Pontevedra | 17

Summary

Kill List Podcast Episode 17: Pontevedra – Detailed Summary

Introduction

In Episode 17 of Kill List, titled "Pontevedra," host Carl Miller delves deeper into the harrowing true story of Ana Garcia, a resident of Pontevedra, Galicia, who became the target of a dark web kill list. This episode uncovers the intricate web of personal vendettas, law enforcement challenges, and unexpected twists that have left Ana living in perpetual fear for her life.

Background: Ana Garcia’s Early Struggles

Ana Garcia’s life in the scenic yet serene villages surrounding Pontevedra was far from idyllic. Growing up in a region characterized by lush green hills and a bustling port, Ana faced significant personal hardships early on:

• Early Marriage and Abuse: At 16, Ana married a man who subjected her to psychological abuse. She remained in this tumultuous marriage for seven years, unable to secure a divorce due to her strict Catholic parents' opposition.

  Ana Garcia [01:25]: "Even though time has passed, I still feel unsafe, even small. That's what happens when you know that someone wants to hurt you."

• Path to Independence: Desperate to escape her abusive marriage, Ana finally divorced and distanced herself from her unsupportive family. With only €350, she purchased a modest house, symbolizing her newfound independence.

  Ana Garcia [07:09]: "I finally got divorced and I don't talk to my brothers or to my parents anymore. I have a kid who is 25 years old now, so I left that house without anything. All that I had was €350, and that was when I bought my House."

Employment and New Challenges

To support herself, Ana began working tirelessly cleaning houses, eventually securing a job at Javier’s fish shop in Pontevedra:

• Workplace Tensions: Working at Javier’s family-run fish shop brought its own set of challenges. Despite a professional relationship, Ana faced hostility from Javier’s wife and son, Alberto, who harbored suspicions about her intentions.

  Ana Garcia [10:28]: "They always try to make Javier fire me. And as Alberto is a child, although he's 39 years old, he's used to having what he wants, when he wants it."

• Escalating Hostility: The antagonism escalated from verbal abuse to physical harassment, with Ana experiencing degrading insults and even a direct threat to her safety.

  Ana Garcia [11:32]: "And then I said, I'm going to call Javier to tell him what happened. And she said, if you call Javier, I'm going to stab you with a knife. And she went to grab the knife. And in that short period of time I escaped."

Discovery of the Kill List

In 2020, Ana’s life took a drastic turn when she became aware that someone had placed her on a dark web kill list:

• Carl Miller’s Investigation: Carl Miller and his team uncovered a murder-for-hire website on the dark web, dubbed the "Kill List," where hundreds of individuals were targeted for their lives.

  Carl Miller [02:12]: "We call it the Kill List. So far, we've managed to help law enforcement arrest or convict more than 30 people for putting someone they know onto the kill list."

• Ana’s Plight: Despite breaking the news to Ana, the Spanish Civil Guard’s inadequate response left her in a state of constant fear, believing that the perpetrator remained at large.

  Ana Garcia [01:33]: "When I'm driving, I'm looking through the mirror, which car is coming in which direction?"

The Arrest of Juan and Its Fallout

A significant development occurred when Juan, Ana’s ex-boyfriend, was arrested for placing her on the kill list:

• Unexpected Suspect: Initially, suspicions fell on Javier’s family due to their animosity towards Ana. However, the Civil Guard arrested Juan, who Ana hadn't spoken to in four years.

  Ana Garcia [16:29]: "He told me it's Juan. I was shocked. I told him, but how? How can it be Juan?"

• Mystifying Motive: The arrest of Juan left Ana perplexed, as their past relationship didn’t provide a clear motive, especially considering his financial struggles.

  Ana Garcia [20:24]: "How can he have €20,000?"

Uncovering Hidden Agendas

Further investigation revealed deeper layers to the case:

• Private Investigator’s Revelation: A private investigator hired by Javier uncovered that Juan had previously attempted to have Ana killed in 2017, linking back to a financial dispute involving lost family money.

  Ana Garcia [26:09]: "Veronica was close to me in the past. So she knew about Juan. She knew he's addicted to Pocket online and that he was struggling with money."

• Chain of Events: This revelation suggested that Juan might have been manipulated into placing Ana on the kill list by Javier’s family, positioning him as a scapegoat.

  Ana Garcia [26:38]: "I have the theory that Juan is the weapon, the scapegoat. Because if I'm dead, Juan is not gaining anything."

Legal Hurdles and Civil Guard’s Stance

Despite mounting evidence, the legal system struggled to hold Juan accountable:

• Insufficient Evidence: The Civil Guard's case against Juan heavily relied on linking his crypto wallet to the kill order. However, translating crypto transactions into concrete evidence proved challenging.

  Thomas Garcia [35:21]: "It has no sense in which any other person uses his data to create a wallet. So the only person who has the password and everything, it's him."

• Judicial Dismissal: In April 2023, despite evidence, the judge dismissed the case against Juan due to the inability to conclusively prove his sole involvement.

  Thomas Garcia [35:21]: "There is no evidence that they are together in that the only thing that they have in common is that they don't like Anna."

Ongoing Struggles and New Developments

Ana’s journey continued with moments of hope and persistent fear:

• Continued Threats: Shortly after Juan’s dismissal, Ana received a chilling threat call, linking back to Javier’s family, suggesting that the danger was far from over.

  Ana Garcia [25:17]: "I got a call and a woman's voice said, watch your back, I'm coming for you."

• Appeal and Reopened Case: In April 2024, Ana appealed the dismissal. A higher court overturned the initial decision, acknowledging the case’s seriousness and instructing further investigation into Juan’s financial transactions linked to the kill order.

  Esperanza Escribano [35:21]: "So this is the good news, actually. Quite recently, in April 2024, there's been a big new development."

Personal Resilience Amidst Adversity

Despite the ongoing legal battles, Ana found moments of personal happiness:

• Marriage to Javier: In August 2022, Ana and Javier married, symbolizing a beacon of hope amidst the chaos.

  Ana Garcia [43:33]: "It was an ideal wedding. The place was just perfect and so beautiful."

Conclusion: A Glimmer of Hope

As the episode concludes, Ana still grapples with fear and uncertainty. However, the reopening of her case provides a semblance of hope that justice might finally prevail. Carl Miller emphasizes the systemic challenges in addressing modern crimes facilitated by technology, underscoring the need for persistent investigation and legal reform.

Carl Miller [46:39]: "Watching the really profound difficulties that like many other law enforcement agencies around the world, the Spanish have had in coming to grips with this new kind of crime."

Ana’s quest for safety and justice continues, embodying the relentless pursuit of truth against overwhelming odds.

Notable Quotes

• Ana Garcia [01:25]: "Even though time has passed, I still feel unsafe, even small. That's what happens when you know that someone wants to hurt you."
• Carl Miller [02:12]: "We call it the Kill List. So far, we've managed to help law enforcement arrest or convict more than 30 people for putting someone they know onto the kill list."
• Ana Garcia [25:17]: "I got a call and a woman's voice said, watch your back, I'm coming for you."
• Thomas Garcia [35:21]: "His defense is going to be very difficult. He could set very little to avoid the blame."
• Esperanza Escribano [35:21]: "So this is the good news, actually. Quite recently, in April 2024, there's been a big new development."

Looking Forward

In the next episode of Kill List, the investigation shifts to another dark web hitman-for-hire site, "Rent a Hitman.com," as Carl Miller continues to track the elusive administrators orchestrating these life-threatening schemes.

---

This summary captures the essence of Episode 17: "Pontevedra" from the Kill List podcast, highlighting the key events, personal struggles, and intricate investigations surrounding Ana Garcia’s perilous journey.

Transcript

[Carl Miller]

Wondry plus subscribers can binge all episodes of Kill List early and ad free. Join Wondri in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts. Anna? Hello? Can you hear me? Anna?

[Ana Garcia]

Yes, yes, I'm here with my dogs, as always.

[Carl Miller]

Is it a Jack Russell? I love the kind of little faces that they have. They're so cute. It's a cold, rainy afternoon in March, but Ana Garcia is in good spirits. Oh, my God. Look at that. Unfortunately, the reason I got her on the phone forces me to bring down the tone of our call. Let me move to some questions. So can she just tell us what's happened on the case? Back in 2020, I broke the news to Anna that someone paid more than €20,000 to have her killed. In the time since her case, her life have gotten stuck in a sort of stasis. Anna doesn't speak English, so you're hearing an actor voice her words.

[Ana Garcia]

Even though time has passed, I still feel unsafe, even small. That's what happens when you know that someone wants to hurt you.

[Carl Miller]

Whoever wants Anna debt, it's still out there.

[Ana Garcia]

When I'm driving, I'm looking through the mirror, which car is coming in which direction? I get scared and write down the license plate of the car that approached me.

[Carl Miller]

Years ago, someone was arrested for ordering Anna's murder on the Dark Web. The Spanish Civil Guard gathered enough evidence against their suspect to be convinced they'd got the right person. They even charged them with a crime. But today, the suspect is still free and they live just minutes away from Anna.

[Ana Garcia]

Something can happen again. And the Civil Guard says, well, don't worry if something happens to you, we already know who is guilty for it.

[Carl Miller]

According to Anna, there's nothing the Civil Guard can do for her unless someone tries to have her killed again. Hearing all this leads me back to one huge question. How is it possible that Anna has been waiting more than four years to get justice, even though the police say they know who tried to murder her? My name is Carl Miller. Since 2020, I've been part of a team working in secret to stop people getting murdered. We broke into a scam murder for hire website on the Dark Web. Watching from the inside, we observed with horror all the orders being placed. Real people being targeted, real money being paid. Hundreds of people have appeared on this website as targets. We call it the Kill List. So far, we've managed to help law enforcement arrest or convict more than 30 people for putting someone they know onto the kill list. With over 150 years of prison time being handed down, you may remember hearing about Ana Garcia's case from earlier episodes, but what you heard back then was just a small part of a much bigger story. A story about how law enforcement agencies and legal systems all around the world are struggling to come to grips with this strange new kind of crime. And for Anna, it means she fears that the law won't be able to act unless she actually comes to harm.

[N/A]

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[Carl Miller]

From wondery and Novel I'm Carmilla and this is Kill List. Ana Garcia grew up in the villages surrounding Pontevedra in Galicia, an area where the climate is much closer to the muted damp I'm used to here in London than the stifling, shimmering heat you normally think of with Spain. The hills surrounding Pontevedra are green and lush. The city's port opens out into the Atlantic Ocean. The entire bay moves to the rhythms of the sea and the creatures living in it. Even before we came into her life, things weren't easy for Anna.

[Ana Garcia]

I got married when I was 16 years old with a man that mistreated me and did psychological violence to me.

[Carl Miller]

Anna says she married him to escape her very strict Catholic parents, and after.

[Ana Garcia]

Seven years I wanted to get divorced, but my father said no way, they didn't allow me. So those seven years were like hell to me.

[Carl Miller]

Her family didn't support divorce for religious reasons.

[Ana Garcia]

I finally got divorced and I don't talk to my brothers or to my parents anymore. I have a kid who is 25 years old now, so I left that house without anything. All that I had was €350, and that was when I bought my House.

[Carl Miller]

Buying this house was a huge deal for Anna. It meant independence, being able to decide for herself what her life looks like.

[Ana Garcia]

For a year, I was working without any holidays. I was cleaning houses of different families. I was working every day because I had to get to €22,000 to buy the house.

[Carl Miller]

The house she could afford was modest. A small grey box with a rusty iron gate and peeling wooden windows. No flooring, no kitchen.

[Ana Garcia]

I just had a mattress and then a shower and a toilet and nothing else. So I was working on the house. I put in the floor and everything. And that's when I started to work for Java.

[Carl Miller]

Javier is the owner of a family fish shop, one of many in the bustling fish markets of Pontevedra. He's in his 60s, seemingly always smiling through his rectangular glasses. With short white hair at his sides and back, he looks gentle and kind. For Anna, the work at Javier's fish shop was tough. Early mornings and hard physical labour day after day. And from the start, there were tensions.

[Ana Garcia]

From the beginning, Javier's wife and Javier's son were against me. She's very, very jealous, that wife. So for the first year I was working there, the wife was saying he allegedly was already in love with me.

[Carl Miller]

Anna says there was nothing romantic between her and Javier at this point. They had a good relationship. Yes, they were growing closer and she felt she could trust him. There may even have been an attraction between them. But Javier was still technically married, even though his marriage was rocky. Ana says she'd never crossed that line. So for a long time she remained just his employee. But Anna alleges that regardless, Javier's wife and son launched a sort of campaign against her because she believes they suspected her of wanting Javier, his money and the family shop for herself. Anna's allegations about what Javier's family did are really serious. We put them to Javier's now ex wife, his son Alberto, and Javier's daughter in law, Veronica, who Anna says was also involved in the feud. But none of them responded to us or commented on Anna's allegations. Nor has it been possible, as you might expect, with a private family feud, to independently corroborate what Anna says. None of the allegations have been tested in court, so you need to bear all of that in mind when listening to Ana's account of what she says happens next.

[Ana Garcia]

They always try to make Javier fire me. And as Alberto is a child, although he's 39 years old, he's used to having what he wants, when he wants it. He couldn't deal with the fact that Javier Wasn't firing me. So Alberto put dog shit in my bag, threw ice in my face, scratched my car.

[Carl Miller]

According to Anna, the hostility didn't just come from Alberto. She claims Javier's then wife also verbally abused her.

[Ana Garcia]

She used to insult me, called me a cantor, a beach or a slat. It was the thing that she did the most her way to say good morning.

[Carl Miller]

Anna says the alleged abuse from Javier's wife also escalated beyond insults.

[Ana Garcia]

One day I was cleaning the van and she appeared and grabbed me by the hair.

[Carl Miller]

As she tells me the story, Anna racks out how she says the scene unfolded.

[Ana Garcia]

And then I said, I'm going to call Javier to tell him what happened. And she said, if you call Javier, I'm going to stab you with a knife. And she went to grab the knife. And in that short period of time I escaped.

[Carl Miller]

Anna didn't report any of this to the police at the time. She said she was scared to lose her job. She needed to be able to afford the mortgage on her house. But then in early 2020, things shifted. Javier finally left his wife and came to live with Anna during lockdown. Things developed quickly from there on.

[Ana Garcia]

I don't know how to explain it to you. It was fast. You know when you start with someone unexpectedly and suddenly one day he's sleeping in your bed. Just like that.

[N/A]

Wow.

[Carl Miller]

Soon Anna and Javier were dating.

[Ana Garcia]

I love him. I love him very madly. We love each other and he's my. He's my teddy bear.

[Carl Miller]

Eight months after Ana and Javier begin dating in October 2020, we intercept the kill order against Anna from a user called johnny25.

[Ana Garcia]

I prefer car accident. A week is good, I tell you when you can begin to work.

[Carl Miller]

She sells fish in market at Pontevedra. She lives alone in.

[Ana Garcia]

She goes to job at 5:40am every day except Monday.

[Carl Miller]

We send a reporter from Barcelona, Esperanza Escribano, to to jump on a plane and find Anna on the other side of the country. Over a single frantic, nerve fraying day, Esperanza races between the fish markets of Pontevedra to track Anna down. And then finally, as the sun goes down, Anna, Esperanza and Javier are all sitting on the terrace of a local bar having a video call with me. Hi there, Esperanza.

[Esperanza Escribano]

Hi.

[Carl Miller]

Are we good to begin? Am I coming through?

[Esperanza Escribano]

Yes. And Anna's boyfriend is with us as well.

[Carl Miller]

Well, Anna Garcia, firstly, thank you. As I explained why we've gotten in touch with her, Anna starts to giggle nervously. Can you ask if there's anything that she can tell us about anyone that she knows that might be using website in this way. Does she know who might want to harm her? That's when Anna stops laughing. She looks into Javier's eyes, silently communicating with him. Then, turning back to me, she tells us the only names that come to her in that moment. Veronica, Alberto, Javier's son Alberto and Veronica, the partner of Javier's other son. Ana and Javier can't think of anyone else who sees Anna as an enemy and who can afford to spend more than €20,000 to kill her. But right now, all Ana and Javier have are suspicions. There's no evidence whatsoever tying Alberto or Veronica to the hit. We report the kill order to the local Civil Guards who interview Anna and Javier. They tell the police all about the alleged feud and their fear that it could have something to do with the kill order. The Civil Guard promises to investigate. Throughout December 2020, Ana and Javier go on with their lives as best they can. They rise early every day to sell the catch pulled out of Pontevedra Bay. But they're both terrified.

[Ana Garcia]

I'm still scared. We still don't know anything new. What we have changed now is that I'm not remaining at home alone.

[Carl Miller]

Daily. Ana is scared of having to face Javier's family. She believes that they want her dead.

[Ana Garcia]

They live in another village, 15 minutes away.

[Carl Miller]

But there's nothing she can do other than just wait for the Civil Guard to step in. Then one day, about a month later, just before Christmas, Anna's lawyer walks into the fish shop and tells her that the Civil Guard have finally arrested someone for paying to have her killed. But the suspect isn't Javier's son, his daughter in law, nor his estranged wife, or indeed anyone from Javier's family.

[Ana Garcia]

He told me it's Juan. I was shocked. I told him, but how? How can it be Juan?

[Carl Miller]

Juan is an ex boyfriend of Anna's who she hasn't even spoken to in four years.

[Ana Garcia]

I started crying because I was thinking, what did I do to you? I remembered all the years that I was with him. Everything. Like a flash of all the moments that I was with him. And I said, but why?

[Carl Miller]

Before, Anna was scared, but now she's also profoundly disorientated. Any idea she had about where the danger is coming from has just been completely upended.

[N/A]

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[Ana Garcia]

The police blocked the street where Juan lives. Special forces of the police came to arrest him, going through the roof with these super big guns in the middle of a village of about a thousand people. And then they took him to the police station.

[Carl Miller]

This is the story Anna hears about Juan's arrest. It throws everything she thought she understood about her situation out the window.

[Ana Garcia]

I started to wonder why. It's been four years since we don't talk anymore.

[Carl Miller]

When I learn about the arrest, I'm just as confused as Anna. The Civil Guard clearly consider Juan the lead suspect in the kill order. But Anna can't think of any reason why he'd want her dead. Especially now. All these years later, Anna tells me that she's known Juan since they were kids. Their families live near each other. Years later, after she got divorced from her first husband, Anna and Juan reconnected. Then they started dating.

[Ana Garcia]

During the first two years, everything was alright. He was charming, he was very nice to me. But then he started to be very unstable.

[Carl Miller]

Anna says that Juan's instability had to do with his growing obsession with online poker.

[Ana Garcia]

One day he was saying I love you. And the day after he was throwing me out of the house. And at some point when we were still having a good relationship, I got pregnant. We were both happy with the idea of having a family. But then one day he changed his mind and said, well, you need to have an abortion. And then I had a miscarriage. And after that everything was going worse and worse and worse, to the point that one day we were maybe having lunch at 2pm in a good mood. And two hours after he was throwing me out of the house again and I was out of the house with the suitcases. So on one of these occasions I said no more. And that's it. That's why I left.

[Carl Miller]

After Their relationship ended is when Ana bought her house and ultimately ended up working in Javier's fish shop. We did put Ana's claims about the relationship to Juan, but he declined to comment. But in her telling, it sounds like an extremely tough experience for Anna. A volatile relationship and the loss of a pregnancy so soon after Anna says she got out of an abusive marriage. But the confusing thing is none of it seems to point to a clear motive for Juan. On top of that, Anna also doesn't understand where Juan could have gotten enough money for the order.

[Ana Garcia]

In the last few days, I've been told about Juan that he has a lot of trouble with money. So I started to wonder, how can he have €20,000?

[Carl Miller]

Often, when we tell someone that they've been targeted by a kill order, they can quickly make sense of it in the context of their lives, either because of a breakdown in a romantic relationship, or maybe the presence of some sort of feud or vendetta. And that's what we thought we had here, too, with Javier's family. But now, with Juan being arrested, the puzzle we were carefully piecing together, well, it doesn't make any sense anymore. But the thing is, the Civil Guard clearly think they have found strong evidence against Juan. It feels crucial that we learn what that is. And so Esperanza, our Spanish reporter on the ground, starts reaching out to the lead investigator, a man called Thomas Garcia, for an interview. But with the case still being open, he doesn't want to share anything on the record. But we do keep the lines of communication open. I was optimistic that Juan's arrest meant that Ana's case is nearing a resolution. But I was wrong.

[Ana Garcia]

I was with Javier in the car on the way home from Marin, and suddenly the Civil Guard called me to notify me that Juan had been released.

[Carl Miller]

The Civil Guard has found incriminating evidence against Juan. Despite that, it seems that the judge presiding over the case has decided that he isn't a big enough threat to Anna to be investigated behind bars. He's released from police custody straight away, although the investigation into him continues. Sitting in a car, Anna tries to process the news.

[N/A]

This is another.

[Ana Garcia]

I felt very disappointed and afraid.

[Carl Miller]

The Civil Guard don't seem happy either. Anna says that the officer on the phone encourages her to file for a protection order against Juan. Anna agrees. The next day, on Christmas Eve, Anna shows up at court to give a statement to the judge.

[Ana Garcia]

The judge asked me if he was contacting me and I said no. If he called me, if we crossed paths, if he was harassing me. But I Said no at the time. And that's why I wasn't given the restraining order.

[Carl Miller]

It sounds like because Juan hasn't directly threatened Anna, the judge doesn't consider her to be at risk from him. Without yet knowing the truth of Juan's innocence or guilt. Over the next few weeks, Anna is too terrified to even leave the house.

[Ana Garcia]

When I go out from the market, I look around. I'm afraid I don't have the karma I used to have in my life. I feel like things are not getting better, but worse. And I'm just tired of this.

[Carl Miller]

Then Anna tells me something extremely unsettling happens. Just a few weeks after Juan is arrested, Anna is on her own in the fish shop. It's the first time she's worked by herself in weeks. At a quarter past two in the afternoon, her phone rings.

[Ana Garcia]

I got a call and a woman's voice said, watch your back, I'm coming for you. I was super frightened and I just turned off the phone.

[Carl Miller]

It's a terrifying moment for Anna. What's especially chilling really is that it was done at the moment when Anna was alone. It's really suggesting that this person knows that Anna is alone for that hour. After Juan's arrest, I hoped that with law enforcement being involved, Anna would more or less be protected. That if nothing else, anyone wishing Anna harm might keep their distance from her. Then Anna tells me something that makes the whole case seem even less clear.

[Ana Garcia]

Immediately I called the police and today they have told me that the call came from Veronica.

[Carl Miller]

Veronica? Javier's daughter in law. Veronica is a big part of the alleged feud over the fish shop. And for Anna, this looks like proof of what she's long suspected. That the conflict with Javier's family and the dark web threat must be connected in some way.

[Ana Garcia]

Veronica was close to me in the past. So she knew about Juan. She knew he's addicted to Pocket online and that he was struggling with money. And Javier's ex wife is from the same village as Juan. So I have the theory that Juan is the weapon, the scapegoat. Because if I'm dead, Juan is not gaining anything. But Javier's family think they would gain something.

[Carl Miller]

Ana thinks this could all be a complex plot woven against her by Javier's family. That they convinced Juan to order her murder on their behalf using their money. But there's no evidence to support that theory. We reached out to Javier's daughter in law, Javier's son and his ex wife, for comment about Anna's suspicions, but we never received a response from them. As the months roll on. There's no new information about the case, at least not from the police, because it's Anna's partner, Javier, who uncovers a big lead that causes the case to swerve again. One evening, a few months after the threatening call, Anna is at home when Javier gets back from a meeting. He's clearly upset.

[Ana Garcia]

Javier comes and tells me, sit down, sit down. You're going to be amazed. I sit down and I say to him, what happened?

[Carl Miller]

Javier has just learned a fact that has remained hidden for many years. It turns out that the kill order we uncovered is not the first time someone tried to plan Anna's murder. Hi there, Raquel. How are you doing?

[Ana Garcia]

Hello, how are you?

[Carl Miller]

Oh, yeah, good, thanks. Thanks for joining us. Anna put us in touch with Raquel, a private investigator Javier hired to gather information about his ex wife and the other family members involved in the feud. All to prepare for his divorce proceedings, which are still going on at this point.

[Ana Garcia]

We were speaking in his car. He will show me the locations for the new investigation. He told me, well, Raquel, there's something that Anna and me are worried. I'm telling.

[Carl Miller]

Okay, come on, you're an investigator. You want to know. Javier tells the impatient PI the story of the Dark Web kill order. He tells her that Ana's ex boyfriend, Juan, has been arrested for it.

[N/A]

And that's when I make the link between the two cases.

[Carl Miller]

Raquel, the private investigator, speaks some English, but she talked to us mostly in Spanish. So you're hearing an actor voice, her words.

[N/A]

My face changed completely. Javier, he stared at me and he said, what? Do you know him? And I said, yeah, yeah, I know him. I know who he is.

[Carl Miller]

The private investigator tells us that back in 2017, after Juan and Anna had broken up, Juan hired her for an investigation. And you will not believe who he wanted investigated. Anna.

[N/A]

He explained that he's thinking about starting a private investigation about €200,000 that suddenly disappeared from his parents.

[Carl Miller]

Apparently, Juan's parents kept €200,000 hidden in the basement and it went missing. According to the detective, they suspected Anna of stealing it because Juan said there was no one else who could have known about the money. But once she started looking into Anna, the PI could quickly tell that she obviously didn't have €200,000. So she told Juan she didn't think Anna was a thief. But five months later, Juan got in touch with the detective again, this time to ask her for some advice. They met at a bar to discuss it.

[N/A]

He tells me he is convinced that Anna stole The money. He doesn't want her to get away with it. And he's thinking how he can settle the score without the evidence pointing to him. So I ask him what he means, and he tells me what is meant by settling the score. Just.

[Carl Miller]

How serious is it that Juan used this specific phrase, ajustas quentas?

[Esperanza Escribano]

Well, it's quite serious.

[Carl Miller]

This is Esperanza Escribano, the Spanish journalist who has worked with us from the very beginning on the story. She's become really close with Ana throughout this whole ordeal, and now she's helping me understand just what this new revelation really means.

[Esperanza Escribano]

Ajusta de cuentas means settling the scores. And in Spanish, you would only use this phrase to mean that you want to kill or harm someone. It's like if you're facing an ajusta de cuentas, oh, my God, you're really in danger.

[N/A]

I don't remember him saying the word hit me, but it was what he was talking about.

[Carl Miller]

The detective was convinced that Juan was asking her for advice about how to have Anna killed. Panicked, she extricated herself from the conversation and left the bar. The detective says that she took the threat from Juan so seriously that for the next few months, she regularly checked newspapers for news of Anna's death. Now, she never went to the police about any of this, which seems surprising to me. But she says that when she asked her official association of Private Investigators for advice on what to do, they told her not to report Juan, saying it might put her in danger as well. After a while, she moved on and forgot about the whole thing until she met with Javier years later, who in turn tells the story to Anna.

[Esperanza Escribano]

For Anna, it felt like a second news about someone trying to kill her. It was like the whole horror story repeating itself all over again.

[Ana Garcia]

I wonder how many times he tried to get me. I feel like I'm still in the nightmare.

[Carl Miller]

After we speak to the private investigator, it feels really important that we connect her with the Civil Guard. I mean, she is alleging that Juan tried to plan Anna's murder years before her name ever showed up on the kill list. Esperanza has been trying to get in touch with Thomas Garcia, the Civil Guard captain, for months. By this point. Now, it starts to feel even more urgent. Thomas Garcia is a hard man to pin down, but luckily, Esperanza is very persistent.

[Esperanza Escribano]

I started calling him every week until he understood that he had to talk to the detective.

[Carl Miller]

Finally, the Civil Guard interviewed the private investigator and included her story as evidence in the case they're building against One. Okay, so let me try and unravel the most tangled case of the whole kill list. We have a vicious family feud over a fish shop. An ex boyfriend with an alleged poker obsession who suspects that Anna has been stealing an enormous amount of his parents money. We have a private investigator that alleges that said ex boyfriend Juan had actually tried to plan Anna's murder before. And we also have Anna believing throughout the whole case that Juan is actually merely acting on behalf of the family involved in the family feud. What a tangle. I mean, how on earth does the Civil Guard go about unraveling all of that?

[Esperanza Escribano]

Well, the good news is that I finally have some answers for you.

[Thomas Garcia]

My name is Tomas Garcia and I am the captain of the Policiajoicial de Pontevedra.

[Esperanza Escribano]

It seems that Tomas and the Civil Guard are confident that Juan is the unique person responsible for the kill order.

[Thomas Garcia]

His defense is going to be very difficult. He could set very little to avoid the blame.

[Esperanza Escribano]

Their case seems to come down to the Bitcoin transfer to the Martyr for Hire website and the crypto wallet where the money came from. When they traced the email and phone number linked to the wallet, they both turned out to be Juan's.

[Thomas Garcia]

It has no sense in which any other person uses his data to create a wallet. So the only person who has the password and everything, it's him.

[Carl Miller]

What does Thomas say about Anna's theory that it was always Javier's family behind the order and that Juan was kind of working on behalf of them and therefore presumably would have received the money from them for the order?

[Esperanza Escribano]

Thomas was very clear on this point. He said that the Civil Guard investigated every suspicion Anna had and they found nothing to suggest that Javier's family was behind the kill order or had anything to do with it or Juan.

[Thomas Garcia]

There is no evidence that they are together in that the only thing that they have in common is that they don't like Anna.

[Carl Miller]

All right, so the Civil Guards don't sound ambiguous at all. In fact, I've actually never heard a police force sound so definitive before a conviction.

[Esperanza Escribano]

Me neither. And in May 2021, that's five months after they arrested Juan, they passed the case over to the prosecutors because they were confident about the evidence they found. But for months, we didn't have sign of Juan facing a trial anytime soon. For almost two years, nothing seemed to be happening with the case at all. But then, in spring 2023, finally something does happen. And it was something quite shocking. In April 2023, Juan's lawyer requested the dismissal of the case. That's something I can understand from. From her. But what seems shocking to me is that the prosecutor decided not to dispute the motion, and then the judge decided to grant the dismissal. And so just like that, the case suddenly seemed to be finished. Anna told me that on the same day as the dismissal happened, almost two and a half years since Juan's arrest, she was working in the fish shop as usual.

[Ana Garcia]

The door has a little window through which you can see the pavement. And it was a total coincidence. I turned around and saw him.

[Esperanza Escribano]

She told me she saw Juan outside.

[Ana Garcia]

He was walking, pushing his bike alongside him along the street, slowly and looking inside. He didn't say anything or make any gestures. He just looked at me. We exchanged glances, we looked at each other. And I started feeling nervous.

[Esperanza Escribano]

Ana thinks Juan went there on purpose on the day of the dismissal to send her a message. We haven't been able to independently confirm that Juan did appear outside her shop. We went through his lawyer and she just said that the statements about him in this story are, and I quote her, totally untrue. But the lawyer also declined to explain what Juan contests isn't true while the case remains open.

[Carl Miller]

So what actually happened then with the case? Like, why did the judge agree with this motion to dismiss it?

[Esperanza Escribano]

It's incredibly frustrating and disappointing for Anna. And not just Anna. I mean, I felt like, what? Is this how it's going to end? As far as we can tell, there were at least two issues converging over Anna's case. The first, that the prosecutor and the judge didn't feel the evidence against Juan was conclusive.

[Carl Miller]

How so?

[Esperanza Escribano]

The problem is that just because the crypto wallet is in Juan's name doesn't actually prove that he made the transactions and paid for the kill order. Because they can't trace the bitcoin used to pay for the order all the way back to Juan's non bank account.

[Carl Miller]

What that shows is this very, very important link that cases around the world have struggled to make between the individual and the order to show a court conclusively that it is the person that has written the order and that they mean it. That has time and again, I think, proven to be the most important and yet sometimes most vulnerable part of a prosecution. And here that's what sounds like really fell apart.

[Esperanza Escribano]

Well, there's still one other, maybe more fundamental hurdle. What Anna's lawyer says is that the people handling Anna's case don't understand the stakes of the case. That it still doesn't seem like the prosecutor nor the judge believe that whoever put through the kill order was a real danger to Anna because they considered the site was a scam and there was never a real hitman.

[Carl Miller]

That's completely mad. Because if there's one thing this investigation has actually revealed, it's that regardless of the fact that the website is a scam, the intent of the people putting the kill orders on there entirely real. And sometimes those people will go out and try many other ways of having people killed is a dangerous misconception that actually caused us to embark on this whole crazy kind of investigation that we've been doing for the last four years.

[Esperanza Escribano]

I know. And what strikes me about this is that it's just down to one judge or one prosecutor who may not consider a case like this serious. And then Anna suddenly has no protection from the system.

[Carl Miller]

And so the person who tried to have Anna killed, whether that's Juan or someone else, is obviously still out there years later. And it looks like any formal efforts to actually hold them accountable and therefore to actually protect Anna ultimately, well, that formal effort has now ended. How has Anna been coping then with all of this?

[Esperanza Escribano]

It's been hard for her, but she's a positive person and she's been trying to move on with her Life. And in August 2022, she and Javier actually got married. Anna said to me she just wanted to put an end to all the bad things that have been happening in the last.

[Ana Garcia]

It was an ideal wedding. The place was just perfect and so beautiful. I cried when I saw the people. I wanted to be there.

[Carl Miller]

And you were one of the people there, Esperanza, weren't you?

[Esperanza Escribano]

I was. I was, yes. I was part of it. I made. After all these years, I felt like. Well, I had to go. It was really comforting to see them happy, smiling, having a party with the people. They wanted to have it. It was a very emotional.

[N/A]

Travels.

[Carl Miller]

So there's bright spots then in Anna's personal life, but her experience of crime and justice here has been bleak and Kafkaesque. I mean, is this the end? After all these years, we actually end up where we first began, with nothing?

[Esperanza Escribano]

No, that's the good news, actually. Quite recently, in April 2024, there's been a big new development. So after the case was dismissed, Anna appealed against the decision. And since then, the case has gone to a higher court and a new judge had overturned the dismissal.

[Carl Miller]

I mean, that is, after everything Anna's been through, it is really wonderful to hear that this isn't the end of everything.

[Esperanza Escribano]

Yes, yes. There is still a window for this case to go through. So this new judge seems to finally believe how serious the case is and seems to believe that Anna was in danger and is in danger and that whoever is finally behind the order really wanted to kill her. This new judge has ruled that every possible avenue has to be exhausted in order to find the missing evidence and to do new research. So, for example, that could mean looking back through Juan's bank account to find out if there is evidence that can link him directly to the kill order, if there is evidence that can prove that he actually bought the bitcoin and use it to pay for the kill order. So this is all good news, but it doesn't mean that the case is going to court and it still can take years. The saddest part of it is that in all this time, Anna will still feel unsafe. But now at least there is a real chance that Anna can have some answers about her case.

[Carl Miller]

For years now, we've watched the stuttering, glacial progress of Anna's case as it slowly made its way through the Spanish courts and legal system. Watching the really profound difficulties that like many other law enforcement agencies around the world, the Spanish have had in coming to grips with this new kind of crime. This is the longest story either me or Esperanza has ever covered in our whole careers. And now, finally, we can make Anna's story public. And I really hope four and a half years on this isn't actually how Anna's story ends. Because there needs to be another chapter here. And that's the one where Anna actually sees a conclusion and finally, finally gets the justice that she still utterly needs and deserves.

[Ana Garcia]

The moment when I get a bit of justice, even if it's just a bit the moment I know the name of the people guilty officially, then maybe I get to live a normal life.

[Carl Miller]

On the next episode of Kill List, we track down the mysterious administrator behind yet another hitman for hire site. Rent a hitman.com.

[Thomas Garcia]

There was about 250 to 300 emails from people around the world saying, how much for asset extraction? What countries do you serve? How much for this? How much for that? I wasn't ready for it. I wasn't prepared to deal with it. This was not what I had in mind.

[Carl Miller]

And he becomes willing to take steps we never were in order to catch attempted murderers.

[Thomas Garcia]

I knew I absolutely had to act. If I didn't get that email, somebody else would have. And results could have been a lot different.

[Carl Miller]

If you like Kill List, you can binge all episodes ad free right now. But by joining Wondry plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short [e-mail] survey from Wandery and Novel this is Kill List. Kill List is hosted by Me Carmilla. The reporter is Esperanza Escribano. This episode is produced and written by Jay Kutajevic. Our series producer is Tom Wright. Kill List is also produced by Caroline Thornham with additional production by Anna Sinfield. Our assistant producer is Amalia Saltland and our researchers are Megan Oyinka and Lena Chang. Additional research from Chris Chris Monteiro for Wanderee. Our senior producer is Mandy Gorenstein. Fact checking by Fendel Fulton. Our managing producers are Cherie Houston, Sarah Tobin and Charlotte Wolfe for Novel Sarah Mathurs is our managing producer and Callum Plews is our senior managing producer for Wandery. Original music by Skylar Gerdeman and Martin Linibel Music supervision by Nicholas Alexander, Max O'Brien and Caroline Thornham Sound design and mixing by Andy Partington for Novel Willard Foxton as creative director of development. Our executive producers are Sean Glynn, Max O'Brien and Craig Strachan for Novel. Executive producers for Wanderee are Marshall Louis and Erin O'Flaherty.

[N/A]

How do you make an Airbnb a verbo picture a vacation rental with a host who's showing you every room like you've never seen a house before. Now get rid of them. There you go. No host ever. Now it's a verbo. Make it a verbo.