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- [00:01]
A
Welcome to the kitesurf 365 podcast. Welcome back to the show. I hope you all had a great weekend. Today I'm joined by Lewis Krathen. This is probably one of my most favorite podcasts I've ever done. We talk about the mindset it takes to do stunts like Andrea's jump. We talk about joining Harlem, some of the new roles he's taking with the brand. We also talk about Lou's transition from kiteboarding to broadcasting. You guys are going to enjoy this episode. Don't forget to follow me at Kite Surf365 for all the latest episodes. Ladies and gentlemen, Lewis Krathan. Lewis, welcome back to the show. It's been a few years since you've been on, I think.
- [00:46]
B
How many years? Like, five, six? It's been ages. Yeah. Thank you.
- [00:49]
A
I think in Covid, I think we spoke around. I mean, I see you at every stop around the world. It's not like I haven't seen you in a long time, but. Yeah, I was just trying to think the last time you had you on, it was. It's definitely been some years.
- [00:59]
B
Yeah. Well, it's nice to come back and tell you a bit about what my journey is involved and what I'm into, and definitely to cover some bits about these latest stunts. You know, it's a big part of me that wants to talk about that.
- [01:11]
A
Yeah, let's talk about that. A few weeks ago, we were on the podcast talking about Andrea's jump, and, you know, I think Colin and I were talking about our favorite jumps. I mentioned Nick's jump and he mentioned your jump over the Brighton Pier. And I think, in retrospect, I think I like those jumps because of the lack of safety, if that makes sense. It was great to hear from you. After. I'd like to ask you about Andrea's mindset to do a jump like that, considering that maybe he was under contract to do it versus you and Nick wanting to do it. Is there something in that?
- [01:41]
B
Well, I mean, I have to start before I go into any of that by sort of saying, first and foremost that, you know, I respect anybody that does anything like this. I have my own beliefs about what I like, like we all do. But anyone that has gone to that place in their mind where really only a select few of kite borders have gone there, know what it's about. When your life is on the line like that. The thought process and the journey that you go on is. Is. Is unbelievable. What that does in your mind is. And it's personal. And it's very isolated. It might not seem that way, but it is actually all down to you. And when you get to that actual point where you have to do something, you know, where it's life and death, it's. It's unbelievable what that can do to you. So I respect that. But I, for me definitely think there's a difference between climbing up and jumping over. That's how I've always, I've always had this thing of my head about earning your altitude. Does that make.
- [02:40]
A
Yeah, I like that.
- [02:42]
B
I like things to be sustainable and we go up off our own. You know, it's kite surfing and we're wind powered and all that sort of thing. But you also can't, you know, when I think about what, you know, Nick probably wasn't going to climb up that massive tower, you know, out there with his kite. And so sometimes the creativity means you need another way to get up there. Take what you said about Andrea, but you know, what he must have gone through out there with it. Sounds like some pressures on him from his sponsors, is that right?
- [03:14]
A
I'm guessing. Right. I mean, I've reached out to Andre, I've spoke to Sergio, I've spoke to the people at Red Bull and they, well, they're not prepared to talk about that jump at the moment just because of what's happening in the Middle east. And I guess they don't feel like it's the right time. But I would. Interestingly, you probably heard in the podcast, I'd heard about that jump a few years ago. I heard that original Yannick was going to do it. And at the time, Janik was kind of a bit skeptical about. Yannick ended up then sort of retiring from kite boarding or whatever he said and, and moving on from Red Bull. So when I saw Andre standing looking at that picture, I thought, well, wow, this is something that they want to do.
- [03:46]
B
Yeah, well, and that's, that's really interesting to me because I always feel, and I've experienced this myself, is that to be successful with something like this, they have to become 100% personal. So if you've got any other reason to do it, which sounds like maybe Andrea has, again, we're just talking, but if there's external pressure or reason, it can become very dangerous because you start to ask questions. Why am I doubt could creep in? Am I doing this because I truly want to? For me, it was so personal. And we'll get to talk about that. There's a number of reasons for that. I mean, I didn't have that extra pressure of social media, which wasn't really a thing or going viral wasn't a thing. And we'll talk a bit about that with the pressures on young people and the psych. Psychological impacts of that as we go on. But it sounds like Andrea may have had exterior external pressure, but I'm sure that he made that personal because that's the only way to really get through all of that noise and that you have to make it personal. I mean, look what, what Nick done on them boats, you know, out in Cape Town. I actually, I. I would rather jump here 10 times in Brighton than do that. I don't want to be. I'm really scared near objects. I'll be honest with you. I've trained. Is that not what we were trained to do? Sky surfers don't go near objects. I mean, your instructor should have said, don't get comfortable. I am even doing a foot plant on a tree or a stump. No thanks. Get away from that. Get over it and be safe. So definitely what Nick done with him boats and just how comfortable he was is something I've always really admired. And the fact obviously he had to do it twice, which is another story. But, you know, it's. I look at that and think, how can you be that comfortable up a rusty, rusty old boat? I think, I think that was wonderful.
- [05:37]
A
It's funny, Lou, when you talk about that, because when I show that to people and I generally shot to people who probably don't really have the reference of kite surfing. And I say to them, do you know how much control it takes to A, climb and B, fly that kite next to that rusty infrastructure and be in complete control? It's crazy.
- [05:56]
B
It's, it's. I mean, the, the risk factor there with your line snagging on and all of that. It's like, you know, and that is what it was. I'm all about things that are pure. For me, that was a total pure moment for Nick. That boat wasn't going to be there forever. And I'm sure that that wore him down where he thought, this is my opportunity. And he got sucked into it, that personal journey. And I think it is wonderful what he done that, that day.
- [06:26]
A
I mean, you can go back and look, listen to Nick on the podcast talking about that made his career. It sort of kicked him off. And I guess it goes to the next point. Do young people do this thinking that's going to make their career? Is that a valid way to create, have a career in kiteboarding?
- [06:42]
B
I thought about this A lot of times now, Adrian, and certainly my worries for the, for the younger generation is that the psychological pressure on them from social media and potentially that quick reward by becoming viral can really sort of obstruct the true purpose of doing something like that, you know, and that is obviously today and where we are. But I had none of that pressure when I done what I'd done. And I think that that would have played a big part on me if I had all those external factors, you know, like, I. I really don't like the idea of being compared with our social media numbers, which I have been with previous sponsors on leaderboards. How do you rank each month? You know what, I'm the one pushing back on that, saying, well, what are the mental effects of doing this? Is that. Can we put some time into that? That isn't great. That is where you're sort of creating an environment for young people to start thinking, oh, hold on a minute. My nice trick where I learned doobie board off didn't get much attention, but someone just jumping off a side of a cliff, you know, like Edgar's jump lately, amazing jump, you know, has way more traction than you, you know, posting your latest trick. So I guess the question is, what responsibility do brands have, you know, in. In educating their young riders about the dangers of maybe going down these paths? And it's just. It is a whole gray area right now, Adrian, where I don't have the answer, but I can see the. The dangers. You know, I worry a bit.
- [08:18]
A
Interesting. You jumped that in a time that, like, Instagram wasn't really prominent back then. I can think of two times, Lou, that you've been on the national use, you know, you've been on that for the jump and when you did the Doobie Loop as well. Now we don't have the news. You know, people's Instagram is the news. People's mobile is their own little private TV station these days.
- [08:38]
B
Totally. You're exactly right. You know, the news is whatever you define it to be these days. The, the national news, they international news, maybe it's the time I come from is still the ultimate holy grail, where if you manage to get breakthrough into that world, which really doesn't know about kite surfing, you've made. I mean, you talk about the Doobie Loop. I couldn't believe it that they were mentioning the Doobie Loop without even thinking what that name entails on. On the national news. I was like, this is the best achievement of my whole life. I got them to say that, you know, but you're right, the news is however you define it. But maybe it's part of my time that I still. When you see it on that national news, you're like, wow, you've broke through. It's the confirmation that you've broke through to, you know, that. That whole world that maybe, you know, the mainstream audience, which for me has always been a bit of a goal with those things.
- [09:32]
A
I mean, what advice would you give to young people who are looking to make that step up? Because the writers are getting younger and younger now. You know, let's say they're getting to that professional area without the actual maturity to maybe know how to handle that pressure. And we've seen. We've seen writers in recent years who have not handled that well and had to take a break and sort of come back and sort of like the second coming of that rider. What advice would you give to people?
- [09:56]
B
I would say, like I mentioned earlier, why are you doing it? You've got to think about the reasons that you're doing it, and you've got to make it personal. You know, if I was. If I was someone else and in my hometown, there was this big thing and everyone talked about it. I'm purely thinking of my own perspective here. That landmark Brighton Pier was, in my opinion, going to be jumped in my lifetime. It had to be me. I couldn't live with myself if it was someone else. I was there every day for a year that gave an opportunity for it. So I have to be honest, I would understand because I've been through that myself. But I would just definitely ask that person to think about why are they actually doing it? If I wouldn't have cared if there was no cameras around on that day, would you still do something if you didn't have cameras around? You know, there's a question to ask yourself. How much does it mean to you? You know, like, obviously you want to have it filmed because of the implications of the reward. And, you know, let's say all my filmmakers didn't film out that day. Of course I would have been guided, but I would have been able to live knowing I'd achieved that. I mean, that's how life was hundreds of years ago. How many things didn't happen back then? It's. It's a really interesting topic.
- [11:18]
A
Is that a generational thing?
- [11:20]
B
And.
- [11:20]
A
And, you know, I guess it's your word as well, right? If people. If you say, hey, jump the Brighton pair and nobody saw it, you know, people are going to say, did it really happen? And that's just the nature of the time we live in.
- [11:29]
B
Right.
- [11:29]
A
It's that classic saying, if a, if a tree falls in the, in the forest doesn't make a sound.
- [11:34]
B
Yeah. I mean, we could also point back to history where we think about, let's take the battle of 300. Was that just such an incredible moment that the story got passed on forever? Is it? How do we know that? Maybe, just maybe, the best things that happen are actually spoken about in a way that continues their legend or their story. But it's an interesting battle that you must go through as a, as a person, usually a young person. I mean, I'm 40 now. I was half this age when I, you know, almost half. I was actually 23, but I had no responsibilities, no children, no family, had nothing to lose. And I think those are the times that you're more likely to embrace a challenge that is basically life or death. These are life or death challenges.
- [12:23]
A
I mean, I don't want to keep dwelling on this jump because we, you know, you and I have spoke about Agnosium and I always tell people, I think you said to me you rode back and forward for, I think, 45 minutes, waiting for that perfect opportunity to jump. I, I believe that was correct on a very, very old deliminating board. The thing is, now I think that, I do think that people like the Stigs, I think they're a lot more careful in their approach to stuff. Like, you know, if you speak to like even like yourself or Stig or, or Nick, they always say, look, they've thought of everything. But when I look at Andre's jump, like he had a parachute. He was there with a very professional team. Opposed to Nick climbing up, you know, the crane with a Carluccio's, you know, sandwich, stuff down, stuff down, his wetsuit, you know,
- [13:11]
B
nothing wind you up more as a professional athlete than when people call you reckless and you don't think about things, you know, like, that is something I'm sure the others have been called as well. And you think, come on, I couldn't have. I couldn't have, you know, made this safer. You know, that's the way you are in the first place to get to where you've got. And also the hypocrisy around people throwing your dangerous, your risky at you is unbelievable. They're getting in a car every day of their lives, probably, or trains or planes, all these things crashes and people get hurt all the time, you know, whereas probably with kite surfing and stunts. If you could give me a percentage of people that have actually slammed into things and messed it up. It's probably quite statistically safe to do. I mean, don't quote me on that, but, you know, people take risks in life every day. And you know, what, what happened to this way of thinking where someone getting in a boat hundreds of thousands of years ago and going all around the world to discover new places? That wasn't reckless back then. That was like the stuff of legend. Christopher Columbus going, you do something like that, now, you're an idiot. Like, what were you thinking? Where was your. Where. Where was your safety? You know, we've definitely transitioned from this, from the human race, which was, you know, you know, the purpose of what we had to do was learn things. But there is a balance and I, and I appreciate that. You know, you've got to accept that side of it as well.
- [14:41]
A
Very rarely, Lewis, do I actually recommend a book to read on the show. Actually, it might be the first time I've ever recommended a book. But if anyone out there, including yourself, Lewis, you should read the book about Shackleton. The toughness of these people back in the day to, to go to Antarctica number one and, and then lose the boat in the ice and then come back in a dinghy is outrageous behavior. So maybe we've just got soft. We've got soft.
- [15:06]
B
Do you think also perhaps the sort of positivity surrounding people going to explore and do the change, maybe you could argue that might have helped them as well? Of course they were going. The risks were stacked against them. What was technology and things like that. But without this sort of like, you know. Yeah, and this is why you have to keep these things personal, which is hard to do when you're going to do something like Andrea just done, because you have to bring in other people to. You can't keep that a secret. You depend on other people, but that, you know, when you keep it personal, you don't have that noise. Had I told everyone all about my ideas of doing Brighton Pier, half or nearly all of them would have said, you crazy, you dangerous. And you start to listen to those voices. So, yeah, I will read that book. Adrian, thank you for that recommendation. I've just written it down. It'll be great to get an insight to the minds of people back then that I often think about. What were they thinking? I also want to add with Going for. I don't even like the word stunt. I've got to be. Be honest, a challenge if you like, that Andrea's just done and Nick has done and Lasse and A number of people that have done those things. The euphoric moment of achieving that challenge is so overwhelming that it can transform you in some ways, going through something like that. I mean, I cried. I could cry thinking about what I went through that day. It's such a moment, and it's so pure and personal for me. The feelings can only be described. None other than almost getting close to the true understanding and purpose of life. You know, my case, it wasn't. I look back and think I achieved that jump over the pier. I actually think about how I surprised myself. I didn't know I had that in me until I was there at that moment. So what I learned about myself is actually what I took away from that. But the euphoria that surrounds you almost can overwhelm you in the fact that nothing else in life matters. You know, what is life about? And it can. Can play games with you, that it can make you think all sorts of thoughts.
- [17:16]
A
Yeah, interesting you say that because I was just speaking to Mario Sanchez the other day, and he got caught in that big updraft, and he said the adrenaline was rushing through him so much he didn't sleep for two days. And that's two days after he couldn't. Couldn't sleep. Just up all night, just pacing around. Just had. And it wasn't. He said it wasn't like I was tired at all. I just could not bring myself down from this elevated chemical that was flowing through my body. He said I was almost like out of control.
- [17:42]
B
And what a natural high, if you want to use the term, is that. And you know, don't forget the roller coaster that he would have gone on. And I even went on back then. Your phone's going nonstop. Your. Of course, today your social media is burnt. You're getting emails. It is. It is so exciting. You know, you're on this wave of adrenaline and excitement and achievement, which is. Which is really hard to describe.
- [18:08]
A
The wave now also includes popularity and being the man of the moment. And that's. That's going back to what you said at the top about the power of social media and whether it's good or bad. That's something that I think everyone, especially young writers coming in, need to. Need to understand.
- [18:22]
B
I think it helped Marius not having a recording device on. If I'm straight, honest with you, I think that every jump for the rest of time will be compared to that jump. And I think whether he believes that or not, I don't know. I think that is. It goes back to that whole thing we have as humans of guessing or not knowing, you know, like, we are never going to know the height of that jump and anything will be compared to that. So as much as I do love the way we use our recording devices now, both of them, and what that gives us, from a coaching perspective and a community. Community perspective, I think that's helped him.
- [19:02]
A
The power of the unknown was what drove those great, great explorers back in the day. You know, that's. That's kind of cool. Anyway, let's. Let's move on to your latest news, mate. Congratulations on joining Harlem. By the way. Why the move to Harlem? Did you feel like it was the right time? Did you hear rumors in your last brand that they were the cleaning house? How did that come about?
- [19:22]
B
I didn't really hear anything about cleaning house. And, you know, I don't think that a lot of the moves have been from, you know, them clearing out as much as other people have going from what I've seen. But, you know, clearly the first thing for me was just witnessing my friends close to me that lives very close to me. Aaron Hadlow, obviously seeing firsthand his journey and how that transformed him and the person he became. Over a year and a half, I wanted that, I wanted that. This new lease of life that he had where he couldn't stop talking about things and was regularly on teams calls and was involved and had purpose and value and excitement and I. I wanted a bit of that. You know, when you meet people in life that have got that, you kind of think to yourself, well, you know, what have I got that right now? So that was the first part, aging for me. And then obviously you start to think about where, you know, can I fit into this? Is this even. Should I even be thinking this way? And, you know, you know, I'd done 10 years with Geotone, wonderful years with them. I left very amicably. I started to see there was an opportunity for me to fit in as a. As a storyteller. As you know, I met with Alex and I simply put to him who I was in actually a graphic where I was holding all of the key pillars of who I was. A father, a coach, a speaker, a mentor for kids. I was clear as day about who I was and how I felt I could fit in with the brand, which is really to help be a storyteller and to give it some depth. You know, they've had this wonderful journey and I felt I could jump on board to give my experience. I guess the journey I've been on, help with the marketing, create Podcasts. As you know, there's a coaching series come, and I've been on board now for nearly three months, and it's just been amazing. I could. You'd need three hours to talk with me on this podcast about the transformation I've gone through in my life, of the value I feel I have. And now, you know, that's. It's very different. I know Aaron has spoke about this as well, but it's a very different ball game than the one we had in the past.
- [21:35]
A
Do you feel more like a family member than a. Than a team writer at Harlem? Because I, I, you know, a lot of brands say, hey, join the family. We are the family. But, you know, you go to any event, mate, when the Harlem boys turn up or the Harlem family turn up. I mean, they turn up in mass, whether they're wearing ridiculous clothes or not, I don't know. But they are a big family.
- [21:53]
B
Well, as we know in life, some families are tighter than others, I guess is the best way to say it. Families have all sorts of disputes and things going on, but clearly, for me, they are. We're a wonderful family off the. But I mean, I could see this stuff on the beach at King of the Air and wondering what's going on here? And then I come to learn about all these exercises they do on team days. And, you know, my own experience, which is all I can talk about in the past of my relationships with brands, I got left to my means, and that suited me. There wasn't so much contact. And, you know, it's clear that some teams have more riders than others, so you naturally have less input. But I wanted to. To achieve more, and I want. And I felt that I could do more and achieve more, and it's a lot more work for me. But I think that that was something I was open to. And, yeah, the family element to things is. Is unbelievable. Like, I already, in three months, feel like I know everybody and their stories and whether they have kids and fat. You know, communication is really important to this brand. I'm on regular calls on a Monday and a Wednesday. I never had structure like that in my life. I had an onboarding to Microsoft Teams the other day. I'm 40 now. I never went through something like that. And I'm absolutely loving what I'm learning and the independence to be given tasks and go off to seek the solutions, and I'm absolutely loving it. It's like a whole change of life for me.
- [23:27]
A
I'm very, very aware of the team calls and, you know, I Remember, going into the mega loop with the shorter lines and, you know, all the sort of accessory brands and accessory objects that are around industry now.
- [23:38]
B
And.
- [23:39]
A
And it was great to hear from the Harlem team about them as a team, as a collective working the way through. How should the line setup be? Do you need to fly on the high V, you know, Ralph in, you know, intricately working with the guys at every. Every everything. And I think that passion and desire to be the best can only really come out of a small brand. I think as it gets too corporate, that that gets lost. And their desire to be the best, we're seeing that now on the water.
- [24:04]
B
Oh, and you're right in. In the team and it being a smaller team, but. But also to add to that is that a team that can actually express himself honestly is important. Right. Like, I'm 40 now. Right. I've done the years of where I've tried to be nice and should I say this, and with such a big brand that I was formally associated with, you did feel a bit or. I certainly felt, should I speak up here? And I joined this whole Harlem journey. Like, I'm 100% going to be me and they're going to like it or not. And this raw honesty sometimes can really get you places where if everybody's on that page, sometimes I have ideas in the marketing calls where they're like, well, what is that about? And I think, well, I just had to get it out there. I might not have shared that in the past, but you pointed out, you know, having that closed team, what with Ralph being so involved and I mean, that is another side to this as well, Adrian. That not only did I feel like I had a place for me to fit in here, I was drawn to the equipment as well. I was. It's very clear that I was not on the, you know, the top of the range model for my previous brand, but that's because I fitted into the sustainable image that was associated with that line. But I was getting whipped by some of the locals down here, and it was hard work for me to catch up. Now I've got the advantage and that personal drive to be on the best thing. It helps, you know, to have that best. So that. That was a big draw as well to me, Adrian. So that the full package was there, but I just had to find a way to. To make it work. It's not easy to get in the door at Harlem.
- [25:42]
A
You mentioned sustainability there. I guess Harlem sustainability sort of lines up with your other sponsors in terms of clean energy. I Know that you are very much involved in scene and, you know, you do that a lot with the kids that you work with as well. I mean, that must have been a big thing that attracted you as well.
- [26:01]
B
Oh, Adrian. I mean, once I saw the wind turbine logo on the Harlem Kite, I knew it was my destiny. To be part of this brand is the clearest way to say that to you. And that might have taken some time, years, if I'm honest with you, where, you know, it wasn't really that we. Everybody knows each other in the kite surfing industry. Discussions all go on, but whether or not you really go for something is the difference. But I always had that feeling. I was drawn to that brand. And as you said, I do a lot with my wind energy sponsor, Global Wind Energy Council, who are the voice of wind energy worldwide, visiting schools and young people and climate change meetings. Using kite surfing as this vehicle to engage not just young people, but everybody. What a great subject to talk about, the power of the wind when you've got a sport like kite surfing. But what I wasn't aware of at the start on this journey with Harlem was just how sustainable this brand is and how key those values are to the brand. And what I come to learn is actually using these products. Actually I'm using a more sustainable product now than I was. And there's a number of reasons for this. And I guess to start with the fact that there isn't different colors of material used is an incredible sustainable way to make kites. Because you have just one material, which is the undyed color, if you like, then it's screen printed and you can make and be flexible with the demand this way. You can make different models of kites by using that material. You imagine every ounce of that material goes into a productive way to use it. Everything is also based in Europe. They really valued trying to decrease the distance between the supply chain. And that is something really important to them. Most of our audience or our. Most of our market is in northern Europe, is in the northern hemisphere, in Europe. Right. So they're trying to get all of these products closer to them. They can be very sustainable thinking this way. It doesn't have to come from China back this way. So it really is part of their DNA. And once I realized that, I was like, wow, I have to. I have to be part of this. I would be the right person to help talk about that, you know, which is another. Yet another role I have this year.
- [28:21]
A
I'm still waiting for those sponsored prints to come out from Brainchild. You know, they've been talking about that for some time. I have seen Harlem kites with different prints on, don't get me wrong. But I would have thought we would have seen more writers tap into it and see their sponsors on the kite. And, you know, you know, it's a, it's a massive marketing opportunity as well.
- [28:43]
B
Definitely. And I think to continue on my roles, one of my roles is to highlight the. The benefits of being able to print anything you want on your kite, you know, and let's not forget, you know, why we are able to do that and just, you know, the importance of the relationship that we have with Brainchild and Ralph For Harlem, we are the only brand that all our models are made there. We are 100% committed to Brainchild. So we have that relationship where we can any print, any design, any innovations that happen there, we're going to be in line to receive them. But I feel just like you, we need to make a bigger noise about this. You know, there should be big brands. I mean, you do. You have seen some of Lorenzo, I think Ducati, they've done a collaboration with. But it's one of my jobs to go to town on this and really talk about the benefits of customization within Kites, which I also want to see big brands attracted to this as well.
- [29:45]
A
I think Harlem has set a precedent where passion and wanting to be the best has shown the industry that big brands don't necessarily need to be the ones that are going to lead this industry.
- [29:57]
B
This definitely shaken things up, hasn't it? You know, I didn't see this coming. I haven't seen anything like this in, you know, 23 years of kite surfing. I'm frequently told that kite surfing is plateaued and it's a difficult industry. And my reaction is, speak for yourself. You know, we're going places at Harlem. It's exciting. And this, this is unique story. You know, I don't know if other brands are looking at this and thinking, well, we better get rid of 75 of people just so that we look like a small brand. How do you sh. That? Can you shake off that image? If you are one of the big brands, I think, I think you can't construct this. You know, how do you get the image of your. A small brand, you know, borderline. That's not really the right word to use startup. But you can't just plant that in people's heads. Once you are a big major brand, it's very difficult to sort of get this image. So it's really important to Harlem. And a lot of the calls I'm on, it's like, how do we remain a close knit brand and stay within the DNA? You know, which has effectively been the reason why they've been so successful is this small team.
- [31:08]
A
I mean, the Harlem story is a crazy story. I mean, I think that's time for another podcast. But I mean, just where Harlem came from and you remember the original Harlem and where they are now, it's, it's kind of, it's kind of. I don't think we'll ever see that again. That rapid rise from a small Dutch, you know, small Dutch company, let's be honest, to, to having the best riders in the world on the best gear and not just winning, completely dominating the competition.
- [31:37]
B
Yeah, I mean, you say there, you know, you remember where they come from. I don't, I don't remember anything about the start of them. That was just another small brand trying to do something. When I watch those videos about, you know, who they were and what they've done, it's, it's absolutely amazing. But the other thing that Harlem seemed to be doing so well, and this is another role I have here in the uk, Adrian, is that part of me joining the brand was two separate roles. I've spoken about the marketing side of things and telling the story and all the work I'll be doing when I'm at events reporting for the team. But there was also an opportunity to join the brand. The sales side of things, certainly in the uk, myself and Aaron are heading that up and this is a side to, to it that I hadn't realized that Harlem are also, they're not just innovating with, you know, top products. The brainchild factory. There's a lot of innovations happening with many different aspects of the brand. And certainly how they see kite sales or kite surfing sales is very different. They're evolving. This part, they really don't believe in this. Twice a year drop on shops where they have to take huge risks, get loads of kit in. Then we got the problem with closeout because that is the big problem in the kite surfing industry. It's damaging to the industry. They believe in shops just having a small amount of stock and maybe even one of each size of a kite that they can replenish at the end of the month because guess what, it's made in Europe. You can get it in 24 hours, 48 hours. That's really lovely for shops to not have that stress. And that's why we don't see loads of close out with Our brand, they want to keep that image of a premium brand. Once you have that all flooded in the market, it's a nightmare. There's a two year cycle, Adrian, how cool is that? There's no stress to just push out next year's model for the sake of it. It also gives people great resale value. But there's a number of reasons why this brand is going places. But the sales side of things also caught my attention once I learned a bit more about that.
- [33:39]
A
Is there any chat about the race to the bottom? Because I do feel like that's something that a brand that Harlem could tap into as well. Because I do feel like, you know, people listen to this podcast, have said it a thousand times, and I'll say it one more time. Your kid Lou, you can go and buy him a skateboard, you know, pay £20, buy him a skateboard. He's a skateboard. He give a little boogie board, take him down the beach, push him into a wave and he's a surfer. That is something that's drastically missing in kite surfing. And I know there's other brands that coming in, but it's just not cool. You know, that's the problem. It's just not cool. Is there an opportunity that we could create a great kite and, and, and be able to fill up that bottom part where we can get more people into the, into the sport without them having to fork out so much money?
- [34:24]
B
Well, I think that's a great topic of discussion and off the top of my head straight away is that Harlem are involved or have sort of an in house brand that makes equipment for women or specializes in unica that they work closely with, you know, so that's already a form of targeting an audience and trying to think specifically what their needs are. But as far as bringing people into the sport, or is it young people that you're talking about or kids or
- [34:54]
A
just generally, I think anyone lower socioeconomic, you know, you name it. I mean, we are a particularly privileged white sport really. I mean we could, we could say that. I mean, I know that's probably going to upset some people, but that's the reality of it. At most levels.
- [35:09]
B
I think it's definitely something that we are looking at. I mean, around the corner is a kite that is being brought into the lineup which is much easier for people to handle. You could argue it has great characteristics to be used for beginners as well. So there's many different areas that Harlem are now starting to fill those slots. You know, remember, it's a new brand There's a surfboard around the corner. There's all sorts of products that need to be created to target, you know, and solve those problems. So I think that they. That in time, they. They will come. But as there's been such a high curve of successful products, it's only now that they have even the resources there now to start looking in the other areas. But what's important for us as a brand in general is the performance of a product, especially with things like seamworld and all the innovations that they've brought. But it has to be in relation to accessibility. So that is something the brand believes in, is high performance. But it's got. There's no point in that for us if it's not accessible. And that is achieved by a number of things, you know, not just logistically, how they work. The designers like Aaron, the route, the. The factory, everybody's expertise within the company. All of those things together combine to allow an accessible price point to. To get to that level of performance which. Which is important. And I will take that back to them. Have we thought about that? Have we thought about maybe something we could make that's really affordable to get people into it? These are. And they will be open to my. To my discussion and bringing that to them. Whereas maybe in the past I might have just dwelled with that in my own brain and thought, I'll just let that go.
- [36:58]
A
The kite industries changed a lot. You know, more brands, more media. I don't know if that's a good or bad thing, but I kind of feel like we're losing the sort of core culture of kiteboarding. You know, when you think about skateboarders, they've got skateboarding bands, their surfers have surfing bands. We don't have any of that in kiteboarding. I feel like we don't really have that culture like other board sports do.
- [37:19]
B
I think it's about where you are and what you see. You know, I've been seeing a lot of stuff lately about the fun of kite surfing. Where is it? Have we lost it? I'm speaking for myself here. I am in an area where I see so much fun going on. And I see that not through my screen or my phone. I see it on the beaches, I see it in the discussions, I see it in the talk about who's jumped what. And so I think it's about perspective, and everybody's perspective is different. But for me, I. Not only do I feel it, but I can see it in the community where I am on the south coast of England. England is a wonderful place to kite surf. And I think I do see bands that involve kite surfers. I do see, maybe I'm fortunate that I see that world. You might be talking as a representative from around the world, but the world that I see, it's maybe one that I choose to see because I want to see more of the world with my own eyes. And I'm very, I think it's clear that I'm conscious of how much time and energy I put through my social media. But what I see on the beaches around my way is a very fun world.
- [38:31]
A
Mate, you've been around the sport for many years, done nine king of the years. Where do you see the state of Big Air at the moment? Can we continue this trajectory maybe?
- [38:39]
B
I think for me I find it hard to talk about the direction of the sport because it's something that is out of my control. So I, you know, I don't, I don't see an issue or a problem with where the sport's at. I'm not going to sit here and say this isn't great about it or it could go here or there because I just honestly don't see the point. I see it's where it is because it's where it is. When I look at it now as to where it's gone, which is very technical, very board off related, I'm, you know, almost proud that I was in an era where it wasn't like that and we kind of, and you know, I, I originally thought, oh, how did we not see that come in? You know, double loops from heel and then the board of sides. You naturally, when you're, you know, part of that scene, think how did I not see that? But where we were with it, which was who can do the biggest mega loop with a 9 meter kite? Which was pretty straightforward. But that was just what was rewarded and why I got to do so many king of the airs from brutally, brutally honest. That was my game. I was into that. I didn't take it personally that it went in a different direction. It was just that door closed that had gone that far. Maybe we'll see that age and we might see, you know. Right, that's enough. I mean what you're seeing now technically with you know, bored osmosis around the body, I personally look at that and just cannot believe the skill level and the athleticism. We were all just like, I can barely touch the ground. We weren't flexible. You know, like the dedication to training now and Jim and seeing Andrea and doing his yoga and Things is like I'm so in awe of that that I'm almost, if I'm honest, a bit of a passenger, just observing in, just like in awe of it. So I'm not concerned about its direction. Over 23 years I've seen it go from freestyle to big air, back a bit again and all sorts. Of course there's going to be a change at some point, but it's not something I worry about. And I'm just, like I said, I'm just sitting back, just being like, wow, I'm almost grateful that I was even part of that. You know, like to where I got to.
- [40:47]
A
Yeah. And it's great to sit back and as you said, just sit back and enjoy and look at the show and you know, we're super lucky that we go to these events and we can see it firsthand. I always worry though, when it comes to the direction of the sport. I always feel like there's this battle between what the riders want, I guess that's subjective. And then what the administrators want. And I think we see that in a lot of sports as well. You know, let's say athletes versus administration. Where do you think that battle is? Do you think that you think the athletes should push? Because let me give you an example. We're seeing where maybe the double loops stop being rewarded as much and then the whole fleet had to change away from that. We've seen before that people have to pick up double loops and, and pick up. And you can't just do a double loop now. You've got to bring in the variations to that as well. Do you like the fact that the administrators can do that or do you think that the riders should push the direction of the sport?
- [41:38]
B
It's a great question, Adrian, and I think it's. This is a long term question that's gone on for quite some time. When you have judges, who are they? Who are the head judges? You know, they're the ones telling you what scores well. And you already. There's your dilemma straight away. If the riders don't agree with that, what do you do? I mean, what do the riders do? We don't believe in that. We're not competing. Well, the sponsors all want them to compete. You end up with this sort of merry go round of who's dictating what. And I see the key, the key solution there is that you have to involve riders that have been at the top and can translate. You know, you almost need a rider's board which can speak to the, the people at the Top and. And translate. That being a great example here, is even just the selection process, right? It's not. It's. No, it's not rocket science to know that Red Bull love a younger fleet. You know, that's. That they want young riders that are looking to prove themselves, and so sometimes they might overlook maybe a more experienced rider. That is just. That's just the way it is a bit. You know, it's a great question to ask, but I think definitely the riders, if, you know, and I think they do represent themselves at events quite well, but some sort of official board where they can bounce back is definitely what's needed. But as you mentioned, it's very difficult. Who's putting the money behind these events? The red bull, the GKAs, you know, they're the ones that effectively, they hold all the cards, such as life, they're paying for it. It's a difficult balance to. To get right.
- [43:12]
A
I've spoken about a writers association before. I think if we could get all the riders involved and have some type of nominal fee to pay, which included maybe insurance, it would be a great way as a collective. Right? So let's say we say, okay, guys, it's €100 a year, but for that you get travel insurance, whatever. And then you could have someone go to, you know, and say, we're not happy with this. But also, I don't want to create conflict between riders and administration as well. But I do agree that the writers should have a say. They should be listened to because they are the people who are risking their lives at times for very little money.
- [43:51]
B
I think we see it in many different areas of life. I mean, just take football. Let's take football to start with, with Var and everything going on there. Who are the people making them decisions? Are they real football players? They're kind of dictating where the sport and the rules go. We see in lots of other areas of life. I think you've got a great idea there where there's, you know, a contribution to an association. I mean, just mentioning what you did, that word insurance, that creates a real feeling inside of me, which obviously, with what I went through with my crash, I didn't know about that. I had to learn about that myself. And I think that these are great points. I wonder how many professionals are listening to this, thinking, you know, am I insured? What happens to me? I know firsthand what happens to you if you get smashed at an event and you haven't got insurance. You go through a very difficult, difficult journey of who's Paying what? And how. How do I even get insured? These are conversations that could be had with something like an association.
- [44:49]
A
I mean, it doesn't even have to be professional riders, Lou. It can just be the Kite Surfers Association. You know, it can be any rider in the world who wants to support the association, wants insurance, can get insurance at a better price. Right. Because we're talking about a bargaining collective here. I think it would be some. We need someone like you, Lou, to hit it up.
- [45:06]
B
You can be the chairman, I can be the child. It's going to. I was going to propose you be the chairman, but just. I mean, there's two different.
- [45:14]
A
I'll be the accountant.
- [45:15]
B
Okay. All right. Yes, you're trustworthy, I guess. But there's two different. There's two different areas to talk about here. There is maybe what I was hinting at a bit more about a riders or a professional insurance because that's not easy. It's actually very difficult to get insured as a professional athlete with the risks that you take. I learned that firsthand. But when we talk about your recreational kite borders, I think it varies from country to country. Certainly here in the UK we have the British Kite Surfing association, which do a lot for access in our country. They have regular meetings, they're involved in events. And typically here, you know, 70, 80, probably 90% of our schools and members in the country have BKSA insurance. And. But, but I don't think every country or has British Kitesurfing Association. In fact, that's a stupid idea because they're not British. So every country tends to have their own nation's representative if you like. Some don't, you know. But I guess what you're pointing towards here is a more global recognized association. We obviously have the IKO as well, but it's definitely something that if anybody's listening here thinking, I can't be bothered with insurance, why would I need that? I think you need to look at that and think about why it's not actually about yourself, is it? Sometimes it's about if you send your kite into some dog walker on the beach. Like it doesn't hurt to. To explore this conversation.
- [46:41]
A
I want to jump back there. You mentioned young guns and I think let's focus on two former teammate Fin Flugel, current teammate Leonardo Casadi. Where do you see the ceiling of these two kids? I mean, both of them super talented, breaking the mold of really Andrea Lorenzo. Really? And Jeremy before them by being so talented at so many different disciplines. I mean, Finn already the. The 2025 freestyle world champion. Do you see these guys pushing on and dominating a lot of these disciplines at the top?
- [47:12]
B
Yes, I do, because they've obviously just got that natural instinct to pick up anything they do. But the interesting part for me, Adrian, is that it's not unheard of that riders can be very good in different disciplines. Think of Aaron Hadlow, Kevin Langere. But doing it at the same time is the key thing here. How you can, I mean, how. I can't even begin to explain it, but you know, the training involved to train both disciplines, this isn't normal, I think, to see that. And I think that it's a very valid conversation to say they could be dominating from some time. I'm especially looking forward to seeing Finn at Lords of Tram, as I think you are, and a lot of people are, because this is now, you know, if there was any event which was like, you're in the world of big air, that's it, you know, like. So, yeah, this is, I think, caught the. Caught us by surprise. Certainly old school thinkers may be a bit like myself that thought that's not possible to be at the top of the game like that have been proved wrong. But it's exciting times.
- [48:15]
A
For a long time. There was a lot of spoken about Andrea Lorenzo when they first came into the scene. Remember, they used to both loop the kite very, very late, especially Andrea's contra was not popular, was. Was looked down upon and actually those guys copped quite a bit of online from the older guard, the senior guys, but they stuck to what they did and they obviously changed the way they rode. But they ended up winning those guys over. And not just winning them over, they. But they made fans of those haters almost.
- [48:47]
B
Yeah, I mean, I was one of them. I felt maybe not, not personally to each of them, but I definitely was someone that, you know, how could I not look at the new movement in kite boarding and think, well, where's the power? That's where I came from. That was the definition of a megaloop, was how level you could keep the kite. And you kept the bar sheet, you know, even in my head now, a mega loop, you keep the bar sheeted in. When I see the GoPro POVs where the bar's halfway out, it takes me some time to understand why. Why is it like that? Is that giving you a second lift? Is that it has to be because you've got one hand on the bar. There's, there's a time where you have to start understanding rather than just, you know, observing and Thinking this or that. Why has it gone down that road? And more than anything, those riders did prove that they can actually easily throw a powered kite loop. I mean look what happened at the Megaloop where they took short lines are going mass and level. I mean I once said that nobody would ever take the board off in over 40 knots and do a Meg loop. No way. What an idiot thing to say. Like when you, I hope no one re quotes me on that but that's just how I saw it at the time. And, and I think, I think it's fair to sometimes have those thoughts. But those, they've definitely proved everyone wrong, haven't they? They, they're that talented.
- [50:03]
A
I think in particularly the 20, 21 or 2 cold Hawaii event when Lorenzo as a 15 year old was in the final. And I remember speaking to Kevin and Kevin just saying to me, man, I was honestly, I was getting too scared to loop. And Liam said to me I didn't know if my kite was going to, didn't know if my kite got handlight. He was and, and he was and he was doing bought off Mega loops at like 20 plus meters. And Jamie Overbeak as well, just setting the trend of what this next generation of riders going to do in those conditions.
- [50:34]
B
So there's a whole new level of control and balance. You know the balance it takes to take one arm off the bar, do something with the ball down there and you know, manipulate the kite to where you want it. That is something that I'm in absolute awe of. You know, like that, that wasn't, it wasn't like that, you know, during the, at least the heights of my career. But some of that was down to the equipment we had. It didn't allow us to sheet out really and do much. So I have to keep that in my mind when I'm beating myself up about why I didn't see this new direction coming. But I like I keep saying I'm so amazed at what I see and I watch videos now. I'm just like, I can't believe that. Like are you kidding me? So that's the sorts of things I'm shared people share on the groups that I'm involved with, the recreational kite groups and I, I'm just as much, much amazed at what they're doing as people that can just jump and maybe do a back roll. Which I think is a good thing about where Big Air is today.
- [51:37]
A
Where do you see the Lords of Tram event on the schedule? I mean I, I think it's in the Big Four. I mean, if we're talking Red Bull, King of the Air, Megaloop, cold Hawaii, I think I've got to put Lords of Tram in that, in that sort of group with those guys, because it's not just a great event, it's really well run. It's the best viewing in kite surfing. We've been standing as the guys are jumping over our heads. You can't beat that spot.
- [52:01]
B
You cannot deny that it is the best arena to watch. I mean, Tarifa is good. You can get close to that, but you're literally getting wet off the board, spray coming off them. You know, I recommend everybody to try and witness that event. It's a quick flight to Barcelona or Montpelier. You can drive two and a half hours up. Do you know, I think the key reason why it's so successful, or some of the key reasons, Adrian, is one, it's the start of the year. That start of the year gets the excitement. It's, you know, what moves have people been focusing on? How's it going to be this year? Everyone's craving an event. You know, it's been a while since we've had King of the Year, so that's one of the big reasons. But also Tristan and the team down there and the way that they run in partnership with the GKS is essential because they have kept the DNA of the event. The Lords of Tram and the craziness of it and the, I want to say, the French style, they've managed to retain that, and that is why that event has a real identity. And they push on that. You know, all of the media, they put out with the crazy. Everyone knows the term smoke on the water. Whether you knew that before or now you've learned it, it's likely come from that event. So I'm so happy to be part of that event, and I look forward to booking my flight and doing that beautiful drive up north through Spain and over the border and looking at those mountains and seeing the snow and bringing my gear if I can kite. It's. It's a really exciting time of the year.
- [53:26]
A
Yeah. And it's bought some unbelievable moments we were speaking about on the podcast. You know, Lorenzo's gear failure, which was crazy, considering he was coming as there's King of the Air. You know, I remember when Baby Shark did the Megalodon and your reaction on the, on the. On the live stream to that. It's just such a crazy event. And the smoke on the water, the smoke. When that smoke comes, you see it coming from the bay above. It's the first time, Lou, I've actually seen riders, their face almost horrified. They're scared. It's very rarely do you see riders actually that terrified. You can see them shaking and just sort of dreading that when Cedric comes down and said, right, we're going back to men Heat falls going out in five minutes. You can sort of feel that dread in the air. And I kind of like that. It's electricity. It's electric. It's electric.
- [54:12]
B
Yeah. You know, how often do we see the top riders do things effortless and sort of not have that human reaction to what they're doing because they're just like robots. But there we see the human side of people competing at the utmost extreme side of the sport. I heard on your recent podcast with Marius how he was describing that he looks into the lagoon above to see where the wind's coming. I thought that was a real lovely insight to the locals and how they manage that area. But I think what is important to State is that this is high stakes kite boarding, an event like that, because it's flat water. And even for myself, I'm very aware when I'm somewhere like Buniero in Tarifa that if I land on a hard surface, I'm way more likely to hurt myself. Now you bring in the strength of the wind there as well. It's no, you know, it's no surprise that we see big crashes sometimes. I mean, you just mentioned one about Lorenzo and I was, oh, I forgot about that. You know, there's, you know, the Josh, there's, there's so many. So I think that the riders are aware. You can't help but be aware of that. But it's, it's something that has to be on the bucket list of any, any kite border in the world. No matter what level you are, get to that event if you can do. It's, it's a life changing experience to witness these guys and girls kiting at this level.
- [55:35]
A
It's a super flat takeoff, but you're landing at about knee high chop because these guys are traveling 150 meters. I think Jamie's done some 250 ones by the time you get down there, mates, very little flat water loo. It's, it's pure skill. And going back to what you were saying before, these guys are the best pilots in the world.
- [55:53]
B
And I like that term, Adrian pilot, because you are up there piloting this thing, you know, and we've seen the jumps where this is also a location where you can jump into the clouds and it adds that extra, extra wow about it. Seeing Hugo in the background do that massive job, knowing Marius has done that job. You know, these are the things that can happen and do happen in competition as well. But the landing itself, you'd never see so many professionals struggle to land and it's not their fault at all. It's almost like in the back of my mind I'm like, maybe we need some sort of side betting game where you're like, are they odds on to land? Put your money on it. Because the most perfect landings can go wrong sometimes. And effectively the most ridiculous landings can come out of it too. It's amazing to watch.
- [56:39]
A
I want to speak a little bit about broadcasting, Lou, because you're one of the leading voices in this industry and it's someone that I've looked up for a long time. You've done loads of commentary. What's tougher, competing or commentating?
- [56:52]
B
Well, I would say about commentating, and I remember hearing this once from a broadcaster speaking and it stuck with me is that you're only, you're only one word or a couple of words away from losing your job. You know, you really are representing the sport. You're talking from the heart. You've got sponsors of an event in the back of your mind, you're thinking fast. It's actually all of the skill set that's needed for when you compete, which is why I love commentating so much. You've got to think fast what's coming next. I love that speed of thought, which is why I loved competing. But I would say commentating because you have that extra element of having to remind yourself sometimes. And you do have to remind yourself. When I get going with Ruben, he's a good friend of mine, you know, I described working with him like going on a six hour drive. Once someone says, what's that like working with Ruben? I said, it's like being in the car with your best mate. You know, you sometimes have to reel it in. And I go to bed many nights after commentating thinking, what have I said today, please? And you've just got to have. I mean, you must have been there, agent where you just like. And you sometimes do say things that are on the limit or you leave your mic open or you do the pressure of perhaps knowing that you are one step away from never being a broadcaster again keeps you sharp and you have that responsibility and you. It's a really cool journey to go. I love football, Adrian. Bottom line, that's why I got into commentating. I wanted to be professional football player. I still do, but I'm probably past that now at full tiva. I love the product of football and the production and the halftime show and effectively from the days where I used to commentate my FIFA games on the PlayStation with a friend, I've managed to keep that passion going and it's led me into some big roles and I'm really grateful every moment that I have in a studio like that.
- [58:47]
A
It's been an amazing journey because we're getting to the age, Lou, where a lot of older pros are sort of leaving the sport and moving on to other things. And it's great to see that you've crossed over into that and made a new career and kept you involved because I guess a lot of people would still want to be involved in this industry but can't.
- [59:05]
B
I've seen many much more talented riders than myself come and go in this sport and that is through many different reasons. But certainly for me, I think it's fair to say and I'd be open with this about my parents. I didn't have a very supported way into the sport. I was at an interesting age, 17. My two brothers were working full time jobs, one as an electrician, one working for the mail and I was there. I want to be a kite surfer. My parents, it wasn't, they didn't support that, they didn't understand that. So I had to go off and earn it and I had to work part time jobs to support that. I lived in my van, I've been through everything and one of my utmost goals was to make it work. And because I had nothing to fall back on, I've been able to do that. But what I would advise any kite boarder, especially if they're on the scene or almost there, being a professional is to start to try and find the gaps. Where are the opportunities? I didn't create this life of being a commentator after competing. I created it. Whilst I was competing I realized no one was on the mic. I knew I could bring something. I started coaching whilst I had that profile which you get when you are a competitive kite boarder. But I could see and craved that longevity to call it my job. And I've managed to achieve that and I've been very fortunate. But it's definitely something I'd advise any up and coming kiteboard stick to what you're good at as well. I started thinking, what do I like doing? I like talking, you know, sorry, but I just can't stop talking. So why not try and get into that, Dude?
- [60:40]
A
I remember back in the days, you would be doing the beach commentary and writing at King Eli at the same time. You'd be commentating, oh, yeah. Having to put the mic down, run out, do your heat, then get back on the mic.
- [60:49]
B
And I was trying to do the live stream at the same time. I was struggling with the idea that the live stream was going to take off and I wanted all of it. I was, you know. And do you know what that actually cost me, though, if I'm honest? It was. When I look back to the 2016 King of the Air, I would be coming back off the water, commentating all day in the sun, with people like Sam Odetzky joining me. You know, it wasn't uncommon there to have. It sounds ridiculous, but it wasn't uncommon to have a drink as well, you know, whilst you're chilling out. And it actually chilled me out because I wasn't stressed about competing, I was communicating. But I got tired and I learned that actually to really give it my best shot, I had to focus on being a competitor. And I'm just glad I got to do that and ever stand on that podium, which was a dream of mine. And I'd done that by letting go of those roles. But it was. It's also part of one of my regrets where I couldn't let go of that role at the Mega Loop. And I have grown up regretting that I didn't take my opportunity to compete at the Mega Loop, for example. I very much was thinking about longevity and, you know, life is. You know, it's harsh. Someone else can take the role. If you don't take it or you let it up one year or you can't make it to an event, you have to be prepared that someone else can do a job and step in. So one of my biggest regrets is that I didn't compete at the Megaloop. At the time, it was seen as a bit of a, if you want to say, B list event compared to Red Bull King of the Air. But as that event developed, I just thought, how was I not. This is what I'm good at. One move, come on. Like, I haven't got a massive trick vocabulary. I wanted that, so I live with that. And sometimes you make bad choices in life, but effect, you know, essentially, I'm very grateful that I've carved that part of my career and it's a very fun thing to do. You know, that's not work. Sitting there at the best view in
- [62:37]
A
the house and Sometimes the best view, sometimes. Sometimes it can be screwed over by cameras getting ruined and looking at a
- [62:43]
B
laptop, you know, or in a container somewhere. I've been and seen it all to some degree, but at least nowadays it's becoming. You know, it is. I mean, look at the Mega Loop, that big glass view, you know, it's. It's pretty special.
- [62:57]
A
I want to finish off with two stories. Number one, my. One of my favorite Mega Loop stories is I remember when Ross Dillon won and you were in the commentary and you had been doing coaching for Ross and you ran down on the beach to congratulate him. I thought that was awesome. I really love that. By the way, Aaron. Aaron Hadlow has never competed in the Mega Loop either. So you guys can, you know, maybe have a couple of cups of tea and go over that one and the other one. I want to say Lou is back in the early stages of the podcast. I want to say around 2017 or 18. The Red Bull king of the air live stream was pretty shitty, and I called it out on my podcast. Maybe there was not many people listening, but you emailed me and said, hey, man, let me give you some background to what's going on. And you are, you know, very nice to me and say, look, you know, there's.
- [63:41]
B
There are about that. Yeah, yeah, he sure was very nice.
- [63:46]
A
But, yeah, you were. You were. You were like, hey, listen, you know, let me give you a bit of background into. Into what's going on. But the quality of the stream has improved remarkably. And I think I was saying at the time, you know, this is the premier event in kiteboarding. We deserve better. That was my line.
- [64:00]
B
Yeah. No, and I think that I don't blame anybody for expressing themselves, because without that, things don't. Things don't change. People get frustrated with this stuff, you know, and effectively, that's when we put changes in places as humans, when people speak out. So I'm glad to hear I spoke back to you in a nice way. Thinking back then, I'm not sure it would have been as nice as you're saying, but constructive feedback is how we develop, and it hasn't. I mean, I sat there on PKA World Tours with my MacBook and a program called Livecast or Streamcast. And if you think that was bad, what you were watching, you know, we're talking, like, modem dialogue. It was almost pointless, me being there. You know, I went through some absolute canings on comedy. There's nothing worse than being at the face of broadcasting when it's a downer that affects your brand itself, as you know. So I've been there. But we are, like you said, at a great place now where we can turn up as broadcasters. And I'm not worried whether the things buffering and all those things we associate with, you know, 2000s terms like the stuff just works and we can do well. But we're actually getting help now where King of the air, we've got about 10 screens in front of us with this stat and that stat, all the stuff you have to do yourself. In some ways, we're getting a lot of support and we are in conversations where they're saying, how can we help you further? It's an amazing change of time.
- [65:25]
A
Well, look, Lou, thank you so much for coming on. As I said before, you know, you're someone that I've looked up to in this industry as a broadcaster and a voice and mate, this has been an unbelievable podcast. I didn't know really what to plan for this, but I knew that we were just going to have a great conversation and that was awesome. Dude, thank you so much for your time again.
- [65:43]
B
Thank you very much, Adrian. And you're often talking, saying people's praises, but I think from my side, with what you have done with your podcast and your broadcasting as well, this is only further helping the profile of our sport. And I've learned a lot off you and your team as well. So thank you.
- [66:00]
A
Hey guys, I hope you enjoyed that episode. Don't forget, if you want to support the show, the easiest way and is to support me for free. Rate me on Spotify. I'm loving those five star reviews. Keep them coming in, share them in your local WhatsApp or kite surfing groups, or just simply tell your mates. If you want to support us more regularly, head over to portraitkite.com and check out all the madness there. Portrait is an independent media company trying to tell the stories of kiteboarding the way we believe they should. These projects are funded by people just like you. And if you believe in what we do and you want to support us more, head over to portraitkite.com the podcast guys will always be free. You don't need to worry about that. But if you want to find more episodes just like this one, use the search button@kitesurf365.com to search your favorite writer or topic. And we'll be back this Thursday for the Megapod.