Healing The “Untreatable” with Angela Skudin | Part 2

Summary

Kreatures Of Habit Podcast Summary
Episode: Healing The “Untreatable” with Angela Skudin | Part 2
Host: Michael Chernow
Release Date: July 2, 2025

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Introduction

In this compelling episode of the Kreatures Of Habit Podcast, host Michael Chernow engages in a deep and transformative conversation with Angela Skudin. This is the second part of their discussion, delving into Angela’s profound grief journey, her battle with addiction, and her exploration of alternative healing methods such as ibogaine and combo therapy.

Angela’s Grief Journey and Healing Process

Angela begins by sharing her heart-wrenching story of losing her husband three years prior. This loss catapulted her into a powerful grief journey, forcing her to confront her coping mechanisms and rebuild her life without the unconditional love and support that her husband provided.

Angela (00:00):
“I lost my husband three years ago and I've just been in this grief journey and it's, it's, it's, it's been the most powerful experience of my life to go through this grief journey and take everything that I had learned while my husband was still here on earth supporting me purely with unconditional love through my healing…”

Angela emphasizes the return of old patterns when her primary support system was no longer present. She discusses how she chose to avoid substances like alcohol, Xanax, Valium, and antidepressants, opting instead for a new set of tools to aid her healing, including breathwork, meditation, infrared sauna sessions, and self-love practices.

Exploring Ibogaine and Combo Therapy

The conversation shifts to combo therapy, a method Angela advocates for treating conditions such as Lyme disease and cancer. She passionately explains the benefits and potential risks associated with this treatment.

Angela (02:46):
“People have a story in their head and they're like, this isn't going to work or this is going to work or whatever. And whatever you say is well...”

Angela details her personal experiences with combo, describing the intense physical and emotional reactions it can induce, such as flushing, racing heart, anxiety, sweating, crying, vomiting, and even long-lasting body rashes.

Angela (04:00):
“You can die detoxing antidepressants, though, too, you know, like, you can die from anything. So what. Who. Who if. Why wouldn't I use Combo?”

She candidly acknowledges the dangers, noting that combo should be approached with caution, especially for individuals with pre-existing health conditions like kidney or heart issues.

Personal Experiences with Ibogaine

Angela recounts her personal journey with ibogaine, mentioning both her experiences with the raw root bark and the isolated compound in pill form. She describes the challenging process of undergoing ibogaine treatment, including prolonged vomiting and the absence of vivid psychedelic visuals for some users.

Angela (05:53):
“I was one of the 20 percenters. The first time I sat with it and I saw nothing, I vomited all night long… And I fell asleep that night for the first time in my life, unassisted…”

Despite the initial hardships, Angela highlights the long-term benefits she experienced, including improved sleep and overall health.

Addiction, Recovery, and Self-Love

The dialogue delves into the complexities of addiction and recovery. Angela and Michael discuss the importance of self-love in overcoming addiction, as well as the role of community and support systems like AA (Alcoholics Anonymous).

Angela (25:02):
“The number one thing that iboga does, regardless of if you see a psychedelic visual or not, is it connects you to self love. It allows you to begin to love yourself, which is the number one thing that an addict needs.”

Angela also shares testimonials from first responders who have benefited from ibogaine treatments, emphasizing the transformative power of this therapy in achieving sobriety and healing from trauma.

The 343 Fund and Community Support

Angela introduces the 343 Fund, a non-profit organization she founded to support first responders dealing with addiction, trauma, and mental health issues. She shares a touching story of an active-duty firefighter who found hope and sobriety through the fund's support.

Angela (30:21):
“What you want your reality to be, this is the way.”

The testimonial underscores the effectiveness of combining ibogaine therapy with community support, breathwork, and coaching programs.

Expanding Ventures: Space Cowboy Coffee Company and Nornir Apothecary

Beyond her advocacy for ibogaine, Angela discusses her entrepreneurial ventures, including the Space Cowboy Coffee Company and Nornir Apothecary in Long Beach, New York. These businesses focus on providing clean, healthy, and plant-based products to support overall well-being.

Angela (38:36):
“I have a coffee shop actually opening tomorrow in Long Beach, New York, called Space Cowboy Coffee company...”

Final Thoughts and Encouragement

As the episode draws to a close, Michael expresses his gratitude towards Angela for sharing her transformative journey and the impactful work she is doing through the 343 Fund and her businesses. Both speakers emphasize the necessity of having open, non-judgmental conversations about addiction and alternative healing methods to foster understanding and support within the community.

Michael Chernow (42:00):
“All right. You're fucking awesome. Really. I. Angela, I'm so grateful for you and for you being able to come on here and just be like, dude, this is it…”

Conclusion

This episode of Kreatures Of Habit Podcast offers a raw and honest exploration of grief, addiction, and the quest for healing through unconventional methods like ibogaine and combo therapy. Angela Skudin’s powerful narrative serves as an inspiration for listeners seeking alternative paths to recovery and self-love. Michael Chernow facilitates a meaningful dialogue that challenges societal perceptions of addiction and encourages a more compassionate and open-minded approach to healing.

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Notable Quotes:

• Angela (00:00):
  “I lost my husband three years ago and I've just been in this grief journey and it's, it's, it's, it's been the most powerful experience of my life…”

• Angela (04:00):
  “You can die detoxing antidepressants, though, too, you know, like, you can die from anything. So what. Who. Who if. Why wouldn't I use Combo?”

• Angela (25:02):
  “The number one thing that iboga does, regardless of if you see a psychedelic visual or not, is it connects you to self love.”

• Angela (30:21):
  “What you want your reality to be, this is the way.”

• Michael Chernow (42:00):
  “All right. You're fucking awesome. Really. Angela, I'm so grateful for you and for you being able to come on here…”

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Resources Mentioned:

• 343 Fund: 343Fund.org
  A non-profit organization supporting first responders through grants for ibogaine therapy and other healing programs.

• Space Cowboy Coffee Company:
  A new, clean ingredient-focused coffee shop in Long Beach, New York.

• Nornir Apothecary:
  A retail apothecary in Long Beach, New York, offering a variety of plant-based and wellness products.

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Note: This summary excludes the advertisement segment and focuses solely on the content-rich portions of the podcast, ensuring a coherent and comprehensive overview for those who have not listened to the episode.

Transcript

[Angela]

I lost my husband three years ago and I've just been in this grief journey and it's, it's, it's, it's been the most powerful experience of my life to go through this grief journey and take everything that I had learned while my husband was still here on earth, supporting me purely with unconditional love through my healing, and then implement that. Like they say, when the student is ready, the teacher will leave. And the teacher left and I found myself here alone and I had everything. All the patterns came back, you know, to self soothe. What are you going to use? What are you going to choose? And alcohol was never a choice, and Xanax was never a choice and Valium was never a choice and antidepressants were never a choice. For me, I had this whole new box of tools to work with.

[Michael Chernow]

I'm Michael Chernow and this is the Creatures of Habit podcast. Our habits will make us or break us. It's just that simple. I've lived on both sides of the tracks and have learned that the decisions we make on a consistent basis truly define who we are as human beings. On this show, I will be interviewing some of the most inspiring, motivating and high performing humans I've encountered to share their daily habits, routines and rituals that help them stay on top of their game and ultimately happy. So sit back, relax and pay attention because what you hear over the next 30 to 45 minutes could potentially change your life.

[Unknown]

Let's go. Then what? Then you just go straight for the plant medicine?

[Angela]

I mean, you're asking me.

[Unknown]

I'm asking you. You're on the podcast.

[Angela]

Yeah, I would go straight. Like if I got, if I had a, if I got a line flare, if I felt like you feel, if I had what you have going on right here, Combo, I would combo myself and I would get out of it and I wouldn't be suffering anymore. So I would use combo. And if I had Lyme disease, if I had cancer or Lyme disease, these three things, diet, alkaline environment, bee venom therapy, and combo. And if I went out of here and got a cancer diagnosis today, I wouldn't even be worried. I would not go get any chemotherapy treatment. I would 100% just use combo and be venom therapy and I wouldn't even worry about it. I would know mother nature had me. I would know God had the cure and that my body was going to be fine. A lot of the time with disease too. I have to mention this. People have a story in their head and they're like, this isn't going to work or this is going to work or whatever. And whatever you say is well.

[Unknown]

So walk us through. I'm just curious because I'm thinking about the combo thing. Like, what happens on Combo.

[Angela]

Lots of different things could happen. Okay. So for the most part, well, men are served traditionally on their arm. Women are served traditionally on their ankle. Okay. Those two approaches lead for a different experience. Okay. If I give myself an arm combo like a man, it's quicker. It gets to the point quicker. The first thing you're going to feel is, like, flushing through your body. You'll feel your heart racing. It can feel like your throat's closing.

[Unknown]

Scary.

[Angela]

Yeah. It takes you on a. If you're not used to it and you're just meeting the medicine, you're. You're going to go on an anxiety ride. Okay. Short term, you could sweat, you could cry, vomit, get a. I've gotten, like, full body rashes. Like, literally, my body was a hive.

[Unknown]

For how long?

[Angela]

Two hours maybe. But I can eat wheat now. I couldn't have gluten until I cleared all of that out with Combo, and now I eat gluten just fine. So. For 13 years, I didn't.

[Unknown]

Can anything really bad happen on using Combo?

[Angela]

Yeah. Yeah. Like, you.

[Unknown]

You can die.

[Angela]

I'm sure. I'm sure there's. There's people that have died. You can die detoxing antidepressants, though, too, you know, like, you can die from anything. So what. Who. Who if. Why wouldn't I use Combo? I was getting trained in Combo, and this girl, she was, like, really sick with Lyme disease, like, you know, like, just in the depths of it, right to where she was, like, just having trouble sitting up or whatever. She had a kidney condition anyway. You don't want to use Condo or Combo if you've got something going on with your kidneys, because that's where it's processing through. So that's not a great idea. So, yeah, you don't. You want to make sure that you are not in terrible health? Like, heart condition, kidney. Kidneys, those kinds of things. Other than that, I mean, I had a heart condition, and I went for Combo, but nothing happened to me. But what it does is it's intelligent. It's kind of like cbd, almost like your inner cannaboid system will. It goes where it needs to go. So you're gonna have a different experience every time. Like, if you've got gut issues going on, it's gonna go to your gut. If. If you've got, like, like for me, I had got MAST cell activation, so it went from my skin. Women will get like, if they get like, like fillers, like lip fillers or like the, the gel or whatever. I don't know if it does it with Botox, but I've heard with lip fillers it'll actually like go to the site that they got can. They can feel it like in where they put foreign matter in their body. So what's going on during that? I have no idea. You know, I'm not a doctor, but yeah, vomiting, puking, and you can get a double rainbow. I've gotten a double rainbow.

[Unknown]

What's that?

[Angela]

When you get it out both ends, you know, you're, you're puking in your pooping. Yeah, you're pooping. It lasts 20 minutes.

[Unknown]

That's it.

[Angela]

That's it.

[Unknown]

So it's a 20 minute long thing.

[Angela]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

And it's super powerful.

[Angela]

Super powerful.

[Unknown]

And how often do you think like you, you would like need to do.

[Angela]

It, like, what is wrong with you?

[Unknown]

Right.

[Angela]

If I got bit by one of my friends, just got bit by a tick. She's in upstate New York, so we'll just use her for an example. And she's a combo practitioner.

[Unknown]

Okay.

[Angela]

So she's going to do 40 days where she's going to sit with combo like at least twice a week for 40 days. So that's what I would do if I got Lyme disease.

[Unknown]

Do you know she says she. Does she know she's got Lyme or is she just got a tick bite?

[Angela]

No, but I mean most ticks will have it. If you get bit by a tick, what are you going to do today?

[Unknown]

Honestly, I do doxycycline. Like that's, you know, because that's, that's.

[Angela]

You're going to go get a prescription. I'm immediately going to go get an antibiotic. I am going to my doctor if I get bit by a tick and I am demanding six weeks of doxycycline. None of this seven days, none of this 30 days. The half life on Lyme disease. And in cases in the biofilm, you need more than seven days or more than 30 days to kill it. So you know, why are you going to halfway do it and then God forbid you start provoking and you just get an antibiotic protocol for seven days or 30 days and you, you didn't kill it, you provoked it. And then your whole system then boom, you're just going to.

[Unknown]

Right, because I know that they, that I've heard that like antibiotics could potentially just literally wake them up. Yeah, wake them up and.

[Angela]

And then they're awake and you didn't do anything about it. You know, they're just thriving. They're having a party because your doctor's like, no, you're. No, you're gut health, you know, like, and they don't want you to take the antibiotics. But, yeah, that's. Lyme disease is probably. Is one of the few things that will get me to run to a doctor. A tick bite is a few things that will get me to run to a doctor and immediately demand antibiotics. So.

[Unknown]

So now I'm all scared of combo.

[Angela]

Um, why?

[Unknown]

You know, I think so. I've been doing a lot of breath work, and I. I'm just a hyper responder to everything, you know, so do.

[Angela]

A dot and see how you respond. I did that to a woman who's hyper responsive, and she's from Ohio. She was in our. She actually works for 3, 4, 3 now, but she went through our grant process and super sensitive. Like, super, super sensitive. So I gave her one dot. If you have a responsible practitioner and you should. They should work with your fears, and they should work with.

[Unknown]

Well, I think for me, the reason why is because. So when I. When I do breath and I do a fair amount of breath work now for the last couple years, you know, if I go for it, which I do, I could very easily feel like I'm having a heart attack. And I have to, like, I. I've learned way more about my body now to, like, understand how to, like, you know, pump the brakes a little bit when I need to and go deeper when I feel like I can. But my body, I just get nervous that, like, something bad is gonna happen. And I think it's from the years and years of drug abuse where I just didn't give a. And I was like, you know, I mean, there were. There were probably from 14 to. To 18, I would say. I mean, I had taken 5,000 hits of ecstasy. I was taking 20 hits of ecstasy a day for, you know, three, four days a week. I mean, I was completely out of my mind, and I think that really fucked my body up.

[Angela]

Well, no, you love yourself now, right?

[Unknown]

Totally.

[Angela]

Yeah. And you didn't love yourself back then?

[Unknown]

No.

[Angela]

So now you're like, you're your best dad to your body, and you want to make sure that whatever's coming for your body isn't gonna hurt your kid.

[Unknown]

But I'm so intrigued for the combo you.

[Angela]

I 100. I feel like you can get rid of what? You're going through with this with Combo? Yeah, it's. It's not that hard. I'm telling you what. What I described to you from Combo. I told you everything that could happen.

[Unknown]

Right.

[Angela]

Okay. Now, have I had all of that happen to me? Yes. How many times have I sat with convo? So many times. I have no idea how to answer that question. I have no idea.

[Unknown]

You sat with it a lot.

[Angela]

A lot. Yeah. I tell people, they say, how many times should you do combo? Do combo? So until you have no idea how many times you've done it, and then you're good for so many reasons. Number one. Why are you counting?

[Unknown]

Mm.

[Angela]

Your ego.

[Unknown]

Well, I think also for me, because it's, you know, for me being just in the world of recovery. Right. Like, I. You know, I mean, I've been told now you're the last person to tell me, but, you know, combo is not something that psychoactively impairs your. Like, you're not going to, like. It's not like a psych. It's not a psychedelic.

[Angela]

No, it's not a psychedelic.

[Unknown]

But iboga is a psychedelic.

[Angela]

It is a psychedelic. But why would it. Why does a psychedelic mean that, like, we give kids ketamine before they go into surgery, and that's a psychedelic, too.

[Unknown]

So why are you asking me? Why would I feel like I'm jeopardizing my recovery with a psychedelic?

[Angela]

Yeah. If it's. If it's medicine for your healing.

[Unknown]

Yeah. I mean, I think that it's just a. I haven't had the call for it. Right. And I think. And I don't. And I know a lot of people in recovery that have used psychedelics and gone on journeys, and I passed no judgment. I just know, for me, I loved psychedelics when I was in active addiction. Loved.

[Angela]

Yeah. What were you doing?

[Unknown]

Lots of psilocybin.

[Angela]

Okay.

[Unknown]

Lots of acid. Definitely. Lots of ecstasy. I was like, before the MDMA era, so I wasn't experiencing much. I mean, I think I did MDMA a few times, but I was really, like, in the pill press, pill ecstasy days, and it was just, you know, I probably did more cocaine, heroin, and alcohol than I did. I mean, psilocybin and shit, but, man, did I love mushrooms. Like, some of the greatest nights of my life. I remember as a teenager running around New York City on mushrooms. Super duper fun. I just would be nervous to step over that line, because I am. I'll be 21 years sober this year in a couple months. Like, I am an addict to the fucking maximus. Like, I know it. No one. Like, I just am. You ask my wife anything that I like to do, anything. Hunting, fishing, fitness, business, throwing the football with my kids. Like, I like all that. I do it to the death. To the death.

[Angela]

Okay.

[Unknown]

And so I've just, I get scared about thinking, thinking about playing with that fire because that fire will burn down my house. I know that is true now, again, I know a lot of people that are heavy, that were people in it, that are in recovery with me, that I used to party with, that were as bad, if not worse than I am, sat with ayahuasca, Iboga, all the things, and they're fine. So. And you're, you're, you're sitting in front of me, you're like, yep. I mean, I was a hardcore Adderall addict. You know, I drank a lot. I did all these things.

[Angela]

Adderall, Xanax, cocaine, alcohol.

[Unknown]

Yeah, yeah. And you're, you know, and so, like, I have to be very careful about what I say because the last thing I'd want to do is like, try to tell people because I haven't experienced it personally. Right. I haven't experienced personally. I think the platform is like, yo, what. What I have experienced, I am so happy, confident and stoked to share my experience with and my story with. But if I haven't experienced it, it's hard for me to be like, oh, yeah, well, this person did it and they're good. And this person did it and they're good. Like, I don' I would be afraid to say that there is a cure for addiction because now we know that addiction is a real mental illness. Actually, it is a mental illness. I mean, I had a guy on the podcast that had been studying this. He's a double board certified neurologist and addiction specialist. He did human clinical studies on the brain and found out it is a brain injury disease, addiction. Our lipid system is very different than his lipid list. You know what I mean? Like, we fire dopamine 10 times. Our dopamine responders, responsors. So I just. Okay, let me hear, let me hear that bogus stuff.

[Angela]

I love the intro. Everything you're saying, I'm like, I'm over here. Just like, I know, I can see.

[Unknown]

It, I can see it.

[Angela]

Because you're just like, everything you're saying is just going to help me help you in your community. I'm going to take one compound. We're going to talk about one, because it is, it's the compound of the hour. In the United States right now, yesterday, for the listeners that don't know, the state of Texas just signed a bill into law allotting $50 million in state funding from the state of Texas towards the research and development of ibogaine for therapeutic use for addiction, unresolved trauma and depression, ptsd, all that stuff. So there are currently working on, you know, I think they're doing a 60 day window for bids for medical facilities to roll this out medically. And the question was asked to. Governor asked a question about drugs or this is a drug. And he said, this is not a drug, this is a medicine. So what happened with iboga? You mentioned all this stuff you were talking about. You love to party. Like, I love to party so much. So I completely know what you're saying about wanting to go trip and wanting to, like, go party with mushrooms with your friends and go hit acid and go to the. The festival and just be out there raving, right? Mm. No one goes to party with iboga or ibogaine. It is not a party drug. It's not a drug. It's a compound from a plant. It's been mislabeled as a scheduled one controlled substance. You know, as I think addicts, they look at those lists and they look at, you know, what we're told are drugs, and we rely on that. And here ibogaine is listed as a scheduled one controlled substance, which means that it doesn't have any therapeutic value to the human body and it's addictive. Neither of those things are true. You also said that as addicts that we have, our dopamine receptors are firing like 10 times higher. So you could go as an addict knowing that, and you could get into recovery. You could go to aa, whatever. You could go get sober, right? And you could be sober and still have that going on, Right? Mm. You can go sit with ibogaine and you can completely reset your dopamine and your serotonin receptors, all of your receptors back to non addicts. And then you can. You have the neuroplasticity because this medicine works on that. We know that from the limited studies that it's had so far. It regenerates white matter in the brain. So we're talking about things that can help with ms, Parkinson's, dementia, Alzheimer's. My sister just went. She's just a regular mom from stay at home mom from Texas. She used to be a pharmaceutical sales rep. Super straight girl. Nothing like her sister. She just went down for ibogaine for chronic pain. She had chronic pain. They didn't know what it was from. They were going to remove my sister's gallbladder. She woke up from ibogaine at a clinic in Ambio Life Sciences in Tijuana, Mexico, and she had no pain, and she hasn't had any pain since that day. She's completely pain free, and she now doesn't have to have her gallbladder removed.

[Unknown]

So is there a way to do ibogaine without having to go through the psychedelic component part of it?

[Angela]

Well, sure. I did ibogaine the first time I ever sat with iboga, which is. It's the same. It's just ibogaine. They've isolated it into the compound into a pill. So you can just take a few pills. With iboga, you have to eat a lot of root bark. So you can either do that just raw or in a capsule form. So four pills I took with ibogaine, and I took about. I took over 50 root bark pills, had to swallow over 50 with iboga. So it's a more comfortable experience to do the ibogaine. Yeah. So 20% of the population sees nothing. They have seen nothing on this journey, and they think it didn't work. You know, they just are like, oh, my gosh. They expect they're sitting with the most powerful psychedelic in the world. I'm gonna have this profound psychedelic experience. I was one of the 20 percenters. The first time I sat with it and I saw nothing, I vomited all night long. I mean, probably 12 hours. Just like projectile vomiting to the point where it's just like, oh, my God, how can I? Is this going to stop? And the next day is traditionally referred to as gray day. After ibogaine, it feels like a hangover, but not. And it's just like, everything's kind of gray. You're still in the medicine. Ibogaine can last anywhere from 12 to 36 hours. And so you're kind of still in the medicine. And I was really hard on myself during great aches. I thought, what am I doing? At the time, I just thought. I just took it too far. And you're crazy. You're doing B venom theory. You're doing combo. Now you got some dude from California in your living room giving you this root bark, and you vomited for 12 hours and you didn't see anything. And I fell asleep that night for the first time in my life, unassisted, without a Xanax, without Tylenol pm, without alcohol, without. Without anything, without drugging myself or putting something in me to sleep. Melatonin. Whatever. And I slept for eight hours and I have done that like clockwork ever since. And more than that, I haven't gone to see a doctor, I haven't been sick once, I haven't gotten a cold, I haven't had anything wrong with my body.

[Unknown]

How many times have you sat with it to date?

[Angela]

I've sat with iboga two times and ibogaine two times as well for different reasons.

[Unknown]

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Back to the Pod and so you'll choose to go back to the Medicine if something comes up and you feel like you need a little so I'm.

[Angela]

Going back to the medicine. Something's come up and I'm going back to the Medicine at the end of this month. So yeah, I, I lost my husband three years ago and I've just been in this grief journey and it's, it's, it's. It's been the most powerful experience of my life to go through this grief journey and take everything that I had learned while my husband was still here on earth supporting me purely with unconditional love through my Healing and then implement that. Like they say, when the student is ready, the teacher will leave. And the teacher left. And I found myself here alone. And I had everything, all the patterns came back, you know, to self soothe. What are you going to use? What are you going to choose? And alcohol was never a choice and Xanax was never a choice and Valium was never a choice and antidepressants were never a choice. For me, I had this whole new box of tools to work with. I had what you mentioned, the breath work. I had meditation, I had my infrared sauna. I had self love. You know, I didn't want to do those things to my body anymore. And I'm going to tell you the number one thing that iboga does, regardless of if you see a psychedelic visual or not, is it connects you to self love. It allows you to begin to love yourself, which is the number one thing that an addict needs. So to deny yourself the possibility of resetting your addiction receptors just from the knowledge that you know and regenerating your brain, that would be silly, Michael.

[Unknown]

You know, it's, it's, it's. I, it's a controversial topic I think, for not only me, but just the.

[Angela]

I get it. It's about control. Addiction is about control. And to think about a loss of control for an addict is absolutely terrifying because you're maintaining and you're maintaining on a pattern that you have control over and you need the pattern. That's where you're going to thrive.

[Unknown]

Well, I also think that it's just like, for not just me, but other people and probably people listening to the podcast. Like, you know, it's interesting, right? You're an addict and like the very, very small percentage of addicts that actually, you know, I'll tell a quick story. My best friend, best friend, all time best friend, running buddy from 13 years old till I was 23 when I got sober just before my 24th birthday party. Hard. I mean it's so interesting you say party like the last five to seven years of my addiction story was not a party. There was no partying happening. It was self mutilation and, and, and, and self hate and, and wanting to die slowly, right? So I was lucky enough to get sober in, in 2004 and my best friend stayed out and he, he was always a, he always turned the volume up a little bit louder than I did, you know. And so he got sober eventually in like 2008 and I was like super grateful. He got sober 2008 and stayed sober for 10, 11 years. But I mean, now knowing where he is, like, I think there was a little bit of in and out, but he didn't make that clear. Anyway, godfather of my first son, my best friend, like, the best guy. You. You meet him, you, like, you're like, oh, my God, this guy's the best guy. And the most talented musician, played in bands that, you know well, opened up for Bob Dylan for years around the world. Like, married to this wonderful woman, like, just. Just built this incredible life. Anyway, no longer sober, living on the street in skid row for the last five years. I haven't spoken to him in three years. And the last time I spoke to him, I flew to LA to try to get. To try to convince him that I had a shaman that was going to meet us in the desert in Ojai to administer ayahuasca with him, because I was told that ayahuasca could potentially be a good medicine to shake the tree for an active addict, because you don't need to, like, apparently with iboga, you need to be off drugs for, like, a period of time, and ayahuasca, you don't. You can kind of just go into it. I mean, obviously, I don't know enough about it, but that's.

[Angela]

Yes and no, but keep going.

[Unknown]

Yeah. So I grabbed Tay out of the tents and thing. I take him to the desert. Shaman comes. I'm pacing in the desert for, like, 12 hours by myself, watching this shit go down, right where Tay is, just under the blankets, like, just, you know, going through it. He gets done with that, gets back into the car with me, opens up his bag, pulls out a crack pipe and just goes for it. Did nothing for him, did not help him. I get a call from Tay. I haven't spoken to him in three years. I get a call from Tay last weekend, and he's in complete psychosis, full blown psychosis, telling me that there are worms and parasites in his eyeballs, in his throat, in his tongue, all over his skin. He's ripped holes all over his body. He's. He's like, mike, everybody thinks I'm crazy. I'm telling you, I got parasites all over my body, man. And I go to the hospital, I go to the er, they kick me out, they tell me I'm crazy. He's also told. He also. He also told me that he's looking at 25 to life for attempted murder that he's been framed for. He's in a full psychosis. He had an amazing life, like, a really amazing life sober. And one decision, two Decisions changed his whole entire path. And so when I think about jeopardizing my life by doing something that even if it, if it's not going to take me out, it just scares the out of me.

[Angela]

Are you struggling right now with addiction, with active addiction?

[Unknown]

No, but I. I am addicted to other things.

[Angela]

Okay, so it should scare you. That's what your ego's job is. If you didn't have our ego, like we wouldn't be alive. And its job is to keep you safe. So you're in your patterns and you're staying safe and that's great. And you may never go to this, you know, but like I have this right here. This is from an active duty firefighter that told me when I met him through my organization that sends firefighters.

[Unknown]

Yeah, so. And I also want to make sure we talk about that too.

[Angela]

But anyway, so I have this firefighter, he fills out an application and he is wants. He wants to die. You know, this guy just wants to die. And he's been trying so hard to get sober, you know, and he is drunk and driving a fire truck too, you know, behind. No one knows. This is a secret, but this isn't uncommon, you know, people are suffering. And he. I have his testimony right here. He's anonymous active duty firefighter from Texas. I have struggled with alcohol, PTSD and depression for years. I've tried over seven inpatient rehab facilities, Sober living, AA pharmaceuticals and individual therapy. I was never able to maintain long term sobriety or address my trauma. I was broken, hopeless and at the end of my rope. Suicide felt to me like the only way out. And a friend reached out to me, told me about ambio life sciences and the success many have had with plant medicine. Unable to pay for it, I heard about a not for profit organization. This was the first time I'd heard of the Casey Scuden 343 fund. This fund was started by Casey's wife, that's me, Angela, to honor Casey who's a member of the FDNY and died far too soon in a tragic accident. Within a few days after putting an application, I got a phone call telling me was I accepted. I had no idea how profound and life changing this healing journey was going to be. Since returning home, I've had zero desire to drink, experienced joy, love, peace and purpose in my life. The fund didn't just save my life, it gave it back. This man is going to be a year sober on July 15. He runs with this fire department, a community of sober support. The fire department gives them a Space to meet. I asked him what has kept him sober and he said community. And he also said, also acknowledging like looking at himself, being able to. I love myself. Now I'm having a craving for alcohol. Is it, is it really a craving for alcohol? What can I do with it? What can I, what new tool can I move to for him? He moves towards like what you mentioned, breath work. I think a lot of people will move that or towards this community support. He is now in a coaching program. He's going to be one of my coaches for people coming through and leading small group pre and post journey supports for me. So this man tried everything to get sober and he is now not drunk at the firehouse. So our communities are safer. He's walking other people, shepherding them through this process. And he has freed himself of his addiction and gotten to the point where he can actually sit and view his patterns rather than just going and grabbing the bottle and choose better for himself because he has self love. So just because something has been categorized by the US government as a Schedule 1 controlled substance doesn't mean people should say that's a drug. This isn't a drug. This is a medical compound. The governor of Texas said so yesterday. And the people of Texas have put $50 billion into developing this. 50 million million. Why have we, I'm Austin, probably you're like 50,000.

[Unknown]

50 billion. 50 billion. At least.

[Angela]

I'm not saying 50,000.

[Unknown]

50 trillion. The people of Texas have put. What's 50 billion?

[Angela]

300 million trillion. I'm like Biden over here saying numbers. Anyway, $50 million.

[Unknown]

Listen, I, I, this is, we've covered so much and we, this is like, I, there's got to be a round two of this podcast. But because there's just so much, there's so much. And I'm actually really excited to share with you sort of what my experience is after the retreat because chances are I will do combo.

[Angela]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

And, and the other, the other, I guess they're called warrior medicines.

[Angela]

Okay. I can tell you what you're going to experience with that. Do you want the sonanga, their eye drops for your eyes?

[Unknown]

Yeah, that's what I've heard. That's going to be tough, right?

[Angela]

Super hard. Super hard. And you're gonna think you're never gonna see again and that you're blind and you're gonna, maybe even people kick their legs and act like children and then.

[Unknown]

In five minutes it's gone.

[Angela]

Five minutes it's gone. And then you have this capacity to control your anger to, to See things differently that you. You didn't have before. Like you have this inner vision. Is what. Sanaga works on Hoppe. Amazing. Great for grounding. It's tobacco and plants crushed up. It depends on what kind, what formula you're gonna have. You can have all sorts of different plants in that Hoppe and depending on the plant, it depends on the kind of energy that goes into it. So a masculine or a feminine plant will alter it. So tobacco is already super masculine. So it's kind of like a. Mmm. A lot of people use it before meditation because it just literally just grounds you like root to ground. When you do hopping, it clears everything out so it gets your mind ready to sit with the medicine. Kind of relieves that anxiety a little bit. When you first initially get it though, you're going to feel like you're drowning. Just breathe out your mouth and then just. You'll be ready for the other side. But yeah, it's kind of a. It'll hit your pineal gland and just kind of like just get you into it. But I think you're gonna like it. That is super addictive. And a lot of people that do that start. I see. I'll be like, oh, we got another hop A addict. You know. So it's tobacco.

[Unknown]

Got it.

[Angela]

So that one's like. I got addicted to hoppe during my healing. I was like it was. Luckily it was during 2020. So you had that face mask on. So you're just snortinopy up your nose.

[Unknown]

Oh my gosh.

[Angela]

But I'm interested to hear about.

[Unknown]

Yeah, I'll tell. I'm going to tell you all about it and then we'll have you back on the show. I mean I know that there's going to be a lot of, a lot of commentary on this one and I think, I think you know, having an open mind and I'm curious as hell like what would be. What is life like if you. I don't believe in blinders and I am an open minded dude and I think for this kind of platform, this kind of setting, like I'm just so curious and that's. And, and you know I. I've got another really good friend who.

[Angela]

So I want to go get your friend on skid row and take him to the ibogaine clinic.

[Unknown]

I think they had.

[Angela]

He would need two journeys though. He would need back to back.

[Unknown]

I think he, I think also like you got. You know, he was, he was asking for help a couple of days ago last week and I. And the minute that help came he got squarely, you know, and so, you know, they look, you got to be ready. Right? I think unfortunately for him. And I'm. I'm never one to. To be like, oh, too far gone. See ya. Like, unless they're dead. Right? Like, that's. That's the way I kind of see it because I've. I've seen a lot of crazy things over the last 21 years, but we gotta wrap this thing up. I just. I'm so grateful for you. Like the 343 fund. So anybody that's interested in learning more about that, how can they. What would be a way for them to do that?

[Angela]

Well, that is the fund that I have that helps first responders, career firefighters, EMTs, or police officers 10 or more years. They can go to 343Fund.org and apply for a grant application to be part of our program. And that's also. The 343Fund.org is also where you can go to donate to help save the life of a first responder. 99% of the funds that come into our organization go directly out to help save the life of a first responder.

[Unknown]

And then you also have a few businesses. Tell us about the coffee shop.

[Angela]

I have a coffee shop actually opening tomorrow in Long Beach, New York, called Space Cowboy Coffee company. And I just opened this coffee shop because there was nowhere to get clean ingredient drinks beverages in my town. And I was just sick of it. So I said, well, I'm gonna open a coffee shop. So I have no idea what I'm doing.

[Unknown]

So this is. This will be the first coffee shop.

[Angela]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

And then the other businesses.

[Angela]

Retail. Retail businesses. I have a retail apothecary business called Nornir Apothecary in Long Beach, New York.

[Unknown]

I'm really interested in going to check that place out. When I was looking at, I was like, this has got some cool, funky stuff.

[Angela]

It's really cool. You have to go in a store to get into it. So it's in Codfish Cowboy, and you, like, go through the, like the old, bathroom of that store, and then you go into this other store and it's a whole new vibe. It, like, completely changes. So cool. Yeah. So I own the Codfish Cowboy in Long Beach, New York, and Nornir Apothecary and the Space Cowboy Coffee Company.

[Unknown]

So, girl, you're killing it. You're killing it. And you've beat. You've beat. You beat the heat with Lyme disease. I mean, that's big. That's crazy.

[Angela]

Yeah. I'll get You, I'm going to get you on the other side of that too.

[Unknown]

So I'm, you know, I've heard that a bunch. I had another guy on the podcast about eight, nine months ago tell me that too. Didn't work.

[Angela]

Oh, you haven't saw the combo yet?

[Unknown]

No, no, no. And then that, that, you know, so I gotta, Yeah, I mean, I got all sorts of things going on upstairs right now, but I, you know, and that, and, and I think having people on the podcast that are thought provoking, that make people think. I mean, I think that's it, right? Like, you know, you can hear, you know, the podcast is this, I do believe this is here to make, to, to just give people an opportunity to just think outside the box, you know, like take a few things home with you, leave what you don't want, maybe get triggered, maybe get to definitely, you know, there's gonna be a lot of sober people that are gonna be like that guy.

[Angela]

You know what? My, I, I grew, I grew up and I come from generational alcoholics. You know, my, my, my mom is sober now and she went through AA to get sober. And I remember my mom told me, you cannot be sober if you are not going to an AA meeting every day or every, like whatever her rules for her sobriety were at the time. And I, she clearly said that that woman would die on that sword, you know, because that was her reality in that moment, which made it true for everyone else. My mom hasn't been to an AA meeting in probably 20 years and my mom's still sober, you know, so whatever you want your reality to be, this is the way.

[Unknown]

I think we should finish with this. I agree with you. I think that the, the, the facts are AA n a 12 step. From my experience and from what I've seen is the most powerful way for addicts to get sober and happy. Now, now I don't go to AA anymore. I check in once in a while, but I don't go. The first 10 years, though, I went hard. I had a commitment for the 10 years. For the first 10 years, I was at meetings probably five to seven days a week. And I was in it and I needed it because I was ready to die an addict, you know, and so I owe my life to AA for sure. I do.

[Angela]

Yeah. My mom too.

[Unknown]

Yeah. I owe my life to it. However, they do plant this seed that if you don't, if you don't go, you're gonna go out and you're gonna use and drink if you know, and, and, and And I don't. I haven't found that to be true for me. I know it is true for other. For a lot of other people. I know, though, you stop going too early and you know. Anyway. All right. You're fucking awesome. Really. I. Angela, I'm so grateful for you and for you being able to come on here and just be like, dude, this is it. This is just like my story. This is what it is. This is how it is. Like, I can't say this is facts for everyone, but I can tell you right now, this is my life and I've. And you've saved other people's lives with the same, same, same philosophy. Thanks for being here.

[Angela]

Thanks, Michael.

[Unknown]

Guys. Holy smokes. All right, there it is. That was a good one. That's gonna bring, that's gonna. That is going to put some goosebumps on people's arms and legs and make you some people angry, make some people really happy. And I'm ready for all of it. I think that these conversations need to be had. I don't think. I know. These conversations need to be had. We need to be a little bit more comfortable having conversations that are a little bit more open minded and not so judgmental and closed off. And, you know, I'm hosting this retreat with a bunch of men and I've got a council of men that are living in the. Speak the exact same language as Angela does. Exact to the T. They sound very, very similar. I was like picking up on the things, you know, and I'm interested in the exploration of this. Am I going to go ahead and do these things? I don't know. Probably not. For right now, that's what I could tell you. But I'm a curious person. I'm a discovery junkie. I want to understand all of it because I think, why not? Why kick something off the table if you don't know enough about it? So look into it, explore it, you know, and that's what, that's what I'm here to help you do. This is, this is a resource for you. So I appreciate you guys listening. Share the podcast with someone who you think also could, would appreciate this. Could, could use this. Could, would, would, would, would benefit from hearing this podcast. Write us a review. Give us a five star rating. I'd love you to death. And you know, tell your friends, tell your friends about us. Subscribe. We love you. Until the next one, y' all. Peace.