Trump Meets His Fate on LA Troops in Federal Court

Summary

Summary of "Trump Meets His Fate on LA Troops in Federal Court" Episode of Legal AF by MeidasTouch

Podcast Information:

• Title: Legal AF by MeidasTouch
• Host(s): Ben Meiselas, Michael Popok, Karen Friedman Agnifilo
• Description: Legal AF delves into the week's most significant developments at the crossroads of law and politics, offering hard-hitting analysis and thoughtful discussions. This episode, titled "Trump Meets His Fate on LA Troops in Federal Court," released on June 17, 2025, examines the legal challenges surrounding former President Donald Trump's attempts to mobilize National Guard troops in California.

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Introduction

The episode opens with a series of advertisements before transitioning to the main legal discussion. Michael Popok, the national trial lawyer strategist, spearheads the analysis of a high-profile case involving Donald Trump and his attempt to federalize the National Guard in California. The focus is on understanding the legal ramifications and the potential outcomes of the ongoing federal court proceedings.

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Background of the Case

Lower Court Rulings

• Initial Ruling: On the previous Friday, Judge Breyer of the San Francisco Federal Court issued a temporary restraining order (TRO) against the Trump administration. The ruling found that Donald Trump had engaged in illegal activities by violating the 1903 Militia Act and the 10th Amendment of the U.S. Constitution.

• Violations Highlighted:

  • Sovereignty of California: The administration did not seek consent from California’s governor before attempting to federalize the National Guard.
  • Separation of Powers: The act was seen as an overreach of executive authority, infringing upon state sovereignty.

Appeal to the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals

• Panel Composition: The appeal is being heard by a three-judge panel consisting of Judges Miller, Bennett, and Sung.
• Presiding Judge: Judge Bennett, a Trump appointee and former Attorney General of Hawaii, is noted for his pragmatic and moderate stance.

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Oral Arguments at the Ninth Circuit

Key Points Discussed

• Jurisdictional Questions: A significant portion of the oral arguments centered on whether the Ninth Circuit has the authority to review the TRO issued by Judge Breyer. Michael Popok critiques that the panel overlooked fundamental jurisdictional issues, which he believes should have been the primary focus.

• Trump Administration's Position:

  • Rebellion Claim: The administration characterized Trump's actions as a rebellion, asserting his inability to execute federal laws without federalizing the National Guard.
  • Political Question Doctrine: They argued that this case presents non-justiciable, political questions beyond the court’s purview.

• Opposition's Argument:

  • Legality of Actions: California’s representatives contended that Trump’s actions were unlawful and violated state sovereignty.
  • Executive Overreach: Emphasis was placed on maintaining the balance of power and preventing executive overreach.

Notable Discourse

• Judge Bennett’s Leadership: Michael Popok notes that Judge Bennett steered the questioning in a manner unfavorable to the Trump administration. At [08:25], he states:

  "Judge Bennett led things is not good for the Trump administration... we can review the decision of a president as a judge at the Judiciary branch."

• Potential Directions for the Court:

  • Remand for Further Evidence: The panel may direct the lower court to develop a more comprehensive record.
  • Stay of Temporary Restraining Order: They could uphold the TRO while awaiting the preliminary injunction hearing scheduled for Friday.
  • Jurisdiction Affirmation: Alternatively, the court might affirm its jurisdiction to hear the case fully.

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Judges’ Perspectives

• Judge Bennett: Identified as a pragmatic and moderate figure, his approach during the hearing suggested skepticism toward the Trump administration’s claims.

• Judge Miller and Judge Sung:

  • Judge Miller: Described as a federalist and former Scalia clerk, indicating a conservative leaning.
  • Judge Sung: A Biden appointee and the newest member of the panel, her questioning was comparatively reserved.

Michael Popok anticipates that the panel may either require more substantial evidence before making a definitive ruling or side with the lower court's jurisdictional stance, potentially curbing Trump's efforts to federalize the National Guard without due process.

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Potential Outcomes

Likely Scenarios

1. Affirmation of Jurisdiction: The Ninth Circuit could affirm its authority to review the TRO, thereby allowing the case to proceed.
2. Remand for Further Proceedings: The court might send the case back to Judge Breyer for a more detailed examination of evidence and legal arguments.
3. Combination of Orders: A nuanced approach where the TRO remains in place pending the outcome of the preliminary injunction hearing on Friday.

Michael Popok’s Prognosis

At [08:25], Popok offers his expectations:

"They're going to find that this decision by Trump to declare the federalization to commandeer the National Guard, they're going to find that they have the just. They have the power and the jurisdiction to, to provide oversight over that, to make a decision about that."

He suggests that the Ninth Circuit is likely to uphold the lower court's jurisdictional challenges to Trump's actions, signaling a potential loss for Trump in this legal battle.

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Conclusion

The episode provides a comprehensive analysis of the ongoing legal confrontation between Donald Trump and California’s state government over the federalization of the National Guard. With the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals poised to make a significant ruling, the legal community and political observers are keenly awaiting the outcome, which will have profound implications for the balance of federal and state powers.

Michael Popok emphasizes the importance of the upcoming preliminary injunction hearing and anticipates a ruling that may limit Trump's ability to unilaterally mobilize federal troops without adhering to legal protocols and respecting state sovereignty.

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Additional Resources

Listeners are encouraged to subscribe to the Legal AF Substack for in-depth court filings, oral arguments, and daily legal analyses. Exclusive content and ad-free versions of the podcast are available to subscribers.

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Note: This summary excludes advertisements and non-content segments to focus on the substantive legal discussions presented in the episode.

Transcript

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[Legal Analyst]

Well, will they or won't they? Three judge panel Basically remote herd oral argument today about whether Donald Trump can take over the National Guard in California on a scant or non existent record of rebellion or that he has to not prove in his view that he has difficulty executing the laws in California without doing so. Is is that three judge panel who heard an hour and a half or so of oral argument going to rule that Donald Trump and his actions under the 1903 Militia act can't be reviewed by a federal court? Or are they going to side with just Judge Breyer, the trial court level judge who has another hearing on Friday in ratcheting up the temporary restraining order up to, up to preliminary injunction? Are they going to side with him and find that they don't have jurisdiction to hear the hearing? They want to know what happens on Friday instead, which is the right thing to do. I would have stopped the hearing in the very beginning and said we don't have jurisdiction and focus on jurisdiction instead. The hearing was marked by sharp questioning of both sides. Many questions being asked by the the presiding judge, Judge Bennett, who is a Trump appointee but was the attorney general in Hawaii and is generally considered to be a pragmatist and a moderate. But what will happen? We'll know very, very soon. But I'm going to give you my overview of hearing the questions and the questioning and the briefing at the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals. Let's get into it here on Legal AF and on the Midas Touch Network. First, let's do the what and the why. Where were we? Why were we the last Friday, Judge Breyer, lower court, federal judge, San Francisco, granted a temporary restraining order against the Trump administration, finding that Donald Trump committed an illegal act, violated the 1903 militia act and violated the 10th amendment of the Constitution because he did not respect the sovereignty of California, did not go through the governor, did not consult with the governor, had no intention of consulting with the governor. The main argument by the governor, government below, as it was at the 9th Circuit judge, you can't review this. This is unreviewable political question doctrine stuff. President says it's a rebellion, it's a rebellion. President says he can't execute the laws. He can't execute the laws and you can't do a darn thing about it. That's their primary argument that got up, that got up to the ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, three judge panel, Judge Miller, Judge Bennett, Judge Sung, Trump, Trump, Biden with Bennett as the presiding judge because he's got senior status. It was done remotely. You had a guy named Shumate representing the Department of Justice and Sam harbor representing California. And the questioning ignored the fundamental jurisdictional question that I believe should have been their first discussion point. Why are we here? Appellate courts don't generally have jurisdiction over temporary restraining orders. Why are we here now? The issue is whether the stay that they granted administratively should stay in place for the duration of the appeal on the temporary restraining order. The problem with the Trump administration side is there's another hearing going on scheduled for Friday that's not going to be stopped. The court is cognizant because Judge Bennett said it at the end of the hearing that there's a a preliminary injunction hearing on Friday. They could put an end to it. They could kill it with a ruling that says either we have jurisdiction, but we don't think the court gave enough deference to the executive branch and violated separation of powers as a result. That's one argument. They could say we don't have jurisdiction at all and say we'll see you after the preliminary injunction hearing. Isn't that a better use of scarce judicial assets and resources? They could say that. Or they could side with the Trump administration and say, yeah, both the temporary restraining order and the upcoming preliminary injunction hearing. We're going to combine. We're going to wait to see what happens on Friday. We're going to do a stay of the entire thing and we'll see everybody in 3, 6, 9, 12 months this.

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[Legal Analyst]

To exactly tell by the questioning, because even though there was sharp questioning, I thought the way that Bennett led things is not good for the Trump administration. He said, let's assume that the government has to put on sufficient evidence to establish a rebellion is going on, a failure of the government, federal government, to be able to execute its laws without the National Guard being federalized, and that we can review the decision of a president as a judge at the Judiciary branch. Let's assume that what was the evidence that was developed below? They may be questioning the evidentiary hearing or lack of evidentiary hearing by Judge Breyer that Judge Breyer needs with direction now for the Ninth Circuit, with instructions, they will remand it to him to develop a proper record. They'll say it is justiciable, meaning judges can review it, but we don't have a compelling record in front of us. Complete the record, do it on preliminary injunction, and let's all come back here and talk about it again on another hearing when the preliminary injunction is granted. But we want to see a bigger and better hearing and record being developed. That could be the way that they compromise. So they send it back to Breyer to develop further evidence to support the record and then make a decision. But here's my takeaway. They're going to find that this decision by Trump to declare the federalization to commandeer the National Guard, they're going to find that they have the just. They have the power and the jurisdiction to, to provide oversight over that, to make a decision about that. That's one Trump will lose on that argument. Secondly, they may find that the record is not properly developed, and they may want Judge Breyer to develop it more properly, both here and in his Friday hearing. And they may give directions. That's why I think they mentioned the Friday hearing, because this is a relatively narrow issue up on appeal, because Trump made it a narrow issue. The narrow issue is whether there should be a stay of the temporary restraining order for the duration to allow for the appeal. But. But there's a preliminary injunction that's going to be held on Friday hearing. I think they give direction for that hearing. I think they combine the two of them. They continue to stay for now, meaning Trump is in charge of federal troops continued in California, and they round this whole thing back up for another hearing in a week or two in front of the same panel. Judge Sung was relatively quiet during the questioning. She's the Biden appointee. She's the newest person on the bench. Judge Miller is a federalist, is a Scalia clerk. But, you know, we can't tell from his exact questioning where it lies, but I assure you that sometime between now and Thursday, within a day we're going to get a ruling for the Ninth Circuit, and I'll be able to report on it right here with the understanding that I believe that Friday's hearing will still go on. If it doesn't, I'll report to you, of course, what the accurate results were. I'm trying now hard to give you my my expectations as somebody that's argued before the Ninth Circuit. So until my next report, I'm Michael Popach. Can't get your fill of Legal af. Me neither. That's why we formed the Legal AF Substack. Every time we mention something in a hot take, whether it's a court filing or a oral argument, come over to the substack. You'll find the court filing and the oral argument there, including a daily roundup that I do called Wait for it Morning af. What else? All the other contributors from Legal a for there as well. We got some new reporting, we got interviews, we got ad free versions of the podcast and hot takes where legal aforementioned on substack. Come over now to free subscribe.

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