Live Wire with Luke Burbank: Episode Featuring Ian & Dr. Aliza Carmel, Zainab Johnson, and McLeet

Release Date: December 27, 2024
Host: Luke Burbank (PRX)
Guests:

• Ian Carmel: Comedian and Emmy-nominated TV writer
• Dr. Aliza Carmel: Clinical Psychologist and Ian’s sister
• Zainab Johnson: Stand-up Comedian
• McLeet: Ethio Jazz Musician

1. Exploring Sibling Dynamics and Body Positivity

Guests: Ian Carmel & Dr. Aliza Carmel
Book Discussed: T Shirt Swim Club: Stories from Being Fat in a World of Thin People

Luke Burbank introduces Ian Carmel and his sister, Dr. Aliza Carmel, highlighting their collaborative book that delves into their experiences of living as fat individuals in a society predominantly geared towards thinness. The book uniquely blends Ian’s comedic take with Dr. Aliza’s clinical insights, offering a multifaceted perspective on body image and self-acceptance.

Key Discussions:

• Origin of the Collaboration:
  "It was my agent's idea," Ian explains how the idea to co-write the book was sparked during a conversation about their shared experiences growing up overweight.

• Processing Trauma Differently:
  Dr. Aliza reflects, "I'm still processing it. It’s a lifelong experience," contrasting her clinical approach with Ian’s use of comedy to navigate their childhood traumas related to weight.

• Home Environment:
  Both siblings emphasize that their home was a sanctuary where being fat wasn’t a source of shame. "It was kind of the one place in the world where it didn't suck to be fat," Ian shares, highlighting the supportive atmosphere they fostered.

• Media Representation:
  They critique how media portrays fat individuals, often oscillating between humor and pity without capturing the complexity and joy of their lives. Dr. Aliza notes, "There's a lot of joy and there's a lot of wonderfulness in this."

Notable Quote:
Ian reads the book’s dedication: "Dedicated to all the fat kids. It gets better." ([32:05])

2. Navigating Diet Culture and Modern Weight Loss Solutions

Discussion Between: Luke Burbank, Ian Carmel, Dr. Aliza Carmel

The conversation shifts to the pervasive diet culture and the rise of pharmaceutical solutions like Ozempic and Wegovy. Both Carmel siblings share their personal battles with various diets, emphasizing the limitations and failings of one-size-fits-all approaches.

Key Points:

• Ineffectiveness of Standard Diets:
  "Diets fail, not the people," Dr. Aliza asserts, explaining that standardized diets don’t cater to individual needs and often ignore the underlying emotional factors influencing eating habits.

• Pharmaceutical Aids:
  The discussion touches on the potential and pitfalls of drugs like Ozempic. Dr. Aliza cautions, "They need to understand what's going on before they just jump on board," highlighting the necessity of addressing emotional and psychological aspects alongside medical interventions.

• Personal Experiences:
  Ian shares his skepticism towards quick fixes, emphasizing the importance of tackling the root causes of disordered eating. "A big part of it was anxiety, and I could go on Ozempic and Ozempic would not treat my anxiety," he admits, stressing that without addressing mental health, such solutions are only temporary.

Notable Quote:
Dr. Aliza emphasizes, "We do a lot of work of detaching from that [appearance] and embracing your worth in more meaningful ways." ([31:08])

3. Life After Weight Loss: Identity and Self-Perception

Guests: Ian Carmel & Dr. Aliza Carmel

The Carmel siblings delve into the complexities of identity post-weight loss. Ian discusses the dissonance between his internal self and public perception, particularly in his career as a stand-up comedian.

Key Insights:

• Changing Perceptions:
  Ian shares, "I was on stage after having lived 35 years as a fat person telling jokes about fat people. And I'm like, why aren't they laughing?" illustrating the challenges of evolving self-identity while maintaining past coping mechanisms.

• Maintaining Relationships with Self:
  Both siblings acknowledge that weight loss doesn’t erase past experiences or redefine one’s relationship with their body. Dr. Aliza adds, "There is a relationship you have with yourself and with your health and with your eating for the rest of your life."

Notable Anecdote:
Ian humorously recounts his struggle with finding fashionable clothing post-weight loss, illustrating the superficial changes that accompany significant personal transformations. "I bought like a cream... I wore it once and then I saw myself in the mirror and I... that was rock bottom for me." ([30:13])

4. Stand-Up Comedy with Zainab Johnson

Guest: Zainab Johnson
Special Mention: Hijabs Off Comedy Special

Zainab Johnson, a comedian and one of 13 siblings, takes the stage to share her unique experiences growing up in a large, Black Muslim family. She humorously addresses misconceptions about her faith and personal identity.

Key Points:

• Cultural Misunderstandings:
  Zainab jokes about the frequent mispronunciations of her name and the assumptions others make about her religious practices. "I always get like, 'Zimbutu, Where'd you get those letters from?'" ([36:32])

• Sibling Dynamics:
  She humorously discusses the statistical improbability of having a gay sibling in a family of 13, highlighting the pressures and expectations within large families. "We should have two," she quips, reflecting on family diversity. ([44:08])

Notable Quote:
Zainab humorously remarks on her family's knockout diversity, "We got 13 kids, and only one is a murderer. You did good, right?" ([44:50])

5. Ethio Jazz with McLeet

Musical Guest: McLeet
Latest EP: Ethio Blue

McLeet, an Ethio jazz musician and TED Senior Fellow, performs tracks from her latest EP, Ethio Blue. She discusses her creative process, the influence of her cultural heritage, and her innovative project, Movement.

Key Highlights:

• Creating Ethio Blue:
  McLeet shares, "I wrote most of the songs in 2019 when I was very, very, very pregnant," revealing the personal inspirations behind her music.

• Movement Project:
  She explains her Movement initiative, aimed at showcasing the cultural power and musical innovation of immigrant communities. "We uplift the songs and stories of immigrant, migrant, and refugee musicians," she states, emphasizing the importance of diverse narratives in music.

Performance Excerpt:
McLeet delivers a captivating rendition of the title track from Ethio Blue, blending traditional Ethio sounds with contemporary jazz elements.

6. Community and Listener Engagement

Throughout the episode, Luke and Elena engage with listener stories about sibling arguments, adding a relatable and humorous touch to the show. Examples include battles over salad ingredients and childhood dynamics inspired by pop culture references like the Spice Girls.

Listener Stories Highlight:

• Heather vs. Her Sibling:
  "I like tomatoes and hate cucumbers," Lauren shares, detailing their playful yet relentless salad ingredient warfare. ([34:03])

• Sarah’s Spice Girls Showdown:
  Sarah recounts wrestling over who gets to embody Baby Spice versus Ginger, reflecting the childhood competitiveness fostered by popular music icons. ([34:31])

Conclusion

This episode of Live Wire with Luke Burbank offers a profound exploration of sibling relationships, body positivity, and cultural identity through engaging conversations and performances. Ian and Dr. Aliza Carmel provide insightful perspectives on navigating life as fat individuals, while Zainab Johnson and McLeet deliver laughter and soulful music that resonate deeply with listeners. The episode successfully intertwines personal narratives with broader societal themes, making it both entertaining and thought-provoking for audiences.

Recommended Listening:

• T Shirt Swim Club: Stories from Being Fat in a World of Thin People by Ian & Dr. Aliza Carmel
• Hijabs Off Comedy Special by Zainab Johnson
• Ethio Blue EP by McLeet

Notable Quotes:

• "It gets better." – Dedication by Ian Carmel ([32:05])
• "We're talking to Dr. Eliza Carmel and also stand up comic Ian Carmel." – Luke Burbank ([16:27])
• "Just someone who has shared your experience, but done so with understanding, humor, empathy, and the advice of somebody with a doctorate in clinical psychology." – Ian Carmel ([14:34])

By weaving together personal anecdotes, expert insights, and cultural commentary, this episode stands out as a meaningful discourse on body image, family dynamics, and the power of storytelling in fostering understanding and acceptance.