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Hey everyone. Welcome to the Know youw Gear podcast, episode 391. Today's episode of the Know youw Gear Podcast is brought to you by Patreon members. Thank you for making this possible. So Monday the 18th, about 10:30 in the morning, right after they open, we got permission from Guitar center to film in the store. We did not have them tell them what we were up to. They knew there was going to be filming. In fact, that's why it took an extra week to get their video released to you guys. I, I needed to get releases from the employees that were in the video, otherwise we had to blur them out. So what happens? I go in the store with $500 cash and some guitars to trade in. I had a Harley Benton and I had an Epiphone and I had a Squire to trade in. And I thought, you know, what would I do? And that's the problem with these videos. They're not what would you do? What should you do? They're what would I do? It's an easy video. I'm not an actor. I, I really can't handle that, you know, remembering my lines kind of thing. So I, I just go in and see what I want to do. And what I wanted to do was basically see if there was something I wanted. So I traded in those guitars. So what I want to do is talk to you about how that broke down. So in the video I bought a used USA made American Deluxe Telly they had listed for $1,000 used. I traded in three guitars, an Epiphone, SG, a Squier Strat and a Hardly Bitten PRS copy with P90s. And they gave me $501 for those guitars. I traded them in, put them towards that Telecaster, paid the difference of $500, I'd like to say and walked out with my Tele Deluxe. But it's still there. It's going to be there until December 4th and I won't be unfortunately there to grab it until December 6th. Or I think some of you guys had a question about that. Let's talk about that. First thing that you have to understand is there's a 21 day hold on that guitar because it's used. Some of you ask what that's for. It depends on your state, depends on your country. This is where it's interesting. In the state of Arizona they have to hold. It's called pawn clearance. It means every single employee has to have a background check, a fingerprint check to handle basically used product. What happens is when they take in used product, whether they trade for it or buy it, they have to sit on it. They cannot release it to a customer for 21 days. Not business days, just 21 days total. So that the information, the description and serial numbers can be sent and submitted electronically. Now, used to be on these sheets that you used to pay for and send in. Now they pay electronically. It's $3. So they send basically each one of those guitars. Guitar center paid $3 each to submit to this to the city and state of Arizona to make sure that they're not stolen. Nobody's reported them stolen. Gives them 21 days to find out to see if anyone has reported them stolen. It used to be 14, so they made it 21. Okay, but I want to break down what happened. And a lot of people really paid attention to me in the video and how my deal worked. You know, oh, he got this much for his guitars, and now he's getting this guitar, and is that a good deal? So you know how it worked out for me? I walked in with a Harley Benton, an Epiphone and a squire and $500, and I walked out with American Deluxe telly. But how did it work out for Guitar Center? They had a Fender USA Tele Deluxe guitar. They paid $500. They're selling the guitar for a thousand. And in the video, you saw them give me half of everything that they were going to sell those guitars for of mine, they gave me half. So we're going to assume that they gave this customer who traded in this Tele Deluxe half. They could have gave him 60%, but we're going to go with half. Because easy numbers, that means that Tele Deluxe that they sold me for $1,000, they paid $500 for. Okay, they doubled their money. Double their money in this. In the guitar. Guitar market is a big deal. It's very commonly used. It's not very common in new. But they made double their money. But I didn't actually buy the guitar. I did trade. So how does that work out? Really, what happened was I gave them $501 cash. There's the picture of me holding my cash. So what happened is they were into that telly for 500 bucks. And because we're friends, we're going to generalize some of the numbers to keep sanity going. Because technically, I just told you, they pay $3 to run pond clearance. So even if they gave that customer $5, they're into it for 503. But we're not going to get two nuts. I just don't Want people nitpicking me if my numbers are off because they're like, what about the $3 you said? Okay, so Guitar Center's numbers, they paid somebody $500. I gave them $501 cash. That means they made $1 and got my three guitars. So think about this. They didn't make $500. They made $1, remember? Because they paid five to that customer. I gave them 501. They're flushing, right, that they've paid themselves back. I gave them 501. So technically, they made $1. Even though now we know it's technically they lost $2. They're in the whole two. But I like my numbers better. They made $1, but they have those three guitars. So even though they're going to double their money on those three guitars. Well, technically, think about this. They're not into the guitars for anything because I gave them what they paid that guy for the guitar. So let's go back to the numbers. So, okay, so I gave him $501. They made $1, and they have three guitars. Now what happens? Well, here's what happens. Now they can sell those guitars for $1,002. They bought my Harley Benton for 150. They're going to sell it for 300. They paid 180 for the squire. They're going to sell it For 360. And the up phone, they paid me 170, 171. So they'll sell for 342. That comes to a whopping $1,002. Now, they could get more for those guitars than they get for less. We're only going to be generalizing these numbers because the truth is, what if some of these suck and they don't sell very well? They could discount these 10% to get them out the door. Or maybe they don't actually mark them for what they told me for. They could mark them up for more. But either way, they sell those three guitars, they sell them for $1,002. If you're doing that math with me now, they were gonna make $500. I go in and I paid cash for that telly, $1,000, that telly. I walk out of the store. They made 500 bucks. But because they gave them three guitars and $500 cash, when they sell those three guitars, they're going to make $1,000. They paid 500. They were to make 500. Now they paid a 500, they're going to make a thousand. You could see why this is beneficial to them. I said they're going to make $1,002 after they sell those three guitars. But realistically keep in mind that's if you've ever been to a guitar center, you know that it's not just when you, you don't just go and buy a guitar and walk out. When you go to buy a guitar, what do they do? Come on guys, you know what they do? They go hey, do you need that Pro Series protection plan? Do you need a guitar stand? Do you want a cable? Do you need picks? Especially if you're a new guitar player, you know, if you're, if you're good at your job. The add ons are, they're the most powerful thing in a sales arsenal, the add on. So let's take a look at that Harley Benton because I was thinking about the Harley Benton in particular. It was really nice. I set that guitar up before I traded in, put new strings on, it played fantastic. They're going to sell that guitar for $300. Let's, let's say a new new guitar player walks in the guitar center and says hey I'm looking for a good guitar. Somebody buys that guitar for $300. Let's say he says well you're going to need a strap, a cable, some picks, a gig bag, an amp, a stand. If you take the items of that. And I took this as generalized Items. Let's say $15 for a strap, $20 for a cable, $6 for picks, $69 for a gig bag, $109 for an amp, $20 for a guitar stand. That's $236 gross worth of add ons. With a general 40% margin they make an additional $94. Now let's say that's a new beginner. Well, they need lessons. Guitar center wants to sell their lessons. Lessons are about $100 a month. Actually I think they're more than that. And they make about $30, which I think actually they make about 40. But again I'm keeping the numbers easy. That means if they sell that Harley Benton and we're able to add on to those things to the customer, they would make not gross, they would make $424. So think about this. Guitar center could have sold me a telly that they paid $500, doubled their money. Now if that one Harley Ben transaction they could make $424. Obviously if they made the $424 profit they would only be $76 short of what they would have made if they doubled the telly. But they still have an Epiphone and a Squire to sell. We haven't even discussed what happens if that student doesn't quit. What if that student sticks with lessons for months each month paying a dividend $34, 30 to $40 a month plus they buy other accessories while they're there. Maybe a learning book, maybe other items, maybe upgrade guitars. Those three guitars that I traded to Guitar center Instead of making $500, Guitar center could make potentially two or $3,000. And essentially if a customer walked in and bought that telling left, that's one customer, that's the end of the transaction. But because I bought them three guitars for the one, because I brought those to them, they are now going to sell four guitars out of that one store. That's four customers instead of one. That is what Sweetwater cannot do. That is what Amazon cannot do. This is how the mom and pop business model works. When it works great. A lot of you guys always ask me what about mom and pop shops? What about this? Like I said, I am loyal to my addictions, my guitar addictions. So I'm going to shop at guitars and I'm going to shop at Sweetwater. I'm going to shop at the mom and pop shops. I'm going to shop at a gas station. If they sell guitars, I'm just addicted to them. Okay? I love guitars and I don't really kind of discriminate that way. I have my preferred way, you know, methods of buying. And because I had a store for 13 years, I do lean towards the mom and pops more. That's the business model that I think Guitar center is missing. I don't think they should solely do use gear, but imagine the advantage to them and how their inventory would just escalate and plume as those transactions happened. That's a great way to get all these guitar players who during COVID got into guitar either first time and got in their, you know, their Amazon guitars or their first time guitars or some of these guitar players out there like you guys and me that kind of bought a lot of guitars. We're sitting on way too many. And the market's a little soft right now. It's a little hard to sell and, and when you do sell, it's a little bit more pain in the ass. Let's just be honest. Selling online or selling in person, this is how Guitar center can. And my favorite way of always saying the best business model solves a problem. They could solve a lot of problems by making it an environment. Heck, they could give us more for our trades. You can See, in their business model, they have the ability to do it. Now it's not just that easy. Cause like I said, there's cost. Keep in mind, the more trades they do, the more potential, potential stolen guitars are going to be going to funnel through there and they're going to lose out on that because it's not a pretty picture. Guitar center. I don't want to speak for Guitar center, but in my experience in the past with Guitar center, when a guitar comes through stolen guitar center always just returns it and they eat the money. When your guitar is stolen and then it's pawned or sold to a place, basically it doesn't mean you get, you automatically get it back. It's you, you got to go to the, to the court with the business and you in the business to figure out what's best. Sometimes you have to pay the business what they paid for the guitar. Sometimes you might have to pay what the business wants for the guitar. And sometimes the business has to give the guitar back. It all has to do with how ethical the business was when they took it in and the situation. And if you guys can amicably figure it out, that's great. But a lot of times if a judge decides, the judge decides and that they're, they always weigh in just, you know, what hurts the business, who wasn't doing anything wrong versus what hurts you. And they kind of come to that conclusion. But Guitar center in my experience is always guaranteed gave the guitars back. Somebody will probably have a different story because somebody always has. Well, not me, but I'm telling you from my experience of years and years, it was always that way in the past. Brian says it is 100 better to sell your guitar over trading. There is more work and time involved though. Tough to say what's better. I gotta tell you again, I always keep everything very upfront with you guys. The guitars I traded in the Guitar center. So you know, I bought those guitars. As you know, I didn't, you know, this isn't a sponsored video anyway. I bought those guitars from a friend who has a music store. I specifically went in and said, hey, I need to buy three guitars. I want them to be very common guitars. I said my number one videos during COVID was Epiphone, Squire and Harley Benton. And so was pretty much all the other reviewers. And I go, so I'm assuming a lot of people out there have them. I think those are cool guitars and I want to cure. I was curious. So you guys know one of the videos that are one of the things in the video I was thinking was going to happen didn't happen. I thought it was going to be a lesson of like buy brand names because I thought Guitar center wasn't going to take the Harley Benton. I was like, ah, take a, I was like looking for a, an off brand brand. I was looking for an Epiphone, I was looking for a Squire. But all three of those guitars had one thing in common. They were sitting in his store for a while and so, you know, he was trying to sell those guitars for pretty much what Guitar center gave me. I let him see the video afterwards and watch, let him react. I should have filmed it. I'm sorry I didn't film him, but I let him watch the reaction and he flat out said, when they said 180 for the squire, is that what it was? Let me go back. He was trying to get 200 for that squire. He said I would absolutely have took 180 if you offered it. He's like, if anyone offered me 180, I would have took the Squire. And then when they said 150 for the Harley Benton, he said I would absolutely took 150 for the Harley Benton. The Harley Benton. I can tell you right now that was the hardest one. I, when they gave me 150 for it, I was in shock. I thought they were going to be 100 bucks because, you know, everybody speaks like now, like I would have bought it for that, but I mean if I would have thrown that on Craigslist, that thing would have rotted for months at 150. And that's kind of why I didn't want to take a premium guitar to a guitar center and trade it. Because you don't take sand to the beach. If there's a great guitar, I don't have trouble selling it. The problem with those three guitars right now, which is the point of the video, and I hope somebody really learned that from the video, is those are the three guitars that when you go out there, that's what everybody's trying to sell there. There is definitely a, a lot of those for sale. You, you know, having an Epone Esquire, they're great guitars but there's just so many of them mid price guitars out there for sale, as you guys know. So the fact that they traded and did a pretty decent job on the trades, like I said, we still all agree, I think they were a little low on the Epiphone. The Epiphone. So you know, if you want to know the math on that, that was the other part of the question somebody asked me was, why did they lowball me so hard? We, we don't know why they went up in price. So, you know, let me tell you why. If you watch the video, they walk away. The employee walks away and talks to the manager. We didn't get to see that part. We didn't follow him with the camera. We didn't think to. When he offered me the $95, I was in a little shock. You can hear it in my voice. I'm like, $95. Are you. That's it. Are you sure? Because I was like, I'm thinking he's looking up the wrong guitar. And he's like, yeah, no, that's what they're going for. Things I can tell you that we've learned since then is a couple things. One, they have a lot of epiphones new in stock. They have a lot of used headphones in stock at the guitar centers. So again, the sand to the beach terminology comes up. I just brought them something they already have a lot of. They don't need any more epiphones. Keep in mind, also, when I was an epiphone dealer, we got a 40% margin for Epiphone, which is a really good margin. Squire was between 30 and 35% margin. So on the math on that is, if I sold Squire for 100 bucks, I expect to make 30 to 35 dollars an epiphone. If I sold it for $100, I expect to make $40 of that profit. So given that I was a baselevel Gibson epiphone dealer for years, I would assume that I would be. In fact, I'd be shocked if Guitar center was not getting a better margin than 40%. How that happens. There's all kinds of ways that margins can be increased by giving co op dollars for advertising or incentives or free guitars or whatever they do. But I would say, let's say to have 45, 40% margin, I wouldn't think would make sense. They have to have 45 or 50% if they have a 50% margin on that epiphone. That epiphone was selling new for 550 on Guitar Center's website. That means they pay 225 for that Epiphone I was trading in. So when I was thinking like, oh, I'd really like to get 2 to 2, 2 to 225 out of it, they're like, well, they pay 225 for them new. So you really want to give me that? Because that's. They got new ones sitting around, they can't sell that. They're into for 225. That's part of the reason why they didn't want to give me a whole lot because it just. Again, it's sand of the beach. I was bringing them something they have a lot of, and they get a really good market margin on it. Why he came up to the 171 price, I have no idea. They didn't me. He didn't say anything. You know, keep in mind, I'm very mindful when I'm in these situations, because you gotta understand, he knows I'm a YouTuber. He knows. This is what he knows. This is what the employees know. A YouTuber is there. He's coming, he's doing videos. Corporate says it's okay. They don't tell him what it's about. If you were them. I'm trying not to make them any more nervous than they. They have to be, in fact. So, you know, the entire thing is filmed with iPhones. We don't use any cameras when we go to a situation like that because, again, the cameras just make everybody act weirder and puts everybody in a different mood mindset. So when you see two people walking around, I have two people on two angles of me filming with an iPhone, and I have lapels, and we have a. We have, like. So, you know, if you saw it, there's a little metal thing on my shirt. It's because I'm hiding a secret wireless. Not secret, but a wireless lapel underneath my shirt. So even that. So. So I'm not even miked up or anything that looks obvious to them. But obviously they know they're being filmed. In fact, there's a funny situation. You probably think there's cameras in that video because there's an employee walking by a bunch of times in the video, and he's looking at us. Every time he walks by, he's looking at us like he. Oh, like you probably looked at it and thought, oh, he's looking at the cameras. No, it's because he recognized my wife. Because he used to come to our store and his friend used to take lessons in our store. So he was like, oh, is that Shauna McKnight? He was like, figuring that out. But anyways, my point is, is I didn't want to really grill anybody. Especially I was afraid if I did. All he knows is that corporate gave permission for me to do a video. I don't want to push him into a situation where he does something that he wouldn't have done for a Normal customer because he's, you know, obviously doesn't want to be, you know, get in trouble. So I didn't really ask him why they upped the price. Here's my theory, and I kind of feel pretty. Pretty confident with it. I feel like they upped it from the $95 at 171 because they did a little more research, found more, and tried to figure out the wiggle room they could do. My guess is he went to his manager, I'm guessing went to the manager and said he. He wants to trade any three guitars. He wants this guitar for a thousand dollars. They know they can give me 10% off the guitar that they're selling me. So instead of giving me 10% off, they just gave me more for my trade. I think that's probably what they did. Kind of like a make this deal kind of work kind of thing. You know, like, I didn't really say it's either take all three or nothing. I didn't say anything. So, you know, if you notice, part of my. My technique when I was trading is I don't say very much at all. I give no information, none, until they ask. I offer nothing ever. When I'm trading, it's. Everybody's just got to ask me. If you ask me a question, I'll give it to you. Otherwise, that's the backstory. So that's the backstory. And if you really want to see more, there's more on the Patreon one. Now, I went in a little depth on a couple little things, too, but that's the back into that story. How are we doing? Let's do a giveaway. We have Scott and Sean. Both Scott and Sean are wearing a. I got drunk once and found out how fast Sweetwater can chip, which is a famous. Ralph, my buddy Ralph said they're both wearing the shirt. One is, of course, holding a bunch of bourbon bottles. It looks like a whiskey. And they got a nice Les Paul. That is Scott. So that's a funny picture. Sean is sitting here with his shirt. He looks passed out. He's holding what looks like a beer bottle. He's sitting in front of Sweetwater. That's actually in front of Sweetwater. Sean's story is actually funnier. I want to tell a funny story because Sean doesn't know this story. So I met Sean at Sweetwater a couple years ago. I was at a Sweetwater event with a bunch of YouTubers, you know, just walking around filming content. And I was filming content. I was walking around. If you haven't seen a lot of the footage of Sweetwater. It's a giant campus. It's huge. It's massive. I mean, it's so many buildings and so many things. I was walking around the campus, and I bumped into Sean, and he said, hey, how's it going? He's like, hey, just want to let you know, Phil, I like the show, and I'm a viewer. And I said, cool. And he goes, I'd like to buy you lunch. Can I buy you lunch today? And so I remember I had some card, and I said, well, actually, they give me lunches here, because Sweetwater gives you this little pass, and it lets you kind of get lunches for, you know, for free, right? So we go to the cafeteria for free. I said, so I already got free lunch. I said, but you want to come just have lunch with me? He's like, sure. And I go, I gotta meet some friends. You want to come meet with some friends? And he's like, sure. So me and Sean are talking. We go in line, we get the food, and, you know, he's a. He's a nice, cool dude. I enjoyed the conversation immensely because it's obviously guitar. That's what I love about this channel. I get to meet you guys, and it's. We talk guitar. So I sit down, and my two friends that I'm having lunch with is Robert Baker from the YouTube channel and Tim Pierce. So now it's me, Sean, Tim Pierce, Robert Baker. And the four of us proceed to have lunch and discuss things. And it was very nice. Of course, you can imagine if you know, those two channels, they. They are who they look like on their channels. They're nice as hell. They're just really nice, sweet, sweet guys and just happen to be super talented. So, Sean, me and Robert Baker and Tim Pierce have lunch. We discuss guitar. We discuss our love of guitar, all the things, music, you name it. And at some point, we finished the meal, and of course, we have to get back to work, right? It's the three. The three gotta get back to the grind. So I said, hey, it was super nice meeting you, Sean. Tim, you know, says, nice meeting you. Robert says, nice to meet you. That's the end of what Sean knows of the story. So, Sean, you won a gift today with your picture, just like Scott. But now you get to hear the back of the story. So when going back upstairs. Cause there's an upstairs area for the YouTubers. Tim Pierce, out of nowhere, goes, so who is that guy again? He goes. He's. He's like, is he an executive here at Sweetwater. Like, he's Tim Pierce trying to figure out, like, what's. What's the connection here? And I go, oh, he likes my podcast. And Tim's like, what? And I go, he. I bumped into him at the. Outside the cafeteria, and he. He's just a viewer of the show. So I like guitars. I thought he's like, oh, he's like, was a really nice guy. And the Rob Baker is like, yeah, he's a really nice guy. And I said, yeah. And they go, oh, we didn't know why he was there. We just assumed like, he was maybe a VP at Sweetwater or somebody you knew in the industry or we didn't know. And I was like, yeah. And they go, oh. And I go, well, I introduced him, but I didn't introduce him as anything other than Sean. So. Sean. So, you know, they enjoyed your company. We had a great time. Everybody had a great time. But it was funny walking upstairs because they were both like, who is that? And I go, it's Sean. He's. He. He. He likes the channel. That's like. And they get it, man. They were like, oh, that's cool. He was great. So that was the story. That was my story. But I never thought they introduced you as anything more than Sean. Brian says, hey, happy holidays, New gear day, saldano, astro 20, fender player telly, anakili, octa, octopi pedal, all on crazy sell at Guitar Center. Find those deals. You know what? The deals have been good this year for the people out there saying, hey, these 20, 25, 30%, 40% sales have been pretty legit. They're pretty cool and I've been really having a lot of fun. I agree with you 100%. And for those of you saying, yeah, they're just putting them back to the things they just jacked up the price on. I agree with you 100% on that, too. The Raymond says thoughts in the Ultra True twos. I already did a discussion of the Ultra True True Ultra twos. He's talking about the new Fendra Fendra, the new Fender Ultra 2 guitars. I think they are great and I hate them. And that is where I stand with that. What I say they're great is I'm a Fender fan. I am. I'm always going to be a Fender fan. Fender does things to make me sad all the time as a company. Still does not stop me from being a Fender fan. The funny thing about having the know your gear thing is I've said this for years. I. I Wear a lot of van stuff. And then I wear the know your gear stuff because I was like, why wear vans? But so for years I only wore Fender stuff. Like my whole wardrobe was just Fender clothes. I just like Fender so much. I love the Fender logo so much. I like Fender guitars. I'm a bass player. So of course the Fender bass is like my favorite bass. The Ultra Twos, in my opinion, are. They're good because I think Fender makes good guitars. They are not great because they could give you so much more for that price. And I really believe that that's one of the downsides of the big corporate thing is you gotta screw us a little bit. And what I mean by that is there's that guitar could be better, they could do better. I'm not even argue make it cheaper. I don't care if they make it cheaper. They got a premium brand, they can charge whatever they want. But I really think it's embarrassing for them and other companies like them to. You know, if Fender wants to make a vintage Strat at vintage spec that, you know, it doesn't have that many kind of, you know, doesn't have stainless steel products, that's fine because it's not supposed to. And it's like kind of like beat up with a keychain. And they want to sell it for $4,000. I don't notice. I'm not complaining about that. I'm not like, hey, go ahead and do that. But to me, if you want to go out there and say we, we made the most advanced guitar ever, the Ultra 2, and then you don't make it half as good as half your competitors for the same price or them selling it for less, it's an embarrassment. You know, if you're going to make something called the Ultra 2 and you're going to do a cortisone neck. Okay, cool. But you know, and my argument is not only stand still frets, I think stand still frets, I think it should have some other features. The reality is this, they have the power and the strength to spend more. They probably spent more marketing that ultra 2 than most companies get to sell in that kind of in guitars. That's why I had no interest in doing a video about them, because I have no interest in it. It's not. If you have one, if you like it, I get it. I like stuff people hate too. When I say people, I mean like me. So I wouldn't be upset if you told me you hate my keys. All I'm not going to. You shouldn't be upset if I don't like your Ultra 2. I like my Keezel. But I've said this before. I like it because I'm a Fender fan and Fender doesn't make me what I want. I don't mean me as a YouTuber, as a customer, what I want. So I went to another brand. I'd like to see Fender come and do something really more better. So that's my. A lot of you guys just excited about stuff you bought today? I understand. I'm showing the stuff I bought today, too. Grumpy Mike, guitar. He recently traded a guitar at guitar center that I bought there. So in other words, you bought it there and now you trade it back. They had records of the sale. They still had to hold it. Crazy. Yeah. So so basically we're saying he bought a guitar, guitar center and then he traded it into them later and they still have to hold it for pond clearance. Yes, that is the law on that. If it was in the return window, you can return it. They don't have to run it through pawn clearance. I had this argument with my city once with through a big fit because at the time, which, by the way, the laws were not as strict as you guys know, I said this last week that my store didn't really buy guitars. We traded guitars. So we didn't do a whole lot of buying. And then what happened was, I think then I don't remember what we were paying. It's probably $2. So you have to pay every time you run something through pond clearance. It doesn't sound like a big deal, but if you do, you know, 200 things, I mean, that's $400 a month going to pond clearance. And so what would happen is like this. Let's say I have a customer and his name's Mike, and he bought a guitar from me. And then three months later, he comes and he's like, yeah, you know, he's had it for a little while and he wants to trade it in for something else. Not loving it. And I traded in. I didn't run it through pawn clearance. This is so, you know, I'm not going to get in trouble because I actually had this fight with the city and the city was like, no, you have to run that through pawn clearance. And I go, well, I sold it to him. So this is a true story. I got in a fight with the clerk of this because I. So, you know, they didn't catch me. I just told them I wasn't doing it. I go, I'm not Doing that. I'm not going to run that through pawn clearance. I run everything else, but I'm not running that. And the clerk's like, no, you have to. And I said, well I don't have to. I sold it to him. I know where it came from. And she said, and this is a true story. She said, what if he bought it and then he sold it somebody else and then he stole it back from them and now he's trading you? I said, look, then fine. I, I didn't take it on trade. I just, he just returned it with a restocking fee. I said, I'm totally allowed to return. I could put a one year return with restocking fee on my, I can make that in my policy so that if somebody buys something for me and eight months later they want to return it, I'll just give them like a 30% restocking fee and I won't call it a trade. And I go, and that's what I'll do. And there's nothing you can do about it. And then she said something even more dumb like, well actually a return is a trade. And I said, oh, don't say that. Every single thing returned at a Walmart and a Target has to go through pawn clearance. Are you kidding? These corporations will lose their mind if every lady who's returning socks to a Walmart has to run that through pond clearance. Anyways, long story short, I did what I want for a little while and then we eventually broke and did what the city wanted. Because you can't fight city hall. They get their money and their time and it's just how it works. Look at the heart of it, I care about what it represents, which is protecting people's stuff and protecting people from actual crimes. I agree with Pon Clarence. I was just like, said in certain circumstances I'm like, okay, well did your store have Black Friday? Thoughts on deals? We did not have Black Friday. In fact, most of the Black Fridays were closed. Just funny enough, I was actually at two of my friends music stores recently and had talks with them and they both said the same thing. They're like, they both hate Black Friday. And I said, yeah, I always hate Black Friday too when I had a store. Not because there's tons of people buying stuff, it's because musicians really don't come to small mom and pop stores for Black Friday. So that's why they used to have small Business Saturday. They kind of still do. But American Express was really smart. You know, for a long time, businesses small business like Mine didn't take American Express. The fees were really high. They took forever to pay you. It was just not really pleasant experience for a small business to deal with American Express. But American Express got smart and what they did is they started sponsoring something called Small Business Saturdays. And they gave a like 20 bucks or they gave money back to this, to people using a American Express if they used it at one small business on a Saturday. So that, that became very lucrative for us. And then we had to get set up our system for American Express. And then of course, American Express I think stopped doing it. And then you're just. Now you have an American Express. But. But anyways, back to Black Fridays. No, you know, and in my store specifically was like a block up from the mall. So what we get on Fridays is dudes coming in. I'm going. And we'd be like, oh, cool people. And he'd be like, my wife's at the mall. I just figured I'd come down to the Mews store and hang out. And then we'd hang out. We wouldn't do any numbers. And it's because, you know, a lot of small stars don't really have real deals. Like we would buy up some stuff and try to run a deal. But you know where the deals are, they're at the Costco or the Online or the Amazon or the Walmart or maybe the Guitar center, you know. Right. And stuff like that. So a lot of small businesses try and some do well with it and some don't. It just depends. We didn't really have for a long time this social media presence you have now. So on social media, you could push on social media, Instagram, hey, Black Fridays. I'll let people know. But most people just assume we didn't have it as a deal. Stephen Forst says, how many guitars do you have? And favorite guitars. I don't have any clue how many guitars I have right now. Usually when you guys ask me, I'll say 20. Because there's about what, 2, 4, 6, 8, 10, 11 behind me and there's more in the closet. It's not a cop out. I just haven't counted in a while. You understand, Like Mike guitars. My world is partly my guitars and partly the youtuber world guitars that I'm doing. So there's always guitars here that are probably not going to stay here. You know, they're just either on loan here or, you know, I got them in some kind for a video or something. But favorite guitars are easy. I just like my delos. I like My sg, I can tell you right now, the guitar, I'll just tell you my. I have a lot of favorite guitars because obviously my wife got this universe that I'm pointing at this amazing one of a kind Piarid Smith private stock, essentially is what it is. Was made to me by my. Made for me by my. My buddy Nathan as a gift. You know, heritage made that guitar for me. So there's a lot of guitars that I can. I'm very lucky and blessed to say, like, look at that. But realistically, I'll just tell you this. The guitars I use that I'm using all the time, it's very, very short list. It's my Kiesel Delos. It's my Gibson sg. It's this Godin classical, multi ack kind of guitar, that bluish gray one I'm pointing at. And there's a Keisel acoustic Zeus that I play and a Kiesel headless bass. Those five instruments, I play those all the time. So much so that those are. Those combined are 90% of my time, my playing time on those instruments. And then everything else has to divide up to the other 10% just out of habit. The confusing part and always will be is I have a YouTube channel. So there's just guitars for the YouTube channel. There's a lot of guitars here. So some are for the channel because I need them for the. To. To do the demos with and reviews. And some I have because, like I said, companies sent them and I don't know. Carl, John says, any thoughts on Kiesel quality assurance and customer service issues? Well, I have great customer service because I deal with Brandon, which you guys aren't a lot of. You know, you guys don't deal with him. He's an artist marketing person. I love Cal, who is their customer service guy. And I think Chris Hung is amazing. And I've never heard anyone say a bad thing about either one of those two. Carl? I guess, you know, I pride myself in my honesty, and therefore sometimes I piss people off. I think Kiesel's problem is they sell their guitars way, way, way too cheap. And because they sell them way, way, way too cheap, they run on a skeleton crew. They overwork themselves and they piss a lot of you guys off because they make mistakes, because that's what happens. And they also don't get back to you fast enough because that's what happens. Or they do things that upset you guys and that could easily be fixed by increasing their prices, slowing down the production, and hiring some more employees if they were to pay me to consult for them, that is 100% what I would have them do. Cut production by almost a thousand guitars. Increase the price 20 or 30%. By the way, for those of you right now thinking with no one to buy them, you're so wrong. You're not even close. The fact that they're backlogged at 4,000 guitars constantly tells me that absolutely, they can handle 3,000 guitars, because if they raise their price 20, 30%, they'd still be sitting at 30 to 40% below their competitors. And I would also have them decrease the amount of options they offer you guys. I would have a production guitar line that just goes production only, and then a custom shop series that they charge more for. I would definitely have cha. Changed all of that. The fact that. The fact that they do it this way. I've said this before. Jeff is. I think he's 46 years old. He's still. I believe this. I'm telling you, if Paul reed Smith was 46 years old, they would be the exact same person. Paul Reed Smith had everything to prove. At 46 years old, he was going to make the best guitar ever. He was going to do everything, and he was focused on that all the time. That's what Jeff is focused on. He wants. He wants to be the best guitars for the absolute best price, at the absolute fastest speed, at the absolute most options. He needs to be the best. Maybe because he likes to race cars. It's in his mentality, but that's his attitude, and bless him for that. But most of the times when I see people upset with Kiesel for any reason besides, Jeff's kind of abrasive, but he's abrasive because he's very honest. So there's no fake side of Jeff. There's no, like, he doesn't have that kind of salesman. He, like, you know, shine shoes kind of logic. You know, he has the. Just more like how he acts. But that is the. The thing with Kiesel. And I appreciate. And this is what I'm just. And again, I have no. No incentive because, like I said, whether you buy what. Whatever you buy. I own every guitar here. Whatever you guys buy is whatever you guys buy. No one's gonna pay me anything. Hell, if anything, I only get paid if you guys click an affiliate link to some of the random stores that don't sell most of the brands that I actually tell you guys about all the time. But my point is, is that I think Kiesel guitars, unless somebody can prove to me something Different. And I've been everywhere. I've been behind the scenes with so many factories and so many shops, they are making extremely price aggressive guitars for. I mean, their custom shop. They're. They're more. They're more custom shop than Fender custom shop. Then Gibson custom shop, then PRS custom shop. They're more custom shop than. Well, they're not more custom shop than. Well, I actually think they're more custom shop than sir's custom shop. They're. They're very custom shop instruments at a very obtainable prices. I'm not saying they're cheap, but comparatively speaking, and I don't know, I always. I have a pessimistic view on things. I figure this ends one of two ways. They either can't continue to do that anymore and they go out of business, or they can't continue to that anymore and they raise their prices or cut production or cut option. Either way, I. And I. So, you know, I think Jeff can prove me wrong because he's that stubborn to make the brand do what he wants for as long as he wants. And you guys will probably complain for the next 20 years about it. Meanwhile, there are a half a dozen guitar companies selling you guitars in Indonesia for the price of what he can build guitars in California, which is crazy to see. So that's my tirade on that. So, yes. But here's the deal. I'll just tell you this. If you have a problem with Kiesel Guitars customer service, just call Cal. There's one customer service person. So if you're upset about how long it takes to get back to you, there's one customer service person. So it's Cal. His name's Cal. He's a Navy veteran. He worked on the nuclear reactors on aircraft carriers. He's super nice guy. He literally got out of the Navy and said, this is a quote from him. He goes, I just want to work at Kiesel. So he got out of the Navy. When he got out, he literally went to Kiesel and went to them and said, I want to work for you. I love your guitars. And so he just works there now. So that's how he works there. So he's a super great guy. So call him and if you have a bad experience, let me know. I'll be shocked to hear that Cal was mean to you because he's just too. He's too, just too nice. All right, so what did Amanda send me? She sent Eddie says, happy holidays, Phil. I want to add chrome covers to my pickups, but I Read, there are a slight tone difference. There could be depends. Do factories do anything to compensate this difference? If you buy them with covers on. Okay, so, Eddie, a couple things. First of all, if you can hear the difference between chrome covers and no chrome covers, you won the tone lottery. Good for you. It's you and Eddie Van Halen and Paul Reed Smith and like four other really talented people. And the rest of us, we just say that we hear it, but we don't hear it. So do I notice a difference? No. I pick covers based on how they look. I am from the late 80s, early 90s era of guitars where you like, almost like buying a Barbie doll and buying dresses. I started sticking colored pickups in my guitars and I started like turning my guitars into fashion. So that's why I do it. What happens tonally is a couple things. Because it's a metal cover and you put a metal cover over the pickup and then that touches the metal base and then you solder those together. Two things happen in theory. First, you are going to kind of reduce the hum, the sound that can get into the pickup. But keep in mind, it's already a humbucker, but there is even more. So it's less noisy, I guess. And also apparently it changes the tone. And there's a lot of theories on that. But a lot of people believe it adds more resistance, which makes sense. It does make sense. Because obviously the more wire, the more resistance. And if you're kind of connecting that, even though it's in the grounded side of it, it's creating more resistance. But the most important thing is the port is to know what really happened, which is really what happened was guitar players in the 70s figured out if they take the covers off, they get more out of their pickup and they run in the amp. Cause they're. We got. Understand before we had all this beautiful distortion on tap. These. These cats back in the 60s and 70s, man, they were just trying to get distortion any way they can. They were tearing speakers, they were shortening cables, they were using fuzz pedals. They were taking covers off the guitar. They were using different strings, they were hitting harder, they were running pickups closer. It was all they could do to just get a little bit more. Okay. And you gotta understand now that is not the case unless you're running all vintage gear and still trying to replicate it the way they used to. So I wouldn't worry about that. In my opinion. Some players are going to tell you they put covers on and they didn't like the sound. It's possible some people are going to say took them often like sound. It's possible. Me, I'm going to go with the looks more than the tone because I would say whatever it's doing to your tone in modern day can be adjusted with some EQ or some gain or just a little adjustment that is not enough to where I would put a focus on it. The only thing you have to know is this on a pickup, when you put a cover on it, if you're adding a cover, I have a video on that. So somebody always makes fun of me. Goes every time he says, Phil goes, I have a video on that. I have thousands of videos on how to do stuff. There you go. Anyways, on the video it shows you you want to use some foam tape or you want to use some wax. I use. You can use paraffin wax. Whatever. You. You just need to make sure that the metal slugs don't touch the COVID because you will hear clicking sound or squealing sounds. It's super easy. You can use tape if you have to or you can use wax. Either way, it's an easy thing to do. It's an ad and you don't have to solder it on. You just don't. You can just stick it on just for the looks and just double stick tape it on. It's cool. And you can buy really good covers on Amazon really cheap. And then you just want to pay attention to the spacing of the covers. There's two spacings. There's an F spaced and a non F spaced. Johnny says this also came from Amanda. Johnny. She grabbed Johnny's question and says, hey, Phil, what percentage of guitar sales are beginners guitars versus guitar addicts? I don't know that answer. There's no data on that. My guess is the guitar addicts buy more guitars than the beginners. I mean, it's just, it's. It would make sense to me. There was probably a time when that wasn't the case. People now buy guitars. Like we all, we're pretty bad, all of us. I mean, if you're hanging out here on your Black Friday watching me talk about guitars, you got it bad. Most people just watch me because they're like, hey, that guy's worse than me. It's like watching a. You know, it's like when back in the. Back in the day when your friend drank more beer than you and you're like, I'm not drinking as bad as Dave. That's your reference to everybody. Like, do you really need a third Bill, third beer, Phil. Dave's on his fifth one. I'm not Dave. That's sounds like a cry from help. It's not. It's just an analogy. It's a exactly what I'm saying. It's like you need seven guitars. Phil McKnight doesn't even know how many guitars he has in a podcast last week. So to answer your question, I think now it's probably guitar collectors and buyers and we're all yeah, I will always say this forever. There are worse things you can do with your money. By far. This is not the worst thing. Sbootstrap also came from Amanda says, hey Phil, what about the numbers of sellers who just want the cash from GC that aren't trading up? Does that model still work? The more guitars they have, the more guitars this, that thing can spread. Does it make sense? So if they. So if I walked in and sold them three guitars, each one of those three guitars have those potentials. I just said. But the trade scenario is really good for them. It's a really good deal. But buying is good deal. But I think trading is still better in the, in the grand scheme of things. But both are still good scenarios and not far off from each other. This one came in of course. This one Kiss. Did you see the Trump guitars And then the cease and desist from the Gibson. This came in a lot. Yes, I did see the Trump guitars. So says Trump guitars hit with season. Desist from Gibson. There's enough videos about this on the Internet. Everybody went for the clicks. But I'll just give you some insight because I know it's a guitar. It's because this became a guitar thing. I have to talk about guitar stuff, I guess. Okay, so here's what happened. So Trump did a bunch of guitars or Trump's marketing company did a bunch of guitars. You can see here these acoustic guitars and then of course obviously some Gibson Les Paul looking guitars. Funny story is they see that they're sold out. But it's funny to me is they may not be sold out. They might have got the cease and desist and immediately just put sold out. Because the cease and desist, that's how a cease and desist would work. It's cease and desist from what you're doing. Otherwise there'll be other legal action. And so in the cease and desist they might have just said okay and they just put all sold out. Because that's way better than taking it down. That's a smart move in other words, because I don't Know why the cease and desist would stop them from being able to say that they're sold out. So the reason I say that is because they're still selling the acoustic ones. The reason this is not interesting to me has nothing to do with politics. This to me is just like when bands do this Kiss, you know, whatever. Bands have merch and they sign it and they sell it. So essentially what he. What they're doing is they're selling these guitars that have these logos and stuff. They're 12, 50 bucks and then like $10,000 if they're signed. That is memorabilia. So we had this, the same discussion on this channel, whether you realize or not, when the Stranger Things guitars came out and they said, hey, what about the Stranger thing guitars? And I said, what I'm going to say now, I'm not interested because that's not a guitar, that's memorabilia. People do this all the time. If he was selling golf clubs or selling, you name it, right? I don't know, something else. What else is like guitars, watches, whatever and things, you know, photos, signed. I mean, that's memorabilia. In fact, most of people buying this stuff probably aren't guitar players. So that's who buys that stuff. So it's not of interest to me. The cease and desist from Gibson. Well, they cease and desist everybody, don't they? So that's not interesting to me. I just want to be very clear with what I do and say on the channel so I don't confuse you guys. I don't care that Gibson cease and desists people all the time. Notice I don't bring it up very often. I bring up things like when they lose a case because that to me is going to change things or potentially could change things. And of course, I brought up when they, when they tried to. When they copied zither and other people. And the reason I did that was because. Not because they copied zither. My opinions are very clear and have not changed since first day I did this podcast. First of all, when it comes to trademarks, I think trademarks are to protect consumers, not companies. So as long as the consumer is not confused, I really don't have a problem with it. If somebody wants to make, you know, a guitar that looks like another guitar, I don't really care at all. The guitar stand that Gibson makes, that looks like a zither stand, I think it looks actually really cool and I think it's smart that Gibson made the base a headstock. I told Tony Zither that personally on a Phone call with him. I said they kind of made their stand a little, look a little nicer in years. Yours. I thought that was cool. I know that probably hurt from him to hear that because I'm a friend of his, but it's true why I had a problem with what Gibson did. It was Gibson tried to buy zither stands, got him to give him their information, their books, his. His information, and then copied him and didn't say anything to him that seemed trashy to me. The. My discussion of the DiMaggio pickup issue is not because. Think of this. Gibson isn't suing DiMarzio for using a pickup like a PAF. They're trying to get his trademarks dissolved by. By the government. Even though they do the same thing. They have the same stupid trademarks on things. In fact, they have trademarks. I've shown it on the show. They have trademarks. They've trademarked the name like distortion pickup. Right. They trademarked the. These silly names too, and silly colors. So it would be one thing if somebody who wasn't doing it called out DiMarzio. I would understand that. I understand a pickup maker saying, I don't think he should have Double Cream pickups as a trademark. I would totally agree. But I wouldn't find it interesting or fair if the company that's calling them out for doing it is doing the same things. By the way, I'm not saying this. I'm saying allegedly, they also try to buy DiMargio. And then of course, when he didn't sell. This also happened too. There seems to be a trend there. But I want to be very clear, when it comes to copy guitars and stuff, I don't like it when people fake guitars. We're going to get into that in a second. But copying guitars and copying stuff, I could care less. My favorite comment that everybody says is, how would you like it if some people copied your channel? Everybody copies my channel. I copied this from somebody else's channel. That's how things work. You copy an idea, you make it your own and you move on. As long as the consumer is not confused, I don't have a problem. My only problem with a YouTube channel would be if the consumer thought they were watching my channel and watching somebody else's channel. That I don't think is fair because that screws the customer. Somebody's bringing up Dale Earnhardt. They were doing the same thing with Epilest Paul's. So like I said, this is a memorabilia play and not a guitar play. The last part of this is they seized $18 million. We'll talk about that in a second. Worth of fake Gibson guitars. It was 3,000 fake Gibson guitars. And if you saw my thing on Instagram, some of them were gift Fenders. So apparently they weren't all Gibsons because there were some Fenders in there, but. And of course, they used this because they wanted the. The title. Right? It makes sense. It's really. It's really $18 million. It's $18 million if all those Gibsons were sold for the real price, the full Gibson price, but obviously at 3000 guitars, at chips in prices would be a much lower number. Not even a million dollars. So they seize these guitars. This happens quite a bit. This happened a couple years ago too. They probably do a lot. But this one was big enough to get on the radar. This is what I don't like. So, you know, I don't like fakes. To me, the difference between a copy and a fake, copying somebody's thing like making a guitar looks like a Les Paul and. And making it cheaper or making it better, as long as it's not confusing the customer. To me, the biggest confusing thing is if the logo looks the same. I would not enjoy it. If Ford was able to stop. I have a Honda Ridgeline. I like it. I really like it. If Ford was able to stop Honda from making my Ridgeline, I'd be very upset. And. Because in no way do I think I'm driving a Ford truck. And no way I wouldn't confuse. There's no, like, no one could walk up to me and go, phil, did you know that's not a Ford F150? I'm like, what? What about the truck? What's what? It has a trunk. Like it's. Because it looks like a truck. Because it's a truck. That's what I'm saying. I think if as long as there's no consumer confusion, they should be able to do what they want. And that's why I don't like it when they put fake logos and fake headstocks on things. Because then again, you guys will say, well, you know, as long as they know it's a fake, it's okay. I agree with that. My problem is that most time they don't know, or a lot of the time they don't know. This one's from Kristen, who says, hey, ever notice how the best guitar players tend to stick to one or two guitars? Yeah, I think that's real common. I like to be familiar with my guitar very much. That's why I play one guitar a lot. I notice I tell you guys all the time I have one guitar like my Delos that I play all the time. Before that was my Strat. Same thing, same common feel. It's a little trickier when I do Guitar of the Week. It's a little trickier to play, you know, a Les Paul this week and another guitar last week. I think a lot of guitar players who play different guitars are doing it for the sound, more so than just, you know, the feel. They don't. Sometimes it's feel, but a lot of times the sound. And a lot of times it's look. So if you notice guitar players, like, if you've been playing the same song for 20 years, you know, sometimes it might be fine to change a bunch of guitars on stage for the look. But I think there's a definitely a good point to playing the same guitar all the time. And I wouldn't discourage that at all from any way whatsoever. All right, guys, as always, thank you so much for your time. Thank you guys for supporting the channel. Like I said, consider becoming a free patron member and getting some extra, you know, videos and stuff from me. And it supports the channel because every time I post those videos on, the channel goes to you guys. And you guys get to see it too. And on that note, I will see you guys next Friday. And I know I said no, you're gear already, but I'll say it one more time and Know youw Gear. Today's episode of the Know youw Gear podcast is brought to you by Patreon members, channel members and viewers who like and subscribe. Thank you.