Trump Trapped at SCOTUS as Appeal Backfires

Summary

Legal AF: "Trump Trapped at SCOTUS as Appeal Backfires"

Date: November 10, 2025
Host: Michael Popok (MeidasTouch Network)
Guests/Panelists: Ben Meiselas, Karen Friedman Agnifilo (briefly mentioned)

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Episode Overview

This episode unpacks a whirlwind of legal maneuvers surrounding SNAP payments (Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program) to low-income Americans, as the Trump administration attempts to halt billions in food aid during a government shutdown. Michael Popok masterfully breaks down a sequence of court rulings, highlights Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson’s clever legal strategy, and explains how the Trump team’s Supreme Court appeal appears to have backfired both politically and legally. The discussion is urgent, rich in legal insight, and peppered with real-time updates.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Battle Over SNAP Payments

[00:43]

• Roughly 1 in 8 Americans (about 42 million people) depend on SNAP every month.
• Amid the ongoing government shutdown, the Trump administration tries to withhold $3 billion in November SNAP payments after partially paying $5 billion.
• Recent district and circuit court rulings require the administration to pay the full $8 billion due to recipients.

2. Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson’s Tactical Move

[01:40]

• Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson, acting for the Supreme Court, grants a brief 48-hour stay—a move criticized by some, but described by Popok as "supremely smart and crafty."
• Her short stay ensures that if Trump loses at the First Circuit (which Popok predicted and was later confirmed), he’ll have to appeal to the full Supreme Court, publicly asking to continue withholding food benefits:

  "Now he’s forced to go... and ask the United States Supreme Court for permission to let Americans starve. That’s pretty crafty." (Michael Popok, 02:40)

• By structuring it this way, Jackson makes it politically and legally painful for Trump, as the administration had already paid $5 billion and thus undermined their own emergency appeal.

3. The Fast-Moving Legal Timeline

[03:30]

• Judge McConnell (Rhode Island): Orders full $8 billion payout; if partial payments made, must be justified—not “arbitrary or capricious.”
• Trump admin pays $5B, withholds $3B, and loses multiple appeals:
  • First Circuit denies stay, noting the administration is "likely to lose."
  • Supreme Court (Jackson) grants very temporary relief.
  • Trump team attempts to claw back $5 billion already distributed—court rapidly intervenes to block this.
  • Simultaneously, 23 state attorneys general (AGs from blue states) seek emergency relief in federal court.

4. First Circuit and Judge Rickelman's Strong Rebuke

[08:04]

• First Circuit panel (two Biden appointees, one Obama appointee; majority opinion by Judge Rickelman, former Center for Reproductive Rights litigator):

  “42 million people, 1 out of every 8 Americans use monthly benefits from the federal SNAP program to buy food for themselves and their families.”
  “For low-income Americans, SNAP is a vital bulwark against hunger and food insecurity. Access to food is... a basic human need. ... Without SNAP, tens of millions would go hungry, the first among a cascade of other health and financial harms... particularly in the months leading up to winter.”
  (Judge Rickelman, summarized by Popok, 08:45–09:45)

• The First Circuit refuses to block the lower-court order and asserts the Trump administration’s grounds for appeal are weak.

5. Judge Talwani’s New Temporary Restraining Order

[10:15]

• 23 Democratic attorneys general, including Rob Bonta (California), file for emergency court protection to stop any further interference with SNAP payments.
• Judge Indira Talwani halts Trump administration’s attempts to claw back billions already paid, pending a full hearing.
  • Orders USDA to pause any attempt to reduce or undo benefits until the November 13th hearing.

6. Political Context and Updates

[11:58]

• Trump’s legal team, via John Sauer, scrambles: files supplemental briefs, citing the Senate’s recent move toward ending the shutdown and funding SNAP (potentially moots emergency need, but uncertainties remain).
• Popok emphasizes the optics: the legal battle is now out in the open, and Trump must publicly "beg the full Supreme Court for permission to starve people." (12:50)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Michael Popok [02:40]:
  “Now he’s forced to go today on an emergency filing and ask the United States Supreme Court for permission to let Americans starve. That’s pretty crafty...”
  (On the trap set by Justice Jackson)

• Judge Rickelman (via Popok) [09:10]:
  “Access to food is, of course, a basic human need. Further, food security is a critical factor in health and well-being... Without SNAP, tens of millions would go hungry, the first among a cascade of other health and financial harms... particularly in the months leading up to winter.”

• Michael Popok [12:50]:
  “That’s again Ketanji Brown Jackson forcing the Trump administration to beg the full Supreme Court for permission to starve people.”

• Popok on the speed and stakes [13:50]:
  "This is a fast-moving story. I’ll cover it here on Midas, on Legal AF YouTube, and on Legal AF Substack..."

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:43]—Opening/context: high stakes SNAP litigation
• [01:40–02:45]—Justice Jackson’s strategy: the 48-hour stay trap
• [03:30–05:30]—Judge McConnell’s orders and partial payment by Trump admin
• [08:04–09:48]—First Circuit opinion and Judge Rickelman’s language
• [10:15–11:53]—Massachusetts’ Judge Talwani halts Trump’s claw-back amid AGs’ emergency filing
• [11:53–12:55]—Latest briefing scramble, Senate shutdown developments
• [12:50–13:50]—Popok sums up the legal and political position

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Summary and Takeaways

Legal AF delivers a lucid, real-time play-by-play of pivotal developments in federal courtrooms, with Michael Popok providing sharp, informed analysis. The Trump administration’s effort to restrict emergency food aid has met unified and resounding judicial resistance—and, thanks to Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson’s calculated move, Trump is compelled to either relent or make a politically unpalatable Supreme Court plea. The episode underscores the human impact (16 million affected children, 1 in 8 Americans) and highlights the judiciary’s role in upholding both law and basic dignity.

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For further details, documents, and daily roundups, listeners are encouraged to consult the Legal AF Substack and YouTube channels.

Transcript

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[Michael Popak]

Us we got a fast moving and breaking story about those SNAP anti hunger payments that go to 1 in 8Americans and Donald Trump and the Trump and MAGA administration's resistance and punishing of hungry people and poor people in America. Yes, the shutdown may be over, but that's gonna take several days. In the meantime, there is a hot and heavy pursuit of those funds to make sure that people don't suffer being led by the Democrats in the courts. We've got a ruling by the First Circuit, we've got a ruling by Judge Talwani in Massachusetts. We've got a request to the United States Supreme Court all on this one day as people who care about other Americans fight to get them the remaining $3 billion in funds. As Donald Trump tries to claw back the $5 billion that his administration paid out so that when people open their refrigerator, there's food to eat and they're not living under the world of food insecurity. And this was all set in motion, I suggest by a a supremely smart and crafty decision by Katanji Brown Jackson two days ago to stay temporarily for 48 hours. A decision by a federal judge in Rhode Island, Judge McConnell. That's the first domino. But she stated people were like, I don't want Katanji Brown Jackson to stay it on the payment of the last $3 billion of SNAP anti hunger payments and food stamps. Let it be another justice. No, she was smart because now she set up the trap, political and legal trap for Donald Trump and he stepped right in it. Now he's forced to go today on an emergency filing and ask the United States Supreme Court for permission to let Americans starve. That's pretty crafty as she already maneuvered so that 5 billion out of the $8 billion was already paid. It's not enough, but at least that payment went out. And now Donald Trump and his legal case is set up for failure in a way because of Ketanji Brown Jackson. Let me tie together the First Circuit ruling, Judge Talwani's ruling in Massachusetts, the original ruling by Judge McConnell in Rhode island, and the request at the United States Supreme Court, weaving it together on the Midas Touch Network. I'm Michael Popak and for Legal af. All right, let's get into it. A week ago Thursday, Judge McConnell in Rhode island ordered that as much of the $8 billion that was owed in November to people who are recipients of this entitlement that they're entitled to have the dignity of food security get paid. And if the Trump administration wasn't going to make the full $8 billion in payments, he wanted to know why and how and make sure it's not arbitrary, capricious. Why? Well, after I got back in front of him and the, and the Trump administration said last Monday and Tuesday, well, we're not, if we make a partial payment, it'll be weeks or months. He said, no, it'll be hours. I'll see you back in my court on Thursday. He brought everybody back on Thursday and he issued a new ruling enforcing his original temporary restraining order in which he declared they are to make the full $8 billion in payments and get it from other funding that they had available to them, including a large fund we call the Section 32, funds devoted for child nutrition that was overfunded, had 23 billion in it. Take 3 billion out, top up the 8 billion that's required to make the full payments of $350 per family and make the payments. One in eight Americans are below the pot free line and get SNAP payments. 1 in 8, 16 million children. That's what we're talking about. And it's time to do it. That was his ruling on Thursday. Did the Trump administration make the payment? Sort of. They made five out of $8 billion and then complained about the rest. They ran to Judge McConnell and asked him for a stay of his order on the remaining three. He said no. They ran to the First Circuit Court of Appeals and asked for administrative stay in time for them to make an appeal. They said no. They ran to the United States Supreme Court over the weekend and asked the justice there, which would be Ketanji Brown Jackson, for the First Circuit to grant a temporary administrative stay so they could file their full stay request at the First Circuit. She said yes. People went crazy. But they shouldn't have. If you read carefully the request by Trump and having and knowing that they had already paid the 5 billion out the the request was not for an emergency shadow docket appeal. The request was for a temporary stay to give the First Circuit time to make their ruling on a full briefing. So Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson, she gave a very short stay. It was about 46 hours. Why? Because then if Trump were to lose at the First Circuit, which he has and she knew he was going to and I'll tell you why when I read from the decision in a second that he'd have to go back to the full Supreme Court and beg them to let him starve. Poor Americans. Think about the optics. Think about it legally. And she also knew that from a record standpoint he had developed a terrible record undermining his argument. Trump cuz he'd already paid the 5 out of the 8 billion out so he couldn't claim on an emergency docket that he needed an emergency appeal for for the last 3 billion. That made no sense. So that she liked. And that's why Trump over the weekend tried to claw back the 5 million to make his record better. But too late. Outmaneuvered by Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson. And now he has to suffer through the politics as he continues to shift and flip flop his position all weekend as he's doing with the government shutdown. She also wanted to take advantage of his tendency to flip flop.

[Ben Meiselas]

Hey everybody, Ben Meiselas here from the Midas Touch Network. I wanted to let you know about my podcast partner Michael Popak's new law firm. It's called the Popak Firm. Michael Popak's pursuing his dream of starting his own law firm. Really based on the popular demand by all the Midas mighty and legal a fers who are approaching Michael Popak with their cases and saying can you help us? And at that time Popak was not able to. So he went out on his own. He started the Popoc firm where he is now handling catastrophic injury cases like car accident cases, trucking cases, malpractice cases, big negligence cases, wrongful death cases. So if you or someone you know have a case like this, the consultation with Popox firm is free. Give him a call. See if you have a case. It's thepopoc firm.com thepopocfirm.com or you can call 877 popak af pok af so 1877 p o p okaf give Michael popak a call and I'm really proud of you, Popak. Thanks for all the hard work you're putting in.

[Michael Popak]

Now we've got the decision by the First Circuit. Let me bring you there. First Circuit says late yesterday that they're not going to grant the stay through the duration of the appeal because he's likely to lose on appeal. But there was no abuse of discretion by the judge that they'd already issued five out of eight billion. There was plenty of funds to make the remaining and she was not going to rule in their favor. Here's what the judge Judge Rickelman, who is a There were two Biden appointees and one Obama appointee on the panel. Rickelman is very interesting because she used to work for the center for Reproductive Rights arguing for abortion rights. That was her day job before she became a judge. She wrote the majority 30 opinion. Here's what she wrote on page four. 42 million people, 1 out of every 8Americans use monthly benefits from the federal SNAP program to buy food for themselves on their families. She also put it in sharp relief when she said about the program itself. She said on page five for low income Americans, SNAP is a vital bulwark against hunger and food insecurity. Access to food is, of course, a basic human need. Further, food security is a critical factor in health and well being, the ability to stay in stable housing, children's physical and educational development. Without snap, tens of millions would go hungry, the first among a cascade of other health and financial harms that would befall those forced to go without enough food, particularly in the months leading up to winter. And that's why she, along with the two others, refused to block the order of Judge McConnell, enforcing his original temporary restraining order that the next 3 billion get paid out. Now there was a second case up with Judge Telwani that was filed out around the same time by 23 attorneys general, led by the attorneys general of Massachusetts and Rob Bonta, the attorney general of California. I have an interview of Rob Bonta that I'm doing that will be up tomorrow Morning on Legal AF YouTube about these issues. In their brief they asked Judge Talwani, who was sitting on a little bit on the sidelines waiting to have another request for temporary restraining order. They filed a second request for temporary restraining order just in the last few hours. They filed it also on the 9th when the 1st Circuit ruled plaintiffs further motion for a temporary restraining order. I'll post this on Legal layoff substack. Here's what they say there Plaintiffs, which are the 23 states blue states, come to this court again for the third time in 13 days to seek emergency relief from yet another unlawful and senseless act by the U.S. department of Agriculture and other defendants in their funding and oversight of snap. We respectfully request an emergency virtual hearing on Monday. Because of the irreparable harm and all of that. Judge Talwani has issued her ruling. Here's her ruling that came out just today on the 10th. Judge Indira Telwani electronic order granting in part plaintiff's further motion for temporary restraining order Good cause shown the USDA memorandum issued on Saturday November 8th directing that to the extent states sent full SNAP payment files for for November 2025 they must immediately undo any steps taken to issue full benefits and shall advise the appropriate offices of those steps is stayed pending further court order. And then she set the hearing for the 13th at 3:30. Meaning over the weekend the Trump administration tried to claw back the money, the.

[Legal AF Substack Host]

5 million, the 5 billion they'd already paid.

[Michael Popak]

She has stopped that on her watch while she gets to her full hearing on the 13th. So you have Judge Talwani stopping the clawback until she gets the hearing in about three days. You've got the first circuit who's ruled and now we're on a 48 hour clock of Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson the Supreme Court justices making because she said 48 hours after the first department ruled she would lift her stay, giving the parties time to run back to court to ask for some sort of emergency relief. And now we've got just now in the last hour or so we've got the request by letter by John Sauer, Donald Trump's Solicitor General, former his his personal US personal appellate criminal defense lawyer writing to the clerk of the court it says pursuant to the court this letter confirms that the government will file a supplemental brief by 4pm this afternoon. And there's been two developments. First, last evening the Senate voted to begin the process for ending the shutdown and funding the government include including full funding for SNAP through the end of the fiscal year. That proposal if adopted by the House, by both houses of Congress and signed by the president would end the shutdown and moot this application, meaning we won't need the appeal, but we still need it because we don't know what's going to happen in the next 48 to 4048 hours, 72 hours in Congress. Do you second this morning a district court, that's Judge Telwani who I just read from in a related case issued a temporary restraining order. The TRO directs the states that had process full step sorry that that TRO purports to stay doesn't purport to stay. It stays the USDA's November 8th memo that directed states that had process full payments to undo those actions and Levert to processing 65% SNAP payments for November. That's again Tanji Brown Jackson forcing the Trump administration to beg the full Supreme Court for permission to starve. People, I'm Michael Popak. I'm glad you're here on Midas Touch Network and Legal A. You can see this is a fast moving story. I'll cover it here on Midas. I'll cover it on Legal AF YouTube and and on Legal AF Substack. We're getting close to our 1 million threshold subscriber base on Legal AF YouTube. Come join us there. And on Legal AF Substack. Join us there as well and consider becoming a paid member. So until my next report, I'm Michael Popak.

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[Michael Popak]

Are there as well.

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