Arian Moayed: Artists Have the Answers, Show Up Again and Again, and...Ditch Your Smartphone?

Summary

Let's Give A Damn – Episode Summary

Podcast: Let's Give A Damn
Host: Nick Laparra
Guest: Arian Moayed (Emmy and Tony-nominated actor, nonprofit founder, artist)
Episode: "Artists Have the Answers, Show Up Again and Again, and… Ditch Your Smartphone?"
Date: October 7, 2025

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Overview

This episode features a lively and forthright conversation between host Nick Laparra and actor/activist Arian Moayed. Together, they discuss Arian's immigrant story, the function of art in turbulent times, systemic barriers in the entertainment industry, and the importance of resilience, community, and speaking truth as artists. The episode is rich with insights about navigating Hollywood as a person of color, the call for deeper and quicker systemic change, and living intentionally in a hyper-connected, often overwhelming world.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Arian's Career & Impact of 'Succession'

• [06:42] Arian describes how landing the role of Stewy in Succession was a career game-changer, moving him from stereotypical, often victimized roles that focused on his Iranian identity to more nuanced characters with agency.
• Quote (Arian, 06:49):
  "Succession brought me to another atmosphere... Now I only play rich assholes. Prior, I was always up for someone that's going through such fucking turmoil."
• He reflects on the industry's tendency to typecast actors of color, especially those with immigrant backgrounds.

2. Representation & Systemic Challenges in the Arts

• [10:34–14:14] Discussion of slow progress in entertainment regarding representation and the enduring power held by middlemen—often excluding marginalized voices.
• Arian argues true change will happen when underrepresented folks control the "levers"—owning production, distribution, and funding.
• Quote (Arian, 12:15):
  "Those mechanisms will only change when society says it has to... But if we're the ones who have the money and pick the art we want to make, we won't have those problems."

3. The Artist's Resilience: Persistence Over Playbooks

• [18:02–21:15] Arian draws from his immigrant experience and years of teaching high school artists, asserting there's no roadmap and the only real answer is persistent, repeated effort.
• Quote (Arian, 18:02):
  "Everyone's bullshitting. Everyone's making it up. No one has any fucking answers. If they had answers, they would do those answers. The only people that have the answers are artists."
• He counsels artists to focus on "the doing," overcoming obstacles by showing up repeatedly.

4. Immigrant Story and How Art Became His Lifeline

• [25:25–31:27] Arian details his family’s escape from Iran:
  • Born during the Iran-Iraq war, the youngest by many years, he immigrated to Chicago in 1986.
  • Grew up as the translator for his family while navigating public schools and cultural assimilation.
  • Discovered art as a form of escape and expression, eventually leading him to New York and co-founding the nonprofit Waterwell.

5. Founding Waterwell: Art as Civic Engagement

• [31:27–34:00] Story of producing their first off-Broadway shows with little money, innovating their way around obstacles, and intentionally using art to pose and engage civic questions.

6. The Role of Live Art and Human Connection

• [53:04-54:48] Arian defends the irreplaceable role of live performance and collective experience in an age of AI and virtual content.
• Quote (Arian, 54:01):
  "I could still do theater, and no one wants to see a robot on stage doing a Doll's House."

7. Art, Activism, and Speaking Out in Difficult Times

• [51:14–54:48; 57:52–63:00] The conversation addresses how artists are negotiating risks of speaking up on issues like Gaza, trans rights, and more, and observes a recent increase in boldness from prominent artists.

8. The Power and Limits of Art to Move the Needle

• [64:04–70:53] Arian outlines Waterwell's process: creating performances that explore unanswerable questions with community input (immigration, military service, voting issues) to provoke reflection rather than push ideology.

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• On being typecast and arriving at 'Succession':
  "Prior to succession ... my Iranian-ness was on full display in all those roles. ... Now I only play rich assholes." (Arian, 06:49)
• On true systemic change:
  "If Oprah has the OWN network, she makes content about Black folks because she's Black. If Tyler Perry has the lever, he can tell the stories he wants to tell." (Arian, 12:20)
• On making art despite obstacles:
  "None of this shit about making a movie or making a play is gonna ever be as hard as that [immigrating] for me." (Arian, 19:17)
• On the necessity of artists:
  "The only things that will matter are the art that is made and the wars that we fought." (Arian, 52:53)
• On the dangers of division:
  "If it's a man that's greedy and has land, he'll use any fucking tool to divide us." (Arian, 45:17)
• On live human connection:
  "We're so interested in a live experience... Live human experiences are the things that we have." (Arian, 54:28)
• On ditching his smartphone:
  "I've been on a flip phone for a year now...I'm too vulnerable and sensitive to be watching those videos. I can't do it anymore." (Arian, 79:29)
• On persistent obstacles for artists:
  "I don't have roadblocks. I have a shit ton of obstacles ... but it's just the doing of it." (Arian, 19:19)

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Important Segments & Timestamps

• Arian’s Career, Typecasting & ‘Succession’ Break:
  • [06:04–07:59]
• Industry Representation and Structural Change:
  • [10:34–14:47]
• Persistence as an Artist:
  • [18:02–21:15]
• Immigrant Story & Early Life:
  • [25:25–31:27]
• Founding Waterwell – Scrappy Art-making:
  • [31:51–34:00]
• Art, Activism, and Navigating Politics:
  • [51:14–54:48; 57:52–63:00]
• How to Move the Needle in the Arts:
  • [64:04–70:53]
• Ditching the Smartphone, Finding Presence:
  • [79:29–82:49]

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Waterwell: Community-Focused Art

• [66:53–70:54] Waterwell partners with community orgs to create timely, civically-engaged performances—recently on immigration, climate change, and voting rights.
• Example: "The Courtroom" uses real transcripts from an immigrant’s deportation case to spur nuanced, bipartisan discussion.

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Release Announcements & Upcoming Projects

• ‘Nobody Wants This’ Season 2 on Netflix:
  • [71:13] October 23rd release
• Executive Producing Upcoming Documentary with Malala:
  • [72:58] "Champions of the Golden Valley" about skiing in Afghanistan

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Memorable Closing

• On sustaining himself:
  • Ditches his smartphone, accepting being "lost" in the city as a practice of presence.
  • "I have to be present with it... When I leave the house ... I just have to be present with it." (Arian, 82:49)
• On community:
  "It's a group of us trying to ... leave this world a little bit better than the way we found it." (Arian, 79:13)

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Tone & Language

The conversation is irreverent, honest, warm, and often humorous, blending candor about trauma and injustice with encouragement and faith in art’s power to sustain resilience and spark societal change. Both Nick and Arian use explicit language and humor to make their points, while always centering the wisdom gained from lived experience.

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For Listeners

Whether you’re an artist, activist, immigrant, or simply interested in how art influences civic life, Arian Moayed’s insights are both practical and soul-stirring. If you want more, support Waterwell, watch Nobody Wants This, or check out his upcoming doc with Malala.

For more:

• waterwell.org
• Arian’s upcoming work: "Nobody Wants This" (Netflix, from October 23), and "Champions of the Golden Valley" doc
• Let’s Give A Damn: letsgivadam.com

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Transcript

[Nick Lapara]

Hey, friends, welcome to the let's Give a Damn podcast, a show where I have conversations with incredible people who aim to lead the planet much better than they found it. I'm your host, Nick lapara. Thank you so much for being here today. You could, of course, be doing a million different things today and you've chosen to listen to this show, this episode. So truly. Thank you very much. Before I introduce this week's guest, I.

Just want to remind you that that.

You can show your support for let's Give a Damn by becoming a monthly donor partner on our Patreon. You can follow us on social media, you can share this episode with friends in person and online, you can buy some of our merch on our website, let'sgivadam.com or maybe you're an organization or company that aligns with us and you'd like to sponsor some episodes. Friends, there truly are so many ways to support what we're doing and I invite you to explore what which ones.

Are right for you.

You can reach out to me with.

Any questions at all at.

Hello, let's Give a Damn Dot com. Friends, my guest today is Emmy and Tony nominated actor, nonprofit founder, and dam giver extraordinaire, Aryan Moyad. I've known about Arjen's work for a few years now, ever since I saw him on the very popular TV show Succession as private equity investor Stewie Husseini. And even though Succession was a huge break for him, Arjan has been putting in the work for over 20 years. At this point, in addition to Succession, you can see him in dozens of films and TV shows like Fountain of Youth, Spider man, no Way Home, Inventing.

Anna, and Drum Roll Please.

The new season of Nobody Wants this, starring Kristen Bell, Adam Brody, Seth Rogen, and of course, Aryan, which releases on Netflix in a couple of weeks. Earlier, I mentioned that Aryan is a non profit founder. Aryan started Waterwell in 2002 alongside his college roommate. Waterwell is a nonprofit production company dedicated to telling engrossing stories that deliberately wrestle with complex civic questions in unexpected ways.

[Lisa Evans]

And.

[Nick Lapara]

And they've been doing just that for decades, making shows like Blind Runner, A Good Day to Me, Seven Minutes, and the Courtroom. Waterwell also works alongside community organizations like the American Immigration Council, the Council on Foreign Relations, International Rescue Committee, New York Immigration Coalition, Iranian American Women Foundation, Labor Notes, and dozens more in numerous local and national communities. In this conversation that you're about to hear, Aryan and I talk about his immigrant story. Moving here at a young age from Iran. We talk about how he became an artist. What drew him to becoming an artist? The importance of making art in the midst of all the fucked up things happening around us. And so, so much more. This was a wildly delightful and inspiring conversation and.

And I can't wait for you to hear it.

Before we begin, a quick reminder, as always, that you can email me anytime and for any [e-mail] you can ask questions, recommend future guests. Tell me how much you love or hate the show.

Tell me how much you love or hate me.

Anything goes. I just love hearing from you. And don't forget, if you prefer to watch your podcasts instead of listening to them, we are on YouTube and as.

Well, except for this episode.

My camera up halfway through this episode and it just stopped recording. And I hate that. But this one is available in audio and dozens and dozens of other podcasts are available in audio and video on YouTube. And now let's get right into my conversation with the absolutely fantastic Aryan Moyed.

Let's go. Arian Moyed. Welcome to the let's Give a Damn podcast.

[Aryan Moyad]

Let's do it.

[Nick Lapara]

Nick, I'm so glad to be speaking with you.

[Lisa Evans]

I usually say, let's give a shit.

[Nick Lapara]

Let'S give a shit, let's give.

[Aryan Moyad]

But you can't say shit.

[Nick Lapara]

You can. You can. I mean, it's way more acceptable now. Yeah, I. I had all sorts of ideas of how to make this the most provocative thing ever.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

And then people were like, well, so the first initial idea was let's give a damn. And then because I am who I am and you're probably the same way, it's like, let's. Let's push the envelope.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

In fact, I got, I did a TedX talk six years ago in Chicago. And my initial, the title for the TEDx talk was Stop giving a fuck and start giving a damn. And so I'm like, I'm always like, let's. Let's push the envelope. And it was like, well, if you want to get as broad of an audience while still being, you know, dam is still provocative.

[Aryan Moyad]

Very.

[Nick Lapara]

And so I was like, okay, let's give a damn. It is. And yeah, I like, here we are, Here we are. Welcome to the show. We first connected a few months ago. Wasn't the right time. Wasn't the right time. And this is the right time. The universe lined it up. So thrilled. Been a fan. I'll be, I'll be completely transparent that maybe I'd seen you in one or two things, but like many people, succession was really the thing where I was like, oh, there's, there's Arjen playing Stewie and what a wonderful role.

[Aryan Moyad]

Thanks, man.

[Nick Lapara]

I mean, really, like, you know, you're not the, you know, you're not in the main, like, you know, family dynamic, but you really leave quite a mark, I think for a few different reasons. One, the acting is great. Not just saying that because you're sitting here, the acting is really great. But you have such a sort of a striking role. Like, it's, it's a, it's a very, you're such a good looking dude playing a. Yeah, very like, very forward, business, like, go getter type person. Kind of very punchable, like, right, like.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah, totally.

[Nick Lapara]

Like, Stewie's very punchable.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah, totally.

[Nick Lapara]

And so even though you're not in all, like, you really left a mark.

[Aryan Moyad]

Thanks, man.

[Nick Lapara]

What was that role? I assume. Tell me if I'm wrong. You did a whole. You've been doing this since. I think the earliest credit I saw was 2003 for you.

[Aryan Moyad]

You.

[Nick Lapara]

Over 20 years.

[Aryan Moyad]

You mean 20, 23.

[Nick Lapara]

You've been doing this for a long, long time.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

Is it kind of like career or life before succession and then life and career after succession? Was it that much of a stark difference or were things already like fucking good going and then succession was in another line of opportunities?

[Aryan Moyad]

And that's a great question. I mean, no, I mean, succession brought me to another atmosphere.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

I mean, prior to succession, I, I.

[Lisa Evans]

Can'T tell you, I can't even tell.

[Aryan Moyad]

You like one or two things that didn't involve me having an accent.

[Nick Lapara]

Wow, okay.

[Aryan Moyad]

Literally, I can't even. I mean, I'm sure they're out there, but most of the time. Or, but, but my, my Iranian ness was on full display in all those roles. Whether it was even if I didn't have an accent, I was playing someone from the Mughal empire, you know, and so, and those folks never get a chance to do any of those things, to be honest with you. Like.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

And so it, it. So yeah, succession. Now I only play rich assholes.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

And, and, and prior, when you're playing, you know, an Iraqi victim and Bengal tiger at the Baghdad Zoo, or you're playing Babur and Gu, or you're doing food and fadwa where you're playing like, you know, someone that lives in the west bank, like, those characters have a victimization already about it that they want to put onto you that you're trying to battle.

[Lisa Evans]

And so those people aren't seen as attractive. Those people don't have love lives.

Yeah.

Those people don't have.

[Aryan Moyad]

They just have this traumatic moment that they're going to explore. And. And so even the idea. I appreciate the compliment, but, you know, even the idea of, like, being handsome or whatever like that.

[Lisa Evans]

That.

[Aryan Moyad]

That really is succession on. Really. I've ne.

[Lisa Evans]

I've never been given ro. I was always up for someone that's going through such fucking turmoil.

Yeah.

That's like.

[Aryan Moyad]

Fuck. Like, oh, we need someone that's like, no.

[Lisa Evans]

His sister was raped and by.

[Nick Lapara]

Uday was saying, can't just have a normal life.

[Aryan Moyad]

Life. No, no, no. I remember being on set for this movie called you Hurt my Feelings, and we were just chatting about this business. It was the four of us. Tobias, Michaela, Julia, myself.

[Lisa Evans]

And Julia was like, how many parts.

[Aryan Moyad]

Have you played where you had to.

[Lisa Evans]

Like, make out with someone or take your shirt off? And I just was like. It was such a shocking question.

Yeah.

Because from 22 to 36 people that live in Iraq and Iran and all these stories, I'm not.

[Aryan Moyad]

I'm not gonna be. You know what I mean? It doesn't. Doesn't. And so I was just taken aback because I was like, I don't think ever.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

But right before Succession happened, honestly, I.

[Lisa Evans]

Would say that the difference came probably.

[Aryan Moyad]

Mostly after Bengal Tiger, just because I was nominated for Tony Award.

[Nick Lapara]

Two nominations, right.

[Aryan Moyad]

I. That was one. That was my first one.

[Nick Lapara]

That was one.

[Aryan Moyad]

My first one.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah. Another one was later.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

Doll's House was later. Yes. And so is that what that happened? I. I kind of, like, had a. Kids, you know, was living on unemployment.

[Lisa Evans]

Checks, and I just got the validation.

[Aryan Moyad]

Marker that my soul needed at that moment, even though broke is a joke and all these. And my confidence in the room just shifted. And I'd already been saying no to terrorist roles prior to that, and so.

[Lisa Evans]

It was easier to say no to.

[Aryan Moyad]

Even bigger things now and then.

[Lisa Evans]

And. And then by the time the Succession.

[Aryan Moyad]

Was happening, I was doing a play on Broadway called the Humans, and that one, I did not get nominated for that, but the play won best play that year.

[Lisa Evans]

And the humans, I got to be.

[Aryan Moyad]

This, like, Lebanese rich guy in a family, and it was a realistic drama, and I got to be me. And just. I was not. Not rich, but I got to. It wasn't defined by an accent, actually. I had the status.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

And the rest of. Was a working class. And.

[Lisa Evans]

And of Succession.

[Aryan Moyad]

Saw that.

[Nick Lapara]

That's beautiful.

[Aryan Moyad]

And then I got cast on Succession.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

Is that changing? I mean, I think I Would like to think that it is changing maybe not fast enough. But is that. Do you see that in the entertainment landscape overall, whether it's Broadway or film or whatever, like, where these people that are born elsewhere or look different, brown skin, whatever, that are just getting cast as, like, normal? Like, is that happening more obviously? It's always happened, but very little. And now it's happening a little bit more. Like, is it happen or is it not happening fast enough?

[Aryan Moyad]

Well, the wheels of progress move slowly.

[Nick Lapara]

Very slowly. Too slowly.

[Aryan Moyad]

So, yeah, the answer that is definitely it's not moving fast enough.

[Lisa Evans]

I think it is happening.

[Aryan Moyad]

I think it's better than it was.

[Lisa Evans]

You know, I just remember, you know, the. The days of, you know, the audition would be for a video game where a.

[Aryan Moyad]

They want a Muslim man screaming after they've been shot, as if Muslim men, like, scream in some sort of different way, which is hilarious. So I think that kind of shit's done.

[Lisa Evans]

It never will really change unless the people that own the levers are the ones that are.

[Aryan Moyad]

That are black and brown.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

And women.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

And Asian. You know, anyone that doesn't have a.

[Lisa Evans]

Chance, that's legitimately the only way. I. Throughout these years, we've.

[Aryan Moyad]

Along the way, I've seen movements of movements from colorblind casting to all these things that have just come, and we've seen those movements happen. And the reality is all of these.

[Lisa Evans]

Mechanisms that I think all from Hollywood.

[Aryan Moyad]

To New York to everyone, all of.

[Lisa Evans]

Them will only change. Those mechanisms will only change because it says. Society says it has to change a little bit. But if we're the ones that have the money and we're the ones that pick the art that we want to make, we will not have those problems. Because when Oprah has the own network, she makes content about black folks because she's black. When Tyler Perry has the lever, he can tell the stories that he wants to tell. And so. And so the reality is that is the actual. If we're looking for speed, if that's. That's the change. Because at a certain point, you know, I always say this. If I was a manager, just a manager of every Iranian filmmaker living in Iran right now, I would be, mark my words, a billionaire, because they have 5 million movies that they make for $50 that win Academy Awards.

Yeah.

So, like, you see what I'm saying? Like, so.

Yep.

But that's the reason that's not happening, is because that person.

[Aryan Moyad]

I don't have that kind of cash. I don't have that, you know. Well, but that's Those are the goals.

[Lisa Evans]

That I think I want and the goals that I think that can make.

[Aryan Moyad]

That change happen faster, that we don't have to be beholden to some middleman. And so the answer to your second part, the first part, second, how it hasn't changed is it's still a game of middlemen. And the middleman at whatever lever of.

[Lisa Evans]

Entertainment there is has to dictate in a. In a bureaucratic corporate mess, has to dictate the, you know, the parameters of which they're.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know, the money. The people that own the money make.

[Lisa Evans]

So if they say, hey, no, I'm only looking for, you know, when I'm.

[Aryan Moyad]

Going to pitch a TV show, one of the things I've learned is that.

[Lisa Evans]

Every two minutes they say, oh, no, we don't want limited anymore now we only want long series.

Yeah.

Oh, no, we don't want long series.

[Nick Lapara]

We only fucking.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

So just don't worry about any of that.

Yep.

And that's because the middleman is giving information down and it's.

[Aryan Moyad]

And it's.

[Lisa Evans]

And it changes so drastically. And I say the same with the theater. The theater. I love the theater.

[Aryan Moyad]

I'm a man of the theater. I think theater is probably the only thing that's gonna last.

[Nick Lapara]

I love it so much.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah, agreed.

[Lisa Evans]

But I will say the thing about theater is that in a company, a.

[Aryan Moyad]

Nonprofit or something, if they want to.

[Lisa Evans]

Do a play about, let's say tomorrow.

[Aryan Moyad]

They want to do a play about, you know, trying to think of, like, a recent news item, like, you know, the earthquakes that just happened in Afghanistan. Tomorrow, they want to do a play about that.

[Lisa Evans]

And then you go to the big.

[Aryan Moyad]

Players, the big off Broadway, even the Broadway players, and say, I'm doing this play.

[Lisa Evans]

It's so timely. It's so necessary after two or three years of development. And then the money, raising the money, by the time the play goes up, that earthquake, unfortunately, because the world is so fucking fast and crazy, is over.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah, well, there's been a hundred tragedies like it since then.

[Lisa Evans]

And so the lever of the theater community to not just say, oh, you have a show, can you write it in two months? I'll put it up in three.

[Aryan Moyad]

Is gone.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah. Yeah.

And that is actually. That can move the needle too, Nick.

[Aryan Moyad]

Do you know what I mean?

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

No, that's really powerful. I mean, so how does that. I want to get to other substantial things that we're going to talk about, but this is interesting to me because I think a lot of people are listening Are not. I think a lot are artists. And we've gotten to do. I, with consulting and with events and stuff, have gotten to do a lot more stuff with artists last couple years. I'm very interested in seeing artists succeed. Like, it's all I think about because we need art more than ever. But all these things are still in the way. There's all these roadblocks, all of these things blocking talented people of color from making art fast, making money from it, making a living, doing it, all that stuff. So if I say, Arjen, you're in charge of. You're in charge of helping artists, like, move this forward. Like, what's your. Who are the. What's the first step to getting people of color, to getting immigrants, to getting into these roles of managers, directors, investors? Like, there are brown investors out there. Like, how do we get this going so that we can make art that's amazing faster and begin influencing the art scene more? Gotta speed this up. It's gonna go slow, but, like, how do we speed it up, I guess is what I'm getting at.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah, I mean, you're speaking to someone that wants to always speed it up, especially with, like, art and progress and all those things. I think the reality is, I mean, to be blunt, without giving too much information away, I'm already doing this right now. I'm like, I am going to try to go after those kind of big monies. So I think the biggest obstacle is money.

[Lisa Evans]

Ye.

[Aryan Moyad]

I mean, you need someone to give.

[Lisa Evans]

But the reality is, is that for me, and it's because I've tasted it all. I've tasted the top of being on a hit TV show or on Broadway.

[Aryan Moyad]

Or, you know, I was in Spider Man.

[Lisa Evans]

I've, like, tasted all those things.

[Aryan Moyad]

I've worked with amazing people, and it's.

[Lisa Evans]

So demystified in my brain now that.

[Aryan Moyad]

My immigrant mentality is the only way that I think about this.

[Lisa Evans]

Everyone's bullshitting. Everyone's making it up. No one has any fucking answers. If they had answers, they would do those answers. The only people that have the answers are artists. That's it. They're the ones that have the mechanism to move things. Paul Thomas Sanderson's movies coming out right now, they're saying it's the greatest movie in the history of movies coming out.

[Aryan Moyad]

Right?

[Lisa Evans]

You know, once before a battle or whatever that's called. Sorry, I'll correct that.

[Aryan Moyad]

Or not.

[Lisa Evans]

And that movie's coming out, and they're talking about, will he be a box office success? And you're like, who gives a shit?

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah, absolutely. Who gives a shit?

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

I'll watch There Will Be Blood again. Let's watch Magnolia. Let's watch Boogie Nights.

[Lisa Evans]

Let's watch harder. It doesn't matter.

[Aryan Moyad]

It doesn't matter.

[Lisa Evans]

It doesn't matter. And so in a way, to those.

[Aryan Moyad]

Young folks or to those people, like, like, how do I do those things?

[Lisa Evans]

The answer is doing it. There is no other answer, you know.

[Aryan Moyad]

And, and, and this is a place.

[Lisa Evans]

Of privilege that I'm speaking of because.

[Aryan Moyad]

I am an immigrant that escaped Iran, came here, had a whole fucking immigrant experience. Parents don't speak.

[Lisa Evans]

Like the whole fucking imagine, you know, the Hallmark movie.

[Aryan Moyad]

It's all there.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

None of this shit about making a movie or making a play is gonna.

[Aryan Moyad]

Ever be as hard as that for me.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

It just won't.

Yeah.

There's no chance in hell that it's gonna all. I mean, unless Trump fucks it up.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know what I mean?

[Lisa Evans]

You know, but there's no chance in hell that we're gonna go into a place. So making a movie or putting up theater with Waterwell or.

[Aryan Moyad]

I don't think of those as. I want to use your example. You use the word roadblocks. I don't think about roadblocks. I don't have roadblocks. I have a shit ton of obstacles.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

And I got obstacle course of fucking, you know, that just never fucking ends. But the reality is, is that I.

[Lisa Evans]

Think it's just the doing of it. And, and you know, when I used.

[Aryan Moyad]

To teach high school for 19 years, I just ended last year with water. Well, and I love teaching high school. And, and when I was teaching high.

[Lisa Evans]

School, you know, I would say to the class, they'd be like, how do I do it? Ask a similar question, like, how do I get this fucking thing off the road? You know, black, brown, port. Every there is trying to ask, like.

[Aryan Moyad]

How do I get off of this and get to the next level?

[Lisa Evans]

And my response would be, if I gave you a ball of yarn and two needles and it's unlimited. And I say you have to sit in this classroom for 10,000 hours and fucking just knit or whatever, crochet, whatever that is. By the end of those five years, let's say six years, you can have your own industry named after you because.

[Aryan Moyad]

You'Re going to just know more than everyone else.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

I think the Jordan, as we're looking at the poster above me, the Jordan.

[Lisa Evans]

Is you just got to shoot more free throws and you're going to miss a fuck ton.

Yep.

And you got to be cool with the.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know, I also say to students.

[Lisa Evans]

Don'T worry about the 29th time where.

[Aryan Moyad]

You don't get a part.

[Lisa Evans]

Worry about when it's 30 in a row.

Yep.

That's what, that's the work.

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know what I mean?

[Nick Lapara]

That's so good. I'm so glad you landed there. That's where I wanted you to land. That's my mentality as well. There's no playbook. There's no playbook for anything. Like you said, everybody's fucking making it up. You show up and you're like, nice, whatever. And you're like, hi, I'm this. And this is what I do. You probably can't actually do that thing, but you show up and you do it.

[Aryan Moyad]

You try your best and then you go, go forward. Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

I have seen, no joke. You know, I mentioned earlier, we've done 280 something episodes of this podcast. I've seen 15 or 20 of my friends start podcasts in the time I've done my one. They've started it hoping to be the next whatever. Fill in the blank. Hopefully not Joe Rogan. The next like top podcast.

[Aryan Moyad]

I'm making cash.

[Nick Lapara]

None of them are around because they wanted to make money. They wanted to kind of shoot up in the thing. And so they went, they go, 10 episodes, 12 episodes, 15 episodes, gone, gone, gone, gone, gone. They're like, how are you still here? You know, not making a lot of money. Like I make money doing other things. Not enough, but like I make money doing other things. But this is not a money maker for me. It is a, it is a, it is a sort of a movement enabler and it's a community builder and it helps me get places. It's the best business card. I could never print a better business card than saying, I've interviewed hundreds of people. Look at the people I've interviewed. I've been invited on by some of the most famous people in the world. They came to me saying, I want to be on your show. But it's just about showing up like, I'm still not an amazing communicator after 280. Like, I'm way better than I was 280 ago.

[Aryan Moyad]

I think you're doing fine.

[Nick Lapara]

Thank you. I've pitched. Seven years ago, somebody was like, you need to do an unscripted TV show. And so we're going to. I had a production company. They, they funded the pilot, we shot it. I thought, man, I'm going to be on fucking tv. This Is amazing. The investors got cold feet. Not really cold feet. I was too leftist for them. They wanted somebody more conserv. So they left. And then Anthony Bourdain's team, after he died, they, they were talking to me about doing a show and then my guy got fired and so that went, that went cold. So it's been like six or seven rounds now, which is again nothing compared to what some people pitch, but six or seven, like almost. And then Anthony Mackie, he started, he started a production company and they wanted me to do a show with like, it's just been like multiple rounds of like, wait, am I, am I going to do a fucking TV show? This is like so close. And, and then it never happened. Right. And there's been. Whether it's podcasting or like TV stuff or investors in my company, like, and it's just about showing up. I don't know what the fuck I'm doing. The last two years I've helped raise $6 million for Gaza. How? I don't, like, I don't. Everyone just trying to figure it out. But I think the important part of this conversation before we move, we move on, we have so much to talk about is like in the artist realm, it's the same as in any other realm. Like, keep going. If you're really like in it to win it, like, keep going. Because art is the most important fucking thing. It really is. Like everybody else, the business people, the volunteers, the non profit leaders, the moms, the dads, the character. Like everybody else is going to art every single day to be sustained. Whether it's music or a fucking painting or poet or a film. We're all like, everybody needs art. So if the artists are showing up, then, then we're, then we are truly fucked. Because most people, most people aren't.

[Aryan Moyad]

Well, it's a complete, it won't exist, hopefully. It's a complete fascistic.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

Authoritarian society.

[Nick Lapara]

That's why they go after the artist first, of course. You know, they want to get rid of the storytellers, the truth tellers. Yeah. Because they're gonna inspire people toward revolution and toward, you know, anarchy. And some like they're, they inspire people to not stay quiet and to go out there and so we'll talk a little bit more about the art later, especially when we get to water. Well, but now that we're 20 minutes into this thing, you've mentioned the immigrant story. You mentioned being born in Iran. Give me the few minute version of. Yeah. Of your, of your story.

[Lisa Evans]

How did you.

[Nick Lapara]

Where were you born? How did you end up here? What were the people, places and things that sort of shaped you and got you to the point a couple decades ago when you were like, okay, I'm going to New York. We'll make art.

[Aryan Moyad]

Oh, wow.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

I mean, yeah, it's like all immigrant stories. It's incredibly specific and incredibly unique and also very common. You know, it's kind of both those things at the same time. I mean, the short of it all is that I was born in 1980, the fourth child, as an accident, as my parents already had a 17, 18 and 19 year old.

[Nick Lapara]

Oh, wow. Big, big age difference there.

[Aryan Moyad]

And my brother, who was 17 years older than me, was fighting in the Iran Iraq War, and my sister was on the streets protesting. My father was a banker that got, you know, got forced to, you know, forced to resign because the mullahs wanted to take over. And I had my other brother, Amir, who is the oldest, was in Chicago at the time when the revolution hit in 79. I was born in 80.

[Lisa Evans]

It was not going to work for us.

[Aryan Moyad]

And because we were not even of a family, the vast majority, if not all of my family is in Iran right now. And we're the only family that got out. So the chances of us even thinking about the States was impossible. But then my brother became a citizen. We came into Chicago because he studied in Chicago. And when we got there in 86, you know, my brother has been. Was, you know, there now. He was almost like 27, 28.

[Lisa Evans]

He went to.

[Aryan Moyad]

He finished high school early. And.

[Lisa Evans]

And then we grew up.

[Aryan Moyad]

And then we came to Chicago and grew up in Chicago and did the whole immigrant game. And my parents, by the time they got to the States, you know, in their 40s, my dad was in his 50s, my mom was in her 40s. They just learned a new language all from scratch.

[Lisa Evans]

Mmm.

[Nick Lapara]

And so it's a big deal.

[Aryan Moyad]

Huge deal. And so I became the translator of the house because my brothers were gone, my sister was in Iran, and. And. And then we just had a very.

[Lisa Evans]

Typical, you know, and then to go to the art of it all.

[Aryan Moyad]

We grew up in this, like, you know, in Chicago. We were in this area where I was going to this crazy school, and it was. I was, you know, my ESL classes were Spanish speaking, so I was learning Spanish first.

[Lisa Evans]

Yep.

[Aryan Moyad]

And my parents didn't know.

[Nick Lapara]

Okay.

[Lisa Evans]

You know.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah, there's a lot going on. And they don't know English. You know, it's all the same lettering. You know, it doesn't. And then and then I came home one day with a knife. And in my mind, I was like.

[Lisa Evans]

I got this knife. I was like, oh, this is crazy. I was in seven, but I'm gonna.

[Aryan Moyad]

Save my family now with this, like, little, you know, knife. And my mom was like, we gotta.

[Lisa Evans]

Get out of here. And then so smartly again, very, you know, lucky. But my family moved to a very niche, rich neighborhood.

[Aryan Moyad]

Very rich neighborhood called Northbrook.

[Lisa Evans]

But we lived on the other side.

[Aryan Moyad]

Of the highway in an apartment complex of black folks, immigrants, veterans, Orthodox folks, you know any the other immigrants. Some Iranians, Indians. And we all grew up there. But we all got to go to the school, to the fancy school. And guess what they had at the fancy school? A shit ton of art.

[Lisa Evans]

Art.

[Aryan Moyad]

And then I was like, immediately I was lucky. Luck?

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

Luck of the deal.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

Chicago's a big art. I mean, a lot of theater there. Yeah, tons. So that's where the love of art sort of. Were you looking for it or was just like, well, I guess I should take that class. I should take that extracurricular.

[Lisa Evans]

I was. Because I was in ESL classes till fourth grade.

[Aryan Moyad]

Fourth or fourth grade.

[Lisa Evans]

You know, in this neighborhood where there's.

[Aryan Moyad]

No one that's in ESL classes, really.

[Lisa Evans]

It was, like, mortifying. And so I found early on that I could make people laugh somehow, some way.

[Nick Lapara]

Sure.

[Lisa Evans]

And I. And I was like, oh, escape valve. Escape valve. Oh, embarrassing, embarrassing.

[Aryan Moyad]

I want to make them laugh. And that became my guard.

[Lisa Evans]

And along the way, and again, lucky.

[Aryan Moyad]

My parents, who are much older now. Do you know what I mean? They look like 50s, 60s.

[Lisa Evans]

Now they are showing me the movies that they watch, which is Charlie Chaplin, Vertigo. It's a mad, mad, mad, mad. Like I'm watching these old black and white movies and I'm learning all these bits.

[Aryan Moyad]

Do you know what I mean? Because they're funny.

[Lisa Evans]

Like, you know, Jack Tripper falling down.

[Aryan Moyad]

The stairs was funny to my parents. And that was then funny to me.

[Nick Lapara]

And then, you know, and because they were old films and stuff, the other kids probably had no clue. Nobody knew. So it was. For them, it was kind of the first thing. Time they had ever heard that bit or that whatever. So you kind of own it.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah. Again, none of this is, like conscious. This is just kind of like, like.

[Lisa Evans]

But I think I was just like, oh, I can fucking make some bits. And then I was like, oh, you know, I couldn't be in any after school. I was like, I did sports, but, you know, I had to be home at a certain. You Know, it was different.

[Aryan Moyad]

Immigrants shoot was different. And so I couldn't be on any teams. I never played a team, but I played a lot of sports.

[Lisa Evans]

But then I started realizing I was like, oh, I can't be Michael Jordan. But like, oh, I could be after school and do the play. I could be after school. And then it was just that. And then, to be blunt, high school happened. Then the. You know, then that's all the girls do plays.

Yeah.

I mean, this sounds so typical, but that's exact. But I was like, oh, I could do this. And all the girls are in plays.

Yep.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know, and then it just.

[Nick Lapara]

Good place to.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah. And then along that way, my mom finally got the bragging rights and my brother who fought in the Iran Rock or Omid, became a doctor and went to Harvard.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

But then while that was happening, I kind of snuck in, went to Indiana University, started doing theater nine. Eleven happened. And then it just dawned on me that, oh, maybe I'm.

[Lisa Evans]

Again, I'm speaking.

[Aryan Moyad]

I never talk like this. I never thought, you know, but maybe.

[Lisa Evans]

What was happening is, oh, I maybe.

[Aryan Moyad]

Do have a vessel. And the vessel isn't maybe not fame. Because at the time, becoming famous seemed, I don't know, kind of impossible.

[Nick Lapara]

Sure.

[Lisa Evans]

But it was more like, oh, I can use art to, like, move, you know, help better society.

[Aryan Moyad]

And then Waterwell was made.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah. With your. Correct me if I'm wrong. Went to school with.

[Aryan Moyad]

At Indiana University, Tom Ridgely. And I go Hoosiers, go Ridgely, who is now the amazing artistic director of. Producing artistic Director of Shakespeare St. Louis. Giving free Shakespeare to St. Louis. Five thousand, six thousand. And I mean, it's unbelievable what he's doing there.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

We founded Waterwell when we were 22 from Indiana University. Moved to the city, had no idea what the fuck we were doing. Within three years, we wrote, wrote, directed, produced five shows.

[Lisa Evans]

The first show was $400.

[Aryan Moyad]

The second show was $800.

[Nick Lapara]

Incredible.

[Lisa Evans]

And we were just obstacles.

[Aryan Moyad]

Like, we were like, I remember. I'll never forget our third show. Or their second show was called Fuente Ovajuna, which was a. You know, it's an old Lope de Vega play about dictatorship and all these. And the rise of dictatorship. And we calling. Had this little book of all the venues in New York City. Some fucking calling all the venues, being.

[Lisa Evans]

Like, how much you charge to rent.

[Aryan Moyad]

It for a day.

[Lisa Evans]

And then we called the Duplex Cabaret Theater. This is a true story. We're like, oh, okay. Amazing. And they're like, oh, there's no charge.

[Aryan Moyad]

What?

[Lisa Evans]

It's two drink minimum. What does that mean? It's like, oh, your guests get charged two drinks? Really? He's like, yeah. He's like. And then if you want to charge them something, we split it. Wait, the space is free?

[Aryan Moyad]

We'll take it.

[Lisa Evans]

We take it. We found out it's a cabaret theater.

[Aryan Moyad]

Blah, blah, blah.

[Lisa Evans]

Honestly, I don't even think they had a website yet.

[Nick Lapara]

What year was this?

[Lisa Evans]

2002.

Okay.

And so. And then, like two weeks later, we've, like, committed. We, like, got Nicole Parker, Happy Anderson, and we go to the Dubai. It's a gay club. Yeah, no clue.

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

But it was free.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

We did it there. And we were like.

[Aryan Moyad]

It still was like an amazing experience.

[Lisa Evans]

Fantastic experience.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know, just. And our first review was in Gay City News.

[Lisa Evans]

It was just like an amazing experience.

[Nick Lapara]

Positive review.

[Aryan Moyad]

Of course. I'm bringing it up. Otherwise.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah, that's right. Don't go read that one.

[Aryan Moyad]

But the world just kind of worked in that kind of, like, way. We just.

[Lisa Evans]

We just found. Whatever it was.

[Aryan Moyad]

I'll move to the next thing. And along the way. And then the fifth show was the Persians, this show called the Persians, a comedy about war with five songs. And it was Aeschylus is the Persians. And we modernized it as like a Rat Pack group. This is 2005. New York Times came, we got a rave review. We extended forever. I got signed by William Morse at 25.

[Nick Lapara]

That 2005.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

You're 25. Right. 1980. 2005.

[Aryan Moyad]

Ish. I mean. Ish.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah. Right, right, right, right. So that's when things. Yeah, now you're represented. Now they're looking for opportunities on your behalf and all that stuff. Right. So things start speeding up in between. So you moved to the city, though. I want to back up just one step.

You move to the city.

You moved to New York City after nine. Eleven.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

So you're. You're a brown guy.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

From one of those, you know, one of those countries. Right.

[Aryan Moyad]

Axis of Evil has already been mentioned.

[Nick Lapara]

Yes, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And white people don't like. Especially back then. It didn't matter. What if it was Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, like, they were all like. It was all lumped in.

[Aryan Moyad]

Nobody knows where Iran is now.

[Nick Lapara]

Yes, exactly.

So even less than then.

And. And it was all bad. So what was. What was coming to this city, which. Off, off camera, before recording, we talked about, this is the greatest fucking place in the world. I hope to be here forever. I love, love, love this city. It's where everything happens and where anything can happen. It's so fucking great. And that was a very tumultuous time. I have brown friends that were. That were hurt, like physically harmed, and it was not a good time. So what was that like? You're young, You're a young guy at the time, early 20s. What was moving to the epicenter of fear of brown people in the early 2000s?

[Aryan Moyad]

Like, it was intense. I mean, it was really, really intense. It was just. It was. I weirdly, the long story, but my brother Omi, the one that was in the Iran rock war, is in D.C. as I was driving to bring all my shit from new from Chicago to New York to move. I was gonna go to D.C. first.

[Lisa Evans]

But, you know, I guess we didn't really communicate.

[Aryan Moyad]

I guess we didn't have self. I had a self. I don't know what happened, but along.

[Lisa Evans]

The way I'm like, hey, I'm like six hours away.

[Aryan Moyad]

I'm gonna stop and watch them call it to go to D.C. from Chicago.

[Lisa Evans]

And he called me, he's like, dude, we're all in Florida. I'm like, what? He's like, yeah, fuck, dude.

[Aryan Moyad]

I don't know what the hell happened.

[Lisa Evans]

So I had to move. So I ended up moving to New York City.

[Aryan Moyad]

It's a true story. On September 11, 2002, stop with a U haul. With a U haul. And I move. And we moved in and we moved on 47th Street. There was five of us in a two bed, three bedroom in Midtown Manhattan. It was just the cheapest place that we could find.

[Lisa Evans]

And I walked.

[Aryan Moyad]

It was must have been now 2000. It must have been like one in the morning or two in the morning. And you know, I was on high on adrenaline, so I was like, I'm just gonna walk to Times Square by myself. I walked to Times Square and I still sometimes have that, even though I've been obviously in Broadway and all that. But it's. I still feel like this feeling of.

[Lisa Evans]

Like, oh, this is never gonna work out. And that's what I felt like. There's never in a million years that.

[Aryan Moyad]

This is gonna happen for me.

[Lisa Evans]

And in college you get to play everything, but in New York you're given.

[Aryan Moyad]

The box that you're put in. And I was Iranian and there was no way around it. And even for all of us that like many of us that can quote.

[Lisa Evans]

Unquote, pass, it just never worked.

[Aryan Moyad]

It just never. It never went that way.

[Lisa Evans]

And so in a way I was.

[Aryan Moyad]

Like, well, I'm gonna start this company. I'm gonna, like, change the world through art. You know, that's kind of what the vibe was.

[Lisa Evans]

But the difference is that what I.

[Aryan Moyad]

Didn'T know at the time is that New York is just a warm blanket. I mean, it's a cold blanket sometimes, but it's a warm blanket too, because you just find community.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

And the thing about New York, it's. It's a city about people and artists and theater people and theater makers and Iranians specifically are people people. And so when you all. You know, when my mom came to New York for the first time to visit me, she's like, of course you're here.

[Lisa Evans]

We're from Tehran. This is Tehran.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know, and so the city just takes you in.

[Lisa Evans]

And then. And then we just went along the way. And then, you know, when I got.

[Aryan Moyad]

Signed by, you know, this huge agency.

[Lisa Evans]

At 25, 26, I told them I didn't know what the fuck I was talking about. I was like, oh, I'm not playing.

[Aryan Moyad]

Terrorists, by the way, and I'm not doing victims. And they're like, okay.

[Lisa Evans]

You know.

[Nick Lapara]

You told them that right off the bat?

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah, off the bat.

Yeah.

You know, wasn't even trying to be hard.

[Aryan Moyad]

It was just like, oh, by the way, I'm not doing that.

[Lisa Evans]

My family escaped Iran.

[Aryan Moyad]

I'm not doing that. That's not who we are. And then I never worked on film.

[Nick Lapara]

And TV because of that. There were probably so many.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

Because there were probably so many roles that you could have gotten. You might even be in a different economic and fame sphere.

[Aryan Moyad]

100.

[Nick Lapara]

If back then, 20 years ago, you had said, yeah, just whatever roles, all.

[Aryan Moyad]

Those shows that came in. I mean, yes, I was. I were given opportunities to be in all those money making shows, but the reality was the water well was climbing.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

And our. And. And. And it was difficult and hard, and it was just the two of us, and. And. And it was a strain on relationships and all that, but it was just working.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

And we were into it. And it was. You know, and at the same time, it was. Quite honestly, it was.

[Lisa Evans]

I just can't. I didn't. When. Especially when I had my daughter, when.

[Aryan Moyad]

Juni was born, I literally was like.

[Lisa Evans]

I can't have my daughter watch me.

[Aryan Moyad]

Do, like, a terrorist role. Which is absolutely.

[Lisa Evans]

Which is so not us. It's such a.

[Aryan Moyad]

It's such a robbery, culturally, spiritually, emotionally.

[Lisa Evans]

To take from some of the most generous people that we all know, especially New Yorkers. Every bodega or food, car, those guys are good to.

[Aryan Moyad]

Good to Us, you know, to take that culturally back is not going to.

[Lisa Evans]

You know, not without my daughter came.

[Aryan Moyad]

Out when I was in 1990, and my entire life as a, as a, as a man trying to get a girl had to be compared to. Well, I saw not without my daughter my entire life, you know.

[Nick Lapara]

You know what's so great, though? I think none of what you just described is great, but what's great is that our kids, they aren't growing up with like, my kids don't look at brown. Well, a. Like, I'm Guatemalan, so they're a little bit less Guatemalan, but they're like, we're around a lot of brown people all the time. My relatives are brown. They're like white passing, but you know, but they don't. They don't. I grew up around all those, all those movies. This was, that was your, your movies. My movies, like, if they're the savior, they're white. If they're the terrorists, they're brown. Right. All the movies I grew up watching. Yeah, my kids don't know that. Yeah, they don't know that. All they know is brown people and black people are the best of us. Yeah, like, they know this about the cultures, they know this about these countries. Like they, they when they what they know about Iran and Afghan. Like, they only know if they know Afghanistan. It's Malala Yousaf. Like, they know the good from these places because you and I both well traveled and we're, you know, we're from other places and we have, like, we know that that's not true. But, man, is it fucking hard to convince these, like our fellow Americans that like, all these were the terrorists. Like, the United States is the most terrorist, is the largest terrorist organization the planet's ever known. You know, like one thing that I, after, after October 7 happened and the genocide in Gaza began. I've been doing a lot of fundraising. The people are bored of hearing me talk about it. But one thing that I did dive into was my background, more into my Guatemalan background. And in the 50s, two times in the 50s, one time in the 60s, Israel with, with the help of the US genocided the Guatemalan people. A million Mayans. Like, like, like it's.

[Aryan Moyad]

I know nothing about this.

[Nick Lapara]

Nobody does. But it happened. It is, it is documented that Israel was behind it. The US was behind it. The Gua, the very corrupt Guatemalan government, was behind it all because they wanted all the Mayan shit. The, all the land and all the, you know, the very rich in resources and a rich Culture point being, like, it's. It's so hard to. I point being, it's so hard to change that perception that, like, white is good, brown is bad. And that's what I grew up believing about myself, about my.

[Aryan Moyad]

Oh, my God.

[Nick Lapara]

Totally, totally. I'm just so glad that our kids and the art that they're gonna make, if they follow in your footsteps and kind of my footsteps, it'll be so vastly different. There's. There won't even be that. It's just, you know, it's a bunch of like, brown kids and white kids and queer kids and all the kids, like, making stuff. And it's. There's none of this, like, oh, well, if you're career, you have to play this kind of role. Or if you're brown, you play this kind of role. And then you got kind of stuck in these stereotypes. Like, that is not done with. There's still a lot of work, obviously, but it feels like a different time.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah, yeah, I think that's true.

[Lisa Evans]

I think that's also the wheels of.

[Aryan Moyad]

Progress moving as slow as possible, but moving slowly.

[Lisa Evans]

Because the reason why people, they want.

[Aryan Moyad]

To divide us at the top is.

[Lisa Evans]

Because it makes them more money.

[Nick Lapara]

Absolutely.

[Lisa Evans]

And where nothing about us is different, what's about us is different. Everyone, at the end of the day, you know, again, a privilege of being.

[Aryan Moyad]

An immigrant is that I've. Especially in working, growing up in Salem Walk in Northbrook, like, I saw all.

[Lisa Evans]

Those other families and the, like the.

[Aryan Moyad]

Greek family that just came in or the Korean family that just.

[Lisa Evans]

I see all those families and I'm like, oh, it's the same thing.

[Aryan Moyad]

But this.

[Lisa Evans]

But like, you know, and so. And unless we purposefully get people to.

[Aryan Moyad]

Know about these other things, we're gonna know fuck all about everything.

[Lisa Evans]

Including. I work a lot with veterans. Including veterans.

Yeah.

How is it possible that a country sends them off to die and to fight to save the country, and then come back, they're damaged mentally, physically, and then you don't protect them.

[Aryan Moyad]

What the fuck kind of life is that?

[Lisa Evans]

So, I mean, I can empathize with so many people.

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

And at that speed. And that's a nuts. And that they don't want.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah, because. No, they don't.

[Aryan Moyad]

Because then they start realizing that, oh, you know, I did this play, the human. I've been thinking about this a lot. And this play, the humans, it's a play about so much. Right. And. But it was very realistic. And I'm talking to the father, and the father is, you know, this rich Scranton White, you know, kind of Mayor of Scranton kind of energy. And he says to me, oh, Verizon bills, electricity, blah, blah, blah. And every night he would say to me this. He would say this line that Stephen Karam wrote, which would be, shouldn't it.

[Lisa Evans]

Cost less to be alive?

[Nick Lapara]

Come on.

[Lisa Evans]

And every time I think about another, when I hear that he's gonna make a trillion dollars or fuck all's gonna make, he's made, you know, fucking.

[Aryan Moyad]

What's his name. Trump has made.

[Lisa Evans]

He's now richer than he's ever. I'm like, this is what's. Stop dividing us and telling us. It's about religion, assholes. You don't give a fuck about that. You care about the religion of you.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah. And for generation to generation to generation to generation, we have. If it's a man that's greedy and has land, he'll use any fucking tool to divide us. And. And. And of course, they don't want us to like each other.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

Because when we start liking each other and we get together, we're like, yo, we Marie Antoinette.

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

Yes.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

We're gonna cut. Chop your head off.

[Nick Lapara]

Absolutely.

[Lisa Evans]

We'll kill you.

[Nick Lapara]

Absolutely. You know, they're so scared of us figuring that out because we, you know. Yeah. If we were to all rise up together, whatever that means. Like, I'm not. I am an anarchist to the core. I don't want to harm human life if ever at all possible. I don't want to. Like, I'm a vegan because I don't want to harm anything living. But, like, let's burn all the rest of it. Like, that's what they're scared of, though. That's what they're actually scared of. They don't even care if, like, they don't care if I die.

[Aryan Moyad]

No, no, no, no.

[Nick Lapara]

But they do care if I burn this building down.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yes.

[Nick Lapara]

To make a statement or a muddy.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

Or. Yes.

[Lisa Evans]

I always. When.

[Aryan Moyad]

With regards to the Iran revolution, that's like. It's an impending bomb that's just about to happen.

[Lisa Evans]

But the reality is, with their money.

Yep.

That's what they care about.

[Nick Lapara]

That's it.

[Lisa Evans]

Fuck with their money. Like, whenever they go on strike or whenever they go, like, you know, worker strikes devastates them, and they're already financially in the tanks, so that's the way.

[Aryan Moyad]

To fuck them over is the fuck with their money.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

And I do some work with the group that runs the general strike for resignations. It's Chris Smalls, the Amazon.

[Lisa Evans]

Oh, I love Chris. Yeah. Waterworld did a show and Chris was amazing.

[Nick Lapara]

So I'm part of this group that is trying to raise awareness about, like, strikes are great. Let's strike all the time. But a general strike, like France is like many other places have done successfully. Like, France went on general strike for three days and the government was like, whatever you want.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah, of course, of course.

[Nick Lapara]

Same thing would happen here. Like, we feel so helpless and powerless because everything is so big and. And everything is so. Everything's so big. Like, we don't get health care, we don't got. We don't. Enough money, food, whatever. But if we all did a general strike for. I mean, when it's happened here, not even general, but like. Like, when. When the garbage. When they stop picking up garbage. Whatever you want. Like, fucking trash. If one union was to shut down the electricity here in New York City, one union said, we're cutting the power grid, whatever you want. They're on their knees. So, yes. And I guess let's shift into something else here just for this sake of time. It's along the same lines, but what do you, as someone who's been doing, making art for decades, seeing all the ups and downs, and you've been in multiple industries, not just like, you're not just like a TV actor or a movie actor or a theater. Like, you've done it all, writer, director, all this stuff. What is the role? I saw your Instagram bio where the only thing you have in your Instagram bio is artist as citizen. First of all, that's brilliant. Second of all, what does that mean? What does that mean for you? And third, like, what is the role of. So I'm speaking to artists now, not everybody about the importance of art. We talk ad nauseam about that on the show. But, like, for those that are making art, want to make art, and are figuring out ways to support artists, like, I guess what I think about a lot is making art. That there's two different things going on here. Making art that makes statements, which you do talk about at water. Well, like, we're making art that, like, pushes on buttons and, like, pushes on. On. On.

[Aryan Moyad]

Moves the lever. We always say, like, move the needle a little bit forward.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah. And then there's. Okay, because. Because I'm an artist and I'm good at what I do. I have a platform. What should I speak up about? Should I speak up so much that I start losing work over it? I'm working with. I consult with several artists right now, and most of the conversations are around, how do I fucking Speak up and make a living. How do I. When I get offered insane amounts of money? I can say this on his behalf because he couldn't name the thing, but I was in Eastern Europe, in Georgia, three months ago, speaking at a conference. I took JP Sachs with me. I don't know if you know jp, an incredible artist, Jewish kid from Canada, opened for John Mayer 2 years ago on his tour. And he's incredible. He has billions of downloads. You've probably heard the song if the World Was Ending. Very famous. Anyway, incredible artist. He got offered. Yeah, he said the number, right? So I can say it.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

He got offered $100,000 by McDonald's to do two Instagram posts about their stupid fucking chicken sandwich. And he was like. He's like, what should I do? Like, do I take the money and then give it all away to, like, God? Like, unreuited? Like, do I give it all away or do I say, no, I don't want your blood money? You know, and so there's all these. He ended up turning it down and, you know, did a post about it went viral, and people were like, yeah, very happy that he did that. And then you got other people that are like, no, I'll take Empire's money and then give it. Like, use it for good. Right? Because then. Okay, now it's not in their bank, right. It's 100,000 less dollars that McDonald's has that I just gave to, you know, whatever organization doing good. So all that to say, like, yeah, how are you thinking about the things that I just described and sort of, what would you encourage artists as. As shit gets crazier, right? Shit is getting crazier. Like, whether it's. Whether it's the genocide, whether it's. What's happening here. Ice kidnapping our neighbors off the street, literally. Fascists. Like, yeah. Democrats and Republicans, they're all varying degrees of fascists, in my opinion. But this is, like, out. This is, like, out.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah, we're on the.

[Nick Lapara]

We're in a bad place place.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

So, yeah. How are you thinking about making art in these times and the money side of it and the being true to who you are and. And what, you know, you're able to do and all that stuff? It's a big question. I'm sorry, that was.

[Aryan Moyad]

Oh, no, no, no, no. I mean. I mean, I get it. I mean, it's.

[Lisa Evans]

You know, I mean, with regards to.

[Aryan Moyad]

Money, I just want to say that. That I don't. I've never played those terrorist roles on film or tv. I Never judged anyone that did. Everyone's got to make their bread. Everyone's got to do their own fucking thing. Like, everyone's got to do their own fucking thing. And so I don't judge my friends, brown, black, whatever, that do things that are. You know, that's not how I think of it.

[Lisa Evans]

At the end of the day, when.

[Aryan Moyad]

We'Re all dead and buried, I'm not going to be talking about how much money I made.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

I just know myself that I just don't. I'm not gonna look up and be like. Unless I've, like.

[Aryan Moyad]

I'm so impoverished, God forbid, that, like, I'm, like, brought everyone down with me.

[Nick Lapara]

Sure.

[Lisa Evans]

I. I'm not gonna be really think.

[Aryan Moyad]

I don't think I'm gonna care about that. I think I'm just gonna be over. So sometimes that's a little bit of a thing. It's also different, again, with someone that's never had money. I don't think about money as my end all be all, which is for a positive and a negative. You know, sometimes that would be helpful. But the reality is, this is the only time to be an artist.

[Lisa Evans]

This is it.

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

There is no other time.

[Nick Lapara]

Right.

[Aryan Moyad]

The two things that remain on earth when we're all dead and buried is the wars that we fight and the art that we make.

[Lisa Evans]

There's nothing else in the history books. There's no. You're not gonna look back and hear about how much money a guy. It won't matter. The only things that will matter are.

[Aryan Moyad]

The art that is made and the wars that we fought.

[Lisa Evans]

That's the only thing that's in the history books. And so, I mean, that's true. What the fuck do you want to.

[Aryan Moyad]

Put your energies into? 1, 2 is. I've hear this debate every five years, and it's been probably happening for hundreds of years. Is this the end of the theater? They always say, like, this is it.

[Lisa Evans]

This is the end of the theater. Yeah, I know, but we are still.

[Aryan Moyad]

Doing plays that are written three, four thousand years ago.

[Nick Lapara]

Thousand percent.

[Aryan Moyad]

And when radio came out, everyone's like, this is the end of theater. Radio's gone.

[Lisa Evans]

Yep.

[Aryan Moyad]

Radio's dead and buried. No, let me rephrase. It's changed. It's shifted. It's shifted.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah, we're doing a version now, but theater.

[Aryan Moyad]

Theater's still going there.

[Lisa Evans]

And also, we're going to Beyonce concerts.

[Aryan Moyad]

And we're going to Taylor Swift concerts.

[Lisa Evans]

We're not going to a virtual movie.

[Aryan Moyad]

Theater watching it, with which we are doing that. Too.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

But we're so interested in a live experience.

[Lisa Evans]

We're still going to church, so. So the live experience of it all.

[Aryan Moyad]

For an artist is going to be the future. Because, you know, when you think about AI and what that's going to look like, we don't know the answers to these things. But you know what I do know?

[Lisa Evans]

At the end of the day, I.

[Aryan Moyad]

Could still do theater, and no one wants to see a robot on stage doing a Doll's house.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know what I mean?

[Nick Lapara]

Like, that's so true. In fact, that's what JP and I were in Georgia doing is we were at a conference speaking, and our session was on. He's a very prolific songwriter. He's written with Ed Sheeran and Sabrina Carpenter, and he just did a. He just did a week with the Jonas Brothers last week, like, a bunch of songs with him. He's an incredible songwriter. So we were talking about. Yeah, songwriting in the age of AI. Like, we got ChatGPT. I could say ChatGPT. Write a song about this in the voice of Arian Moyad and da da da da. And then it spits out a song. And so we. Yeah, we did this whole thing because. And one of the conclusions was, a, don't be like, just use it as an opportunity to be a better artist, like, make better art. Right. But also B, like, I don't think. Not. Not in our lifetime. And maybe well beyond that, even when AI is in full, full, full, full play, as you pointed out, people are still going to want to go see shit live. Whether it's, I want to go see Wicked or one of your plays or. Yeah, I go to. I go to mass every Sunday. I do. Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

Fuck, yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

Beautiful. I want to go and I want to be in a room with people. I want to smell the smells. I want to, you know, bow in the cross. Like, I want to do all that stuff.

[Lisa Evans]

As Hollywood is struggling, Broadway had its.

[Aryan Moyad]

Best year last year.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

People are paying in the room. Come on.

Yeah.

So at the end of the day.

[Aryan Moyad]

The live human experiences are the things that we have. And at the end of the day, I think the wars that we have with AI are going to be really about us wanting to have. Be in person and not wanting that. Not wanting. We wanting a human connection.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

That's the hope at least. And so, yeah, artists are now needed more than ever.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah, I noticed that. It says my phone.

[Lisa Evans]

I'll.

[Aryan Moyad]

Don't worry, I'll figure it out. All right.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah, no, that's really great for those of you wondering what that was. My camera just stopped working. But we'll have half YouTube and you got all the audio. Okay. So along those lines, you know, one of the bigger things that's happening in the world right now is what's happening in Gaza. And for artists that's been sort of, you know, I've. I know that you and these are my friends, artists for Ceasefire, the film workers for Palestine, things that you have signed on to. And there's been a lot of, I mean, we just. At the Emmys last week, you know, a lot of conversation around Hannah Einbinder saying, go birds, fuck ice and free Palestine. And you had Javier Bardem and you had all these other people and then you had others being like, why here? And there's so much back and forth about how to speak up and what's the right way and all that stuff and people losing jobs and particularly with what's happening in Gaza. Like, what has been your observation of artists? Like, what. What do you think is happening, do you think? I think before the last couple years was speaking up on all kinds of issues. It was a whole different landscape than now, where even the first year, I think of the genocide, like, there was a lot of people losing roles and now you have people that are winning awards and like doing really well that are speaking up. So there's a lot of, like, people saying, I don't, I don't. Whether it's what's happening there or trans rights or whatever. There's a lot. I feel like there's been a. I've seen a lot more boldness because now people aren't well. It's less. It's still risky. It's still hard. I get it. It's hard to speak up about things that we care about and hard things in the world. But it feels less consequential now because you have people that are doing well and speaking up, like Mark Ruffalo, you know, like these people that are doing quite well in their careers and still speaking up however they want about a variety of issues. Do you think that's sort of changing in the arts, in the artist space?

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah, I do, I do.

[Aryan Moyad]

I went to see an amazing play last night called home at 59 East 59 Hend Ayub, a dear friend of mine. It was about her one woman show, about her living in Haifa and being an actress that then. And then deciding to be an actress and coming to the States and doing it all. It was beautiful, beautifully done. And in the audience were a bunch of old friends that, you know, we did plays together, Dawoud Haydami and Asif Manvi and Dean Obadallah. And we were just talking about those days when we played Palestinians and Israelis in these plays. And I remember Dawud and I did this play called masked.

[Lisa Evans]

It was 2006, 7, 8, something like that.

[Aryan Moyad]

And it was a pal. It was, it was a. It was a story about the first intifada about three Palestinian brothers written by an Israeli.

[Lisa Evans]

And it was done during the first.

[Aryan Moyad]

Intifada in Israel underground. And it was a big hit.

[Lisa Evans]

Wow.

[Aryan Moyad]

And the guy, Egal Nayur. I'm saying that name wrong, so whatever, look that up. But he did it originally. He ended up playing Saddam in the House of Saddam series. And he was in like Munich. And he's a great actor and he played that part. He's an Iraqi Jew, that Israeli.

[Lisa Evans]

Wow.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know what I mean? Yeah. So beautiful, beautiful guy. So we did this play and.

[Lisa Evans]

And we were selling out.

[Aryan Moyad]

And it was a big old.

[Lisa Evans]

It was doing well.

[Aryan Moyad]

And then.

[Lisa Evans]

But it was a 99 seat theater. And then we'd have these talkbacks.

[Aryan Moyad]

And one of the talkbacks, someone asked, you know.

[Lisa Evans]

You know, as actors, like.

[Aryan Moyad]

What character do you relate to the most?

[Lisa Evans]

And I played the freedom fighter.

[Aryan Moyad]

I was playing the. The advocate of violence, you know, and I said exactly this.

[Lisa Evans]

I said, well, I don't believe in violence.

[Aryan Moyad]

I don't believe that's ever helped anything for anything.

[Lisa Evans]

But let me just say this. I have to believe in my character, otherwise they're gonna be right.

Yeah.

You know, I'm actually answering the question as an actor.

[Nick Lapara]

Right.

[Aryan Moyad]

Like it doesn't matter who, what part you play and this. And then someone else said something, maybe Dawoud and maybe the panelist said something.

[Lisa Evans]

And this woman got up and started.

[Aryan Moyad]

Screaming at us and called us Nazis.

[Lisa Evans]

Good God, this is 2006, 7 5.

[Aryan Moyad]

Something right around that pocket. And the talk back ended.

[Lisa Evans]

She leaves. I'm so hurt.

[Aryan Moyad]

I mean, let's be very.

[Lisa Evans]

I'm so offended and hurt.

[Aryan Moyad]

I'm like emotionally scarred.

[Lisa Evans]

What the fuck do you mean? Do you think I have. You're talking about something completely different. I was so offended and hurt because it doesn't matter to me whether it's Jewish or Israeli or Palestinian or. The content doesn't matter. Human beings should not be put into cages, period. I don't care what the fuck the vibe is. And if Iranians are doing fuck them, if Democrats are doing fuck them, I'm not on your side. And to have that being thrown at me as someone that was like, oh, I was putting my love and heart into the complexity of this thing.

[Aryan Moyad]

I wasn't giving you a binary.

[Lisa Evans]

I was giving you how.

[Aryan Moyad]

And. And, yeah, and I.

[Lisa Evans]

And I will say that stuff in person is visceral now. It's online, and it come.

[Aryan Moyad]

Or in, like, you know, people get my phone number and, like, tell me I'm a, you know, anti Semite or whatever they tell me, and, like, just random, like, bots texting me that I'm going to hell, and what the fuck do I know?

[Lisa Evans]

And so, weirdly, I will say the hate is there.

Yeah.

But it's changed. And to be quite honest, I feel it's less.

[Aryan Moyad]

I feel it's less now than it was even six months ago, even a year ago.

[Lisa Evans]

We're not blind. We can't. I could give you that.

[Aryan Moyad]

We're all ignorant.

[Lisa Evans]

I'll give you that one.

[Nick Lapara]

Sure.

[Lisa Evans]

But we can't be all fucking blind and we can't be all, you know, like, we see what we see.

[Aryan Moyad]

And so it doesn't matter to me. I mean, it does matter to me, obviously, because, you know, this has been happening to them since 1948, and this has gone on. This is a nightmare of epic proportions.

[Nick Lapara]

Absolutely.

[Aryan Moyad]

But.

[Lisa Evans]

But your backstory or whatever reasoning that.

[Aryan Moyad]

That you believe that some dude that wants land and money has told you that, this is the vibe. I don't give a shit.

[Lisa Evans]

And so, to me, I. I feel a softening.

[Aryan Moyad]

And because there's so many of those folks now. You have Putin, you have Khamenei, you have Netanyahu, you have Trump, you have all of these. It's all circling a bunch of, like, weird, you know, all of them, that we, as a collective are starting to.

[Lisa Evans]

Be like, well, we're not blind. We know what you're doing.

[Aryan Moyad]

And so I think that's changing as well.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

Slowly and unfortunately for the poor Palestinian people, it's. It's. It's. It's. It's just a moral human failure that we can't even protect them.

[Lisa Evans]

No.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know, we can't even protect them.

[Lisa Evans]

No.

[Nick Lapara]

But I do think I agree with you. I feel like some things are shifting now. It's horrific. I. You know, the. The first fucking thing that I saw on my Instagram this morning, I can't even do it anymore, was a kid who technically was dead, but their body was still moving and their guts were spilling out of their stomach, and I was just like, come on. Yeah. And so. But I do. I do think that, like, this and.

[Lisa Evans]

Can I just jump in and say something? But the questions are. It's not about.

[Aryan Moyad]

To me, the progress comes in the questioning at Waterwell. When we're trying to do a new.

[Lisa Evans]

Piece of art, we try to answer an impossible question. What does it mean to be an immigrant?

[Aryan Moyad]

We did the show called the Courtroom.

[Lisa Evans]

What does it mean to be serving in the military?

[Aryan Moyad]

We did a thing called Blueprint Specialist.

[Lisa Evans]

What is it? We ask a big question that's kind of unanswerable.

[Aryan Moyad]

Right.

[Lisa Evans]

And unless we get to ask those.

[Aryan Moyad]

Questions, we don't really get deeper and deeper and deeper, which is something that Waterwell believes in depth over breath.

[Lisa Evans]

So the questions are being asked right now.

Yeah.

15, 20 years ago, no one was asking questions. The questions were, why are you in it? You know, I walk into a room, every room, and already everyone accuses or.

[Aryan Moyad]

Thinks I'm an anti Semite.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

Just because. Even though Iranians freed Jewish folks 25.

[Aryan Moyad]

600 years ago, even though there are Iranian Jews in my life that have.

[Lisa Evans]

No, none of it makes sense.

[Aryan Moyad]

Sense. You know, even though.

[Nick Lapara]

Well, you're also Semitic.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah, exactly.

[Nick Lapara]

I mean, on top of that, like actually Semitic.

[Lisa Evans]

And then also on top of all of that, you know, the Middle Easterns just say, we did not kill 6 million Jews.

Yeah.

We would never do that.

Yeah.

Honestly, we would never do that. And just not Iraq. I can't imagine I can speak for just sounds so uncalled. Evil people do that.

[Aryan Moyad]

And.

[Lisa Evans]

I feel for my Jewish friends too. I gotta be honest with you.

[Aryan Moyad]

I do feel for them.

[Lisa Evans]

Because you get some radical, someone on the left who doesn't know the difference between policy and religion, just like many folks don't know the difference between policy.

[Aryan Moyad]

Of Iran and the people of Iran.

[Lisa Evans]

They'Re going to conflate those things. Yeah. They are going to be in danger. That is dangerous.

[Nick Lapara]

Absolutely.

[Lisa Evans]

Now we have to protect them.

That.

It's, it's an, it's a, it's a, it's. I, I, I, I blame the three.

[Aryan Moyad]

To eight men that run this world.

[Lisa Evans]

God. Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

And, and, and I genuinely think they are evil geniuses. To make it seem like we're all the enemies.

[Lisa Evans]

As if what the are we enemies for?

Yeah.

Anyway.

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

No, absolutely. So what's the future of. So Water well has been around, around doing shit. Making an impact here in New York and beyond. Still going.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

What's, what's the future look like for, for you? For Water well? I mean, we need you. Please continue. Please let us know how we can support you. Those that you know, aren't here or do live here in the city. Yeah. What's the, what's the future of Waterwell look like?

[Lisa Evans]

I mean, it's run.

[Aryan Moyad]

I'm the co founder and the board chair. It's run by the incredible Lisa Evans, who is a, you know, one of our great living theater directors. To be real with you, in times of strife like this, we're needed more than ever. So, like we have a we. Two weeks ago, we did an event with New York Immigration Coalition at Pacific and read stories of New York immigrants that have, like, changed New York society. And a huge event out there. We're doing an event on Monday for climate change.

[Lisa Evans]

You know, the community organizers kind of.

[Aryan Moyad]

Come to us and they have been for about a decade now, and asking.

[Lisa Evans]

Us, how do we do this thing? How do we change the needle on this thing?

[Aryan Moyad]

Can you make a piece of art to help us do that? And that's what we've been doing. We had a show last year called the First Ford Hill Project, which was the transcripts of Anita Hill and Blasey Ford's Senate committee.

[Lisa Evans]

And.

[Aryan Moyad]

We performed it at woolly mammoth in D.C. and at the public here. And we had unbelievable talkbacks from level four to just incredible pregnancy. Now New York City constituents as well. And that's going to be coming back and touring.

[Lisa Evans]

I mean, like, again, our work is.

[Aryan Moyad]

For the communities and to really try to, like, shed the light and try to shed the light to, like, you.

[Lisa Evans]

Know, 100 to a thousand people at a time, not to millions of people, because immigration.

[Aryan Moyad]

Telling people about immigration and immigration reform at a million people at a time is nearly impossible.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah, right.

[Aryan Moyad]

You can't. But if we tell the stakeholders here.

[Lisa Evans]

Is some version of this which is messy. Like, we did this show a few.

[Aryan Moyad]

Years ago, called the courtroom, which was a reenactment of one woman's deportation case. We performed it in courtrooms in New York City.

[Lisa Evans]

Wow.

[Aryan Moyad]

And I'm gonna say this. It was pro American. Weirdly, it ended up making everyone proud.

[Lisa Evans]

Weirdly, it's because it was just transcripts.

[Aryan Moyad]

And it was as this one woman.

[Lisa Evans]

Named Elizabeth Keithley, who came here legally, went to the dmv.

[Aryan Moyad]

They said, would you like to register to vote? Thinking that America is the greatest place in the world for that.

[Lisa Evans]

She's like, of course.

[Aryan Moyad]

They sent her a registration card. They shouldn't have done that.

[Lisa Evans]

She votes.

[Aryan Moyad]

She shouldn't have done that. She didn't know her husband didn't know.

[Lisa Evans]

She had the green card.

[Aryan Moyad]

They tear it up. And they put her in deportation and they deport her.

[Lisa Evans]

And so we do the transcripts of this show. Now, you have to realize, for a lot of Democrats, this is a tricky show.

Yeah.

Voting. This is.

[Aryan Moyad]

Even before voting was a thing.

[Lisa Evans]

It was like voting, but it's like, oh, no, Democrats, wake up. This is a sample of one voter case.

[Aryan Moyad]

That's a fraud.

[Lisa Evans]

You got to just point to this and be like, you're telling me there's.

[Aryan Moyad]

10 million of these?

[Nick Lapara]

Insane.

[Lisa Evans]

Impossible. Yeah, it's because when we go so deep and you realize we're like, well.

[Aryan Moyad]

There can't be this many of these.

[Lisa Evans]

This is so rare. See, I'm saying.

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

And so that's beautiful.

[Aryan Moyad]

And.

[Lisa Evans]

But Democrats have troubles with it too.

[Aryan Moyad]

So are Republicans.

[Lisa Evans]

But the truth does not, you know, truth. And. And what's cool about transcripts is that the transcripts really make it apolitical. It doesn't matter. You can come see the courtroom and say, hey, she should have fucking voted.

[Aryan Moyad]

That's the law.

[Lisa Evans]

She got deported.

[Aryan Moyad]

I believe in the law.

[Lisa Evans]

And you know what? I disagree.

[Aryan Moyad]

There's gotta be some nuance in that.

[Lisa Evans]

But I could see it.

[Aryan Moyad]

Laws, laws, laws, laws, law. You know, we follow laws or we don't follow laws. That's what this country is supposedly about. And so that brought up some fun, kind of like real bridge gapping stuff. And then we did it. And then every immigration rights activist in the country came, and now we have 25 shows from that. 30 shows.

[Nick Lapara]

That's incredible.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah.

[Lisa Evans]

But again, it's about serving that thing.

[Aryan Moyad]

To, like, tackle a bigger thing.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

So that's on the Waterwell side, under my side.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

I mean, I have.

[Lisa Evans]

I don't know when this is gonna air.

[Nick Lapara]

Two weeks.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

Or whenever you want.

[Lisa Evans]

Oh, well, I'm on this new television.

[Aryan Moyad]

Program, season two of Nobody Wants this.

[Lisa Evans]

Hell, yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

Which is a big old hit for Netflix. And by the time that this airs, I think the show will be out.

[Nick Lapara]

We'll link to it, talk great about it.

[Aryan Moyad]

But I love doing that show. And so that comes out on October 23rd on Netflix. I played Dr. Andy. I got to be the boyfriend of Justine Lupe, who plays Willa in succession. All of our scenes were together. She is great phenom. Phenom on this show. If you haven't seen it out there, if you've viewers or listeners haven't seen it, please go see it. It's beautiful.

[Lisa Evans]

And also talks about the beauty of Judaism and all of the stuff that actually matters, the stuff that brings people together.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know, dinners.

[Lisa Evans]

That's what this is.

[Nick Lapara]

That's what it's about.

[Lisa Evans]

The other stuff. I don't believe you.

Yeah.

You know, I don't believe that Khamenei that runs Iran gives a fuck about Islam.

[Nick Lapara]

I don't think he gives a shit about that power.

[Lisa Evans]

What's the power? And I don't conflate those two.

[Aryan Moyad]

So my Muslim family members.

[Lisa Evans]

I don't conflate what my Muslim family.

[Aryan Moyad]

Members are and what that guy is like.

[Lisa Evans]

They're different.

[Aryan Moyad]

They're evil.

[Lisa Evans]

Just like, I don't do it with.

[Aryan Moyad]

Like, my pastor friend that lives down the block from me, Tiffany.

[Lisa Evans]

I don't think that she represents what, you know.

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

Whatever the fuck.

[Nick Lapara]

The rest of the evangelical Christians, whatever.

[Aryan Moyad]

The crazies want, you know, I don't.

[Lisa Evans]

Believe that that's the case.

[Aryan Moyad]

So it's cool to be on a show that really like highlights.

[Nick Lapara]

I can't wait to watch it.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah, it's fun. It's fun. I get to be a comedy, which is fun for me.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

I'm also.

[Aryan Moyad]

Also going to be available now that when this airs, it says I'm also. And you brought up Malala, but I didn't want to say anything because you don't know this. What I'm about to say.

[Nick Lapara]

No, I don't.

[Aryan Moyad]

I think in, like, a matter of hours, really, it's going to be announced that Malala and I are going to be executive producing a documentary about Afghanistan, skiers in Afghanistan called the Champions of the Golden Valley. In 2019, this amazing man named Ali Shah started the Afghan Ski Challenge and started it for men and women. And this documentary film crew went out, grabbed it pre and post. Pull out. So pull out of 20, 21 out of Afghanistan. And so it's, I think, one of.

[Lisa Evans]

The most decorated, if not the most.

[Aryan Moyad]

Awarded documentary of the season. Wow. And Malala and I have signed on.

[Lisa Evans]

As executive producers to give it that.

[Aryan Moyad]

Oscar love that it needs. It's a beautiful film. It's so inspiring. It's so hopeful.

[Lisa Evans]

It's so joyful because they're so the people that these kids, they have not no money for skis.

Yeah.

So he's teaching them how to make.

[Aryan Moyad]

Skis out of wood.

[Nick Lapara]

Amazing.

[Lisa Evans]

It's.

[Aryan Moyad]

And then they do a ski challenge which is like, has this epic. And it's like.

[Lisa Evans]

It's a great sports doc.

[Aryan Moyad]

Like a favorite of mine. I saw it at Sundance. And so I'm going to be producing that and trying to get that over the. And as you can possibly imagine, no distribution.

[Nick Lapara]

That was my next question was how the fuck can we see it? But not yet because there's no distribution.

[Aryan Moyad]

And yeah, you know, it's, it's, it's very difficult still to try to tell those stories when you don't hold those levers. When you don't hold the, the levers, it's hard to get stuff out there. And so. And if no one's gonna advocate for it, then it's not gonna get seen.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah. How does that get advocate? Like I probably have five or six friends right now that are filmmakers that have just, just mind blowing content. Documentaries show. And the distribution is. It's holding back. Like there's so much art to be seen that is just waiting, you know, did the festivals, it did whatever, maybe a theatre but like can't get it out for everyday people to see it. Like if a few people can see it that are privileged enough to get invited to these things or if they can go to festivals, which is again is a very privileged thing to do, but they can't. Like, but everyday folks can't see it. It's tough.

[Lisa Evans]

It is. It is.

[Aryan Moyad]

And it isn't.

[Lisa Evans]

It isn't.

[Aryan Moyad]

It isn't. I say that to say I just, I can only answer these questions with examples.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

And years ago I made this series, this TV series web series called the Accidental Wolf, which was a. Which is I think the first ever web, like thriller. Like a web series thriller.

[Lisa Evans]

Okay.

[Aryan Moyad]

And it starred all my Broadway friends ever. And everyone's in it. Yeah, I would say like at the time it was like 150 Tony nominations, 60 Emmy nominations. Laurie Metcalfe, Stephen McKinley Henderson, Brandon Dirt, like Kelly O' Hara starring. Everyone's in this fucking gorgeous thing. Liza Colonzayas and. And I made it as a producer hat on. Because everyone's like, this is a cool idea.

[Lisa Evans]

No one will make this.

[Aryan Moyad]

I was like, I'm just gonna make this fucking thing. I don't give a shit. And so I started making it a.

[Lisa Evans]

Few dollars and Damon Oli, our producer, got some money and then we made a first season and then we started.

[Aryan Moyad]

Pitching it to people, the Showtime and HBO.

[Lisa Evans]

And they're like, this is fucking. It's 2017. This is fucking cool. We can't do shit with this.

[Aryan Moyad]

Zero.

[Lisa Evans]

So we made our own website that was interactive, completely free. After every episode, a pop up comes.

[Aryan Moyad]

Up and says, can I call you real quick? It's a show about a phone call.

[Lisa Evans]

Hey, if you let me text you.

[Aryan Moyad]

I have a message for you after each one do you know where I am?

[Lisa Evans]

I'm right here. Just click on me.

[Aryan Moyad]

And you'd click and it'd be like right where you're at. Or it'd be like, where.

[Lisa Evans]

You know, just like fun little.

[Aryan Moyad]

We called them entertainments.

[Lisa Evans]

Yes.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah, you did.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah. And they were like cheap little things in between the things.

[Lisa Evans]

The fucking thing went viral.

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

Kelly got nominated for an Emmy from the show.

[Lisa Evans]

Wow.

Then all of a sudden I was.

[Aryan Moyad]

Like, oh, my God.

[Lisa Evans]

Then the investors of the first season gave more money.

[Aryan Moyad]

These geniuses gave more money, made a second season. Now we have like four hours of a show, but we haven't shown the second two hours.

[Lisa Evans]

So we're like, oh, you know what? Let's sell it.

[Aryan Moyad]

We sell it.

[Lisa Evans]

We put it out into. And Topic buys and we make a third season. And all of a sudden, Topic owns everything. But now to watch my show, you.

[Aryan Moyad]

Have to have a six month subscription as a topic, which no one watches the show. And I always say, and I love Topic, bless Topic for making that happen. But they were just fucking, you know.

[Lisa Evans]

They'Re fucking around too.

[Aryan Moyad]

Everyone's, you know, we're all trying to do our best here and.

[Lisa Evans]

Putting it out. Myself had more viewership in the first.

[Nick Lapara]

Season, then all three with distribution.

[Lisa Evans]

And so in a way, the power.

[Aryan Moyad]

Is in our hands.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah, it's good.

[Lisa Evans]

The power is in our hands. You got some fucking piece of art that's fucking great and you believe that it needs a voice and a place. Make your own shit. Put it out there in your own way.

Yeah.

Get.

[Aryan Moyad]

Get creative. Get great.

[Lisa Evans]

If that fails, that doesn't mean it's over.

[Aryan Moyad]

It just means that you have to.

[Lisa Evans]

Do something else now.

Yeah.

If that feels.

[Aryan Moyad]

That just means you have to do something else now.

[Lisa Evans]

If that. That's the only thing, that's the only mechanism moving forward. And that's kind of how I think.

[Aryan Moyad]

About it, you know, I love it.

[Nick Lapara]

I love it. Well, before we move on and wrap up with the last question, congrats on the executive producing.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah. I can't wait for you to see the movie.

[Nick Lapara]

Malala's great. You're great. I can't.

[Aryan Moyad]

I can't wait for it.

[Nick Lapara]

Last question. You've been so kind to give us over an hour at this point, and you've got meetings and shit.

[Aryan Moyad]

Thank you.

[Nick Lapara]

To get to. How are you as an artist, as a human, as a partner, as a father, all these things? How are you taking care of yourself? How are you sustaining yourself as an artist and as all those other things?

[Aryan Moyad]

Very Hard. Very, very hard. There's drastic measures. I mean, really, it's friends, family, love. I mean, just surrounding yourself, people like that, that just understand, you know, you challenge you. I think that's the key to life, man. I really do believe that. I just believe that it's a group of us trying to do this thing, trying to make, you know, leave this world a little bit better than the way we found it, you know?

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

So that's. That's one. I'm inspired by art. I'm inspired by music. I'm inspired by, you know, all those things, the drastic measures. And I'm sure you probably saw this as you're trying to, like, get a hold of me and all that is. I don't have a smartphone anymore.

[Nick Lapara]

Amazing.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah. I have been on a flip phone for a year now.

[Nick Lapara]

Hell, yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

Because I was. I was. I'm. I am too much of. I'm too vulnerable and sensitive to be watching those videos. I can't. I can't do it anymore. I don't. I don't have it in. I know it.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Aryan Moyad]

I know they exist.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

And I know you're not doing it because you want to ignore it.

[Lisa Evans]

Right.

[Nick Lapara]

You know it. You can't.

[Aryan Moyad]

I can't do it because I just can't. I can't. I mean, it's happening right now. I can't see another dead baby.

[Nick Lapara]

No, it's.

[Aryan Moyad]

I'm done with that devastating one. Two is.

[Lisa Evans]

I'm done. All of the things.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know, what are the things that I've learned? People are like, what have you fucking learned? What's. What's been.

[Lisa Evans]

The better about it, you know, it's.

[Aryan Moyad]

75% amazing, 25% annoying. The thing I've learned the most, the thing that I'm loving right now, I.

[Lisa Evans]

Should say, is that since the iPhone, we have been. Now we.

[Aryan Moyad]

We believe as a society, as a people, as a human race, that we're.

[Lisa Evans]

All afraid of getting lost. Because even today, you googled, mapped and saw the.

[Aryan Moyad]

It was like a 18, 30, 40.

[Lisa Evans]

Whatever version, and you clicked on the.

[Aryan Moyad]

I did the same thing. Right. And the reason is because we don't want to get lost.

[Lisa Evans]

And things that we know. We know this fucking city. You're still like, should I go to the A.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know, like.

[Lisa Evans]

You know what I mean?

[Aryan Moyad]

Like, all that shit every day, all day. And.

[Lisa Evans]

And the first thing I've realized is I'm gonna be lost all the time.

[Aryan Moyad]

Now because I have no GPS A.

[Lisa Evans]

There's no scenario of which I'm Gonna be so fucking lost that I'm like. Unless I'm like, dropped in an ocean.

[Nick Lapara]

Right.

[Lisa Evans]

Like, then I'm not gonna be able to figure it out.

Yep.

You know, mostly because I'm not afraid.

[Aryan Moyad]

Of talking to strangers.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

[Nick Lapara]

Same.

[Lisa Evans]

Yep.

[Aryan Moyad]

So when I'm. And so New York.

[Lisa Evans]

Easier, L.A. hard.

[Nick Lapara]

Sure.

[Aryan Moyad]

You gotta drive around all that shit. So I write down my directions.

[Nick Lapara]

Amazing.

[Aryan Moyad]

And then I do the direction, and then I get lost. Happens so immediately, I give myself 30 extra minutes. After looking it up on Google Maps, I give myself 30 extra minutes. And then after that's done.

[Lisa Evans]

And if I get lost, I go.

[Aryan Moyad]

To a gas station, bro, and I say, how the fuck do I get on this 10?

[Lisa Evans]

And why does it say 10?

[Aryan Moyad]

101.

[Nick Lapara]

Yep.

[Aryan Moyad]

And why are those three. 10, 100.

[Lisa Evans]

It's like there are other numbers.

[Nick Lapara]

They're fucking with you.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah, totally.

[Nick Lapara]

That's amazing.

[Aryan Moyad]

Yeah. So that. That has been a game changer. And there's no real roadblocks to it. There's only one particular. Weirdly of all on earth, there's only one thing that I can't get into, and that's any Ticketmaster Arena. So I. But I'm usually going with a friend. So I just transfer tickets and.

[Lisa Evans]

Yep.

So I.

[Aryan Moyad]

You can't. You can't.

[Nick Lapara]

And that's a pretty first world problem. You know, that's like a small thing.

[Aryan Moyad]

That's not.

[Nick Lapara]

But you're so right. Like, especially in a city like this, where we live.

[Lisa Evans]

What, are you gonna get lost?

[Nick Lapara]

Like, literally, you know, I do cigar walks several times a week or I get on a city bike. And a lot of times I just won't even know where I'm going. Like, I just know I need to get to. Like, I need to go, you know, to. I need to meet a friend at Union Square. I'm up in Harlem. Well, I can do. I can do Central Park West. I can do the east side of the park. I can go, you know. You know, like, there's so many ways to get there. I know I'm gonna end up at Union Square. I don't even know. Look at my map. Once I know how to get there, I'm just gonna keep whittling my way down until I get there. And so that's a real. That's a real beautiful thing. It is. And you don't have all the shit that I have from being on this fucking thing. Yeah.

[Lisa Evans]

I mean, I have it on my computer.

[Aryan Moyad]

I'm not gonna lie. I'm not having a computer. But But. But there is, you know, so when I'm out, when I leave the house, like from that moment I leave the house until the next time I open my computer, I just have to be present with it. So that's really kind of fun as well. What's annoying is it annoys everybody. No one can get a hold of me. My texts sometimes go through.

[Lisa Evans]

Yeah.

But it's okay, you know, it's okay. It's all right.

[Nick Lapara]

It's a.

[Aryan Moyad]

We're all gonna live.

[Nick Lapara]

I love it.

[Aryan Moyad]

So that's kind of like been a big, like, drastic, like, move to the hoop.

[Nick Lapara]

But I'm sure you are much more centered and focused and healed person. I know, I know. It's not good that every day I'm on social media, I'm way too. People can find me. If it's not text, it's email. If it's not email, it's DM. If it's not DM, it's WhatsApp signal. There's 900 ways to get a hold of me.

[Aryan Moyad]

And A and B, everyone's. I also notice this.

[Lisa Evans]

Everyone's got their own addiction. So I never really realized this, but.

[Aryan Moyad]

Actually my addiction is email.

[Lisa Evans]

I constantly was, did I get another email? And then I'd get an email Nick, and I'd be like, yo, I can't answer this right now. Give me a few days. Like, I don't need this. But I was like, oh, I want to make sure that you receive the email. Who gives a shit? Wait three days. That's.

[Aryan Moyad]

You know, that's so true.

[Nick Lapara]

I always. I have a different perception myself. I too chronically checking my email 90 times a day. I check my email and I want to. In the. Whenever someone does that to me where they don't respond for like, I don't give a shit. But I think the person's gonna get upset at me if I don't. If I'm not like, immigrant shit. There have been 10 emails today that I have. I'm not kidding you. I've respond within 30 seconds of them sending it to me. I did two on the way up here. I got the email as it was dinging. I responded right away. Within 30 seconds of them sending it, they had my reply. Who the fuck needs it wasn't that urgent.

[Lisa Evans]

Not that it's not that deep.

[Aryan Moyad]

No, it's just not gonna ever be that heavy. It's just not.

[Lisa Evans]

And if it's that heavy, they call me.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah, totally. That's true.

[Aryan Moyad]

And that's the. The Can I tell you the biggest plus of this, the 74 phone calls.

[Nick Lapara]

More community.

[Lisa Evans]

I have people in my life that.

[Aryan Moyad]

I've been texting with only for four.

[Nick Lapara]

Or five years, and now you're talking.

[Aryan Moyad]

They have to call me because I.

[Lisa Evans]

Can'T fucking text all that.

[Aryan Moyad]

It takes too long, you know, t9ing it is not that fun.

[Nick Lapara]

Oh, I remember those days. It was not fun at all.

[Aryan Moyad]

No.

[Nick Lapara]

Arjen, thank you so much for water. Well, for your work, for your immigrant story, for all the good you're putting in the world, for the ways you've challenged us.

[Aryan Moyad]

Let's give a shit, baby.

[Nick Lapara]

Yeah, let's give a shit. Let's give a fuck.

[Aryan Moyad]

Let's give it damn.

[Nick Lapara]

Let's give all of it. Thank you.

[Aryan Moyad]

All right, man.

[Nick Lapara]

Friends, thank you so much for showing up and for spending some time with Arien and me today. To find links for everything mentioned in today's conversation and to keep up with all things let's Give a damn, visit letsgivadam.com Please share this episode with a friend. Please leave us a five star rating and review on Apple podcasts or Spotify. And please show up in the weeks ahead. We have many more incredible conversations coming your way. You can reach out anytime and for any [e-mail] keep giving a damn.

I love you all.

Bye for now.