In this episode of Lex Pacificatoria, Michael speaks with Sabine Nölke, former Canadian Ambassador and a seasoned international lawyer, about her extensive diplomatic career, the evolution of Canadian foreign policy, and the future of multilateralism. Sabine reflects on her role in providing guidance to the government in drafting key international treaties, the challenges of creating accountability mechanisms, and the personal qualities needed to succeed in diplomacy today. She shares candid insights into Canada’s shifting alliances in the Trump 2.0 era, the erosion of trust and expertise in international relations, and why she remains cautiously optimistic about international law’s enduring role.

Produced and hosted by Michael Campbell https://x.com/Campbell_M_J

Sponsored by the Western Academy for Advanced Research's 2025 theme "Exploring Possibilities for Peace in the 21st Century"

Western Academy for Advanced Research: https://uwo.ca/academy/index.html
Exploring Possibilities for Peace in the 21st Century: https://uwo.ca/academy/themes/possibilities_for_peace/index.html
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Connect with Sabine Nölke online:

BlueSky: https://bsky.app/profile/snolke.bsky.social/
LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/sabine-nolke-🇨🇦-3041b727
Substack: https://substack.com/@canuck21

Think your recent work fits the theme of the podcast? Complete the guest form if you would like to be featured. https://bit.ly/42Y4hIs

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© Michael J. Campbell 2025

Time codes
0:00 Why pursue international law?
5:04 Establishing a career
8:47 Achievements
13:10 Important of mentors
15:55 Canadian identity
18:22 Return of expansionism
20:22 Loss of American allyship
22:05 Art of persuasion
24:31 Working with Trump
27:25 Trump 2.0
30:17 Acknowledging bias
30:55 Threats to security
33:47 International criminal justice
36:09 Optimism
38:24 Does international law work?
40:58 Advice for future diplomats
43:08 Be interested in the world
43:47 Be wary of grand narratives

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Defending the International Legal Order with guest Sabine Nölke