Meet The Brand Making UPF Clothing Chic

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Meet The Brand Making UPF Clothing Chic"

Title: Let's Get Dressed
Host: Liv Perez
Episode: Meet The Brand Making UPF Clothing Chic
Release Date: June 23, 2025

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Introduction to UPF and the Need for Stylish Sun Protection

In the latest episode of Let's Get Dressed, host Liv Perez delves into the often-overlooked world of UPF (Ultraviolet Protection Factor) clothing. She highlights a startling fact: the average white T-shirt only offers a UPF rating of about 5, allowing 20% of UV rays to penetrate through to the skin (04:02). This revelation sets the stage for an in-depth discussion on the importance of sun-safe clothing and introduces listeners to a brand that's revolutionizing this space.

Guest Introduction: Emma Gerber of Claudent

Liv welcomes her longtime friend, Emma Gerber, the co-founder of Claudent, a brand dedicated to designing stylish, elevated UPF 50+ clothing. Emma shares her personal connection to the brand’s mission, rooted in her partner's sun allergy, which necessitates reliable sun protection without compromising on style (07:53).

Notable Quote:
Emma Gerber: "I don't want to wear the UPF clothing that exists in the market. I don't want to only be wearing, like, a paisley print or a pastel color. I want to look how I want to look, and I want to feel comfortable." (07:53)

The Origin Story of Claudent

Emma recounts the inception of Claudent, driven by her business partner's struggle with polymorphic light eruption—a sun allergy that causes hives and rashes upon sun exposure (09:45). Additionally, Liv shares a poignant personal anecdote about her father's melanoma diagnosis during her middle school years, underscoring the critical importance of sun protection (08:41).

Notable Quote:
Liv Perez: "I have to remember to reapply every 90 minutes. I'm not going to miss a spot. Spot that is, like, invisible to the naked eye because I know where my clothes are on my body." (08:41)

Understanding UPF: Beyond Traditional Sun Protection

Liv and Emma break down what UPF entails, explaining that it functions similarly to SPF but for clothing. UPF 50+ garments allow only 1 out of every 50 UV rays to penetrate, offering significantly better protection than standard fabrics (13:31).

Notable Quote:
Emma Gerber: "We test everything with the AATCC, which is the American Association of Textile Chemists and Colorists. Anything above a UPF 30 is considered protective, and our garments maintain UPF 50+" (14:09).

Designing Fashion-Forward UPF Clothing

Emma details the intensive process of designing Claudent's apparel. The brand meticulously selects fabrics that not only provide maximum sun protection but also ensure comfort and style. After testing over 1,500 fabric headers, Claudent focused on creating garments that feel like favorite vintage pieces rather than typical rash guards (16:05).

Notable Quote:
Emma Gerber: "We wanted it to feel like when you grab your favorite vintage button-up from your closet to throw over your bathing suit." (16:05)

Sustainability and Material Choices

Claudent emphasizes sustainability by opting for recycled synthetic fibers, which retain their UPF properties longer compared to chemically treated natural fibers. This decision reflects a commitment to creating durable, long-lasting products that minimize environmental impact (18:09).

Notable Quote:
Emma Gerber: "We decided on recycled synthetic fibers that have inherent protection, as opposed to chemicals and natural fibers." (18:12)

Overcoming Industry Challenges and Misconceptions

The discussion shifts to the challenges Claudent faces in the fashion industry, particularly the high costs and limited availability of stylish UPF fabrics. Emma explains that the perception of UPF clothing as uncomfortable or unattractive is a significant barrier (22:04).

Notable Quote:
Emma Gerber: "People think of sun protection as a chore. We're trying to bridge the gap by offering stylish options that people actually want to wear." (20:13)

Marketing Strategies: Changing Perceptions Through Experience

Claudent has effectively utilized pop-up shops in resorts and high-traffic locations to allow potential customers to experience the quality and style of their UPF clothing firsthand. This hands-on approach has been crucial in dispelling myths about UPF apparel being solely functional and unappealing (27:04).

Notable Quote:
Emma Gerber: "Being able to feel the fabric is what makes the biggest difference for us. It changes people's minds about what UPF clothing feels like." (27:04)

Future Collections and Innovations

Looking ahead, Emma shares insights into upcoming collections, including a backless silk dress designed to offer sun protection without sacrificing style. This exemplifies Claudent's commitment to expanding their range while maintaining high standards of protection and aesthetics (24:12).

Notable Quote:
Emma Gerber: "We’re developing our SS26 collection, which includes a backless silk dress that provides added sun protection in a chic design." (25:22)

Personal Fulfillment and Brand Growth

Liv and Emma discuss the emotional rewards of building a brand that aligns personal values with business objectives. Emma expresses immense satisfaction in seeing her products become wardrobe staples that customers actively choose rather than merely functional items (30:02).

Notable Quote:
Emma Gerber: "Wearing it because I want to, not because I have to, is really fulfilling." (30:02)

Advice for Aspiring Entrepreneurs

In the concluding segment, Emma offers valuable advice for those looking to start their own brands. She emphasizes the importance of believing in oneself and being willing to bet on one's vision to inspire others to invest and support the venture (30:48).

Notable Quote:
Emma Gerber: "You have to believe in yourself and bet on yourself. You can't expect others to bet on you if you're not willing to do it on yourself." (30:48)

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Conclusion

This episode of Let's Get Dressed provides an insightful exploration into the intersection of fashion and functionality through the lens of UPF clothing. Liv Perez and Emma Gerber shed light on the importance of sun protection, the challenges of creating stylish UPF apparel, and the passion driving Claudent's mission to make sun-safe clothing both chic and accessible. Listeners are left inspired by the blend of personal experience, scientific understanding, and creative design that underpins Claudent's offerings, encouraging a more thoughtful approach to everyday sun protection.

Transcript

[Ryan Reynolds]

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[Zoe Saldana]

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[Ryan Reynolds]

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[Zoe Saldana]

C mobile.com hi everyone. Welcome back to another episode of let's get dressed. It's your host, Liv Perez. Did you know that the average white T shirt only has a UPF rating of about 5, meaning that 20% of UV rays will still reach your skin on a daily basis. And yet we all go about our day throwing clothes on and thinking that we're protected from the sun's rays. This week we are diving into the world of UPF fellow fashion, what it means and getting to know a brand that is making sun safe clothing actually chic. Today I'm joined by one of my oldest friends, Emma Gerber. We've actually known each other since we were babies. And she also just so happens to be building one of the most exciting brands in the sun care space right now. It's called Claudent and it's designing stylish, elevated UPF 50 plus clothing that not only protects your skin, but also makes you want to wear sun safe clothing. We talk about the science of UPF fabric, why most quote unquote sun protective clothes actually wash out after a few cycles, and how her brand is combining function and fashion all at once. If you are someone who loves sun safety, but also if you're just looking for really great summer basics, I know you guys are going to love getting to know Emma and love the brand. Before we get going, A quick housekeeping note. If you love this podcast, you will definitely, definitely love my new substack newsletter. Let's Get Dressed. As a subscriber, you will get weekly fashion deep dives, daily styling tips, trend forecasting, and access to an incredible community of fashion lovers alike. And as a thank you to you guys for being my podcast listeners, I'm giving you three months free when you subscribe for the full year. That's just $63 for exclusive content and access to my private style chat where you can ask me questions directly like what to wear to a friend's wedding or how to style that new shoe that you just got for your closet. You can sign up through the link in the show notes and I hope to see you guys there. Let's go get dressed with Claudent's Emma Gerber. Welcome to the pod.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Thank you.

[Zoe Saldana]

I'm so excited that you're here.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Me too.

[Zoe Saldana]

It's been a while since I've had. Actually, I don't think I've had like, an OG childhood friend on the pod. Maybe I have ever. I don't think so.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Okay. Well, I'm honored.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah, I don't think so. This, like, feels fun.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. Feels like comfortable.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah. Usually I have guests, like, come over and they come to the pod and like, the dog is in the back of the room. No one knows the dog's here. And you're like, keep the dog.

[Ryan Reynolds]

No, I like, want the dog to kiss me on the face.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah. If anybody hears Bodhi running around, I'm sorry. But we're also not that sorry.

[Ryan Reynolds]

No. Why not?

[Zoe Saldana]

How are you?

[Ryan Reynolds]

Good. How are you?

[Zoe Saldana]

What's going on in life?

[Ryan Reynolds]

Nothing. I'm going on a trip tomorrow. So today I'm just trying to after this organized pack, the day before you.

[Zoe Saldana]

Leave for a trip is, to me, hell on earth.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I have, like, the most pre trip anxiety.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

No matter what.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yep. I was just listening to a podcast episode this morning about this, about how, like, people spiral in chaos moments. And I think it was a Mel Robbins episode. And she was like, when I have so much to do, all of a sudden I'll just pick up a different activity. Like, I'll start cleaning my house. The house doesn't need to be cleaned, but there's like 10,000 other things I need to do.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I just, like, make a list of, like, all the things I have to do today and why they're annoying, and then I will do them at like.

[Zoe Saldana]

4Pm do you prioritize them in order of annoyingness?

[Ryan Reynolds]

No, I just put them all off. And then whatever closes first gets done first. So, like, the drugstore will be last. The dry cleaner will be first.

[Zoe Saldana]

Right, right, right. But are you doing the most annoying thing first or are you leaving it to the end?

[Ryan Reynolds]

Probably leaving it to the end.

[Zoe Saldana]

Why do we do that?

[Ryan Reynolds]

Paralyzed with fear.

[Zoe Saldana]

Paralyzed with fear, but also, like, I set myself up to fail.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Zoe Saldana]

I'm like, just do the hard thing first. Enjoy the rest of your day.

[Ryan Reynolds]

We all procrastinate. It's human nature.

[Zoe Saldana]

Last Monday, I had a full calendar of things I needed to get done. Right? And then I woke up and I saw something, like, on our YouTube that I didn't like. I spent the rest of the day redoing the entire YouTube channel.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah, of course.

[Zoe Saldana]

Wasn't even on my to do list. Didn't need to be doing it, but spent the entire day doing that and didn't hit any of the, like, pretty urgent things that I need to do on my to do list. It's a sickness.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I wonder if it's like, the ability to, like, start and stop something that you decided to do. Like, you. You saw something you didn't like, and it was like, easy to fix it. And you got to, like, see the fruits of your labor immediately. You weren't like, planting the seed for something. You were like, I'm gonna fix this right now. And then you were done, and you got to be, like, fulfilled.

[Zoe Saldana]

I do think there's something to that, because when I make my to do list, like, on Friday for the next week, it sits with me all weekend.

[Ryan Reynolds]

That's a crazy habit. You do it on Friday and you think about it all weekend.

[Zoe Saldana]

You see what I mean? It's like the more time and space you give to These things to breathe, the more they fester. Whereas, like, if I just woke up or maybe I waited till Sunday.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Zoe Saldana]

So I woke up Monday organized. But yeah, I'm that way. Like sometimes, like even right now, I'm like, what do I have to do next Monday?

[Ryan Reynolds]

Oh, I'm a like morning of. And then I like, sometimes I even write that down. Things I've already done so that I can get the satisfaction of checking it off.

[Zoe Saldana]

Now I do this thing at the end of the day where if I don't feel accomplished, I actually wrote down everything I did that day so I could be like, look at how much you actually did.

[Ryan Reynolds]

That was very nice. I like that. Yeah.

[Zoe Saldana]

Positive affirmation. I'm not like an affirmations girly, but like, I will do things that actually remind me of all the things. Like it's good practice. Right. I feel like we do that at the beginning of the day, but what about at the end of the day?

[Ryan Reynolds]

No, that's more.

[Zoe Saldana]

I like that. Yeah. Okay, great. Now I'm thinking about all the things I need to do next week.

[Ryan Reynolds]

My heart rate's a little bit elevated now.

[Zoe Saldana]

I mean, it was when we started, but it's okay. We're still here. I'm thrilled to have you on the POD today. I feel like you and I first connected on your brand when I did the UPF segment for the Today show two years ago. And I actually remember that being very eye opening because obviously UPF is something that is so important we should all be wearing especially peak summer. But I was shocked at how many people didn't know about it and how limited the assortment of UPF clothes were. Not to say that the brands that are selling it are not great brands, affordable, accessible to a lot of people. But it was very refined, like, or. Sorry, it was very niche. Like the athletes of the world, the Lululemons. There's this one brand, Cooly bar. I think you and I talked about that. Like, I think hits a very similar specific demographic. But there hasn't been like a cool fashion brand that's been like, let's also make it sun safe. So I remember us connecting on that and it was the first time I heard you were doing all of this and I was so excited about it. So tell me a little bit about like the origin story of Claudette.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah, so my business partner actually is allergic to the sun, which I was not totally like, sure was a real thing unless you had to be like a real shut in. But she has like a, like a claritin Allegra everyday routine that allows her to. To not, like, break out in hives and be allergic to the sun. And she was, like, shopping around and she was sort of seeing what was out there because it's something that started affecting her in her late 20s, early 30s. And so she was like, I don't necessarily want to wear the UPF clothing that exists in the market. I don't want to only be wearing, like, a paisley print or a pastel color. I want to look how I want to look, and I want to feel comfortable, and I want to feel like me while still wearing UPF clothing in order to sort of decrease the symptoms of her allergy.

[Zoe Saldana]

Right.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And so she was, like, looking. Searching far and wide. And she was talking to me about it, and she was like, I feel like maybe we should do this. And I was, like, not totally well versed in the UPF space. And then we just sort of started toying around with the idea and for me felt really personal because in middle school, my dad was diagnosed with melanoma. And so I definitely, like, was very aware of skin cancer and sun protection and the importance of spf. And I think the idea that you could just wear something really easy that gives you that added layer of sun protection and doesn't. I do totally support wearing sunscreen every day. Everyone should wear sunscreen. But there's, like, no user error. Like, I'm putting my shirt on. I don't need to remember to reapply every 90 minutes. I'm not going to miss a spot. Spot that is, like, invisible to the naked eye because I know where my clothes are on my body. And so that's sort of how we started.

[Zoe Saldana]

Allergic to the sun is a. That's a tough one.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I know. It's really. Especially living in Los Angeles feels a bit tricky.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah. It's sunny here 90% of the time.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. And I guess it affects, like, about 10% of the population. It's called polymorphic light eruption. And it's not debilitating by any means, but it's quite uncomfortable.

[Zoe Saldana]

Hives, right?

[Ryan Reynolds]

Hives, rash. It's very uncomfortable.

[Zoe Saldana]

Wow. Yeah, I. I've not heard of that before, but I feel like it's when I. I remember being younger and I feel like there were those allergies that. Or more so as I know people who, as they've gotten older, have developed an allergy that they haven't had when they were kids.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. They say, I think it's like every seven or nine years, your allergies change.

[Zoe Saldana]

I Think they say. Don't they say that about most things in the body?

[Ryan Reynolds]

Oh, really?

[Zoe Saldana]

Like every. I've always heard that, like every seven years your hormones adjust or something like that. I don't know if there's fact to that, but I have heard that.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. I was lactose intolerant as a child, and I'm not anymore.

[Zoe Saldana]

My sister one day woke up insanely allergic to bananas.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Really?

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah. She cannot, Austin cannot eat bananas.

[Ryan Reynolds]

She just woke up one morning and.

[Zoe Saldana]

Ate one, had a banana, like she did every day and had like a full allergic breakout.

[Ryan Reynolds]

New thing to be scared about.

[Zoe Saldana]

Great. Let's add it to the list of other things. I think of things like that. Yeah. Okay. So she has this regimen every day that she's sick to every day.

[Ryan Reynolds]

But it's more like. Like, if she's, like, running a quick errand, it's not something she has to be super worried about, but it's like prolonged outdoor exposure, vacation, summer.

[Zoe Saldana]

Right?

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Zoe Saldana]

You know what's interesting? I feel now more than ever, sun care is huge. I have friends who are. Who have completely demonized the sun, unlike anything I've ever seen. Whereas, you know, I remember growing up being in the sun was like the thing I think our parents were, you know, sunbathing, no sunscreen for years. But I feel like there are also so many things now that I'm learning about sun care that maybe I didn't know before. Like, I didn't know that reapplying even was a big thing. Like, and I've seen a lot of that language on TikTok recently of like, okay, you put sunscreen on in the morning, but are you reapplying it through the day? I don't even do that.

[Ryan Reynolds]

90 minutes is not a long time.

[Zoe Saldana]

It only lasts 90 minutes.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I mean, I am not a dermatologist or a doctor, but I have been told that you should reapply your sunscreen every 90 minutes.

[Zoe Saldana]

I mean, I put sunscreen on when I. Even when I am just working from home all day. It's also the same thing when you're on a plane. I've always heard if you're in the window seat, you need to be wearing sunblock.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Or in the car.

[Zoe Saldana]

Or in the car. That's a big one. And I see that a lot in Los Angeles. People who will. Who will drive with UPF gloves. My mom has, you know, all the things that, like, protect the car on her windows. Yeah, there's been a lot of advancements.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. I think also, like, I mean, I Grew up with, like, a mom who loved the sun. Same, like, worked at a tanning salon when she was in high school. Like, loved the sun. And a dad who was really scared of the sun.

[Zoe Saldana]

Right.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Who, like, because I grew up, like, being a competitive equestrian, I was outside every day for a long period of time. And my dad's, like, crazy about the shade and sunscreen, whereas, like, my mom's, like, with the foil outside. And so it's interesting to kind of like, I don't know, I think I ended up somewhere in the middle.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And then now with like, what I do and who I work with, sort of finding a way to be both. Like, I still am gonna wear my bathing suit. I still want an hour in my bikini by the pool, but then I want to be able to get myself out of the sun.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yes. I think there's a nice balance. I also, like, I love. Not that I love hearing, you know, about your dad going through this really challenging time, but I do think the best brands are from founders who have personal experiences with things and want to create a solution not just for themselves, but for a lot of other people. Okay, so let's get into UPF a little bit. What does it stand for? And then tell me a little bit about the difference between wearing a UPF shirt and just wearing a traditional long sleeve.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. So UPF is for like all intents and purposes like SPF for your clothing or for fabric. And it stands for ultraviolet protective factor. And so anything above a UPF 30 plus is going to be widely considered protective. And anything under a UPF 30 is just more or less like your day to day cotton shirt. And your average white cotton tea is going to be about a UPF 3 to a 5. So that means that 1 out of every 5 UVA and UVB rays is still penetrating your skin through your clothing, whereas a UPF 50 plus garment, which ours are only one out of every 50.

[Zoe Saldana]

Wow. Okay.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Is still penetrating your skin.

[Zoe Saldana]

I remember when you and I were talking about. We did a pre call for this and you were talking about how in the industry right now there are a lot of quote unquote, UPF clothes that aren't really UPF and that come out in the wash really quickly. What should people be looking for as their shopping? Upf, like other certain certifications, standards that really make the world of difference.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. So we test everything with the aatcc, which is the American association of Textile Chemists and Colorists.

[Zoe Saldana]

Okay.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And they are sort of responsible for the standards that you test to and we test everything to their AATCC standards. And so as I said before, like, a 30 plus is going to give you pretty good protection, 50 plus being the highest possible rating. And for us, what was really important is to not use any chemical treatments. So a lot of your, like, lower price point, like Amazon, like Amazon Basics 15Amazon Basics UPF shirt is going to be a chemical treatment. And what, what happens is the more you wash it, the more the protection is going to wash out. So you really only have on average about 30 washes for your shirt before it's just like wearing any other shirt. Whereas ours is actually about how the fabric is woven and what it's woven with. And you will have your protection for the lifetime of your garment. So that's not to say if your shirt lasts a hundred years, it will still be a 50 plus, but it will never go before 30, whereas a chemical treatment will wash out to the single digits.

[Zoe Saldana]

There is so much I feel like, that you have to go through to make these products what they are. What was that process like? Even just like as a brand founder, as a designer, like, what was the learning curve of finding all the right suppliers, right vendors, right certifications, what was that like?

[Ryan Reynolds]

It was really hard. I think we tested probably over 1500 fabric headers, and we felt really passionate about not making what people think UPF clothing feels like. We didn't want to make a rash guard. We didn't want to make something super hot and slinky and like, not comfortable. We wanted it to feel like when you grab your favorite vintage button up from your closet to throw over your bathing suit. And so what we were able to find kind of off the bat was more athletic fabric. So, like, to make our polo shirt and our tennis skirt, like, that was not necessarily what we set out to do, but what we made with our first collection. And then we ended up finding a mill who made the best UPF fabric we could find on the market for what we wanted to make, but it was still not what we wanted. And so we did like six month to a year process with them sending things that we loved and owned. Being like, how can we get closer to this hand feel? How can we get closer to this drape and sort of working with them to create something totally proprietary. So it was really tough. But I think we were really confident in what we wanted to do and how we wanted the fabric to feel. And I think it's been an interesting journey because from like a sustainability standpoint, we didn't want to make something super Wasteful. And we didn't want to make something super bad for the environment. But in order to achieve a UPF 50 plus, you do, or at least in my experience, have to use some synthetic fibers and some synthetic blends. And so the sort of trade off being one shirt that will last you your lifetime instead of maybe five shirts made from a natural fiber with a chemical treatment that will only last you one summer. So fewer better as opposed to natural fibers that will not last for a long time with the protection.

[Zoe Saldana]

I do think there's a sustainable aspect to that.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. And I think like it's not sexy to be like it's a poly blend, it's a nylon blend. There's definitely some trade offs with that. But we're using recycled wherever possible. And I think just like fewer better things, no matter really what they are, is the way that I want to live my life and the way that I think can become the most sustainable. Like not to say that we wouldn't love a natural alternative. And we are experimenting with tencell and recycled spandex and things like that. But that was sort of the choice that we made was recycled synthetic fibers that have that inherent protection as opposed to chemicals and natural fibers.

[Zoe Saldana]

I mean there really aren't a lot of brands doing this.

[Ryan Reynolds]

No. I mean I think it's big in a lot of other countries. I think like Coolibar and Solbari, these sort of like giants of the UPF space are Australian. Right. And I think in like when I was in Japan, I don't know if you noticed this on your trip, but I felt like everyone was wearing gloves.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yes.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Even if they were wearing like a tube top and a tank top, they were wearing gloves also.

[Zoe Saldana]

Just in general. I mean, when I was there it was really warm. We were there at the end of May and locals were covered head to toe. I was in like a tank top and pants. But there was no sacrifice on that. It was. They were fully protected.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. So I feel like in Asia, in Australia it is quite a big more popular.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Thing. But here it's not. I think it's for babies. I think especially because I learned recently that like you can't put sunscreen on your baby until they're like six months old.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yep.

[Ryan Reynolds]

So I think for children it's really important and I think older people and golfers or deep sea fishermen, like people with these sort of like really specific needs. But in terms of like day to day use, I don't really. I did a pop up in Hawaii and this woman was like did you invent this? I'm like, I didn't invent it.

[Zoe Saldana]

That's crazy in Hawaii.

[Ryan Reynolds]

But it's interesting that you think that.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah, I mean, I. I think Americans have given it an unsexy connotation.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I think people think of sun protection as a chore. I was having this conversation with my friend recently, and he was like, your clothes are so expensive. Like, my friend was looking at your website. Cause she wanted to support you, but it's too expensive. She doesn't want to spend that because sun protection feels like a chore. You're not like, I don't want to buy a $250 shirt for something I don't really want to do.

[Zoe Saldana]

Right.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And so what we're sort of trying to bridge the gap on is, like, yes, it's expensive, and yes, it is sun protection, but it's also just a good shirt. And I think, like, look. Yes, there's the melanoma, the skin cancer. All these really serious reasons why you need sun protection. But living in a place like la, there's also vanity. You want to protect your neck and chest. You want to protect your skin. You want. I don't know. I feel like we live in a place where people are getting peels and people are getting facials and people are doing these treatments that make them even more sensitive to laser hair removal.

[Zoe Saldana]

Right.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Drinking a margarita.

[Zoe Saldana]

I mean, I feel like you see aging most on your neck and chest first as well. Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And your tops of your hands.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yes. Like, I get Botox, but when I. I notice now when I wake up.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Zoe Saldana]

After sleeping on my side, sometimes my whole chest is wrinkled.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Zoe Saldana]

And I'm like, I should probably not. I actually, when I go out now, I'm putting more sunscreen on my chest than I am anywhere else if I'm by the pool.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. And I just think, like, that's maybe a more fun angle.

[Zoe Saldana]

Right.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Like, I want to look good. I want to look good for longer. And so I need to take care of my skin. Not, like, ugh, I have to wear sunscreen every day.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah. Let's reposition it.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Zoe Saldana]

Let's completely rebrand.

[Ryan Reynolds]

You look chic and look young forever.

[Zoe Saldana]

What do you think are some, like, big misconceptions around UPF that people are getting wrong maybe in the way that they wear it or they buy it? Is there something where you're like, let's. Let's clear the air on that?

[Ryan Reynolds]

I think that it all feels like a rash guard and that you're going to be really Hot. Like, I think whenever I'm like, oh, it's sun protective clothing, people are like, oh, it's hot. I don't want to wear that in the summer. I'm not comfortable. It's thick. Like, it's. I understand why you think that. And, like, I've definitely been on vacation and bought the. The souvenir store rash guard. That's uncomfortable because it was a need, not a want.

[Zoe Saldana]

Right.

[Ryan Reynolds]

But I think the idea that clothes you want to wear can be UPF 50 plus is not something that people think is true. And so I think we're really trying to be that first piece of UPF clothing that you buy. So it's like, I like this shirt. I like these pants. And it's an added bonus. Not like, oh, I need to buy this weird printed rash guard because I have a bad burn.

[Zoe Saldana]

Is there a world? And this is my limited knowledge on manufacturing. I'm trying to think of why big fashion brands don't just include UPF in some of their. Like. Like, for example, if I was a brand that really did a lot of, like, summer dresses, I would be wanting to include UPF in all my clothing. Just as an added bonus. Yeah, what is the, like, guardrail there? Are they just not wanting to invest in the material? Is it expensive? Like, why are we just not seeing it more? Fashion in general, I think.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I mean, in my experience, it's really expensive, but I also am making such limited quantities, and I make everything in Los Angeles, so that's just sort of a triple whammy for expensive. I also think it's really hard to find nice UPF fabric. I think it's sort of a chicken or an egg. Like, is. Would there be nicer UPF fabric on the market if more people used upf? And would more. Or would more people use UPF if there was nicer UPF fabric on the market?

[Zoe Saldana]

Talk to me a little bit about the process of designing something that's a bit more fashion forward. Like I was saying earlier, there's not a lot of options out there. And I'm sure that there's a very, like, strategic conversation around, like, hey, we're going to include these fabrics, but also we're going to be selling things that people actually want to wear in their everyday lives. Like a great pair of green pants that I've been obsessing over or, you know, an amazing blue button down that somebody can wear to the office, to the beach. And I feel like that's not really being done. So talk to me about a Little bit about that process.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. So I think definitely, like, the biggest hurdle is coverage. Like.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

How many different ways are you going to make a long sleeve or a long pant? And so I think what we're trying to do is be super modular. So I think you could wear this button up with a bikini bottom if that's who you are and that's what you want. But you can also wear our mock neck turtleneck under this button up if you want the longer sleeve, you want to cover your neck. So sort of trying to speak to a wider swath of people who want different levels of sun protection. And like, no judgment, like, if you want to wear our short short, I want to wear it. And it's easy and it's comfortable and I'm still getting that added sun protection. And so I think we're sort of trying to toe the line with what is really obvious from a sun protection standpoint. Like, I do sort of think this is an obvious easy shirt. It's long sleeve, it's full length, covers your skin. It has buttons. So you can button it all the way up if you want. But then we're developing our SS26 collection right now. And like, I'm making a backless silk dress.

[Zoe Saldana]

You are.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And maybe that's not obvious and maybe it's not the most sun protective garment in the world, but there's a girl who wants to wear that and does appreciate the added benefit, but it's not the be all end all. Like, they don't want to be wearing a long sleeve turtleneck, long pants, and high socks in Mexico.

[Zoe Saldana]

Some is better than none in my opinion. And I think being able to offer a fashion forward selection for something that people really do care about is amazing, I think. And I, I love the collection you just did. I think the colors are so great. And that to me, really caught my attention this time. I know your first collection was very athletic, focused. You had the tennis skirt.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Zoe Saldana]

This really felt like a foray into something that, like, I can't wait to wear. Like, I'm gonna wear the button down and shorts to the beach this weekend, and I can't wait. Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I think what was interesting is I loved our first collection and I thought it was really beautiful and I loved the fabrics, but I never reached for it. And like, I'm willing to admit that I own them. I wear them sometimes, but it's not what I want to wear. This. I want to wear these pants. I want to wear the. We just made a relaxed short that's Like a slouchy, oversized short. I reach for it every day. And the fact that we can make something that is sun protective and useful and just, like, nice to wear.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Is just, like, really fulfilling and really exciting.

[Zoe Saldana]

As a small brand, do you feel like there's been something specifically that has helped you get a lot of attention? Whether it's like an ad campaign that you did marketing on Instagram, like, what do you think has been a really good fire for you guys in a.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Sort of interesting way? I think being able to pop up in real life has made the biggest difference, because sort of what you were asking about, like, preconceived notions of UPF fabric. I think people, like, have put it in this box in their head where they're like, oh, I don't like it. And so we did a pop up at a hotel in Hawaii and people were like, oh, this is nice. Like, this is comfortable, this is lightweight. And then we see them come back on our website, or we did a trunk show at my mom's house or we did one in Montecito. And I think sort of, yes. I love Instagram and I love our shoots and we work with creative, creative, talented, beautiful, wonderful people. But I think the, like, being able to feel the fabric is what makes the biggest difference for us. And I think it's the biggest hurdle because it's expensive and it's hard to find these places around the country to pop up and to bring the inventory and all those things. But I do think being able to change people's minds about what UPF clothing feels like is what's helping us the most. We're in one resort in Hawaii, two resorts in Mexico, and we're gonna go in a new hotel that's opening in the Rockaways in New York.

[Zoe Saldana]

Cool.

[Ryan Reynolds]

So, like, that sort of has been our niche.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

But I think we'll get emails being like, oh, I bought this pair of shorts at this hotel, but they didn't have the top. Like, I want the matching top. And so I think sort of in a weird way where, like, I think Instagram and ads and all those things and influencers have been great for us, but I do think for the everyday customer, being able to change their mind in person is what is really helpful.

[Zoe Saldana]

That makes a lot of sense, just being able to feel it and be like, oh, it's not, as you were saying earlier, it's not that rash guard material. Like, it's a whole other thing.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. And like, oh, this is just like a great pair of pants.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

It's not like a weird swim legging with like my reef walkers.

[Zoe Saldana]

The green pants.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Zoe Saldana]

I would say if anyone's listening right now and wants to buy something, it's either the shirt you're wearing or the green pants.

[Ryan Reynolds]

The green pants are great. They are sold out in extra small, but okay. Well, another size.

[Zoe Saldana]

Yes. But also the top. You're wearing the button up shirt. I have it in like a cerulean blue and you're wearing it in like a light beautiful blue that has made your eyes look really great this whole time.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Mm.

[Zoe Saldana]

But highly recommend both of those. What has been your proudest moment so far with the brand?

[Ryan Reynolds]

I think there's two. I think what I was saying before, like making these things that I reach for in my closet is just like a crazy experience. I think, like, I always loved fashion and I always like, I made like this weird bootleg magazine as a child in my house, my parents and like it was just always such like a far fledged dream idea. I went to film school, didn't think I was going to do fashion. But then like to be like, oh, I'm getting dressed and I'm not wearing it because I have to or because it's like mine. Wearing it because I want to. And I find that really fulfilling. And then every time a stranger orders on my website, it like sets my heart a flutter.

[Zoe Saldana]

Oh.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Because I feel like selling to your friends and family is one thing. And then you get these people that are like 12 degrees of separation. You're like, oh, that's like Blank's cousin. Like, you're so grateful, but you're like getting those people where you're like, how did you find this?

[Zoe Saldana]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Like, where did you come from? And you still want it and you don't like care about me as a person, you just want my product. I don't know. I find it really exciting and kind of weird and fun.

[Zoe Saldana]

A real impact somewhere. Like someone you convinced someone of the product without having to have a personal relationship.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. I don't know. I find it really exciting. I'm like, ooh. Like you're at, you're like from a state I've never been to and like, you still want the shirt.

[Zoe Saldana]

For people listening right now who maybe eventually want to start a brand or think it's a crazy idea and no one's going to buy it, what would be your biggest piece of advice?

[Ryan Reynolds]

You don't bet on yourself. How can you expect anyone else to?

[Zoe Saldana]

So true.

[Ryan Reynolds]

So I mean, that's obviously very privileged. A lot of people don't have the ability to do that. But I think you have to believe in yourself and you have to bet on yourself. And you can't expect customers, investors, co workers, partners to bet on you if you're not willing to do it on yourself.

[Zoe Saldana]

Love that. Thanks for coming on the show.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Thank you for having me.

[Zoe Saldana]

This was so fun.

[Ryan Reynolds]

SA.