The Grand Finale

Summary

Leave the Gun, Take the Cannoli: The Epic Story of the Making of the Godfather — The Grand Finale

Release Date: April 23, 2025

In the final installment of "Leave the Gun, Take the Cannoli: The Epic Story of the Making of the Godfather," hosts Mark Seal and Nathan King delve deep into the intricate tapestry that wove together to create one of Hollywood's most iconic films. This comprehensive episode encapsulates decades of research, interviews, and reflections, offering listeners an unparalleled glimpse into the challenges, triumphs, and enduring legacy of Francis Ford Coppola's masterpiece.

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1. Introduction to the Grand Finale

As the curtain falls on this illuminating series, Seal and King set the stage for a nuanced exploration of "The Godfather." They emphasize the film's monumental impact on cinema and American culture, highlighting how it transcended its medium to become a byword for excellence.

Mark Seal [02:13]: "Evans holds firm to the conviction that he saved the movie, saved the studio, and in many ways elevated the glory of American film."

2. The Making of The Godfather: Behind the Scenes

The journey to bringing "The Godfather" to life was anything but smooth. Studio interference, mafia threats, and intense creative disputes threatened to derail the project at every turn. Seal recounts the tumultuous production environment, emphasizing the resilience and determination of the key players involved.

Robert Evans [02:16]: "When you walked out of Godfather, we were introduced to a different world."

Challenges ranged from revoked location permits to violent confrontations over casting decisions. One particularly harrowing incident involved a producer's car being riddled with bullets, underscoring the tangible dangers the production team faced.

3. Research and Storytelling: Crafting the Narrative

Mark Seal shares his extensive research process, detailing how he unearthed both new and archival interviews to piece together the film's complex history. His commitment to "casting a wide net" ensured that even the most seemingly inconsequential voices were heard, enriching the narrative with diverse perspectives.

Mark Seal [03:43]: "I just thought that I was going to do a magazine story, but I had no idea that I would later write a book about it and that it would consume my life for so many years."

One standout interview was with Marilyn Stewart, Paramount's head of publicity and promotion, who provided invaluable insights into the film's marketing strategies and global sensation.

4. Insights from Cast and Crew

The podcast features candid conversations with pivotal figures who shaped "The Godfather." James Caan, Robert Evans, and Al Ruddy share personal anecdotes and reflections, shedding light on their experiences and contributions.

Mark Seal [08:10]: "We spent I think, three hours that day talking about the movie and his role and how he prepared for the part."

Caan discusses his deep immersion into the character, while Evans reflects on the film's financial and personal implications for him.

5. The Godfather's Legacy and Impact on Hollywood

"The Godfather" not only redefined the gangster genre but also set new standards for filmmaking. Its success at the 1973 Oscars, despite Marlon Brando's controversial absence, solidified its place in cinematic history.

Mark Seal [17:52]: "Mario decided not to go because he was too worried about having to give a speech so he watched it from home in suburban New York."

The film's enduring legacy is attributed to its storytelling prowess, character depth, and the authentic portrayal of the American Mafia, which resonated deeply with audiences worldwide.

6. Reflections on Key Figures and Their Legacies

The episode pays homage to the numerous individuals who contributed to the film's success, many of whom have since passed away. Al Ruddy, Mario Puzo, and Robert Towne are among those remembered for their pivotal roles.

Mark Seal [26:20]: "Robert Towne once said that he was not really interested in writing novels, that he just wanted to write movies and listen to that list of movies that he wrote."

Seal delves into their post-Godfather careers, highlighting how the film served as a springboard for their continued influence in Hollywood.

7. Personal Stories and Final Reconciliations

One of the episode's most poignant moments is the recounting of Robert Evans and Francis Ford Coppola's reconciliation during the film's 25th anniversary. This heartfelt interaction underscores the personal bonds formed amidst the chaos of production.

Robert Evans [31:47]: "We must have done something right."

Their embrace symbolizes the enduring respect and acknowledgment of their collaborative efforts, cementing the film's legacy as a testament to collective vision and perseverance.

8. Conclusion: An Enduring Masterpiece

Mark Seal and Nathan King wrap up the series by reflecting on the timeless nature of "The Godfather." They assert that the film's success lies not only in its cinematic achievements but also in its profound exploration of family, power, and the American Dream.

Mark Seal [03:20]: "The story endures as those who made it recede, leaving behind a testament to the glory of the American family and the steadfast belief in the American dream."

The Grand Finale serves as both a celebration and a deep dive into "The Godfather's" creation, offering listeners a rich, engaging, and comprehensive understanding of why this film remains a cornerstone of American cinema.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Mark Seal [03:43]: "I just thought that I was going to do a magazine story, but I had no idea that I would later write a book about it and that it would consume my life for so many years."

• Robert Evans [02:16]: "When you walked out of Godfather, we were introduced to a different world."

• Mark Seal [17:52]: "Mario decided not to go because he was too worried about having to give a speech so he watched it from home in suburban New York."

• Mark Seal [26:20]: "Robert Towne once said that he was not really interested in writing novels, that he just wanted to write movies and listen to that list of movies that he wrote."

• Robert Evans [31:47]: "We must have done something right."

• Mark Seal [03:20]: "The story endures as those who made it recede, leaving behind a testament to the glory of the American family and the steadfast belief in the American dream."

This structured and detailed summary captures the essence of "The Grand Finale" episode, providing a cohesive narrative that highlights the key discussions, insights, and conclusions drawn by Mark Seal and Nathan King. For those who haven't listened, this summary offers a comprehensive overview of the podcast's exploration into the making and legacy of "The Godfather."

Transcript

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[Lisa Vanderpump]

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[Stassi Schroeder]

Let's do this. Ciao. It's Stassi. Of course. Lisa brought in her favorite to be resident chaperone of the castle.

[Mark Seal]

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She's my eyes and ears.

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[Mark Seal]

Cheers to all the toxic couples in the castle.

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[Mark Seal]

O.Com in his palatial estate known as Woodland, Robert Evans sits up in his bed. He's still glued to the screen. The movie has ended and the memories begin.

[Robert Evans]

It's my most important legacy in life.

[Mark Seal]

Evans holds firm to the conviction that he saved the movie, saved the studio, and in many ways elevated the glory of American film.

[Robert Evans]

When you walked out of Godfather, we were. You're introduced to a different world, as.

[Mark Seal]

I would later write in the book, from this bed and from this man and those he appointed, the Godfather sprang forth. It was a miracle on paper and on screen. Created and inspired by the sons and daughters of immigrants, its characters were portrayed by a band of misfits who base their roles on a gang of miscreants humanized to the point of being honorable. The story endures as those who made it recede, leaving behind a testament to the glory of the American family and the steadfast belief in the American dream.

[Robert Evans]

Marcus?

[Mark Seal]

I'm Mark Seal.

[Nathan King]

And I'm Nathan King.

[Mark Seal]

And this is Leave the Gun, Take the Cannoli.

[Nathan King]

In our final episode, we're discussing the life, legacy and legend of the cast, crew, and film. Mark, when you walked into Woodland that day, did you know you would eventually write the definitive book on the making of the Godfather?

[Mark Seal]

Not at all. I just thought that I was going to do a magazine story, but I had no idea that I would later write a book about it and that it would consume my life for so many years. After the article was published, I started thinking about writing the book, and I was able to meet with Anthony Colombo, son of Joe Colombo, who headed the Italian American Civil Rights League. And we drove out to a diner in New Jersey, and there he was. He comes into the diner, walking with a cane. By then, I think he was in his 60s, maybe. And we talked for a long time, and he couldn't have been nicer. And I tried to imagine him back in those days in the Park Sheridan Hotel with Al Ruddy speaking before the League.

[Nathan King]

You've said previously, Mark, when you're writing a magazine article like this, that casting a wide net is very important and talking to as many people as possible, no matter how inconsequential they seem. Did you do that here?

[Mark Seal]

Oh, yes, of course. You know, I tried to talk to as many people as I could for the article and then later for the book. And it was amazing. After the article came out, people would call and tell me facts that I couldn't have dug up any other way. But it was nothing like after the book came out, one man called and said his uncle had delivered the horse's head to the set. There were so many unexpected but important additions that just came from the story being out there in the world.

[Nathan King]

Who was the most unexpected character you talked to?

[Mark Seal]

Well, maybe Marilyn Stewart, because I hadn't really read anything about her. There's not one interview that I could find. But I called the number that I had found for her, and she answered the phone, and it Was like. It seemed like she was expecting my call, which, of course, she couldn't have been. But she was just ready to tell her story. And what a story she had to tell. You know, she came on, she was Paramount's head of publicity and promotion, and she just started before the movie was even shot. You know, fostering its image, making sure that she got the magazine covers and all the television shows. And I just thought she was a great window into the Godfather's past and how it became such a sensation worldwide.

[Nathan King]

I wanna talk a little bit more about the reporting aspect of it. How you sort of organize your thoughts and figure out who to talk to. Someone like Janet Snow, for instance, is that someone whose name just comes up in the course of interviewing someone else, and then one thing leads to another.

[Mark Seal]

That was a great story. So Janet Snow had not been interviewed either. I mean, maybe she had, but I had not seen any interviews with her. And I was talking to Gray Frederickson, and he go, oh, my gosh. Mario had an assistant during those days, and he couldn't remember her name at first. And he just said, oh, Janet Snow. And I called Janet. And she, right off the bat, told me this incredible story about Mario Puzo arriving in Hollywood and that story about the white Lincoln Continental. And I went, oh, my gosh. It was just, like, too wild to believe. You know, as you're putting together a portrait of somebody for a book, you're just trying to get as much clay as you can to build the character. And Mario had done lots of interviews, so there was a lot about him in print. But a person like Janet Snow, who was there when Mario arrived in Hollywood and drove him from Paramount to the Beverly Hills Hotel. I mean, you can't get much better than that.

[Nathan King]

And it's interesting because while they're in very different situations, Mario's a huge successful author and Janet's a relative nobody. They're both neophytes in their own way in this Hollywood world. And I think that's enough to bring them together.

[Mark Seal]

Yes. And they were both fairly young. Mario's in his 40s, and he was new to that world. Plus, Janet had a magical story to tell about how she got the job. You know, you open a door and these stories just come flooding out. Like, I'll never forget going to James Caan's home in Beverly Hills when I was researching the article. And I walk in and there was a huge drawing of the Godfather on his wall. It was Don Corleone and his three sons, including Sonny, who was played by.

[James Caan]

James Caan, I think, you know, with.

[Robert Evans]

A lot of those guys, not just the Italians, obviously, like I said, you know, the immigrants couldn't get a job working with three cents, you know, so they did what they had to do out of need.

[Mark Seal]

And we spent I think, three hours that day talking about the movie and his role and how he prepared for the part, how he got.

[Nathan King]

What was it like interviewing James Caan because he's obviously an actor, but also sort of a street guy. Did you find him very easy to interview and affable?

[Mark Seal]

Oh, certainly. And later when I called him for the book, he was incredibly forthcoming. I talked to him for another, I think two hours and then called him again for another hour or so. He was so giving and generous with his time. Was there somebody that you picked up.

[Robert Evans]

Mannerisms from, like, you did, like the Rickles idea? Well, Andrew was my closest friend, you know, and he had certain energy, you know, there's a certain energy about Rickles when he was younger, you know, which he still has today, in his 80s, you know, but it's obviously not as sharp. None of us are sharp, but.

[Mark Seal]

But I could just see that Bada Bing line coming out of.

[Robert Evans]

Yeah, well, that's where it came, you know, I don't know. I wish I'd had the foresight to like, what do you call a copyright that thing. I could have made money. I wouldn't be begging.

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[Stassi Schroeder]

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[Mark Seal]

Cheers to all the toxic couples in the castle.

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[Stassi Schroeder]

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[Mark Seal]

Thing that I was privileged to do was research the life of the actor who played Luke Abrazzi, Lenny Montana, who is one of the most unforgettable characters in the movie. He was a former wrestler and some say a bodyguard. I was able to dig up some really old newspapers about him, and there's one where he tells the story of going to visit his mother in suburban New York at the same time they were filming the Godfather there and had been looking for the perfect actor to play Luca, who had to be a mountain of a man. And they had gone through several potential actors, all professionals, but none were quite right. Anyway, Lenny is visiting his mother and Al Ruddy looks out on the crowd that's gathered around the set and sees this colossal man behind the barricades. He takes Lenny Montana to meet Francis Coppola in his trailer. Lenny's head was probably scraping the ceiling because he was so big, and Coppola looks up at him and says, that's Luca Brasi.

[Nathan King]

We mentioned earlier that Robert Evans passed away in 2019, just before we started making this show. Sadly, he wasn't the only one there Were six or seven other characters in the Godfather story who died while we were making this podcast?

[Mark Seal]

Yeah, just to name a few. Al Ruddy died this year. Eleanor Coppola, Roger Corman, Robert Towne, the screenwriter who wrote the majestic succession scene. Fred Roos died this year. James Caan 2 years ago. I mean, it's amazing. Time takes its toll. This is a movie that was made 50 years ago, so a lot of time has passed and a lot of people who gave so much to the film have passed along with it.

[Nathan King]

One thing we should talk about is the proliferation of conflicting accounts and specifically how you chose whose to believe.

[Mark Seal]

Well, honestly, I didn't want to choose, and I don't really think it's my job to take a side and make a choice. All of the stories were so fascinating, and in the absence of any conclusive evidence about who was right, who was wrong, I just decided to present all the versions to readers and let them decide. And I feel like we've done the same thing with this podcast. But it was a pretty chaotic time. And Ira Zuckerman's Godfather journal was such a great help because he was there every day and documented every single day of filming in such detail that you really couldn't quite argue with that because that seemed to be the definitive Fly on the wall account. I mean, there's very few movies where you have someone who's written a day to day diary of everything that happened. And so it was a real treasure to have that as a resource.

[Nathan King]

And what about Gianni's version of events? I like his account the best.

[Mark Seal]

What were you like personality wise?

[Robert Evans]

Like this? Same as am. Never changed. Don't care about nothing. We gotta leave. I'll jump out the window.

[Mark Seal]

We leave. Take a shot.

[Robert Evans]

See you later. I don't care about nothing. I started from nothing.

[Mark Seal]

Well, yeah, of course, because Gianni Russo has a way of telling these things that they make them come alive, you know, but so many others do as well. I mean, Al Ruddy is the same way, and of course, Bob Evans, I mean, he's the same way. And Francis Coppola is a professional storyteller. They're all amazing storytellers.

[Nathan King]

After working on this podcast, it's hard not to feel like making a movie is a completely foolish endeavor because you have all of these conflicting personalities tossed together in one place and, you know, you're all working toward a common goal, but it seems like things are bound to go wrong more often than not.

[Mark Seal]

Yeah, it's a miracle that any movie gets made, isn't it because all the personalities, money, logistics, there's so many ways for things to go wrong. It's not unusual for a movie not to work out. And the Godfather is a rare case where the ending was happy and the alchemy worked against all odds.

[Nathan King]

I think that directors like Francis Ford Coppola get a lot of flack for being almost authoritarian in their pursuit of getting what they want. But you can kind of see where that would be a benefit in making the Godfather, because you need someone with such a determined vision and sense of purpose.

[Mark Seal]

There has to be a captain of the ship, right?

[Nathan King]

Mark, we know the movie did well financially, but did the people involved?

[Mark Seal]

Well, there's conflicting stories once again, about this. You know, some people said they got rich off of the movie, but really the actors were paid minimal salaries, I guess 35,000, I think, for some. And that was for the established ones. Al Ruddy said he had points and he did well on it. But one thing is clear above all is that Paramount made a lot of money. Robert Evans told me that day in Woodland that being the head of production, he didn't have any points. So he didn't make any money off the movie personally. But, you know, it gave him a springboard to do other things when he became an independent producer. So it's another mystery of the Godfather about who made what on the movie. But here's how Al Ruddy described it in our interview.

[Robert Evans]

You gotta understand, nobody ever envisioned the success of this movie. Everyone worked for scale. So classic cuts. Mario had two and a half points and I had seven points. But they don't who care. Wasn't that profit this week? You know what they say, it's not worth the paper it's written on, right? Right. Net profits. Except this move went through the roof.

[Nathan King]

If there was any doubt about how the movie did or was received in Coppola's mind or anyone else's, it was eradicated when the 1973 Oscars came around. Mark, can you talk a little bit about that?

[Mark Seal]

The Godfather was nominated for 10 awards at the 1973 Oscars. Best Picture, Brando as Best actor, Coppola for Best Director, Coppola and Puzzo for Best Adapted Screenplay, and for Best Supporting Actor, three of them. Al Pacino, James Caan and Robert Duvall. They also had nominations for costume, editing and sound. When the envelopes were open, it was Mario Puzo and Francis Ford Coppola for Best Adapted Screenplay. And they said that Mario decided not to go because he was too worried about having to give a speech so he watched it from home in suburban New York. Brando won best Actor. But probably in one of the most famous events in Oscar history, he didn't attend. And instead he sent an emissary on his behalf, a woman named Sasheen Littlefeather, who got up and gives a speech about what had been happening at Wounded Knee.

[Sacheen Littlefeather]

Hello, my name is Sacheen Littlefeather. I'm Apache. And I am president of the National Native American Affirmative Image Committee. I'm representing Marlon Brando this evening, and he has asked me to take tell you in a very long speech which I cannot share with you presently because of time, but I will be glad to share with the press afterwards that he very regretfully cannot accept this very generous award. And the reasons for this being are the treatment of American Indians today by the film industry. Excuse me. And on television in movie reruns and also with recent happenings at Wounded Knee. I beg at this time that I have not intruded upon this evening and that we will in the future, our hearts and our understandings will meet with love and generosity. Thank you on behalf of Marlon Brando.

[Nathan King]

It's fair to say that everyone was stunned by Sasheen Littlefeather's speech. Another surprise was to come shortly thereafter in the form of the Best Picture.

[Mark Seal]

Award and the winner.

[Odoo Representative]

And the winner. Albert S. Ruddy.

[Robert Evans]

Godfather.

[Mark Seal]

Let me do this quickly in two parts because I know it's past midnight in New York and some of my relatives want to go to sleep. There are a number of people I would like to thank, as everyone else would, because they deserve it. Bob Evans for giving more than any studio head should in time and creativity. Frank Yablanz for having the courage and imagination to sell his film and make my mother rich. Charlie Bludhorn for having the courage to finance films which I guess borders on insanity. And Peter Bart, who was a friend all the way through.

[Lisa Vanderpump]

Hello, darlings. Pack your suitcase. For a new season of the Hulu original reality series Vanderpump Villa.

[Stassi Schroeder]

Let's do this. Ciao. It's Stassi. Of course. Lisa brought in her favorite to be resident chaperone of the castle.

[Mark Seal]

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[Lisa Vanderpump]

She's my eyes and ears.

[Stassi Schroeder]

I love this.

[Lisa Vanderpump]

Get ready for the luxury and drama that awaits us in Italy.

[Mark Seal]

Cheers to all the toxic couples in the castle.

[Lisa Vanderpump]

Season 2 of Vanderpump Villa premieres April.

[Stassi Schroeder]

24, streaming on Hulu.

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[Mark Seal]

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[Nathan King]

Connect with [e-mail] let's talk about legacy. The film sort of eclipses the careers of most of the people who made it.

[Mark Seal]

Yeah, it's like every person who touched the movie has this asterisk next to their name that says the Godfather.

[Nathan King]

Well, let's start with the obvious. Francis Ford Coppola. Despite the success of the first movie, Coppola was so scarred that he didn't want to make a sequel. But then Charlie Bludorn talked him into it.

[Mark Seal]

Yes, the story goes that Coppola initially didn't want to do it, but then Hurricane Charlie erupted. Francis, you've got the recipe for Coca Cola and you don't want to manufacture any more bottles of Coke. And whatever happened, Coppola ended up signing for Godfather 2. And after that, Godfather 3. And of course, Charlie Bludorn wanted to make Godfather 4, 5 and 6 as well.

[Nathan King]

This movie changed Coppola's life.

[Mark Seal]

Well, for better and for worse, but mostly for better. You know, time heals all wounds. And recently Coppola told Rolling Stone that he saw the Godfather as a gift. He said the movie opened up the world to me. Some of the greatest people in the world have wanted to talk to me simply because I was the guy who made that film.

[Nathan King]

What about Mario Puzo? What happens to him afterwards?

[Mark Seal]

Well, Mario Puzo became a superstar screenwriter. He became rich, he became famous. He could gamble all he wanted. I love what his son told me via email. He told me now that he had money, look out. He would buy books instead of taking them out of the library. He rented a house in Malibu. You know, he would eat whatever he wanted. He would gamble whenever he wanted. I think he still loved the good life of Hollywood and, of course, Las Vegas. He wrote a book about Las Vegas that was sort of a love letter to the city and what it meant to him. And in addition to writing many more novels, he wrote the screenplay to Superman. So he maintained his Hollywood ties.

[Nathan King]

Another person who went on to have an amazing career, Robert Towne.

[Mark Seal]

Yes, Robert Towne became the dean of Hollywood screenwriters. He wrote Chinatown and so many other movies that became classics.

[Nathan King]

And he wasn't famous when Coppola brought him in, but he had certainly worked on other projects. He had done Bonnie and Clyde and McCabe and Mrs. Miller, and then the Godfather was probably his first big project.

[Mark Seal]

Yeah. And I love the story of how he came up with that incredible scene, the succession scene. It was late in the night in New York, and Coppola was going to pick him up the next morning to take him to the set. And he was looking at the COVID of Mario Puzo's novel, you know, with the invisible puppeteer holding the strings, you know, with those strings dangling down. And he said it was like at 4 in the morning, the line came to him. And it was just this incredible line that would sum up so much. And it became one of the most classic scenes in the movie.

[Nathan King]

Listen to this list of movies he went on to write after that. The Last Detail, Parallax, View, Chinatown, Shampoo, the Missouri Breaks, Days of Thunder, the Firm, Mission Impossible 1 and 2.

[Mark Seal]

Yeah, pretty incredible list. Robert Towne once said that he was not really interested in writing novels, that he just wanted to write movies and listen to that list of movies that he wrote. I mean, he's one of the greatest screenwriters in Hollywood history.

[Nathan King]

What was Charlie Bludorn's legacy like at Paramount?

[Mark Seal]

Charlie Bludhorn saved the studio in the end with the Godfather and other movies later. But sadly, Charlie passed away at a fairly young age. He lived in the Dominican Republic, where he built this amazing resort, but he died on a. They say on a plane coming home. So he missed out on seeing so much. And I would have loved to have obviously spoken with him, but he's remembered by everyone whose path he crossed.

[Nathan King]

What about Al Ruddy? What happens to him afterwards?

[Mark Seal]

So Al Ruddy remained vital until the end. He produced both the Godfather And Million Dollar Baby, winning Best Picture Oscars for both. And he died at 94 years old last May. And about two weeks before he passed away, I spoke to him again. He was the same Al Ruddy as always, you know, talking a mile a minute. His memory was sharp, and he was really excited about this podcast and wanted to do whatever he could to help, which is typical. Al, the quintessential producer, the man who gets things done.

[Robert Evans]

When we came back from Sicily, I went through New York, and they said they wanted to do a sequel. And I told SIS straight out, I said, I have no interest. Listen to me. No interest in ever doing a movie again. But this mob, I, I, I got lucky. I got out. I've been happy. I'm in one piece. I can never get more out of it.

[Nathan King]

And regardless of the fact that he didn't work on subsequent Godfather movies, he clearly cared about the movie's legacy a lot because he worked on the offer.

[Mark Seal]

Yeah, the offer was really molded around his life. It was his story. Miles Teller played Al Ruddy. You know, he was the central character.

[Nathan King]

You didn't get a chance to interview Brando because he was dead by the time you started working on this. But if you could have, what would you have asked him?

[Mark Seal]

I would have loved to have known, in his own words, about how he made the transformation into Don Corleone. But Alice was able to tell me a lot. And also she was able to tell me his reluctance to play a mobster. He didn't want to do it at first, and he only wanted to do it when he heard that they were thinking about Laurence Libya. And he goes, he can't play a Mafia don. And Alice said she looked in and he was like using shoe polish to create a mustache and dye his eyebrows. And she goes, no, that's not right. Do it like Brando. But I would have liked to have asked him about that.

[Nathan King]

Let's move on to Evans. So you spoke with Evans in 2008, which is 11 years before his death. What were his reflections on the film and his legacy?

[Mark Seal]

He said it was his greatest legacy, but it was also a failure for him personally in many ways, because he chose the Godfather over his personal life. And that was slipping away from him that day in Woodland. I'll never forget the line that he said. He said, it's so long ago. So many people are dead. And he proceeded to rattle off everyone who had died in the interim, which at that point was already quite long. Richard Castellano, Marlon Brando, John Casal, and so forth. And so he had some regrets for sure, but at the same time, he was really proud of the movie and all that the movie had achieved. As I wrote in the book, he felt that he had fostered it, and much of its success was due to him, which, you know, as the head of the studio, he had the right to believe.

[Nathan King]

If the filming process was rough for Robert Evans, it got even rougher after the Godfather came out, didn't it, Mark?

[Mark Seal]

Well, at first it went all right. He produced Chinatown, starring his close friend Jack Nicholson. But not long after that, he left Paramount to become an independent producer. And that's when he started to struggle a little bit. As I wrote in the book, he descended into darkness for a period. There was a misdemeanor cocaine trafficking plea in 1980, the box office disaster of the Cotton Club in 1984, his entanglement in a murder scandal stemming from the film, and the eight torturous years it would take him to clear his name. Also, I thought it was interesting. His wealth, which is pretty much always the ultimate measure of success or failure in Hollywood, dropped from 11 million in 1979 to $37 a decade later. He had to sell his beloved home, Woodland, and he was only able to buy it back with the help of Jack Nicholson. The house of a Hollywood producer is always very important, but for Robert Evans, this was beyond anything. He had so many memories there, and it was a privilege to be able to interview him in that storied place, which is where he lived until his death in 2019.

[Nathan King]

Okay, so, Mark, let's end this on a happy note. We know that Evans and Coppola eventually made up, or supposedly made up at the 25th anniversary of the film. Let's hear Evans recollection of that evening in San Francisco five years ago.

[Robert Evans]

Evan, was the 25th anniversary of was in San Francisco. Francis walked in there. He's king of San Francisco. As he walked down the aisle, I took his sister Talia to the affair. He came over to me. He put his arms around me and kissed me and said, we must have done something right.

[Mark Seal]

Oh, that's good.

[Robert Evans]

That's a good line.

[Mark Seal]

Yeah, that's right.

[Robert Evans]

Must have done something right. And kissed me, then walked on.

[Mark Seal]

And Evans was really proud of that.

[Robert Evans]

It's my most important legacy in life, this.

[Mark Seal]

The Godfather is number one.

[Robert Evans]

It broke a whole barrier. A film, opera. It is new filmmakers, great ideas, and fighting the organization. And I love fighting the organization.

[Mark Seal]

What organization were you fighting?

[Robert Evans]

Paramount. The two of them? Yeah. The other one was what the other One was the boys. But they're all the same. Well, they're all. Everything is monetarily focused and I was looking to touch magic. Magic, to me, lasts longer. Why is it that Mozart is remembered far longer than Napoleon? The world of art is remembered far longer than the world of gre.

[Mark Seal]

Leave the Gun, Take the Cannoli is a production of Airmail and iHeartMedia.

[Nathan King]

The podcast is based on the book of the same name written by our very own Mark Seal. Our producer is Tina Mullen, research assistants by Jack Sullivan.

[Mark Seal]

Jonathan Dressler was our development producer.

[Nathan King]

Our music supervisor is Randall Poster. Our executive producers are me, Nathan King, Mark Seal, Dylan Fagan, and Graydon Carter.

[Mark Seal]

Special thanks to Bridget Arceneaux and everyone at CDM Studios.

[Nathan King]

A comprehensive list of sources and acknowledgments can be found in Mark Seale's book, Leave the Gun, Take the Cannoli, published by Gallery Books, an imprint of Simon and Schuster.

[Stassi Schroeder]

The best moments happen when you're with your people, laughing, vibing and just enjoying life. Coke is making those moments even sweeter. Share a Coke is back and it's all about sharing with the whole crew. Doesn't matter if it's your bestie or bro, there's a can with their name on it. So grab one for the squad and make some memories. But hurry, because these Coca Cola limited edition bottles and cans won't be here forever. Don't miss your chance to share a Coke with all your favorite people.

[Cindy Crawford]

A mother's love deserves a gift like no other. Celebrate her love, strength and style with heartfelt jewelry from Pandora. From iconic charms to sparkling necklaces, rings, earrings and more, there are so many ways to say thank you, Mom. So on Mother's Day and every day, tell her how much she means to you with a gift from Pandora. Visit Pandora in store or [e-mail] hello, darlings.

[Lisa Vanderpump]

Pack your suitcase for a new season of the Hulu original reality series Vanderpump Villa.

[Stassi Schroeder]

Let's do this. Ciao. It's Stassi. Of course. Lisa brought in her favorite to be resident chaperone of the castle.

[Mark Seal]

Stassi is an icon.

[Lisa Vanderpump]

She's my eyes and ears.

[Stassi Schroeder]

I love this.

[Lisa Vanderpump]

Get ready for the luxury and drama that awaits us in Italy.

[Mark Seal]

Cheers to all the toxic couples in the castle.

[Lisa Vanderpump]

Season 2 of Vanderpump Villa premieres April.

[Stassi Schroeder]

24, streaming on Hulu.

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