Two Guys, Five Rings: Tara Lipinski and Johnny Weir

Summary

Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang

Episode: Two Guys, Five Rings: Tara Lipinski and Johnny Weir
Date: January 24, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this vibrant episode, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang—aka "your culture consultants"—dive into all things Olympics, pop-culture, and friendship with special guests and iconic figure skating duo Tara Lipinski and Johnny Weir. The discussion covers their rise as beloved commentators, their forays into non-skating events, the importance of authenticity in their partnership, personal reflections on being in unexpected spaces, and their joint experience on the reality show "The Traitors". Expect a playful, insightful, and fashion-filled journey through sports, entertainment, and what it means to make your own lane in culture.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Introduction: Pairing Up and Opposites (00:11–02:22)

• Matt and Bowen riff on the idea of pairings—from melodies to dynamic duos, setting the stage for their guests.
• Banter on the similarities and differences between theater, music, and sports.
  • Memorable line (Bowen, 00:38): "Theater is the opposite of sports."
• They draw a playful parallel between their own duo energy and that of Tara and Johnny, teeing up the main guests: “The two and only Tara Lipinski and Johnny Weir.” (02:22)

Tara and Johnny's Origin Story: Finding a Kindred Spirit (03:18–05:40)

• How their partnership began:
  • Tara and Johnny were initially solo commentators for women’s and men’s figure skating, respectively, at NBC.
  • Their friendship sparked while sitting in a hallway discussing handbags before the 2014 Sochi Olympics.
  • After that impromptu connection, they pitched NBC to let them commentate together, leading to an audition and subsequent joint coverage at Sochi.
  • Tara (04:23): “By the end of that conversation, we said, we need to pitch NBC that we commentate together. And this was right before the 2014 Olympics.”
• Johnny on instant rapport despite skating's cutthroat culture:
  • “For some reason, when Tara and I met, I didn’t feel any of that. There was no competitiveness. It was just pure love…to actually share a career and something we love with the world and do it sitting next to our best friend…so magical.” (04:51)

Breaking Out of the Skating World: New Challenges, New Stages (05:41–09:18)

• Transitioning beyond figure skating:
  • After Sochi, their popularity surged, leading to broader roles—commentating at the Kentucky Derby, Super Bowl, National Dog Show, and more.
  • Tara (07:00): “We show up everywhere you think we should have been, and somehow we just have to learn and figure out what we’re doing…”
  • Johnny (08:01): Shares the experience of being “slighter and tinier than most” at Super Bowl media day, and the unique reactions they receive from unlikely fans, like LA motorcyclists.
  • They credit their chemistry and mutual support for being willing to try new things: “We love having fun and experiencing new things, and it’s easy when we’re together…we find the fun and humor in everything.” (08:18)

Fashion at the Olympics: Process and Philosophy (09:18–11:12)

• Bowen asks about their Milan Olympics fashion prep.
  • After years of partnership, their telepathic coordination means they often show up with matching or complementary styles, even when not discussing outfits.
  • Tara (09:44): “We will show up…we weren’t allowed to talk to each other [on Traitors]…and we showed up in white and black.”
  • They shop months in advance and travel with up to 20 suitcases, mixing and matching pieces at the hotel, always sharing elements for each broadcast.
  • “We always do a gold look that we look forward to, but we have a Traders nod coming at you guys for this year.” (10:38)

Authenticity, Pressure, and Pushing Boundaries (11:23–15:29)

• Bowen and Matt reflect on why Tara and Johnny fit in niche or unexpected spaces.
  • Both come from humble beginnings outside Philadelphia.
  • Johnny discusses the perfectionist culture of elite skating and how it forged resilience and adaptability: “To be a figure skater, you have to be a little bit of a perfectionist and a little bit competitive, at least.” (13:06)
  • He credits becoming an entertainer with learning to “take it on the chin … if we’re not great at it, we can laugh our way through it.”
  • Tara (14:20): Emphasizes the power of authenticity in both their skating and commentary: “…we always just felt like we have to be our most authentic selves… it feels like a safe space that we’re allowed to do that.”

Figure Skating’s Changing Culture (15:29–16:36)

• Shifts in the sport: Tara describes how new personalities and openness have broadened the scope of what’s acceptable.
  • Tara (15:39): “We call them the Big Three … they all have such different personalities.” She praises Isabel Levito, Amber Glenn, and Alyssa Liu for bringing perseverance, authenticity, and fun.
  • The sport is evolving for the better, more welcoming to diverse personalities.

Local Lore: Delaware Skating Connection (16:36–17:46)

• A nod to regional fame: Matt asks Tara about training in Newark, Delaware, confirming local rumors.
• Johnny (17:12): Reflects on University of Delaware as the “number one training facility” of their era. “More than you would expect have come through Newark, Delaware.”

The Traitors: Inside Reality TV Dynamics (18:03–27:36)

• The Faithfuls’ Experience: Tara and Johnny discuss strategizing as “faithfuls,” reacting to seeing conversations in the “turret” for the first time as viewers.
  • Insights on contestant Rob, whose laid-back attitude and surprise gameplay were “iconic.” (18:45)
  • Tara (18:45): “Rob blows my mind … in the castle, he was just so laid back.”
  • Overwhelmed and disoriented at times, Johnny jokes about being “traumatized” by the experience and worrying about hair and makeup (19:45).
  • Both describe the castle as alternately “traumatizing and terrifying” but also fun and healing, given their unusual childhoods as skaters.
  • Johnny (21:39): “Anytime you give us…an Easter egg hunt or a conga line, like, we’re both going to give it our all because we didn’t get to do it.”
• Handling Reality TV Secrets:
  • Refuse to share how long the “castle” drive is, referencing strict NDAs.
  • Matt compliments their “gold medal” adherence to NDA rules (22:36).
• Strategizing Relationship Concealment: Upon entering “The Traitors,” they tried to downplay their friendship.
  • Tara: “I thought he was being way too friendly. So I really give him the cold shoulder of like, nice to meet you, sir.” (23:09)
• Starstruck Moments (or Not):
  • Neither is particularly starstruck, often not following reality TV or pop culture closely.
  • Johnny: “I really don’t follow pop culture a lot…” (23:43)
  • Most impressed by the castle itself.
• Organic Friendships: Tara bonds with Candace outside of Housewives lore, reflecting the importance of meeting people as they are.
  • Tara (26:31): “I just know who I met. The human in front of me that I…grew a friendship with, and now we talk about our babies, and I still haven’t watched any of the shows…”

Closing Banter: Milan, Wine, and Friendship (27:36–29:15)

• Talk of future meetups in Milan, prioritizing pasta, wine, and future episodes.
• Exchanges jokes about possibly “forgetting” to report on these future adventures, rounding out with their signature irreverence and light heartedness.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Bowen (00:38): “Theater is the opposite of sports.”
• Tara (04:23): “This is my soulmate in life, and I love you.”
• Johnny (04:51): “It’s so rare…to find someone like that, but from where we come from, even more rare.”
• Tara (07:00): “We show up everywhere you think we should have been, and somehow we just have to learn and figure out what we're doing…”
• Matt (11:23): “You guys stand out in this outstanding way…pushing things forward in terms of people projecting certain ideas onto you.”
• Johnny (13:06): “To be a figure skater, you have to be a little bit of a perfectionist and a little bit competitive, at least.”
• Tara (14:20): “We have to be our most authentic selves. We have to say what we feel, whether…it’s for the entertainment of it all and to have fun or to call out a judging panel.”
• Johnny (21:39): “Anytime you give us like...an Easter egg hunt or a conga line, like, we’re both going to give it our all because we didn’t get to do it.”
• Tara (23:09): “I thought he was being way too friendly. So I really give him the cold shoulder of like, nice to meet you, sir.”
• Tara (26:31): “I just know who I met. The human in front of me…”

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:11–02:22: Matt and Bowen’s musical and duo banter; intro to guests
• 03:18–05:40: Tara and Johnny’s origin as a duo and chemistry
• 05:41–09:18: Breaking out of figure skating; new pop culture frontiers
• 09:18–11:12: Olympics fashion planning and execution
• 11:23–15:29: Authenticity, pressure, and boundary-breaking in career and sport
• 15:29–16:36: Evolution within figure skating—The “Big Three”
• 16:36–17:46: Delaware skating lore and local pride
• 18:03–27:36: Reality TV: The Traitors—secrets, strategy, and cast dynamics
• 27:36–29:15: Conclusion—future plans for Milan, wines, and enduring friendships

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Takeaways

• Tara and Johnny’s on-air magic is rooted in genuine friendship, authenticity, and resilience developed in the demanding world of figure skating.
• Their forays into mainstream pop culture highlight the power of stepping outside comfort zones and being willing to laugh through uncertainty.
• The episode balances inside-skating nostalgia, commentary on reality TV’s weirdness, and the reminder that sometimes standing out—and supporting each other while you do—is the best way to win the gold.

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Listeners are left with the infectious optimism and camaraderie of all four personalities—ready for more culture, more Milan, and more "looks, looks, looks."

Transcript

[A]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.

[B]

Ring, ring, ring, ring, ring. That was a new melody we found.

[C]

I like it.

[B]

Ring, ring, ring, ring, ring. It can be anything.

[C]

And it is five notes, five syllables is five opportunities for or more opportunities for melody.

[B]

And that's on music. Now, today we're here to talk about sports, though, because this is the two Guys Five Rings podcast. And I'm Matt Rogers.

[C]

I'm Bowen Yang. Would you say music is the opposite of sports?

[B]

I would, no. Theater is the opposite of sports.

[C]

I don't know. Theater and sports are kind of similar where it's just people watching.

[B]

Well, here's the thing. Theater really does meet sports when we discuss a certain dynamic duo. Let's get this on our show today. Yes, there is another Olympics duo that's not us. I don't know whether to be threatened or welcoming. I guess because they're on the show, we should choose the latter.

[C]

We should choose the latter and welcome them. They are our guests. We're not gonna threaten. It's gonna be a nice moment. We don't wanna be, I don't know, a Judge Judy. No. Now that woman, she brings people into her show and then she's rude to them.

[B]

She really is a very judgmental person. But I guess that's sort with being a judge, you know what I mean?

[C]

I'd go, oh, Judge Sheindlin, have some respect for yourself. I'm not gonna call you by your first name. I don't know you like that.

[B]

Oh, wow.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Sheindlin. Forget about the Sheindlin of it all.

[C]

I happen to like that name.

[B]

Judge Judy Sheindlin.

[C]

Judge Judy Sheindlin. You know what are great last names as well?

[B]

What?

[C]

Lipinski and Weir.

[B]

I can't think of better. Rogers and Yang. Get bent. Get bent, get bent.

[C]

Seriously, seriously.

[B]

Sick of us any. Um, luckily these two are going to be all over our screens for the next, I guess, hopefully the rest of our lives. We hope they make it very far on Traitors we don't yet know. Yes, but I will say that they are on traitors. They are Olympians themselves. They are commentating, which is different than judging. In fact, they often commentate on the.

[C]

Judging, which is very valuable. It's the checks and balances of the Olympics, as it were.

[B]

And here they are, the one, the only, or should we say the two and only. The two and only Ty Lipinski and Johnny Weir.

[C]

Enjoy.

[B]

Well, well, well, look who it is. Another pair, another iconic pair.

[C]

We've got Tara Lipinski and Johnny.

[B]

We're with Us.

[C]

Thanks for joining.

[D]

We are so excited to be here. Thank you guys for having us.

[B]

Listen, we did need someone, anyone with any expertise about winter sports to come beyond this podcast, because it is not us. So thank you so much for throwing us a life raft.

[A]

We're here to help. We're here to know.

[D]

Just ask. Right?

[C]

So explain the concept of winter for everybody.

[D]

Well, in hockey, they wear pads for winter. Okay.

[C]

That's the main thing that we need to know. Padding, of course.

[B]

So you guys are obviously. I. I think it sort of, like, changed commentating when you guys, like, decided to team up. Was that an idea that you guys had about each other? Or were you. Was it sort of. Was there a chemistry read? Like, how did it happen that you guys came to be.

[D]

So it was.

[A]

It was really kismet because I was commentating the. The women's event, and Johnny was commentating the men's event, and we were doing it separately. And of course, you know, skating is a very small world, so I knew of Johnny, but we never really had a lot of interactions. We skated at different times and competed at different times, but we were in NBC Sports studios and waiting to do our respective commentaries that night. And we were sitting in a hallway on the floor with our bags next to each other, and we just started talking about our handbags. And I was like, this is my best friend. I don't know where he's been, but this is my soulmate in life, and I love you. And pretty much we chatted. And by the end of that conversation, we said, we need to pitch NBC that we commentate together. And this was right before the 2014 Olympics. Oh, my goodness. It's been crazy.

[C]

Over a decade.

[A]

Over a decade. And we then did a little audition.

[B]

Oh, there was an audition.

[A]

There was an audition. And I think we nailed it. And then we moved on to Sochi.

[D]

And the thing is about where we both come from. Obviously, we share a past as figure skaters and elite athletes, and figure skating has a bad reputation for not being the warmest and coziest of environments, because it's not like football, where you have a game every single weekend to prove yourself. You really get one chance in front of the world. So that ultimately creates a culture where it's so competitive and you don't want to trust anyone because they might stand in your path. And for some reason, when Tara and I met, I didn't feel any of that. I didn't feel any hostility. There was no competitiveness. It was just pure love. And it's so rare, I think, in life anyway, to find someone like that, but from where we come from, even more rare. And it's just been the most magical journey to actually share a career and share something that we love with the whole world and do it sitting next to our best friend. It's just. It's been so magical, and we're so grateful every time we sit in that booth.

[C]

I mean, that's beautiful because, I mean, listen, if figure skating were warm and cozy, would melt the freaking ice. So it's okay. But also, I think the reason why people love you guys so much as a duo is that you demonstrate this technical knowledge on top of being personalities, which is something that you have to sort of account for, because the attention of the audience at home is on and everyone in the room is on the activity. But, like, you are literally adding color and depth and dimension to what is going on, giving context in a very important way. So I think the fact that people have fallen in love with you beyond, you know, the technical precision of what you've done and demonstrating your careers is sort of the special thing. But how did you guys know to expand beyond figure skating? Cause talk about doing the summer Olympics. Talk about doing the derby. Like, how do you read up on these things?

[B]

That was a hat thing, wasn't it?

[D]

It was a hat. Well.

[A]

What was so crazy is we didn't really expect this. We went to Sochi. We were in Russia. We had our adjoining rooms. We were having the time of our life. We were on NBC Sports, which was, you know, not the primetime show. So no one was really noticing us while we were there. But one morning, I. I looked at Instagram, and I was like, johnny, things are happening.

[D]

We were so nervous there. Like, we barely understood it, of course, but.

[A]

But we realized that, you know, oh, when we get back, things might be a little different. And they were. We immediately sort of got the spot as. As the new primetime commentators. And then really, the cherry on top for Johnny and I, where our careers together expanded was the offers and the opportunities to work within NBC Sports at the Kentucky Derby, the Super bowl, the National Dog Show. And then beyond that, we. We then got other opportunities which. Which we didn't expect. I mean, we hosted a. We have done the crate. We show up everywhere you think we should have been, and somehow we just have to learn and figure out what.

[D]

We'Re doing at the Super Bowl. It was kind of the cutest thing. So we went to the media day, which I think we were both pretty unfamiliar with, and it's when the players sit in their own little booths and the press of the world travels around from booth to booth, talking to whomever. And because we are so much, like, slighter and tinier than most.

[A]

Yeah, I just wiggled my way up a little bit.

[D]

But then these other, like, very kind of grizzled football reporters and people from the local beat, like, we're not reporters. We're not used to, like, shuffling. We get taken places.

[C]

You get taken.

[B]

Right.

[D]

They opened this little beautiful pathway and kind of pushed us forward. Here's Rob Gronkowski. Here's Tom Brady. And it was just. It was so fun. And it's funny to see the kind of people that react to us, because being from figure skating, it's a very niche world. And then, you know, I had my own reality show for a long time, and that was even more niche than Olympic figure skating. And, like, there was all this stuff that we've done, and, like, I can be getting gas, and I was in LA once getting gas, and a group of motorcyclists stopped to be like, I love you and Tara. You guys are awesome. That's the reaction that we get from. From people. It's. It's so overwhelming and so special. And I think just the fact that we love having fun and experiencing new things, and it's easy when we're together because, you know, I'm always going to be there to support Tara, and she's always there for me. So we're not afraid to try things. And we. We find the fun and the humor in everything that we do. And I think that's. That's why we keep going. That's why we keep working and showing up at the super bowl when we shouldn't.

[B]

I feel like it's. It's so obvious how much fun you guys are having. And one of the ways in which that comes across most is obviously in the fashion. So this is Milan, okay? It's a fashion capital in a major way. I want to know what we can expect, but also how far in advance you started. Sourcing pieces, getting everything together, coordinating. Walk us through this process.

[A]

So, you know, we are actually getting very good at this. You know, 12 years in, so the time is getting shorter in prep just because we are like an old married couple where we will show up. And we showed up at Traders, and we weren't allowed to talk to each other there, and we showed up in white and black. Like, we are just. We. It's like telepathic. We kind of know what to do now. We know Our colors. And so we'll shop and we'll source, you know, a few months in advance. And then we really do. It's no joke when we bring, like 20 suitcases because we just bring everything. Because then when we get to the hotel, we put it all in our wardrobe racks and we like to mix and match and make sure that we are sharing some similar elements in each. Each broadcast. And we do it there. But I feel like this year, Johnny, we have one fun look. We always do a gold look that we look forward to, but we have a. We have a Traders nod coming at you guys for this year.

[D]

One of the looks.

[C]

On Traders Giving.

[B]

Fashion at the Olympics. Giving fashion. It's going to be all about you too, Johnny.

[A]

We should just like, wear a cloak one day.

[B]

We should just.

[A]

Just straight up both being cloaks.

[D]

I am a faithful.

[B]

I don't know what you're saying.

[C]

There's going to be a turret, like space in Milan that we will stake out for you and we'll find that turret for you.

[D]

Thank you.

[C]

I want to go back to this idea that, like, you guys show up where you quote, unquote, like, shouldn't be. I think that is why. I think the fact that you guys stand out in this, like, outstanding way is because I think even with figure skating as, like, a niche thing, you guys really did, like, push things forward in terms of people, like, projecting certain ideas onto you. Right? Like Tara, you as a teenager and Johnny, you as someone who was really pushing the boundary for, like, what the visuals and the campiness and the fun of what the sport could be. I think this is why. I mean. Well, I should ask you guys, do you guys think that's what's giving you this instinct and this maybe armor to be in spaces like that?

[D]

Well, I think we both come not only just from skating backgrounds, but we're both from. Tara was born in Philly. I'm from Amish country outside Philly. We come from a similar place and we have very similar values, I think, in the way that we were raised, in the way that we grew up. And there's just that natural way that we respond to one another just from. From humble upbringings. And then as we got into sports, we were both obviously very competitive. Tara, you know, won so early, and there's such a drive that you have to have to be able to accomplish that and hold all the pressure of the world on your shoulders. And, you know, in my own way, I didn't win the Olympics like her, but in my own way, I Dealt with a lot of pressure, you know, to be. To be the face of something when all I was trying to do was to be a skater and to be a great skater. And I think figure skating and any professional level sport or Olympic level sport, it forces you into being flawless. And I think that both of us, having been raised up in that and like, you're not allowed to fail. There is no opportunity to fall down. You cannot do something halfway. I think that growing up in that gave us the opportunity to, as entertainers now and people that work in television now, we can just try anything and take it on the chin. And even if we're not great at it, we can laugh our way through it. And it's taken a long time for me personally to learn how to do that, because, you know, to be a figure skater, you have to be a little bit of a perfectionist and a little bit competitive, at least. And I think that the way that we embrace the world is often through hard work and preparation, but with humor or what's the point? And I think that that is similar to the way a lot of people live their lives. There's so much pressure on people to be great, to be perfect, to win the bread, to hunt and gather, to do all of those things. And sometimes you just. You want to giggle and you want to Google with your friend. And it's just so special that we have these abilities, no matter what they are, no matter what comes our way, know that we will show up, we will be ready, we will be prepared. We will have worked hard.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I think also, Jay, it's interesting. I think not only. I think there's probably a few things that go into it, but I think our friendship and us being so in sync makes for a very seamless banter and organic banter. But I think beyond that, it's kind of what you were saying about our sport. We skated at different times, but there was a lot of similarities throughout our careers that I think we both identify with, and we have those shared experiences, but just who we are as people. I think both as amateur skaters, we were very authentic, and we showed up as ourselves, and we weren't kind of afraid to ruffle feathers here and there. And again, in figure skating, that's not always the norm, especially back then. Now the sport is changing so much in a really good way. But I think when we're in the commentary booth, we always just felt like we have to be our most authentic selves. We have to say what we feel, whether it's for and you know, just for the entertainment of it all and to have fun or to call out a judging panel. And I think just being on the same page in that way, it feels like a safe space that we're allowed to do that.

[B]

Well, Tara, you mentioned that it's changed. I feel like people outside of the sport would love to know what you attribute that change to in the attitude around the sport, within it.

[A]

Well, I think it's just a culture, and over time, that will evolve, and there will be people inside the sport that are pushing those boundaries that eventually everyone will start to accept, and it becomes the norm. And I think that that's what we're seeing now. We're seeing, especially in the women's event. I think it's incredible. We call them the Big Three, the three women going to the Olympics, and they all have such different personalities. Isabel Levito is the perfectionist of the group, but very funny. And then you have Amber Glenn, who's had an incredible journey. And one word to describe her is just perseverance and authenticity. And she wears her heart on her sleeve, and she talks about her mental health, struggle, and how she's overcome all that, or still tries to in this moment. And then you have Alyssa Liu, who is just so much fun, pushing all the boundaries. Shows, like, dyes her hair every day and shows up to practice late and is like, this is who I am, and this is what I want to skate to, and this is the dress I'm gonna wear. And I think that's great for the sport.

[C]

Absolutely. And before we wrap it up with some traitor's questions, we have to. Our friend who grew up in Newark, Delaware, wanted us to ask you, Tara, if you did indeed train at the University. University of Delaware, before. Oh, my God. Okay.

[B]

You just. You just. You confirmed a lot of lore, because it was.

[C]

Because it was. It was the scuttlebutton town just in Newark, Delaware. There was, like, Tara Lipinski's training here. And so I think you.

[D]

You.

[C]

You figure very heavily into that town's.

[A]

Johnny and I vote again.

[B]

All the Delaware icons of Jay and.

[A]

I, but we were both there fighting women.

[D]

We both. So in our area, the University of Delaware was the number one training facility for figure skating. And skating's still like that. There will be huge training bases in Montreal, in Michigan, in California, in New Jersey. But, you know, back in our time, it was Delaware, of all places. And my parents took me there because of people like Tara Lipinski that had been training there. And the level of coaching was so high, and the Level of skating was so high. And, yeah, there's a lot of people that have come through Newark, Delaware. More than you would expect.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Don't work.

[D]

Don't work.

[B]

Don't work.

[D]

Don't work, don't work.

[B]

Okay, it's time for us to finally talk about the Olympics, by which I mean the traders. So I want to know as faithfuls, which we can confirm you are at least at this point. I love that you both look down a little bit. Like, you're Both like, okay, NBC's watching. But when you're watching the show, what something that I never really think about until obviously I'm watching it is like, oh, all the faithfuls are watching these conversations in the turret for the first time. So I guess. What were your reactions at home, watching both Allen's selection of the traitors and these interactions between Rob, Candace, and Rinna, which, by the way, an iconic three.

[A]

Well, it's so fascinating to watch it back. Obviously, iconic three. I think that the. The choice of traitors is top notch on this season, but Rob blows my mind. I don't know, John. He's incredible when you're watching because in the castle, he was just so laid back.

[B]

He's a side in a way where.

[A]

I was like, maybe he doesn't even want to play the game. Like, he's just chilling. But he also was invested at certain times, but just in this, like, really helpful. Like, he was.

[D]

He would.

[A]

Everyone in the castle just adored Rob. And it was. It's hilarious, the moment that he was chosen just to see him up there. And. And I'm like, I. Like, I watched them play chess because I thought it was weird, but yeah.

[B]

Yeah. I was wondering if you were picking up anything there.

[D]

Right.

[A]

But I'm like, it's Rob. I mean, he must just be teaching Lisa chess. But, I mean, there's a moment you see on my face where I'm like, that's weird.

[B]

You're like, I'm not sure those two know how to play.

[C]

Neither of you know the rules.

[D]

I kept forgetting what I was doing, to be fair. Like, I was. It's so overwhelming. I relate, and I think traumatizing is the word, Johnny.

[C]

Yes.

[D]

Yes. Like, I was very worried before he went because of, like, privacy and making keeping the game, like, secret and all of that. There's no hair and makeup, so I was very worried about how I was gonna look because I'm not gifted to doing my hair and makeup. So that was one thing. But then otherwise, like, I am so chill with people like, I accept you as you are. I'm a cancer. So, like, give me all of your trauma. Let me help you.

[B]

Pisces, Scorpio.

[D]

Like, that's, that's my vibe. So in trying to suss out, especially from the beginning, Candace, Rinna, and Rob, I was just like, I love everyone and I want everyone to win, but it's just. It's such an overwhelming experience. And Tara and I watched it back last week. We were commentating the US Nationals. We stayed up until two in the morning watching the three episodes after work. And it was just so funny because there are so many moments that you're not in the room for. And the conga line. I missed the conga line entirely. No idea where I was.

[A]

Well, I like a good, good time too, Jay. Like, the thing about the castle is traumatizing and terrifying most of the time, but then other times, this cast was so cool. I think all of us got along so well.

[D]

For the most part.

[A]

It was hard. But, you know, conga line or dance party. I'm like, any castle camp activity, like, let's have some fun. Like, let's do it up.

[B]

It didn't rub you. It didn't feel weird to you that she was just like out of nowhere suggesting it? It was like, yeah, we've been drinking. Let's do a conga line.

[A]

I did say maybe we do this tomorrow. But then you hear me saying that because I'm. This is strange and it's late and I'm tired. But you know what? If you're going to do the conga.

[D]

Line, let me get it once. Tara goes all in too. Like, we didn't have normal childhoods or proper childhoods in any way. So anytime you give us like a ram head Easter egg hunt or a conga line, like, we're both going to give it our all because we didn't get to do it.

[C]

Sure. It's healing. It's healing something from the past. I have a very important question, which is how long is the drive from the castle to where they put you up? Which is not a production secret. No, I just want to know how long is that? Oh, no, you're not allowed to say. They're not allowed to say.

[B]

They really can't say.

[C]

You really can't say. Wow. They both were just like, you guys are good.

[D]

Well, we signed crazy NDAs. We can't tell anything. I can't afford a lawsuit.

[B]

Yeah, I was going to say, now I want to know, what does the NDA say? Can you say that? Like, what Are you up against.

[D]

I can tell you. And we were, we can tell you.

[A]

What happened that you saw.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

You can confirm our eyes were working.

[C]

You guys win the gold for abiding by the NDA. Congratulations.

[B]

Well, I guess one thing that we do know is that, you know, obviously you guys are an extremely well known duo and so your decision to act like you were not very close, were people sort of approaching you being like, hey, why aren't you talking to your very well known friend? Or did you just find that it didn't come up.

[A]

Well, Jay, I'll start this off and you can finish it. But I, you know, Johnny and I knew we were going to this together before we went.

[B]

You did.

[A]

And, and so when we got there, I mean our plan, what I thought the plan and we agreed the plan was just far away and just hope somehow they think we work together, but we're not that close. And you're, we're in this and we're competitive in our own right. So when Johnny, the very first night, you can kind of see it when they, it was such a quick clip. But he comes up and I thought he was being way too friendly. So I really give him the cold shoulder of like, nice to meet you, sir. You know, like I, and I saw his little face after I know him so well and I saw his face where he's like, okay, I don't know where to go.

[D]

Well, the thing is, like, I'm really socially awkward and like I like my people and everything I've learned, like how to be outgoing and stuff is just a very learned skill. So we, I don't think t. We never assume anyone knows who we are. And I think it's just again, because of the way we were raised and who we are, I'm not going to assume anything. We're going to be humble about it if someone does know, but if they don't know, we're also not going to be upset about it. And with that said, I never know who anyone is. I really don't follow pop culture a lot and time, to be fair. And we showed up and I knew Tara obviously, and I knew she was going to be there. And we had interviewed Eric Nam for a piece on K pop during the Olympics in Pyeongchang. So we knew him, but he had to remind me that I knew him. Otherwise I was just like, they're all so pretty and loud. Like, what am I gonna do?

[A]

Like, obviously we knew like Lisa Rinna, but I've never watched Housewives. I didn't Know who Rob was? I had no. We had no idea, I think, was.

[D]

There someone, like, I'm getting a lot is about Rappaport because, like, when you're there, you don't have access to your phone or the Internet and things like that. So I couldn't even, like, Google people, and I didn't know how divisive he was because I take everyone at face value. When you shake my hand, that's when I kind of make my judgment about you. So we didn't have any background information about anyone. And, like, since I've been home and people have seen the first three episodes, they're all like, how did you handle him? I'm like, I just thought he was loud, but I didn't realize his kind of reputation.

[C]

Well, pretty quickly, he. I feel like, divided the room within the traitors anyway, so, you know, he. He tips himself off in a way, so.

[B]

But out of everyone, was there one person that you actually were starstruck by, even if you don't follow two things?

[C]

Many.

[B]

That much?

[D]

Well, I didn't know anyone, honestly, I didn't know people didn't know if I should be starstruck or not, because I know I'm a fan of the show, and I know there's a lot of housewives and gamers, and I've never watched an episode of Survivor or Big Brother in my life. So as huge as they are in their communities, I had no idea I was. I'd known Alan Cumming before in the city and was, like, not starstruck by him. I wanted to see what he was wearing, but I knew him. The castle was very impressive. And, like, driving up to it for the first time, I was pretty starstruck by the castle, I can say. But everyone else, like, I just met them as regular people, not as huge stars in their own realm.

[B]

You probably were able to give, oh, my God, that's Tara Lipinski. To really fake it.

[A]

Well, what I think was cool is that because Johnny and I don't watch a lot of reality television that we really. I was talking to Candace about that. I really bonded with her, and I don't know anything about her history on Housewives, any storylines. I don't know anything. So I just know who I met. The human in front of me that I, you know, grew a friendship with, and now we talk about our babies, and I still haven't watched any of the shows, and I don't think I need to. I like the friendships that I made in the castle in that way.

[D]

Yeah. And I mean, we knew. We kind of knew of Mark Ballas because I did Dancing with the Stars, but not the season that he. He was on a break that season. And I quickly fell in love with Candace and Caroline. And I was just trying to be as chill and cool.

[A]

Lisa.

[D]

Rinna is the coolest.

[B]

Yeah, we love Rinna.

[D]

We love her.

[C]

Coolest, the best vibe. Well, I think the moral of this is that Eric Nam had to give you a. Actually, we've met Johnny, so that's very cool. You can wear that as a bad vibe.

[D]

He ran up because we were all outside the castle, Right. And it was just a cluster of people in cool outfits. And he ran up and instead of saying, johnny, it's so good to see you, he said, johnny. We worked together when we did that piece for the Olympics in Korea.

[C]

I'm Eric Reminder.

[A]

That's how you do it.

[D]

The cutoff.

[C]

He's so the best. The best. Well, thank you so much for joining us, for giving us your time. You guys are very busy right now. We'll see you in Milan, hopefully.

[D]

Yes.

[B]

We're going to be watching. We'll hang, we'll get a. We'll get a cocktail. I feel like this is a. This is a foursome that needs to happen.

[D]

We're gonna be working so we can have like a butter noodle or some pasta. We can drink.

[C]

Sure, sure.

[A]

I mean, I like a glass of wine.

[D]

I'll have dinner with you both.

[C]

It's heart healthy.

[B]

There we go.

[C]

See you there.

[D]

Thank you guys so much.

[B]

Bye, guys.

[D]

Bye.

[B]

A stirring conversation, truly.

[C]

They were willing to get into it with us about trader stuff. I'm truly.

[B]

As much as they could.

[C]

As much as they could.

[B]

You know, I'm interested. I love hearing how the faithfuls feel when the traitors are revealed on television. It's a whole other show they haven't even seen.

[C]

Of course.

[B]

Fascinating stuff.

[C]

Fascinating stuff. They're legends. I am genuinely so excited to hear them talk, talk, talk, and come out in looks, looks, looks.

[B]

And I'm excited to flag them down for a glass of wine on the ground in Milan.

[C]

On the ground in Milan.

[B]

It's gonna happen.

[C]

And we'll have a French wine. Yeah, A French wine in Italy, not an Italian.

[B]

You're so subversive.

[C]

So on the nose.

[B]

Anyway, whatever we drink, we'll be sure to tell you all about it on the next episode of Two Guys Five rings.

[C]

It might not be the next one. It might be another.

[B]

We don't know when it's gonna be.

[C]

We don't know we might forget about. We might forget to mention it.

[B]

At some point, you'll either hear from us or you won't.

[C]

And that's just how life is. That's just how all communication is. Really. Yeah. I can't guarantee that you'll hear from me ever again after today.

[B]

I would be sad. Ultimately, I'd get over it, because I'd have to.

[C]

Right?

[B]

But it would be hard to lose you, Bo.

[D]

I agree.

[A]

This is an I heart podcast. Guaranteed human.