some trauma, some brokenness.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Yeah.

[Lecrae]

Because there's something in you that is trying to prove or validate some lies that have been told to you or fight through some lies that have been told to you, some insecurities, and that's what makes us push so, so, so hard. Even if you look at David in the Bible. Like, he was so amazing, but he was still the son of Jesse who was the last one to be picked to be king. And so he just. You see that trauma coming out in his lifetime. And. And so for me, you know, it took me a while to see that. These shiny statues don't validate me. I was already somebody before I got them.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Yes.

[Lecrae]

You know what I mean? I was fearfully and wonderfully made. And these are the evidence of how gracious and good God is and what he's done to me. But these. These are not what defines me. And it took me a while to get there, so. So when you first get them, they do become an extension of your worth and value. And like, yeah, I'm somebody now, but as you grow, you learn. Like this. Don't make me. I make this.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

No, absolutely. And you speak about. We all are fighting through trauma, you know, and as a black man in the light, how have you been able to deal and navigate your own trauma?

[Lecrae]

Therapy.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Come on. Come on, man of God. Talk about it. Because a lot of people. I got Jesus. I don't need therapy. Yes, you do. Let's talk about it.

[Lecrae]

Let me tell you something, man. I'm be honest. All the folks out there who say, I don't need therapy, I got Jesus. Stop wearing your glasses. Stop taking your heart medicine. Stop taking your insulin for your diabetes. Stop exercising. You don't need it. You got Jesus, right? Yeah. So, like, stop wearing deodorant. You got Jesus. You hear what I'm saying? It's ridiculous. There is a brain in your head, and there are people who understand the human brain. If you really dig deep, you can find Christian therapists who understand your human head and your spiritual heart.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Yes.

[Lecrae]

And do a unique work. And my therapist, we pray and then we get to work. You know what I'm saying? So therapy has really been the most transformative part of me because it allowed me, like, my therapist had me one time to just, hey, let's just think about the little boy that was being abused, that was being neglected, and let's pray for that little boy. That was you. And that was a powerful thing. Like, I know that boy is here now, but it was a powerful thing to just go back and. And to wrestle with that. Because a lot of us, especially as black men, we think, man, we just gotta power through it. You know what I'm saying? I'm just gonna power through it. I'll be good, and I don't need nothing. And we just bottling up all of this trauma and we're unhealthy men, and we are terrorizing our women with the unhealth that is living inside of us. And it's not fair to the women. You know what I'm saying? And women are having to settle for unhealthy men, which is ridiculous. And that's why so many single women now, because they ain't got time for your unhealthy fool. So get healthy.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Come on.

[Lecrae]

You know what I'm saying?

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Now you preaching.

[Lecrae]

Hey, listen, I got a daughter.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Come on.

[Lecrae]

I got time for this.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

That's real. That's real. You recently released your 10th solo album, number 10, Reconstruction. Y' all put your hands together. Have y' all heard it? Have you downloaded it?

[Lecrae]

I appreciate all of y'.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

All.

[Lecrae]

I love all of y'. All.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Yeah, download it right now if you don't have.

[Lecrae]

Appreciate y'. All. And come see me at the Tabernacle November 23rd. Come Holl at me.

[Matt Rogers]

Hey.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

It is Fire. It is my new gym workout album. It gets me through the StairMaster. And that's the hardest part. I've been like. But when I. I was telling you backstage, I had started a fast earlier this month, and I was like, oh, Lecrae has a new album out. Because even with the music that I listen to, I'm very, very intentional about what I take in, especially when I'm fasting, because a lot of us said it before. We don't realize that music is a portal, and it incites feelings whether we realize it or not.

[Lecrae]

So she preaching. Just preach, Crystal. Let me chill out. What else you want to say? We listening.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

So I was driving down the road, and it was the song Bless you, Lord. And this. Literally, I play it over and over and over again. But it was a part where you said, I've done some things that I cannot stomach. And I immediately. I used, like, a gut punch, and I just immediately started crying. And it was a realization that a lot of times when we're living out of the will of God, we're doing things and not even realizing that it's detestable to him, you know? And he's very disappointed and just thinking about his grace. And even, like, when you change your life, you look back like, I cannot believe I was doing what you know, and just the grace of God. It hit me, and I was just so grateful. But if it hadn't been any other day, I would just been bopping. But that day, I was like. I was like, what did he say? And so I kept listening to it, but that Whole album, it feels like a public service announcement. I feel like you're very deliberate, you're intentional, and you're letting us know we need to shake some things up. You over here turning the tables over in a tabernacle. Let's talk about the inspiration behind reconstruction.

[Lecrae]

Yeah. Reconstruction is. It's an album about understanding that sometimes we have built lives, whether that is spiritually, relationally, financially. We have built our lives, most of us, on a solid foundation, especially if it's the Lord.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

But we hoping that foundation gonna last.

[Lecrae]

Hey, come on now. Come on now. You've been listening. I like it. But. But the foundation is solid. But we. But some walls are cracked and some. Some. Some mold is in the ceiling, and. And there's some asbestos in our house. And so, you know, we have to deconstruct that house to reconstruct the one that we're supposed to have. So my personal story is that, you know, I was so church hurt that I said, I'm done with God. I'm out. Because I just. So that I was so hurt, and because I didn't grow up in church, I said, well, I'm just gonna go back to doing what I was doing, you know, I'm back. I'm gonna go back to the streets, you know? And I felt like Peter, when Jesus told him, he said, you know, you're going to deny me three times, Peter. Like, no, I'll never do that. But then he denied him. And when he denied him, Jesus looked at him after the rooster crowed, and I was thinking, Jesus looked at him and said, I told you you was going to deny me. But he wasn't saying, I told you so. He was saying, I knew you was going to do that, and I still chose you. I still chose you. And that was the beginning of my reconstruction, right? It was like God told me, like, no, I need you to keep building. I need you to start over, reconstruct this house. I'm gonna do a work in it, and we gonna still use you. You not done your story. Not over yet, so you can start over today. So this album was me expressing to people the process that I had gotten to to get past the guilt and the shame and to still be useful in the kingdom and to collaborate with people to make music so that even the people I'm collaborating with, so that they understand that. TI Killer Mike, come on, we gonna do a song together. We're gonna talk about the grief that we've gone through, losing family members, losing friends, and we're gonna allow that to be a healing moment for us all so we can be reconstructed. And that's why I did the album. I just want people to know their story's not over. We can still keep going.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

That is so good. That's something that I feel like a lot of us as Christians, we carry the shame. And God ain't even thinking about that no more. He has forgiven and forgotten about that, and we're still carrying it. And it's not allowing him to use this the way that he wants us to be used. I know that's something I struggled with as well. And I want anybody to know in the audience if that's something you're struggling with, if you've repented for it and asked for forgiveness, and you're moving differently. God has forgiven you for that. So stop holding back on what God has for you. Because a lot of times our shame is just the enemy's way of keeping us from doing what God wants us to do. Y', all, he is speaking.

[Lecrae]

Nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah. The woman is a successful actress. Podcast, you do not have to be up here preaching at these folks like this. You know what I'm saying? You could have just been quiet on your show, chilling, letting all them fall in love with your character and getting mad at everybody who opposed you. But you out of character right now, preaching to folks. We appreciate it.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Listen, I'm Moses right now. This is him speaking. I was like, just speak through me, Lord, Whatever you got for the people. I just do whatever he prompts me to do. Yes, let him use you. But no, that's real. You're an artist, you're a songwriter, an author, in addition to being a husband and a father.

[Lecrae]

That's right.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

How do you handle it all?

[Lecrae]

Oh, you got to prioritize. Let me tell you what I do. I prioritize. I walk in the house, my kids be like, daddy, get out my way. I'm trying to holler at your mama. You move. Because, listen, she's the priority for me. Yeah, she's the priority. All they want is for us to stay together anyway, so they ain't mad that they come second fiddle to their mama, you know what I'm saying? So I prioritize her, you know, and make sure that she doesn't feel like the world is crumbling around her. She feels supported, you know what I mean? And. And, you know, not to get on my high horse, but, fellas, that's what leadership is. You. You. Leadership is not being a tyrant. It's not telling somebody what to do. Leadership is leading in service, leading in humility, leading and asking questions. You know what I'm saying? Lead in those areas, like lead in apologizing, because she ain't never gonna do it anyway. So, you know, but. But that. That's my number one priority. But then here's the. Here's the kicker. And this confuses a lot of people. I say, but before her. Here, just stay with me. Before her is me. Stay with me.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

We're with you.

[Lecrae]

Stay with me. Before her is me. Because if I am not emotionally, spiritually healthy, I'm no good for her. Yes, I'm no good for her. So I have to take care of my relationship with the Lord. I got to take care of my mental health, my emotional health so that I can be there for her and prioritize her and prioritize my kids. Now, after me and the Lord and me and my wife and me and my kids, then I give the rest of the world some energy. Y' all can get some energy. Because my family only gonna get one me. The world can find another artist, Right?

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Okay. I love that. In closing, I want to ask you, is there anything that you want to let us know you have coming up where we can follow you? Keep up with you. All the things.

[Lecrae]

Go stream my album, Go listen to it two more times, ten more times. Thank you. Keep up with me on the Deep end podcast. I might be back on social media next week. We'll see what happens. And. And make sure you give flowers to this woman.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Thank you.

[Lecrae]

Because she don't have to do this. Sincerely, this is your platform and you invited me up here, but I got to give you your flowers. Like, I love the way you're using your platform. I love the way you're using your voice. A million little girls want to grow up to be actresses, but, but, but, but it's difficult when you get there to leverage it and use it in a way that blesses people in a way that you're doing. So thank you and thank you for having me.

[Chris Renee Hazel]

Thank you so much for everyone who came out. Thank you so much. We love you. In the meantime, in between time, y' all know what to do. Yes. I love you guys so much.

[Matt Rogers]

Whoo.

[Coca-Cola Announcer]

What a vibe we've got, y'.

[Audiobook Narrator]

All.

[Coca-Cola Announcer]

As always, it's classic HBCU energy. Non stop action. The band is rocking and the crowd lit. Chants, echoing, drums beating, everybody showing that school pride. Moments like this. Yeah. They call for an ice cold Coca Cola, crisp and refreshing. That's a game changer. Right there. Mm, yeah, that taste always hit the right note, just like the band at halftime. Passionate fans, school colors everywhere, and an ice cold Coca Cola. That's a winning combo. No matter the place, no matter the moment. Everybody knows fan work is thirsty work. So grab a Coca Cola and keep that HBCU pride going.

[Audiobook Narrator]

Season two of Unrivaled Basketball is here and the talent is unreal.

[Pets Best Insurance Announcer]

Paige Beckers, Nafeeza Collier, Kelsey Plumb, Brianna Stewart and more are back to redefine the game.

[Audiobook Narrator]

Unrivaled basketball season two sponsored by Samsung.

[Pets Best Insurance Announcer]

Galaxy, tips off January 5th on TNT, TruTV and HBO.

[Public Investing Announcer]

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[Audiobook Narrator]

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[Charlamagne Tha God]

This is Julian Edelman from Dudes on Dudes with Gronk and Jewels Sunday mornings I've got my game day ritual, coffee.

[Lecrae]

Lucky socks and now new morning Uncrustable sandwiches. It's all about that 12 gram protein boost with the new uncrustables Bright Eyed Berry or Up and apple flavors. Bright Eye Berries got a feisty receiver energy up an apple. Your classic Do it all tight end, soft, pillowy, packed with protein and easy enough for Gronk to grab from the freezer. Whether you're on the couch, driving to the tailgate or heading to the locker room, New Morning Uncrustable Sandwiches are the MVP of snacks. Your new Sunday kickoff ritual starts here with New Morning Uncrustable sandwiches packed with 12 grams of protein.