How I Won The WOO Worlds | Episode # 409

Summary

Kitesurf365 Episode #409 — How I Won the WOO Worlds

Date: October 20, 2025
Host: Adrian Kerr
Guests: Clark Robinson, Toby Wigglesworth, Maxwell Dahl, Ella Geiger, Jason Montreal, Evan Klein

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Episode Overview

In this special post-WOO Worlds episode, Adrian Kerr interviews standout performers from the 2025 WOO Worlds Nations Cup. The focus is on personal stories, team dynamics, the unique nature of standout kite spots, and the evolving strategies of different nations aiming for kiteboarding’s most coveted community title. The episode dives deep into the efforts, equipment choices, near-misses, and wild moments that mark WOO Worlds, offering both technical insight and human drama from across the globe.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Clark Robinson – Senior Jump Height Winner (28.1m)

• Achieving the Goal
  • Clark set a personal best (PB) and won in the senior jump height category in dramatic, last-minute fashion.
  • Quote: “My plan was to obviously try and get a PB. And I got it and I literally went straight in because I was like, holy. I've never been that high.” (01:19)
• About Plimmerton Spot
  • Recognized for its unpredictable, extreme conditions and “lofty” gusts. Riders are drawn by its world-record potential but wary of water spouts and daunting weather.
  • Quote: “Super gusty conditions... You’re like in your mind, ‘I don’t want to be here’…” (01:19)
• The Jump Experience
  • Clark describes the fear and thrill of being unexpectedly high, stringing together heli loops, unsure if landing would put him on land or rocks.
  • Other riders, notably Hugo and John, followed for safety.
  • Quote: “I did my first heli. Normally I’d be doing that at 15 meters, but it was probably over 20… I need to stop heli looping because I’m going to land on the motorway or rocks or whatever.” (02:22)
• Equipment
  • Uses Duotone Rebel D Labs, finds them more stable in gusty conditions.
  • Quote: “No one else has them here... feels stable in the gusty stuff.” (05:31)
• Community and Culture
  • Highlights the tight-knit NZ crew, mutual motivation, and the pursuit of progression regardless of age.
• Memorable Moment: Clark reflects on not seeing a dangerous water spout, showing the unpredictable risk factor at Plimmerton.
  • Quote: “Maybe I’m just too old, mate... Kind of oblivious to it, you know, like.” (08:29)

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2. Toby Wigglesworth – Men’s Distance 1-hour Winner (58.2 km)

• Growth and Olympic Ambitions
  • Transitioned from junior ranks into Olympic foiling, emphasizing the strength of NZ’s training squad.
• Chasing 60km+ in an Hour
  • Believes 60km is within easy reach; his winning run was underpowered and not ideal.
  • Quote: “I did 58 and wasn’t a great day. I was completely underpowered on a 15 meter.” (10:42)
• Strategy
  • Chose direction for flatter water, saving legs with more tacks (16) rather than pushing for a single relentless downwind.
  • Quote: “I started by plotting like a nice chart on a map and then kind of followed that plan. I plan to have an outgoing tide as well, just to help me a little bit.” (11:59)
• Gear
  • Rode the Tubinger V3, 15m VMG2 Flysurfer, and a Teri floorboard. Ride back upwind took another 1.5 hours post-attempt.
• New Zealand Community
  • Stresses the value of group chats and the inclusive, communal push for Nations Cup success.
  • Quote: “We all are on a group chat so we all message about it and we like trying to get the women's distance one hour for the nation's Cup.” (16:00)

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3. Maxwell Dahl – Highest Junior Jump Winner (30.8m)

• The Session
  • Nailed his winning jump during Cold Hawaii semi-finals, despite coming back from injury and with challenging “nuking” winds.
  • Quote: “This is like my second time on the water after my injury.” (20:04)
• Gear Talk
  • Used North Orbit 2026 (standard version/pro bar), lauding improvements in hangtime and loop speed.
• Academy Life (World Class Kiteboarding Academy)
  • Describes a balance of schooling and kiting, creating an international, supportive environment.
  • Quote: “You just have school in the morning... And then in the afternoon go kite for like two, three hours…” (21:28)
• Joking About Prizes
  • Winning gear (Core XR8, Sensor 4 bar) seen as trade fodder rather than a switch in loyalty.
  • Quote: “I mean, there’s only one thing I can do. Sell it.” (21:06)

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4. Ella Geiger – Women’s 1-hour Distance Winner (49.4 km)

• Wins Post-Worlds
  • Managed the top women’s distance after tiring World Champs, highlighting resilience and commitment.
  • Quote: “I saw there was one day left and I really wanted to just go for it.” (23:53)
• Route and Tactics
  • Attempt in Poole Harbour, unplanned and completed using her phone as a tracker.
  • Amassed 36 tacks, with hindsight to try a downwind route for better results next year.
• Gear
  • Used typical race setup: Flysurfer VMG3 and Chebanga foil.
• UK Challenges & Team Cohesion
  • Suggests UK lacks the internal drive and organization seen in New Zealand, with results posted more independently.
  • Quote: “I haven’t heard too much to be fair, but I think next year if we get a group going, then we could definitely be on the podium.” (27:23)
• Olympic Talk
  • Confirms kiting and foiling are set for LA Olympics, noting the unique spectacle and visibility challenges in the sport.

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5. Jason Montreal – Flying Kiwis Team Leader

• Near Victory Reflections
  • NZ finished just 10.6m behind the Netherlands. Clark and the Wigglesworths were pivotal.
  • Quote: “We basically got maybe 10 to 15 guys who can consistently jump over 20 meters. There’s maybe two guys who can consistently jump over 25 meters... The rest of us kind of have to hope for an absolute storm…” (31:44)
• Plimmerton Missions
  • The decision to rush to Plimmerton was last-minute, capitalizing on forecasted storms.
• Community Building
  • Jason organizes Woo Worlds parties and weekly PB shoutouts to keep spirits and engagement high.
  • Quote: “I scroll through WOO each week and give everybody a little shout out... we really make quite a community thing out of it here.” (34:05)
• Strategic Analysis
  • Notes NZ’s tide-dependent geography limits the country’s best attempters for “most jump heights” or “distance.”
  • Quote: “To get 10 hours of kiting... you’d have to do that six times over the course of a day… Those weekend disciplines aren’t good for us.” (41:00)
• Looking to the Future
  • Recognizes the points loss as younger riders leave the junior ranks, but is optimistic about new faces and continued “give it a go” culture.
  • Celebrates the diversity and balance demanded by the current Nations Cup scoring system.

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6. Evan Klein – Netherlands’ Nations Cup Winner & Team Max Height

• Dutch Focus
  • Implies the Dutch prioritize big air and “going big” over holistic team scores in other categories.
  • Quote: “I think the Dutch just care about going big.” (44:10)
• Team Dynamics
  • Credits early strong sessions and contributions from Jamie and Martha for securing victory.
• Emerging Talent
  • Notes the surprise of new young names like Ingemar Wordman pushing the leaderboard.
• Challenges of Distance
  • Evan experimented with foil distance events, but wind and technical errors made it more difficult.
  • Quote: “With the foil you need actually a lot of power to go quick. So the wind was light, so I really needed to work the foil really hard.” (45:23)
• Personal Challenge & Health
  • Recounts the struggle and persistent tinnitus after a failed 24hr foil attempt, highlighting the physical toll of extreme kiteboarding challenges.
  • Quote: “This is the most hard thing I’ve probably encountered in my life… I sort of got tinnitus from the challenge.” (46:39)
• Team Leadership Gaps
  • Suggests Dutch performance could rise if someone coordinated more team-driven efforts, noting how NZ and South Africa benefit from strong leadership figures.
  • Quote: “I feel like the Netherlands needs more of a leader to get people in action.” (49:57)
• On Plimmerton and the Future
  • Expresses interest in storm chasing in New Zealand, but recognizes logistical/travel barriers for European teams.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Clark, confronting Plimmerton’s dangers:
  “You kite there, as you head out, you’re like in your mind, ‘I don’t want to be here.’ You get water spouts... I literally got there and I was like, I’m not doing it. And then once I got out there, I realized it wasn’t that bad.” (01:19)
• Toby on pushing for more:
  “I did 58 and wasn’t a great day... Could easily break 60 on a better day.” (10:42)
• Maxwell, post-injury:
  “Oh, I was on like sixth place because I haven’t been riding because I had an injury. This is like my second time on the water after my injury.” (20:04)
• Ella, spontaneous winner:
  “It wasn’t really planned. The night before I heard you didn’t actually have to have a WOO to do it. So I just used my phone and the next day I went out...” (24:51)
• Jason, on NZ’s big air chances:
  “We got maybe 10 to 15 guys who can consistently jump over 20 meters... The rest of us have to hope for an absolute storm in the jumps of our lives.” (31:44)
• Evan, on the Dutch mindset:
  “I think the Dutch just care about going big.” (44:10)
• Evan, on the cost of endurance:
  “This is the most hard thing I’ve probably encountered in my life. The ringing in the ear... was pretty hectic... I wouldn’t wish this on anyone.” (46:39)
• Community matters:
  “It’s a small community in Auckland, and then... everyone’s out Woo’ing a lot and trying to get better, really, no matter what the age.” — Clark Robinson (06:36) “We all are on a group chat so we all message about it...” — Toby Wigglesworth (16:00)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Clark Robinson Interview & Plimmerton Insights: 00:49–09:51
• Toby Wigglesworth on Distance, Gear, Community: 09:57–18:37
• Maxwell Dahl, Junior Big Air Winner: 18:43–23:30
• Ella Geiger, Women’s 1hr Distance: 23:36–29:26
• Jason Montreal, Team Leadership & Community: 29:32–42:48
• Evan Klein, Holland’s Big Air Focus & Team Challenges: 42:55–53:35

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Episode Tone and Language

Casual, enthusiastic, supportive—reflecting the tight-knit and good-humored nature of global kiteboarding. The speakers use language of camaraderie and genuine awe at fellow athletes' accomplishments, with a Kiwi and Northern European bluntness and honesty throughout.

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Summary Takeaway

This episode illuminates how the WOO Worlds have become more than just numbers—they’re about community, risk, resilience, and evolving tactics. Whether being pushed into new heights by gusts and friends, or grinding out marathon distance sessions, this is a portrait of kiteboarding as both sport and tribe. Each guest, in their own way, shows how kiteboarding’s boundaries keep expanding—literally and figuratively—thanks to passion, friendship, and a touch of madness on the water.

Transcript

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Welcome to the kitesurf 365 podcast.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Welcome back to the show. I hope you all had a great weekend. On today's episode, I catch up with six people who had outstanding performances from the nations cup at this year's WOO Worlds. We hear from Clark Robinson, Toby Wigglesworth, Maxwell Dahl, Alec Geiger, Jason Montreal and Evan Klein. Don't forget to follow me at kaitsurf365 for all the latest episodes, ladies and gentlemen. Yeah, there's a bunch of people. Alright, guys, let's hear from Clark Robinson, who won the senior jump height with a score of 28.1 meters. Hey, Clark, congratulations on winning the WOO Worlds, buddy. Unbelievable effort. Was that a. Was that a goal for this year's comp?

[Clark Robinson]

It was a goal to get somewhere and obviously an added goal to get a PB and actually win it. So in the last second to last day. So, yeah, crazy.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Let's talk about that Plumerton spot. I know you guys rushed down there to, you know, to basically get second place in the. In the Nations Cup. How special is that place? Four big jumps, Hugo done in the world record there. You've got a pb. Mark Harrison's got a PB there. Jason Montreal's got a PB there. What makes it so special?

[Clark Robinson]

Super gusty conditions, Very lofty. If it's the right direction, which is kind of like a Norwest, then, yeah, you're gonna get the. The special conditions, normally relatively horrific conditions. I would say you kite there as you head out, you're like in your mind, you're like, I don't want to be here. Yeah, you get water spouts, which Mark got caught in last year. So it's scary. Yeah, I didn't even want to go out on the Sunday. I was like, literally got there and I was like, I'm not doing it. And then once I got out there, I realized it wasn't that bad. And my plan was to obviously try and get a pb. And I got it and I literally went straight in because I was like, holy. I've never been that high.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

You know what, I'll put the video up online, I'll put it in another couple of stories, but mate, that. I don't know if it's the second heli loop and the third one. You just keep getting lifted up and up.

[Evan Klein]

Yeah.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Stage. That must have been pretty scary. You must have been thinking, holy.

[Clark Robinson]

Like I said to Jason, I've never been that high. So I did my first heli. Normally I'd be doing that at 15 meters, but it was probably over 20. And I know what it's like, Hali looping there. I know that you travel and you go up and I went up and I looked down and I was like, what the hell? So I did one more and then after that I was like, okay, I need to stop halle looping because I'm going to land on a land like the motorway or rocks or whatever. Hugo and John basically were chasing me, watching to make sure I didn't die. And basically as I landed, they landed, they were right next to me and. And then I looked at my watch and I was like, wow, I couldn't believe. I mean it was, it was just a kicker. It was just a kicker and a gust, but that's what that place is like. If, if you get that in one go, then it's. It's crazy. Yeah, yeah.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

The way the videos are shot, it looks like you're flying directly at the land. You know, Jason Montreal said, you know, there's 2 or 300 meters more water down, down where you can go. But is that something that you guys do when someone gets that big jumpers, the other riders to come down just to be there? You know, you talked about for, for safety. Is that, is that part of the plan or do you guys just do that naturally?

[Clark Robinson]

I think they kind of did it for me because they obviously knew that I'd never been that high before and kind of went. They saw the heles, obviously watch me go back up. Probably were thinking, oh God, is he going to. Like, how is he going to land? You know, I mean, I've had, yeah, I've had some serious hammerings there, just trying to jump. Like not even doing kite loops, just jumping. You get ripped off the water when you don't expecting it and you might travel 20, 30 meters downwind, you know, and you're just kiting along. So I was lucky I didn't get a dropout because dropouts there are super common. But yeah, once I was up there, that was when I was like, okay, now I need to come down.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Yeah, it's that when you get up there, it's like, okay, I gotta start thinking about this now, you know?

[Jason Montreal]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Clark Robinson]

Because it was quick to get up. Like, it was. I just hit it and I just went straight up with that kite. You know, there's super vertical lift straight up. And then I did the first howling and then I realized, okay, that was way too soon because now I'm feel like I'm higher. Then did another one and then Kind of just was like, okay, I'm just gonna move the kite backwards and forwards until I land and. And that's pretty much what happened. Yeah. And then, yeah, I went in and then Hugo's dad, obviously he was filming it, but when I got back, there was no one at the beach. I couldn't put my kite down because it's also like, you can't just land a kite there. But luckily he ran back and grabbed the kite and then he was like, I got it on video. I was like, holy. Yeah, I was.

[Evan Klein]

I couldn't believe it, man.

[Clark Robinson]

I was like, jesus. I mean, yeah, because obviously a lot of the time it's not caught on video. So, yeah, it was crazy.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

What gear were you on, mate? Because I know, you know, you around Mark and Jason and probably get to try a bunch of different gear. Have you tuned the gear into what you like or you got a setup that you always use?

[Clark Robinson]

Rebel D Labs. I'm using. No one else has them here, so that's all I use now. I was on the Evos like Jason, but this year I got, well, probably a year ago, I got the Rebels. I really like them. Yeah, like, more stable. I haven't tried any of, you know, the Norths or anything. Um, maybe the two when the new ones come out. But I do like the Rebel. Yeah, it's. It's. It feels stable in the gusty stuff. It.

[Jason Montreal]

It's.

[Clark Robinson]

I wouldn't say it's stable, but, you know, like. Yeah, you don't have control in 40 to 50 knots, I don't think. But I don't in a way.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I mean, it's. This is classic Kiwi sort of attitude, right? Battling with the big boys and doing more than they can. You know, we say like, you know, we're not really a big kite surfing culture does. Is the. Is the Woo Worlds in particular the nations cup, something that you guys enjoy and enjoy the chase and enjoy the battle? Because it seems like you guys, along with South Africa, the only two countries that are really pushing it, you know.

[Jason Montreal]

Yeah.

[Clark Robinson]

I just like kiting with these guys because it pushes me. So obviously if they push me, hopefully that, you know, I try and push them. But it's. It's a small community in Auckland and then. And everyone knows, everyone, everyone's out Woosting a lot and trying to get better, really, no matter what the age is, you know, Like, I don't think so anyway. But yeah, I mean, yeah, it's. We thought we wouldn't come anywhere this year actually, but then we Went down and we had a good session and then Hugo's brother Toby went foiling and that made the difference. So, yeah, it's crazy. So pretty cool.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I'm going to speak to Toby later, but I'll ask you, is Toby going to be a problem like his brother as he gets older? Has he got the same talent and drive as Hugo?

[Clark Robinson]

Yeah, I think so, but I think he's into different stuff.

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Right.

[Clark Robinson]

More into the racing. Maybe he'll get into it. He did say he is competitive against Hugo, so when I saw him the other night, so I think, I think so, yeah, I'd say he will get into it. I think Hugo's going. Leaving soon for a comp. So, yeah, I mean, yeah, I was surprised at jump. Like, I wasn't expecting it, but sometimes that's how it works. My first PB of over 20, I wasn't expecting it and. And it happened when sometimes if you're trying too hard, it just doesn't happen, you know. And then, yeah, I mean, like on the Saturday, I think I got 21.6 and I was like, well, that's not going to get me anywhere. And we knew that it was forecast for 50 on Sunday. I don't think it got to 50, but we just. Yeah, the water spouts are probably the worst. And I'm like, man, the boys are like, did you not see the water spout? Did you not? I'm like, no, all right. Maybe I'm just too old, mate.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Too old, too scared.

[Clark Robinson]

I'm kind of oblivious to it, you know, like.

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Yeah, yeah.

[Clark Robinson]

Whereas Mark, like, I think on the Saturday one hit him and he ejected his kite and he's like, I didn't see me in the water. And I'm like, why? What happened? He's like, oh, water spout hit me again. Like, they seem to like, follow him.

[Maxwell Dahl]

Around.

[Clark Robinson]

And he hates them, you know, good for good reason. So that's the only thing about that place. Yeah. It's better to get up if it's not raining because they. You just. If you're standing on the beach, you just see them coming through like mini tornadoes and that's when it gets a bit dodgy.

[Maxwell Dahl]

Right.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Is there a Wellington scene? Are there Wellington kiters who come up when you're there or is it just the Auckland crew come down?

[Clark Robinson]

No, they did come up. Yeah, they were kiting as well. I think when it gets really windy, there's a few guys that will still come out. On the Saturday, it was quite busy. Wingers, windsurfers and kiters and I guess it was 35 to maybe 40 max on the Saturday. So it does get busy. Yeah, yeah for sure. Whereas there was a few guys out on Sunday. Yeah.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Well look Clark, congratulations mate. Unbelievable effort. I hope your goal next year is to break 30 meters. I think that'd be super cool. Pushing it and, and showing that age is just a number as you said. Sukay. Also I don't want to say her age but I mean also pushing it for the ladies in South Africa. So yeah it's, it's awesome to see man. Congratulations brother.

[Clark Robinson]

Cheers bro. Thank you.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

All right guys, this is Toby Wigglesworth who won the men's distance 1 hour with a distance of 58.2 kilometers. Toby, good to see you buddy. You've grown up since I last saw you mate. It's been. I feel like you've become a man in these last two years.

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Yeah, a little bit. Yeah. That and the kite. Foiling for the Olympic class. Gotta put on a bit of weight.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Are you gonna continue with the racing or are you gonna follow Hugo and get into big air or gonna do your own thing?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Yeah, at the moment I'm still pushing for the racing. Yeah, we'll see over the next year. There's a good like good training squad in New Zealand so it's easy to push with them.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Well look, congratulations on winning the 1 hour distance 58.2. Is it possible to break 60?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Oh yeah, definitely, very easily. I did 58 and wasn't a great day. I was completely underpowered on a 15 meter and also you can get much better days where it's much flatter and just like if you were on 11 meter you'd be at least another knot quicker on average.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

So why is that? If you're on, you're saying if you weren't on the 15 you're on the 11, you'd be faster.

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Just it's always been quicker. It's always quicker downwind on 11 if you're load up.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

So because I remember when Lucas did it the year before he was hitting for the people who have no idea about Auckland, he was heading north. Right. You were heading east. I mean I know it's wind direction but is it flatter water to go that way? Is it in particular way you chose that window?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

I think. Yeah. We were planning on doing that to Morasai down the east coast as we did on the wing and we liked it. It got a bit rough down the bottom but it's quite. There's a few like nice shouted spots but the Other way, going north, you end up like back of Rangi. And it does get very, very, like, choppy.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

What's the strategy for that? I mean, obviously the few attacks, the better, but also the, you know, the. The few attacks, the more sort of taxing toll it takes on the legs and the body. How do you manage that? What was your strategy? To keep for one hour?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Yeah, so I started by plotting like a nice chart on a map and then kind of followed that plan. I plan to have an outgoing tide as well, just to help me a little bit. But otherwise, I mean, my Hugo would like, try to go for the least tax possible, but I was like trying to save the legs a little bit. So I ended up doing 16 attacks. But like, my job's pretty quick, so it doesn't really make too much of a difference. But you're basically pushing for a speedrun the whole time, just pushing and pushing.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I mean, did the legs get sore even with 16 tacks? Were they sore at the end?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Honestly, not that bad. I've been doing a lot of training.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

So is it possible to do a single tack? I mean, is that even possible?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

I'm sure, like with a big open sea, but you get into some pretty big C stat.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I mean, 58 is the winning distance this year. What's your goal for next year? Are you going to push this again?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Yeah, I'll definitely go for it again. I think if I can get around 63, maybe 62 and beat, I think, Ricardo's record.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

How many times you try this? Is this the first time or you did it a couple times?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Twice. So the first time it was when the way Lucas did, but it was light again, so just a. And I kind of was half committed just to test it. And then the last one I saw, I got overtaken by Janus Janice Mouse and then went for it the next day.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Janus Mouse, another winner of this event through the years. Did you know you were ahead of schedule during the. During the hour, or are you just basically pushing blind and just hoping it's gonna work out?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

I think the start, the first 20 minutes I was solid. I was hitting like 35s on my watch quite easily. And then, well, that's like 65 on the kilometers. And then all of a sudden, like the wind just dropped. So I was struggling to even get like any speed, like. And then all of a sudden the last like 15 minutes, I was like. I knew I had to push hard, so I went like really quick for the last 10. And then I sort of knew that was it because I knew where I needed to end up in terms of the location.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

So as a percentage sort of what angle downwind are you sort of riding on that foil?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

I'm not sure but I'm mainly going to VMG or slightly above. And then if it's super light like it did go for a bit I was reaching. But yeah, it's going as low as you can because it's just quicker on the kite.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

You get to the end of the hour, I see your track finishes. You're in the middle of the bloody ocean. What do you got to do then you didn't have to come back or was someone down there to meet you?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

I kited all the way back at wind. It was only an hour and a half back up. So not too bad. I mean I. I went for a little like tiki tour at the end just to have a look the coast and then.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

And what was the setup? What were you riding?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

I was riding the Tubinger V3, the 15 meter VMG2 fly surfer and a Teri floorboard.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

So you actually went back upwind yourself? I mean I guess you weren't pushing it on the way home, right?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

No, no I did a little bit. The funniest thing was it went to about 25 knots on the way back up. So I was so overpowered.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I mean 21.8 on your junior jump probably a little bit disappointing. I mean obviously actually we had some big jumps come from Ingemar and Max Dahl but those guys are up in that massive storm. Is that something that you want to improve on for next year or are you going to be out of the juniors next year?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

I think I'm out of the juniors next year but I will.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Jason, Montreal is going to be so upset.

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Yeah, it will be. There's a few young around here that are coming up so we'll try to it but otherwise I'll try to get back maybe beat my record which is 27.3.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I was just speaking to to Clark and I really feel like that New Zealand buys into this nation's cup in the woo world better than anyone. You know like you know it brings like you know you're talking about you and Lucas and you guys have a pretty good foiling sort of training community. Even you guys get involved and I think other areas struggle to get the racing teams to come and do this. So I always feel like New Zealand has a really good community around this world. I know Jason, Montreal does a lot of stuff with building the community and, and updating everyone but yeah, it's really cool to see.

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Yeah, it is, yeah. I mean, like we all are on a group chat so we all message about it and we like trying to get the women's distance one hour for the nation's Cup. So we got Justina Kitchen, who was at the Olympics last year, and then we never found a woman's for the wing jump.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

But yeah, we could put. Put Hugo on a wig, man, you never know.

[Maxwell Dahl]

Yeah.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

But yeah, it's crazy that you guys got second, but I think that. I think the woman's wing was just not really tapped into, you know, if you look at even all the scores, there wasn't really any big. I think South Africa had a big one and near one for Spain was big, but there wasn't many big scores, you know, so it wasn't too impactful. But I hope next year people can buy into that and see that as a chance to pick up scores. I mean, I think you guys are only 10 points behind first or something like. Something crazy like 10.6 behind, behind first place, you know.

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Yeah, I think definitely if we had a better few days at Plumerton, plus we could have definitely added them all with the wing jump and then maybe a little bit more in the distance for now.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

So were you there when Clark did his big jump?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

I wasn't, no. I went down like a few weeks before.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I said to him, what was it like when that, when that, you know, when he does that second or even third heli loop, it just keeps getting lifted up. I said, how are you feeling? I love his honesty. He goes, mate, I was shitting myself.

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Yeah, he did that to me the other day. It was a bit of a crazy gust. It was my first time down there this year and blimey, it's a tactic.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

What's your goals for racing then going forward? Are you going to do winging as well or just concentrate on the Olympic class?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Yeah, mainly focusing on the Olympic class. I'm doing a. Well, I'm hardly. I'm probably doing more twin tipping than I am winging, but I'm still keeping a little bit of winging every now and again. And then my goal for next year is to come do a little bit of a Europe trip maybe and then see if I can push into the Gold fleet.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Cool. And what about any big air? Is that something that you're interested in? I mean, because, you know, going back two years, Hugo was in the same position as you. Right. He was sort of, you know, didn't know whether he wanted to do Kite 4 racing, but, you know, he's fallen to big air and done super well. Are you looking to do the same or just going to cut your own path as, as someone else, as an individual, you know?

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Yeah, I think I should keep up the big ear as well. There's a nice scene here, like with my brother as well, to push me, but on the racing at the moment, just taking my own path.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Toby, unbelievable effort, man. I mean, you and the Wiggles, you and your brother have dominated this world. It's so cool to see and I'm loving that, you know, you guys are pushing forward and doing it things your own way. But Mike, thanks again for your time and yeah, maybe I'll see you in Cape Town if you come down this year.

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Yeah, yeah, we'll see, we'll see.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

This is Maxwell Dahl and he won the highest jump in the junior division at this year's WU Worlds. Max, how are you doing, my man?

[Maxwell Dahl]

I'm doing great. What about you?

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I'm doing good, man. A lot of people don't know, but I've known Max for a number of years. You're only 15 years old. You're definitely a name for the future. I'm sick of talking about you on this podcast. And you've gone and won the Woo world's highest jump for the juniors. That must have been pretty awesome.

[Maxwell Dahl]

It was so fun. I was out there on my seven. It was like I couldn't hold it at all. It was nuking and I was out there with Clement and we were just going for jumps like all the time. Yeah, it was so fun.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

This happened actually during Cold Hawaii. Did it happen after the final or were you riding and getting the win while the guys were competing?

[Maxwell Dahl]

No, I think I was riding in the semi finals because when Clement got knocked out, he came down to ride with me and yeah, we're just riding down there and like we could see in the competition behind us and yeah, they were just going massive too. It was so fun.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

When was the big jump? Was that during that time or was it again? You went out after the finals and got it close to the pair because it looked like it was better kickers where the guys are riding, right?

[Maxwell Dahl]

No, no, it was during the camp and yeah, the kickers were pretty bad out there, but it worked.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

What place you in going into that? Because I think Ingemar was leading the junior division at that time.

[Maxwell Dahl]

Oh, I was on like sixth place because I have. I haven't been riding because I had an injury. So yeah, this is like my second Time on the water after my injury.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Wow. And do you know Ingama?

[Maxwell Dahl]

No.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

He was probably thinking that I've got this new, brand new Core XR8. I've got this new sensor bar, and then here you come in and destroy it. I mean, 30.8, dude. Did it. Did it feel big?

[Maxwell Dahl]

It felt bigger than the other ones for sure.

[Evan Klein]

Yeah.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

What gear were you on? Which. Which north setup? Because I know you're part of the north team.

[Maxwell Dahl]

Yeah, yeah. I was on the Orbit 2026, the standard version and the Pro bar.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I think that standard is now the former old pro. Right. Is that how it works?

[Maxwell Dahl]

Yeah, yeah, that's how it works. I feel they've made a big improvement with like hang time, but it can still loop fast. It's so. It's so good.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

How many heli loops, man? How many heli loops from 30.8 meters, do you know?

[Maxwell Dahl]

Oh, I don't know. I think like two or three.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Two or three? I love it.

[Jason Montreal]

Yeah.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

What are you going to do with this new Core XR8 and the new Sensor 4 bar?

[Maxwell Dahl]

I mean, there's only one thing I can do. Sell it.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Maybe you can sell it to someone in. In wicker.

[Maxwell Dahl]

Oh, yeah, I should do that.

[Evan Klein]

Yeah, yeah.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Tell. Tell us a little bit about wicker and. And what's it like to study in a school that gets to travel around the world? And you guys have just been up in Denmark. You've been up on that spot training. Yeah. What's it like to be involved in a school like that?

[Maxwell Dahl]

Oh, Wick is awesome. You just have school in the morning. You sit like on a bench or inside in the dining table of the place they rent. And then in the afternoon go kite for like two, three hours and. Yeah. And then later in the afternoon, you're smashed. It's so fun.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

What about homework?

[Maxwell Dahl]

Homework?

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

That's homework. I must admit though, all the students that I've met that have come through the world class kiteboarding academy are great kids. And you're the same. How often do you ride up in Novapore?

[Maxwell Dahl]

Oh, never. This was my first time in like two years.

[Toby Wigglesworth]

Two years.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

But you guys were just up there for world class, right, were you?

[Maxwell Dahl]

Yeah, yeah.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

And you just didn't have any wind?

[Maxwell Dahl]

No, we didn't. We didn't have any wind. They went out like three times, but I didn't go because I was injured. Yeah.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Coming back from injury and then doing 30.8 is pretty awesome. You must. Mate, you must have been pretty sore the next day after getting on the Water for so long.

[Maxwell Dahl]

Yeah, the shoulder was beat. Sure.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Are all the people in the world class kiteboarding academy competing in the WoO worlds at different levels? Do they talk about that in the school?

[Maxwell Dahl]

I mean, one of her teachers made like a wicker, what's it called, a wicket group. And like everyone with WOO joined that. So I say yes, we everyone competed in that team.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Max height and team total distance or just in the individual jumps mainly?

[Maxwell Dahl]

I don't know, just to do jumps. I don't think they're that competitive with it, mate.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

You can't beat the Wu Tang Clan, bro. I mean that. You're talking serious competitors. Well, Max, thank you very much, buddy. It's always great to catch up with you. Always enjoy having you on any experience. We've been involved. You've come on the, you come on boat trips to Egypt with us. I see you all around the world. You're definitely a name to remember, guys. And if you are around, you do see Max come up and say hello. He's a super cool guy. Max, congratulations on winning the Max fight in the junior division at WOO Worlds. Sell that, sell that kite for as much as you can to your, to your wicked classmates. And mate, congrats again, dude.

[Maxwell Dahl]

Yeah, thanks.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Next up is Ella Geiger, who won the woman's one hour distance with 49.4 kilometers. Ella, congratulations on winning the woo one hour distance challenge for women. Yeah, amazing effort. How did you do that? After coming off the World champs, you must have been absolutely tired.

[Ella Geiger]

Yeah, it was pretty tiring to come straight off the Worlds, but I saw there was one day left and I really wanted to just go for it. So it was pretty good fun.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Before we get into it, let's talk about the world's 16th in gold fleet there. I mean, were you happy with that? Is that something you've been working towards? The UK have always had really strong women. Are you looking to push into that sort of top group of the UK girls now?

[Ella Geiger]

Yeah, definitely. Yeah. I just want to keep pushing and see how well I can do it.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

How motivating was it to watch Ellie win the gold medal last year or two years ago now? Was that cool?

[Ella Geiger]

Yeah, that was super cool.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I hope we're gonna see some more footage next time. We just didn't see enough.

[Ella Geiger]

Oh, I know. I hope they get the drones out. Yeah, it's such a cool thing to watch.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Absolutely. Well, let's talk about this attempt. 49.4 kilometers. You took first place. Where did you do it? Did you plan this? What was the sort of strategy going into this one hour challenge.

[Ella Geiger]

It wasn't really planned. The night before I heard you didn't actually have to have a woo to do it. So I just used my phone and the next day I went out and just did a load of reaching for an hour. I did it in Poolland harbour.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Oh really? So how many texts did you think you did?

[Ella Geiger]

4. I think it actually told me I did 36 or something like that because.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I just was speaking to Toby and Toby did it. He only did 16 texts. Right. So he went. I mean he went miles and miles out of the city. If you went to go and do it again, would you do it differently?

[Ella Geiger]

Yeah, absolutely. I would go for a downwind run next time. Yeah, yeah, I think I could go quite a bit further.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Can or is a single tack even possible? Toby was telling me he can do a single tack for an hour. I think that's. That would just be a killer on the legs, right?

[Ella Geiger]

Yeah, I mean my legs were sore after 10 minutes.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Well, I tell you what, you did really good. I scrolled to the bottom of the list and far, far down. Someone called Be a Map did 439 meters. So you did a lot better than them. How was the win that day?

[Ella Geiger]

Well, I did the kite one and the wing one on the same day. So when I was kiting it was like pretty good wind. I was quite powered on the 15 and then it dropped for when I did the wing one so that was quite a bit harder.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

And what gear were you riding? What, what kite? What and what foil?

[Ella Geiger]

Just the race setup. So The Flight Surfer VMG3 and the Chibanga foil.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Was there a lot of chat at the 14 championships about the Worlds? Because in the past Yanis Mouse, Ricardo Panosi have sort of. It's all always been about the same time. They've always come late to the piece and. And taken gold. Where their girls talking about going for this record?

[Ella Geiger]

No, I didn't really hear much chat about it. I think the main focus was just.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

On the Worlds and Nations Cup. Unfortunately in the last weekend, the uk, I think they're in. I think they're in second at stage going into three days out and actually got picked by two teams and basically done them foils. Of all the things you did such a good effort. But then we had all these big foil races. Justina and Toby and New Zealand went down and put these big efforts in. Yeah.

[Ella Geiger]

Oh well next year do you think.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Is there someone sort of leading the UK team and making sure people are doing stuff or is it just people just posting scores and it's sort of a maybe a bit rudderless? Would that be fair to say?

[Ella Geiger]

I haven't heard too much to be fair, but I think next year if we get a group going, then we could definitely be on the podium.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Maybe you should do that, Ella. I mean the UK has got a massive kite surfing scene, a huge foiling scene, huge winging scene. I've met a bunch of those guys up there. Francesca, Maney's bus tour, they're all into foiling, all into winging. I think you guys should be up there on the podium.

[Ella Geiger]

Yeah, I think this is definitely a job for next year.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Have you come from kite surfing yourself or have you come from sailing?

[Ella Geiger]

No, I've just come from kite surfing.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Because I remember speaking to that sort of Olympic cycle before and a lot of those girls had come from other sports and other disciplines. Right. And hadn't really kited for before. Is it, are more people in the UK coming from kite surfing and getting into the racing now?

[Ella Geiger]

Yeah, I think there's quite a mix. Like a lot of people have transitioned from other boats, but there are a few people that have just come from kitening.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Is it confirmed for the next Olympics? I mean, we never really know what's going on. 100% confirmed.

[Ella Geiger]

Yeah. 100%. It'll be in LA because I kind.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Of feel that the IOC didn't really realize what they had, you know, been able to go out in 5 knots and being able to sort of compete when other boats don't want to. And I, I kind of think they slipped up on this last year and we never saw the best of the foiling.

[Ella Geiger]

Yeah, I think it was a bit of a shame how they presented it, like maybe the lack of presentation, but no, it's so uncertain what will happen.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

If winging takes over. I'm going to be devastated.

[Ella Geiger]

Oh, I'm gonna be so sad as well.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Well, look, Ella, congratulations on winning the Woo 1 hour distance challenge for, for females. Amazing effort. I hope next year you guys and as a UK nations cup team can, can get back on that podium because you know, the top teams of Netherlands, New Zealand, Australia, they're really pushing as a country. I hope you guys can do the same. Congratulations on your, your foil World Championship and yeah, good luck for the future.

[Ella Geiger]

Ah, thank you so much.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Let's hear from Jason Montreal, who is the team leader of Flying Kiwis and the spiritual leader of the nation's cup for New Zealand. Jason Montreal, 10.6 meters behind the Netherlands. That Must annoy you because it was.

[Jason Montreal]

So close, very close. To be honest, until the last weekend, we didn't even think we were in with a chance. So if it wasn't for Clarkey having the jump of his life and the young foil racers doing their thing, yeah, we would have been a lot further down the list, let's put it that way.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

When was the decision to go to Plymouth and made was that just like, hey, there's a storm guys, let's just go for it and see what we can do?

[Jason Montreal]

Well, Hugo and his dad had actually planned to go and spend the week there because he's obviously training for the bigger competitions coming up this year and the rest of us didn't really have any plans to go down there. We literally just decided the day before. I think we saw a good forecast and I was unavailable to go down on the actual day. The guys all ended up having their big jumps because of a family event. It was actually my nephew's fourth birthday, so, mate, you're a good uncle. I got a high five out of it and that was all I, all I contributed to the event. But yeah, I just went down there because I actually had some kites to test. So I've got this really fun new brainchild bandit that I am working on a review for right now. And because there is no. Basically the two reasons I go to Wellington are woo Worlds or testing kites. So it actually looked like a weekend of 9 meter. It didn't look like a weekend of absolutely sending it. So I did actually get some time on that kite, but I had to drive up the coast an hour and a half to get less wind to do it, which is pretty funny.

[Maxwell Dahl]

Yeah.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Looking back at the results now, can you see where you can improve for next year? I mean, you know, obviously, you know, the wing, the woman's wing, was probably an area, let's be honest. Have you got a plan to improve on, on those areas for next year? Because it's kind of crazy, right? I was saying in the podcast, you know, the other day, is that New Zealand, even though it has a kite surfing culture, it's not like South Africa or Holland by any means.

[Jason Montreal]

Yeah, we kind of scrape by the skin of our teeth each year. We, we basically got maybe 10 to 15 guys who can consistently jump over 20 meters. There's maybe two guys who can consistently jump over 25 meters called Hugo and Mark. And then the rest of us kind of have to hope for an absolute storm in the jumps of our lives to really to put our team in contention. So each year we never, we never expect to do particularly well and you know, we just basically take what we can get out of it. Obviously the Wigglesworth family is, you know, the absolute star of Woo Worlds the last two years in a row. So they single handedly propel New Zealand to glory and unfortunately Toby I think is leaving the juniors. So that's a huge, you know, smack of points we're going to be missing out on next year. So hopefully we'll find some new young person and maybe we'll get lucky and find some new ladies who really want to get into winging and you know, chasing those big storms for the stand in Plumberton. But, you know, we'll always go for it. We're, you know, like those crazy Germans and the older teams we, you know, always give it a go.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I mean, let's shout out to Toby. I mean, incredible effort. I think he keeps his brother honest too. Right. And he's going to start keeping Hugo honest because I mean, I was looking at the track, I mean the guy went halfway to the Coromandel. If you know Auckland, the Coromandel looks very, very far away. But I mean amazing effort from him.

[Jason Montreal]

It is unbelievable that not only he did it on the last day but what he put in to actually go and do it. And I think his brother actually Hugo ended up getting him on the winging distance too. I think they were 1 and 2 in winging, which I didn't even realize until they were teasing each other at. We had our catch up Post Woo World catch up for the New Zealand Kiters and they were joking about it and I was like, oh, I didn't even mention you guys in the. Because I do a little weekly wrap up for all the Kiwis of who got new PBS for when I mean all the Kiwis, I don't mean our team, I mean every kite surfer in New Zealand. I scroll through WOO each week and give everybody a little shout out if you got a new PB or if you had a big crash or you, you know, you set a new. Even if you just did a cool session photo, I give away bar tabs and stuff like that for it. So we really make quite a community thing out of it here.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Yeah, let's talk about that little community. I know you do a Post Woo Worlds party. I believe you do one before the Woo Worlds. How does that work? And is that just to keep everyone focused? Is it just sort of keeping the community together?

[Jason Montreal]

Literally the only times like every. Everybody in the kites river community has the friends that they message when it's time to kite. Some of us are friends like outside of kiting. Like I play disc golf with a bunch of the guys sometimes we'll have a go out for dinner. But the bulk of the community which is really only like 40 or 50 people in Auckland who do big air, we just kind of see each other at the beach. We usually see each other in our wetsuits and we don't really socialize. So this just, I think I did the first one three or four years ago. I just thought, oh, there's a good excuse for everyone to actually hang out outside of a windy beach. So that's where it started and each year I've just kept on doing it.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Let's go back to one of the big winners in the New Zealand group which is Clark. I mean incredible. I mean that's the jump of his life, mate. And by the way, the video footage of just crazy, right? The, the updrafts you get on those heloops is just incredible.

[Jason Montreal]

It is one of the best jumping clips I have ever seen regardless of level regard. Like first of all it so beautifully showcases why you can set the world record there. Like those, the updrafts, the consistent, you know, each time he does a heli gets lifted a little bit higher. The fact that he broke his PB by almost 4 meters. Yeah it's, it's a beautiful video just to showcase the spot. So anyone hasn't. Check it out, check it out. I think Woo's posted it but also just for Clarky as well. He's been. Two years ago when I got my pb he also got his PB and he's been chasing it ever since. And he's like, he's regularly chatting with the guys. Oh, do you think I should go from 22s to 23 meter lines or. Oh, I just won this new board for Duotone. You think this one will jump higher? Like he is absolutely frothing to get that record. So I don't know what he's going to do now that he's done 28. But hey he's, he's just off 30 so I mean maybe next year that'll be the goal because dude that I.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Think that second heliluk when he just gets picked up again, I mean you kind of start thinking am I going to run out of beach here? I mean on the way the video or the way those videos look, it looks like I know the bay is a lot bigger than it looks by, but the way those videos are shot, it almost looks like he's going to run out of beach, you know, Sorry. Run out of water.

[Jason Montreal]

Yeah, it's. It's crazy, the. Just constant lifts. Luckily, yeah, where he is, he's probably got another 3, 400 meters of downwind travel. He'd have to be Hugo to travel right into the Mana area of Puerto Rua. But, yeah, it's a great video and, yeah, hopefully a few more riders see it and they want to venture down here that time of year to try to chase it.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I know the Aussies have always reached out to me and I think I've, you know, spoken to you about that, saying, hey, reach out to these guys. They're always talking about coming and doing a mission to Plymouth. And the problem is, it's just if you're not in Australia, it's just so far away from everyone else to try and go. Do you think if you could get a big storm and get sort of the 10 of the top guys down there, you know, that that record would be broken again?

[Jason Montreal]

So it's also a spot where, like, you got to be lucky like, that particular day. If you look at the rest of Clarkey's jumps, I think his next highest was 21, and his next highest after that was maybe 15 or 16. So it's not just guaranteed that you're going to get those updrafts. Like, I was out the day before testing nines, and every jump was like 13 to 15. And on one of the last jumps of the session, I was about to pull a loop, and just as I was about to pull the bar, I got one of those crazy gusts and went from about 12 to 22 meters. Luckily, I didn't pull the trigger on it or I would have gone full. Full jetto through the bay. But just because you're down there doesn't mean you're gonna get it, you know, Hugo was also doing everything in God's creation. Obviously, Hugo can consistently jump high no matter what, but he was. He was out on his foil kite. He was out on his foil board. He was out on his 7. I think he was out on his 8 like he was, and he was consistently jumping 25 to 27, but he was jumping it based on skill. He did not catch a single, I think, updraft, like a. Like a nuclear updraft in five hours of kiting that day. So it's very like, if you could imagine if he's already jumping 29 meters on a foil board with a 7 meter ERA. If he had to hit the same gust that Clarky hits, that could have been the world record. So it's one thing like if you can get to. Basically if you can already jump 15 to 20 meters and you catch one of those crazy lifts, you can probably jump 25. But if you can already jump 25 to 30 and you catch one of those crazy lists, all of a sudden you're knocking on the door.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I mean it's all about keeping it together. Right. When you get that lift that you said, a jump 12, it lifts you up to 22. I mean there's at some stage you've got to keep your together. Right? That's the, that's. It's all about.

[Jason Montreal]

Yeah, yeah. And then you got to know what to do with it. To get back down safely is obviously a huge factor.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I mean, how much of a loss was Marc Jacobs for you guys in this comp? I mean I kind of feel like this. I, when I look at, when I compare the Netherlands to you and then even South Africa, I think there's just so many what ifs here that you could have pushed through it and won that as well. I mean, I know that the Netherlands had huge. Their top three boy scores were massive. Even their, even their junior score was massive. Right. But I, I think they lacked in every, almost every other department, you guys beat them.

[Jason Montreal]

Yeah. So we actually obviously had this chat as well, like kind of ribbing Mark on a bit. I think he came down with us the first time we went down when I got. And like I mentioned, you also got to kind of be on the water at the right time. So the first time we went down in the month, I, I ended up with 24. One of the other guys, Mark Harrison, who's consistently jumping, you know, mid-20s, he got a PB of 28 as well. And I think Mark hit 28 or 29 on Surfer, so he probably would have been on into the 30s on the woo. So if you factor in maybe mark's getting a 31, it would have possibly added 17 meters onto my 24. So we still would have been just behind them. We still would have, you know. Yeah, yeah. Unfortunately our, our ladies, our biggest lady jumper who's sort of in that kind of 12 to 15 meter inch, he was on holiday over it. So we probably missed out on maybe four or five there. So we, you know, we could have been knocking on the door. But you know, that's what makes it interesting. Everybody like the Netherlands are obviously have some, the best big Air pros in the world, but maybe they don't have the same foil racers committed to it. So you know, how cool is this.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Nation'S cup for you guys in New Zealand? I mean you guys have embraced this. I mean we, you know, my team is all about the, the team events, but I kind of feel like you and the South Africans have embraced this the most and, and have better strategies and plan for this. I mean I think it's the best event in the whole of Woo worlds.

[Jason Montreal]

We, we certainly like it because obviously it has so many different things. And the reality is when it comes to New Zealand and Kading, the most jumps height and the longest distance is just not really possible because we're so tidal. You obviously know New Zealand, but for other people to get an idea, unless we have a perfect mirror wide day where it blows all day, which is maybe five, ten times a year, if we go kiting at a lot of the local places, we've got about two hours before there's no water. So we'd literally have to kite at one spot, drive to another spot, kite for two hours, then drive to another spot. You don't have to do that six times over the course of a day to get 10 hours of kiting. And it's just, yeah, those other, those other weekend disciplines aren't good for us. But that's what's great about the whole month is, you know, it gives other countries that have better conditions for it. I'm surprised. Like I would have thought places like, you know, Brazil would have been really good for that. Or Sherman island like in California. I know when I was last there, it starts blowing at 6am and it blows all afternoon. So they could, they could put up serious distance on the foils if they were more interested in it.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

The problem with those team challenges, you just got to have people who want to put themselves in serious pain. I know guys, you know, people listen. You know, you see Timo Martin posting all this stuff. These people are not normal. You know, these guys are not normal people. To, to want to spend 10, 12 hours on the water every day, midnight, it's, it's kind of crazy. Well, anyway, Jason. Hey mate. Congratulations to, to you and the New Zealand team. You guys have done unbelievable second place and I, I think this is going to be a cool battle every year to see what you can do. I know that DK and the South Africans are always looking at strategies and how to improve and I know you do the same. But mate, thanks for your time and congratulations again.

[Jason Montreal]

Thank you so Much Great to chat to you as always, Adrian.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Lastly, let's hear from Evan Klein who is part of the winning Dutch team in the nations cup and also part of the winning team with Kypemarnagar. Let's give my old mate Evan Klein a call. He actually knows I'm going to call him, so it's not going to be too much of a surprise. But let's talk the Netherlands and all the stuff he's doing around the Woo Worlds, which is super cool.

[Evan Klein]

Hello, Evan.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

What's happening my man?

[Evan Klein]

What's good? What's good? I'm here in the lovely, not so cold, but rainy Netherlands.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Where are you off to? You're in the car, huh? Where are you going?

[Evan Klein]

I'm going to Noordak and then tomorrow.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Did you say you're traveling tomorrow? Are you off on another trip?

[Evan Klein]

Tomorrow morning at dawn. I thought I shouldn't. Amsterdam. And after that I will be going back in the car to Frischland where I live.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

So busy.

[Evan Klein]

Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Let me ask you a serious question. Do the Dutch actually care about the Nations Cup? It seems to me when I look at the results, they, they backed it up with big jumps, but then in pretty much in every other area they sort of didn't do super well.

[Evan Klein]

I mean, that's a good question. I think the Dutch just care about going big.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Yeah, true.

[Evan Klein]

Yeah, yeah. But no, they. We had a really good session at the start of the Woo world and that just solidified the leaderboard. So. And yeah, of course not to forget, Jamie and Martha did a major contribution to the team as well later on in the Woo world. So I think that was the main reason that we got such major results.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Who is this guy? INGAMAR WORDMAN, the junior 29.9 end up getting second getting put by Maxwell Dahl. But this is a name I haven't heard before. Do you know anything about this kid?

[Evan Klein]

No, no, I haven't heard of him before. I called on a leaderboard too and yeah, pretty, pretty insane results for him.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

But this is kind of cool. This is what makes the Nations Cup, I think special because all these people come out of the woodwork and you get these sort of, you know, results that sort of, you know, contribute to that when. I mean, I'd like to find out more about this kit as well. I know that you tried a 24 hour foil, but did you, did you have a go at doing the men's distance in one hour?

[Evan Klein]

Yes, yes, I, that was actually a pretty challenging challenge. Like the first time I did It, I recorded it wrong, unfortunately. So I needed to go again. And the second time the wind was not too strong. So with the foil you need actually a lot of power to go quick. So the wind was light, so I really needed to work the foil really hard to gain a little bit of speed. So, yeah, I didn't get the results I hoped for. But yeah, I think as a big air rider, you know, kite surfing is such a so many disciplines and foiling is just something different. You can more like, compared to sailing than kite surfing because it's so technical and so many different aspects into play. Yeah, it really opened my eyes.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

About a couple months ago, you tried to do 24 hours foiling. What happened about that? I mean, I know that you put out the video, but what actually happened? Why did you end up failing that attempt? Because I like the fact that you're going to do different types of stuff in kiteboarding. You were just talking about falling then and, you know, you're a former competition rider but now doing more media content. What happened in that 24 hour challenge?

[Evan Klein]

A little bit of a funny backstory now. Before we got into that project, we did the storm chase Iceland, which we waited six weeks for storm to come. And then after that I was like, okay, what can we do now? Because it's summer, you know, And I was like, hey, why not push the foil? So I was like, this is going to be an easy project, you know, because we don't need a nuke and you can win and I could just do easy training, etc. Etc. And this is the most hard thing I've probably encountered in my life. The reason for it is that you think like, oh, let's go sky surf for 24 hours, you know, but then with rescue comes into play, the wind, very specific wind directions and wind strengths come into play again. And yeah, we managed to work it through. But in the meantime, there was a bigger problem coming up, which was my ears. I sort of got titanized from the challenge. I think it's curable. I'm still working with it. So I always had a pretty big neck from big air and stuff and crashes and stuff. So there was a lot of tension in my neck and especially also on my jaw where the jaw and the neck muscle connect to each other. So this basically caused like 80% of the tinitis. So, yeah, I got it checked out and still going through therapy to get rid of it, but at one point it was pretty hectic.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

And is that just a constant ringing in your ears? Is that what you're experiencing.

[Evan Klein]

Yes, yes. The ringing in the ear were pretty. Yeah, hectic. Like, I wouldn't, like, wish this on anyone. It's like really, really. Yeah. Really intense. And the thing is with it is that it just doesn't go away. So even if you want to be sort of in a peaceful place, you just like, you know, how did the.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Foil set that off? Was it. Was it just the whistling of the foil, you think?

[Evan Klein]

No, I thought it was first the vibration. Like, I still want to speak to some people who have a lot more knowledge about vibrations and hydrodynamic current than me. But also with the foil, you're constantly, of course, stabilizing yourself, you know, so when you stabilize, when you. When you're stabilizing, you also do this with your neck a bit and with your back. So I think with me, there was just this constant pressure on those muscle groups that are around the air and around the jaw that triggered the titanitis.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Forget about those long falling next year. You know, you got to get those Dutch guys focusing on the wing because that wing height in the men's and women's man almost cost you guys in the end.

[Evan Klein]

Yeah, yeah, the winging. I was. I was even considering jumping on the wing myself. Like, I can barely wing. I could maybe rock out a few jumps, but nothing serious. You know, take it for the team, take it for a nation.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

And obviously, you know, kite mana went on one team Max Height. Interesting though, beating South Africa and Kiwi teams. It's almost like you three were on Team Max Height. And also the guys who sort of pushed the nations cup, which is super cool. I feel like the Netherlands sort of needs more of a leader to get people in action because, you know, New Zealand, Jason, Montreal is doing it in South Africa. DK sort of pushing them along. I feel like the Netherlands just winning, but they're sort of a bit rudderless. And I think if you have someone like you mate, you. You can. You guys could even do better.

[Evan Klein]

Yes, yes, yes, Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, everybody has their own schedule, you know, so it's always even. We dedicate our lives to kite surfing. It can be a challenge to. Yeah. Be on the water at certain times, but it's definitely the most fun to be in the water with your friends and just crack out the best boost you can and make it happen. Yeah. And I think we were just very early with constructing a good team, which made our team good. So there was a little bit of secret behind it on sort of how we got those. Yeah, we won the challenge. And of course, not to forget, we had two major storms hitting the land. Although I need to say I was considering going to call the white for a world record attempt. I was chatting with Martin about it as well, but it was just. Yeah, we were like, nah, it's not going to be over easily over 50 knots, so it's not going to be worth it. And then I was just checking social media and then I see all these riders boosting out insane 30 meter jumps and I was like, oh, no way.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Have you ever thought about going to Plimmerton in New Zealand as where, you know, where all those big jumps are done? New Zealand, it's. I know it's a. By the way, it's on the other side of the world and there's, you know, it's run on storms as well. Have you actually thought about doing some long distance sort of storm chases and going to the other side of the world and looking for different locations?

[Evan Klein]

Yes, yes. Like New Zealand is an interesting one because if you would go on the other side of the world, let's say the south side of the world, Chile, you see that. South Africa, Australia, you know, a lot of these countries that have a lot of wind are so remote that it's sort of. Yeah, it's too dangerous to simply go out there and have the storm down with no resources around. But New Zealand has definitely been on my list. It's just difficult to sort of plan it out because, yeah, you cannot plan it and go there if the fold off lines off because the travel is simply too long. So then the other thing you need to do is go there for six weeks and then just hope for a storm.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

I mean, it's crazy. I was watching Clark Robinson, you know, the guy who won the senior 28.1. I think he's done two or three, two or three heli loops and the second heli loop even takes him even higher again, which is so crazy. On the video it looks like he's going straight at the land, but actually there's like 3 or 400 meters more water to the south. You sort of can't see. But yeah, it looks like a crazy spot. I mean, Hugo's doing, you know, 29.5 on his foil there and you know, so, yeah, I think that's a spot that's been, it's been cashed in. But I think it'd be super cool to see a whole lot of top guys from Europe to come down there one day and just. And go for it, you know?

[Evan Klein]

Yeah, yeah, definitely. Need to get more. But yeah, New Zealand is just for everybody. So far away.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Tell me about it, bro. Tell me about it.

[Evan Klein]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

All right, Evan, thanks for taking time to make this call, bro. I know you've been super busy, man. Good luck on all your trips and congratulations to you and the guys in Netherlands again, mate. Out shout showing the way, which is awesome. Thanks and more. See you in Cape Town, bro.

[Evan Klein]

Yeah, thank you man. Looking forward to seeing you in person and thanks for having me.

[Adrian (Podcast Host)]

Hey guys, I hope you enjoyed that episode. Don't forget, if you want to support the show, the easiest way is to do it for free. Rate us on Spotify. I'm loving those five star reviews. Keep them coming, share them in your local WhatsApp or kite surfing groups, or simply tell your mates. If you want to support us more regularly, head over to portraitkite.com and check out all the madness there. Portrait is an independent media company and we're trying to tell the stories of kiteboarding the way we believe they should be told. These projects are funded by people just like you, and if you believe in what we do and want to support us, head over to portraitkite.com and on this Thursday's episode, Colin and I are going to be talking about Zip, the latest multilevel release from Portrait. And we're going to talk about this week's episode. And don't forget, guys, the podcast will always be free. If you want to find more episodes just like this one, use the search [e-mail] to search your favorite writer or topic and we'll see you this Thursday for the Megapod.