Last Podcast On The Left: Episode Summary

Episode: Strange Customs: An Interview with Sasha Sagan

Release Date: December 27, 2024
Host: The Last Podcast Network
Guest: Sasha Sagan, Author of Four Small Creatures: Such as We and Host of the podcast Strange Customs

1. Introduction to Sasha Sagan

The episode kicks off with Henry Zabowski and Ed Larson introducing their special guest, Sasha Sagan. The hosts express excitement about her presence, highlighting her work as an author and podcast host. Sasha Sagan warmly engages with the hosts, appreciating the introduction and sharing her connection to her renowned parents, Andrea and Carl Sagan.

Notable Quote:

• Sasha Sagan [02:35]: "Hello. It's so nice to be with you both. Thanks for that hilarious and charming introduction."

2. Being the Daughter of Carl Sagan

The conversation delves into Sasha's relationship with her father's legacy. She emphasizes that her worldview and creative endeavors are deeply influenced by her parents' work, particularly Carl Sagan's contributions to science and literature.

Notable Quotes:

• Sasha Sagan [02:54]: "A lot of my work and definitely my worldview is based on my parents' work. So I feel like it's part of my identity."
• Henry Zabowski [03:04]: "Do people immediately assume, obviously, I know you're a genius because I was reading your essays. You know, you're very smart."

3. Conspiracies, Religion, and the Human Psyche

Sasha explores the intersection between conspiracy theories and religion, suggesting that both stem from humanity's discomfort with uncertainty. She posits that the need to find explanations, even unsettling ones, fills a psychological void when faced with the unpredictable nature of the future.

Notable Quotes:

• Sasha Sagan [05:45]: "There is this correlation between conspiracy theories and so much of the history of religion because we are so uncomfortable not knowing."
• Sasha Sagan [07:08]: "It's as much of a faith as anything else because you kind of believe that like a faith in the deep state means that there's a daddy somewhere making sure that there's a plan."

4. Exploring Human Customs and Rituals

Sasha discusses the concept of customs from an anthropological perspective, inspired by her father's thought experiments about explaining human behavior to an extraterrestrial observer. She underscores the importance of rituals in providing structure and meaning, especially in a secular context.

Notable Quotes:

• Sasha Sagan [08:07]: "If you were an anthropologist from somewhere else, how would you explain, you know, marriage? Anything from rituals around birth to April Fool's Day or Halloween."
• Sasha Sagan [09:56]: "It's about processing change, right? Like someone's alive and then they are not alive. How do we make sense of that?"

5. Secular Alternatives to Religious Rituals

The discussion shifts to secular approaches to marking significant life events and seasonal changes. Sasha emphasizes the creation of meaningful rituals without relying on religious infrastructure, highlighting celebrations like the winter solstice as examples.

Notable Quotes:

• Sasha Sagan [12:53]: "I do everything. We do Hanukkah...and we do Christmas stuff too. And then the other thing that we do is the winter solstice."
• Sasha Sagan [13:40]: "Tomorrow, no matter what, the days are gonna start getting longer again. And that is unpleasant. But because of the axial tilt of the earth, we will have more sunlight and eventually return to summer."

6. The Afterlife and Belief Systems

Ed Larson poses personal questions about the afterlife, referencing his father's skepticism and his own spiritual conflicts. Sasha responds by outlining her evidence-based stance, expressing skepticism toward afterlife claims without empirical support.

Notable Quotes:

• Ed Larson [22:46]: "There's nothing to me. Like, my dad died twice. The first time he died, he had no idea that anything ever happened."
• Sasha Sagan [22:58]: "I need evidence. I don't believe in an afterlife. I don't believe in anything paranormal because without evidence, how can we possibly know what is real?"

7. Science, Evidence, and the Universe

Sasha elaborates on her scientific perspective, emphasizing the importance of evidence and the self-correcting nature of science. The conversation touches upon the possibility of alien life and whether scientific principles are universal or subject to variation across the cosmos.

Notable Quotes:

• Sasha Sagan [28:07]: "Science is a method to understand. And whatever we were to encounter somewhere else, surely it would be amazingly different. But the pursuit of understanding it would still be science."
• Sasha Sagan [30:32]: "Science is not a set of beliefs. It's a method that constantly tests and updates our understanding based on new evidence."

8. Astrology and Its Place in Modern Society

The hosts challenge Sasha on the validity of astrology, leading to an engaging discussion. Sasha dismisses astrology due to the lack of empirical evidence but acknowledges the human desire to find meaning and connection through such practices.

Notable Quotes:

• Ed Larson [34:56]: "Does astrology hold any merit? Am I the same as everyone born on October 5th?"
• Sasha Sagan [35:34]: "Astrology is not supported by evidence. How would the positions of planets and stars at your birth impact your personality?"

9. The Future of Religion and Secularism

Sasha shares her insights on the evolving landscape of religion and secularism. She suggests that increasing secularism might paradoxically lead to heightened fanaticism as individuals seek new forms of community and identity outside traditional religious frameworks.

Notable Quotes:

• Sasha Sagan [38:32]: "The rise of normalizing a lack of religion can make more fanaticism because sometimes you dig your heels in deeper when you feel there's a threat."
• Sasha Sagan [40:18]: "Religion is a mirror. You can find reasons to feed the poor or to feel superior to others. It depends on how you choose to use it."

10. Building Community Without Religion

Concluding the episode, Sasha emphasizes the importance of community and belonging without relying on religious institutions. She advocates for involvement in causes, volunteering, and social justice as means to foster meaningful connections and collective purpose.

Notable Quotes:

• Sasha Sagan [46:01]: "When we can look at ourselves as belonging to the planet, we can overcome superficial and meaningless differences."
• Sasha Sagan [47:11]: "For those of us who are not religious, we have to build that sense of community for ourselves through causes we believe in."

Closing Remarks

The episode wraps up with the hosts thanking Sasha Sagan for her insightful contributions. Sasha shares her social media handles and encourages listeners to check out her book and podcast, Strange Customs, even though she's currently on a break from active hosting.

Notable Quotes:

• Henry Zabowski [50:37]: "Please buy the book for Four Small Creatures: Such as We by Sasha Sagan."
• Sasha Sagan [51:22]: "I'm Sasha Sagan on Instagram and I just had the best time talking to you both. Thank you."

Key Insights and Conclusions

• Human Need for Meaning: The episode underscores humanity's intrinsic need to create meaning through rituals, whether religious or secular, to navigate the complexities of life and change.

• Science vs. Belief: Sasha Sagan advocates for a science-based worldview, emphasizing the importance of evidence and the adaptability of scientific understanding in the face of new discoveries.

• Community Without Religion: In an increasingly secular world, building community through shared causes and social engagement is vital for fostering a sense of belonging and collective purpose.

• Critique of Extremism: The discussion highlights how both religious and secular extreme beliefs can stem from a desire for identity and control, urging a more inclusive and evidence-based approach to understanding the world.

Useful Resources

• Sasha Sagan on Instagram: @sashasagan
• Book: Four Small Creatures: Such as We by Sasha Sagan
• Podcast: Strange Customs (Currently on a break, but available for past episodes)

This episode offers a profound exploration of human customs, belief systems, and the quest for meaning, guided by Sasha Sagan's unique perspective as the daughter of Carl Sagan and a thoughtful commentator on modern society.