Gen X Retirement Home

Summary

Laugh Lines with Kim & Penn Holderness
Episode: Gen X Retirement Home
Date: June 2, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this lively and heartfelt episode of Laugh Lines, Kim and Penn Holderness explore the hilarious—and sometimes poignant—realities of Gen X aging. Prompted by a recent visit to Penn's mother in a memory care unit, Kim and Penn imagine what a Gen X retirement home would look and sound like, from the music playing in the halls to the activities (prank calls! Columbia House sheets! garden hoses as toys!). The episode also delves into generational shifts in beauty standards (eyebrows, anyone?) and opens a larger conversation about social support systems, especially among men. As always, the hosts blend humor with empathy, inviting listeners to laugh, reflect, and chime in on their own experiences.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Visit to Memory Care and Reflections on Aging

[03:14 – 09:00]

• Kim and Penn share stories from a recent visit to Penn’s mother, who is in the end stages of Alzheimer’s. They reflect on the resilience of caregivers and the bittersweet milestones (“She’s the longest resident here!”).
• Music’s impact on memory is discussed, and they joke about what songs’ll wake them up in their own dotage.
  • Quote (Kim, 07:00): “Laughter through tears is one of my favorite emotions.”

2. Music & the Gen X Retirement Home Playlist

[09:00 – 12:15]

• They speculate about what music will be played in Gen X retirement homes (Pantera, Snoop Dogg, Salt-N-Pepa, Blues Traveler).
  • Quote (Kim, 09:59): “If music truly has this impact on our brains...what’s the song they’re going to play and you’ll just sit straight up and know every single word?”
• Kim's picks: "Shoop" by Salt-N-Pepa, Blues Traveler’s "The Hook".
• Penn's pick: "Gin and Juice" by Snoop Dogg.
• Noting that their kids are starting to appreciate Gen X “classics”.

3. What Activities Will Gen Xers Want in Retirement?

[12:14 – 23:00]

• Kim and Penn create a hilarious “Top 10” wishlist of retirement home activities, including:

  1. Columbia House coloring sheets: reliving the chaotic subscription model of their youth.
  2. Oregon Trail IRL tours: “Everyone gets a little dysentery.”
  3. Frosted tips & Sun-In booth: nostalgic beauty trends.
  4. Running Man dance lessons (Gen X vs Gen Z styles)
  5. Prank calling other residents: “There was no caller ID!”
  6. Making mixtapes: catching your favorite song on the radio.
  7. Friendship bracelets: still cool, confirmed by Gen Z producer Sam.
  8. Water hose fun: celebrating the garden hose as the ultimate childhood toy.
  9. John Hughes movie marathons: clarifying which films are—and aren’t—John Hughes.
  10. Be the 10th caller—Radio call-in contest: using “Mr. Microphone” (with the infamous “Hey, good looking!” commercial [28:24]).

  • Quote (Penn, 15:06): “Number one: Columbia house record activity sheets.”

  • Quote (Kim, 17:33): “Prank calling—they just won’t get how much time [Gen X] spent doing this.”

  • Quote (Kim, 18:13): “I think girls should do it [prank calling boys and giggling].”

  • Fun aside: The group discusses the oddities of drinking hot water from garden hoses and the joys of jumping through sprinklers (20:07).

4. Generational Beauty Standards & Kim’s Eyebrow Saga

[31:14 – 42:36]

• Kim reads a critical DM about her eyebrows and opens up about how impossible it feels to balance not caring with societal pressure: “Not caring is its own kind of pressure.”
  • Quote (Kim, 33:27): “I am so jealous of the women who can dropkick beauty standards… but I do care how I look.”
  • Quote (Kim, 37:35): “I have never dressed for a man… I dress for the girls, the girls, gays, and theys.”
• The hosts and producer Sam comment on beauty standards evolving (thick vs. thin brows) and the challenge of staying ahead of trends. Tips for brow-boosting (Costco Rapid Brow Serum, castor oil, tinting at the salon) are shared, but with the clear caveat: Only if you want to!
• Penn insists (with typical endearing obtuseness) that no man notices women's brows.
  • Quote (Penn, 37:00): “We’re not noticing your eyebrows at all.”
• Sam offers a passionate PSA about why people shouldn’t shame others’ appearances on the internet.
  • Quote (Sam, 44:24): “Stop talking bad about people.”

5. Women Supporting Women vs. Men Supporting Men

[48:46 – 53:52]

• The group reflects on how women have built robust support communities, both online and offline.
  • Quote (Penn, 49:39): “Women supporting women, women supporting women… y’all, for the most part, are doing it. Men could learn a lot from you on that.”
• Kim issues a "call to action": Listeners are invited to share examples of men supporting men vulnerably—“Is it just Bible study and CrossFit?”—and suggests support for men might need guidance from women.
• Touches on the "loneliness epidemic" amongst men, the lack of safe, open spaces for sharing, and the challenges of gender roles.
  • Quote (Kim, 52:06): “I do not see men in those communities, and in fact, the opposite, and I think it’s deeply harmful.”

6. The Signature Laugh Line

[53:54 – 55:42]

• Voicemail from listener Abigail, who misread the previous episode title and thought Kim & Penn were interviewing a psychic medium—prompts more jokes about “the year of our Lord Dolly Parton” and future potential episodes with a medium.

7. Closing Reflections

[56:00 – End]

• Recap of the wild range of topics covered: aging, activities, music, eyebrows, beauty pressures, gender support systems, and the promise of more in the next episodes.
• Kim and Penn encourage listener participation: send podcast title ideas, share thoughts on men’s groups, and recommend mediums!

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Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• Kim, on aging in place (04:07):
  “This week I was reminded in one day, in one day specifically, that I am not old enough and yet too old, and I'm showing my age.”
• Penn, about Gen X playlists (09:38):
  “I do believe... your brother Dale will be listening to Pantera.”
• Kim, on Columbia House nostalgia (13:06):
  “What are the ways that...they’re going to make us fill out Columbia House worksheets... like a coloring book.”
• Penn, on making mixtapes (19:33):
  “Making mixtapes using a jam box and a cassette... hours and hours of entertainment.”
• Kim, on beauty pressure (33:36):
  “Not caring is its own kind of pressure. You’re supposed to age gracefully and not care, but look effortless and be confident and take care of yourself and not try too hard.”
• Sam, on body shaming (44:24):
  “Why are we putting women down?... Stop talking bad about people.”
• Penn, on men’s vulnerability (52:23):
  “Why is there a loneliness epidemic that’s specific to males right now in our country?”
• Kim, imagining a Gen X retirement home (53:52):
  “We have danced, we have laughed. We have talked about my eyebrows...I need information about men’s groups, mediums, and what should we have titled this podcast!”

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Important Timestamps

• 03:14 – 09:00: Alzheimer’s journey, music & memory
• 09:00 – 12:15: Gen X playlist debate, what music will “reach us” in old age
• 12:14 – 23:00: Top 10 Gen X retirement home activities
• 31:14 – 42:36: Beauty standards, Kim’s eyebrow dilemma, crowdsourced advice
• 48:46 – 53:52: Gender differences in community, loneliness, and support systems
• 53:54 – 55:42: Laugh Line listener voicemail & psychic medium discussion

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Memorable Moments

• The running gag about dancing to “Booty Music” in the nursing home and pranking fellow residents over a closed circuit.
• Kim’s deadpan delivery on the Gen X childhood: “Listen to the radio and hit play/record when our favorite song came on and prank call people.”
• A meta-moment about changing beauty standards, “By the time you get the brow thing figured out, thin brows will be back.”
• Listener Abigail’s confusion about “medium” vs. “retirement home” and the crew riffing on doing a psychic episode in the future.

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Call to Action

• How are men supporting each other? Kim and Penn want to hear from listeners—call, write, or suggest experts if you know how men build community or what’s working to fight male loneliness.
• Podcast title suggestions are invited as the episode closes with self-deprecating laughs at their own indecision.

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For more laughs, nostalgia, and honest talk about aging, tune in to future episodes of Laugh Lines with Kim & Penn!

Transcript

[Penn Holderness]

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[Penn Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

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[Penn Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

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[Penn Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

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[Penn Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

That's avocadogreenmattpress.com Holderness avocadogreenmattrush.com Holderness they're gonna hand you a tambourine and it's gonna be like welcome to the Jungle women

[Penn Holderness]

are probably feeling less lonely than men.

[Kim Holderness]

Everybody gets a little dysentery.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Sam]

And Kim's eyebrows.

[Kim Holderness]

And Kim's eyebrows.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. We get older every day. Got more wrinkles. That's okay. Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

We're laughing.

[Penn Holderness]

When we age, life is like a comedy stage. And that's why we got.

[Kim Holderness]

Hi there, friends. I'm Kim Holderness.

[Penn Holderness]

And I'm Penn Holderness. Thank you so much for joining us on Laugh Lines. If it's a wide enough shot, you can see that it's an Ugg moccasins kind of day.

[Kim Holderness]

I am wearing my house slippers because guess what? Lift the veil. We are in our house.

[Penn Holderness]

Yep.

[Kim Holderness]

It is really hard to get motivated to put on a bra for this.

[Penn Holderness]

I know, right?

[Kim Holderness]

When we went to YouTube. We are on YouTube and I had to consistently put on bras to record a podcast. It was. My body was like, wait, what?

[Penn Holderness]

We need, like a closed stuff circuit camera where, like, within five minutes of leaving what looks like a professional scene, Kim is in this special, what I call her bathrobe of all bathrobes that she's just gotten that she has a matching bathrobe with Lola and. No.

[Kim Holderness]

Well, no. Lola got it for Christmas. She accidentally left it at home. I put it on because I missed her. And then I was like, oh, this is great. And then I just, like, sent her another one to school. I have become an old lady. But we have matching bathrobes now.

[Penn Holderness]

Anyway, so look, if you ever over plucked your eyebrows in 90s, welcome, welcome. This is your home. Also foreshadowing.

[Kim Holderness]

Yes. This week I was reminded in one day, in one day specifically that I am not old enough and yet too old, and I'm showing my age.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay. Oh, wow. So this is. This is new information to me. Tell me, tell me what the.

[Kim Holderness]

Not old enough. We went to go visit your mom yesterday at the memory care unit. And first of all, angels of angels that care for these people. And your mom has been there for seven years. She is the longest.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, she's the. She's king of the mountain. If that was the game that people played in a memory care unit, pushing people off. She is. We looked at each other like, yay.

[Kim Holderness]

Celebrate. Like, congratulations, nobody. It is so sad because you get to know the other residents when you visit and then when you. When you walk in and you see their picture about, like, you know, and the flowers and the flowers of, like, who's recently passed, it is like, it's a little bit of a. It's a lot of bit of A gut punch. And so the fact that your mom has been there the longest of any other resident, we're like, yay. Cool. But she's hanging on. She. They're all like, she's a strong lady, you guys.

[Penn Holderness]

It's the codes that we're hearing from, again, the angels on earth are she's really strong or, like, she's hanging in there, or, like, she's incredible or with a question mark. Anyway, like, one. One of them was like, she's doing fine. Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay. So if. If you're new here. Pen's mom is in the end stages of Alzheimer's. She has been in the end stages of Alzheimer's for two or three years, longer than most. Longer than most people. She will be studied by science. She's actually. They have a. It is set up.

[Penn Holderness]

Yes. Brain study from Duke University. It's like. I want to talk about that really quickly.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay.

[Penn Holderness]

So it was. It got shut down for a while during the pandemic and then came back in. And basically, they want to study the brain of an Alzheimer's patient because, first of all, you can't, like, officially diagnose someone with Alzheimer's until you see their brain.

[Kim Holderness]

Right?

[Penn Holderness]

So it's very rare that you get that kind of data. And so her. Her brain is like this very. It's. Everyone's very excited to get a look at it.

[Kim Holderness]

So to be clear, Penn's mom and dad sign up for the study 20 years ago.

[Penn Holderness]

Yes, 20 years ago.

[Kim Holderness]

It was 20 years ago because it was before Lola was born. And there is a wral, which is our local station, interviewed your mom and dad about the study. And I. And I'm not. I'm cry that Lola, when she misses your dad, she watches.

[Penn Holderness]

Of all the things that she watches.

[Kim Holderness]

She watches the YouTube video about him, but he was talking about Alzheimer's prevention, and stuff like that, so I didn't know that. Anyway. Okay, I'm gonna stop. No. Because this is happy. So angels on Earth, I'm gonna stop

[Penn Holderness]

because this is happening.

[Kim Holderness]

This is happening.

[Penn Holderness]

It doesn't have to always be happy.

[Kim Holderness]

No, it doesn't have to always be happening. I know, but feeling feelings is just hard and truly. Yesterday, we. I had made Lola this weekend watch Steel Magnolias, and one of Dolly Parton's famous lines from that is like, laughter through tears is one of my favorite emotions. And it is true, because we were. We were. You know, everybody in the room is like, she's still here, and you don't know how to feel about it. And then Your brother, who is so involved and so kind, said, hey, remember, if she's in her room by herself, leave the music on. Because music was such a big part of her life. There's all this evidence that your brain hangs onto music longer than it does speech.

[Penn Holderness]

Right. She stopped talking two or three years

[Kim Holderness]

ago, more than that.

[Penn Holderness]

And she's, she's. Can't hum anymore. But she hummed for years.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah, it was. I mean, honestly, it's been five or six years since she stopped talking. Since she stopped talking.

[Penn Holderness]

She hummed for a long time.

[Kim Holderness]

She would hum or even sing.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

And so music has a special place in your brain worth knowing. And it is interesting because they do have music, a lot playing in that unit. And it's, it's music from their childhood. Right. It's 50s, 60s, 70s, from their heydays. Right. And that's the music that you can tell, you know, her eyes open and lights are up. So we were joking that like the Gen X nursing home for your brother Dale, specifically the music channel that they're going to be putting on is going to be like Pantera.

[Penn Holderness]

I know. I feel like I need to like qualify this for my brother because he is a sweet, sweet man.

[Kim Holderness]

Sweetest, kindest.

[Penn Holderness]

He's the, he's the guy. Guy who, if you get, if you get to a four way stop, there is no way he's going first.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. He's never going to leave that pool race.

[Penn Holderness]

He loves death metal. He absolutely. He took me to a death metal concert that I was so funny because he would send me like death metal CDs in college and I would like funny listen to them because it's just hysterical. You don't understand what they're saying. And they're screaming pretty loud and they may be like white supremacists. I don't really know what their deal is, but it's like, I don't know.

[Leon Nayfak]

Wow.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

So, so, but I. Dale is not very much.

[Penn Holderness]

Not in no way. No. But so. But I'm like giggling at the songs and he's like, guess what? We got your tickets to Pantera. And I was like, oh, I'm going to an entire concert with these people.

[Kim Holderness]

So I do believe, and I don't know that I could sing or scream a Pantera song, but I do believe that your brother Dale will be listening to that in.

[Penn Holderness]

To Pantera.

[Kim Holderness]

To Pantera.

[Penn Holderness]

So probably.

[Kim Holderness]

And I think there's going to be a music hour. They're gonna hand you a tambourine and it's gonna be like, welcome to the jungle.

[Penn Holderness]

Welcome to the jungle. So we got. Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

So here's my question to you. If. If music truly has this impact on our brains that we are going to have the ability to remember music more than speech, what is the song they're going to play? And you're going to be like. The kids are going to be around your bed and be like, oh, dad, he doesn't remember good life. And then you're going to. They're going to hit play on this song and you're going to sit straight up and know every single word.

[Penn Holderness]

Probably gin and juice. Like that. I mean, that one just gets me going. Okay, but unfortunately, the first like three seconds of that song, if you listen to it, is someone urinating.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay. But no. So then you pee your pants, but you'll probably have a diaper.

[Penn Holderness]

Yep. So you'll just let that go? I mean.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah, I think you owe us some of it.

[Penn Holderness]

With so much drama in the lbc.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah, go for it.

[Penn Holderness]

Kind of hard being Snoop D O double G, but somehow, some way keep coming up with funky ass like every single day. May I kick a little something for the G's and make a few Answer my E. Yes. And then the parties in the jumping because your mom ain't home. I got. We did a. One of our first parodies was a Halloween parody with that where I got to say I got witches in the living room getting it on.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

Or no, no witches in the living room taking my corn candy corn and they ain't leaving till six in the morning.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

And we had like, kids in our neighborhood dressed as witches. Those videos were.

[Kim Holderness]

And now those kids were like adults. They were stupid. They were awesome.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. Those girls are like, married now.

[Kim Holderness]

I know. It's craz. So mine. It would either be shoot by salt

[Penn Holderness]

and pepper, of course, or Blues Traveler or the.

[Kim Holderness]

The. The Hook. That. That chorus from Hook. Or that time. Yeah. I think I'm just gonna know that until I die. It's been carved into my brain.

[Penn Holderness]

Any of those. Like, I imagine, first of all, our kids are gonna know those songs. Have you noticed that they're starting to listen to our classic rock? Like, it's. It's having a moment. Like they're listening to Nirvana.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. No. And Lola's super into PC likes Biggie. She was like, just on a big Stevie.

[Penn Holderness]

Oh, that's awesome. Yeah, I put her on Liz Fair and she started to like her too, which is another great one. Anyway.

[Kim Holderness]

Anyway.

[Penn Holderness]

So, okay. I love this nursing home journey we made. We remember we made that Video about the Gen X retirement home.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. And it would just be us, like, dancing to booty music.

[Penn Holderness]

And so you asked me a fantastic question this morning right before we sat down, and I had a little bit of time to think about this, but, like, they've got these activities at my. At my mom's nursing home. There's like, you know, there's. There's a guy who comes in and plays music.

[Kim Holderness]

They do bingo.

[Penn Holderness]

There's bingo. There's. Of course there's bingo. There's like, chair exercises. There's, like, on the lower floor. There's, you know, other stuff like there. And once you go to the regular community, there's water aerobics, there's activities. Right. And you asked the question, like, what are like, 10 activities that our generation could, like, implement that's not currently in retirement homes?

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. And I don't even know if it needs to be 10. But I was thinking, what are the ways that. Like that. And this made me laugh so hard. Like, what are we going to be doing? And I. My first instinct was they're going to make us fill out Columbia House worksheets. Like, they're just. It's going to be like a doodle sheet. Like a. A Columbia House coloring book. Coloring book. Like the watercolor. And because it, you know, we actually recently did a song. Is it appropriate to play that here where we.

[Penn Holderness]

Oh, the Columbia House.

[Kim Holderness]

OG I really don't know. I think that I might be still in some collections. Like, my credit was definitely impacted by ordering Columbia House records.

[Penn Holderness]

I am a Columbia House.

[Kim Holderness]

Oh, gee.

[Penn Holderness]

I got 12 CDs for free. And then I didn't paid their late fee. I had debt collectors come in for me. So there's a bit of the song. I'm happy to tell you that they forgave all debt in, like, 2000. And Sam can look this up, but they. They officially. I think it was like, in the 2000s. It was a lot later than you would think. But they officially forgave all the debt.

[Kim Holderness]

Love that.

[Sam]

Columbia House filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in 2015, meaning that any residual debts from that era are essentially uncollected.

[Penn Holderness]

There you go.

[Kim Holderness]

They filed for bankruptcy. I wonder why. Yeah, like, what was the business model? Like, a hundred thousand pennies. But then they just scammed everybody.

[Penn Holderness]

The business model was like, put this in magazines like Tiger Beat, where, like, unresponsible teenagers will, like, sign a bonding contract for many, many years of servitude and debt, which is. Yeah, not a great business model.

[Kim Holderness]

Do you think that in our nursing home, babe. They're going to have a highlights magazines everywhere.

[Penn Holderness]

Find the five things.

[Kim Holderness]

Five things that are different.

[Penn Holderness]

That's a good one. So without further ado, pen and Kim's 10 activities we want when we get put in a nursing home.

[Kim Holderness]

Number one, Columbia house record activity sheets.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay. Like coloring books.

[Kim Holderness]

Coloring books of Columbia house records forms.

[Penn Holderness]

Amazing. Okay. Number two, Oregon Trail IRL tour.

[Kim Holderness]

So everybody gets a little dysentery.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. But like, we. They turn the entire thing into an Oregon Trail. You have like, fake wagons that you go through. You have to go over rivers and water. Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

And everybody dies of dysentery. Yeah. It'll be great. Okay. I suggest a frosted tip station. Yes.

[Penn Holderness]

Right. Frosted tips. Or could you also just do sun in.

[Kim Holderness]

Or sun in.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

And that could be a fun activity. And we would. We would have to do it to each other as residents. Yes.

[Penn Holderness]

My. My buddy brought sun in to the beach for us, like one. One week. And we didn't tell any of our parents about it. And it did not go great.

[Kim Holderness]

It. It turns you. It orange.

[Penn Holderness]

No, it wasn't blonde. It was orange. We were all redheads by the time we left. Okay. Number four, running man lessons.

[Kim Holderness]

Do you guys know that the running man that the kids do these days is different than our running man?

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

I take a dance class I've talked about all the time. It's dance insanity. And sometimes we do a lot of 90s moves. And listen, these youngins, they're good. They're better than me. It's fine. But when she throws a running man into the combination.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

It trips them up.

[Penn Holderness]

Yep.

[Kim Holderness]

I find such joy. And they're cute little young selves having a little bit of struggle.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

Do you know. I mean, I don't know if I could do it here.

[Penn Holderness]

You mean the new running man or the old running.

[Kim Holderness]

I could do both here, but I don't know if the camera would allow it.

[Penn Holderness]

Right back here, babe.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay. The first is the traditional. The only running man that should have ever.

[Penn Holderness]

The hammer Running man.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. Ready?

[Penn Holderness]

The Vanilla Ice running man. Yep. There it is. That's easy, right?

[Kim Holderness]

You're lifting a leg, pushing back. This is how the kids are doing it. They're doing like. Like a. Like a. More like a. Like a. Like a kick out. They're doing more of like a heel kick out.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay.

[Kim Holderness]

Like a.

[Penn Holderness]

That's not a running man.

[Kim Holderness]

That's not a running man. It's a lift and push.

[Penn Holderness]

Lift and push.

[Kim Holderness]

And they're doing like a kick that's totally different. And this is why in the retirement home we need lessons.

[Penn Holderness]

Do they have the hammer variation of the Running Man? Hang on, I'm gonna be up there with you. The hammer variation is you're here and then you go, you switch the sides. You go all the way around like a dance sign. And then there's the Jason Sudeikis. What's up with that? Redo this while you're doing it. There's a lot of different variations.

[Kim Holderness]

There are a lot of. See? And this is why it would be a good activity in the nursing home, because there are so many variations that the Gen Xers know. I think there should be a special activity where we get to prank call people. I don't think people of this generation understand how much time we spent prank calling.

[Penn Holderness]

It was a lot.

[Kim Holderness]

It was a lot of time.

[Penn Holderness]

There was no caller id.

[Kim Holderness]

There was no caller id. We had nothing to do. There wasn't the Internet. Our dad was watching TV and there was only one TV in the house and it had three channels. So literally all we had to do was like, listen to the radio and hit play and record when our favorite song came on and prank call people.

[Penn Holderness]

So. And it's funny because that's coming up next. But I want to stay on prank calling people because I love this, especially in a memory care unit. I think it should be closed circuit and I think you should prank call the other people in your residence and they'll, they'll be very confused, they'll forget about it. And then you could do it over and over again.

[Kim Holderness]

Alzheimer's humor.

[Penn Holderness]

I mean, look, look, if you're, if you got five out of six of your parents and grandparents getting it, you can make a joke about it. So, but like, that would be.

[Kim Holderness]

What was your prank? Did you have like a script you used?

[Penn Holderness]

It was always trying to make them say something, right? And I'm trying to remember, like, you know, like. So I would do knock knock jokes with people like, knock knock. Who's there? Boo, boo hoo. Don't be such a crybaby and hang up. Like, mine were very G rated.

[Kim Holderness]

I think girls, I, me personally, we would. If you liked a boy and you were like, with your girl, like, you would call their house, just giggle and hang up.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, I had that happen to me once. I mean, like, I was not a hunk, but like once that happened to me and it like, I gotta tell you, feels great. Feels great when you know there's a girl giggling and hanging up.

[Kim Holderness]

Maybe girls should do it.

[Penn Holderness]

Yep. Never Figured out who it was. Number six. Making mixtapes using a jam box and a cassette. So you have to, like, sit there and wait for your favorite song to come up, and then you have to really quick hit record.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

On time.

[Kim Holderness]

It's a skill.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, it is. And that. That's, like, hours and hours of entertainment because you're just really having to listen through all the songs you don't like.

[Kim Holderness]

Ye.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. I think that's a skill. Okay. Making friendship bracelets. I. I think kids still do friendship bracelets. Sam, you're young. Did you do. Did you make friendship bracelets? You did?

[Sam]

Oh, yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

Just because I was, like, a atypical show choir boy. Like, I. You've seen me make friendship bracelets.

[Kim Holderness]

Very good.

[Penn Holderness]

I can. I can rock them. Like, the. The pinky you can make.

[Kim Holderness]

You can make shapes.

[Penn Holderness]

I think it's like, seven threads. Four on this and three on this, and you get the pinky to thread through. Like, I can make a mean friendship bracelet. Okay. Number eight. Everyone gets kicked out a nursing home, and you only have a garden hose. That's your only toy.

[Kim Holderness]

But let me tell you. No. Like, the garden hose truly was the center of our summer life. It was your first. I have to, like, wash everybody's car, and then you. You can put an attachment, like, the sprinkler head on it, and then you play. Like, literally. Playing in the sprinkler was an entire activity.

[Penn Holderness]

Jumping through the sprinkler.

[Kim Holderness]

Yes.

[Penn Holderness]

And your parents wanted to do that because you were also disgusting. Well, also unaware that you were watering the lawn for them.

[Kim Holderness]

Yes.

[Penn Holderness]

And.

[Kim Holderness]

And then. And then you drank it when you got thirsty.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

It was like an entire entertainment container.

[Penn Holderness]

And the water never got cold. 145 degrees. And you would get, like, blisters. Did you ever get, like, blisters on your mouth from the.

[Kim Holderness]

I think you're just a blistery guy. I never got blisters just from the.

[Penn Holderness]

From the metal that you're like.

[Kim Holderness]

You're putting your mouth on the metal.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. You got to make sure you get the. Get a good flow. No. Okay.

[Kim Holderness]

You take it from the midstream.

[Penn Holderness]

Oh, like this?

[Kim Holderness]

Yes.

[Penn Holderness]

I feel like I'm to death if I'm doing one of the seal.

[Kim Holderness]

Are you one of the people that when you're drinking out of a water fountain, you like.

[Penn Holderness]

I have in the past gotten very close. My mouth has gotten very close to it.

[Kim Holderness]

Like, you're not supposed to touch the metal part. Like, you're not supposed to, like, totally.

[Penn Holderness]

Like, I Probably touched the metal part.

[Kim Holderness]

Ew.

[Penn Holderness]

Listen, I did a lot of gross stuff growing up, and I get sick less than anybody in our family.

[Kim Holderness]

We have talked about this.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

I always was, like, with pride. Oh, I'm. I'm so healthy. I never get sick. I never get sick. I get sick and you don't.

[Boost Mobile Announcer]

No.

[Kim Holderness]

It is so immune system. It's from licking everybody.

[Penn Holderness]

Putting my entire mouth around the water fountain.

[Kim Holderness]

I suggest also a John Hughes movie marathon. Those are the. Those are the movies of our people. Yes, yes.

[Penn Holderness]

And there. There are many. So it could be John Hughes movies and also movies that we think might be John Hughes movies.

[Kim Holderness]

Like.

[Penn Holderness]

Well, there's a lot of movies that we think are John Hughes movies, but they're not John Hughes movies.

[Kim Holderness]

Say more.

[Penn Holderness]

So tell me what you think is a John Hughes movie.

[Kim Holderness]

Like Ferris Bueller's Day Off.

[Penn Holderness]

I don't think that was a Johnny's movie.

[Kim Holderness]

Really?

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, I think it's like Sixteen Candles, Uncle Buck. Like, what are the John Hughes movies?

[Kim Holderness]

Okay.

[Sam]

John Hughes is most famous for Sixteen Candles. Breakfast Club.

[Penn Holderness]

Yep.

[Sam]

Weird Science.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. Oh, God, yes.

[Kim Holderness]

Weird Science. Yeah.

[Sam]

Ferris Bueller's Day Off.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay, sorry.

[Kim Holderness]

Thank you.

[Penn Holderness]

Sorry.

[Sam]

Planes, Trains and Automobiles.

[Kim Holderness]

Classic.

[Sam]

She's having a baby.

[Kim Holderness]

Yes.

[Sam]

Uncle Buck.

[Penn Holderness]

Yep.

[Sam]

And Curly Sue.

[Penn Holderness]

Curly.

[Kim Holderness]

Curly Sue. I didn't realize Curly sue was a John.

[Penn Holderness]

Yes.

[Sam]

Oh, and this is interesting. Those are all directed, written and produced. Written only. Like, he just wrote that.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Sam]

National lampoon's vacation.

[Penn Holderness]

What?

[Sam]

Mr. Mom.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay.

[Sam]

Pretty in Pink. Some Kind of Wonderful. Home Alone.

[Kim Holderness]

Stop.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, I knew that.

[Sam]

Made in Manhattan.

[Kim Holderness]

Jennifer Lopez.

[Penn Holderness]

Which one was Ali Sheedy in?

[Kim Holderness]

Not Made in Manhattan.

[Penn Holderness]

Are you sure?

[Kim Holderness]

Jennifer Lopez was a hundred percent made in Manhattan.

[Sam]

Yeah, I can tell you that strongly.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay.

[Penn Holderness]

Made to order. Sorry. I mean, that's pretty close, right? Yeah. All right, so he did do a lot of them. There are. But, like, I always assume that St. Elmo's Fire was a John Hughes movie because it's like the same people from all the other movies.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. Okay.

[Penn Holderness]

Like, it was literally the same cast. I thought Weekend at Bernie's was a John Hughes movie.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay. So, you know what? I'm. This is also. I think our kids have seen certain John Hughes movies, but I feel like this summer we may have to, just, as part of their cultural education, start over, do a John Hughes movie marathon.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. And when PC's like, I already saw it. He was on his phone when he was 12 watching it. It's gonna have a different. It's gonna hit different now.

[Kim Holderness]

Although I don't think he had a phone at 12 but yes, I think like it's a phone free. It is a Gen X movie watching experience which means you are raw dogging it. You were just looking straight at the screen with no technical device in your

[Penn Holderness]

hands and the number 10 activity for a nursing home of our generation.

[Kim Holderness]

More on this after these words. This episode is sponsored by Better Help.

[Penn Holderness]

You know, for some, summer is their favorite season. Travel picks up, kids are out of school and adventure is the focus for

[Kim Holderness]

others, just juggling it all can be tough and can lead to overwhelming counting down the minutes until the kids are

[Penn Holderness]

back in school and many of us worrying that we're wasting the days of sunshine.

[Kim Holderness]

I know I feel the pull between going exploring or staying inside and relaxing. Some people thrive while others are just trying to survive.

[Penn Holderness]

Therapy can help people better understand their needs, feel more confident setting boundaries, and create a version of summer that actually feels good.

[Kim Holderness]

With over over 30,000 therapists, BetterHelp is the world's largest online therapy platform, having served over 6 million people globally.

[Penn Holderness]

And it works. We know that because there's an average rating of 4.9 out of 5 for a live session, and that's based on over 1.7 million client reviews.

[Kim Holderness]

Plus BetterHelp does the initial matching work for you so you can focus on your therapy goals.

[Penn Holderness]

You don't have to say yes to everything this summer. Find support in in therapy, sign up

[Kim Holderness]

and get 10 [e-mail] Holderness that is

[Penn Holderness]

betterhelp.com Holderness Summer always makes me rethink

[Kim Holderness]

what I'm reaching for every day. Lighter fabrics, better materials, pieces that just feel good the moment you put them on and look effortless. That's why I keep coming back to Quints. The fabrics feel elevated, the fits are thoughtful, and the pricing actually makes sense. They focus on high quality quality essentials. Think breathable linen, soft organic cotton, washable silk, but without the luxury markup, Quinn says.

[Penn Holderness]

Beautiful everyday pieces like 100% European linen pants, dresses and tops with style starting at 32 bucks.

[Kim Holderness]

Their denim is soft and easy to wear and their organic cotton sweaters are perfect for layering on cool summer nights.

[Penn Holderness]

Plus, everything at Quint's is priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands.

[Kim Holderness]

Quince works directly with ethical factories and cuts out the middlemen. So you're paying for quality, not brand markup.

[Penn Holderness]

And it's not just clothing. Quince has really become a destination for elevated essentials across home, kitchen, bedding and beyond, making it easy to bring a more premium feel into everyday life.

[Kim Holderness]

You have to check out their 100% organic cotton poplin a line maxi skirt. It comes in four cute colors, perfect for these summer days when the weather is all over the place. Quince denim has been a standout for me. It has that structured, supportive feel, but it's still really soft and comfortable. And when I saw the price, I genuinely double checked.

[Penn Holderness]

Elevate your summer wardrobe. Go to quints.comholderness for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too.

[Kim Holderness]

That's Q-U-N-C-E.com Holderness for free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com/holderness.

[Penn Holderness]

Be the 10th caller radio call in contest.

[Kim Holderness]

So, so tell me how this works.

[Penn Holderness]

All right, it's super easy. You have, there's, there's, there's a radio. It's got a radio in there that you have to have a radio in your room that's going to be like an alarm clock radio or whatever. And then they'll get like a shortwave, maybe one of those microphones that you remember those microphones in the 80s that would like jack into your radio. No, are you serious? There were commercials of like people in there. It would be your car radio and a microphone. It'd be like a guy walking by going, hey, good looking, we'll be back for some hamburgers later like at the drive through. And you could. It basically. Are you.

[Kim Holderness]

No memory.

[Penn Holderness]

We're gonna stop right now and we're gonna show the ad on YouTube of the weird antenna car. The weird antenna microphone that you have in your car.

[Kim Holderness]

Hey, this Christmas party is getting a little too quiet. I think it's time we liven it

[Penn Holderness]

up with my favorite Christmas gift, Mr. Microphone. Hey, what'? Well, you set the dial on your FM radio and testing, testing. These kids are having a fabulous time with Mr. Microphone, the cordless microphone that actually puts your voice on the radio. There are no attaching wires, so you're free to move around broadcast over any FM car radio. Hey, good looking, we'll be back to pick you up later. Hey, good looking, we'll be back to pick you up later.

[Kim Holderness]

Was a little problematic.

[Penn Holderness]

It rained in my head though, for some reason.

[Kim Holderness]

So this is evidence where I am a little, only slightly younger than you, but it seems as if there a lot happened in those few years. I have no memory of this at all. All right, so, so okay, back up.

[Penn Holderness]

We get everyone a radio in their room. We get a Mr. Microphone and just at some Point during, like it's gotta be the person running the switchboard.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah, right.

[Penn Holderness]

Cause they've. There's always.

[Kim Holderness]

And out of nowhere.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, like, like, hey there, campers. The 10th caller wins.

[Kim Holderness]

Free pudding.

[Penn Holderness]

It's free pudding. And then so they have to answer all the calls. And so you're sitting there, which is what you had to do. Just dial, dial, dial, dial, dial over and over again while they play the next song. And the 10th caller wins.

[Kim Holderness]

What an activity. I also. Can we go back to this commercial? The production value and the scripting was so bizarre to in conjunction with today's standards.

[Penn Holderness]

There were a lot of things wrong with that.

[Kim Holderness]

Right. I mean, it was a little problematic on a few different kind of platforms, but it is. I wonder in 50 years what they're going to look at this podcast and be like, oh my gosh, I can't believe they were so antiquated and so old fashioned that they were wearing clothes. I don't know. What is it going to be? That is so cringy.

[Penn Holderness]

We do this exercise all the time. Like, I am apologizing for anyone who found this video 50 years from now for how incredibly insensitive I was, for whatever it is that I was insensitive about because it's going to be something because no one ever knows.

[Kim Holderness]

And well, I mean, we, I'm sure there's something we're doing that's problematic and we don't know and we're here for it. And I'm sorry. But yeah, like, what is it anyway? I don't know. Fun exercise.

[Penn Holderness]

Now I'm okay, now I'm nervous.

[Kim Holderness]

So now that we've done our activities, so you can see how yesterday we went through all the motions, you know, kind of very sad about your mom. And it's still like, it's this prolonged, awful goodbye. And then we, we were dying, laughing, thinking about Dale, listening to Pantera in his room. And then we were thinking about the activities. So when I have those sort of roller coasters of emotion, to me it's sort of exhausting to kind of feel all those feelings because, you know, I don't like feeling feelings. So I was numbing out. We're driving back and you're talking to your brother on the phone and I just get on Instagram and I check the D, my DMs. I don't think you know about this, Pen.

[Penn Holderness]

I watch your stories.

[Kim Holderness]

You do?

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, I know about this.

[Kim Holderness]

You do. Okay. So I get this message and I do like to check DMs. I do like to message with you and somebody with the profile picture that says radicalized by basic decency. This person said, can we please find some help for Kim's brows, please? Like, this person is very. Was very insistent that I get help from my eyebrows.

[Penn Holderness]

What? I'm okay now. Now I'm looking at your eyebrows. What? Is there something wrong with your eyebrows? They look perfect. They look like they've been, like perfectly sized and shaped, and they look like they've been done by a professional. What's.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay?

[Penn Holderness]

What's going on?

[Kim Holderness]

I have a lot of feelings about this, so I shared. I shared the message more like, what are we doing? Because there's this we do not care club that started with, her name is Sanders, Melanie Sanders. She's great. And I thought as women of this age, like, we were just not gonna care about those things anymore. But I do admit I do care about how I look, and I hate it. I really, I think it puts a lot of pressure on you to say, like, you should not care about this, because not caring is its own kind of pressure. You're supposed to age gracefully and not care, but look effortless and be confident and take care of yourself and not try too hard. And so there are all these things that women are just cycling in their brains. And I am so jealous of the women who can drop kick beauty standards, truly, if the women that can go out and just be in their own skin and truly don't care, I aspire to that. But I do care how I look.

[Penn Holderness]

Right. And it's shown in what you just said, like, your reaction. As much as you want to not care there, you can't make yourself not care.

[Kim Holderness]

Right?

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

So here's another issue. I didn't even know to be insecure about my eyebrows.

[Penn Holderness]

You never thought about it? Oh, man. Okay.

[Kim Holderness]

And so one person, I'm telling you, the crap that people say and the, the voices women have. Maybe it's just me. Maybe it is just me.

[Penn Holderness]

Hang on to a pause. Because you, you got this comment from this person, but then you put it on your story, right? And so there must have been a lot more comments after that. And I imagine they're more supportive. But, like, what were people saying after that? Because I know you dive into those.

[Kim Holderness]

So I think there's a huge difference in I'm sharing this beauty tip with you.

[Penn Holderness]

Right.

[Kim Holderness]

Versus I'm looking at you and feeling that something needs to change. Right. Like I am, I'm looking at you and seeing that you are not meeting this standard. And so, like, There is. That is.

[Penn Holderness]

So what's the difference? Because the whole. I mean, the whole point of I'm sharing a beauty tip is like, you're looking for a beauty tip or listening to it because you want to change whatever it is.

[Kim Holderness]

That is a very fair question. I will say there is a difference, because when I posted that, most of people are saying, are you kidding me? In this world, you're worried about somebody's eyebrows? Truly, that's where I go if I see someone online and I. I'm kind of distracted by a look or an outfit or whatever. I don't have it within me to, like, make a judgment and say it publicly. So much of it was, you're great, you're fine. Ignore it. But there were some people saying, please share any tips you get. Like, please share. Like, because I'm insecure about my eyebrows. And there. There were some people who were saying. And I have to read you one. It was from a local makeup artist. And this is. She said it perfectly. You look amazing. Never even crossed my mind that that was an issue. If for some reason you were interested in the here are options, but only if you're interested. And that for. For me, was like. Because I had brought it up, and it was a softer way of saying, hey, this is what I do for women. And that was much softer.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay, we've been talking about this for five minutes. I still don't understand what's wrong with your eyebrows. Do you want them to be, like, thinner, or do you want them to be thicker? Or do you want them to be blonder? Or, like, what is. I. I'm. I've been. This whole time, I've been just staring at your eyebrows.

[Kim Holderness]

I love this for you.

[Penn Holderness]

And because I don't spend, like, you have such beautiful eyes and cheeks and lips and teeth, I don't really just spend a lot of time looking at your eyebrows, but now that I look at them, they're like, what. What the hell? What's like.

[Kim Holderness]

I think there is now there's. You know, how. There's. The beauty standards change.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

And so now what is more desirable to who? I don't know.

[Penn Holderness]

Fashion.

[Kim Holderness]

I don't know. The mode is really, like, thick eyebrows.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay, so that's it. So that people want thicker eyebrows.

[Kim Holderness]

And.

[Penn Holderness]

And when did that happen? Because then several years ago.

[Kim Holderness]

Several years ago. So in the 90s, like, Friends era. It was thin. Yeah, it'll go back to thin. But this is just. Honestly, that's your.

[Penn Holderness]

That's what the good Lord gave you.

[Kim Holderness]

This is what they've always sort of looked like.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

But I will say there are women that reached out and they're like, share your tips. And I did get some that I'm going to share. Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

Before you do that, I just. I want to let you know something. This eyebrow thing, it's interesting because I don't think any of it has to do. And maybe you don't care. It. It doesn't have to do with, like, whether men find this attractive or not because we don't care. I'm just letting you know, like, we're not noticing.

[Kim Holderness]

Right.

[Penn Holderness]

So this is specifically, like, how you feel about yourself and your image. Because I think I speak for most men, that we don't pay much attention to women's eyebrows. Or if we do, it's like, super subliminal.

[Kim Holderness]

And as a woman first, I appreciate that. As a woman, I have never dressed for a man, put on makeup for a man. I love you. You're great. But I dress for the girls. The girls, gays. And they's like, I want to look good for my girls, and I want to, like, I want to look good for myself. So I love that you don't know that, and I love that you don't notice eyebrows. And I believe you because, no offense,

[Penn Holderness]

it's the most time I've ever spent looking at your eyebrows.

[Kim Holderness]

But no offense, but you look at men's eyebrows.

[Penn Holderness]

Oh, my God.

[Kim Holderness]

Caterpillars crawling across your face.

[Penn Holderness]

No, I look like one of the senators from Gladiator if I don't, like, immediately take a weed whacker to this every single week. And I used to not. And so you. I can tell when you're like. I'm like, oh, she's looking at me longingly. And I'm like, no, she wants to. I went to pick something off of my face.

[Kim Holderness]

Face.

[Penn Holderness]

I don't know what it's going to be.

[Kim Holderness]

No. Okay. So if you are interested and if it's a. Something that you feel healthy about and you want to learn, I got several tips about what other women. And they phrased it in a way that was like, here's what I do. You look great. Here's what I do.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay. I'm just. Just making sure really quickly. We just had a very empowering moment where you said, like, what? Why are we giving beauty tips to all of these people? And now you're about to give.

[Kim Holderness]

This is for those that are interested.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay. Got it.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. And. But I'm telling you, honey, the battle and the. My brain over, like, this strong urge to give a middle finger to somebody who makes a comment like this.

[Penn Holderness]

Right.

[Kim Holderness]

And then now all of a sudden, I'm like, wait, my eyebrows?

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

You know, like, oh, wait, no, they are. There's a beauty standard I didn't even know about.

[Penn Holderness]

All right, so let's qualify this. We think y' all are beautiful no matter what, but if this helps y' all out with yalls thing, y', all,

[Kim Holderness]

that's a lot of y'. All.

[Penn Holderness]

Well, it feels like a good time to use the y' all word, because I'm. I don't know whether I'm talking to y' all is, I think, a very inclusive.

[Kim Holderness]

That's right. No, you're right. Y' all is a very inclusive term.

[Penn Holderness]

Whatever y' all want.

[Kim Holderness]

Whatever y' all want.

[Penn Holderness]

Here we go.

[Kim Holderness]

So there apparently is a brow boosting serum they sell at Costco that several women. Sam, can you confirm this to be true?

[Sam]

Costco Rapid Brow Eyebrow Enhancing Serum.

[Kim Holderness]

So several women. I feel like I should. Before this episode hits, I should order some, because.

[Sam]

Two pack, of course.

[Kim Holderness]

How much is it?

[Sam]

49.99.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay, 49.99.

[Penn Holderness]

For two.

[Kim Holderness]

For two. In. In, like, the women's, like, beauty space, that's actually a fair price. A few women said they put just plain old castor oil on, and it's sort of like, in their opinion, it makes them look lush. So I think if you have more to work with, maybe the castor oil.

[Penn Holderness]

I don't know what castor oil is, but I feel like I hear about it every 10 years as a solution to something.

[Kim Holderness]

And then the local makeup artist, she did give some options. Apparently, if you're getting your hair done and highlighted, which I do, because I do care about how I look because I'm a basic bee, you can get your. I. Some. Some hairdressers will, like, tint your eyebrows as well, because there are. Or you can go to a makeup artist type of person who does this because all of those little tiny hairs that are not visible, if you do.

[Penn Holderness]

If you like the baby hairs.

[Kim Holderness]

If the baby hairs. If you dye them, it picks up more and they look more lush.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay.

[Kim Holderness]

I don't know if I'm willing to do that. I. I feel like I did that probably 15 years ago once, and I was so shocked by just. It just was too drastic for me.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. So is it possible that by the time all of this works out for you ladies, it's going to go back to having thin eyebrows again?

[Kim Holderness]

1,000%.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

And that's the maddening thing about beauty standards.

[Penn Holderness]

Who decides this?

[Kim Holderness]

Instagram? The Kardashians? Alex Earl, who are all maze, amazing and beautiful. Do your thing. Get that bag. But it is. It is impossible. And I hate that I care. I wish I didn't, truly.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. No. Like, I'm just.

[Kim Holderness]

How much time do you spend in a day worried about what you look like?

[Penn Holderness]

When I'm in front of the mirror in the morning, it's sometimes a. Sometimes not a great moment for me.

[Kim Holderness]

I hate that that happens. But I'm also. Aw, me too.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. And I'm just like, dude, it's not getting any better. Is it? Like, you're just, like. No matter what you're trying, it's. You're just. These things are. That's here and that's here, and it's just gonna happen. And then I usually move along. Keep her moving. By the time I go to sleep, I'm like, okay, you look fine. You gotta work out in. That's. That's it. And I'm. I. I do. So now, if you and I are doing anything that, like, might end in intimacy, I always check on the eyebrows

[Kim Holderness]

and the nose hairs.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. Because I've, like, there's been a time where I thought you were, like, leaning in to kiss me, and you're really trying to pluck my nose hairs in my eyebrows. So, like, that's Love you. Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

That's marriage.

[Penn Holderness]

But it also. I think you should know that I don't really care what I look like to other men, but I do care what I look like to you. Or probably just women in general. Like, if I went to, like, we almost always do, anytime we do, like, a public event, it's like 90% women. And so I want to dress nicely for that. But if it was, like, just for dudes, I would show up in my sweatpants.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

So I wonder what that's all about.

[Kim Holderness]

I am trying now that I've hit 50, to realize that it's not getting better and that when I look at my picture in 10 years, when I'm 60, I'm going to wish I appreciated what was in the mirror now. And I've actively been trying to appreciate what I'm seeing. And it was interesting when Lola ran across some pictures from my niece's. Bianca's wedding, like, probably six years ago. Five or six years ago. And she said, mom, did you get lip fillers? Which I have not. And I was like, so my face is changing very slightly. I mean, that happens at your age. Your lips get Slightly thinner. But I remember that day. I did not feel good about myself. I remember it was a hot day, and I was putting on a dress that was too tight because I'd gained some weight since I had bought it, and I just. I was not feeling good about myself. And now I look at the picture. Yeah, it's your screensaver.

[Penn Holderness]

My screensaver is this day. By the way, you look great in this picture.

[Kim Holderness]

But I remember thinking, oh, I look so gross. I hate how I feel. But now I know that in 10 years, I'm going to look at myself pictures of now and think, wow, you were wasting time. I'm so. I am getting better about that. I am getting better about that.

[Sam]

Can I say my psa?

[Penn Holderness]

Yes.

[Kim Holderness]

Sam, we've talked a lot about this,

[Sam]

like, beauty standard, and. And whatever. I think my message I'm getting out of this is, like, why are we putting women down? Like, why. Why did she feel the need to, like, comment that, like, you guys are real people? I'm the number one person who can say this. I lit. I.

[Kim Holderness]

Like, you live in our house, I'm at your house.

[Sam]

Like, I would never go on anyone's comment and say anything about their body. And we're just perpetuating these, like, problems.

[Kim Holderness]

Yes.

[Sam]

And. And stop talking bad about people.

[Kim Holderness]

And that. That is truly what it is, Sam. It's. Why do you feel so safe coming into my space on the Internet? And perhaps this person thought they were being funny and helpful.

[Sam]

Right.

[Kim Holderness]

Because trust, there are moments I'm like, okay, ladies, where are we buying our bras these days? Like, I have gone out and asked for help and opinions, and maybe this person, I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt. They thought they're being helpful. But why, in the year of our Lord Dolly Parton 2026, are we feelings? Like, the feeling safe a To. To just mention a woman's body and, like, who has time?

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

There's so many other things to worry about, so there's a lot of layers to this.

[Penn Holderness]

I want to tease ahead to something that we're going to talk about at a later podcast.

[Kim Holderness]

More on this after these words.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay, we've got an ad. And I know, I know that's usually your cue to fast forward, go refill your water, whatever. But hang on, because this one's actually for you. Maybe. Let's find out.

[Kim Holderness]

This is an ad from Mini Health, and it's about menopause and perimenopause. So real quick, midlife roll call.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. If you've touched a thermostat in the last 45 minutes, it's stay with me.

[Kim Holderness]

If you've put something in the freezer and had absolutely no memory of doing it, stay, listen.

[Penn Holderness]

Well, that one actually applies to me as well. Anyway, keep going.

[Kim Holderness]

If you've woken up at 3am drenched, changed your pajamas, gone back to sleep, woken up drenched again, and just decided to sleep on a towel like some kind of sad little personal beach, you need to stay with me.

[Penn Holderness]

Raise your hand.

[Kim Holderness]

Kim all of the things.

[Penn Holderness]

Yep.

[Kim Holderness]

Here's the thing. Midi Health is a virtual clinic built by women for women and they are done with doctors telling us that this is all in our heads or that we just have to push through it.

[Penn Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

It's the midlife care we actually deserve.

[Penn Holderness]

Book your virtual visit today@join MIDI.com that's join M I D I.com

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[Leon Nayfak]

Leon Nayfak, best known as the co creator of Slow Burn and Fiasco. I had of course heard of OnlyFans, but always with a distant and quiet skepticism. A silent judgment, you might say. Who is actually using this platform?

[Kim Holderness]

Um, I am.

[Gracie Kanan]

Hi, I'm Onlyfans creator and comedian Gracie Kanan. I work from home now. I'm on OnlyFans. And in case you guys don't know what OnlyFans is, ask your husband.

[Leon Nayfak]

My journalistic curiosity got the best of me when I found out that my own sister had started an OnlyFans account.

[Gracie Kanan]

I'm not his sister.

[Leon Nayfak]

Just to clarify, it turns out a lot of what I thought I knew about OnlyFans was wrong.

[Penn Holderness]

I felt like I wasted 3.5 years for something that wasn't real.

[Gracie Kanan]

What happens when connection comes with a price tag? Listen to OnlyFantasy wherever you get your podcasts or binge all episodes of Only Fantasy Ad free right now only on Audible. Start your Audible subscription in the Audible app or on Apple Podcasts.

[Penn Holderness]

First of all, Kim did not mean to say that Dolly Parton is 20, 26 years old.

[Kim Holderness]

Oh, my God.

[Penn Holderness]

You did say the year of our Lord. Dolly Parton.

[Sam]

The year of our Lord, Dolly Parton.

[Kim Holderness]

Our Lord is Dolly Parton, and the year is 2026.

[Penn Holderness]

I have so much more I want to say about this because, Sam, you made me think of something that Kim and I talked about for hours last week, which is the fact that, that for the most part, women are supporting women in a way that men are not. You guys have built a support community.

[Kim Holderness]

You mean men are not supporting men?

[Penn Holderness]

Yes.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. Yes. Women are supporting women in a way that men are not supporting other men. So for the most part, you guys are crushing it. This seems like an isolated incident here, and I just want you to remember that in the grand scope of things, your gender has gotten it right. It's the reason why, like, I think that women are probably feeling less lonely than men in the world on average right now. And I'm talking about adult men, I'm talking about young boys, and I want to talk about that a ton more when we move on in this podcast. But Kylie Kelce, she won an award for her podcast, and I saw her. Did you see her acceptance speech?

[Kim Holderness]

I did.

[Penn Holderness]

It was three words. Women supporting women, women supporting women, and that. And. And y', all, for the most part, are doing it.

[Kim Holderness]

Well, I agree.

[Penn Holderness]

So I, I want to. A big picture, 30,000ft. Say that. And that men could learn a lot from you on that. It seems like what you're dealing with today is just a little cattiness.

[Kim Holderness]

I, I want to put a call to action out to our audience on this because Penn and I have spent hours talking about this, that women have done the work. And it's evidence in the online communities. It's evidence in. In real life communities.

[Penn Holderness]

It's evidence in our community, looking at who's engaging in commentary.

[Kim Holderness]

And I think we, they. We have done the work to make ourselves better. There are more women or more girls being accepted into college than boys. There are, There are women who are supporting each other and girls in a way that is so special that I've benefited from, that our daughter has benefited from. I, I do not see men in those communities, and in fact, the opposite, and I think it's deeply harmful. So my, My call to action is, do you know in this community. I would love to hear from you. Are there ways that men are connecting in a way that they feel safe and vulnerable? There's Bible study and there's CrossFit is all I've been able to come up with.

[Penn Holderness]

There's bars, but you're facing in the same direction and you're talking about sports and you're not getting the opportunity to be vulnerable and talk about your feelings in life. So I have a buddy of mine sent me a text two weeks ago asking could we try to find a community. This is clearly becoming an academic epidemic. He had just lost a friend to suicide because he was so lonely. And first of all, it was like, I'm like, I knew I like this guy. Yeah, like this. But now I really like this guy. And I like. I think I want to help. Yeah, I want. And I think you start small and you start with one on one conversations. And maybe for men, we'll need a little bit of a script when it comes to that.

[Kim Holderness]

And it's interesting. I wonder if they are. They were. I wonder if there would be pushback from women because. Cry me a river. You're still in every leadership position and, and in C suites, you're still running the government. You're still. So men are still running things.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

So. But I want to be as a mother of, of a son and the wife of a husband who really are trying. I want to acknowledge that I don't see spaces where you are able to be.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

Vulnerable and safe and share.

[Penn Holderness]

I think it's apples and oranges. Yes, Apples. Which is a whole other conversation is why aren't there more executive women? Why hasn't there been a female president? There's like, those are all very valid questions. The orange over here is why are. Why are men having a tough time being vulnerable with each other? And why is there a loneliness epidemic that's specific to males right now in our country?

[Kim Holderness]

I would love if this is where our community is amazing. If you guys call in. Leave us your thoughts email. Send us an email. Even if there's a subject matter sort of expert on this. There's a guy named Scott Galloway who, he's talked on this. He talks about a lot of different

[Penn Holderness]

things we got to get him on.

[Kim Holderness]

He talks about business and politics and all this stuff. But I know he has talked about this. This. If there's anybody else having these conversations, we would just personally in our home, love to learn more. So if you have thoughts on that, I would love to dedicate a podcast or two. Or three on this. But again, I also want to acknowledge it does get prickly as a woman because we have done so much work, and yet we are still not able to make decisions about our bodies. And there are things that. So it's a tricky conference. It's a tricky conversation, but I would love to support you. And quite honestly, I think men would need some guidance from women on this. Okay. We covered a lot today. We have danced, we have laughed. We have talked about my eyebrows. I think we cannot legally. Legally, I don't think that we can end this clinically.

[Penn Holderness]

We need to end on the laugh line.

[Kim Holderness]

We need to go to the laugh line. Hi, Kim and Penn. This is Abigail from North Carolina calling and just wanted to say that with my full May Simper brain, I glanced at the title of your most recent podcast and saw the word medium. It then took me 25 minutes into the podcast before I realized you were not interviewing a psychic for the day.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay, that might be enough.

[Kim Holderness]

We're gonna get to the psychic stuff.

[Penn Holderness]

Did we not make it clear enough? It's possible.

[Kim Holderness]

It's possible. But also, you know me, I would love to interview a psychic.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. You and I are in a different camp when it comes to that one.

[Kim Holderness]

I love that.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. Good for you. You know what you could do? You could have one on the show, and I could just, like, give up my seat, and you could sit right here with you.

[Kim Holderness]

Sam will sit me with me.

[Sam]

Oh, I would sit with you.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. You guys do that.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. It is so interesting. The people that accept that.

[Penn Holderness]

Accept.

[Kim Holderness]

Well, that. Believe.

[Penn Holderness]

Oh, yeah. Believe. Believe. Believes.

[Kim Holderness]

Better believe. Are. Are. Are me, first of all.

[Penn Holderness]

They're you.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. And the people who don't. Just don't. How can you not?

[Penn Holderness]

Because I've been got before.

[Sam]

That's fair.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay.

[Penn Holderness]

I've, like, I've. I've realized that, like, somebody read me, and I quickly found out that they did, like. And I. I'll tell you how I know. They did, like, a deep web search, acted like they didn't know me. And when they were talking, they used terms that clearly they had gotten from the Internet and not from the person.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay. I've had. I did. I interviewed a medium and my work at Inside Edition, and that was pre. Like, information about you on the Internet. Like, there was a bio of me, I think, on the Inside Edition website. But no, there wasn't really anything else. And she. And my great grandmother had passed away, and there were. There were some family things she brought up, and she said my great grandmother's name. Name. And that wasn't like, I wasn't publishing. I think in the obituary, it was like. And she leaves behind, like, 97, 000 great grandkids. Like, I wasn't named, so I don't know. And this stuff she was talking about, it felt right to me, but. Yeah, you do. You boo.

[Penn Holderness]

Anyway, like I said, I am all for you having a medium on, and. And I. My energy would not be good for that, so you should have them on, and I could just be. Be supporting you.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay. I feel like the window has been open.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Sam]

What a weird podcast.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay, how are we titling this podcast?

[Penn Holderness]

Amerie's gonna have, like, it's gonna be

[Kim Holderness]

like, mediums and Gen X nursing homes.

[Penn Holderness]

Water Gen X nursing homes.

[Sam]

And Kim's eyebrows.

[Penn Holderness]

And Kim's eyebrows and Pen's eyebrows. And love.

[Sam]

Love John Hughes movie.

[Penn Holderness]

John Hughes movies. Poirier. Anne Marie.

[Kim Holderness]

Like, she's usually the one who comes up with sexual nightmare. It is Anne Marie's, like, it's one of her many 10,000 duties to suggest titles for the podcast because Pen and I suck at titling things.

[Penn Holderness]

No, I like just making it, like, one word. That has nothing to do with the podcast. So I would have called it Anne Marie's 10,000 duties. Like, that's what I would call the podcast duty.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay, we are leaning heavy onto the Laugh Lines audience. I need information about men's groups and how we're men are supporting each other. I would love that input. If you got a medium, I'd love to hear about that. And then number three, what should we have titled this podcast? You're gonna see it. It's gonna be listed. But tell me what would have been

[Penn Holderness]

a better title, and that'll be really useful to us yesterday.

[Kim Holderness]

We could change it, though.

[Penn Holderness]

I guess we could.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. Anyway, Laugh Lines is written and produced by Anne Marie Tapke Penn Holderness and Kim Holderness with live music from Pen Holderness. It is original music. Okay. Sorry, I'm. I'm. I'm trying to test my brain.

[Penn Holderness]

No, that was good. Yeah, you're doing great.

[Kim Holderness]

You go ahead.

[Penn Holderness]

No, I want you to see how you're doing.

[Kim Holderness]

It is recorded and live, edited and live, produced by Sam.

[Penn Holderness]

None of it's live, but. Okay,

[Kim Holderness]

so we're not live.

[Penn Holderness]

No.

[Kim Holderness]

By Sam Allen.

[Penn Holderness]

Said live 20 times live.

[Kim Holderness]

We're doing it live, and it's hosted by Acast. And we'd love to hear from you on the Laugh Line. So email us at podcastholdernessfamily.com or call us at 323-364-3929. We'll talk to you soon on the Laughline.

[Penn Holderness]

That's pretty good. That was great. Cut.

[Kim Holderness]

Love you. Bye.

[Leon Nayfak]

I'm Leon Naifak, best known as the co creator of Slow Burn and Fiasco. I had of course heard of OnlyFans, but always with a distant and quiet skepticism. A silent judgment, you might say. Who is actually using this platform?

[Kim Holderness]

Um, I am.

[Gracie Kanan]

Hi, I'm Onlyfans creator and comedian Gracie Kanan. I work from home now. I'm on OnlyFans. And in case you guys don't know what OnlyFans is, ask your husband.

[Leon Nayfak]

My journalistic curiosity got the best of me when I found out that my my own sister had started an OnlyFans account.

[Gracie Kanan]

I'm not his sister.

[Leon Nayfak]

Just to clarify, it turns out a lot of what I thought I knew about OnlyFans was wrong.

[Penn Holderness]

I felt like I wasted 3.5 years for something that wasn't real.

[Gracie Kanan]

What happens when connection comes with a price tag? Listen to OnlyFantasy wherever you get your podcasts or binge all episodes of OnlyFantasy AD free right now only on Audible. Start your Audible subscription in the Audible app or or on Apple Podcasts.

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[Gracie Kanan]

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[Kim Holderness]

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[Gracie Kanan]

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