
Hosted by Susan Ni Chriodain · EN
What really makes work-life fulfilling?
Through stories, reflections and insights from leaders, thinkers and creatives, we shine a light on the invisible forces that shape our work lives — what it means to be human. This isn’t just something to tune into — it’s something to attune to.
Hosted by award-winning author Susan Ní Chríodáin, Life Beyond the Numbers is for people who care about people. Because while numbers matter — people matter more.

"We can do so much better for ourselves in terms of the way in which we live and the degree of fulfilment and meaning that we derive from life." Kate Jones Kate Jones shares her unique approach to fostering personal and organisational fulfilment. We explore her Wheel of New Horizons, a framework for helping successful yet unfulfilled individuals reconnect with their heart's desires and navigate life changes with purpose. Kate also unveils her Work Thrivometer, a tool that pinpoints 10 ingredients for thriving in the workplace. From redefining success to balancing sensitivity with strength, Kate offers a fresh perspective on achieving a deeply fulfilling life. Her story of a transformative trek in the Himalayas brings these insights to life, highlighting the interplay of leadership, followership, and inner purpose. Kate Jones is a certified leadership and life coach, consultant and facilitator that specialises in helping purpose-led leaders create more Deeply Human® organisations where more people can thrive and do their best work without burning out. She is on a mission to change the world of work, and to help as many people as possible to live, lead and work well. She founded Neon in 2013 after ten years in corporate consulting and a further ten in social care. She is the architect of the Deeply Human® leadership model and leads The Deeply Human Culture Club, a community of like-minded leaders who want more organisations to be a force for good on the inside and out. Connect with Kate: Through her website Deeply Neon On LinkedIn Kate's Linktree Resources Mentioned: The Wheel of New Horizons & The Neon Work Thriveometer Simon Sinek Brene Brown The Olympics

"If they're not applying creative and intuitive thinking in addition to critical and judgmental thinking, then they're not creating new knowledge for the organisation. They're just taking old knowledge and rearranging it. And for me, that's not adding value." Jackie Eaton Jackie Eaton shares her unique career path from obtaining a mathematics degree to working in operational research for NATO. She discusses her affection for solving complex problems, her initial struggles to discover a career-fit and the compelling nature of public service. Jackie and I chat about gender dynamics in the workplace, the challenges and rewards of working in a male-dominated, multicultural environment, the importance of effective communication, the role of psychology in leadership and the impact of AI on analytical work. Jackie shares insights on maintaining optimism and tips for those aspiring to work in organisations like NATO. Jackie Eaton works at NATO. She is a specialist in analysis of public sector issues including defence and health sectors or anything else messy and complex with excellent communication and interpersonal skills. She describes herself as an eternal optimist, smart problem solver, data geek and psychology nerd. She is also a mentor, trainer and ray of sunshine in the office. Connect with Jackie On LinkedIn Resources Mentioned NATO Leading Beyond the Numbers by Susan Ní Chríodáin

"...they were willing to take risks for the experience .... and I think I've really taken that on." Liz Jarman Liz Jarman and I discuss her planned departure as CEO of Living Goods at the end of 2024. She shares her fascinating approach to succession planning, leadership transitions and a non-linear career path. We chat through some of her achievements, including fostering a strong organisational culture, scaling operations sustainably and spearheading a digital transformation in community health. Liz reflects on the influence of her upbringing on her leadership style, her emphasis on a high-performing team and giving people recognition - all offering invaluable lessons on leadership and managing change. Liz Jarman was named CEO of Living Goods in 2018 and is a member of the Living Goods Board of Directors. Liz has 25 years of experience from various sectors, Liz joined Living Goods in 2014 as Director of Product Strategy and was promoted to Kenya Country Director in 2015 and at the end of 2017, she was promoted to Chief Strategy Officer. Born in Zambia, Liz spent a large portion of her career at Sainsbury’s, a $30 billion UK grocery business where she rose to lead Sainsbury’s Product Development and Fairtrade strategy and worked with thousands of global suppliers with a particular focus on African sustainable supply chains. Connect with Liz On LinkedIn Resources Mentioned Living Goods Squiggly Careers Podcast

"Don't be funny, be human - you don't have to force it. Have a sense of humour. Have the ability to look at situations and see the humour that you do when you're outside of work. How often do you go home from work and you're sitting at the dinner table saying to your partner, or your family, you just wouldn't even believe what happened today..." Beth Sherman Beth Sherman and I place a lens on the transformative power of humour in our work-lives. Beth shares insights from her career as a comedy writer and stand-up comedian, illustrating how humour can be a powerful tool for leaders to build trust, reduce tension and foster team dynamics. We touch on practical applications such as using humour to make interactions more human, make connections in diverse environments and improve workplace resilience. She emphasises the importance of self-awareness and authenticity in using humour effectively. Beth believes humour is a love-language, it can be used like a seasoning and that there is a lot of truth in humour. Beth Sherman is a speaker, comedian, and seven-time Emmy Award-winning Hollywood comedy writer who's written for the biggest shows in American television, including Late Show with David Letterman, The Tonight Show With Jay Leno, Ellen, and the Academy Awards. As a speaker, she helps individuals and organizations harness the power of humor to create meaningful connection and genuine engagement with clients, colleagues and audiences. Connect with Beth LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/beth-sherman/ Website: https://www.bethsherman.com/ Resources Mentioned: Professional Speakers Association Victor Borge

"This is about what you are experiencing. And I think the beauty of your experience is it's your experience and no one can argue with that." David Lee and I delve into the significance of emotional self-regulation and co-regulation, highlighting the impact they have on psychological safety and productive workplace environments. We discuss concepts from my book 'Leading Beyond the Numbers' including the importance of emotional granularity and how subtle changes in language can shape one's perception and interactions. We also cover the value of reflection and curiosity, and the cultural impact of emotions in an organisation. Through relatable examples and research, our discussion offers practical techniques for managing emotions and enhancing workplace culture. David Lee is a coach, consultant, workshop facilitator, keynote speaker, and author of Dealing with a Difficult Co-Worker, who loves creating a win/win/win relationship between people and the organizations they work for. He helps leaders and leadership teams learn how to become "people whisperers", and by doing so, increase their ability to make their organization THE choice for "A List Talent" and inspire the best in their people. Connect with David On LinkedIn Through his website, SoulSatisfyingWork Resources Mentioned How to Up Your People Game at Work: LinkedIn Live Series (Forthcoming onOct 7th, 14th, 21st & 28th 5pm UK/12pm EST) Leading Beyond the Numbers, Susan Ní Chríodáin The Book of Human Emotions, Tiffany Watt Smith The Emotional Dictionary, Susie Dent Lisa Feldman Barrett, How Emotions are Mad Daniel Goleman Steven Porges and Polyvagal Theory Don't Bite the Hook, Pema Chodron Ted Lasso on Apple TV Emotional Agility, Susan David

I am thoroughly enjoying reading "Wayfinding: The Art and Science of How We Find and Lose Our Way" by Michael Bond and have drawn from it to put together this episode. The parallels between how we do this out there in the wild and within the daily confines or our work-life struck me. I've used excerpts from this book, in particular the psychology of being lost, for this episode and added some of my own thoughts, stories and poems. Please note that I will be taking a break for the month of August. Until September .... happy wandering! Resources Mentioned Wayfinding: The Art and Science of How We Find and Lose Our Way by Michael Bond

"There's schools of thought around us; the quantum nature of humanity in terms of us being energy and vibrations. And whether you think of it as woo-woo, pseudoscience or whatever, I'm not concerned about that as much as understanding that when we got on this call, our energy levels were higher than usual and matching each other. And I think that is something that as people we really need to tap into. Being able to empathetically match our energy and also have the ability to shift it up or down as we see fit and that serves the environment that we're in." Steve Wright Steve Wright and I have a dynamic discussion on his career journey from IT to coaching, and the intersection of human and information technology. We delve into how upbringing influenced Steve's interest in people and the importance of human interaction in technology. We explore leadership, the psychology-physiology connection, life's valleys and peaks and the significance of personal responsibility. We discuss the significance of energy in interactions, both personally and professionally. Steve also shares insights into his coaching practice, particularly around being a thinking partners to help managers become effective leaders. Steve Wright's career path took him into Information Technology (IT) but the lessons of Human Technology remained, and have been a thread throughout his life. He experienced the transformation that can be achieved with a change in our physiology and psychology. Steve with over 25 years of experience is now a seasoned IT manager turned business and life coach based in Lancaster, UK. He empowers managers to become inspiring leaders through his company, SAWright Coaching. Connect with Steve On LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sawright/ Through his website: https://sawrightcoaching.com Resources Mentioned: The 1 to One Thing Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-1-to-one-thing/id1696216009 Episode 45 of The 1 to One Thing Podcast, Leading Beyond the Numbers with Susan Ní Chríodáin: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/ep-45-leading-beyond-the-numbers-susan-ni-chriodian/id1696216009?i=1000657301125 Tony Robbins https://www.tonyrobbins.com/

"There's four key components that I focus on in my work and my programs. The environment [ ]. There's behaviour. You would be shocked if I told you that almost every single thing that we do from the moment we wake up until the moment we go to bed, is an amalgamation of the quality later that night of how we sleep." Dan White Dan White and I discuss the critical role of sleep in our daily lives. He outlines four key components - environment, behaviour, psychology, and culture - that influence sleep. We delve into Dan's personal experiences with sleep, why quality trumps quantity, and how our modern lifestyles impact our sleep and circadian rhythms. Dan shares valuable insights into the interplay between sleep, health and well-being, and performance at work. We also touch on Dan's initiatives with Sleep Better, Live Better Foundation which focuses on educating younger generations about the benefits of proper sleep habits. Throughout, Dan stresses the value of simple solutions, like spending time outdoors and integrating natural light into daily routines, to improve sleep and health. Daniel White is a Registered Nutritionist (MSc, ANutr) and Functional Medicine Certified Health Coach (FMCHC) with extensive educational, research and clinical experience in the fields of nutrition, psychology, stress management, sleep science, health education and human behaviour change. Daniel educates people on how to radically transform their lives whilst spreading his passion for a natural and holistic evidence-based approach to health and well-being. Connect with Daniel Through social media: LinkedIn and Instagram Visit his website Check out Sleep Better Live Better Foundation Resources Mentioned Why We Sleep, Matthew Walker The Biology of Sleep & Your Unique Sleep Needs | Huberman Lab Guest Series with Dr. Matt Walker