Ep 340 | She Fought for Her Son's Freedom and Won | Guest: Lyn Ulbricht

Summary

Kibbe on Liberty: Celebrating Freedom and Advocating for Sentencing Reform

Episode: Ep 340 | She Fought for Her Son's Freedom and Won
Guest: Lynn Ulbricht
Release Date: July 9, 2025

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Introduction: A Moment of Celebration

In Episode 340 of Kibbe on Liberty, host Matt Kibbe welcomes listeners from the vibrant setting of Porkfest, a renowned festival known for its live music and spirited gatherings. The episode is a celebratory reunion with Lynn Ulbricht, the mother of Ross Ulbricht, famously known as the creator of the Silk Road marketplace. After 11 and a half years of relentless advocacy, Lynn shares the joyous news of her son's release, marking a significant victory in her fight against what she describes as an unjust legal system.

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The Journey to Freedom

Lynn Ulbricht recounts the emotional and arduous journey to secure her son's freedom. Reflecting on the moment of Ross's release, she shares:

“It was very surreal at first. It was almost hard to believe, honestly. I really didn't expect a full pardon.”
— Lynn Ulbricht [01:30]

She emphasizes the profound sadness and uncertainty she endured during Ross's incarceration, highlighting the personal toll on her family. The transformation from despair to elation underscores the significance of their victory, not just for their family but as a beacon of hope for others facing similar battles.

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Ross's Impact and Freedom Fest Speech

A pivotal moment in the episode centers around Ross Ulbricht's impactful speech at Freedom Fest. Matt Kibbe urges listeners to watch Ross's heartfelt address, which delves into the dehumanizing aspects of the prison industrial complex. Lynn describes his performance:

“It's very heartfelt. It's very authentic. You know, he's breaking down a couple times and told some pretty horrific stuff.”
— Lynn Ulbricht [05:14]

Ross's ability to connect emotionally with the audience, despite his limited public speaking experience, was a testament to his resilience and the depth of their advocacy efforts. His speech not only humanizes those incarcerated but also challenges existing sentencing paradigms.

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Reviving the Movement for Sentencing Reform

Beyond Ross's release, Lynn Ulbricht is spearheading a new advocacy group aimed at combating unconstitutional sentencing practices. She elaborates on the motivations behind founding Mothers Against Cruel Sentencing:

“We have to make a noise because when you make a noise, people start paying attention. It's like someone said to me just today, she goes, I didn't know about these sentences. Most people don't.”
— Lynn Ulbricht [14:44]

The organization focuses on highlighting the plight of non-violent drug offenders, who constitute over 60% of the prison population. By emphasizing personal stories over statistics, Lynn aims to shift public perception and influence legislative change.

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Strategies for Advocacy and Change

Lynn outlines her strategic approach to advocacy, which includes leveraging personal narratives and building coalitions:

“We wanted to have mothers and others making a one-minute video about their case, about their kid or their husband or their wife or whatever. It's mainly men and just saying, and this is their sentence and what it's done to their families.”
— Lynn Ulbricht [16:43]

Matt Kibbe complements her efforts by introducing the concept of restorative justice, advocating for community-driven solutions to replace the punitive aspects of the current prison system. He references a documentary produced by his organization, highlighting successful models like Longmont, Colorado, where restorative practices significantly reduced recidivism rates.

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Unity Within the Libertarian Movement

A notable theme in the conversation is the importance of unity among libertarians to tackle broader societal issues. Both Matt and Lynn express frustration over internal conflicts within the movement, emphasizing the need to set aside differences to address common adversaries:

“Especially if we're unified. I'm really tired of all the fighting amongst libertarians and crypto people, and we're fighting each other and we've got a bigger enemy.”
— Lynn Ulbricht [24:09]

This solidarity is portrayed as essential for driving meaningful change, with the Ross Ulbricht case serving as a unifying point that brings diverse factions together.

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Conclusion: A Call to Action

As the episode draws to a close, Lynn urges listeners to support her newly established advocacy group:

“Go to the website and... We do have a Twitter, very small, very beginning stages, Twitter X Count... We have MothersAgainstCruelSentencing.org.”
— Lynn Ulbricht [22:54]

Matt reinforces the significance of their collective efforts, highlighting that Ross's case is emblematic of larger issues surrounding privacy, cryptocurrency, and government overreach.

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Final Thoughts

Episode 340 of Kibbe on Liberty serves as both a heartfelt celebration and a rallying cry for continued advocacy against unjust sentencing practices. Through Lynn Ulbricht's inspiring journey and the renewed focus on legislative reform, the episode encapsulates the enduring spirit of resilience and the critical need for unity within the libertarian community.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• “It was very surreal at first. It was almost hard to believe, honestly. I really didn't expect a full pardon.”
  — Lynn Ulbricht [01:30]
• “We have to make a noise because when you make a noise, people start paying attention. It's like someone said to me just today, she goes, I didn't know about these sentences. Most people don't.”
  — Lynn Ulbricht [14:44]
• “Especially if we're unified. I'm really tired of all the fighting amongst libertarians and crypto people, and we're fighting each other and we've got a bigger enemy.”
  — Lynn Ulbricht [24:09]

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For listeners eager to support ongoing efforts for justice reform, visit MothersAgainstCruelSentencing.org and follow their initiatives on Twitter.

Transcript

[Matt Kibbe]

Welcome to Kibbe on Liberty. I'm live at Porkfest. There's wind, there's club parties going on near us. We have a live audience and we're talking to my dear friend Lynn Ulbricht. Her son Ross is free and we're going to celebrate. Check it. Welcome to Kibby on Liberty. Lynn. Hey.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Hey.

[Matt Kibbe]

How's it going? I feel like I can't remember last time we. But it was like year and a half, two years ago maybe, on the show. And I feel like something's changed, but I can't put my finger on it.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, it's just this thing. I think my son is out of prison. Amazing. Miracle. Miracle.

[Matt Kibbe]

This is going to be an unanswerable question, but how does it. How does it. You spent 12 years.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Close.

[Matt Kibbe]

Eleven and a half.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

Fighting for your son's freedom.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

How does it feel now?

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Well, it was very surreal at first. It was almost hard to believe, honestly. I really didn't expect a full pardon. We didn't know what to expect, really. I did trust that Trump would do it because he pledged twice and he told me personally he would. But it was still very surreal, you know, and at times it still is, but it feels great. I honestly, and I think this is true of everyone who has a loved one in prison. I just had this. I was happy at times. I had fun, sure, and all of that, but I always had this sadness. It was always the sadness, you know? And then, you know, if I really thought about it, I was very sad. And, you know, my son, who I love so much, was just rotting. I mean, he made the best of it, but still he was confined in this cage. And I never knew. I didn't know. I just didn't know how it all, you know, work out. And I just knew that I had to do everything in my power to get him out of this situation. And I was willing to do it till I died, you know, and. Because I just couldn't. So I don't have that sadness anymore. And it was like a day or two after it happened, it suddenly I was in a. Just a parking lot, walking in the parking lot in Tucson, and I was just like. Felt so happy, and I hadn't felt that happy in so long. It was like this sadness went away, you know, it was really. It's really. It's people who have loved ones in prison, they're doing time, too.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah. Yeah. And Ross talked about that, and I want to get into his Freedom Fest speech.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

But I was reminiscing you at Freedom Fest about the first time you hotboxed me and you cornered me at the Renaissance weekend. And that must have been. I don't know, that would have been 10 years ago, maybe 20.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Well, he just would have been arrested.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

So 2013.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

And you one of many people trying to get your attention.

[Matt Kibbe]

Well, I know. Like, I'm trying to remember how you did it, because, you know, back then, everybody had an idea that they wanted to pitch to me or a project or something like that. But you had. You were persuasive and persistent, and every time I would see you after that.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

You would follow up, which was. I'm like, oh, Matt's at Pork Fest.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

You know, and so that was a whole different environment, too.

[Matt Kibbe]

Once you saw me here. You knew I was gettable. I know, because he's like, okay, he's one of those guys.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yes, that's right.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah. But, like, you just kept going. And like you said, you had this darkness, this realization that you might not succeed, and it. You know, to most people, it would seem like an impossible project.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Oh, it did. Yeah. Absolutely.

[Matt Kibbe]

But you're a machine. I think we're gonna draft you to run for president or something. Yeah.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Do what?

[Matt Kibbe]

Draft you to run for president or something.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

I'd be a terrible government employee. I'd be bad. Very bad.

[Matt Kibbe]

That's why we like you. So you've started a new organization and. I don't know, it. It didn't sound to me like you. You discussed Ross's speech with him much before he gave it at Freedom Fest?

[Lynn Ulbricht]

No, he just said he was going to be focusing on the prison. I didn't realize how emotional. If anybody hasn't heard, I really recommend it. It's very heartfelt. It's very authentic. You know, he's breaking down a couple times and told some pretty horrific stuff. Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah. Horror stories.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

How many of you saw the speech that Ross gave at Freedom Fest? Just the guys that I took to Freedom Fest.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

I think it's pinned on his Twitter, and it's worth it.

[Matt Kibbe]

You have to watch it.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, it's really good.

[Matt Kibbe]

You have to watch it.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

And that's really. It's so him, too. Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

And on my team, we were just marveling at the presence that he had on stage for someone that surely didn't have much experience at public speaking.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

He strikes me as a very introverted guy, and it was just amazing. Amazing.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah. He leans introverted, but he likes people, you know, but, yeah, yeah, he's, you know. Yeah, it was amazing. Even the Bitcoin one, too. I thought he did great, you know.

[Matt Kibbe]

But I'm old enough to remember when there was a serious push by libertarians, Republicans and Democrats, particularly like the. The Massey Rand, pa, Mike Lee Republicans, the Liberty Republicans, working with progressive Democrats on prison reform, on criminal justice reform, on drug legalization, like, the whole mantra of that. And that momentum went away at some point. But it sounds like you and Ross want to light that fire again.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, because I met so many people in there who, you know, Ross has an extreme sentence. Yes. Double life plus 40 years, you know, crazy. And I think it actually helped us get Trump's attention because he said that sentence, you know, and so I think it actually helped, ironically, but met so many people who. The sentence just seems so. Their sentence seems so wrong. It was just so long. And people would write me about their kid or whatever, and I'd be like, geez, you know, somebody has to do something about this. And then I'm thinking, well, I guess I do. But I put it off for a couple of years because I just was too busy with Ross and everything. But now he's free, and I'm still thinking about those people because they're in there and the sentences are just. They're unconstitutional. In our Constitution, our Bill of Rights, the Eighth Amendment says no cruel or unusual punishment. And these sentences are cruel and they're unusual. If you go back before 1980 in the drug war, very unusual. And so by our traditions, they're extremely unusual. And there's a thing called the Sentencing Reform act that said a sentence should be sufficient but no longer than necessary. And these sentences are way past necessary. And Ross talked about that on his speech. There's people in there. We need to be protected from those people. It's just, yes, maybe someday they'll reform, but right now they can't be let out. But he said most people in prison are fine to get out. They shouldn't be in there.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah. That the unconstitutional elements of Ross's sentence are ultimately what persuaded Thomas Massie to look at it seriously.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Also, the Eighth Amendment.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Thomas was.

[Matt Kibbe]

I think that was his gateway to taking a look at the other elements of the case. And I think he said that publicly. He certainly told me.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, yeah, he did. He said it at Freedom Fest. Actually. I got up and asked a question to him and Mike Lee and somebody, I can't remember, and he brought up the Eighth Amendment. And then he. He actually asked me, because he was going to be talking to someone influential, said, what point should I make? I said, make Your point? The Eighth Amendment. He goes, I'll do it. And so that's what he did. So we kind of collaborated, but. Yeah, but he had. He was the one that saw it. Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

Who was the first legislator to come out and say what they've done to Ross is wrong?

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Well, privately, I would say it was Rand, because he submitted Ross and two other people for clemency the first time around with Trump. And the two other people got it, and he didn't, and he actually questioned that. And he also called him and talked to him about it. He wrote him a memo saying the same deep state that's after you is after us. And that was final hours. And we were all just pleased, you know, but he didn't. And he later told me Bill Barr was fighting it.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

And making it very hard for Trump to do so.

[Matt Kibbe]

I have this theory that the neocons don't like crypto technology because they lose control.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

It's kind of hard to print endless currency for endless wars and hoard all that power if people are doing it for themselves.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah. But, Thomas, as to your question, he was. Massey was more public, and he was wonderful, you know, and Kennedy had him on her show several times, and, you know, just. He was great. He really did. And he tells us. It's a funny story. So he was going to endorse Trump, and he decided towards the end, and Trump told him. Massey told me that later. He told him, in your endorsement, put that kid in who got like, a hundred years in libertarians, like, put him in your endorsement. And he did. I said, thank you so much. He goes, no, he told me to do.

[Matt Kibbe]

That's a very Trump, like.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Right. So him.

[Matt Kibbe]

Super Trumpy.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

So we're here at Pork Fest, obviously, and we got club music going on over there, and we're having cocktails, and we're with family. Again, my impression, correct me if I'm wrong, but I feel like the Free Ross movement was kind of born here.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, absolutely. You know, I first started, I went to Austin, where they were having south by Southwest and a bitcoin conference, piggybacking on that. And I was just going around putting up flyers, begging people to talk to me and crashing little seminars so I could talk to the speaker and stuff like that. And. But there was a. I got to know some of the people there, and one of them, Harlan Dietrich, called me later and said, hey, I'm going up to this festival in New Hampshire. I'm making T shirts for Ross. We sell them. I said, great. I'LL hand out flyers. And he said, well, you should speak. And I'm like, what? You speak? And he's like, yeah, you really should. I know the organizers, blah, blah, blah. Well, they said, sorry, we're full. We can't do it. And then I'm like, oh, phew, thank you. I don't have to do it. Good. But then, like, the next day, they're like, wait, whoa, whoa. We're going to have you speak at the Pavilion on Saturday night. And I'm like, oh, my God. Okay, I'll do it. And. But Nicolaspie was in the audience, and he put me on Reason TV after that, and it kind of. That gave me more of a voice, and it just kind of grew. But it was Pork Fest who gave me the chance. It was porkfest that had the faith to, you know, give me a voice for Ross.

[Matt Kibbe]

Was that your first public speech?

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Pretty much. I mean, I'd done small things in the years of groups and things, but I worked hard on that speech. I still think it's a good speech.

[Matt Kibbe]

Well, it's a pretty forgiving group of people.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, it's great.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah, it's talking to families, so.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, totally. Yeah, it was good.

[Matt Kibbe]

Is this speech, I assume it's still online. We gotta watch it. We gotta give. Give. I'll give you my critical assessment of your. Of your first book.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

I brought up the Constitution a lot. I was, you know, some of the things that they were doing. And I'm like, what the hell? You know?

[Matt Kibbe]

So fast forward to. We talked a little bit about Ross's speech and everybody needs to watch this. A powerful performance, but also a powerful message that I think has been lost since the steam behind prison reform has been lost and sentencing reform and all of these victimless crimes that are punished through the prison industrial complex. And he made that emotional case for just the dehumanizing nature of what they're doing to people. But you should be on a beach somewhere. But you're at Pork Fest.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Well, this is vacation for me.

[Matt Kibbe]

This is family. But you're at Freedom Fest, and I'm sure you have a very full schedule of doing stuff. And you decided instead of taking a vacation, you're going to start a new advocacy group. Tell me.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

I think we can do both, right? A little bit of both.

[Matt Kibbe]

I hope so. I hope so. I am, in fact, drinking a beer while I'm working.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

So you can do both, but, well, again, I can't forget those people. And I had already thought about it and I'm like, you know, maybe I can use what I've gained with the Ross thing. I've gained connections, I've gained some notoriety, you know, some experience. And I've certainly done more speeches than I had when I started. And it would be a waste. It'd be kind of a waste to just, well, I'm done. Follow my bliss, whatever that is, you know, and, and I feel like if I can use it to help them, that would be very fulfilling for. It was great. It'd be, you know, I want to see some of them walk out of those cages, somehow make those sentences shorter. Yeah, I don't know, you know, I'm not sure yet how it's all going to work. I'm going to get advice, I'm going to. I've talked to people, I've talked to the pardon czar and she loves the idea, you know, she's, you know, Alice Johnson, and I've actually was connected to the pardon attorney Ed Martin a bit, you know, and so just keep trying, just what I did with Ross, you know, keep trying to get people who can influence things and also get the word out. So if you guys could help me, it's like, you know, just, you know, we have a Twitter, we have a website just starting. We're just starting. I wanted to take advantage of the conferences, so it quickly got started. MothersAgainstCruelcentencing.org we're calling it Max. And just if you could spread the word, we have a Twitter, very small, very beginning stages, Twitter X Count. And just I want to make a noise because when you make a noise, people start paying attention. It's like someone said to me just today, she goes, I didn't know about these sentences. Most people don't. They think we have, you know, fair sentencing or whatever. And it's like, and I think it might be hard because there's a lot of, like you're saying, pushback about, you know, crime and people need to be, you know, people being let out that commit crimes and all of that. But there's so many people. Over 60% of the prisons are non violent drug offenders, you know.

[Matt Kibbe]

Thank you for joining me today on Kibbe on Liberty and for being part of our fiercely independent audience. Every week, my organization, Free the People, partners with BlazeTV to bring you this show. My guests bring smart perspectives on everything from current events to timeless philosophical debate. If you like what you hear, go to freethepeople.org kol and support Kibbe on Liberty so we can continue to produce these honest conversations with interesting people. Now let's get back to it. It's a business. And that's part of.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Matt's a big opponent.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah, yeah. There's a prison industrial complex that is. That is both politicians and private businesses.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

A lot of lobbyists.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah. And they feed off of the system. And you may not know yet, but one strategy that you just mentioned, and we talked about it a little bit at Freedom Fest is just working, coming up with a list and telling the stories of the most abusive, outrageous sentences and pitching those to the administration. Doing that research would be helpful.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yes. We wanted to have mothers and others making a one minute video about their case, about their kid or their husband or their wife or whatever. It's mainly men and just saying, and this is their sentence and what it's done to their families. Because I feel like stories are going to have much more impact than statistics. And the statistics are terrible. But there's statistics, you know, but when you hear somebody from the heart talking about how it's destroyed their family or their kids or even communities, I mean, you know, I think that's what we're gonna do too. Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

And that is your strategy. That was your strategy. You told Ross's story and people got to know him as a human.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, exactly. You gotta humanize it because people in prison now are not. Nobody thinks about them. It's like Ross said, they're the least among us and how we treat. The least among us says who we are and they're the least among us. Nobody cares. Nobody thinks about them. And my whole thing was, I'm not going to let Ross be forgotten. I've got a big mouth and I'm going to use it. But you know, many people don't have that and so we want to help them.

[Matt Kibbe]

Are you thinking about potential legislative campaigns as well?

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Well, I don't. Well, we're a non profit, so if you want to save on your taxes, you know, you can give it to us and help us perpetuate this. But educational campaigns. Yeah, and, and, yeah, and pressure, you know, political pressure. We, we're not allowed to lobby, but we. Maybe we could figure out some way, I don't know, to do it through some other way.

[Matt Kibbe]

You know, I want to, I want to pitch you sometime on restorative justice because we did a documentary, I think four years ago now called how to Love youe A Restorative Justice Story about Longmont, Colorado. And it is, I view it as a radically libertarian solution to the prison industrial complex. And it diverts quite often. It's a first time Offender who made a dumb mistake, it diverts them from going into the judicial process.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Oh, that's great.

[Matt Kibbe]

And you know, because once you get in, like I learned this from my restorative justice friends, once you get into the system and you're in court, your job is to deny that you did anything wrong. Yeah, deny, deny, deny.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

That's right.

[Matt Kibbe]

And what restorative justice does is it first it asks the permission of the victim. Are you willing to go through this process with the person that committed this crime against you? So it forces the person that did the wrong to accept and acknowledge and take responsibility for what they did. And as a libertarian, the thing that has always bugged me most about the criminal justice system is they talk about paying your debt to society as if society was harmed. There's a, I'm going to upset my restorative justice friends, but there's a word they use for the person that did the wrong and the victim that are different words. But it's still that, like if there's a point to enforcing the laws, it's to make the victim whole. And what restorative justice does is it, you know, it's never about money. It's not financial restitution, because it's most likely the person that committed the wrong doesn't have the means to, to make them whole. But it's mostly about taking responsibility. And the power of that in Longmont, Colorado, is the recidivism went from whatever it is, 90 plus percent the cycle to almost zero.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Wow.

[Matt Kibbe]

So it's a solution, but it's a bottom up solution. It's the community actually taking the justice system back from people. So that might be something to talk about. Not so much to rescue people that are already caught up in the system, but to prevent the next generation from feeding the beast.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Right. Because that's a perfect way of putting it. It's feeding their inventory essentially because kids of the people that are in there are likely to statistically likely to go right into prison.

[Matt Kibbe]

But to call it like the coalition for these types of efforts that you're talking about is not dissimilar than the coalition you built for Ross.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Right. Well, that's what I know how to do. Right.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Just do what I did with him. But I'm totally open to ideas and I want to go to different criminal justice people I know and others and say, what do you think? What should we do to get people out, you know, the cages that they're in, maybe shorten the time or somehow, I don't know about Changing the law. I think that's my. I don't know. I don't know.

[Matt Kibbe]

Well, if you change the story, the laws will fix themselves in a certain way. If you're changing the culture, if you're raising awareness for the types of inhumane sentences and conditions, I think someone else.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

There's pressure.

[Matt Kibbe]

Someone else can pick up the pressure.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

So we need inside information on what Ross is going to talk about tomorrow.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, but this he shared with me about the first one and I even gave input. The second one he told me was about the prisons. But I don't know what he's gonna say tomorrow. I really don't. I honestly don't know.

[Matt Kibbe]

Sons are. Sons can be unreliable on this.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Sons are. My daughter's much more communicative than my son. It's just that way. They are.

[Matt Kibbe]

One o' clock tomorrow.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yes, I think so, right? Yeah, it's one o' clock tomorrow.

[Matt Kibbe]

By the time people see this, they'll have missed it, but it'll be online.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah. And tell us again how we sign up for your new project.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah. So just come to. We do have a website. It's small, but we have it. Mothers Against Cruel Sentencing dot org. I use the word cruel because it's in our Constitution. It's, it's, it is cruel and it goes against our American value of mercy. And so go to the website and. Yeah, and also we do have a X account. You know, if you put that in there, it'll come up or. Max.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah. And a shout out to. It's possible that every person here right now. I see Angela's over there and Martha's here. And God knows how many people were personally involved.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Absolutely.

[Matt Kibbe]

As a building block in this campaign.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

So many great people are really interested in this. Yeah. And helping actively.

[Matt Kibbe]

And we were talking about this before we got started. As, you know, we, as libertarians, we don't feel like we win very often. So it's kind of nice to win.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

It is.

[Matt Kibbe]

So it's this bigger. I know as a mom and I know as a question of human justice, freeing Ross is an end and of itself, but it's emblematic of something much bigger than that.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, well, we can. That's the thing. And I said in my talk here, I was like the least likely person. I mean, I'm a boomer. I didn't know anything about encryption or really Bitcoin much except what Ross would say. And just, you know, certainly not taking on the federal government in a high profile deep web drug case. I mean, like, oh, my God, you know, Ross, could you have picked any bigger enemies for me to fight for you? You know, not to mention the banks, because it was all that bitcoin, all this stuff. But, you know, my daughter calls me Frodo, the unlikely person who starts, you know, but you just keep going. And any of us can do it. You know, it's. Especially if we're unified. I'm really tired of all the fighting amongst libertarians and crypto people, and we're fighting each other and we've got a bigger enemy, guys got a more urgent thing. And so just encourage people, either join or start something or whatever, because if we're all on the same team doing different things can win.

[Matt Kibbe]

Well, I have to keep talking about this because this is something else we were talking about beforehand. And. And I'm old enough in the libertarian movement that I have zero interest in fighting with my friends, and I get sort of frustrated with all the internal battles that we have because I feel like we have bigger common enemies out there.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yes.

[Matt Kibbe]

And the battle for Ross was very uniting.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

All the libertarians were pretty much for Ross.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yes. Finally we agreed on something.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Finally agreed on something on something.

[Matt Kibbe]

Who knew? But. But as I argued last year when. When it was still debatable about whether or not Trump was going to keep his promise, doing this is much bigger than Ross.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yes.

[Matt Kibbe]

Because it's. It's a statement about cryptocurrency, it's a statement about privacy and whether or not we're going to allow the government to take all of those freedoms away from us. So I think it's a big deal, and maybe we as libertarians could learn something about. But what happens when we work together.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Exactly. I mean, and just to say that judge, when she sentenced him, referenced his philosophy, and she said, I don't. And first, she didn't let his libertarian beliefs be known to the jury. That was forbidden.

[Matt Kibbe]

Because they might be persuaded.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah. They might say, oh, he's just a kid just doing this libertarian thing. And then at the sentencing, she said, you have very dangerous philosophy, which is basically libertarian philosophy. And I don't know that you've left it behind. And this is her justification for putting him in prison for life. And then we said to the Supreme Court lawyer, well, how about a First Amendment argument here? And he said, yeah, it won't fly. And he was probably right. You know, they didn't, you know, so that's a big, big issue. Right. Also, the whole thing with the, well, I use the crypto thing, you know, I'm a bitcoin maxi. I'm. You know, how about what? Be freedom maxis. We're all for freedom. Okay. And then we can all agree on that. And then we can have our small differences, you know, Be freedom maxis.

[Matt Kibbe]

I don't know. That's pretty radical.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, it is. I don't know.

[Matt Kibbe]

That's crazy talk. And just to kick this dead horse one more time, we're at Pork Fest and there's one of everybody and everything here. All different sort of philosophies, all different chosen careers and perspectives and hopes and dreams and all that stuff. And yet we all get along.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah, we all get along.

[Matt Kibbe]

And I feel like that's. Isn't that our. Well, mostly. Mostly except for that guy. But the whole point of freedom is that we believe in voluntary cooperation. People coming together and doing stuff and creating beautiful things. And that should inform our strategy maybe.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Exactly.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

And if you don't like somebody's or personality or what they say, say even, or as long as they, you know, they're not yet. They're there for freedom.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yeah.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

You know, or their personal life and you don't approve, whatever it is. So what? That's how I was about Ross. It's like, are you for Ross getting him out? Great. You're my friend.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yep.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Not tyrants or something. I wouldn't, you know, horrible people, you know.

[Matt Kibbe]

But I'm talking about there were very few tyrants that were on Ross's side.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah. They're not on his side anyway. But yeah. Just not have petty. I don't. Maybe even they don't think it's petty. But it's like we have. Just remember there's bigger fish to fry. There's bigger enemies up in Washington, wherever direction that all over the world. We just were talking to a Turkish woman. She's dealing with all kinds of persecution in Turkey.

[Matt Kibbe]

Yep. The fight is everywhere.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah. So, yeah, she was here.

[Matt Kibbe]

Give it up for Lynn. Guys.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Thank you so much for all your support.

[Matt Kibbe]

So grateful.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Thank you, Matt.

[Matt Kibbe]

Thank you.

[Lynn Ulbricht]

Yeah.

[Matt Kibbe]

Thanks for watching. If you liked the conversation, make sure to like the video, subscribe and also ring the bell for notifications. And if you want to know more about free the people, go to freethepeople.org.