← Let's Be Honest with Kristin Cavallari
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- [00:01]
Jo Miller
The following podcast is a Dear Media production.
- [00:04]
Kristin Cavallari
This is, let's be Honest with Kristin Cavallari, a podcast all about getting real and open on everything from sex, relationships, reality tv, wellness, family, and so much more. And just a fair warning, there will probably be some oversharing. Cause I got all the power.
- [00:21]
Jo Miller
Yep.
- [00:23]
Kristin Cavallari
Jo Miller. Welcome.
- [00:25]
Jo Miller
Hi.
- [00:26]
Kristin Cavallari
I am so excited to finally meet you. I found you on social media, and I instantly became obsessed with you. I find you so incredibly empowering. You speak my language, and you've really made me feel like I'm not alone out here in the world. And so we're going to get to all of that, but I want to start with your personal journey, because it's a wild story, and it started from the moment you were born. So tell everybody about your childhood.
- [00:56]
Jo Miller
Yeah. First of all, I'm so excited to be here. And I feel like people are either like, holy shit, you're speaking to my soul, or they're like, what language is this woman saying? So it's one or the other.
- [01:05]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah. Yeah. Well, the people who get you, get you, and that's what matters.
- [01:09]
Jo Miller
Yeah. So I started off on kind of like, a weird note incarnating here onto planet Earth. So I was born with a Port Weinstein on, like, the whole left side of my face, which today, it's super cool. Like, birthmarks are, like, everyone's, like, going viral for them. But growing up, I had never actually seen anyone with one. And I underwent these really, like, crazy surgeries. My family kind of, like, hid me out for. Put makeup on me, you know, they
- [01:31]
Kristin Cavallari
were sort of embarrassed by it.
- [01:32]
Jo Miller
Yeah. Like, they were like. My mom was like, I feel like people look at me like, I'm hitting you. Oh, wow. Yeah. And I don't think that was, like, coming from a bad place. Like, they were probably trying to, like, protect me. But even, like, my neighbor was like, oh, this kid needs to get, like, treated. Like, I was actually called, like, disfigured, deformed in the news. Wow. And then at one point, they had to bring my entire school into an auditorium to, like, watch me getting these procedures to be like, don't pick on this kid. Whoa.
- [01:58]
Kristin Cavallari
Like, what age was that? Oh.
- [01:59]
Jo Miller
Like, I'm like a literal infant infant. Like, I started getting surgeries, I think, like, around the time I was 4. And, like, throughout my entire childhood also, mind you, like, it didn't do anything. Like, it didn't go away. It didn't, like, make it any better.
- [02:11]
Kristin Cavallari
What kind of, like, what were they doing in the surgeries? Yeah. Because it's. It's a birthmark on your cheek.
- [02:16]
Jo Miller
Right.
- [02:16]
Kristin Cavallari
And it's how big? Like, it's pretty.
- [02:18]
Jo Miller
Yeah, yeah. And after they treat it, it would look like sometimes it would, like, I couldn't open my eye. They would shove, like, metal shields in my eyes. No, I don't think they knew what they were doing. Like, lasers today are very, like, gentle, and it's, like, not a big deal now, but that was kind of experience, and I kind of was like, oh, is there. There's something, like, wrong with me? Like, why is this, like, happening? And so just at, like, an early age, I kind of was like, I need to hide my face. Like, I have to look a certain way. Like, I literally was wearing makeup as a child, so that was kind of, like, my initial footing onto planet Earth.
- [02:50]
Kristin Cavallari
And what would your parents say to you? Like, what was going on?
- [02:53]
Jo Miller
Yeah, I think our generation above, and you can tell me if this is true for you or not, but they didn't have, like, TikTok and social media, and, like, we've really normalized things to you, like podcasts and things like that. But they didn't say anything, actually, so there's no conversation going on. So I just kind of was, like, put a smile on my face. I actually didn't want the surgeons to know that they were hurting me, so I would be like. Like, while. Like, I'm getting, like, tortured. So that. Overcompensating. Exactly.
- [03:20]
Kristin Cavallari
So you really just had to go through all of that alone. Yeah, all of that as a young kid. That's a lot.
- [03:26]
Jo Miller
It was. And then, like, later on in life, I started seeing people with birthmarks, and I was like, oh, I'm not the only. I thought I was, like, the only one. We didn't know. We don't have, like, Instagram back in the day.
- [03:34]
Kristin Cavallari
Right. And so what about your birthmark today? Because you still have it, right? It's just a lot lighter.
- [03:39]
Jo Miller
I do. When I'm not wearing, like, full glam at all, you can still see it. I kind of, like, feel like it's a little bit cool. Like, I look at it and I'm, like, kind of glad it didn't fully go away, because I feel like it represents a part of me. I'm like, that. That built my character for sure.
- [03:52]
Kristin Cavallari
And so how did that. Then how did your personality evolve and everything that you went through as you got a bit older, like, into your teens and your early twenties? Paint that picture for me.
- [04:01]
Jo Miller
Yeah. So I feel like everyone has this sort of like, catalytic experience, usually early on or in their, like, teen years, where it just, like, sets off a totally different trajectory. So obviously, that didn't make me feel super confident, like, coming off the bat. So I feel like it kind of opened up this, like, unworthiness, insecure, visibility wound that just bled into, like, every area of my life, probably into, like, my late, you know, 30s, which is, like, relatively soon.
- [04:30]
Kristin Cavallari
Right. And so. And you've talked about. Cause again, I mean, I follow you, and I'm. I love all of your videos. You were really unhappy. You were a little out of control. Like, you were a partier. Right. Which I can relate to. I mean, I was sort of there, too, but I mean, also, like, for me, I know I went through a really insecure phase. And it wasn't also until, like, my 30s that I kind of really started finding myself. And we're gonna get into this, too, but, like, really leaning into authenticity and finding your voice and owning your gifts, which you talk a lot about.
- [05:00]
Jo Miller
Yeah.
- [05:00]
Kristin Cavallari
So how did you go from, like, being unhappy and being a little out of control to now getting where you are today? Because you're a coach. You're. You call yourself a spiritual guide and coach. You say you help old souls become rich, famous, and a household name, which I love. So how do you go from that to where you are today?
- [05:17]
Jo Miller
Yeah, so I. Like, you said, like, I got sober at 20, was, like, in rehabs, in and out of, like, different, like, therapy institutions in my early 20s. And then I had a neurological disease at, like, 25. So I was bedridden for, like, another 10 years. But even when I was going through this, I was still, like, coaching and supporting people, even in my, like, corpse. I call it my corpse there.
- [05:38]
Kristin Cavallari
And, like, you couldn't make a joke about it at least, right?
- [05:41]
Jo Miller
Yeah. Like, looking back, I'm like, okay. It all, like, played itself out in the moment. I was, like, hanging on for, like, dear life. But then I kind of got to this, like, low point. I got out of, like, a bad relationship, and I was, like, so used to being at rock bottom that I was like, fuck it. Let me just, like, go all in on my brand. And that's kind of when everything kind of took off, and I was like, wow, every single experience that I've been through, and after working with, like, thousands of old souls, I realized a lot of, like, parallels, trajectories, patterns, and it kind of developed the brand that it is today. And that's why people are like. You are like, oh, I get it. Because you Are like an advanced soul, obviously, like what you're doing with your brand and your podcast and front loading. Certain themes and challenges early on, like you said, addictions are like, a big thing.
- [06:20]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, front loading. I used to do a lot of hypnotherapy and she used to talk about that too. Is same thing. Old souls, you really front load your life. It's like trauma and just like bullshit after bullshit and you're like, I can't take anymore. But then you do get over the hurdle and then you can help other people, like what you're doing, and you can actually settle into peace. And so I want to talk about your spiritual journey too, because again, everything you say in the spiritual world, I am all in on with you. How did you. Well, how did you start to get into spirituality?
- [06:52]
Jo Miller
Yeah, well, at 20 years old, when I got sober, I was, like, forced into believing that there was something greater. It's kind of like the remedy when you're, like, diagnosed with alcoholism at like, 20. Like, I was basically told I was gonna die if I didn't stop drinking.
- [07:05]
Kristin Cavallari
Wow.
- [07:06]
Jo Miller
I was actually drugged against my will in a rehab. It was a really crazy story.
- [07:10]
Kristin Cavallari
Wait, I wanna hear this story.
- [07:11]
Jo Miller
So my ex boyfriend's ex girlfriend came into the rehab and she was like, let's run away. And at this point, I just thought. I thought rehab, you just, like, go and you chill and then you go back to drinking, and then everyone's like, sober for life. And I was like, oh, my God, I'm in the wrong place. Like, I just want to go party. So she was like, do you want to go party? And I was like, of course. Like, let's get out of here. And then she. We ended up like, in, like, the Tenderloin in San Francisco with, like, a bunch of people, like, shooting up drugs. And then we, like, she, like, brought some drugs back into the rehab, and I had, like, taken some pills or something that night because I wasn't trying to, like, do any hardcore drugs. And then she ended up, like, drugging me against my will. And I was like, screaming, no. In the rehab.
- [07:50]
Kristin Cavallari
Oh, my God.
- [07:51]
Jo Miller
With, like, a dirty needle. No. Yeah. And I'm such a people pleaser that I was like, the next day, like, obviously they were like, these women are high. Like, yeah. And then we had to end up, like, having my family and the whole rehab family come into a circle. And I just took the heat because I was such a people pleaser. I was like, oh, yeah, I did drugs. Like, I didn't throw her under the Bus or anything. And then me and my parents were sitting there like, you know, we, like, were like, terrible parents. Where have we gone wrong? And then I had to, like, go get, like, testing with my mom every, like, six months for a while to make sure it was just, like, so traumatizing that I've never had a legal drink since then. So that kind of like, feared me into sobriety.
- [08:31]
Kristin Cavallari
So do you sort of look back at those moments in your life and be like, actually it was a blessing
- [08:36]
Jo Miller
if it wasn't like, so many moments in my life. Like you said, like, you get to this threshold where you're like, it actually can't get any worse. And then it, like, does, but, like, it needs to, to, like, get that lesson. It's almost like you can get less faster if you just, like, crash out sooner. Like, that was my life for a long time.
- [08:51]
Kristin Cavallari
That is so crazy.
- [08:52]
Jo Miller
Yeah.
- [08:53]
Kristin Cavallari
Okay, wait. And then you said, what disease did you have that made you bedridden for 10 years?
- [08:57]
Jo Miller
It's called me now. It's basically chronic fatigue. I also had, like, fibromyalgia, Hashimoto's. I had, like, mold toxicity. I kind of have all the, like, gut problems, a bunch of things compiled. But it was mainly me, CFS that like, took me out. I had a very, very bad case of it.
- [09:11]
Kristin Cavallari
So how did you then get better that you were just giving you drugs or what? Or medicine, I should say.
- [09:16]
Jo Miller
Yeah. So either people were like, you're going to die of, like, a brain cancer or you're going to like. Or you're just making it up. And so they did some brain scans and they were like, clearly something's wrong here. And then they kind of just. It just kept going to doctor, doctor. And finally I was like, there is no cure. So, like, I just went to LA and I was like, I'm going to live my best life and just, like, start doing weird shit in public and, like, letting my, like, freak flag fly. And then I kind of crashed out and I started seeing, like, online programs. For me, CFS started like, popping up and I was like, rewiring my brain a lot, doing a lot of, like, reprogramming and healing. And then eventually I kind of, like got myself out of bed. But yeah, I couldn't walk for like a couple years.
- [09:54]
Kristin Cavallari
That is crazy.
- [09:55]
Jo Miller
Yeah, it was nuts.
- [09:56]
Kristin Cavallari
I bet you were really scared too.
- [09:58]
Jo Miller
Oh, it was terrifying. You're like, am I gonna be stuck like this for the rest of my life? Like, I couldn't even drive home sometimes. I would just sit in my car for hours, and my house would be, like, a block away. It was wild.
- [10:10]
Kristin Cavallari
That is. And you said you had a boyfriend at the time, too.
- [10:13]
Jo Miller
So I dated someone. Right. Like, right as I got out of bed. I was like, cool, I'm out of bed. Like, I'm ready to do, like, yeah, like, back into the wild. And then it was, like, super dramatic, and I was like, okay, that was not the path to go. I was like, I'm so much better. Like, blowing up my own brand. Like, do not rely on a man. Like, that was a quick, hard lesson as well.
- [10:33]
Kristin Cavallari
Well, you talk a lot about that. So let's get into that. Because you say that old souls will be blocked in love, right. Until they essentially find, like, what they're destined to do.
- [10:44]
Jo Miller
Yeah.
- [10:45]
Kristin Cavallari
Okay, so just talk to me about that. And also, how do you know that, like, I. So that's my thing. I am all in on the spiritual stuff, as, like, you are. But how do you know that's like. Is it just a knowing? It's like a gut feeling.
- [10:58]
Jo Miller
So I worked with 2,000 people, one to one directly in a year on top of all my. And then I also had, like, group programs. I also did, like, a million other things, but I just kept seeing this repeated pattern over and over and over and over again. And I was like, wow. It's really evident that when you have, like, a message that you're meant to share, typically what happens is people will date, like, one of their most toxic twin flames or their most toxic twin flame right before they have this big catalytic event in their brands and, you know, even, like, in your own life. Like, I feel like you've actually been a voice for a lot of people going through certain breakups, relationships, narcissistic abuse. And I think that sometimes on a higher level, souls will volunteer for that and kind of trailblaze in your own way. So I've seen you do that in your own brand. And obviously, having to do that publicly is a whole nother level in and of itself.
- [11:53]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so that's interesting. So it's the same pattern for everybody.
- [11:59]
Jo Miller
Yeah, not everybody. I would say for, like. I would say like, a small, small percent of the population or.
- [12:06]
Kristin Cavallari
I mean, sorry, everyone that's sort of on this same trajectory on.
- [12:10]
Jo Miller
Yeah, like, sort of. In this coming to their end of their incarnation cycle, there is a pattern and theme. Of course there's going to be small outliers, and of course, there might be someone who actually meets a partner that helps their path. But for A lot of us, it's usually like, we will date our most toxic person because it's actually sometimes this big catalyst and it teaches us not to outsource something. Because for a lot of us, we'll just get comfortable. Like, for a lot of old souls, like, if you didn't have this, like, calling or deep thing inside of you, it's really easy to just hang out in someone else's shadow.
- [12:39]
Kristin Cavallari
Right.
- [12:40]
Jo Miller
So it's like, that's the easier path, but it's almost like the universe will kind of block you until you become the person who's visible with your gift. And then from there, it's actually easier to date.
- [12:50]
Kristin Cavallari
It's so interesting because I have thought so many times, because I would say, essentially I've been single for the last six years. Of course I've dated, but I've thought. I'm like, if I was in a relationship, I can almost guarantee I wouldn't be doing half the shit I'm doing.
- [13:02]
Jo Miller
That's how you know.
- [13:03]
Kristin Cavallari
But when am I gonna meet someone? Because now I'm like, all right, it's been six years. I'm doing all the things.
- [13:09]
Jo Miller
Yeah, you're like, universe, we're read.
- [13:12]
Kristin Cavallari
Well, you just recently said that before you call in your soulmate, you'll have like your asexual era. Yeah. I'm like, yeah, that also resonates.
- [13:19]
Jo Miller
Have you entered it?
- [13:20]
Kristin Cavallari
I've been in it for a while. I'm like, what the hell?
- [13:23]
Jo Miller
That's honestly how you know you're an advanced soul. It's like, the periods are much. It's not like a normal, like, let's take a breather from, like, dating. It's like these long periods and you're like, but, but like, any day now, you're like, all the lessons have been learned. But I. I really believe that there is going to be someone handcrafted, crafted for you. And I feel like this year in particular is kind of a period where a lot of those, like, narcissistic kind of relationships are collapsing. And I've noticed that more people are. Yeah, it's coming out in the wash. People are waking up. Yeah, it's sort of this, like, karmic cycle where that's being revealed.
- [13:58]
Kristin Cavallari
So it's interesting. I know. I've noticed that there's been a lot of breakups and it's been kind of interesting to see. Watch it from afar.
- [14:04]
Jo Miller
Yeah.
- [14:09]
Kristin Cavallari
Okay, guys, we have a new Peacock original series based on Ellen Hilderbrand's best selling novel, the Five Star Weekend. It is a star studded cast. We have Jennifer Garner, Darcy Carden, Gemma Chan, Regina hall and Chloe Sevenier. Stream it Only on Peacock July 9th. So here's the premise if you're not familiar. After a devastating loss, fame cook Hollis Shaw, played by Garner, hosts a weekend getaway on Nantucket for her best friends. She decides there will be a total of five for the getaway. Declaring it a weekend of five star treatment. Hollis invites one friend from each phase of her life. Childhood, college, motherhood and a fourth mysterious online friend. Long buried secrets will come to light. Luxurious coastal backdrop of beautiful Nantucket. Hollis is a food blogger so food cooking and recipes have a strong presence throughout the series. I love that. So there's a lot to unpack here. You are not going to want to miss this again. That is premiering July 9th on Peacock. I will be tuning in. I can't wait to hear what you guys think. Let's talk about Salt and Stone specifically their viral deodorant. When I apply this deodorant in the morning all day long people ask me why I smell so good and you guys, it's because of the deodorant. I am telling you they have a discovery set which is the perfect way to explain, explore and find your signature scent because in that discovery set you get all four of their scents to try. Their four scents are Santal, Bergamot, Saffron and Neroli. I really do love all of them and so it is kind of fun to change it up. I also love their deodorant because not only does it smell great, it is award winning. It's aluminum free which I always make sure I'm looking for and it's formulated with 48 hour protection. We love that. Salt and Stone also has really great smelling body wash. I actually put it in my guest room and I always get compliments on it. So if you don't know Salt and Stone, quit sleeping on it and check them out. Try Salt and Stone's discovery set. To find your signature scent go to saltonstone.com honest and use code honest at checkout for 15 off your first order. That's saltandstone.com honest and use code HONEST for 15 off your first order. Let's talk about the food brand Just Ingredients. Just Ingredients believes in nourishing your body with real food ingredients. You guys know I love that. The reason I love Just Ingredients so much is because they are committed to ingredient transparency and products made with ingredients they use themselves specifically. I want to talk to you guys about their electrolytes because they are so good and they're flavored with real fruit for a great tasting, nourishing electrolyte drink. Made with organic coconut water and no added sugar, no artificial flavors or sweeteners or colors, and no sugar alcohols. It's also formulated without synthetic emulsifiers, gums, anti caking agents or fillers. Again, that's why I love this brand so much and they do third party testing for quality you can feel good about. So definitely check them out. There's so many yummy flavors. Right now I'm doing their watermelon lime which is delish. Visit just ingredients.com honest and use code honest at checkout for 20 off your first full price purchase. That's J U S T I N G R E D I E N T S Use code honest for 20% off your first order. Again, this applies to full price orders. Let's talk about a brand that we all know and love, and that is Lululemon. You know that feeling when you find a pant that actually moves the way that you move? No bunching, no pulling, no adjusting mid pose? Well, that's, that's what a good studio pant should do. And most of them don't get it right, but Lululemon just did. With the Groove Relaxed Cinch pant, the Nulu fabric feels like nothing on your body and the singable helm lets you adjust for whatever class you're in. And the relaxed fit actually holds up when you move. I love that there's no pulling, which means there's no restricting. So you can just freely move in these pants, which is the best. I also love when a pant is so great for a workout class, but then it's also great when you move about your life and your daily routine. So to brunch afterwards or getting a coffee and it still looks great. So not only is it functional, it also is really cute and flattering and all of the things that we want in our athleisure wear. If you haven't checked these out yet, I'm telling you, you're gonna want to the Groove Relaxed Cinch pant. Go to lululemon.com right now. New styles drop all the time and the colors go fast, so you're not going to want to wait. And if something doesn't work for you, there are free returns always. That's lululemon.com lululemon.com. So you're. Are you 37?
- [19:00]
Jo Miller
I'm 38 now, so forget.
- [19:02]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, I know, I know. As you get older, it's like, you have to really sit here and. So when was the last time you were in a relationship? It's been a while, right? Yeah.
- [19:10]
Jo Miller
So it was right before I blew up my brand, which I think I was, like, 35.
- [19:15]
Kristin Cavallari
Okay.
- [19:15]
Jo Miller
Yeah. So it was a couple years ago. But I have, like, long stints of, like, solitude.
- [19:20]
Kristin Cavallari
How do you. Well, do you ever have those moments of being lonely and kind of sad about it?
- [19:25]
Jo Miller
Yeah, I mean, I think it would be. I think anyone's lying if they say that they don't, but I think it's way more painful to feel lonely inside a relationship 1000% where you just. Every day. It's also torture when you're going back and forth, like, should I leave? Should I not? Like, that's a pain that I would rather, like, not have that over. The pain of, like, a little bit of loneliness here and there, without a doubt. Right.
- [19:46]
Kristin Cavallari
Once you've experienced loneliness in a relationship, you're like, I would rather be alone for the rest of my life than experience that ever again. How do you get through those times, though? Like. Cause you're so good about, like. I know with me, when I watch your videos, I feel so hyped. I feel jacked up. I'm like, yes, I can do this. I'm not alone. Do you have to take your own advice sometimes? Like, what do you do when you're. When you are feeling down about it?
- [20:09]
Jo Miller
Yeah, I think that for me, I just bottomed out in so many relationships that you get to this point where you're just like, this pain is better than that pain. But for me, I also have, like, amazing guy friends. So sometimes just being in that, like, masculine energy, kind of like, that's like a placeholder. But you're like, oh, this is, like, how I should be treated. This is, like, feels good. So I do have, like. I call them, like, my fake husbands. So I do have, like, male friends. And sometimes I think that energy can kind of carry you through, but there was periods where I was just, like, like, literally isolated from, like, society. And it's hard, but I feel like sometimes we have to learn lessons in that to, like, hold back our power, not, like, rely on someone to escape or validate us. Right. And I feel like once you kind of, like, majority of those programs are kind of not running anymore. I do think it's just, like, a matter of timing. And maybe it's not you. Maybe it's like, your partner needs to get out of a relationship or they need to, like, finish up something before they're ready for you when. So you could be ahead of them. And they're just, like, waiting to kind of either go through a breakup or relocate or something like that.
- [21:14]
Kristin Cavallari
I've thought about that. I'm like, he's still married. He's coming,
- [21:19]
Jo Miller
you know, go through the first round.
- [21:21]
Kristin Cavallari
Exactly. Well, so, like, get a divorce, have a year or two, get it all out of his system, and then he'll come find me.
- [21:26]
Jo Miller
There's men. Divorced men are so good because they've
- [21:30]
Kristin Cavallari
had to work at something.
- [21:31]
Jo Miller
Yeah.
- [21:32]
Kristin Cavallari
And. But I do think they need that period in between divorce and dating. Some people getting some things out of their system before settling down again. I don't understand the people that go from relationship to relationship.
- [21:43]
Jo Miller
I'm like, how? They're not even that many people to like.
- [21:45]
Kristin Cavallari
I know.
- [21:46]
Jo Miller
I don't even like anybody.
- [21:48]
Kristin Cavallari
I know.
- [21:48]
Jo Miller
You know, that's my thing.
- [21:49]
Kristin Cavallari
I'm like, I'm ready to like someone. Like, that's fun. To have a crush and a flirt. I haven't even had that. Even had that. That's all right. Okay, so I want to talk about when your clients come to you and you're coaching them, is it primarily women?
- [22:01]
Jo Miller
Only women.
- [22:02]
Kristin Cavallari
Oh, it's only women.
- [22:03]
Jo Miller
Yeah. So I don't work with men.
- [22:04]
Kristin Cavallari
Got it. Why is that?
- [22:05]
Jo Miller
I feel like women have certain programming that men have that level of conditioning. Like, women are very shamed in so many ways that men aren't. And so I just love getting women, like, unhinged. And that's just does something for my soul.
- [22:20]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, no, I get that. Well, to be able to help so many women has gotta just fuel you and make you feel so good.
- [22:27]
Jo Miller
100.
- [22:27]
Kristin Cavallari
What are you coaching with these women when they come to you? Like, how. What does that process look like? How does it start? And then what kind of tools are you giving them to use in their everyday life?
- [22:35]
Jo Miller
Yeah. So a big part of what I help people with is, like, their messaging around their brand and how to actually, like, scale their brand and create content. But with that comes a lot of visibility. I think that you've been a trailblazer in the women's empowerment space and just being unapologetic and being a vessel to, like, hold misperceptions and judgment. And most people crumble in that.
- [22:55]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah.
- [22:56]
Jo Miller
That is most people's biggest fear in life. And so part of what I do is, like, rewire people to feel safe. And I use something called theta healing, which is actually, you can muscle test and do kinesiology. I don't Know if you've ever experienced that.
- [23:06]
Kristin Cavallari
I do know about that. Yeah. Yeah, that's great.
- [23:08]
Jo Miller
It's like the fastest way to clear blocks. So it's like internal and then it's also like on a practical level, like, what's the strategy? What's like your brand offers? What do you want to like, get out there? What's your message?
- [23:18]
Kristin Cavallari
Amazing. I love that so much. So people's biggest fear is being seen A hundred percent. That's interesting.
- [23:26]
Jo Miller
Yeah.
- [23:27]
Kristin Cavallari
Well, even like, I know because I've been in the public eye for over 20 years and I would be lying if I said sometimes people's opinions didn't still affect me. And if I go through phases, like, sometimes I'm like, I don't give a shit. Like, I know what that's about. And other times I'm like, oh my God, they think that about me. I'm like, what do you say to someone like that?
- [23:43]
Jo Miller
Yeah, well, I'm curious with you. What was the hardest part or the hardest thing that people said? Because usually there's a particular thing that people can pinpoint that hurts a little bit more than others.
- [23:56]
Kristin Cavallari
You know what it's always been is when it's inaccurate information. Because I'm like, if you hate me for something I really did, I'm like, cool. I like literally don't care. Because again. And I want to talk to you about authenticity because I know that's your biggest thing. You tell everyone to lean into their authenticity. And I do feel like I'm someone who's been really authentic. So when it's not authentic and you're judging me on something that didn't happen, that's where I get really, really mad. There's nothing I can do. You can't control everyone's perception no matter what you do.
- [24:25]
Jo Miller
Yeah. And it hasn't prevent you went and built empires off of it and brands and not a lot of people can take that feeling of being judged. And sometimes it paralyzes people and they're like, I never want to get out there again because this is like my worst fear happening.
- [24:38]
Kristin Cavallari
So what do you do to. So let's say someone puts themselves out there, they get judged and they crumble. What would you say to them?
- [24:44]
Jo Miller
A lot of the times that's activating. Sometimes it's a past life program. Oh yeah. So sometimes we have to go a little bit deeper out of this lifetime. Sometimes it's ancestral past life regarding and family programming. Right. So that might not even be their program. It might be like their lineage that like, if we get out there and we're misperceived, we're gonna. Some people really think they're gonna die. Like the body saying, we're gonna die, even if consciously they're like, I can handle this. The body might override that.
- [25:09]
Kristin Cavallari
Right.
- [25:09]
Jo Miller
And so that's where we start creating more safety. And also, like, every single woman in particular has the gift of alchemy. So anytime you're misperceived, you can make a comeback. You can launch a podcast. Like, there's so much more in our control than people realize. It's just about getting creative with it.
- [25:25]
Kristin Cavallari
And you recently said too that the more you don't care about people's perceptions, the less hate you'll get. Why is that, you think?
- [25:33]
Jo Miller
I think sometimes when we are these conscious beings and creators of our reality, sometimes we have to experience the thing that we fear the most to actually get beyond it. So when we're really hyper focused on something and it materializes and then we're just like, okay, well yeah, fuck it, it already happened. Like, I'm sure after that, like sometimes it can relive itself in our mind, but sometimes we're kind of like, all right, well fuck it, the worst thing already happened, so I might as well go launch this thing. Or I might as well put myself out there in that way.
- [25:58]
Kristin Cavallari
Totally. And this is a little crazy and woo, woo. And I'm sure some people are like, you're nuts. But I really think too, everything is energy. So if you're constantly focused on, like, I don't want this to happen, I don't want this to happen. It's gonna happen where like if it comes and you just let it go,
- [26:12]
Jo Miller
it just goes and then it's gone 100%. I think about like one time, I think Sia like, like a nude got leaked of her and then she just reposted it and it took all the power out of it. Right, Gen?
- [26:23]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah.
- [26:24]
Jo Miller
Right. So to your point, when you just defuse it.
- [26:26]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah.
- [26:27]
Jo Miller
It just, it goes away. It's like the law of energy.
- [26:30]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, exactly. I like, I'm trying to explain that to my kids right now and they're like, what are you talking about? Like a little young for all of that.
- [26:38]
Jo Miller
Start them early.
- [26:39]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, exactly. Okay. If you could equipped everyone with three pieces of knowledge to help them live a more authentic life, what would they be?
- [26:46]
Jo Miller
Yeah. I think number one, the darker nights of the soul that you go through, the more impact you're built for.
- [26:53]
Kristin Cavallari
Right.
- [26:53]
Jo Miller
So if you're like going Through a really hard period right now, you're being prepared for impact. And then number two is to your point, I think the more we can, like, lean into vulnerability, authenticity, we get rewarded for that. And then lastly, I think the universe rewards persistency. Like when you have a dream or a vision, even if it feels so far out of reach, if you commit to that, like, your life depends on it, basically, you can do anything.
- [27:16]
Kristin Cavallari
And everyone says that. Everyone's like, you know, right before they wanted to give up, they just kept going a little bit longer, and then that's when everything happened for them. So everyone who is successful always says
- [27:26]
Jo Miller
that has that breaking point where, like, I want to quit and then it, like, locks in.
- [27:29]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, exactly. No, it's so true. I love your messages on money. And I think. I don't know why, but for women, the conversation around money has always been like, a little off limits or like, it's not okay for some reason for women to be chasing money. Of course, men can chase money all day long and we celebrate them for it. But a woman, you're like, oh, my God, her priorities are in the wrong place. So why do you think that is, first of all?
- [27:55]
Jo Miller
Yeah, well, I think a lot of the programming on this planet's kind of fucked up.
- [27:59]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah.
- [27:59]
Jo Miller
So I think that is to keep us small and subservient. And I think social media has actually changed that for so many women. Like, the generation before us didn't have the opportunities that we do with personal branding. There's so much more power and control. And I think that's why women are actually not dating as much or pickier in their dating life, because we actually have other shit that we can, like, do.
- [28:18]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, exactly. We've got money now.
- [28:20]
Jo Miller
Yeah.
- [28:20]
Kristin Cavallari
You don't have to rely on a guy, literally.
- [28:22]
Jo Miller
If we're, like, making our own money, we're our own sugar daddies. The only thing a guy brings to the table ultimately is, like, how they treat us.
- [28:29]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, exactly. I've got a lot of quotes from you in this money section. And so. And you basically just said it, but you've said money won't make you happy. Money is superficial. That that is matrix programming to make you think money is a bad thing, AKA keep, make, keep you small and broke. You say money is power and when you have options, you're no longer a slave to the matrix. I wish every woman had this mentality. It's so good. How do you coach your women to think like this?
- [28:55]
Jo Miller
Yeah, I think it's more of, like, an embodiment Right. So I think just being. That's why I created a brand called her Unapologetic Success, is because I think so many women have this deep desire for more, but we've just been shamed to think that there's something wrong with that. Right. Like, men are naturally rewarded for that. And then women are told, like, they're too masculine or, like, you have to be smaller to fit in. And I think, like, females in particular sometimes can, like, have this wounding where we, like, bond over certain things. And if you, like, come out of that suffering, it almost makes you, like, not likable or not relatable. Right. And so I think that that's what we're kind of programmed to believe, when in actuality, it, like, makes good people even better people. It makes us freer, happier. And it's, like, really, like, it's actually very spiritual, especially when it's connected to your impact.
- [29:42]
Kristin Cavallari
Okay, so I love that you said that, because that was another thing I was gonna talk to you about, is you do say, yeah, money is spiritual. Money is energy. I believe that. And so it's like, when you try to hold on to money and you're so tight about it, it won't flow to you. Like, money has to flow. You have to put money into the universe for it to come back to you. So explain that to me.
- [30:00]
Jo Miller
Yeah, so just like, old souls are typically, like, blocked in love until they get visible with their gift. It's often the same thing with money. So if, like, you tried to, like, when you are here to, like, launch these incredible brands and be the spotlight, if you tried to, like, go. Not that you would ever do this, but in the past, like, if you tried to steer away from this, like, you'd probably get traumatized if you went to go get a 9 to 5, or, like, if you tried to go do something, it's not going to unlock the level of abundance until it's the thing that you're really here to share or, like, a creative gift inside of you that you put out. And that's when the universe is going to reward you. So you have to become the person who's comfortable with visibility, who's comfortable with money. And so there's kind of this journey until you unlock your abundance when you're here for a very specific purpose.
- [30:43]
Kristin Cavallari
So how do you know what your purpose is? For someone who's listening, who feels like they're destined for more, they just don't know exactly, like, what their gifts are. Do you coach women to find their gifts too?
- [30:53]
Jo Miller
Yeah. So your calling is gonna call you and it's gonna call you over and over and over again. So for me, like, I didn't actually know what it was. I just started saying I have gifts to myself. And I started walking around, like, when I was dead in bed with my neurological disease. And I was walking around pretending, like, in my mind this is very delusional. Like, I was helping all these people.
- [31:14]
Kristin Cavallari
Y. Yeah, that's great.
- [31:16]
Jo Miller
And then people actually started showing up. Like, while I was sick in bed, people started calling me. They're like, hey, like, I heard you did this clearing on your friend. Can you do me? And then, like, people were like, hey, I want to be your first paid client. And then they paid me, like, astronomical amounts of money. And I was like, what the hell? And it just kind of. It came to me. But I had to step into this being like, I have a gift. Even though I didn't know what it was, I didn't know how it was going to come into fruition. So sometimes you just have to own it without even knowing what it is yet.
- [31:41]
Kristin Cavallari
Yet it's almost like manifesting in a lot of ways. Right?
- [31:44]
Jo Miller
That's literally what it is.
- [31:45]
Kristin Cavallari
You're just calling it in without even really knowing what you're calling in.
- [31:49]
Jo Miller
So, yeah, exactly.
- [31:55]
Kristin Cavallari
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- [35:39]
Jo Miller
That's a really good question. So I Had a couple near death experiences and it unlocked psychic gifts. Whoa. Yeah. I actually like felt my soul leave at one point and come back. It was really wild. Yeah. I looked over at my mom, she was actually driving me to like the er and I was like, mom, I'm not going to like make it. And what? I was on a sleep pill because I couldn't sleep. The neurological disease leaves you wide awake all night and then you're dead during the day. It's a form of torture. So they finally put me on a sleep pill and then they just told me to go cold turkey. And that's actually when you can die. So it's like actually going in and out of like consciousness, about to have seizures for like 30 days. They actually had to put me in like a rehabilitation center because my brain was no longer responding to the drug. And they're like, you could like die.
- [36:19]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah.
- [36:20]
Jo Miller
So at one point I actually like left and then came back in.
- [36:23]
Kristin Cavallari
And you remember it?
- [36:24]
Jo Miller
Yeah. And then after that I like it unlocked. Yeah. Like it started unlocking more gifts. So it kind of got easier to go between worlds.
- [36:32]
Kristin Cavallari
Whoa, that is so cool. So do you feel like all of that was sort of like predestined? Like you had to go through that in order to get where you are today?
- [36:40]
Jo Miller
I 100% believe that there are things pre programmed in this reality that are predetermined before we, we come here. And I think the soul. Yeah, the soul remembers it. If you get that deja vu feeling.
- [36:51]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah.
- [36:52]
Jo Miller
What for you and your life has been some of those like, pre programs.
- [36:55]
Kristin Cavallari
I just think like the overall journey that I've been on. Because, you know, if you think about it like I was living in Chicago. Yeah. I was getting into a lot of trouble. So I got shipped, shipped off to Laguna Beach, California. I got on TV that fell into my lap. I mean, literally right place, right time. And I think I was destined to end up with my ex husband, you know, and it ultimately got me to Franklin, Tennessee and launched my business. Like there are so many things that when you get a little bit older, like, like us in our late 30s, when you can look back, it is like building blocks and life starts to really make sense. Yep. I just think, I think it's so cool. And I think too, like when you're going through those hard times, you know, it just seems like so unfair. And you're like, what the fuck? But when you can finally get to the other side, you're like, I get it.
- [37:43]
Jo Miller
That's the path.
- [37:44]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah. And it's actually. I think it's so cool. Yeah, I think it's so cool. And I do think that we sort of like sign up for our journey before we come to Earth. And so. And that's something I've talked about on my podcast before too, is like, when you are going through a hard time. How I've gotten through a lot of them is if I'm sitting here like, I signed myself up for this, so I know I can get through it. That's been like my biggest tool for getting through hard times.
- [38:07]
Jo Miller
Wow.
- [38:08]
Kristin Cavallari
What do you say to yourself? To get through hard times?
- [38:11]
Jo Miller
Yeah. Similarly, I'll like, ask my soul. I'm like, okay, if this, if this was pre programmed, what am I trying to like, what do I need to learn from this to speed this up?
- [38:19]
Kristin Cavallari
Yes. Right.
- [38:20]
Jo Miller
You know, to your point, like for advanced souls, it's not just like a little hiccup, a little rough pat. It can be like years. You're like, when is this gonna end? Yeah. And that's when. And then all of a sudden will, like, the miracle drops in. It all makes sense. And that. That's kind of the pathway, right?
- [38:37]
Kristin Cavallari
I know, it's so funny. Have you seen those memes on TikTok? They're like, a spiritual person reacts like this. And a regular person like this. And the spiritual person, everything is like, what's the meaning behind this? Like, my foot hurts. Like, oh, no, what's this trying to tell me? I'm like, so that person, like, asking
- [38:50]
Jo Miller
ChatGPT the spiritual meaning, literally, oh, my
- [38:53]
Kristin Cavallari
God, my chat GPT thinks I'm insane. Oh, my God.
- [38:56]
Jo Miller
I love it.
- [38:58]
Kristin Cavallari
For women who are not used to making money, let's say, and. But they're on this journey now. How can they learn to love money and to be comfortable with it?
- [39:07]
Jo Miller
Most of the time, people who say, like, oh, I don't care about money. It's because we believe it's hard. So any of that kind of like, shaming program is just designed to keep us safe. So there's nothing wrong with that. It's just a survival program. So part of it is just being like, what do I actually believe about money? Like this probably money has, like the most programming on the planet, right? So it's like when you actually think about it, it's. It's actually like, it's literally a piece of paper.
- [39:32]
Kristin Cavallari
Like, it's like, not even real.
- [39:33]
Jo Miller
It's not even real. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's like, if you were the creator, then how would you want to like express it or how would you want it to come through you? And I think that that kind of takes the focus off of like the paper and it's more about like, what do you want to like, bring to the world and like share? And that's usually how we can kind of flip it.
- [39:49]
Kristin Cavallari
It. Yeah.
- [39:49]
Jo Miller
And energy.
- [39:50]
Kristin Cavallari
I love that you've also said, like, having this mentality, like, money's obsessed with me, like, and you've said God wants you abundant. You said that earlier. Like, when you can lean into your gifts, that's when you become abundant.
- [40:00]
Jo Miller
Yeah.
- [40:01]
Kristin Cavallari
And that you've also said, get some fucking money so you can change the planet. I love that.
- [40:06]
Jo Miller
Yeah. I mean, if you think about the people in charge of the world, probably not, you know, the best people. So if more empathic women who are very impact driven had money and had resources and had power, we can kind of shift some of that imbalance on this planet.
- [40:22]
Kristin Cavallari
Yes, exactly. Yeah. We need more love and joy to out balance some of the corruption. Corruption that's happening. Okay. I really want to talk to you about appearance and just beauty in general because I sort of struggle with this because I think I'm a pretty spiritual person and there's a large part of me that, that cares about my appearance, but I'm like, but is that an unspiritual thing to do? So what's your stance on appearance and caring about the way that you look as a spiritual woman?
- [40:53]
Jo Miller
Yeah, first of all, I just love the vulnerability around that because people would look at you and assume like, oh, she has no insecurities. Like, doesn't know what an insecurity is. Right. But just even the fact that you're like, able to share that and I same thing with money. Like, I think having your vessel look the way you want it to is spiritual. If glam instantly boosts your vibe, glam it up. If a little Botox does it, if bleach does it, like, right. Whatever gets you in. The energy of like, I feel more at home here. I'm all for it. Like, I'm. Girl, I've like done everything. I'm like, all for it. Like, whatever makes you feel better. Obviously there's an extent where it's like, you can only do so much. I'm not saying that's the only way, but I think you can work outside, in, inside out. I think it goes both ways.
- [41:38]
Kristin Cavallari
Okay. I love that because I've really gone back and forth on that because I'm like, like, you know, enlightened me, you know, super spiritual me wouldn't care about the way that I look. But then I'm like, yeah, but I do. And I. It's like this push and pull and I go through phases. I feel like everything's a phase with me. But, like, I don't know, I just was really excited to get your opinion on that because that is something that I sort of struggle with. So you. Totally. Cool. Botox fillers. All the things.
- [42:01]
Jo Miller
All the things. Because whatever makes you feel confident is going to help you get beyond yourself. And the more we're not thinking about our insecurities, I think the more impact we can make. So I actually think it's very selfless to take care of yourself and look the way you want.
- [42:13]
Kristin Cavallari
Okay. I like that.
- [42:16]
Jo Miller
Yeah. I'm like, all for the injections.
- [42:19]
Kristin Cavallari
So is that sort of another way that, like, the Matrix. Matrix tries to keep us small and that, like, oh, it's, you know, silly to care about your appearance.
- [42:28]
Jo Miller
Anything that's basically, like, good, we will be shamed for.
- [42:31]
Kristin Cavallari
Right.
- [42:32]
Jo Miller
So we as, like, cycle breakers go against the program. So the program is like, if you do something, don't tell anyone. Right, Right. Like, it's shameful to want to change something about yourself. So, yeah. It's like, the more you kind of just own whatever you want to do.
- [42:46]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah.
- [42:46]
Jo Miller
The better. And of course, there's going to be some point where you're like, there's only so much you can do to make yourself feel. You got to do, like, some of the internal work, too.
- [42:53]
Kristin Cavallari
It's both. It's both a good combination.
- [42:54]
Jo Miller
Yeah, it's a good combo. It's a good combo. But honestly, like, whatever is going to make you feel more confident to get out there in the world, like, thank God, like, beauty. I think it's actually healing. I think, like, plastic surgery is designed to be healing.
- [43:05]
Kristin Cavallari
I love that.
- [43:06]
Jo Miller
Yeah.
- [43:06]
Kristin Cavallari
Yes. Yeah. I can tell you doing my boobs was the best thing I've ever done. Same, like, literally. I. Yeah. And I did it after I. I breastfed three kids, you know, I mean, but, like, I still. I. I tell every woman that. And I was actually against plastic surgery for the longest time, and then I did my boobs and I was like, no, I'm sorry. But what that just did for my confidence. Right. Like, a thousand percent. I would do it any day of the week.
- [43:27]
Jo Miller
I do not promote, like, I don't recommend anyone doing it, but if deep down it's going to change your life, help you get out there, help you not feel insecure and if that's what you want to do, like, I'm all for it. Shout out to, like, Dr. Diaz, Dr. Unger for me.
- [43:43]
Kristin Cavallari
Thank God, saving us girls two boobs at a time. Okay. I have three things that you've said that I love so much, and I just want you to expand on each one a little bit. Okay? Okay. You've said be unhinged, be a. Be crazy. I love it. I love it. So explain that to me.
- [43:59]
Jo Miller
Well, let's start off with the one, because I feel like you got hit with a lot of misperceptions around that.
- [44:05]
Kristin Cavallari
Thank you.
- [44:06]
Jo Miller
And everyone that I know that has, like, met you, even before I came on here, I was meeting with some friends and told them where I was coming today, and they were like, she is the sweetest person. Like, she is so kind. Like, I have heard the best things about you. I'm not just saying that because I'm on your podcast, but typically, people who say what they think are actually, like, the kindest people. And oftentimes people who feel trapped in that, like, nice cage, not that they're unkind, but it usually comes out sideways or it's not really. Like, we can only be taught to, like, smile for so long.
- [44:37]
Kristin Cavallari
Right?
- [44:37]
Jo Miller
So I think that that in this kind of day and age, women are actually, like, being more vocal and being more direct, and as a result, we're actually, like, kinder people.
- [44:46]
Kristin Cavallari
I love that. That's such. You just explained that perfectly. And also, thank you. That's very sweet to hear. I did have. When I was, like, 18 and I moved up to LA, I met with a producer, and he said, my only advice to you is to meet as as many people as possible. Because he was like, you're so different than you were on the show. I was like, is that a good thing or a bad thing? But thank you.
- [45:05]
Jo Miller
No, it's working because people are, like, just, like, using it. And I think that at the end of the day, like, it always comes out in the wash, right?
- [45:12]
Kristin Cavallari
Thousand percent. Karma is real.
- [45:15]
Jo Miller
It's real.
- [45:15]
Kristin Cavallari
It's all part of the journey, too, right? Like, I don't know if you're big on, like, birth charts and astrological signs and all that, but, like, even according to my birth chart, it's, like, part of my journey of, like, being labeled the bitch and being misunderstood and then, like, finding my voice. So I just think it's so cool how it's all connected and there's a purpose for us all. I just think it's awesome.
- [45:35]
Jo Miller
Totally.
- [45:35]
Kristin Cavallari
Okay. The second one is being the bigger person. 24, 7 is not spiritual. Sort of kind of what you just said a little bit, but elaborate just a little bit more. Yeah.
- [45:44]
Jo Miller
I feel like for old souls who grew up in narcissistic families or in families where it tips towards the narcissist. We are conditioned to always let things slide, to be the bigger person, to let things go. So that becomes a way of being in the world. But for that archetype, our programming is to actually speak up. To not let slide, to be like, that's actually not okay. And I'm like walking away. So for people who may be. Yeah. Exact boundary, literally, literally, that's the pathway. And so that requires us to like not be the bigger person, to like speak up, have our backs. Like that's usually the.
- [46:22]
Kristin Cavallari
So scary. Right. When you first learning how to speak up and set boundaries.
- [46:26]
Jo Miller
Viscerally painful.
- [46:28]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, it is, is. But when you went. I had to do that with my dad. And I remember my dad, my dad's a narcissist and I've come out of my life. But when I first, I could never speak up. When I first finally started to like, I was in therapy about it and she gave me a book about setting boundaries. And it was like terrifying. But like once you do it, then it's, oh my God, it's so much easier.
- [46:47]
Jo Miller
You can't go back.
- [46:48]
Kristin Cavallari
Can't go back.
- [46:49]
Jo Miller
It frees your soul completely. What was like the first thing you had to say to him that you were scared of?
- [46:53]
Kristin Cavallari
I used to trash my mom constantly, like even into well into a adulthood. Wow. And it would always piss me off and I would like get this fire in me. Like I literally felt it like in my stomach. And finally I just was like, no, I'm actually done with you. You don't get to trash my mom like that. And I mean, I think it definitely caught him off guard, but needed to happen.
- [47:12]
Jo Miller
That's so powerful.
- [47:13]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah.
- [47:14]
Jo Miller
And good for you. Because most of the times people, like children don't see that and they can get like brainwashed.
- [47:19]
Kristin Cavallari
Well, I was for a little while and I think that's why as an adult, I was like, oh, you're like,
- [47:23]
Jo Miller
you see it later. Yeah, that's typically how it plays out. But the fact that you caught it sooner than later, sometimes people go their whole lives.
- [47:29]
Kristin Cavallari
I know. I also feel like it's interesting, like collectively we're hyper aware now of narcissists, probably even like more so. Like, I think the word gets thrown around a lot. But I also do feel like we're dealing with a lot of.
- [47:40]
Jo Miller
Yeah, I'd rather have it be overused than underused. Yeah.
- [47:43]
Kristin Cavallari
And I do feel like a lot of people are waking up to narcissistic abuse, which is great.
- [47:46]
Jo Miller
Yeah. Thank God. Thank God, thank God. Because they can't get away with it as much. And no one knew, like, especially when you're programmed to, like, as women, like, not speak up, go with the flow. You're dealing with, like, a scary person who's narcissistic and they can, like, use against you. Like, the fear is real. It's not just, like, imagine it's real. And so now that we can label it, it can like, really save women from going into things longer than, like,
- [48:08]
Kristin Cavallari
knowing what to look out.
- [48:09]
Jo Miller
Yeah, exactly.
- [48:10]
Kristin Cavallari
Did you deal with a narcissist in your family?
- [48:12]
Jo Miller
Yeah, we have narcissism in our family for sure. And I feel like the family system always kind of tips to that person. And so it's not usually just one level of trauma. It's often like, you, you know, multiple layers of it. It's. It's the whole system. It's not always just that one person. Exactly.
- [48:30]
Kristin Cavallari
It affects everybody.
- [48:31]
Jo Miller
Yeah.
- [48:31]
Kristin Cavallari
So deep. Okay, then the third thing is, the bigger you grow, the more people you're going to let down. So true. Yeah. So explain that.
- [48:40]
Jo Miller
Really, it is. It's so true.
- [48:43]
Kristin Cavallari
Can't please everybody.
- [48:44]
Jo Miller
And if you want to grow a brand, if you want to be successful, you want to get out there and make impact, you have to become a professional disappointer.
- [48:53]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah.
- [48:53]
Jo Miller
You just do. Because it's not humanly possible. Like, your people pleaser has to die.
- [48:57]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah.
- [48:58]
Jo Miller
You know what I mean? Think about how precious your time is. You're gonna have to cancel. Sometimes you have to be a little bit more flaky. Like, it's just the way it is. And so I think it's actually an opportunity, especially in business, to be more selfish.
- [49:09]
Kristin Cavallari
Thousand percent. You gotta make yourself the priority.
- [49:12]
Jo Miller
You literally do. And. And just, like, let yourself be flaky if it means not abandoning yourself. And, like, you just have to stop doing shit out of, like, obligation, which can be really hard.
- [49:22]
Kristin Cavallari
Learn to say no. That's one of the most empowering things, learning to say no.
- [49:25]
Jo Miller
We are not taught that. Like, we usually have to learn that after, like, severe, narcissistic, psychopathic people. And then we're like, okay, now I got the hang of it.
- [49:34]
Kristin Cavallari
Oh, literally. It's so true. Well, okay, if people could only take away one message from you. What would you want that to be?
- [49:41]
Jo Miller
What do you think your audience is struggling with the most right now?
- [49:44]
Kristin Cavallari
Oh, my gosh. That's such a good question. So I do get a lot of questions about. About confidence and how I have so much confidence and how people can have more confidence in their life.
- [49:55]
Jo Miller
I believe we all have an alter ego. Like, if you have that desire, it's your destiny. So, like, there's a confident version of you that already exists.
- [50:03]
Kristin Cavallari
Cool.
- [50:04]
Jo Miller
And I feel like if you merge with her, like, every day, like, even make, like, an alter ego name and, like, channel that.
- [50:11]
Kristin Cavallari
Love that.
- [50:12]
Jo Miller
Yeah, yeah.
- [50:13]
Kristin Cavallari
Because then in a way, you're, like, separating, so it's not as vulnerable.
- [50:17]
Jo Miller
Literally. That's it. And you're just, like, channeling this character. And if you can do that, like, in your brand and in business or, like, anytime you get outside your comfort zone, you have this, like, thing that you can just turn on and shift into. So it's like, that's gonna help you, like, build your confidence as well.
- [50:32]
Kristin Cavallari
By the way. I think I've always done that with the entertainment world, and I didn't, like, realize what I was doing, but I think in order for me to disconnect a little bit, I've always had to, like, click into someone that's not entirely me.
- [50:44]
Jo Miller
Did you have, like, a cue or was there, like, a mental switch, or were you just naturally doing it?
- [50:48]
Kristin Cavallari
I think I just sort of naturally did it. Maybe when I was younger, it was more of a survival thing, you know, with being painted in this light that I didn't think was me. But no, I just sort of, like, naturally did it. But it helps. It does. Because when there's a little bit of a disconnect, even the judgment then doesn't affect.
- [51:03]
Jo Miller
Because you're like, I'm just playing this character.
- [51:04]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, you're like, cool. That's not me.
- [51:05]
Jo Miller
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I feel like they're talking shit about someone else.
- [51:08]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, exactly. That definitely helped me with reality shows for sure.
- [51:11]
Jo Miller
Oh, I can only imagine. It's so outside your control.
- [51:13]
Kristin Cavallari
Yeah, exactly. You're amazing. You are such a badass. I appreciate you being here so much. Keep doing all your videos because I'm watching and I am like, hell, yes. Tell everyone where they can find you and where they can potentially sign up with you too.
- [51:27]
Jo Miller
Yeah. So you can find me at Margo Elise Miller on Instagram, Tick Tock, and Facebook. Oh, my God, the sweetest. Actually, when you messaged me, I was like, oh, this, like, can't be real life.
- [51:36]
Kristin Cavallari
No, I literally DM'd you on TikTok. No.
- [51:38]
Jo Miller
I was like, this has to be a fake account. And then I looked at. I was like, my job is, like, dropped.
- [51:42]
Kristin Cavallari
I'm obsessed with. But you never responded. And then I got on TikTok for, like, six months.
- [51:46]
Jo Miller
I died. I was like, this was four months ago. I was like, how did I miss this? And then I had my team literally stalk your team, and we're like, I'm. We're gonna make this happen here. We are manifesting this. I was like, we are not letting this slide. I was like, the icon messaged me. No, it's true. But thank you for also, like, blazing the trail for women. I think that you've, like, changed the game in terms of, like, women stepping into their power. You, without even, like, having it be your brand message, have normalized successful women. Women being in their power. So you've been such a trailblazer for, like, our generation and the women to come. So thank you for you as well.
- [52:20]
Kristin Cavallari
Thank you. True to two Badass Women. Please note that this episode may contain
- [52:31]
Jo Miller
paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services.
- [52:34]
Kristin Cavallari
Individuals on the show may have a
- [52:36]
Jo Miller
direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.