Ralph Nader Radio Hour — December 7, 2025

Main Theme:
This episode features a wide-ranging conversation with Judith Enck, founder and president of Beyond Plastics, co-author of The Problem With Plastic: How We Can Save Ourselves and Our Planet Before It’s Too Late. The discussion centers on the global plastics crisis, the health and environmental hazards of plastics, why recycling falls short, grassroots and policy solutions, and the importance of collective civic action.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Who Is Responsible for Plastic Pollution?

(04:18) Judith Enck:

• Primary Culprits: Major fossil fuel and chemical companies: Exxon Mobil, Shell, DuPont, and Dow Chemical are top U.S. plastic producers.
• Sacrifice Zones: Industrial clusters such as "Cancer Alley" in Louisiana, an 85-mile stretch with hundreds of petrochemical facilities, suffer severe health impacts:
  • Cancer rates there are seven times the national average.
  • Disproportionate harm to low-income and communities of color.

Quote:

“Plastics are made from fossil fuels and chemicals. The number one plastic maker in the United States today is Exxon Mobil...what these companies have done is they have created sacrifice zones.” (04:18) — Judith Enck

2. Industry and Political Inaction

(06:13) Ralph Nader / Judith Enck:

• Negligible political representation for affected communities in places like Cancer Alley.
• Local/state environmental agencies lack enforcement:
  • EPA enforcement weak under recent administrations.
  • Local politicians offer subsidies to polluters.

3. Where are the Eco-Friendly Competitors?

(07:15) Ralph Nader / Judith Enck:

• Other material industries (paper, cardboard, glass, metals) are not using their influence to fight plastic dominance.
• Paper industry sometimes opposes policies that would reduce plastic.
• Some support from Glass Packaging Institute and aluminum, but insufficient.
• Real progress comes from small businesses investing in reuse and refill.

4. Retail and Policy Responses

(10:13) Ralph Nader / Judith Enck:

• Aldi supermarkets are cited as doing better than most by avoiding plastic bags and limiting processed foods but still have room to improve.
• Real change requires state laws mandating reduction, not just voluntary actions.

5. Policy Prescriptions and Laws

(11:57) Ralph Nader reading from the book):

• Top policy measures:
  • Producers fund municipal recycling and invest in reuse/refill.
  • 50% packaging reduction in 10 years.
  • All single-use packaging must be genuinely recyclable.
  • Ban toxic chemicals.
  • No loopholes/industry control.
• Key take: Recycling isn’t working and will never adequately work for plastics.

Quote:

“The sad reality is that plastic recycling has been an abysmal failure. Always has, always will be.” (13:41) — Judith Enck

6. The Recycling & Chemical Recycling Myths

(13:41) Judith Enck:

• Plastic recycling rate in the US is just 5–6%.
• Plastics have thousands of chemical variations, making sorting impossible at scale.
• Plastics industry misleads the public on the viability of recycling – partly why CA Attorney General sued ExxonMobil in 2024.
• Chemical recycling (pyrolysis):
  • Doesn’t scale, is polluting, and often just produces low-grade fossil fuels.
  • Out of 11 recent facilities, three have closed; the remaining handle only a tiny fraction of waste.

7. Artificial Turf as a Toxic Plastics Menace

(19:07) Ralph Nader / Judith Enck:

• Artificial turf: multilayered plastic (nylon, polypropylene, crumb rubber).
• Contains known and suspected carcinogens: benzene, arsenic, phthalates, chromium, cadmium, PAHs.
• Can reach 200°F on hot days, causes injuries, exposes children.

Quote:

“Can you think of a sadder world than one where our green spaces are replaced with plastic artificial grass? … These are very toxic chemicals that kids are playing sports on.” (21:06) — Judith Enck

8. Cigarette Butts & E-cigarettes as Plastic Pollution

(25:10) Ralph Nader / Judith Enck:

• 4.5 trillion cigarette butts littered each year.
• Filters contain plastics and heavy metals: formaldehyde, nicotine, arsenic, lead...
• E-cigarettes add new plastic and battery waste, often targeting youth.

9. Everyday Solutions & "Skip the Stuff" Policies

(27:55) Judith Enck:

• "Skip the stuff": Default to providing no single-use plastic cutlery, napkins, or straws unless requested—saves money, limits waste.
• Model bills and guides are available at BeyondPlastics.org.

10. Reuse & Refill Systems

(30:23) Judith Enck:

• Examples: School cafeterias switching from polystyrene to reusable trays, water refill stations replacing bottled water, wineries exploring refillable glass.
• Most US public water is safe, making bottled water unnecessary in most areas.

11. Power of Government Procurement

(32:56) Ralph Nader / Judith Enck:

• State procurement rules can drive market change (e.g., bans on government purchase of single-use bottles in NY & MA).
• Executive orders can powerfully reshape the market, as seen in federal recycled paper requirements.

12. Grassroots Female Leadership & Civic Engagement

(35:37) Judith Enck:

• Most local leadership in anti-plastic activism is by women; calls for more male involvement.
• Civic ladder concept: Start with personal action, escalate to school/community/city/state organizing.

Quote:

“There’s an incredible gender gap...We need more men involved. We need more people involved.” (36:13) — Judith Enck

13. Systemic vs Incremental Solutions

(41:11) Ralph Nader / Judith Enck:

• Systemic: full bans (e.g., lead in gasoline) are ideal but not yet politically feasible for plastics.
• Current work focuses on incremental: bag bans, toxic chemical bans, reduction targets, building momentum for more ambitious future action.

14. The Problem with Plastic — The Book’s Origins

(43:18) Judith Enck:

• Book was developed through her teaching and activism at Bennington College.
• Co-authored with journalist Adam Mahoney.
• The cover is, fittingly, plastic-free.

15. Alternative Innovations & False Technological Promises

(44:33) Steve Scrovan / David Feldman / Judith Enck:

• Niche recycling solutions (e.g., Ridwell) are well-intentioned but insufficient and distract from systemic solutions.
• “Science will fix it:” No practical microbe/biological solution forthcoming for plastics at real-world scale.
• Industrial hemp could be a viable alternative but faces policy obstacles.

16. What’s Next for Beyond Plastics?

(49:18) Hannah Feldman / Judith Enck:

• Focused on comprehensive packaging reduction in New York and New Jersey.
• Supporting local affiliates nationwide on bags, turf, "skip the stuff", etc.
• Upcoming screening of new plastics and health documentary.
• Federal efforts largely defensive; wary of preemption or weakening of toxics law.

17. The Political Context & Trump’s Role

(50:56) Ralph Nader / Judith Enck:

• Trump administration “patron devil” of oil and petrochemical industry.
• EPA enforcement gutted; fossil fuel industry narrative dominates.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the persistent plastic recycling myth:

  “It’s like telling people there’s no Santa Claus…plastic recycling has been an abysmal failure.” (13:41) — Judith Enck

• On artificial turf:

  “Can you think of anything sadder … plastic artificial grass? … These are very toxic chemicals that kids are playing sports on.” (21:06) — Judith Enck

• On systemic vs. incremental change:

  “You have to be aspirational and politically viable at the same time…We don’t have the luxury of getting total bans adopted. It’s just not going to happen in the next 10 years.” (41:45) — Judith Enck

• On civic engagement:

  “If you start paying attention to plastic in your own life, you see there are alternatives…before you know it, you’re at your city council…You sign up for a decade to do this.” (39:10–41:11) — Judith Enck

• On hope:

  “I’m not discouraged at all. I see progress and I see small numbers of people making a big difference.” (52:59) — Judith Enck

Important Timestamps

• 04:18 – 06:13: Big plastics—companies & regional impact ("Cancer Alley")
• 10:13 – 11:57: Retailers, policy examples, and optimism on chains like Aldi
• 13:41: Why plastic recycling doesn't work
• 17:33: Chemical recycling explained—why it fails
• 19:07 – 23:25: Artificial/synthetic turf as a toxic issue
• 25:10 – 27:55: Cigarette butts, e-cigarettes: the overlooked plastic problem
• 27:55 – 29:59: “Skip the stuff” policies—cutlery & small wins
• 30:23 – 32:56: Reuse/refill systems and practical examples
• 32:56 – 35:37: Government procurement power, inspiring case-studies
• 36:13: The gender gap in environmental leadership
• 41:11 – 43:18: Systemic vs. incremental approaches to bans
• 43:28 – 44:52: Book’s genesis; plastic-free cover
• 44:52 – 46:10: Limitations of tech fixes in waste solutions
• 48:00 – 48:27: Industrial hemp as alternative
• 49:18: Upcoming campaigns and grassroots focus
• 50:56 – 52:13: Political obstacles—Trump & regulatory rollbacks
• 52:41 – 52:51: Book cover is plastic-free!
• 52:59 – 53:15: Judith's concluding optimism

Actionable Resources & Final Thoughts

• Model policies, guides, and advocacy info: beyondplastics.org
• “Start Here” guides in the book—practical home solutions, but the focus is on policy and civic change.
• Plastic-free publishing: The book cover contains no plastic—setting an example for industry.
• Encouragement: Despite the enormity, small groups are winning—persistence matters.

Summary tone:
Informative, urgent but hopeful, empowerment-focused, with a clear call for both individual responsibility and collective civic action.

For listeners new to the plastics crisis, this episode is both a wake-up call and a practical guide to becoming engaged and making change—at home, in your community, and in policy.