The Hill I'll Die On

Summary

Episode Summary: "The Hill I'll Die On" | Laugh Lines with Kim & Penn Holderness

Release Date: June 17, 2025

In this episode of Laugh Lines with Kim & Penn Holderness, hosts Kim and Penn delve into the intriguing and often humorous concept of personal "hills you'll die on." Centered around the idea of passionately holding firm on certain opinions or pet peeves, the episode features lively discussions, insightful listener call-ins, and plenty of laughs. Below is a detailed breakdown of the episode's key segments, enriched with notable quotes and timestamps.

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1. Introduction to "The Hill I'll Die On" Theme (03:05 - 05:20)

Kim and Penn introduce the episode's central theme—exploring the personal "hills" each host is willing to staunchly defend. They set the stage for an engaging conversation filled with anecdotes and listener interactions.

Kim: "I think that also Sunny knows when I'm in emotional need."

Penn: "This is Laugh Lines. And if you're joining us on our new video cast on YouTube, you can see the back of Sunny's head..."

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2. Listener Call-In: Courtney on Voice-to-Text Habits (05:42 - 08:05)

Courtney from Nebraska shares her frustration with the overuse of voice-to-text features spilling into other areas like voicemail, sparking a relatable discussion about modern communication habits.

Courtney: "I was leaving a voicemail for a doctor's office, and I was saying my sentence... and then I said, period, and continued talking because that's what I do when I send long text messages."

Kim: "I think it's so disrespectful."

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3. Defining "Hill I'll Die On" (07:02 - 08:10)

The hosts clarify the meaning behind the phrase "hill I'll die on," tracing its origin to the controversial Hamburger Hill battle during the Vietnam War. They emphasize that a personal hill represents a belief one is unwilling to compromise on.

Penn: "When we say it, it means that one thing you'll never change your mind about and about which you are the most passionate."

Kim: "I am willing to get canceled. These are my opinions, and you'll never change my mind."

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4. Kim’s Hill: Backing into Parking Spots (08:39 - 13:31)

Kim passionately discusses her aversion to drivers who back into parking spots in crowded areas, labeling this behavior as selfish and disruptive.

Kim: "People who back into parking spots are selfish. They cannot use it anymore. And the cleanup is like a crime scene."

Penn: "This is my hill. I'm allowed to have this opinion."

Kim shares a personal story about a frustrating experience at Target, reinforcing her stance.

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5. Listener Call-In: Julie on Safe Parking Practices (17:16 - 18:21)

Julie echoes Kim's sentiments, highlighting the importance of safety over convenience when parking in crowded lots.

Julie: "I back into a parking spot 95% of the time. It is so much easier when you have to get out."

Kim: "What are we running from? Like zombies?"

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6. Listener Call-In: Nikki on Oxford Comma and Punctuation (18:33 - 21:15)

Nikki brings up the debate over the Oxford comma and the use of two spaces after a period, sparking a spirited exchange about grammatical preferences.

Kim: "If you don't have a high schooler who is writing papers right now or college essays, you may not know this. People have dropped the Oxford comma."

Nikki: "I do the one space. That's what we were taught when I was growing up."

Anne Marie, the producer, chimes in to defend the use of the Oxford comma, igniting further discussion.

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7. Listener Call-In: Jennie on Shopping Carts (24:45 - 26:00)

Jennie expresses her frustration with individuals who neglect to return shopping carts, labeling them as inconsiderate.

Jennie: "People who don't return the shopping cart will leave it stranded in the middle of the parking lot..."

Kim: "In my road to 50, I have vowed to do acts of random kindness. I put people's carts away."

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8. Listener Call-In: Shira on Cereal and Soups (26:04 - 27:55)

Shira humorously debates whether cereal qualifies as soup and touches on related food debates, such as the classification of hot dogs.

Shira: "Cereal is soup."

Kim: "I didn't know that there was another way. Our son puts milk in the bowl first..."

The conversation highlights playful disagreements over everyday topics.

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9. Listener Call-In: Kelly on Pickles in Food (27:54 - 29:20)

Kelly passionately argues against putting pickles on various foods, believing they overpower natural flavors.

Kelly: "Pickles should not go on anything. Not even burgers."

Kim: "I love a pickle. I'll ask for extra pickles, but I get that."

The discussion showcases differing culinary preferences among the hosts and listeners.

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10. Listener Call-In: Janine on Audiobooks vs. Reading (31:03 - 34:23)

Janine challenges the notion that listening to audiobooks is equivalent to reading, advocating for the traditional experience of reading.

Janine: "Audiobooks count as reading."

Anne Marie: "That's ableist... audiobooks count. It just counts."

The debate touches on accessibility and personal preferences in consuming literature.

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11. Listener Call-In: Lauren on Rinsing Dishes (39:29 - 40:17)

Lauren contends that rinsing dishes before placing them in the dishwasher is unnecessary and potentially inefficient.

Lauren: "Rinsing dishes before putting them into the dishwasher is wrong."

Anne Marie: "Dishwasher efficiency. Rinsing can actually interfere with the dishwasher sensors..."

The conversation humorously critiques modern dishwashing practices.

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12. Listener Call-In: Joe on Realtors (40:03 - 40:57)

Joe raises his issue with the pronunciation of "realtor," expressing his strong preference for the correct enunciation.

Kim: "It's pronounced realtor, not real. Atter."

Joe: Expresses his frustration leading to a playful exchange between the hosts.

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13. Penn’s Top Five Hills (40:57 - 48:21)

Penn shares his personal top five hills he'd die on, ranging from pronunciations like "nuclear" to broader cultural topics such as the authenticity of the national anthem.

Penn: "It's pronounced nuclear, not nuclear."

Kim: "Great hill you'll die on... Tom Cruise is a national treasure."

Penn's choices highlight his unique perspectives and set the stage for further discussions.

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14. Discussion on the National Anthem vs. "America the Beautiful" (45:03 - 48:21)

The hosts debate the merits and challenges of the current national anthem, proposing "America the Beautiful" as a more accessible alternative.

Penn: "The national anthem is an octave plus seven semitones. It's like an octave plus a fifth, which is the average vocal range of an untrained singer."

Kim: "We are putting a picture of him up... So I would love people from Hawaii to chime in on this."

The segment includes performances of both songs, showcasing their differing emotional impacts and vocal demands.

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15. Conclusion and Final Thoughts (48:37 - 50:44)

Kim and Penn wrap up the episode by reflecting on the various hills discussed, acknowledging the diverse opinions of their listeners, and teasing upcoming content.

Kim: "Thank you so much. I love this community that's been created in the comment section, in the voicemails."

Penn: "This has been so much fun... as always, we love to hear from you!"

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Notable Quotes

• Kim Holderness (03:05): "I have to do some nice things. I do put people's carts away."

• Penn Holderness (07:30): "So when we say in our family, this is the hill I'll die on, it is a. I am willing to get canceled."

• Courtney (05:42): "I was leaving a voicemail... I want to include punctuation."

• Anne Marie Tapke (21:11): "The style guides can't agree on the Oxford comma, but the style guides have changed."

• Penn Holderness (43:15): "It's sky lacrosse... you get 10 points for a goal."

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Key Insights and Conclusions

• Personal Boundaries: The episode emphasizes the importance of identifying and standing firm on personal beliefs and annoyances, fostering a sense of community through shared grievances.

• Generational Differences: Topics like the Oxford comma and communication habits highlight the evolving nature of language and etiquette across generations.

• Humor in Everyday Life: By addressing mundane issues with humor, Kim and Penn encourage listeners to find laughter in the everyday challenges of aging and parenthood.

• Listener Engagement: The numerous call-ins demonstrate the active and engaged listener base, showcasing diverse opinions and experiences that enrich the conversation.

• Balancing Views: Despite holding strong opinions, both hosts display openness to differing perspectives, promoting respectful discourse.

Conclusion: "The Hill I'll Die On" is a testament to the show's mission of aging gracefully and humorously. Through relatable topics and lively exchanges, Kim and Penn create an entertaining and thought-provoking episode that resonates with listeners navigating similar life stages.

Transcript

[Kim Holderness]

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[Penn Holderness]

And Little Bellies wants to remind you to embrace your own instincts. You know your child best. Trust that inner voice and do what comes naturally for you and your little one.

[Kim Holderness]

Little Bellies offers age appropriate organic snacks made with wholesome and natural ingredients avoiding artificial colors, flavors and additives.

[Penn Holderness]

Little Bellies supports exploration and discovery by encouraging self feeding and helping babies and toddlers expl new tastes and textures.

[Kim Holderness]

Convenient for busy parents, Little Bellies is a helpful and wholesome option for on the go snacking.

[Penn Holderness]

Little Belly's products are designed to complement your natural instincts to provide good food and support your child's development.

[Kim Holderness]

Plus, they've got a variety of products from Puffs to Pick Me Sticks to cater to different stages and preferences.

[Penn Holderness]

As you navigate that beautiful journey of parenthood, remember to trust your instincts and to do what feels natural for you and your baby.

[Kim Holderness]

And for wholesome, age appropriate snacks that you can feel good about, look for Little Bellies. You can find them at major retailers near you or [e-mail] Little Bellies do what's Natural America.

[Penn Holderness]

Tom Cruise shed his grace on thee. You called me selfish. So that happened. I just wanted to I underlined that.

[Kim Holderness]

Selfish there Let my spaces live people.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, we get older every day. Got more wrinkles.

[Kim Holderness]

That's okay.

[Penn Holderness]

Ye laughing. When we age, life is like a comedy stage. And that's why we got laugh lines.

[Kim Holderness]

Hey everybody, I'm Kim Holderness.

[Penn Holderness]

And I'm Penn Holderness. This is Laugh Lines. And if you're joining us on our new video cast on YouTube, you can see the back of Sunny's head, because she is cruising for some affection right now.

[Kim Holderness]

I think that also Sunny knows when I'm in emotional need.

[Penn Holderness]

And you're having a morning.

[Kim Holderness]

I'm having a morning. I was so excited that this podcast is on the calendar because I just need a little laugh.

[Penn Holderness]

Yes.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah, just, you know, just normal. Like when your kids are having a bad day, you have a bad day.

[Penn Holderness]

Type of thing, and no one empathizes like you. We know that.

[Kim Holderness]

And then. And then, guys, something really big happened. I was getting ready, and my bronzer cracked on the floor.

[Penn Holderness]

So I thought this was about the kids. This is. This is largely about your bronzer. Now tell me, what is the deal? What is it bad when bronzer cracks? Can you not use it anymore?

[Kim Holderness]

You cannot use it anymore. And the cleanup is like a crime scene.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay, it's cleanup issue.

[Kim Holderness]

I will say I was very excited about today because this will be a fun one. Again, welcome to Laugh Lines. If you have ever had to take a picture of a pill bottle to zoom it in to read the dosing instructions, you're home.

[Penn Holderness]

You're home. This is for you. This is for you.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

So quick note, guys. If you're looking for something fun to do as a family this summer, you can grab our game Family Face off right now. We're letting you know because it's 20% off right now, which doesn't normally happen. That's right. In our shop. So the link is in the show Notes. It is a really fun game. Everyone who plays it comments on how they like a. How quickly it moves because you can get done pretty fast. And also how it moves literally. Like, you get out of your chair and you're not just sitting there for the entire game. There's. There's movement, there's spontaneity. All the things that we love. You know, really, in our videos, we put into a. A board game.

[Kim Holderness]

And I need a fun, fast game.

[Penn Holderness]

Yes.

[Kim Holderness]

And I will say that's a hill I'm gonna die on. And that, my friends, that's a segue, is the theme of the week.

[Penn Holderness]

The hills we're going to die on. We're gonna talk about exactly what that means. We're gonna set some ground rules on hills that we can die on. Some things work, some things don't. And then we're gonna go to the laugh line quite a bit. And get your hills that you would.

[Kim Holderness]

Like to die on, and then stay tuned. At the end of the show. You have a top five for us.

[Penn Holderness]

Yes, the top five. Well. Cause I don't know, because it's one hill, right? Everyone's got one hill. I've got, like, five hills, and I need, like, I'm going to name them, and maybe you'll help me pick the actual hill that I'm going to die on. But first, our opening call from the laugh line. Call us up and you tell us what's on your mind.

[Courtney]

Hi, I'm Courtney from Nebraska. I'm wondering if it's just me or if other people use talk to text so much when they're sending text messages that it carries over into other areas. For example, I was leaving a voicemail for a doctor's office, and during the message, I was saying my sentence, whatever, like, I need to reschedule this appointment. And then I said, period, and continued talking because that's what I do when I send long text messages. I want to include punctuation. I'm sure the receptionist got a great laugh out of it.

[Kim Holderness]

Oh, that's amazing. Have you. Because you. You're a big voice to text her.

[Penn Holderness]

I am. When I have to be. No, like, I don't. If I'm driving, I voice to text. I just text a lot. So, yes, on. On the average, I'll probably do that eight or nine times a day.

[Kim Holderness]

I think it's so disrespectful.

[Penn Holderness]

We're moving on.

[Kim Holderness]

When. When people.

[Penn Holderness]

Here we go.

[Kim Holderness]

Are voice to text. They're on speakerphone and they're like, in public. Come on, guys. I don't need to know what you're texting your mom. Yeah, that's just me.

[Penn Holderness]

So that's a good point. Is that the hill you'll die on?

[Kim Holderness]

Ooh, I don't know.

[Penn Holderness]

So that's a good hill, though, because we do have some people saying that, like, speakerphones, no bueno in public. Like, you should lose your phone privileges.

[Kim Holderness]

I think we should explain what we're talking about.

[Penn Holderness]

Yes. You have heard people say this before, I'm sure. Blank, blank, blank. That's the hill I'll die on. When we say it, it means, like, that one thing you'll never change your mind about and about which you are the most passionate.

[Kim Holderness]

Right.

[Penn Holderness]

The history of the term, the origin of the hill I'll die on question is commonly believed to reference. Ha. Hamburger Hill, a fortification with little strategic value that was the subject of much controversy after a gruesome 1969 battle during the Vietnam War.

[Kim Holderness]

So when we say in our family, this is the hill I'll die on, it is a. I am willing to get canceled. I'm willing to. These are my opinions, and you'll never change my mind. Yes, I have very few hills because I'm just not that much of a confrontational person. I'm pretty neutral about most things.

[Penn Holderness]

Well, it's good that you have very few hills, because you really was only supposed to have one hill.

[Kim Holderness]

Hill.

[Penn Holderness]

That's the whole point. It's not the hills I'll die on. It's the hill I'll die. Okay, Another ground rule.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay.

[Penn Holderness]

About hills that you'll die on. It can't be something super obvious. Right. Racism is bad. Can't be the hill you'll die on.

[Kim Holderness]

Right. Racism is bad.

[Penn Holderness]

Everyone is.

[Kim Holderness]

It shouldn't be on that hill. We should be joined down that hill.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, The. The hill that you'll die on should. And I think in your case, will have people disagreeing with you, and you will have to defend it like they did in Hamburger Hill during Vietnam.

[Kim Holderness]

I just also feel like hamburger. It needs a. A more. That's a very profound loss of life for something called Hamburger Hill. I feel like if we could go back and rebrand that. Something like.

[Penn Holderness]

Like Nachos Gulch. That's not good either, but that's what it's kind of like, right?

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay, here's how it all started. Friends ready? I was in a very busy Target parking lot. It was one of those Saturdays where everybody was out running their errands. I find a parking spot. The guy in front of me with his massive Ford 9000, 750 truck passes.

[Penn Holderness]

9750 truck.

[Kim Holderness]

He passes it. I'm like, score. I found a parking spot. No, no, no. He puts on his reverse brakes and backs into the spot, causing, like, all of us. All of us had to then back up to accommodate him backing in, causing a traffic jam. There's pedestrians waiting. People who back into parking spots are selfish. They are selfish. I know you eventually have to back out of the spot, but that's an expected time. We see reverse lights as expected time. I expect to wait for you to pull out of the spot, and I like. I'll just pop right into it. Pen holderness is a selfish person. When he backs into a parking spot. This is my hill. I'm allowed to have this opinion. If you're at the airport, there's nobody around. Take your time back in all you want. I Get it? Bravo. Show off. You can back into a spot, I think, in a crowded parking lot. You cannot do this. Also, if you have, like, a Ford 9750. I'm sorry. Go park far away. You're taking up three spots. Your truck does not fit in these. What? And I get it. You need a truck for work, and I thank you for the work that you do. Steve Tapke. Thank you.

[Penn Holderness]

That's Anne Marie's husband.

[Kim Holderness]

You need a big truck, and I applaud you in that important where. I need you to do that work, because I don't know how to do that work. But I'm sorry. When you buy that big of a truck, you cannot back into a spot in the middle of a crowded parking lot. You have to go away. You have to find a spot in a field somewhere and then walk to Target. I put this out on Instagram, and I asked, what is the hill you will die on? But, man, so many of you have opinions and feelings about backing in.

[Penn Holderness]

Before we do that, let's unpack a little bit about what was said. I want to know more about the Ford 9750. I feel like.

[Kim Holderness]

Is that an actual truck?

[Penn Holderness]

No.

[Kim Holderness]

Are we going to lose a sponsorship?

[Penn Holderness]

I don't. I don't. I don't. I don't think it was the 9750 that loses the sponsorship with the. With the pickup trucks. Okay, so tell me more about this truck. Does it have, like, when it backs up, does it go beep, beep? Does it have, like, floodlights? Like hips?

[Kim Holderness]

You know what I mean? Like, the trucks who have hips.

[Penn Holderness]

Yep. It's got a badonkey donk.

[Kim Holderness]

It has, like, around the tires, and then the side view mirrors are like arms.

[Penn Holderness]

They're moose antlers.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah, they're like arms.

[Penn Holderness]

Got it.

[Kim Holderness]

And they take up and I get it. You have a beautiful truck that costs more than my house. Park it somewhere else.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay, so you called me selfish. So that happened. I just wanted to. I underlined that selfish there. And so I felt a little attacked as well.

[Kim Holderness]

Sorry, that was. That was a little strange.

[Penn Holderness]

Do I regularly back up when it's super crowded? I generally go find a place that's pretty far away when I back up.

[Kim Holderness]

You're. You're very good about that.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

So we'd like to recant.

[Kim Holderness]

There have been moments.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay.

[Kim Holderness]

There have been moments.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay. When we are at a hockey game, I don't care what. I am backing in. I'm backing in. If there's a car behind me, I Am backing in for two reasons. For me, I'm better at backing up than I am at going forward. I'm always worried I'm going to sideswipe somebody. And I have these, like, cool cameras and an overhead, like, laser thing that shoots down and tells me exactly where the lines are. But it doesn't really do that when I'm going forward. And then number two, when you're, like, leaving a hockey game or a crowded parking lot or anywhere, I think it's safer to leave without backing up. I'm always worried I'm going to hit somebody when I'm backing up.

[Kim Holderness]

Fair. In fact, when I put this on Instagram, we got a lot of feedback and a lot of people saying, kim, I'm normally with you on things, but it is safer. They sh. They referenced fire trucks back in. So they can make a quick exit. They mentioned that it was safer because if you had to make a quick exit. I'm sorry, are we all in the FBI? If you're having to make a quick exit, you have a whole just different set of problems. And I don't know that a quick pull out in the parking lot is going to help you.

[Penn Holderness]

I want to stop here for a second and give you a high five because this is a great hill you'll die on. In order to have a good hill you'll die on, it has to be slightly unhinged.

[Kim Holderness]

But there are so many people that agreed with me.

[Penn Holderness]

Yes.

[Kim Holderness]

They said people who back in are monsters.

[Penn Holderness]

She's now stabbing the couch with our pen. So this is a very good. Like, you have fulfilled the definition of a hill that you'll die on.

[Kim Holderness]

I'm willing to get canceled on this. I am willing. When you hear this opinion, if you say, I'm going to unfollow this account because this woman is so unhinged. I'm sorry. I loved that you were here. More on this after these words.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay, Kim.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

You're getting into bed. You're turning out the lights. What is running through your mind as you try to fall asleep?

[Kim Holderness]

Okay, well, actually, what isn't going through my mind, like, all the things I need to get done, like making dinner and getting shopping and that weird thing I said to a neighbor 3 years ago I can't get over.

[Penn Holderness]

Well, the good news is bowl and branch sheets are here to quiet all that noise. Wrapping you in a softness so extraordinary, your body and mind effortlessly drift to sleep.

[Kim Holderness]

Yes. I love that.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

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[Penn Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

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[Penn Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

Feel the difference an extraordinary night sleep can make with bowl and Branch get 15% off plus free shipping on your first set of [e-mail] Holderness that's Boland.

[Penn Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

As the temps start rising, I feel this familiar urge to refresh my closet. But I'm not wasting money on pieces I'll only wear once and just for one season. Quint changes that.

[Penn Holderness]

Quince's clothes are timeless, lightweight and far more elevated than anything else. At this price, let your wardrobe finally.

[Kim Holderness]

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[Penn Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

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[Penn Holderness]

And they only work with factories that use safe, ethical and responsible manufacturing practices and premium fabrics and finishes.

[Kim Holderness]

Their 100% European linen tank is a summer must have. It comes in five colors and it's breathable with linen that's naturally heat regulating. I have it in deep navy, but it's only $29.90, so I might pick up a few more colors.

[Penn Holderness]

There you go. Okay, well, give your summer closet an upgrade with quince. Go to quints.comholderness for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns.

[Kim Holderness]

That's Q U-I-N-C-E.comholderness to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quint.comholderness.

[Penn Holderness]

Picture this. You're halfway through a DIY car fix, tools scattered everywhere, and boom. You realize you're missing a part. It's okay because you know, whatever it is, it's on ebay. They've got everything. Brakes, headlights, cold air intakes, whatever you need. And it's guaranteed to fit. Which means no more crossing your fingers and hoping you ordered the right thing. All the parts you need at prices you'll love. Guaranteed to fit every time. Ebay things people love. This is a good hill. And what happens for a hill you'll die on? You will face a siege of some sort. Historically, that's. That's what the metaphor is. Should we go to the laugh line and hear from Julie?

[Courtney]

I back into a parking spot 95% of the time. It is so much easier when you have to get out. I'm sorry. I do agree with Pen on that. A lot less accidents when you have to back out of a spot. The only time I don't back in is when somebody's on my tail and there's just a lot of cars. I don't want to hold people up. So I try to be respectful of that.

[Kim Holderness]

Julie, what I heard here is that you are a very sensitive, empathic person.

[Penn Holderness]

Empathetic.

[Kim Holderness]

Empathetic. You are a good person because you know if somebody's on your tail, if there's a line of people, you don't do it. That's what I heard. I heard that. I also heard that in case there's an emergency. Julie, what are we running from? Like zombies? Come. Is that gonna really help you? It is. I. So we did look it up. It is statistically safer. There are fewer accidents.

[Penn Holderness]

We looked it up.

[Kim Holderness]

You looked it up and reported to me. I did not want to know that information. Let's move on.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay, so we're moving on because this is. You know why? Because it doesn't matter what anyone says. This is the hill you're going to die on, which is the definition of the term in Bravo. A plus for the hill that you will die on.

[Kim Holderness]

Now it's your turn. We're going to hear from you, the listener, about the hills you'll die on. My cousin Nikki Stanton actually texted in. Literally does not mean actually.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, and Nikki, I'm with you. Also, anytime you use literally and you're not using it correctly, like I literally took a thousand hour nap, people are saying that now. That's not literally. Literally means the actual number.

[Kim Holderness]

I would say something. We got 50 to 75 messages on the Oxford comma.

[Penn Holderness]

Oh, yeah.

[Kim Holderness]

If you don't have a high schooler who is writing papers right now or college essays, you may not know this. People have dropped the Oxford comma. So the Oxford comma is also known as a serial comma. It's the comma placed before the last item in a list before the conjunction usually and, or, or, for example, in the list Apples, comma, orange commas and bananas. The comma after oranges is the Oxford comma. While it's not grammatically incorrect to omit the Oxford comma, it is a matter of style and is often influenced by specific style guides. Modern day writers and English graders and high schoolers.

[Penn Holderness]

Graders are doing this too. I thought it was just the teenagers who were doing this. No, everyone's.

[Kim Holderness]

They're being taught to drop the Oxford comma. And it is so uncomfortable. It's not personally my hill. It is, because I think it's a style thing. But I cannot tell you how many messages we got on this.

[Penn Holderness]

It's nonsensical to me. Like it's. You're listing something. So if you get rid of the comma, it's apples and then oranges and bananas. They're like off in their own little group, hanging out away from the apples. If you don't use that comma. That's how I feel about it.

[Kim Holderness]

That's how you feel? That's how many people feel. People who read college essays say they can tell if their parents helped them because there's the Oxford comma and what's Family Adventures says. And we got this one a lot too. Two spaces after the period. She was correct. Not changing. Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

What's wrong with taking two periods?

[Kim Holderness]

Okay. Why are you laughing?

[Penn Holderness]

This is a ridiculous. And Lola and I got in an argument about this too. Why. Why not put two spaces after a period?

[Kim Holderness]

I think it's like the lack of comma. The lack of space. It's just like a little bit of effort.

[Penn Holderness]

Can you give it a second? Like, give the thought a second and let it kind of breathe for another space?

[Anne Marie Tapke]

I do the one space. That's what we were taught when I was growing up. And I want to say that I edit our blogs before they go out.

[Penn Holderness]

And Anne Marie's laughing.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

Kim and Pen's two spaces. Every single.

[Kim Holderness]

Why is Anne Marie. Okay, Anne Marie Tapkis, confession hour. We fix that for you guys every.

[Penn Holderness]

Time you leave it like it is.

[Kim Holderness]

Let my spaces live, people.

[Penn Holderness]

Like, I'm pretty passionate about the two space bars.

[Kim Holderness]

Spaces live.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

Okay, but there's a difference here.

[Penn Holderness]

Give it a second.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

The style guides can't agree on the Oxford comma, but the style guides have changed.

[Kim Holderness]

They have changed. Say it's one space and it is universal. They can tell if they parents have helped with the college essay. First of all, I'm going to preface this. We're about to call my mom, and she was a high school English teacher, so we're going to get her quick opinion on the spaces in the Oxford comma, but that's not what I want to really bring her in on.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay.

[Kim Holderness]

Berenstain Bears.

[Penn Holderness]

The what?

[Kim Holderness]

The Berenstain Bears was my favorite book series as a young person. I think it was so readable. There was a brother and sister bear. There's my. So it looked like our.

[Penn Holderness]

Looked like your family.

[Kim Holderness]

It looks like my family, but in bare form. I could read those books independently, and I had all of them. Now people are telling me that it's the Beren Stain Bears dispelling, and it's a total Mandela effect. So many people have mistakenly recalled this series, the Berenstein Bears. And it's such a big group of people that, you know, the Mandela effect, it's a collective widespread false memory where many people recall a detail differently from what has actually happened. There are very famous Mandela effects. This is one of them. And we got many messages that the hill they will die on is that it was the Berenstein Bears. I think this just proves we are living in different timelines. There's been a glitch, and that timeline has merged with ours.

[Penn Holderness]

And that's not necessarily a hill. You will die on timelines, But I do love. This is another great. The fact that it's the Berenstein Bears is a great hill you'll die on because it is unhinged, because all you have to do is look it up. And you were wrong.

[Kim Holderness]

I'm wrong according to this timeline, but I think so. Let's call my mom.

[Penn Holderness]

I mean, there's books.

[Kim Holderness]

Hello, baby. Hi. Okay, we're recording a podcast, so.

[Penn Holderness]

Hi, Peggy.

[Kim Holderness]

Hi, Peggy. Okay, I can. Okay, so here's my question. Mom, do you remember when I was a young child, there was a book series and it had four bears, and it was the mama bear and a papa bear, and there was like, brother bear and sister bear. Do you remember that book series? Yeah. Do you remember what it was called? The Berenstain Bears.

[Penn Holderness]

She got it right.

[Kim Holderness]

It's the Berenstain Bears or Steen or something, but I always pronounce it Berenstain. So there's this famous sort of Mandela effect that there's a whole bunch of people, myself included, that remember it as the Berenstein Bears. And so we're just wrong. And it sucks to admit it. As a former English teacher, what is your feeling on the dropping of the Oxford comma and two spaces after a period? I have no problem with one space after a period at all but the Oxford comma is the hill I will die on.

[Penn Holderness]

Because.

[Kim Holderness]

Because you can change the meaning of a sentence by dropping the Oxford comma. Yeah, mom, rant for us. Tell us about it. I know for sure that I have either written or read sentences that the lack of an Oxford comma changed the meaning of the sentence. So I think it's utterly ridiculous to drop the Oxford comment.

[Penn Holderness]

So Peggy was not affected by the Berenstain Bears Mandela effect.

[Kim Holderness]

She can also read, and I, at the time, wasn't really reading.

[Penn Holderness]

So can we just rip through some other ones that he's gotten that I love? Okay. William Needham Finley the fourth. People who don't push their cart back to the grocery store are monsters. That's the hill that he'll die on.

[Kim Holderness]

A lot of those. In fact, we have, like, one. We picked one of many voicemails on this.

[Courtney]

The hill that I will plant my flag on is people who don't return the shopping cart. They will leave it stranded in the middle of the parking lot instead of just walking it over to the car corral or take it back inside the store. Yet these are the same people I see that go to the gym and work out like crazy, but they can't walk a few extra steps.

[Kim Holderness]

In my road to 50, I have vowed to do, you know, acts of random acts of kindness. I will say I just assumed everybody returned their carts. My. If I'm like, oh, crap, it's been a week, and I've just been a real biatch to people. I have to do some nice things. I do put people's carts away. So many people don't put them away.

[Penn Holderness]

What's going through your mind when you're doing that?

[Kim Holderness]

I'm getting my steps in.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay. Okay.

[Kim Holderness]

You're not like, I'm not.

[Penn Holderness]

So this is not the hill.

[Kim Holderness]

You'll die. I'm kind of neutral. I do. If they just, like, let it roll down the hill and it bumps into my car, yes. But I have to say, a lot of most, it was the Oxford comma, the double space and shopping carts were like the.

[Penn Holderness]

Those are the big ones.

[Kim Holderness]

Things that brought passion out of people.

[Penn Holderness]

Another big one was cereal. Yeah, People talked about cereal a lot.

[Kim Holderness]

Stacer do or cereal into the bowl before adding milk. There is no other way. I will let you know. We heard quite the opposite. I didn't know that there was another way. Our son, I think it's. We didn't ever teach our kids how to eat cereal. I guess he puts milk in the bowl first, did you know that I.

[Penn Holderness]

Have noticed that he's done that.

[Kim Holderness]

Try to correct him. And I feel like we failed his parents.

[Penn Holderness]

Does it really matter?

[Kim Holderness]

I think you get a better looks.

[Penn Holderness]

A little better at the top. Maybe.

[Kim Holderness]

I don't know. Then Shira Langa says, which I just think it's funny. I don't think this is the hill she'll die on. But that cereal is soup. So if a hot dog is not a sandwich. Jack Falk wrote, a hot dog is a taco.

[Penn Holderness]

So what if you're at a restaurant and you say, what's your soup of the day? And they're like Lucky Charms cereals, not soup. Sorry. That's a great hill you'll die on. You're wrong.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay, Kelly, she's going to talk to us about some pickles.

[Courtney]

Pickles should not go on anything. Not even burgers. Pickles just overpower the flavor of everything. And why do they put them on everything? They put them in wraps, they put them on chicken, they put them on burgers. However, fried pickles are another story. But putting pickles on things, I don't know, it's just mask the flavor of what you're trying to eat.

[Kim Holderness]

Kelly very passionate about pickles. See, I love a pickle. I will add a pickle. I'll ask for extra pickles, but I get that. Okay. Bravestone of all on Instagram, don't put fruit in my salad ever. It's inappropriate and frankly, fundamentally wrong.

[Penn Holderness]

Great hill. When you get unhinged and call it inappropriate to put garlic.

[Kim Holderness]

I love like a strawberry spinach salad.

[Penn Holderness]

With avocado, which also is a fruit.

[Kim Holderness]

Caroline. Idiots. I think she is saying this just to start a fight. Pineapple on ham or pepperoni pizza is a match made in heaven. She's just trying to start.

[Penn Holderness]

You feel like you're being gaslit right now.

[Kim Holderness]

I. No, here's the thing. I'm very neutral on food. If that's. I'm not gonna yuck your yum.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. So pineapple and ham, that's called the Hawaiian pizza, right? That is a. That is a common order at a restaurant is. I'll get the Hawaiian pizza.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

I think if it has a name, then we should allow it.

[Kim Holderness]

Do we think a lot of people in Hawaii eat pineapple and ham pizzas?

[Penn Holderness]

It's a really good question.

[Kim Holderness]

I do want you to know that the Hawaiian pizza was invented in Canada. This tracks.

[Penn Holderness]

This tracks by a Hawaiian person.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

That man's not Hawaiian.

[Kim Holderness]

That man's a Greek guy from Canada.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

A Greek born Canadian invented The Hawaiian pizza. Hawaiian pizza.

[Penn Holderness]

And we're putting a picture of him up.

[Kim Holderness]

If you're watching this on YouTube, that is really funny. So I would. I would love people from Hawaii to chime in on this.

[Penn Holderness]

Right?

[Kim Holderness]

Oh, here's one that's going to be very offensive to you. The Top Gun films are overrated.

[Penn Holderness]

Sorry, who wrote that?

[Kim Holderness]

Eleanor Blythe.

[Penn Holderness]

Eleanor Blythe. Okay.

[Kim Holderness]

He'S taking a deep breath.

[Penn Holderness]

Anyone who didn't give Top Gun Maverick 10 out of 10 stars should be arrested, pulled out into the street and charged with treason. That movie was amazing. Like Tom Cruise running around with his karate chop hands, like in a big screen theater. And was there real sexual chemistry between Tom Cruise and. What's the woman's name?

[Kim Holderness]

Jennifer Connelly.

[Penn Holderness]

Connelly. Absolutely not.

[Kim Holderness]

No.

[Penn Holderness]

But when it's time to save our country, Tom Cruise gets results. Damn it. You may call him not just a maverick in the sense of his call sign, but in his personality. It's a double entendre, people. You didn't shed a tear when Iceman died.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. I mean, you didn't shed a tear.

[Penn Holderness]

When he finally reconciled his relationship with Goose's son. You didn't like seeing Simon Howell with.

[Kim Holderness]

His shirt off, huh? So here's my question.

[Penn Holderness]

I'm a man and I like that. That guy's fit. That's what I want to look like.

[Kim Holderness]

I'm gonna say I loved the original Top Gun. I think that the second Top Gun checked all the boxes, but I think it's just hard to. Yeah, I don't. I mean, I'm just. I. I'm. I'm. I'm okay. I'm just gonna. You did great, honey. Yeah, great.

[Penn Holderness]

I'm sorry. Like, I just really like that movie. I'm sorry. I've seen it several times and it doesn't get worse. It's just always good.

[Kim Holderness]

Beth is really serious about sidewalk protocol. Appropriateness of walking dogs on the sidewalk.

[Courtney]

I have this system. If you're a single person walking on.

[Kim Holderness]

The sidewalk and someone comes by with a dog or two dogs, the person.

[Courtney]

Walking alone should go into the street.

[Kim Holderness]

A stroller with a mom trumps dogs. There's a whole system here of how.

[Courtney]

To appropriately walk on the sidewalk.

[Kim Holderness]

I love that. I was playing chicken, though. Here's my question, Beth. There was a kid who was riding his bike on a sidewalk, which I. I'm a. I'm a fan because some our streets, there's not a bike lane. It's a little crazy.

[Penn Holderness]

I'm not opposed person riding bikes on the sidewalk.

[Kim Holderness]

And I was walking on a sidewalk. I am really cool when you say I'm like, I'm gonna step out of the way. But he was almost, like, aiming for me, and he didn't, like, say anything. So I think we need to teach our kids protocol of, like, a excuse me or a thank you. It was like a lady, you're on my sidewalk. And he was, like, playing chicken with me. Like, he was like. Every time I stepped. Like, he was. Yeah. So I kind of wanted to, like, trip him a little. Janine Sons wrote, audiobooks count as reading. And then right after Danae Reinhard wrote, listening to an audiobook is not the same as reading. Both are great. They're just not the same. Okay. I have made a vow to read 50 books this year, and the only way I can get that done is I have my Kindle and I sync it up with the audible. So I read it at night, and then when I'm doing carpool, I push play, and I can get through a very long book and, like, five days. But you're telling me, Danae, that it doesn't count that I'm listening. I would love it in the comments if. If we had. I just would love to hear your opinions on why. Do you have an opinion, Pen?

[Penn Holderness]

Yes. If you're able to listen to a book and understand and get through it, then it's a book. Who cares if you're reading it or listening to it?

[Kim Holderness]

It is different. It is different, but for people with dyslexia, for people that adhd, it's easier.

[Penn Holderness]

For a lot of them.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. So I. Of course. I mean. I mean, maybe reading is the wrong term, but it counts as finishing.

[Kim Holderness]

It counts as maybe. What do you think, Sam? Sam is also a very voracious reader. This is your hail. Oh, let's hear it.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

This whole time, I've been trying to think, and then when I read that, I was like, oh, I'm getting.

[Kim Holderness]

You're getting hot.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

I'm getting hot.

[Kim Holderness]

Right? Right now. Her arms are. Okay. Producer Sam. Her arms are crossed. She's sweating a little.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

If I'm being the meanest, it's ableist, right?

[Kim Holderness]

Oh, yes.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

Like, I'm sorry, but audiobooks count. It's just. It counts. I don't. I. I'm. I'm too mad to form words.

[Kim Holderness]

That's. How angry. Are you about to cry?

[Anne Marie Tapke]

Yeah, I just get mad. I get mad that people like. Because. Also. Because reading is such a joy for me.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

It makes me so happy. And so for someone to Gatekeep such a joyful thing makes me so angry. Like, why aren't you letting people. People have this?

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. Live your truth. Yeah, I'm glad you have that hill, because that is. I am actually not a really super confrontational person. If somebody said that to me in public, I would say, okay, cool, that's your opinion. And not fight it. But you're so right. Because my son, he needs to see it and hear it to really for it to stick in his brain. And so if he's super into something, he'll listen as it's being read along and sometimes he'll just listen to it. So I'm gonna.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, I bet it goes 90 degrees.

[Kim Holderness]

I'll back you up more on this after these words.

[Penn Holderness]

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[Sam Allen]

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[Penn Holderness]

I want to move on to a couple of sports ones.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay. This first one from Tara long. Bowling, golf, etc. I know what she means. Are not sports. They are skills slash hobbies. But not sports. Tara Long thinks that. That anything where you're not running and sweating and playing on a team and hitting someone are not sports. I applaud her for having a hill that she'll die on. That's. It's ridiculous. How are they not sports?

[Kim Holderness]

They are not sports. I enjoy watching.

[Penn Holderness]

Sure. That that's different. Golf, there's a score or there's a tournament. There's an entire league. There's a money list. You have to walk about 10,000 yards in order to complete complete this. And you do it for four straight days. That's a sport.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah, it's a sport.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay.

[Kim Holderness]

No, I'm not gonna. I just. This is one of those things I'm pretty neutral on. If Penn puts golf on it is like Pavlov's dog. I will fall asleep like in. In. I'll be washing the dishes. He has golf on in place. I just fall asleep.

[Penn Holderness]

I don't think golf minds that statement. I think that their ratings would go up if more people who fell asleep during golf watch it.

[Kim Holderness]

They just keep watch so into sports and sports watching that when we were on the Amazing Race and we were in these hotels, we were in different countries on new sports. Yeah. And there was no English speaking programming on tv.

[Penn Holderness]

That's where I fell in love with speed climbing.

[Kim Holderness]

And there was. Where. What country were we in?

[Penn Holderness]

Switzerland.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. They had speed climbing. It was amazing speed climbing. And it was being broadcast in maybe German and which made it very. It just made it that more.

[Penn Holderness]

And it was like honey, deflator mouse is back up again. I know that's not the person's name. I know that's an opera. But it was like some name like that.

[Kim Holderness]

But they. We watched speed climbing for like two hours. Yeah, yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

You kind. There was an American who did.

[Kim Holderness]

Well, I know her name was Brooke. Hey, Brooke, if you're listening, see if.

[Penn Holderness]

There'S a great climber, an Olympic climber named Brooke. Okay. While we're on this. Yeah, we got a. We got another great. I love a good unhinged hill.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay.

[Penn Holderness]

Because the hills have to be unhinged. This is from Brooke. It's her name. Her name is maybe.

[Kim Holderness]

That's why I thought maybe it's our speed climber.

[Penn Holderness]

What if it's our speed climber Brooke Roboto. Yes, that's her. Yeah, she's good.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

French American, professional rock climber. Specializes in competition climbing and is an Olympic silver medalist in the combined bouldering and lead climbing event. 2024.

[Penn Holderness]

She got me through Covid first ever or through an amazing Race.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

Climbed a sport climbing route graded 5.15.

[Kim Holderness]

C. I would also like people to know that Penn sometimes doesn't remember shoes, but he remembers Brooke is an Olympic speed climber.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, the brain. Great. It is fascinating. Okay, other Brooke. Maybe the same Brooke.

[Kim Holderness]

Maybe the same Brooke.

[Penn Holderness]

Maybe the same Brooke said travel sports are expletive deleted awful on all levels and completely out of control. I dread seeing wraparound Oakley wearing baseball pant donning turbo coaches thinking every game is a D1. Ted a Tet. Should I keep going? This Is pretty good. We do not need to take the sport so seriously. We do not need to travel to Davenport, Louisiana or Fargo or Alabama in August to play a team on par with any team around us. We do not want to get in a room block at some godforsaken red roof inn with an indoor pool the size of a postage stamp with questionable carbon monoxide detection. Let kids actually enjoy the sports.

[Kim Holderness]

Amen. Yes. That is no notes.

[Penn Holderness]

That's a good hill.

[Kim Holderness]

We participate in it because if we.

[Penn Holderness]

We did with both kids.

[Kim Holderness]

We did with both kids. And so we are hypocrites.

[Penn Holderness]

Well, this is not a hill I would die on. Actually. I believe that travel sports is really good. I think it teaches kids patience. I think it. It shows them, like, the commitment that you need. It's a good off season. Add on to, like, what you're doing at school. As. As a consumer, I don't like paying $15 for a parking spot because I know they jacked the price up just because they knew I was coming.

[Kim Holderness]

And they never. It's. It's a mystery. At basketball tournaments. They're sorry. The credit card machine is not working. It's cash only. Every time. Every time your cash, like your credit card machine is broken.

[Penn Holderness]

Really, the two more I want to do this one from Lauren Campbell who want to let this one go. Lauren Campbell. Rinsing dishes before putting them into the dishwasher is wrong.

[Kim Holderness]

I've actually heard that from an appliance repair person that it's designed to be dirty. Like dishwashers are designed to have dirtiness.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

Dishwasher efficient efficiency. Rinsing can actually interfere with the dishwasher sensors and detergents effectiveness, potentially leading to a less thorough cleaning. Okay, that sounds like a marketing ploy.

[Kim Holderness]

What kind of sensors do we have on. This thing's not going into space. Okay.

[Sam Allen]

It's just cleaning the dish.

[Kim Holderness]

Everyone calm down. There's no lasers in there.

[Penn Holderness]

Let's end with Joe, who has a hill he'd like to die on. Concerning realtors.

[Kim Holderness]

It's pronounced realtor, not real. Atter.

[Courtney]

From one ADHD to another adhd.

[Kim Holderness]

Penn, you are dead end. It's safer to back into a parking spot than to back out of a parking spot. Okay. Joe.

[Penn Holderness]

We were so excited about Joe. And then he's got my drive.

[Kim Holderness]

And then. First of all, thank you so much. I love this community that's been created in the comment section, in the voicemails. We love hearing your voices sending us messages on Instagram. This has been so much fun. But now it Is time for my husband to give his top five. Penn needs to decide on the hill he will die on. So these are your top five contenders?

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, top five contenders. I think I'm gonna go in reverse order of what I think will be my hill. But I would love other people's opinions. Like, I want to see. I want to workshop these, because the more people disagree with them, I think the more I might need to make it my hill.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay. Got a couple of outside looking in. Oli. Number one is. It's pronounced nuclear.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay.

[Penn Holderness]

Not nuclear. Number two, know the difference between less and fewer. If you just have a moment, it'll just take a second. Less is something ethereal that has no quantitative property. Fewer is when you can assign. Yeah. Okay. Number five. I don't think this will be my hill because it's. It's. It feels like a lot of people are making this their hill. Die Hard is a Christmas movie.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah, Right? I mean, yeah, that's a pretty popular hill.

[Penn Holderness]

Aren't we getting closer to people agreeing with that, too, just because of how ridiculous Christmas movies are? Now you can turn anything to a Christmas movie movie. Number four, music in restaurants needs to be quiet and have no lyrics.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah, absolutely. Well, we're on the laugh lines, guys, so. Yes. This is. This is where we are now. Music needs to. Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

Music. It's because our. Our functioning. Our audio functioning gets worse after we turn a certain age, and I can't hear what the person in front of me is saying. And that's why I'm going to dinner.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay.

[Penn Holderness]

Is so I can hear what they're saying. Number three, sushi should be eaten with your hands.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. We're good. Good. We're good. What's your.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

What's your stance on chopsticks?

[Penn Holderness]

I don't think that they. They help anyone. I think. I think that they're impossible to operate. And if I try to pick up a piece of sushi with it, either the rice will fall off or the fish will fall off, and then I just end up, like, having to put it together with my hands culturally.

[Kim Holderness]

Or is it offensive to eat it with your hands?

[Penn Holderness]

As a matter of fact, more people in Japan eat sushi with their hands than in America.

[Kim Holderness]

I think we need to fact check that.

[Penn Holderness]

You really should fact check that.

[Kim Holderness]

That sounds like one of those things.

[Penn Holderness]

I sounded so confident.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

In Japan, again, it's generally acceptable and even considered traditional to eat sushi with your hands.

[Kim Holderness]

Oh, okay.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay. So that may not even be a hill. That might just be that. I got it right.

[Kim Holderness]

You need to popularize.

[Penn Holderness]

I need to let people know that. Great.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

I bet chopsticks were created by a Greek born Canadian.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay, number two, Quidditch has the dumbest scoring system of anything ever.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

First you have to explain what the Quidditch scoring system is.

[Penn Holderness]

All right, so Harry Potter has this sport and it's so imaginative. And I love, when I read it in a book, I thought it was the thoughtfulness of it. And you're flying through the air and you have all these different teams and J.K. rowling put it all together on her own. She's like, I'm gonna invent a sport and good for you. You go. But the scoring system Is you get 10 points for scoring a goal, which is already hard. There's people beating the crap out of each other.

[Kim Holderness]

It's like sky lacrosse.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah, it's sky lacrosse.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

Except. Except you get 10 points for a goal. And if you catch this little golden thing that's running around, the game is over and you get 150 points.

[Kim Holderness]

So why would you even need to score a goal?

[Penn Holderness]

What's the point of anything else going on? Unless you score 15 more goals than the other team, which never happens.

[Kim Holderness]

But do games end without.

[Penn Holderness]

No, the game doesn't end until you catch the Snitch.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay, that is stupid.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah. If you look up, there's a lot of colleges who have Quidditch clubs and they play like their version of Quidditch. They use like a deflated volleyball so it doesn't like hurt as much when you hit people. And they have changed the scoring. They changed the snitch to 30 points.

[Kim Holderness]

Well, what is the Snitch?

[Anne Marie Tapke]

Okay, since obviously in the magical version, the Snitch is magically moving. So what do you do in real life? 18 minutes in an impartial person runs onto the field with a sock hanging from their shorts that has a tennis ball.

[Penn Holderness]

Sorry. Hanging from their shorts.

[Kim Holderness]

Sorry. That is so phallic sounding.

[Penn Holderness]

Yeah.

[Anne Marie Tapke]

Where from there, I assume, assume like flag football. It's back.

[Kim Holderness]

Better, better, better. Let's describe it. It is a man wearing a bright yellow tracksuit sweatsuit. And on his thigh, on the side of his thighs it's written Snitch. And then right above his butthole dangles a sock with a tennis ball. So you are grabbing this man's posterior. Oh my Lord. In heavens. If you are watching this video, we are going to put a graphic up. Obviously 12 year old boys came up with this. I think college kids who are 12 year old boys.

[Penn Holderness]

Okay, here's my last one. Our national anthem. We can do better. Whoa.

[Kim Holderness]

I thought I was gonna get canceled for backing into spots. Pen holderness in and of itself.

[Penn Holderness]

I hear the national anthem, I get emotional. I think it has. It's. It's. It soars at the end. It's got a nice bridge.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. Whitney Houston. The best version here.

[Penn Holderness]

I'll tell you what, I've got kind of like a vanilla answer, and then I've got a little bit more mint chocolate chip answer, like a little more flavor. The vanilla answer is. The national anthem is an octave. And plus seven semitones. It's like 19 semitones. It's like an octave plus a fifth, which is the average vocal range of an untrained singer is somewhere between one octave and one and a third octaves. So if you're not a trained musician, you can't sing this song.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah.

[Penn Holderness]

It's got too much range.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. I don't. So we went. We go to these hockey games and there's somebody who comes out and performs.

[Penn Holderness]

Adam Lee Decker.

[Kim Holderness]

But he. And he does an amazing job. And it's a. You get goosebumps. But it's not something we're participating in. Singing.

[Penn Holderness]

We were supposed to, like, we're supposed to. When you're at it, you're really supposed to be able to sing your own national anthem.

[Kim Holderness]

Oh, I don't even try.

[Penn Holderness]

Right.

[Kim Holderness]

It's too hard.

[Penn Holderness]

If you look at other countries, they're all singing their. Their anthems. They're singing.

[Kim Holderness]

I, I. You know what? You're right. I'm sort of like mouthing the words because I don't want to be.

[Penn Holderness]

It's. It's just the range is tough.

[Kim Holderness]

It's tough.

[Penn Holderness]

It's a little longer than other ones. And here's the big thing. We've got two bangers just sitting there waiting to be the national anthem. Tell me America the beautiful.

[Kim Holderness]

Great song.

[Penn Holderness]

Lower range. Right. It's like an octave in one note. So a singer can. Can do that.

[Kim Holderness]

Sing it for us.

[Penn Holderness]

Oh, beautiful Four spacious skies for amber waves of grain see Taking out Midwest for purple mountain majesties that could either be the Blue Ridge or the Colorado above the fruited plain don't forget Kansas America, America, God shed We're gonna switch from his to its grace on me and crown thy good with brotherhood from sea Atlantic ocean to shining sea Pacific Ocean. We've covered it all.

[Kim Holderness]

We've covered. And it's a beautiful song.

[Penn Holderness]

Yes.

[Kim Holderness]

Yeah. I think it makes me feel very patriotic.

[Penn Holderness]

We've also got God Bless America.

[Kim Holderness]

Let's hear it.

[Penn Holderness]

Written by Irving Berlin, Jewish immigrant.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay, let's see.

[Penn Holderness]

God bless America. Land that I love. Ever sing this in a bar with drunk people? They get really happy. Stand beside her and guide her through the night with the light from above from the mountain to the prairie to the ocean wide with foam God bless America My home sweet home. We're not done. God bless America if you want to. My home sweet home.

[Kim Holderness]

I hear what you're saying. Those are more accessible songs. And the national anthem, it is like you need to be Whitney Houston to sound good singing it.

[Penn Holderness]

And if you want to go mint chocolate chip with the explanation.

[Kim Holderness]

Okay.

[Penn Holderness]

The third verse of the national anthem condones and endorses slavery.

[Kim Holderness]

I don't think I knew that. Oof, that's rough.

[Penn Holderness]

We don't sing it. It's not part of what we sing, but it's part of the poem that was written by Francis Scott Key. So what is my hill? Is it one of these? Or is it. Is it Tom Cruise in Top Gun?

[Kim Holderness]

I feel like you got most passionate about Tom Cruise blowing stuff up. I think that in terms. I think your hill is that Tom Cruise needs to be valued as a national treasure.

[Penn Holderness]

Tom Cruise is a national treasurer. That's. I got pretty deep with the national anthem, but I was not as passionate, not as passionate as I was with Tom Cruise.

[Kim Holderness]

Yes. Thank you for joining us. I cannot wait to see the comment section on this post. And I'm sorry if you have to unfollow, unsubscribe because of my take. I'm backing into a spot. I apologize. No. Nope.

[Penn Holderness]

To Hill. You'll die on. Don't apologize.

[Kim Holderness]

Can't apologize.

[Penn Holderness]

America, America Tom Cruise shed his grace on thee. Laugh Lines is written and produced by Kim Holderness, Penn Holderness and Anne Marie Tapke with original music by Pen Holderness. It is filmed, edited and live produced by Sam Allen and hosted by acast. As always, we love to hear. So please write to us at podcastheholdernessfamily.com or leave a voicemail at 323-364-3929 and we will talk to you soon when you back that truck on up and listen to us on the laugh line. This episode is brought to you by IQ Bar, our exclusive snack sponsor.

[Kim Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

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[Penn Holderness]

Oh yeah.

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[Penn Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

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[Penn Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

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[Kim Holderness]

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[Penn Holderness]

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