Podcast Summary: Leadership Conversations @ The Kitchen Table

Episode 88: Ryan Power, Deputy Chief – The Power of Communication

Host: Berlin Maza
Guest: Deputy Chief Ryan Power (Spokane County Fire District 3)
Date: December 15, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode features Deputy Chief Ryan Power, who oversees Professional Development and Wellness at Spokane County Fire District 3. The central theme is the essential role of communication—specifically, the “human factors” of communication—in effective fire service leadership. Chief Power shares concrete approaches for developing leaders at all levels, focusing on building relationships, understanding different communication styles, and making “soft skills” a tactical priority.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Role & Scope of Professional Development

• Chief Power's Portfolio: Responsible for training, health/wellness, recruitment, and retention. His approach integrates leadership development across all ranks, from new firefighters to chief officers.
  • “If it didn’t have a home, it ended up with me…There’s leadership component in there. There’s some executive leadership training.” [03:40]
• Outside-the-Box Training: Department supports and even funds attendance at specialized leadership programs (e.g., Leadership Under Fire, Stonewater Training Group, Pathfinder Strategies) that extend beyond contractual requirements.
  • “We’re providing some leadership stuff that is outside of Pro D…It’s more in the human factors world.” [04:41]

2. Human Factors & the Power of Relationships

• Chief Power's Turning Point:
  • He recounts a story of unintentionally causing an uproar among fire chiefs when sending an email lacking relationship context, learning the power of established trust:
  • “He never said anything different than what I said. It was 100% because of relationships.” [12:40]
• Emotional Intelligence:
  • Repeatedly emphasized as a “tactical skill” requiring deliberate practice:
  • “If you want to become a better officer...you're probably missing what I think is the most important part: the emotional intelligence parts.” [00:10]
• Impact of Leadership:
  • Appreciation for how bad leadership experiences shaped his perspective.
  • “At the time, I didn’t like it…but as I worked my way up…I realized those are things I can learn from.” [10:25]

3. Practical Communication Training (The Drills)

• Homegrown Curriculum:
  • Developed “escape room” style communication drills, focusing not on technical skills, but on building awareness of communication styles and challenges:
  • “We built almost escape room type challenges on the drill ground that focused on those specific topics…” [18:17]
• Voluntary, Reflection-Based:
  • 100+ members participated voluntarily in small groups, with stations highlighting communication difficulties.
  • Outcomes included self-realization regarding communication types and blind spots.
  • “Maybe I need to focus a little more on listening than talking.” [21:34]
• From Lessons to Action:
  • Compiled lists of communication challenges and successes to guide officer-level action plans.
  • “I tried not to make it stop with just identifying a hazard. I tried to make it something actionable…” [23:51]

4. Understanding Communication Styles: “The Four Cs”

Chief Power adopts and adapts a framework from Susan Fowler’s Why Motivating People Doesn’t Work…:

• Connection: Building trust and relationships is foundational.
  • “If I can’t connect with you because of my personal bias…already causing a challenge or a barrier…” [29:56]
• Choice: Valuing people’s input and giving them agency when possible.
• Competence: Technical proficiency is crucial, but not to the exclusion of interpersonal skills.
• Consistency: Leaders need to be predictable and fair, prioritizing this over likability.
  • “Being consistent, valuing that more than being liked is super important.” [32:17]

5. The Four Communication Styles

Chief Power outlines four digestible communication styles for officers and firefighters:

• Narrative/Social: Relates through stories, seeks connection (can be verbose).
• Direct: Clear and concise (can feel unemotional or harsh).
• Empathetic: Prioritizes understanding how others feel, strong listening (may communicate less).
• Logical/Analytical: Detail- and process-oriented, seeks accuracy (may become frustrated by rambling).
  • “The best leaders are the ones that can seamlessly transition between all [these styles] and give the people what they need. It’s not what Chief Power needs, it’s what the person on the other end needs.” [51:18]

6. Why Communication Often Gets Overlooked

• Stigma: Soft skills are subconsciously devalued in the blue-collar, tactical paradigm of the fire service.
  • “There could be a stigma about this type of stuff…that it's soft…It's a blue collar job. We need to go work...But I also think there can be middle ground.” [26:18]
• Lack of Metrics: Hard to quantify improvement in communication; most measures are anecdotal.
  • “I don’t have a measurable metric to say it got better…” [26:58]
• Training Imbalance: Countless hours are spent on technical skills, but virtually none on communication unless championed by leadership.
  • “We will train on hard skills all day long…We don’t have the curriculum…for communication building.” [40:01]

7. Actionable Takeaways for Listeners

Chief Power encourages leaders at every level to:

• Learn and practice switching between communication styles depending on the situation and person.
• Deliberately create space and opportunities for communication skills practice.
• Build self- and situational-awareness regarding personal and generational differences.
  • “Human factors is a tactical skill…If you don’t practice it…you’re not going to. It’s just like anything else.” [42:20]
• Transition communication lessons from theory to concrete, actionable changes (not just discussion).
• Recognize and mitigate implicit bias as it affects connection and team dynamics.
• Share authority and empower others on the team.
  • “I love it when you just give people something and they go make it way better than whatever I came up with.” [63:20]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Emotional Intelligence as a Tactical Skill:
  • “If you want to advance in your career…you're probably missing what I think is the most important part: the emotional intelligence parts.” [00:10]
• On the Power of Relationships:
  • “It was 100% because of relationships.” [12:46]
• On Learning from Failure:
  • “I was lucky enough to have some really bad leadership…Those are things I can learn from.” [10:25]
• On Soft Skills Imbalance:
  • “Someone struggles with throwing ladders…we drill. Someone’s not building connection or communicating well…We just move them…We’re escaping the problem.” [39:15]
• On Communication Drills:
  • "We built almost escape room type challenges...The skill didn’t matter. Skill is communication piece.” [20:23]
• On Style Flexibility:
  • “The best leaders are the ones that can seamlessly transition between all and give people what they need. It's not what Chief Power needs, it's what the person on the other end needs.” [51:18]
• On Team Flow:
  • “A team demonstrates the ability to manage adversity’s emotions, mitigate hazards, and complete tasks effectively—all while maintaining focus on the mission and supporting one another. That was exactly what we were doing.” [61:04]
• On Well-Being as the Major Leadership Challenge:
  • “The health and wellness of all firefighters…needs to become probably one of the priorities…That is a major challenge…and an opportunity…” [66:17]

Timestamps for Important Segments

• [03:40] – Scope of Chief Power’s role; leadership development in his department
• [10:25] – Defining the “human factors” of communication
• [12:40] – Critical learning moment: relationships trumping facts in leadership
• [18:11] – Designing unconventional, communication-focused training
• [21:34] – Realizations from communication drills: directness and listening
• [26:18] – Cultural and practical barriers to prioritizing communication
• [28:15] – The “bubble” analogy for human factors and communication
• [29:56] – Introduction and explanation of the Four Cs
• [47:48] – The Four Communication Styles in leadership
• [51:18] – How great leaders flex styles for the receiver, not themselves
• [66:17] – Chief Power identifies Health & Wellness as the next major leadership challenge

Book Recommendations

• Why Motivating People Doesn’t Work… and What Does – Susan Fowler
• Turn the Ship Around – L. David Marquet
• Crazy Horse (as historical inspiration; author not specified) [69:30]

Leadership Challenge & Final Thoughts

• Leadership Challenge: Chief Power nominates Tim Love (Assistant Region Manager, DNR Wildfire, Eastern Washington) for a future episode.
• Parting Advice:
  • “Effective communication is a cornerstone to effective leadership…You can’t lead people super effectively if you don’t understand people…If people focus a little bit of time on that, they’ll see some benefit.” [71:46]

For leaders—current and aspiring—Power’s approach reframes communication and emotional intelligence as core, tactical skills that deserve training time and deliberate practice, not just lip service. Action, accountability, and adaptation are central to his philosophy: build relationships, flex your style, and create environments that value both performance and connection.