Experiencing Forgiveness in Real Time

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Experiencing Forgiveness in Real Time"

Living Influence with Bill Thrall and Scott Boyd
Date: December 11, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this heartfelt episode, Bill Thrall and Scott Boyd dive deep into what it means to truly experience forgiveness—not just in the theological sense, but as a daily, lived reality. They focus especially on freeing ourselves from shame, reconciling not just with God and others, but critically with ourselves. With candid personal stories and scriptural insights, Bill and Scott explore how to live "forgiven" in real time, moving from a posture of shame and "sin management" into a transformative experience that empowers us to influence others.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The Common Struggle with Forgiveness and Shame

• Opening Reflection: Bill describes living with "a constant angst" of never feeling forgiven and always feeling "not good enough" ([00:09]).
• Forgiveness is presented not as a one-time event, but something to "try on" as a new identity: "Try on this new set of clothes that says, I'm forgiven." – Bill ([00:39])

2. The Daily Reality of Sin and Its Effects

• Living in a World Affected by Sin: Both Bill and Scott emphasize that everyone lives influenced by their own sin and by the sins of others ([01:03]).
• "Being affected by sin tragically always triggers my shame. And that's why you started with those words. You've lived in that reality of never being enough. Those are shame words." – Scott ([01:20])

3. Theological Grounding: What Does It Mean To Be Forgiven?

• True Nature of Forgiveness:
  • "Jesus has already forgiven all of your sins, past, present, and future." – Bill ([02:38])
  • Scott clarifies: "In reality, every person who accepts Jesus Christ is forgiven. And God says I'll remember their sin no more. I'll cast it as far as east from the west." ([02:50])
  • Yet, the experience of sin and its impact continues to affect us in real time ([03:50]).

4. Scripture and the Paradox of Confession

• 1 John discussed: "The blood of Jesus Christ, God's Son, cleanseth us from all sin."
• Distinction between being positionally forgiven by God and the need for ongoing, real-time confession for cleansing ([04:08]–[04:37]).
• Scott: "Because I am experiencing the sin for which I have done in real time, I need to ask for forgiveness so I can be cleansed of what I've done." ([05:19])
• The act of repentance and forgiving others is necessary for present freedom: "In real life, unless I experience repenting, I will not be cleansed of the sin I've done in real time unless I let you repent and forgive you for what you've done." – Scott ([08:02])

5. The Two Gifts for True Forgiveness

• Two divine gifts:
  • The ability to confess and be cleansed of our own sin.
  • The ability to forgive those who have sinned against us ([06:53], [08:02]).
• Forgiveness is described as "applying the blood of Jesus to the sin done against me," while repentance "applies the blood of Jesus to the sin that I have done" ([08:44]).

6. Real-Life Examples and Freedom from the Past

• Powerful story: Bill recounts helping a woman who, after three decades, found freedom from the effects of childhood harm through processing and forgiveness ([09:07]–[09:59]).
• Bill shares his own journey: "Nobody's ever hurt me as much as I have. Nobody has ever done as much damage to the guy who's talking as I have." ([10:50])
• When Bill trusted Jesus "to cleanse me today of what I've done to me," he experienced overwhelming freedom and the breaking of "the bondage of my hidden behavior" ([11:10]).

7. Forgiving Ourselves and Letting Go of Shame

• Scott highlights how self-dialogue can reinforce shame: "The things I say about me... how I talk to me... to begin to let go of all those things... Those are lies that have formed our identity." ([12:04]–[12:22])
• Bill summarizes: "Breaking the bondage of the lies I told me because of what I had done to me." ([12:27])

8. Living in a New Reality—Forgiven With God, Others, and Self

• "Our sin no longer defines us" is the core takeaway for relationships with God, others, and ourselves ([13:12]).
• The process leads to liking oneself: "Now, this is going to sound corny... but I'm sorry. I like me now." – Bill ([14:24])

9. The Impact of Early Experiences and Parental Relationships

• Scott relates his own harsh self-talk to his childhood, specifically his father's abandonment and alcoholism ([14:37]).
• He identifies a pattern: people with settled self-relationships often had "a good dad," highlighting the powerful impact of early experiences ([15:15]).

10. Moving From Shame to Influence

• The result of practicing real-time forgiveness: living without the "angst defined by my shame" and instead "living into the purposes of God" in open relationships ([16:57]).
• Bill critiques "sin management theology" that keeps Christians stuck in shame versus the grace-focused approach that enables living "in a condition of living forgiven" ([17:15]).
• Living forgiven empowers influence: "When you live in the two, you help others to begin... to start living in the two. And that's called influence." – Scott & Bill ([19:04])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the illusion of heavenly judgment:
  "I was taught when I would go to heaven, they would read all of those sins of mine... But listen to what that did to you. See, that was a shame. That was a teaching of shame to scare you from sinning." – Scott ([06:53]–[07:07])

• On personal transformation:
  "Nobody's ever hurt me as much as I have... I'm going to trust Jesus and his blood to cleanse me today of what I've done to me." – Bill ([10:49]–[11:20])

• On self-forgiveness and identity:
  "I like me now. For years. For years. No, no." – Bill ([14:24])

• On influence:
  "When you live in the two, you help others to begin... to start living in the two. And that's called influence." – Scott & Bill ([19:02]–[19:17])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Opening & Theme Introduction: [00:09]–[01:36]
• Theology of Forgiveness: [02:38]–[05:33]
• Two Gifts and Real-Time Cleansing: [06:39]–[09:06]
• Personal Stories of Freedom: [09:07]–[11:44]
• Shame, Self-Talk & New Identity: [12:04]–[13:24]
• Fatherhood, Childhood Wounds & Self-Relationship: [14:37]–[15:45]
• Role of Grace vs. Sin Management: [16:57]–[17:15]
• Living In the “Two” (Forgiven and Free): [18:37]–[19:17]

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Conclusion

Bill and Scott’s candid discussion offers both a theological foundation and practical encouragement for anyone wrestling with shame, self-condemnation, or the pain of relational wounds. The episode underscores the importance of not just understanding forgiveness intellectually but also experiencing it viscerally and relationally—an invitation to live truly free, to like oneself, and to influence others from an authentic place of grace.

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For further study: Listeners are invited to download study guides and join community discussions, fostering a deeper exploration of these life-changing truths.

Transcript

[A]

In life.

Sometimes we can live with a constant angst, believing that we're never quite forgiven. What would it be like to actually experience forgiveness? Welcome to this week's Living Influence. I say that with seriousness because I. I've lived in that state like I'm never good enough. I'm always coming up short. When's the shoe gonna drop to. Then all of a sudden.

Try on this new set of clothes that says, I'm forgiven.

[B]

Amen.

[A]

Or even. I mean, it's deeper than that. It's more than that. It's just much deeper. Yeah, yeah, but it's possible.

[B]

That's the key to today.

[A]

Yes, it's possible. That's the hope.

[B]

It's the home. Here's our reality. All of us live being affected by each other.

[A]

Right?

[B]

That's the way we live.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And we live in that being affected by each other because of our sin and the sin that's done to us, we live that way.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Most of us don't pause to imagine that because we live being affected by each other. It becomes the foundation for the way I see myself. It becomes the foundation for where I see God. It becomes the foundation for the way I see you. Being affected by sin tragically always triggers my shame. And that's why you started with those words. You've lived in that reality of never being enough. Those are shame words.

[A]

Yeah, they are.

[B]

We know those are shame words. And so for many, they live in the reality of the sin they've done and the sin done against them never being resolved. That's their reality. We've had lessons on that that we've shared in our podcast, but this podcast we want to talk about, is it possible to live in a state of being forgiven? Can I actually live in that reality?

[A]

I used to teach fifth grade Sunday school in my history, and I would talk about asking God to forgive us, or has he forgiven us? And I would always ask the question, like, what if you're in the car and you're, like, really angry at your brother and you hit him and then the car's hit and everybody dies?

[B]

Oh, jeepers, you were a horrible teacher.

[A]

I know.

[B]

The snot out of the snakes.

[A]

No, it's like, no, but it's like, are we only forgiven when we go, will you forgive me, God? Do we have to keep that slate clean? And it's like, well, no, actually, Jesus has already forgiven all of your sins, past, present, and future. But we still have this word, forgiveness.

[B]

In reality, every person who accepts Jesus Christ is forgiven. And God says I'll remember their sin no more. I'll cast it as far as east from the west. So from God's perspective, 2,000 years ago, at a place called Calvary, you were forgiven. Yet let's talk about reality in today's world. Yet today I, in my life, am experiencing sin that I do. And I am experiencing the sin that you do to me today. I'm experiencing that. And because I'm experiencing that, I need to know a God perspective. God no longer sees my sin, but he is concerned about what my sin is doing to me today.

[A]

Right.

[B]

So we have to see a perspective of God. Not only did he forgive me, remembers my sin no more, but 2,000 years ago, he took care of that. When I live today in the reality of the effect of sin.

[A]

Right.

[B]

So in one John, there's these verses, and the blood of Jesus Christ, God's Son, cleanseth us from all sin. Wow, really? The blood of Jesus Christ, God's son, cleanseth us from all sin. What sin is it? Just the sin I do. But then he says this, if I confess my sin, he is faithful and just to forgive me.

[A]

So it's like, wait, didn't you just forgive it?

[B]

Ah, that's important.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because here's what we're doing. We're trying to come up with a realization that this lesson is about living, forgiven. That's what this lesson is about. How do I live? Forgiven. I am forgiven before God. But the sin that Jesus died for, I'm not experienced. I haven't experienced till now. In this reality of my now, I am experiencing the sin I've done and the sin you've done against me. And today in my now, my God wants to cleanse me of what I've done and what you've done to me in my present reality, so that being clean, I can in fact be free. Because at the very beginning you described this angst, this angst of shame. Do you know, in the angst of shame, I never experienced freedom?

[A]

Yeah, I can believe that.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I can say, and rightly so, I can be very biblical and I can say I am forgiven, therefore I don't need to ask forgiveness. Or I can say I am forgiven. And because I am experiencing the sin for which I have done in real time, I need to ask for forgiveness so I can be cleansed of what I've done. I need to ask you to repent of what you've done to me so you can be clean and I could be clean of what you've done. To me. So I'd like to put it in this context. So God has given us two gifts to help us deal with the sin that we are experiencing as Christians before God. I'm forgiven. Could I scream this as loud as I can? I'm screaming now. My sin never separates me from my God because my God has totally trusted the cross. And when he trusted the cross, he and I became like that.

[A]

And he's not even going to remember.

[B]

It, but he won't even remember it. But he knows that I'm living in real time with real people like you and these other people, and we're doing something affecting each other.

[A]

I was taught when I would go to heaven, they would read all of those sins of mine.

[B]

Yeah. Well, that's a tragic thing. I don't know who taught you that. Could I pause for a minute and say, shame on them, because.

[A]

This horrifying thought.

[B]

But listen to what that did to you. See, that was a shame. That was a teaching of shame to scare you from sinning. Because in heaven, all your sins were going to be rehearsed. I, as a Christian, will never stand in judgment for anything I've ever done.

Everything I ever did. He stood in judgment for me at Calvary.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

So when I get to heaven, I will be in a place where I will not any longer remember, like my God, because of Calvary, Anything I've ever done.

That was sinful.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That's the hope of the salvation and the power of the cross. So I have these two gifts.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And one gift says that if I confess my sin, he is faithful and just to forgive me and to cleanse me for unrighteousness. I thought he already forgave me. He did. As far as he's concerned, I'm forgiven. But he understands something. In real life, unless I experience repenting, I will not be cleansed of the sin I've done in real time unless I let you repent and forgive you for what you've done. That second gift, forgiving you, I won't be healed or cleansed of what you've done to me. The blood of Jesus Christ. And a lot of people who taught us another lesson. I'd like to repeat it. A lot of people don't understand that forgiveness is actually applying the blood of Jesus to the sin of done against me. Repentance is actually applying the blood of Jesus to the sin that I have done. And when the blood of Jesus is applied, I am clean.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Recently, I met with a woman. For 30 years, this woman, she's in her mid-40s, she never, ever, ever processed what was done to her as a child. Ever.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And we went into a long time together of her processing very careful and honestly what was done and forgiving every step in the process. And, Scott, I'll never forget. It's happened with many people I've dealt with, but this one woman stands out right. In the time together, she stopped me and she started crying and she said, do you know, for the first time.

I'm free?

And she looked at me and she says, do you have any idea what this feels like? I'm clean.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Now, that's the power of the application of the blood of Jesus in real time, right to sin that was done against her. We've got to be really, really wise here.

Can I trust.

Really trust that the blood of Jesus is capable of cleansing me today of all that I have done? So often what we talk about this week. Oh, the sin that I have done to you and the sin you have done to me. But I like to always have this. And the sin that I have done to me. Is it possible for me to be cleansed of the sin that I have done to me?

[A]

Your relationship with you.

[B]

My relationship with me. And you've heard me share this before, but I've been hurt a lot. My childhood was hard.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But nobody's ever hurt me as much as I have. Nobody has ever done as much damage to the guy who's talking as I have. Do you know, I'm like that woman some years ago. I'm like that woman where I sat one day and I just said, I'm going to trust Jesus and his blood to cleanse me today of what I've done to me. That freedom, Scott, was overwhelmingly amazing.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And you know what it did? And I haven't shared this part with you. What it did is it broke the bondage of my hidden behavior because my hiding kept me identified in my shame. Being cleansed of what I had done broke the power of what I was hiding.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And for me, personally, I didn't think that was ever possible.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So let me summarize for everybody this truth just before you do, please.

[A]

So this. This forgiving me. Yeah. I just want to. I want to pause on that because what I. What I do to me, it shows up in my language. Oh, about me.

[B]

Absolutely. Absolutely.

[A]

The things I say about me.

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

How I talk to me.

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

To begin to let go of all of those things.

[B]

I mean, because they formed our identity. Scott, let's be honest.

[A]

Those are Lies that have formed our identity.

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

Things that we say to ourselves.

[B]

That's how powerful this lesson is.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Breaking the bondage of the lies I told me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because of what I had done to me.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And by the way, some of us are real rascals. We've done some really ridiculous, horrific things to ourselves and others. And imagine being at a place where 2,000 years ago, a savior.

Forgave me for everything I did. Now, 2,000 years later, he's given me two gifts. For me to deal in real time with the sin I'm doing and the sin that's being done to me so that we can live in relationships where our sin no longer defines us.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

See, I have a relationship with God. My sin no longer defines me. That's done. But I'd like to have a relationship with you. You're my friend. What if we had a relationship?

[A]

And I'd like to have a relationship with me where I'm constantly.

[B]

Here you go.

[A]

Let's start beating myself up.

[B]

Exactly. Let's start there. What if I had a relationship with me and a relationship with you? How is that possible? Is the blood of Jesus. Is it possible that I can live forgiven? Now watch this. Forgiven with God, because I trust what Christ did at Calvary and forgiven with you because of what his blood is doing today to cleanse me of what you've done to me. I have lots of stories of people dealing with horrific issues with the power of forgiveness and watching that healing deeply, including me. Scott, I would say to you that I was my worst enemy forever. Now, this is going to sound corny, and some of you may not get it, but I'm sorry. I like me now.

[A]

Sorry.

[B]

Just gonna be honest.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I kind of like me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

For years. For years. No, no.

[A]

See, and this is a. It's an experience I've had because we have similar backgrounds. I.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

I had a dad that left when I was in fifth grade, and he was an alcoholic. And even though I loved my dad, I hated him in ways. It was just. Was complicated. And I think that.

That created a permission in me to be harsh with myself anytime.

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

I got close to being like my dad.

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

And I've talked about this before, but when I've met. When I meet other men, I can sense there's something different about them. There's something more settled about them.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

They're like, well, I don't care what he thought. This is what I did. There was nothing wrong with what I did. I mean, they just have this. They have this settledness and confidence, and it's about how they. It's about their relationship with themselves. It is. And I can always. I'll pause and go, you had a good dad, didn't you?

[B]

You're almost always right.

[A]

I'm almost always right.

[B]

Oh, you are. It's that big a deal?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

No, it's that big a deal. You just brought up a big, big deal.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Now, as we think about this dynamic, how do I as a Christian live forgiven.

Because I have a savior, because I have relationships where I have repented. I have relationships where I have forgiven. I live forgiven because I have learned to let the blood of Jesus Christ cleanse me. I'm in a reality where now I don't live in the angst defined by my shame that keeps me hidden. I live in a reality of openness with brothers like you who know me well. We trust each other, we love each other. We're in these podcasts together because we think we've got a message that could make a difference in the lives of thousands of people. We're living into the purposes of God. Wait a minute, Scott. Aren't you the guy that really screwed up and you blamed yourself your whole life? And Bill, didn't you blame yourself your whole life? Yeah. Well, what happened? I learned to trust God with me, and I found that he could handle me and he loved me and he transformed me. Now, that sounds like a lot of biblical words, because it is, but I want to catch a negative into a positive.

[A]

Yeah. What's the negative?

[B]

Well, the negative is this sin management theology is constantly keeping Christians in the state of sin in a condition of separation from God, and that condition never, ever takes them out of their angst ever. The message of grace, you are forgiven. God remembers your sin no more. But in his wisdom, he made provision in your daily reality to give you two gifts to deal with the fact you sin against other than yourself and you're sinned against. Do we understand that those gifts can cleanse me and clean me and listen to this and put me into a condition of living forgiven? That's what this is about. And if we can capture that, I have lots of stories of lots of people who have been really hurt who are living today in the freedom of being forgiven in their relationship with God. And here's the second part. And in their relationship with each other.

[A]

And in their relationship with themselves.

[B]

And thanks for keep bringing it there, because that's where the angst is.

[A]

That's where the angst lives.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So here's our joy. How do I what happens if I live Forgiven. Remember in our last podcast you motioned that I'm free from sin and I'm free too.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Watch what happens when I'm forgiven. I get to live in the 2.

[A]

You do get to live in the 2.

[B]

I get to live in the 2. I no longer am living in the Washington.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I'm living in the two.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That's where I live now. I live in the two.

[A]

Yeah. And by the way, when you live in the two, you help others to begin. Amen. To start living in the two.

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

And that's called influence.

[B]

Well done.

[A]

Thanks for watching. We love that you're here. Please hit like and subscribe and check the link at the bottom of this podcast. We have a link for study guides if you'd like to do this with a group or the small group with friends or even just do a little more study on your own. But we love to have you here. We'll see you again next week.

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