Trump Official Stunned as Judge Readies Criminal Referral

Summary

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Legal AF by MeidasTouch

Episode Title: Trump Official Stunned as Judge Readies Criminal Referral
Date: December 9, 2025
Host: Michael Popok (with references to colleagues and legal figures)

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Overview of Episode Theme

This episode provides a deep dive into breaking legal developments surrounding criminal contempt allegations against members of the Trump administration, particularly relating to the deportation of 200 Venezuelans to El Salvador. The discussion centers on federal Judge Boasberg’s ongoing inquiry into whether Kristi Noem and other Trump officials willfully violated a court order. Michael Popok breaks down legal maneuvers, key players, and witness testimony that may lead to criminal referrals.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Background of the Case (“JGG” Case)

• The episode focuses on a high-stakes legal dispute involving the Trump administration’s deportation of 200 Venezuelans to El Salvador’s infamous Sikot Prison, despite an emergency restraining order.
• The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) and other advocacy groups successfully halted the deportation in court on March 15, but officials allegedly disregarded Judge Boasberg’s order.

2. Judge Boasberg’s Order and Contempt Concerns

• Judge Boasberg, Chief Judge of the D.C. Federal Trial Court, is advancing toward a determination of criminal contempt due to the disregard of his order to “ground the planes.”
• Michael Popok explains:
  • “He’s already determined that there’s probable cause… that there was criminal contempt that was committed by the Trump administration. Now he knows it’s Kristi Noem because they filed an admission just a few days ago in which they threw Kristi Noem under the bus…” (03:21)

3. Kristi Noem’s Role and Affidavit

• Kristi Noem, implicated as the official giving the “code red” to proceed with deportations, submitted a two-paragraph affidavit defending her actions.
• Popok:
  • “She submitted this ridiculous two paragraph affidavit under oath in which she said…my lawyers told me and I didn’t know and I gave the order—like, no, that’s not going to do it, Christie.” (03:56)
• Judge Boasberg found the affidavit and other declarations insufficient to determine if contempt was willful.

4. Emergence of Key Witnesses

• Judge Boasberg is now calling for live testimony from pivotal figures:
  • Erez Reuveni: Former DOJ lawyer turned whistleblower, now at Democracy Forward
  • Drew Ensign: DOJ attorney who advised Noem and is accused of misleading the court

5. Bombshell Whistleblower Revelations

• Erez Reuveni’s whistleblower complaint outlines DOJ leadership, under Emil Bove (now a judge), encouraging lawyers to ignore court orders during the Trump administration.
• Memorable recounting of the key meeting:
  • Reuveni: “And we were told at this meeting that over the weekend, the president of the United States would be signing a proclamation invoking… the Alien Enemies Act. This is a wartime law from 1798… Trump used it against more than 100 Venezuelans that the government said were terrorists. They were to be denied their right to be heard by a judge.” (06:07–06:53)
  • On Bove’s direction: “Bove emphasized those planes need to take off no matter what. And then after a pause, he also told all in attendance and if some court should issue an order preventing that, we may have to consider telling that court ‘you.’” (06:53–07:13)
  • Reuveni reaction: “What felt like a bomb had gone off. Here is the number three official using expletives to tell career attorneys that we may just have to consider disregarding federal court orders.” (07:15–07:27)

6. Emil Bove’s Non-Denial

• Bove, now a judge, claimed a lack of recollection when questioned by Congress—raising eyebrows about his conduct:
  • “I have no recollection of saying anything of that kind. To the extent I usually don’t… I did not suggest that there would be any need to consider ignoring court orders… Did you suggest telling the courts you in any manner? I don’t recall. You just don’t remember that.” (08:00–09:13)

7. Next Steps: Live Court Testimony

• Judge Boasberg orders Erez Reuveni and Drew Ensign to testify live:
  • “Erez Reuveni, come on down. December 15, 2025, at 9:30 a.m. you’re giving testimony in live court.” (12:17)
  • The government must produce Drew Ensign for testimony the following day.
  • The judge plans to directly question witnesses, then allow the ACLU and DOJ to cross-examine.

8. Potential Outcomes

• The episode outlines the real potential for criminal referrals and prosecution of Trump officials, including Kristi Noem.
• Popok’s closing note:
  • “This is going to be a s**t show of epic proportion against the Trump administration who have been effing with Judge Boasberg for too long and now they’re going to find out because somebody may be going to jail and her name may be Kristi Noem.” (13:29)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On contempt of court:
  “That, ladies and gentlemen, is a classic example of contempt of a court order—that’s called contumacious conduct.” (Popok, 02:50)

• On the inadequacy of Kristi Noem’s defense:
  “No, that’s not going to do it, Christie.” (Popok, 03:58)

• On Bove’s infamous instruction:
  “‘If some court should issue an order preventing that, we may have to consider telling that court you.’” (Reuveni quoting Bove, 07:14)

• On judicial skepticism:
  “I have no recollection of saying anything of that kind… Did you suggest telling the courts you in any manner? I don’t recall.” (Bove testimony, 08:00–09:13)

• On the coming showdown:
  “This is going to be a s—show of epic proportion against the Trump administration…” (Popok, 13:29)

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Important Timestamps

• 01:21 – Popok introduces the case against the Trump administration regarding the deported Venezuelans.
• 03:21 – Judge Boasberg’s determination of probable cause and demanding Noem’s affidavit.
• 05:33–07:27 – Interview segments with whistleblower Erez Reuveni describing DOJ pressures.
• 08:00–09:13 – Congressional grilling of Emil Bove over his comments to DOJ lawyers.
• 12:17 – Judge Boasberg orders live testimony from Erez Reuveni and Drew Ensign.
• 13:29 – Popok predicts major ramifications and possible jail time for Kristi Noem.

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Episode Flow & Tone

Michael Popok adopts an energetic, no-nonsense legal analysis style, mixing legal detail with clarity and occasional dry humor (“No, that’s not going to do it, Christie”). He scathingly critiques the Trump administration’s conduct, highlights the seriousness of the court’s intention, and keeps listeners engaged with vivid analogies (“like Keyser Soze”). The episode is fast-paced, urgent, and rich with primary-source testimony and insider legal perspectives.

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Conclusion

The episode is a must-listen for those tracking high-level legal accountability for officials from the Trump administration. It provides exclusive insights into witness strategies, judicial attitudes, and the real possibility of criminal referrals. The forthcoming live testimony promises more explosive revelations, which Legal AF will cover in future episodes.

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Transcript

[Michael Popak]

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Visit sofi.com stunt to learn more loans originated by Sofi Bank NA member FDIC 2 terms and conditions apply. NMLS 696891 in a case involving 200 Venezuelans sent to El Salvador without due process by the Trump administration on an order by Kristi Noem. Are we one step closer to Kristi Noem being sent to prison or for criminal prosecution by a federal judge? Well, I have a new order of Chief Judge Boasberg and where he posits that while he doesn't currently have enough information at his disposal to determine whether Kristi Noem willfully violated his court order to turn the planes back around and not fly to El Salvador, he's going to do some more fact finding and at the present time a referral for prosecution would be not out of the question would be premature.

When does premature become mature? That's what I want you to know here on Midas Dutch Network and legal af. I'm Michael Popak. This all arises out of a case we Refer to as JGG has to do with 200 Venezuelans who were originally shipped without due process to El Salvador Sikot Prison to get them away in the middle of the night from federal jurisdiction. It was stopped by the American Civil Liberties Union and other groups who ran into court and got Judge Boasberg in an afternoon hearing on 15th March to ground the planes. And he told Drew Ensign, the lawyer for the Department of Justice to ground those planes, tear down those runways. Except Drew Ensign either didn't care or the Department of Justice clearly didn't care or Homeland Security because the planes kept flying. And that, ladies and gentlemen, is a classic example of contempt of a court order that's called contumacious conduct. Now for the last five or six months, the case was stuck in appeals world. It's now unstuck. And the.

Boasberg chief Judge of the D.C. federal Trial Court is moving forward with his determination. If he's already determined that there's probable cause, probable cause that there was criminal contempt that was committed by the Trump administration, now he knows it's Kristi Noem because they filed an admission just a few days ago in which they threw Kristi Noem under the bus because the judge said, who, who made the decision? Who gave the code red? They said it was Santiago. No, it was Kristi Noem. And so he said, fine, submit an affidavit from Kristi Noem about why she made that decision. A couple days ago she submitted this ridiculous two paragraph affidavit under oath in which she said there was a hearing. They told me about the hearing, but they told me about it in the night. And then my lawyers told me and I didn't know and I gave the order like, no, that's not going to do it, Christie. And when I saw those declarations from her from Todd Blanche, from Joe, Joe Mazzara, who's the general counsel for Homeland Security, I had my first reaction and I did a hot take on it was, oh, there is going, they're just told off. The judge told to go F off. And as a result he is now going to have to have a fuller hearing or more fulsome hearing as we like to say. So he said out loud, I want to speak to Erez Reveni. Erez Reveni. To continue my movie buff pop culture references is sort of like Keyser Sozy, if you know what I'm talking about, with.

The usual suspects. Erez Raveni was a lawyer for the Department of Justice who got fired for telling the truth. And he prepared and provided to Congress a 30 page whistleblower statement in which he said that Amel Bovey, who is now on the Third Circuit Court of Appeals, being hidden there by Donald Trump when he was the acting number three in the Department of Justice, gave the command to the litigation, immigration litigation, lawyers for the Department of Justice to dare to tell judges to f off. In fact, in case you forgot, Erez Raveni, here's errors on 60 Minutes.

[Interviewer]

At the beginning of the second Trump administration, you were promoted again.

[Erez Reuveni]

That's right. Very soon into the administration, I was selected to be the acting deputy director of the Immigration section, overseeing about 100 attorneys and every case that arose in the federal district courts.

[Interviewer]

But it was the very day of that promotion, Friday, March 14, that he and others were called to a fateful meeting with Emil Bovey, President Trump's newly appointed number three, at the Justice Department, who was once Trump's criminal defense attorney.

[Erez Reuveni]

And we were told at this meeting that over the weekend, the president of the United States would be signing a proclamation invoking something called the Alien Enemies Act. This is a wartime law from 1798, invoked three times in the nation's history during the War of 1812, World War I and World War II.

[Interviewer]

The Alien Enemies act allows rapid expulsion from the U.S. of the citizens of enemy nations during a war, but without a declared war. Trump used it against more than 100 Venezuelans that the government said were terrorists. They were to be denied their right to be heard by a judge. Rainy says Bovi expected a challenge.

[Erez Reuveni]

Bovie emphasized those planes need to take off no matter what. And then after a pause, he also told all in attendance and if some court should issue an order preventing that, we may have to consider telling that court you.

[Interviewer]

And when you heard that, you thought.

[Erez Reuveni]

What felt like a bomb had gone off. Here is the number three official using expletives to tell career attorneys that we may just have to consider disregarding federal court orders.

[Michael Popak]

And here's Emil Bovey, who's trying to get the job as a 3rd Circuit Court of Appeals judge, denying that he gave that statement, although curiously, basically saying he can't recall exactly at that moment. Like he's used the F word on numerous occasions before. Here's his back and forth with Adam Schiff. Play the clip.

[Interviewer]

In the complaint, it says Beauvais stated that DOJ would need to consider telling the courts fuck you and ignoring any such court order. Did you say anything of that kind in the meeting.

Senator, I have no recollection of saying anything of that kind. To the extent I usually don't. You recall, Mr. Bovet, if you said or suggested during a meeting with Justice Department lawyers that maybe they should consider telling the court fuck you, it seems to me that would be something you'd remember. Unless that's the kind of thing you say frequently. Well, I've certainly said things encouraging litigators at the department to fight hard for valid positions that we have to take and defend. And if you frequently suggested that they say fuck you and ignore court orders, is that also something you frequently do, such you might not remember doing it in this occasion? No. And as I explained, I have never. So did you or did you not make those comments during that meeting?

Which comment, Senator? You really need me to repeat it? Did you suggest, as Mr. Rouveni wrote, that DOJ would need to consider telling the courts fuck you and ignore any such court order? I did not suggest that there would be any need to consider ignoring court orders. At the point of that meeting, there were no court orders to discuss. Well, did you suggest telling the courts you in any manner? I don't recall. You just don't remember that.

[Michael Popak]

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Which is up on substack for legal AF as well. In response to the court's order of November 28, the government has submitted cursory declarations. That's not a good thing. From Secretary Kristi Noem and the attorneys then at the Department of Justice who advised her about her making the decision to continue the transfer of custody after their temporary restraining order was issued by the judge. As this declaration does not provide enough information for the court to determine whether her decision was a willful violation of the court's order, the court cannot at this juncture find probable cause that her actions constitute a criminal contempt. So a referral for prosecution would be premature. But the court believes that it's necessary to hear witness testimony to better understand the bases of the decision. So he's ordered. Erez Reuveni, come on down. December 15, 2025, at 9:30am you're given testimony in live court.

It says plaintiff shall attempt to secure the presence of Erez Revenue for testimony. It's not going to be hard. They'll serve a subpoena. Erez Revenue used to work in the Department of Justice. He now works a democracy forward. I don't think the ACLU is going to have problem problems getting the democracy forward to cooperate and bring Erez Roveni in. The government shall produce true Ensign on the following day. Oh League alert from the ACLU is going to have a field day cross examining his counterpart at the Department of Justice along with Judge Boasberg. It says both sides shall appear in person and will have the opportunity to. To question witnesses. See, the judge plans to do his own inquiry. Yeah. Then he's going to turn it over to the ACLU and the Department of Justice. Yeah. This is going to be a s show of epic proportion against the Trump administration who have been effing with Judge Boasberg for too long and now they're going to find out because somebody may be going to jail and her name may be Kristi Noemi. We will follow it all as we always do on Midas Touch without blowing smoke or sunshine. Hit the subscribe button on legal AF YouTube. Not just the podcast, the YouTube where, oh, we're achingly close to 1 million subscribers to get us ready for 2026, the midterms and beyond. Be a part of it. Find out if you may have forgotten who could remember yesterday, today what I had for breakfast. Go see. If you if you're a subscriber, it's all for free. If not, hit that subscribe button. Come join us on Legal AF Substack as well. So until my next report, probably to update you on this matter, I'm Michael Popak. Can't get your fill of Legal af? Me neither. That's why we formed the Legal AF Substack. Every time we mention something in a hot take, whether it's a court filing or a oral argument, come over to the substack. You'll find the court filing and the oral argument there, including a daily roundup that I do called Wait for It Morning af. What else? All the other contributors from Legal AO are there as well. We got some new reporting, we got interviews, we got ad free versions of the podcast and hot takes where Legal AF on Substack. Come over now to free subscribe.

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