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- [00:00]
Mike Marolt
You don't just fall into pat. You don't just pick up something and love it and say, I'm passionate about it. Passion is something where you love it so much that you don't have to obsess over it. You know it's going to be there. You know that it makes you feel good. It's just a beautiful place to be where you're doing it exclusively for the right reasons.
- [00:26]
Michael Chernow
So do you think that you could comfortably say the difference between passion and obsession is. Obsession is more goal oriented, Passion is more soul oriented.
- [00:41]
Mike Marolt
Totally.
- [00:42]
Michael Chernow
You like that one?
- [00:43]
Mike Marolt
I do. And it's, you know, the difference is that you'll know when you're in a state of passion when you know that you don't have to do it.
- [00:56]
Michael Chernow
I'm Michael Chernow and this is the Creatures of Habit podcast.
- [01:01]
Podcast Narrator
Our habits will make us or break us.
- [01:04]
Michael Chernow
It's just that simple. I've lived on both sides of the tracks and have learned that the decisions.
- [01:09]
Podcast Narrator
We make on a consistent basis truly define who we are as human beings.
- [01:15]
Michael Chernow
On this show, I will be interviewing.
- [01:17]
Podcast Narrator
Some of the most inspiring, motivating and high performing humans I've encountered to share.
- [01:22]
Michael Chernow
Their daily habits, routines and rituals that help them stay on top of their game and ultimately happy.
- [01:30]
Podcast Narrator
So sit back, relax and pay attention.
- [01:32]
Michael Chernow
Because what you hear over the next 30 to 45 minutes could potentially change your life.
- [01:38]
Mike Marolt
Let's go.
- [01:44]
Michael Chernow
You are a very interesting human being. You are an expert mountaineer, but the difference between you and someone that would just be, you know, heading out to go summit Everest is that you ski down. Yeah, that's been your thing.
- [02:04]
Mike Marolt
Skiing is really a way of life. And you know, my dad was an Olympian and my uncles were Olympians and so that was kind of the go to for family get togethers. I got a twin brother, an older brother and a sister and my mom. We all skied and you know, dad kind of introduced us to it and you know, I loved ski racing my whole life and, but just skiing. And you know, dad also, when he was younger training and didn't have a lot of money and couldn't get to South America or the glaciers in Europe in the summer, we had year round snowfields, small glaciers in Colorado and he would drive up there and he would climb up and he would train and when we got to be about 12 years old, it was July 3rd and my dad said, guys, go throw your ski gear in the back of the station wagon. Scratching our heads, looking at him like, dad's losing it. It's you know, July 3rd, we just got off the baseball field, we're playing golf and. But we worshiped dad and got in the car and he drove us up to Independence Pass, which is just outside of Aspen. You can drive to it and then you get out at the top and you hike up to about 12,000, 13,000ft and then you ski back down, then you hitchhike back up to get your car. So he introduced us to that. And my brothers and I never aspired to be Olympic ski racers. We just, you know, it's a really unique talent that you either have or you don't. We loved ski racing and we were good ski racers, but we weren't that good. But we had really good motors for endurance. We figured that out when we were younger and so we just kind of parlayed that love of skiing into climbing mountains. After that day, we skied down and I was just hooked. My dad was also in that mountain culture world and he was friends with a guy named Jim Whitaker, who was the first American to climb Everest. And Jim gave my dad a book, Americans on Everest. And it's not an exaggeration. Before we could read, we were flipping through the pictures and I just remember the blue sky and the white snow and the color of the gear and it was just like, that's what I'm going to do. So we incorporated the climbing and the skiing and the endurance with, with the mountaineering and you know, here I am.
- [04:45]
Michael Chernow
So you've been doing this for 40 years now, maybe longer, and you've, you've, you've attempted or have accomplished or conquered 80 peaks, is that right?
- [04:59]
Mike Marolt
It's just over 60.
- [05:01]
Michael Chernow
Just over 60 peaks. What give me, I'm dying to hear a story. You know, like there's, there's obviously the great stories and then there's also the challenging stories. I am sort of more inclined to hear the challenging stories because you're sitting here in front of me right now. So I would imagine that there are certain things that have happened along your 40 plus year journey of climbing mountains and then skiing down that have forced you to enhance your self awareness in life in general from things that have happened out there. So do you have any of those stories that you could share that are, that were really like, wow, that was intense.
- [05:39]
Mike Marolt
Yeah. You know, it's kind of an interesting question because, you know, nine out of 10 people ask you about what was it like to be on that summit or that summit. And summits are great, but we've never been driven by summits. And it sounds really trite, but it really is about the journey. And we had progressed in the sport up to about, I don't know, six or seven years ago, to where we decided that we wanted to take our climbing and skiing to the ultimate level, and the ultimate level in the Himalayas in the winter. And the reason why it's the ultimate level is because in the winter, Himalaya, you have just enormous cold and enormous wind. And we decided that we wanted to go to a peak that we had skied in the regular season. It's about 24,000ft called Mostagata in northwestern China. And nobody had ever climbed this peak in the winter. And we knew it was going to be daunting because it sticks up out of the Tibetan plateau and it's literally the hub of the seven great ranges of the world. They all come to this point. And so it gets hammered with wind, hammered with cold. The weather station on the top was recording -107 degrees, and the winds were just blowing 100 miles an hour from the west. Then it would change to the east. And. But we had built up this experience. We were later in our careers and we decided we were going to go try it. And so we tried it three times and didn't get to the top. But on the final expedition, we got up to about 21,000ft and another storm came in. And I mean, just cold beyond cold. You know, it wasn't 107 below zero where we were, but it was all of 60 or 70 below zero. And so we said, well, we got to get out of here. We got to retreat. And the thing about wind on those mountains is that if you're on snow, there's a thing called ground effect. So if the wind is blowing 100 miles an hour and you've got boulders that are 2ft high, if you get below 2ft, you're not going to blow off the mountain. And there were just enough boulders to where we knew that if the gusts came, because if you get hit by much over 100 mile an hour wind, you're going to blow away. And so we packed up everything and we're going down now. Skiing or trekking, we're walking, we're on a talus rock field, and we have to get down to base camp for safety. And I put my pack on and all of a sudden the wind hit me. And it's like, you know when you see the cartoons with the guy getting hit by a cannonball? The wind hits me, picks me off my feet, blows me back. Thank God I Landed on my pack, and I thought, wow, you know, didn't even have time to get scared. So I'm trying to get back to my feet, and I look back at my brother Steve, who's about 50 yards up the hill, and he's ragdolling in the wind. He's literally cartwheeling. The wind has just picked him up and is blowing him across the. The slope. He was, okay. So we had to go down about 2,000ft, and you could hear the wind coming. It would sound like a jet, and you would immediately get on your stomach. And it took us eight, nine hours to descend 2,000ft. And that was probably the most satisfying experience that I've had in my whole life. And it's just the irony of climbing in the Himalayan the winter is that without a close second, the most miserable thing you can possibly choose to do, but the most satisfying. And didn't even get close to the summit. But the summit success was overshadowed by the just survival. And you go through experiences like that. I mean, summits are great, but they're fleeting moments. It's those. The hardship and the struggle and the perseverance and the courage that it takes to keep after it, just to survive is what really makes us keep going back. And a lot of people don't really get to experience that. You know, they climb commercially and they're told what to do, and they're very conservative, and they don't allow themselves to get out there and learn through the epic. Epics in life are what teach you how to survive and how to succeed. And that's the reason why, I think, at age 60, we're still planning and executing expeditions to these high peaks.
- [10:49]
Michael Chernow
Wow.
- [10:49]
Mike Marolt
So.
- [10:50]
Michael Chernow
And you guys go out there. No Sherpa, no guide. Like, you're out there, you're planning and executing all alone, 100%. So I have to ask the question. You just finished telling me a pretty terrifying tale. What do you think? I mean, what I'm sort of picking up from you, or kind of assuming, is that you're addicted to surviving. You're addicted to survival. You are obsessed with survival and what it makes me think, and I would imagine there's something here. For a million years, beings on two feet have been forced to survive. And that is what we have been judged on, our ability to survive. As time has evolved, let's just call it, in the last five to 700 years, survival has become far easier than the last 900, 500, you know, 9,500,000 years. Right. So if I think what I'm sort of picking up here is that like you are an extreme survivalist and that makes you feel most alive.
- [12:27]
Mike Marolt
Yeah, I mean, you hear adventure athletes talk about it all the time. I mean, you don't feel alive unless you're bumping up against that envelope. But I think what I've learned is that I'm not obsessed with survival. That's a part of us. And you know, it's the saying is we're designed to survive more than thrive. And that's totally true. For all of those years, you know, you had to make a fight or flight decision. Am I going to run from the saber toothed tiger or am I going to fight it? You know, that's the mentality that kept people alive. And now over the last, you know, 10,000 years, that emotional vortex of our brain has started to catch up. And so we don't have to necessarily make a fight or flight decision about everything. And we have this emotion ability that we can tap into to really thrive. And that's been a big part of my journey because obsession is a form of survival. And what I've learned is that if you can break away from that survival mentality, I mean, don't get me wrong, surviving is very satisfying and it is addictive. But you are doing yourself a disservice if you live in a state of obsession. And I know that a lot of talk these days in pop culture is you gotta grind and you gotta obsess and you've gotta stay focused and you do in order to be successful. But through a couple of experiences that I've had in the mountains, I've learned that if you can pivot from obsession, you can actually gain the skills and the habits to actually experience passion. Passion is something that takes a lot of work. People think, oh, I'm passionate about bird watching, I'm passionate about, you know, surfing or whatever. There's a big difference between liking something and truly being passionate. And the reason why it's important is because when you're in a state of obsession or survival in the brain, what's happening is you're operating on cortisol and all of the fight or flight responses of the brain, adrenaline, and those things are powerful and you can accomplish enormous things by being obsessed. But the problem is that when you live a life and your habits point you towards obsession, you're gonna, you're shortening your life because you're wearing yourself out. I mean, I was talking to one doctor and he said if you injected cortisol into your body, it would kill You. It's toxic. It's very important because it is a catalyst for the adrenaline and for the fight or flight. And there will be times. You know, I was crossing the street just 15 minutes ago on a bike. You know, I'm not used to these bike lanes. It's like, well, the bike came, and it's like I had to step back. I needed an adrenaline rush. So it's really important. But if you can make the pivot to find true passion, you're still grinding, you're still working hard, but because you are in such a euphoric state, with all of the positive processes in the brain, the endorphins and the serotonins and everything, it actually makes you want to do it more. And I could make a very strong argument that it makes you work harder because you just love it. And that's what I've experienced in my ski career, and that's healthy. I mean, who the hell wants to live their life? Just listen to the language. Oh, you gotta grind. You gotta just, you know, fucking bust ass. You gotta just stay focused, you know, and you're staying focused when you're obsessed on a goal. Well, let's talk about what a goal is. A goal is something that is not worth setting your sights on unless it's got a greater chance of failure than success. And I always use the story of my dad. He made the 56 Olympic team, and a week before the Olympics, he broke his leg. He had to watch those Olympics from a hospital bed, and he achieved that goal. He made the Olympic team, but he didn't get to go to the Olympics. From the day that he broke his leg, he developed an obsession that he was not going to just go to the 60 Olympics. He was going to win a medal. And he just listened to the language. He sacrificed relationships with his friends, with his parents. He sacrificed school. And it worked. He got to the year of the 60 Olympics. He was skiing top five in the world. You can imagine what happened when he went to the Olympics. He did not win that medal almost destroyed him. And he basically quit skiing. But he went through a transformation from that. It destroyed him. But he was a traveling salesman, so he was always on the road. And mom was stuck at home with my brother. And I were twins. We were infants. And then I had a brother and a sister. They were toddlers. And he tells this story. He came home from the road and he said, oh, my God, I looked at your mom, and she's pulling her hair out. And he said, I got to do something. I Got to get these kids out of here. And he defaulted to what he knew. He got his skis out, he took all of us kids up skiing, and he loved it. And he started taking us out. And that's, you know, then he eventually he introduced us to ski mountaineering. But it's. The lights went on in my head, the difference between obsession and passion, you know, he died 23 years ago, but the year before he died, we were out skiing, and it was a powder day, blue sky, and I'm riding up the lift with him, and he said to nobody but I was there. He said, God damn it, Mike, if I would have had the passion that I have to ski today back then, I would have won that medal. And that was a moment that went off in my head where I started to, you know, because I was 30 years old, I was an adult. It's like, what's going on here? And he, he, he pivoted over his life. He pivoted from full obsession to skiing for himself. And just. I mean, nobody loves skiing more than what is.
- [19:23]
Michael Chernow
How do you define passion?
- [19:25]
Mike Marolt
Passion is a state of mind where it entails a level of experience. It's like I said, you don't just fall into passion. You don't just pick up something and love it and say, I'm passionate about it. Passion is something where you love it so much that you don't have to obsess over it. You know it's going to be there. You know that it makes you feel good. It's. It's just a beautiful place to be where you're doing it exclusively for the right reasons.
- [20:06]
Michael Chernow
So do you think that you could comfortably say the difference between passion and obsession is. Obsession is more goal oriented. Passion is more soul oriented.
- [20:21]
Mike Marolt
Totally.
- [20:22]
Michael Chernow
You like that one?
- [20:23]
Mike Marolt
I do. And it's, it's, you know, the difference is, is that when you truly find you are, you'll know when you're in a state of passion, when you know that you don't have to do it to be happy. And the difference is that when you're in a state of obsession, the reason why it's less spiritual is because you think you're in control. And, you know, dad beat himself up, you know, when he went, when he didn't win that medal. If I'd only worked harder. If I would have only done this. Sometimes it spills over. I had shitty skis. Coach was an asshole. It's just you find yourself when you don't reach your goals in a just degrading frame, negative frame. Of mind. You blame yourself, you blame the people around you and you think that you're in control and that you could have done something different. When you're in a state of passion, you don't care. Goals are still important. I mean, I'm not anti goal, but I've realized that if you're not living where your feet are and if you're not living trying to be the best that you can be, I mean, I know I'm not the greatest ski mountaineer in the history of the world, but every time I go out, I want to be the best that I can be. And the difference is, is that when you're in a state of obsession and something bad happens, you get pissed off, you get frustrated. It messes with your mind when you're in a state of passion. And this is another way that I know that when I'm in a state of passion, when problems come up, you actually get excited because that's where the learning happens. It gets back to satisfaction. It's fun to solve problems. It was fun crawling on our stomachs off that peak. It was fun figuring out how to do it and not get killed.
- [22:27]
Michael Chernow
You also have a business and are you passionate about your business?
- [22:35]
Mike Marolt
I love what I do. I love what I do. I didn't always. You know, it's funny, I'm no different than anyone. I mean, I'm human. And I was into the benchmarking and, you know, what you gotta do to maximize your profit. And, you know, I tell the story that this client came in and knocked on the door and threw her, owed me some money, threw her check on the floor and left. And I went after her and I said, whoa, how's your day going? What's going on? She goes, I hate coming to you. You either tell me I have to write a check or you need to get paid or I owe taxes. It's just, it's worse than going to the dentist. And she said, but you're the only person I trust to do it. That's when the light went off in my head that, I mean, accounting, being a CPA is something that you either like it or you don't. There's no in between.
- [23:36]
Michael Chernow
Facts, facts.
- [23:39]
Mike Marolt
And I thought, holy shit, I do have an ability to do this. I could actually, if I could actually make that person comfortable, I could really not only help them with the stuff that they hate, but I could really make a difference in their life. I don't want these people to hate me or accounting or hate coming in here and it's kind of cliche, but as soon as I stopped counting my own money, it just started to flow. And I have a revolving door. I mean, I have people coming in all hours of the day just to come in and pay their bill or pay their taxes, but to just bullshit. And so I do like what I do. I mean, I'll never retire. Retirement is. Just scares me more than anything in life. I just don't want to retire. I wouldn't mind working less hours, but that's a whole other story.
- [24:37]
Michael Chernow
I recently heard something that I think is very powerful. There's a. There's a. Now it sounds to me like you have this crew, your. Your brother Steve and your buddy Jim and the trifecta, the guys that you, you go to these mountains with. It sounds like there's a bond there that's just. Just unbelievable. Right? And. And I know so many men specifically are struggling to have those relationships, those bonds, because, you know, I mean, when you really think about it, men are not judged on their friendships. They're not judged on how great their relationship with their buddies are. Their brother is. They're not judged on how much they're laughing with their friends and their family. Men are judged on how much money they make and how strong they are, whether they're a great father or a great husband. That's what we're judged on. Right? So we as men are thought to believe that this is the path. Gotta make money, you gotta be strong, you gotta be a great husband, and you gotta be a great dad. And so that's what we focus on. And we're alone.
- [25:58]
Mike Marolt
That's interesting. That's a really interesting take.
- [26:01]
Michael Chernow
We're alone.
- [26:02]
Mike Marolt
Yeah.
- [26:02]
Michael Chernow
Because it's not necessarily a team sport trying to be super successful, trying to be super strong, trying to be a great father and trying to be a great husband. However, if there was another layer to that where we were judged on the quality of our friendships, I think it would impact all of those other things way more than anybody could ever imagine. Right.
- [26:32]
Mike Marolt
I would agree. I mean, the. Just from a practical point of view, you know, being on that many expeditions, and Steven, Steve has been every expedition with the exception of one. He blew his knee two years ago.
- [26:48]
Michael Chernow
And that's your twin brother?
- [26:49]
Mike Marolt
That's my twin. He's been step for step, turn for turn. Jim's been on, you know, 99% of all his expeditions. And Steve, obviously, is my brother. Jim is every bit my brother, is My two adopted daughters are my kids. And from just on a superficial, practical level, the ability to bounce really personal problems off of people that you're close enough to do that with. And when you spend as much time on those trips, you know, in a room as big as this, a tent, you become very close, and you. You become very vulnerable and comfortable being vulnerable around those guys. And the, the advice that you give each other, just being a sounding board is just. It's. It's unbelievable. I mean, it's almost spiritual. It is spiritual. And, you know, I'm just really blessed that. That I have that. That trio. I mean, it was coined by a couple ski magazines as the three amigos. And, you know, it's a huge source of pride. It's kind of cool, but it's, it's. It is a gift. And there are. I mean, in Aspen, you know, it's a mountain community. There's some hardcore athletes, you know, from Lance Armstrong down to us, and everybody in between. I mean, there's a. But the problem is they don't have that cohesive group that they can rely on to do it. You know, people say, well, why would you waste all your time putting together your expedition and not using Sherpa and this and that when you could write a check and have a commercial guy do it for you? Well, we don't need. We never needed that because Steve has his role, I have my role, Jim has his role, and we enjoy working together to create. It's no different than you creating your restaurants or, or your, Your products now. I mean, you know, I've read the stories. I mean, you had partners, you had buddies that helped you succeed. And, and, and I think men do. A lot of men do have their fishing buddies or their golf buddies or their, you know, we have climbing buddies. But I think that it's something that is not recognized, like the making money and being a great dad. But I'll tell you this, one of the knocks on mountaineers, and it's true, to a certain degree, it's the most selfish activity you can imagine. I mean, you are going out there and you are risking your life, and my wife is staying home with the kids, and I'm out there having fun. I mean, it's risky. I'm out there on vacation. She's back home dealing with infants, you know, struggling.
- [29:47]
Michael Chernow
Does she have an out. An outlet like that?
- [29:50]
Mike Marolt
She does. I mean, she is an artist. She goes to Europe and does art seminars or whatever, retreats and stuff like that. And she used to go on bike trips with her. Her buddies. And I really encourage that. And then, you know, we always make sure, we take a vacation or two together as well, but it's really important to have that away time. But she, and she's. I think women do have friendships that, you know, you know, your wife's got who her friends are and who her buddies are and she probably does a lot of stuff with them. Just like Shelly, my wife, does.
- [30:29]
Michael Chernow
How long you been married?
- [30:32]
Mike Marolt
I've been with Shelly since 2000, so. And we've been married for 23 years.
- [30:37]
Podcast Narrator
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- [32:02]
Michael Chernow
Back to the pod. You're a crazy human. I can just tell. I mean, you're a little crazy and the things that you do are incredible and it takes a little crazy and a little incredible to pull off some pretty extraordinary things, right? I mean, it's just a fact, you know, it's rare that you find just, you know, plain Jane average Joe that is willing to do these things. So I guess I just question what, what do you, what do you think the secret sauce to your marriage has been?
- [32:42]
Mike Marolt
You know, that's a tough question because I went through a period before I Met her where I was a little too crazy.
- [32:52]
Michael Chernow
Like, what does that mean?
- [32:53]
Mike Marolt
I was with a lady for a long time and that didn't work. And then I kind of, you know, it kind of, kind of got a little, little wild with, with dating and stuff like that. And Shelly was in the process of adopting our first child and she needed paperwork done and she came in to talk to Steve. And I've got a separate practice from Steve, but I was in the same office at the time. And so they did the paperwork and he said, you're so wonderful, you gotta meet my brother. And I happened to walk in right as he said that, and I said, hi, nice to meet you. And I shook her hand and she said, well, I can't do anything until after Christmas, but let's. Yeah, let's go grab a beer or something. I'm shaking her hand. And it's not fireworks, it's not infatuation. I went back to my office and I said, holy shit, I'm going to marry her. And she had the same experience and, and it just, it just works. But I think that, that as far as, you know, talking about habits, one of the things that we started doing when we had Tallulah, you know, and no pregnancy because she was adopted, all of a sudden you have this kid in your hands. You're two individuals on Monday and on Tuesday you got this kid. And we learned really quickly that if we wanted to spend any quality time with each other, it had to be before the baby got up. So for the last, I don't know, 19, 20 years, we get up at 4:30 or 5, first 45 minutes of the day, coffee, talk, and we can talk about anything.
- [34:53]
Michael Chernow
You and your wife do that?
- [34:55]
Mike Marolt
We do that every day.
- [34:56]
Michael Chernow
Wow, wonderful.
- [34:58]
Mike Marolt
You know, when she's on. On a trip or I'm on. On a trip, it's one of the hardest. It's one of the things that I miss the most because you have to just have that basic communication with no other stimulation. And, and it's just, you know, sometimes you. We fight, sometimes we cry, sometimes we laugh. It's just everything. And it's just a. It's a gift. It's just awesome.
- [35:27]
Michael Chernow
I've interviewed hundreds of people over the years, podcasting. No one has ever said that they do that with their partner. It's always wake up at 5 o' clock in the morning, meditate, breath, work, hydrate, run, exercise, sauna, cold plunge, you know, whatever. No one has ever once said, I wake up at 5 o' clock in the morning, 4:30 in the morning, to sit down across the table with my wife for 45 minutes and have coffee talk. That's incredible.
- [35:58]
Mike Marolt
With the, with, with one small light on. And it's just, you know, I use the analogy. My dad used to say this about getting up in the morning. He obviously an Olympic ski racer. When you look at people that, you know, you'll see the Winter Olympics this year. When you see people jumping out of the start, they kick their skis back and they just push as hard as they can. And my dad used to say, guys, no, you got to get out of the gate. Don't get me wrong, but if you, if you fuck up that first turn, the next 50 are going to be screwed up too. And he said, it's the same with going to work. It's the same with starting your day. You got to start your day on the right foot. You got to make the first turn. If you don't make the first turn, the rest are going to suck. If you make the first turn, it's not going to guarantee that the rest of the turns are going to be great, but you got a way better chance and at least you have one good turn. And it's the same philosophy with work. You know, we get up and I, you know, the coffee and, and I have my routine and I want to hear it too.
- [37:06]
Michael Chernow
I want to hear the full morning routine. So walk us through what that looks like.
- [37:09]
Mike Marolt
Yeah, I mean, I get up, we have coffee, talk, then you know, get ready for work, slowly wake up. I mean, it takes, takes the body, you know, based on what I've read, at least 50 minutes to fully wake up. And before I have the coffee, full glass of water, get the digestion going. You know, when I came in, I talked about being 60. I mean, your GI tract just starts flipping and so you really got to take care of it and then take a shower and Shelly does the New York Times crossword puzzle and feed the dogs. Then I'll generally take the dogs for a walk. And then I come back and I make my oatmeal smoothie. Smoothie with your stuff. The maple syrup is to die for. And then three days a week, I'm Catholic and I go to mass. I go to 8 o' clock mass three days a week and then on Sunday. But before work, it's just. The church is right across from my office and it's something that I started doing about 10 years ago. And that is where I start out with my meditation. And then it works into the just, you know, the benefits and the spirituality that you get from spending. And it's, you know, it's 20 minutes. And the priest that we have is just genius priest. And he always. It's always as if he's talking directly to you. And then I, you know, start my day, and it just sets me off on, you know, it's my first turn. It just sets up the rest of the day for. For success and joy, for the easy stuff and handling the nightmares as best I can to come out the other side a better person.
- [39:13]
Michael Chernow
I always use this analogy because I, for me, like, I love the visual of, like, you know, the skier coming out of the gate. I always use the analogy, you know, you're sitting in the stands of a horse track and you're betting on, you know, Lady Lady Champion. You got all your money on Lady Champion. You see the horses at the gate, they're just bumping up. You know, they're ready to go, ready to go. And then all of a sudden, pop. You hear the pop. You hear the. See the gates go up. Everybody flies out of the gate. Lady Champion trips. She trips, trips. And the chances of her. Even though that trip was short and small, the chances of her catching up to the rest of those horses are just. They're just slim to none.
- [40:01]
Mike Marolt
Slim to none.
- [40:02]
Michael Chernow
And I always say, don't be Lady Champion. Don't trip in the morning. The morning is the one time you have control over not tripping. It's the one time in the day where you can truly control whether tripping is an option or not. And if you choose to trip the rest of your day, probably gonna be some bloody knees.
- [40:30]
Mike Marolt
That's right.
- [40:31]
Michael Chernow
You know, and if you don't, and if you choose not to trip, meaning you just get out of bed and you do the thing, you know.
- [40:37]
Mike Marolt
Well, it's like, you know, my buddy Jim, he. I did the. In my last film, the guy asked him, what's the most important thing you've learned? And he said, I've learned to do the right thing the right way for the right reason. If you're playing catch up during your day, it's really. Yeah, it's really easy to shortcut things and shortcutting and compromising. It doesn't work when you're climbing. It doesn't work when you're driving. It doesn't work when you're working. You know, you have to start out your day on the right foot. And that just takes slowing down a little bit and stepping back before you step forward.
- [41:21]
Michael Chernow
Do you have a wind down routine at the end of your day that you like?
- [41:25]
Mike Marolt
Yeah, I generally, in the summer, I will do my workout after work. And in the summer, it's either a day or two running up Aspen Mountain at the end of the day, or, you know, I'm a passionate mountain biker, and, you know, so I'll do that. And then I. I have a small gym at my house for my resistance training. And then in the winter, I generally ski, you know, three to five days a week, including what we call at skiing, walking up on the skis. I don't know if you're familiar with that, but on the way home, I'll just stop at one of the resorts, walk up and ski down and. And then Shelly and I share, you know, if she's making dinner, I do the cleanup, and, you know, vice versa. And then, you know, in the evening. Always end the evening walking. The dogs love my dogs, and they have a big yard and everything, so the walking is more for me than them, but it's just kind of a nice way. And Shelly and I walk the dogs together and then do my. Got a little meditation before I go to sleep, then say a rosary or something. And I do the. I learned this From a guy, Dr. Selk, I think his name is. Have you ever heard of Dr. Selk? He's a guy that came up with the one minute meditation. And I'm big into meditating, but the One Minute meditation is something that I've told people to do it. You tell 10 people to do it, five will never do it, and the other five come back and rave about it. It's just one minute of calming yourself down just through basic. Feel your head, feel your ears, feel your hands. One minute to do that. Then the brain works in series of seven. You cancel negative thoughts. Cancel negative thoughts. Cancel Negative thoughts 7 times until you're not thinking about anything negative.
- [43:41]
Michael Chernow
How does that work, canceling negative thoughts?
- [43:45]
Mike Marolt
It's rewiring your brain.
- [43:47]
Michael Chernow
But how do you do it?
- [43:48]
Mike Marolt
You literally just say that to yourself. Cancel negative thoughts. Cancel negative thoughts. Cancel negative thoughts. And if you can think of a negative thought, think of it while you're saying it.
- [43:57]
Michael Chernow
So you just repeat seven times. Cancel negative thought. Cancel negative thoughts. Cancel negative thoughts.
- [44:02]
Mike Marolt
And don't ask me why.
- [44:04]
Michael Chernow
But you do that seven times.
- [44:05]
Mike Marolt
The brain works in a series of seven. And if you're still thinking negative thoughts after you do, then just do it again. And after you do it a couple times, you're anticipating the bulk of the work, which is come up with three things that you're grateful for or that were cool or that were positive. And the reason why this is successful is because it sounds like it's pretty easy to do, but when you get to the, the gratitude part of it, that the, the three to three to five positive things, well, this is pretty cool. But I only have, you know, five, so. Well, let me put that to the side. And you go through the list and you, your brain starts focusing on only the positive stuff. And it gets even better because the next day, oh, I got to remember that for my one minute meditation. You go through your whole day trying to find these positive things that happened or things that you're grateful for. So that when you get to bed, before you're going to shut your eyes, you go through the list and it goes viral. And it is enormously proven and efficient way to rewire your brain. And sounds easy.
- [45:31]
Michael Chernow
It's only so one minute. Kind of just decompress. Slow your breath.
- [45:35]
Mike Marolt
Yeah.
- [45:35]
Michael Chernow
Slow down the brain waves seven times. Cancel. Cancel negative thoughts. Cancel negative thoughts. Cancel negative thoughts. If you're still feeling a little funky, kind of run that a few times. And then three things. One thing that you're grateful for, really cool thing that happened that day, and a positive experience.
- [45:55]
Mike Marolt
Just anything positive. And then you'll find yourself after doing that, you go through your day. Oh, I got to remember that for tonight. I got to remember that for the night. You stop thinking about the negative.
- [46:06]
Michael Chernow
You know, something that I've started doing that's been really, really helpful for me. And I've heard about it over the years, but I never really took into action. And journaling. Out of all the habits that I have done over the years, journaling tends to be the one that suffers most for me. Like, it's the one. It's the one habit that I know is so incredibly impactful, especially when I use it in the morning and write my day out. Like, it's so. It's such a great one, but it tends to be the one that I put to the wayside. One thing that I've started doing, which has been super awesome, is I try my best to carve out 10 minutes at the very end of my day at my office before I pack my stuff and, you know, get into my truck and drive home. And what I've been doing is a buddy of mine, this guy, Tom Doyle, sent me this really beautiful journal. And it has no prompts in it. It's just a leatherback journal with paper in it. And what I have been doing at the end of My day is, I have been sitting at the desk, just pausing for a few minutes, giving myself a couple minutes to breathe. And I have truly just been recounting my day, walking through what I did in the morning, what it was like from morning to the office, what happened when I sat down at the desk, the calls that I had. So I'll go back into my calendar and I'll just like look at the calls that I've had or the meetings that I've had and I'll just write a couple of notes on those things. And literally it's just reflecting on the day, just sort of. And it's so wild to think that so many of us will legitimately go through our day and never think about what happened, never look back at what happened.
- [48:01]
Mike Marolt
Especially the positive stuff. It's, you know, getting back to the passion concept. In my mind, it comes down to a triangle. It's moderation, gratitude and humility. And if you're not looking back at your day, at the positive things, you're not expressing gratitude. And whether you call it the universe, whether you call it God, whether you, whatever you call it, not to get too out there, but let's just, just assume the big bang is correct, that it's actually happened. I believe it did. I mean, and now it's just a theory. But think about the billions of years that all of this has existed. The one undisputable fact that no human from the beginning of time can argue is I exist. If you really think about that, it's mind boggling. And if you think about the fact that from the time I got up this morning till the time I'm sitting in this chair to the time I go back to Aspen, a lot of stuff happens. And a lot of difficult stuff happens, but a lot of really good stuff happens. And it's not about what happened, it's just about that it did. I mean, think about that. Think about the fact that you just.
- [49:32]
Michael Chernow
Like put a smile on my face. Just me, you just walking me. First of all, I am so this, I am so grateful that you're here. Like, this has been such a great conversation. And I think that you are, you're, you're articulate, you, you've had some incredible experiences. I, I have sort of extrapolated this idea that you've really created this balance in your life between things that you love doing and people that you love. And I bucket your accounting practice into that. Because I asked you, I said, are you passionate or are you obsessed with work? Because I know you're passionate about ski mountaineering. And you said, I'm passionate about my work as well. And so there's just this. Now, I'm sure that there's some darker stuff in your life and your story.
- [50:27]
Mike Marolt
Everybody has dark stuff. Yeah.
- [50:28]
Michael Chernow
But it just sounds to me, and based on your. The sort of arc of your life, you've really created this ability to balance out the things that you're really. That you really love and how you have been able to spend, you know, if you've put 60 plus expeditions on, written them down in history, right. You've broken records, you've skied some of the highest peaks in the world. You literally are a record breaker. Like, you know, I can only imagine the amount of hours and days and weeks and months you've spent on that in your life. Right. And then forgetting about the amount of hours you've actually physically spent on it, but just thinking about it and, you know, and so it's just, it's just. And you seem like such a humble dude. You're just a chill guy that's just speaking from his soul. And so for me, as an interviewer, somebody who has sat across the table from a lot of people, there is an. There's an ease to the way you communicate that is super attractive and inspiring. And I just wanted to say that because I feel really like I just. There's. There's so much to be learned from that.
- [51:46]
Mike Marolt
Michael, don't kid yourself. I listen to a lot of podcasts, and I'm into the podcasts that are designed to help people. And two people stand out in that world. And I've listened to all of them. And the first one is Lance Armstrong. And I know Lance. I mean, I don't know him as well as my brothers. They know him a lot better. And you. And the reason why I threw the dart to try and get this interview to happen and to get to know you a little bit is because when you look at these podcasts and you look at what he went through in his life, and when you look at what you went through, I mean, laying in that tub of ice water, you can't even call the number for help because of what you're doing and where you were and where you are now, I mean, it's back at you. It's inspiring as all hell, and it's beneficial. And I've turned other people onto this podcast and it's like, this is genuine. This is the real deal. Because this guy has been to fucking hell. And now he's on his Way to heaven. I mean, figuratively speaking and spiritually probably, too, but it's like, it's unbelievable. Thanks, man. And that's the reason why I'm honored and thankful to be here talking with you, because, dude, I got a lot to learn. I mean, nobody's life is perfect, but it's like, I'm 60 years old and I want to make the next 20 or whatever I have left, something other than me. You know, I want to take my life experience and I want to share it. And I wasn't sure if this whole big thing that I'm on transferring, pivoting from obsession to passion is something that. That you could coach. I wasn't sure if it was just something that you learned from the classroom of life, but I'm gaining the confidence in the ability to understand that. It's a topic that I just know when I was 30 years old, if I'd have had somebody that I could have tapped into, like you or, you know, with somebody that has my message, I just think it can help people, and it can.
- [54:29]
Michael Chernow
I mean, I want to finish with this thought. I love this conversation that I've never, ever really put much thought to the difference between obsession and passion. I think it's really. It's very, very interesting. Obviously, anybody can obsess. Most of us do. I would say all of us do it.
- [54:52]
Mike Marolt
It's efficient. It's. You can accomplish a lot through it, but it's going to cut you short eventually.
- [55:00]
Michael Chernow
Not everybody believes that they have something they're passionate about. So for the person listening who is struggling to just uncover, unearth what it is they're passionate about, meaning they are. So they. They love something so much that. That not doing it doesn't bother them because they know, like you had said, right, they love something so much that not doing it doesn't bother them because it's always going to be there. How can you help somebody find out that. What that is?
- [55:40]
Mike Marolt
Well, you know, my. My dad, who was just the pillar of wisdom in my life, he. I remember some of the last words that he said to me. He said, you know, Mike, I was given the gift to ski in the Olympic Games. Some guys are given the gift to hit a curveball at a Yankee stadium. You've been given the gifts to climb and ski where not a lot of people can or have. And he said, the problem in life is that everybody has a mission. Everything is good. Regardless of how miserable your life is at times, everything is good. Even a snake. A snake may not be seen as Good to you and me, because it's a snake, but it's still good.
- [56:24]
Michael Chernow
I love snakes.
- [56:26]
Mike Marolt
I mean, I like snakes, too, but I mean, you know, rats, whatever. Everything is good. And regardless of what state you're in, you're exactly where God wants you to be. And he said, the problem that I've seen in my life is that everybody has gifts, and God gives us those gifts to accomplish the mission. And he said, the problem is that we have this thing called free will. And a lot of people, they fail to look for their gifts, they fail to find their gifts, and they think they're ordinary. Nobody's ordinary. And you have to. You have to. If you can understand that you've been given a gift. I don't know what your gift is, you know, but you have to seek your gift. And once you. It's the. Seeking is the process that allows you to not only find your gift, but to find your purpose. And that boils down to gratitude. And what I have had success with clients and with friends is seek gratitude for everything, everything in your life, even the mundane. You know, like going and getting a glass of water out of your tap. 99% of the world can't do that. You know, I was driving out of the supermarket and they made a roundabout, and it's like, God, thank God. They put those direction signs on there. I mean, there's construction stuff. Everywhere I went, I was. It's a skill. Gratitude is, It's a habit. It's a skill. And you have to, you have to just say, thank you for that. Thank you for that. Thank you for that camera. You have to train yourself to have gratitude, because if you do, you. If you can develop a sense of gratitude for the mundane. When those gifts pop up, there's going to be contrast. And you're going to say, that is a gift. I have the physiology to climb at altitude. I have the gift to ski down. I. These are all my gifts. And then you can leverage them and the leveraging of those gifts. You know, on a practical level, it's allowed me to write books and, and, and produce films which people can enjoy. I've used the films to raise hundreds of thousands of dollars for, for Ms. And muscular dystrophy and victims of drunk drivers. But on, on a spiritual level, when you seek your gifts and you find them and you figure out what your purpose is, it's really the ultimate manifestation of how much God or the universe, whatever you want to call it, it is a manifestation for how much our Creator loves us. And there's nothing. There's no greater sense of being than when you experience that. And it's tough to experience it, but when it happens makes everything worth it.
- [59:50]
Michael Chernow
Mike Mehrolt, ski climber, author, filmmaker, accountant. Just all around incredible human being. Man, I am so happy that you got in my DMs. And we've been back and forth for the last year trying to get this thing together.
- [60:06]
Mike Marolt
Yeah, thank you.
- [60:07]
Michael Chernow
I'm grateful for it. I really, I can't wait to listen back to this episode because I've been so engaged with you here. I probably missed a few of the pieces because of how just focused I have been. And I really can't wait to just unpack it a little bit myself and deeply listen to it because, you know, everybody that listens to podcasts, they always want to hear from an expert. An expert. I don't really have experts on this podcast. I have human beings that have inspired me because all the things that I've done in my life to date that I will put in a book someday have been on the backside of inspiration I've gotten from somebody else. And so you're an expert in life. I believe that. And it's. What did somebody say to me once? You know, I forgot it was a functional medicine guy that I had on the podcast. And, you know, he's like, I don't have credentials. I have like, something along the lines of, you know, I'm an expert of experience, you know, and I think that that is so powerful. It's so, it's so true. We're all experts at things that we want to be known for. Right? And for some people, it's robbing banks. For other people, it's climbing mountains and skiing down. So it's been wonderful having you here, man. And I feel like this is going to be an incredibly valuable podcast for everybody listening. You know, the, the community that listens to these podcasts, really, it's just like a 45 minute to an hour long piece of content that, that, that people just want to smile afterwards. Right. And we've accomplished it.
- [62:14]
Mike Marolt
Bingo. I mean, you hit it on the head. That's a great podcast. It's, it's practical. It just covers all areas of life. And you've had some. I think they're experts. I mean, I've learned a lot from them. I mean, anytime you can learn anything from somebody, they're more of an expert at whatever you learned from them than you were before you heard from them. And it's just you're doing your thing and thank you for what you're doing. And really, I don't know if anybody has, but the way that you've shared your story and built it into your podcast, I mean, the inspiration from that and the vulnerability that you, the courage that it takes for somebody to do that is. That's end of story, man.
- [63:07]
Michael Chernow
Thank you, brother.
- [63:08]
Mike Marolt
End of story. So thank you.
- [63:10]
Michael Chernow
Absolutely. Ladies and gents, what a wonderful episode with Mike Morholt. I encourage you to follow Mike and Mike. Where can people, like, see the books that you've written and the films that you've made and just follow along your journey?
- [63:32]
Mike Marolt
They can go to skiing Everest.net.
- [63:35]
Michael Chernow
Okay.
- [63:36]
Mike Marolt
And I'm not as big on Instagram, but I am Mike Marolt at Instagram and then I'm just Mike Merolt on Facebook.
- [63:44]
Michael Chernow
I encourage you to do that. Obviously, I am, I am positive that a smile has been on your face like it's been on mine for the last 45 minutes to an hour. Mike is just a genuine human being that's done some really extraordinary things. And him coming here to share his experiences through those things has just brightened my day 100%. I feel a sense of lightness and levity after speaking to a guy who has truly done some groundbreaking, like, record breaking things. So if you loved this podcast, all I ask of you to do. Well, I'm gonna ask you for a couple of things, actually. I'm gonna ask you a couple things. One, share the podcast, Share the podcast. Post it on social media. Send it to your brother, send it to your sister. Send it to your husband, wife, sister, uncle, your mom. Send it to your dad. Send it to someone who you really care about and you think is gonna love listening to this episode. I think if you send it to.
- [64:48]
Podcast Narrator
Anybody, they will appreciate it.
- [64:50]
Michael Chernow
But the easiest thing you can do is just is to share it on your social media accounts with your community. And if you're feeling super generous, a five star rating and a great review goes a very long way as we try to grow the Creatures of Habit podcast. I love this part of my job. I am passionate about this piece of my life. Being able to sit down and ask questions from people that have inspired me and then share those answers with you. So help us grow this thing. I can't thank you all enough for subscribing to the podcast and just being along the journey with me. I love you. I know you know that. I appreciate you. And until the next one, y', all, peace.